Scale

2007-03-23T03:25:58Z

201.22.50.113: /* Planets */

[[Image:DreamwaveCover6.jpg|right|250px|thumb|...since when is a sedan 9 stories tall?]]
Scale in the ''Transformers multiverse'' is, to put not too fine a point on it, screwed.

Virtually no generation, era, franchise, fiction, toyline or other incarnation of ''Transformers'' has presented scale in a consistent, logical or easily-believable fashion. Most fans would agree that one needs to either ignore it or accept it, lest they be tempted to actually explain away these problems and in the process undoubtedly [[fanwank]] themselves into oblivion.

However, this does not mean that the chronic scale problems of ''Transformers'' do not merit description.

== Types of scale problems ==
=== Scale within toylines ===
As it generally well known, the [[Generation 1 (toyline)|Generation 1 toyline]], especially the entire pre-[[Transformers: The Movie|Movie]] lines, were created from repackaged and [[redeco]]ed toys from several different Japanese transforming toylines. The crucial point being that they came from ''different'' toylines. All characters (well, virtually all; see below) ''should'' be in correct scale to each other as they all are supposed to represent real-world altmodes that can pass for correctly-scaled vehicles etc. However, since the ''[[Diaclone]]'' toys were not designed to be part of the same line as [[Microman]] toys, scale issue arise. While Diaclone figures such as [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]], [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] and [[Hound (G1)|Hound]] are more-or-less in correct scale to each other, many of the [[Mini Vehicle]]s from the Microman line are clearly far too small by comparison. Even aside from the deformed [[penny-racer]] style proportions, even a comparatively small car such as a [[Bumblebee (G1)|Volkswagen]] is disproportionately tiny when compared to a [[Jazz (G1)|Porsche]] that should be in the same scale. The disparity becomes all the more obvious with other [[minibot]]s such as [[Warpath]] and [[Seaspray]] whose [[altmode]]s would suggest that they should be many times their actual size.

Another glaring scale problem comes in the form of the [[Seeker]]s, who turn into F-15 Eagles which, in real life, are 63.8 ft (19.44 m) long. Clearly not in scale with the Autobot cars then...

Other scale problems come from characters who transform into the same (or very similar) altforms but whose toys are very different sizes. For example [[Air Raid (G1)|Air Raid]] transforms into and F-15 Eagle, but his toy is half the size of [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]]'s. In reality they should be an identical size (in fact, [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]], transforming into a Concorde passenger jet should in fact be one of the largest G1 Transformers with an Earth altmode). The same can be said for [[Breakdown]], who, having a Lamborghini Countach altmode, should be in scale with [[Sunstreaker]]. This also goes for the other [[Stunticon]]s and all the Special Teams/[[Scramble City]]-type combiners with Earth-based altmodes, whose toys are all out of scale to earlier waves. By the same token, Warpath should be roughly the same size as [[Blitzwing]].

Also, from an in-universe logic perspective, the characters with role-play altmodes such as [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]], [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]], [[Perceptor]] or [[Laserbeak (Armada)|Armada Laserbeak]] are scaled to be human(well, kid)-scale. Although [[size changing]] is obviously not possible for real toys (or at least, that's what [[Takara]] ''wants'' us to think...), this human-scaling makes in some cases for inordinately large robot modes, e.g. [[Blaster]].

There has only been one notable exception to all of this; the ''[[Alternators]]'' toyline, where every item is a 1:24-scale representation of a real type of car, and thus remain in perfect scale with each other.

=== Scale within shows ===
Scale issues abound within cartoon fictions, especially the [[Generation 1 (cartoon)|G1 cartoon]]. A lot can be attributed to animation errors, or even "lazy animation". [[Size changing]] is rarely depicted on screen outside of characters such as [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] and [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], but is rather implied (or, one could argue in many cases, inferred) in the following method: character such as [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]] transforms in-frame from robot to shuttle with no visible expansion of size relative to his surroundings. Cut. In the following shot his fellow Decepticons are shown running into frame, suddenly tiny in stature so that they can board the shuttle. Although Astrotrain has not been shown to actually grow (in the was Megatron is usually seen to perceptibly shrink in-shot), one infers that it is more likely that Astrotrain has expanded rather than all his confederates have individually shrunk. The same goes for [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]] and other "transport" characters.

Some scale problems appear to be arbitrary, for example Optimus Prime (and, indeed, most Transformers in general) is routinely shown as being throughly gargantuan, equal to several stories in hight and capable of cradling humans in the palm of one hand. In reality, Prime would probably be less than 20 feet tall. Conversely, [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] is sometimes shown as being only a few feet taller than an average human, where in reality he would be around 10 feet tall. And those pesky [[Seeker]]s remain a walking scale problem; in reality they would be amongst the largest Transformers of all and would ''tower'' over their Autobot adversaries, whereas the animation generally depicts character such as [[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]] and [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] as being approximately the same height.

[[Combiner]] characters are often depicted as far larger than the sum of their parts. Characters such as [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] and [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]] are frequently shown being as tall as large buildings, sometimes even the size of small skyscrapers. When one thinks that their individual limbs are comprised of cars and construction vehicles, this becomes patently absurd. [[Superion (G1)|Superion]], however, actually ''would'' be fairly massive, if one considers the much larger real-world size of his component parts.

[[Image:TeenyCliff.jpg|left|thumb|Cliffjumper is one ****ing tiny car. Or Hound is a ****ing huge Jeep.]]

In most cases, the [[Generation 1 (cartoon)|G1 cartoon]] adopts approximations of the toy scale (with all its inherent problems) when depicting the characters in robot modes; Prime, Megatron and Soundwave are generally animated at the same height, Seekers and Autobot cars slightly shorter (although not ''as'' much shorter and unevenly so as the actual toys are), and [[Minibot]]s are given a smaller stature again. However, these depictions were ''far'' from consistent.

Some fans interpret these discrepancies to also be the result of [[size changing]], but this is debatable. If virtually all characters used mass-shifting (or whatever) to gain or drop just a few feet for no apparent reason (other than to make the animation more plausible), the technology would seem pointlessly mundane. Furthermore there is no strong evidence in the series to indicate that size changing truly is so widespread as opposed to the animation having a particular style to it that favours emphasizing the hugeness of the Cybertronians.

=== Show scale vs. toy scale ===

Some characters have great discrepancies between their cartoon scale and their toy scale. "Giant" characters such as [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]] are, even aside from any [[size changing]] for transport purposes, clearly not in the same scale in toy form as they are depicted on screen. [[Mini-Cassettes|Cassette characters]] such as [[Rumble (G1)|Rumble]]'s toys are roughly the same height as most [[minibot]]s, while in the show they are usually portrayed as human-sized (which is odd, considering that Soundwave is capable of expanding to massive size).

[[Hot Rod|Rodimus Prime]] and [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]] are usually shown to be of a fairly similar hight (although Magnus is much bulkier), whereas there is a considerable difference between the size of their toys. By the same token, Rodimus is always depicted as being an equal stature to his opposing leader [[Galvatron (G1)|Galvatron]], whereas the toy Galvatron is instead the same size as Magnus.

[[Metroplex (Cybertron)|Cybertron Metroplex]] is depicted as gargantuan in animation, whereas his toy is merely Leader-Class (although the Japanese [[Galaxy Force]] release, dubbed "Megalo Convoy", included an exclusive [[redeco]] of the [[Heroes of Cybertron]] [[Optimus Prime (Armada)|(Cybertron) Optimus Prime]] to indicate the "correct" scale.

=== Citybots ===
[[Image:EarlyGalvatronTVMagazine1.jpg|left|250px|thumb|Okay, if you were ever ''this'' big in the cartoon, THEN we might be able to call you a city.]]

The characters [[Metroplex (G1)|Metroplex]], [[Trypticon]], [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]] and [[Scorponok (G1)|Scorponok]] each have altmodes which are described as a "city". However, the scale at which they could plausibly house enough humans, ''let alone'' Transformers to be in any way reasonably defined as a "city" would suggest a robot-mode scale that would make [[Hojoni|Godzilla]] look like a gecko. No fiction to date, not even the ''very'' large depictions in the Japanese ''[[Headmasters (television series)|Headmasters]]'' cartoon, even begins to approximate the size that a true "citybot" would logically become. In reality, the grossly-undersized depiction of [[Unicron]] (see below) would probably be closer to the scale of an actual transformed city. Which is ironic, as in Season 3 of the [[Generation 1 (television series)|G1 cartoon]] Unicron requires citybot eyes to replace his own shattered ones. That's right, citybot eyes fit a ''planet''bot. Explain that one...

Rare examples which even suggest such a realistic city scale include occasional Japanese promotional art (e.g. see left). A popular non-official source which also depicts citybots in "true" scale is the 13th installment of Matt Moylan's [[LilFormers]].

Furthermore, there is virtually no way to reconcile the "city" altmodes of the actual toys with any believable use of the term. Using windows as even a vague scale, they would hardly qualify as a city ''block''. The cartoon episode ''[[Thief in the Night]]'' makes some headway in explaining this via an establishing shot that shows Metroplex to be only a small smaller sub-section of the "actual" Autobot City, although this was not repeated.

Although little fiction to date has significantly featured the Headmaster leaders fulfilling their "city" roles, they have in the Japanese-exclusive cartoons been employed in their tertiary modes as massive starships capable of transporting and housing many normal-sized transformers. Conversely, the Marvel [[Generation 1 (comic)|G1 comic]] depicted Fort Max and Scorpy as merely "large-standard" size characters, of an equal height to Powermaster Optimus Prime and, in some UK issues, even the same as Rodimus Prime (to be fair, Powermaster Prime was often drawn "undersized" in the comics).

=== Planets ===
Scale when it comes to planets is almost so fraught it's actively painful. The logic problems of describing citybots as "cities" is a thousand times worse if [[Unicron]] is supposed to have a planet-sized altmode, and that Cybertron is in turn supposed to be in scale with him. Although different fictions have compared both [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]/[[Primus]] and Unicron to drastically different Sol-system planets, the fact remains that they are supposed to be ''planets'', and yet across most fictions they are shown in such insane scale-relation to characters that it would suggest they are barely the size of a very, very small moon (or a space station).

[[Image:Unicronplanet.jpg|left|thumb|I'm ''how'' big?!]]

To start with, [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] itself was depicted throughout G1 as having buildings visible from space. Although this was clearly intended to make it immediately obvious that the planet was entirely technological in nature, it actually makes no sense whatsoever, as such structures would have to be the size of small continents to actually be visible from such a distance. If the buildings were in fact supposed to be Transformers-scale skyscrapers (or even 2000 A.D. style mega-bocks), Cybertron would therefore be barely a fraction the size of Earth's [[Moon (moon)|Moon]]. By comparison, the rather Coruscant-like orbit-views of Cybertron in the ''[[Beast Machines (television series)|Beast Machines]]'' cartoon may be less distinctive or recognisably "Cybertronian", but are ''far'' more believable.

[[Image:Cybertronplanet.jpg|right|thumb|Those are some pretty effin' big buildings...]]

Unicron, however, is a much more extreme problem. If one presumes that no obvious [[size changing]] occurs during his transformation (and really, why would he want to become ''smaller''?), he would be so massive that any shot that features even a ''part'' of his body, let alone the whole thing, would be of such a scale that no normal Transformer, however massive, would even be visible in the same frame. His depiction in the ''[[The Transformers: The Movie (1986)|The Transformers: The Movie]]'' in which he directly interacts with normal-sized Cybertronian characters is blatantly absurd (regardless of how totally phat it looks). Shots such as the [[Dinobot]]s fleeing his grasping hand, a starship penetrating his eye or ''especially'' picking up Galvatron between his thumb and forefinger before swallowing him (or, similarly in the comic, impaling [[Brainstorm (G1)|Brainstorm]] on his fingernail before crunching him between his teeth) bend any concept of plausible scale beyond breaking point. If Unicron is the size of a planet, his hands would be the size of continents. This would make Galvatron the size of Great Britain.

There is no possible explanation for any of this. Just go with it.

=== ''Beast Era'' scale ===

In the ''[[Beast Era]]'' scale is not such a large issue, although it certainly does crop up in less obvious (depending on your point of view) ways.

==== Real world scale ====
Although the Beast Warriors all seem to exist quite happily in their own relative scale, their scale in relation to the real-world animals they have adopted as [[altmode]]s is more problematic. While the "giant insect" characters such as [[Waspinator]] and [[Inferno (BW)|Inferno]] are obviously not in real world scale, when considered carefully virtually none of the characters actually are. The only character who has been clearly depicted interacting with real members of his adopted species is [[Cheetor (BW)|Cheetor]], who is seen attempting interact with other cheetahs in ''[[Beast Wars, Part 1]]'', who react in fright. Cheetor was shown here to be in the same scale as real cheetahs, which effectively makes him the measuring stick for all other characters. [[Rattrap]] is therefore obviously a monstrously huge rat, about the size of a large dog, [[Rhinox (BW)|Rhinox]] is a rather small rhinoceros, and [[Optimus Primal]] is probably a roughly normal-sized gorilla. However, [[Megatron (BW)|Megatron]] is therefore an positively dwarfish specimen of a ''Tyrannosaurs Rex''.

In their few interactions with (adult) protohumans, the Cybertronian characters seem between twice and three times the average height of humans. This does not entirely make sense if one considers that a cheetah (essentially) standing on its hind legs would not be much different in hight to a modern man. Whether this is to imply that protohumans in the BW universe were much smaller than modern-day humans (or real neanderthals for that matter), or that prehistoric cheetahs were much larger than modern cheetahs is a matter of personal taste. Or you could just say Mainframe stuffed up a little.

==== Scale relative to G1 ====
[[Size changing]] appears to be a thing of the past by the Beast Era, as the majority of the Cybertronian race seems to have considerably downgraded in size, apparently due to the [[Maximal Upgrade]] Program (although this is of course a backwards rationalization, since the show's basic premise requires the characters to transform into (vaguely) normal-sized animals, compared to the G1 characters transforming into large vehicles etc.). When entering the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]], the Beast Warriors are very small compared to the dormant G1 characters, especially [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]]. They are roughly the size humans should be (but usually weren't) depicted in relation to these characters.

==== Toy scale vs. cartoon scale ====
The first waves of ''[[Beast Wars (toyline)|Beast Wars]]'' figures were not made in the same relative scale to each other as depicted in the cartoon, although from Season 2 onwards the scales (and general toy-accuracy) of the cartoon became much more consistent with the toys.

For example, of the Season 1 Maximal crew, [[Dinobot (BW)|Dinobot]], Cheetor, [[Tigatron (BW)|Tigatron]] and Rhinox are all from the same deluxe [[size class]], while [[Airazor (BW)|Airazor]] and Rattrap are considerably smaller basics. Optimus Primal, an ultra, stands at virtually twice the size of the deluxes. In the show, Dinobot is the tallest, followed by Rhinox and a slightly shorter Optimus Primal, shorter again is Tigatron, while shorter still is Cheetor (despite being an identical mold) and Airazor, while Rattrap is the shortest, but by no means to such a degree as his toy would suggest.

The ''[[Beast Machines (toyline)|Beast Machines]]''' toyline was far worse in terms of scale discrepancies with its cartoon, with the tallest character [[Silverbolt (Fuzor)|Silverbolt]] becoming the shortest (show-featured) Maximal toy, and similarly the massive [[Tankor (BM)|Tankor]] was reduced to a tiny basic-class (well, in Japan anyway, but the Tank Drones that his BWR toy was redecoed from were supposed to be the same size anyway). And, sadly, the most show-accurate toy in the line (well, ''sorta'' in the line...) "Air Attack [[Optimus Primal]]" was rendered as an enormous supreme figure, completely incompatible with the other toys.

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