MediaWiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:The One

2006-10-03T23:06:16Z

206.163.120.10:

I argue that The is part of The One's formal title, and should remain.

I will probably be outvoted, but I still think it sounds dippy alone. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 14:17, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

:I agree. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 14:21, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

::Quick, let's change it back before Steve-o gets back from botcon!
::"Well, we '''held''' a vote, it's too bad you weren't here..." It's Assistant Editors Month on the Wiki!-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 17:28, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

::Mmn, yes, I'd vote for "The One" too. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 20:02, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
:::Passed unanimously! --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 22:55, 1 October 2006 (UTC)
::::DAMMIT!!!!!! --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 05:06, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

: I vote for "The One" also. But, how about some content first? --[[User:Crockalley|Crockalley]] 23:33, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
:: I'm not really sure it's a vote-on thing. It's like voting on how to spell actual words. Proper protocol calls for "One." It sounds dippy, but that's just how it's done. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:09, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::: But is "that's just how it's done" really a good enough reason when 1) it DOES sound dippy (for The Fallen too) and 2) it makes it a bit Harder for folks to find things, as people doing an info search will almost certainly search "The One" not just the word "one". I mean, is there a real reason for doing it that way other than made up "protocal" because if not I'd say it's just buracratic silliness to stick to a rule that doesn't help and actually confuses matters a little. I add my vote for "Names that are actually titles" to include the "The". [[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 00:28, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
::::You are aware of the existence of redirects, yes? [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 00:50, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::: I'm inclined to agree with most of the people posting here. The article really should be "The One," as "The" is part of its name. Just like "The Fallen." I mean, can you conceive of any possible situation in which it would be called "One" instead of "The One"? - [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 01:21, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
::::"Hello, One." "You're never going to get away with this, One!" Unless you say stuff like "I'll get you ice cream, the boy." or "Damn you, the Joker." [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 01:29, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::: Yes, in *adressing a character with a title-name personally* you might drop "The" as in calling out to The Pope, by saying "Heya, Pope! Overhere!" But when talking '''about''' such a character you would pretty much always use "The" as in "Boy The Fallen sure knows how to warm up a room." and given that these entries are not personal adresses to the characters but us talking about them for other people, using "The" for title-names is just much more natural. Again, any actual reason not to? [[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 02:38, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::::Because it's more natural for me to have the titles not have an article at the beginning unless it's the name of a work? That seems to be equal to your justification. [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 02:43, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

:::::::Is the Fallne's Titanium toy called 'Fallen' or 'The Fallen'? I mean, if the toy iself is sodl with 'The' in its name... -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 03:28, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

How about "One, The"? (And likewise, "Fallen, The"). It's a little doofy, but not as doofy as leaving it out entirely. And it does follow a proper indexing protocol.

:There is no reason to worry about indexing or searching. With a redirect at [[The One]], anybody typing "the one" into the search box will be sent to The One and immediately redirected to One automagically. "The" is not part of this entity's "name". If anything, it has no name at all, which is why it's referred to descriptively. When referred to in the article, it will presumably be as "the One" with "the" included. Even in the first sentence when the term is bolded, I would recommend bolding "the". But I see no real reason to include it in the article title. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 06:16, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
::Real reason to include it in the article title is because it sounds right --[[User:Crockalley|Crockalley]] 11:13, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::But there '''is''' an indexing concern: how it gets listed [[:Category:Gods|here]], among any other categories it may eventually be put into. I agree that having it filed under "T" for "The" feels wrong. But "One, The" seems a good compromise to me. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]]
:::<nowiki>[[Category:Whatever|Something, The]]</nowiki> would list a "The Something" article under "S". We already do this for humans, both real and fictional, to index them by last name. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 18:01, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Oh, well in that case, hell. My vote DEFINITELY goes for calling the article "The One." If we're looking for a "real reason," then it would be that so far the name has never been used without the "The" in any fiction. And "One" is such a common word that it helps to distinguish it as a name/title. And, above all, it looks just plain doofy without it. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 18:20, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Here's the best way I can sum up the case for "The One": Imagine seeing it on a category-page and being unfamiliar with it. If it's just the word "One," it comes across very strangely and vaguely. One ''what?'' You don't even know if it's a noun per se. But if it's listed as "The One," it immediately comes across as a name or title. And every other reference to it will have the "the," so it seems counterintuitive that the one instance of omission would be the TITLE, of all things. So which is more important: reduced obfuscation, or hard-and-fast adherence to a stylistic rule? - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 19:01, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

The article itself says "The One is Unicron's and Primus' daddy." Since the title of the article is "One," shouldn't this sentence read, "One is Unicron's and Primus' daddy."? I'm being facetious. But really, would you say that? "One is here to pick up the kids." "Oh, I saw One at the grocery store today." "Primus and Unicron were created by One." Would you say that? --[[User:Crockalley|Crockalley]] 20:04, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

:That's a really awful argument. By that logic nearly every subgroup, and possibly the factions as well, should have a "The" in their article titles. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:35, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
::Not necessarily. "Constructicons built the city." "We're being attacked by Stunticons." "Oh no, Dinobots!" Personally, I agree with moving this to "One, The." - [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 23:00, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Surely even wiki standards must bow in the face of an overwhelming 'ick.' That's why we have the suffix system we had today, it's a mixed standard that recognizes that sometimes imposing standards actually hurts the material's presentation. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 22:55, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::Almost every group name CAN have "the" attached to it, yes, but the key difference there is exclusivity. "Combaticons" or "the Combaticons" - both usages are in common parlance. Whereas we've NEVER seen "One" without a "The." Moreover, as I stated above, "One" by itself is such a common and ambiguous word that its specific meaning here is needlessly obscured if there's no "The." You admit, "When referred to in the article, it will presumably be as 'the One' with 'the' included. Even in the first sentence when the term is bolded, I would recommend bolding 'the'." So if ''every other reference'' to it has a "The," then why should the title be awkwardly different?<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Interrobang

2006-10-03T21:55:40Z

206.163.120.10: Forgot the signature. AGAIN.

Sorry if I wasn't aware of this, but has there been a discussion about making a "''series'' Character" category and putting all the characters into it?
Also, the Classics category does not belong in the Generation 1 category. The Classics Mini-cons aren't from G1, nor is Leo Prime. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 17:07, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

:Every new iteration of G1 has added unique characters. In DreamwaveG1, we got [[Fallen|the Fallen]], [[Gravitas]] and the other ancients, [[Backbite]] and his assassin team, etc. The IDW comics have given us a bunch of new humans and even a [[Calabi-Yau|named spaceship]]. ''Classics'' is likewise a G1 continuity because of its core cast and overall theme. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]]

::I ''think'' I read in some report out of BotCon that the Classics Mini-Cons are going to be considered part of a G1 universe. Can anyone confirm that? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 17:58, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::: I can. Forrest Lee stated the Classics Mini-Cons ARE, fictionally, part of the Classics "neo-G1" universe. Which I wholeheartedly approve of. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:15, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::My first reaction was, "WHAT fiction?" But then it occurred to me that the ''Classics'' line has already seeped into the IDW-G1 universe via Jetfire. How much crossover can happen before we consider them one and the same (well, as one-and-the-same as, say, DW-Energon and the Energon toys)?
:::::Doubt that'll happen. At the fan club magazine panel, [[Forest Lee]] said that next year's fan club newsletter comic storyline was probably going to use the Classics in a post-Marvel Comics universe. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 19:35, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::::Serious? Oh, rock ''on.'' - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:10, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::::Actually, I wonder how that'll square with their apparent plan to keep annually releasing the clear Energon combiner figures. Maybe those characters will jump out of the UT dimension and into the Marvel comic universe? - [[User:206.163.120.10|206.163.120.10]] 21:55, 3 October 2006 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Interrobang

2006-10-03T21:55:09Z

206.163.120.10:

Sorry if I wasn't aware of this, but has there been a discussion about making a "''series'' Character" category and putting all the characters into it?
Also, the Classics category does not belong in the Generation 1 category. The Classics Mini-cons aren't from G1, nor is Leo Prime. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 17:07, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

:Every new iteration of G1 has added unique characters. In DreamwaveG1, we got [[Fallen|the Fallen]], [[Gravitas]] and the other ancients, [[Backbite]] and his assassin team, etc. The IDW comics have given us a bunch of new humans and even a [[Calabi-Yau|named spaceship]]. ''Classics'' is likewise a G1 continuity because of its core cast and overall theme. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]]

::I ''think'' I read in some report out of BotCon that the Classics Mini-Cons are going to be considered part of a G1 universe. Can anyone confirm that? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 17:58, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::: I can. Forrest Lee stated the Classics Mini-Cons ARE, fictionally, part of the Classics "neo-G1" universe. Which I wholeheartedly approve of. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:15, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::My first reaction was, "WHAT fiction?" But then it occurred to me that the ''Classics'' line has already seeped into the IDW-G1 universe via Jetfire. How much crossover can happen before we consider them one and the same (well, as one-and-the-same as, say, DW-Energon and the Energon toys)?
:::::Doubt that'll happen. At the fan club magazine panel, [[Forest Lee]] said that next year's fan club newsletter comic storyline was probably going to use the Classics in a post-Marvel Comics universe. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 19:35, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::::Serious? Oh, rock ''on.'' - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:10, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

::::::Actually, I wonder how that'll square with their apparent plan to keep annually releasing the clear Energon combiner figures. Maybe those characters will jump out of the UT dimension and into the Marvel comic universe?<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>