MediaWiki - User contributions [en]

User talk:Detour

2007-09-23T05:13:09Z

69.234.145.190: Funny Guy

==Megatron joke==
The monsters in MMPR always started out human-sized. Then, at some point, Rita throws her staff down from the Moon shouting "Make my monster grow!". The staff lands in the ground and energy shoots out of it, making the monster enormous. The laser effects around Megatron's cannon in that picture look a lot like the staff. Here is a YouTube clip of it: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUelB-OSneY]. Honestly, it's not a big deal to me, but the old joke doesn't really make any sense in the first place. It seems to be a premature ejaculation joke to go along with his cannon firing, but it's not like there's anybody else in the picture for the innuendo to be complete. I think the observation our anonymous editor made about the resemblance to the staff is actually pretty clever. A rare instance of somebody changing a joke for the better, IMO. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 16:20, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
:Huzzah! I have a talk page now! Anyway, thanks for clearing it up... I didn't get the ressemblance of Bandora's staff to the laser blast effects of Megatron's cannons... At least I understood the previous joke, wasn't all that funny but it made sense without the explanation. -[[User:Detour|Detour]] 16:54, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

== Funny Guy ==

Why you think that the military threats are funny you fuck? Whats wrong with you Uncle Fucka?<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Chris McFeely

2007-09-23T05:07:21Z

69.234.145.190: Fat Retarded Fuck

I'd just like to say that the continued expansion of the Headmasters cartoon articles is pretty awesome... even if the episodes themselves are so not. THIS is the kind of shit that our wiki really needs to make it stand out... we got the dirt on EVERYTHING, not just "hey look I remember this guy from 1984". You can get information on Optimus Goddamn Prime anywhere on the web. A rundown of the Japanese episodes and incidental characters and bizarre powers?... (Incidentally, does "Cross-Head-On" have an article? Should it?) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 22:58, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

:Ta, guv'nor! It just remains to see how long before I get distracted by something shiny and forget about 'em. As for Cross-Head On, I covered the process in the [[Transtector]] article (which I should update to remove that bit about the different Transtectors' powers. "Head On" doesn't deserve an article, it just being the plugging-in of the head, so I don't reckon the Cross-Head On warrants one either, really. Mind you, I'm trying to remember where the "Head Formation" fits in. I'll see when I get to it in the show, I guess. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]]

::I think it would at least warrant a redirect link to a relevant sub-section of the Transtector article. Even if the whole process is vague at best... --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 01:23, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Not including copyright on your images makes Baby Jesus's lawyers cry. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 21:48, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

==Miranda II==
DUDE! That caption you gave to the [[Miranda II]] pic is great! Thanks! I couldn't think of anything to say and that's PRECISELY what I should have said, given how much I hated the series after episode 16! --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 19:21, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

== Master Builder(s) ==

Hi just wondering what you meant by your comment that the DVD got it wrong. The screen cap I posted was from the actual episode (not a DVD title screen) and it clearly shows the title as singular. I guess I'm just wondering what official source states the title as plural—if you know? [[User:Telet093|Telet093]] 02:20, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

==Auto-Bop==
Hey, Chris? Is there any way to determine which thug in Auto-Bop is "Dag"? I'm screenshotting the episode, and "Furg" was easy to figure out... but there's several other incidentals with speaking voices. I'm thinking either the guy who gives Poplock and Rocksteady the free passes or the Dancitron doorman. --[[User:Monzo|Monzo]] 11:58, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

== Transformers (2007) ==

In honor of your outstanding achievement in posting the best snark ever, I hereby bestow upon thee the Andrusi [[wikipedia: sea lion|Seal]] of Approval. --[[User:Andrusi|Andrusi]] 23:58, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

== Money is everything ==

Hey, do your scripts tell you what unit for force Computron uses to activate Abominus's timer mechanism in the final act of MiE? I can't make it out. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 03:35, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

==?==

What part of ireland are you from?[[User:GWolf]]

== Quint Q's ==

Were the various Quintesson ships or Quint body types refereed to as anything in the original scripts? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:54, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

:Alas, nay. They're all just randomly "Quintesson," "Quintesson Scientist," "Quintesson Leader," etc. Just describing the role of the character in the episode, rather than as a name for the body-type. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 19:40, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
::Drat. Well, thanks. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 19:47, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

==???==

Just wondering. You're the guy who did the audio commentary for HM right?
:Yessir, that's me. I also appeared on the Masterforce, Victory and movie DVDs. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 15:09, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

==Fort Max voice==
Chris, if there's some sort of dispute/common error about the voice for RID Fort Max, maybe you should add a note to that effect. That way people won't think that our article has an error in it. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 18:48, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

==IT MUST BE COMPLETED==
Hey, Chris. Please tell me you have the second half of "[[The Beast Within]]", so we can complete this memorial to the worst thing ever. [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 22:09, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:Ye-es, sadly. Should I dig it out, or can I just invite you over to jam a rusty fork in my eye? (I ''really'' wish I could be nicer about this comic, since it's done by TheTF.Net's webmaster, an' all, but... there's just nothing nice to say about it...) - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 22:12, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::Scans needed, then. For science! (I'm masochistic. I am so sorry.) [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 22:26, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

::Aww, it's okay to feel bad Chris! I was actually trying to dig the thread where I yelled at you about your Ryo Annual story out of google groups because I thought I could recycle some of the language for a trivia note explaining ''why'' giving a fan writer ''one shot'' to tell a story in limited pages almost inevitably results in a stupid decision to do something 'signifigant' and bad/pointless rather than telling a good story... but I couldn't find it in the archives. :(
::You're ''allowed'' to be mean to Darren, because you've been through the same thing he has! ^_^ -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 22:30, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:::Yeah, but mine was editorially interfered with! :) - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 22:35, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:::Oh, and it was Chris Funaro who made a comment on it, rather than yourself, Derik. Although I didn't really get what he was saying at the time, and I still don't. But I get what you're saying here. Although I wasn't making up what I wrote, as "The Beast Within" does - I was just stealing it out of Japanese video games. :) - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 22:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::::Really? I know I drafted a response at one point, i wonder if the posting service lost it...?
::::I believe the nature of ''my'' objection was that you needed to step back and say "Gee, all this story is doing is awkwardly affirming the Japanese backstory of the character, complete with bizarre footnotes saying 'it's true, check out a series of video games not available in english if you doubt me!' Unfortunately doing this doesn't actually make Ryo any ''less'' confusing because if he's a dimensional refugee- why the hell does he haf a father on tamers!Earth?" Basically, you were were given a forum- which is fine, and a subject you wanted to talk about- also fine, but rather than ''add'' to the universe, you used it as a soapbox to declare "Yes, the Japanese backstory counts, and I'm goign to gloss over it in a quick-to-the-point-of-incoherence summary!" As a result the DM Universe 'looks' exactly the same whether this story had been published or whether it hadn't. Now if you'd used the story to explain about Ryo's father (given Ryo's brief cameo on adventure!Earth in 02) that explanation would have ''added'' to the universe, explained a problem- and the ''Japanese'' fans would be saying to one another "Hey, there's this official story published by the limeys that fits between the last game and Tamers and explains some things! Scanlations PLZ!"
::::Darren was given 8 pages to tell a story, and rather than tell a cute adventure that would add to the universe (and we know it's possible to do a full story in as little as 3-5 pages, we've seen it done, repeatedly) the enormity of the ''opportunity'' instead overwhelmed him and he instead chose to the ''biggest, kewelest'' thing possible. There's ''no'' personal interaction in the story- Predaking, Devastator, Menasor and Bruticus clearly were ''not'' actually killed (despite what the story implies) the Beast goes crazy and then it stamped down with Grimlock vowing that they will '''never speak of this again under punishment of catapult'''. So basically-- nothing happened, and there's a fiat at the end saying 'and the beast will never again appear anywhere, ever.'
::::Even ''ignoring'' that a Dinogot gestaly is a ''dumb'' idea and that part of why the Dinobots were ''awesome'' that they were a non-combining sub-group tough enough to kick a combining sub-group's ass... even ignoring that The Beast ''dripped'' 'kewl' and 'x-treme' and 'badass' in ways that should be avoided on principle... the true crime is that the story basically never happened. If you took it away from the universe, continuity would look ''exactly'' the same, except it would lack the footnote 'Dinobots can combine, but they never ever do because the combiner is crazy.' No personal interactions, the actions ''in'' the story (the deaths of the 'cons) dont' actually occur so they're not even worth counting as having occoured. The story is ''pointless'' You could have accomplished the exact same thing with a 1-sentence note in a Dreamwave guide. "Dinobots can combine, don't." It's a generic battle with generic deaths and generic angst spun around a footnote. It accomplishes nothing other than establishing that footnote to be true while essentially saying 'but you can ignore it because it will never be used again.' And I don't think Daren would ever have chosen to tell ''that'' story if he hadn't been dazzled by the overwhelming opportunity and become consumed by a need to do something significant.
::::The result is that people love and passionately declaim the virtues of Linkage, which ''everyone everywhere'' accept is ''actually happening'' during the Armada cartoon, off-screen. By contrast for this ''other'' multi-part DVD pack-in story (with more pages per installment) is so looked-down on that even the ''wiki'' staff, who are completionist freaks who delight in documenting the weird and the stupid part of Transformers were saying "Yeah... can we just leave that out? DVD pack-ins don't count, they're like the profiles calling Cyclonus a Unicron, right?"
::::And it wasn't that I dislike affirming Ryo's japanese backstory? I thought it made for a bad story, and I think addressing why Ryo had a father could have been a ''good'' story in the same number of pages if you wanted to tell a story about Ryo jumping universes, and ''that'' story would have added to the universe. While I dislike the core concept, it's probably ''possible'' to tell a good story about the Dinobots having a combiner mode-- but this wasn't it. In both cases while ''events occour'' in both stories, they are completely inconsequential evens that serve merely to contain a editorial fiat saying 'this is true.' and I blame that response on the ''overwhelming urge'' to 'do something signifigant' when a fan-writer is given one shot to tell a story that overrides good sense and objectivity.
::::(That was more or less what I was going to post back then, even if google lost it. I trust you can see what I'm getting at even if you may choose to disagree.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 23:14, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:::::Oh, I can totally see what you're getting at, all right. My goal, though, wasn't really to ''affirm'' Ryo's backstory, but more to tell people - "Hey, so, this exists." This was something that was real and official in Japan, but which next to ''nobody'' in the west knew about. Heck, had I the room, I would've ''totally'' tried to explain his dad - but that was a secondary concern to actually just ''putting the information out there''. Funnily enough, the regular writer did something similar of his own accord when he summarized the first Tamers movie in an even more ham-fisted way than I did. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 23:40, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::::::So take one page out of the story about how Ryo has a father since he's dimension-hopping and do a 1-page fact-sheet at the end about the events aof the games which received only a passing reference in that story (footnoted to 'see the fact seet at the end for more info on this!')
::::::I'm also being way too harsh on this. I ''despise'' Monday morning quarterbacking<ref>That reference probably makes no sense to you if you're British, does it? It refers to criticizing the decisions made by the football field leader in the heat of the game on Sunday night from a privileged perspective of the next day when it's easy to say 'that was a stupid idea' about something ''you know'' didn't turn out.</ref> because hindsight is 20/20, and it comes off like [http://www.theonion.com/content/node/52328 this guy].
::::::There's some correlary to Murphy's law about "once you start asking the ''wrong questions'' you will never find the right answer." Having decided to tell Ryo's game backstory, it's ''really hard'' to step back objectively and see it's not working. I'm not ''quite'' asshole enough to hold you feet to the fire for something that's a fundamental tragedy of human nature. :p
::::::Besides, you were being disingenuous when you said you had no editorial interference. Didn't they cut your length by 30% after you scripted it? Thus the whole story ended up compressed and you lost most of the shell sequence about Ryo coming to trust Cyberdramon more. I'm not ''thrilled'' with that story, since I think 'characters learn to trust one another' is boring and genric, but it did speak to Cyberdramon becoming much less unpredictable and dangerous in the anime vs. the games. So there was an ''attempt'' at telling a story to add to the universe- it just got mostly squeezed out. (And thus part of the reason I speak in generalities about the problems involved in fan-gets-one-shot, not all of which directly apply to you.)
::::::Man I miss Tamers, I should rewatch it. Was Savers any good? (I hated the first episode...) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:55, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Oh, you said 'was' interfered with, not 'wasn't.' ignore that bit then. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:01, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
::::::::Now, see, to me, that's doing it backwards. You're saying it oughta to have been about why Ryo had a father... with an addendum explaining the story that contains the ''problem with him having a father''? You need to remember, out of the vast majority of kids picking this comic up, ''nobody knew this stuff''. To explain away a problem in a story that ''no-one has read''... well, that's just... backwards. You need to atually tell them the story first, so they can be aware there's even a problem that needs to be addressed. Re: the intereference, the bit about Ryo trusting Cybertron was actually more like what got added ''in'' to the story. My aim was to tell a story dealing with Ryo being torn out of his home universe, and trying to find a role or purpose for himself in a world not his own. This, then, would be my explanation for that "super-hero" personality he had in Tamers (which I had previously lampooned all to hell and back in fanfics). There's a vestigal reference to that in the final panel of the finished story, which is a total non-sequiter to anything else that happens in the story because it all got cut out because I was "witing over the heads of the target audience." ''Grmmble''....
::::::::Oh, and I quite enjoyed Savers. But it was very far removed from all the other Digimon series and had a very different tone and approach that I could see not pleasing a lot of folks. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 20:48, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
I'd just like to note "it can't happen in any established continuity" is because, well, basically it can't. Lack of quality aside, it has characters alive and active alongside others who were not around with them (for example, the Predacons), various deaths, etc. It just can't be wedged in anywhere without a metric shit-ton of ridiculous, speculatory to the point of being utterly made-up retcon. And for that we should be thankful. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 00:42, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
:There should be a note that the Dinobot combiner is probably ''not'' part of most continuities, just like Cybertron is ''not'' internally configured to allow Primus to transform into robot mode in most continuities. (I ''think'' that's how the Ultimate Guide described it...) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:55, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

==Headmasters appearance lists==
On "[[Operation: Destroy the Decepticons]]", it's just a recap before the title card, as you suspected.

In "[[Duel on the Asteroid]]", there is an establishing shot of the interior of Spaceship Bruce's bridge. You can clearly see Fortress' back, and then there are four guys seated at a console further up who are too small to really distinguish. From the context and a later shot, it's clear that they are the four main Headmasters. But you can't really tell visually. So... I don't know exactly what rules you have been following when making your lists. I decided to put Fortress first, since he's quite recognizable, then Pointblank, and then the HMs when they get a closer shot. Feel free to modify if that's not the way you were doing things. Also, when they do appear, they are seating (L to R) Chromedome, Highbrow, Brainstorm, Hardhead, so I rearranged them from your ordering. Again, I don't know if that's how you were doing things or not. When the Decepticon Targetmasters first appear, on Fortress' screen ambushing Pointblank, I can't tell which of the two blue guys is which. I'm just trusting the order you listed them in. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:00, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

:That is, indeed, precisely the way I've been doing them, so that's just lovely. Ta muchly! :D Now, I just need to belt out the final two episodes before the end of Sunday... - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 22:12, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

==Hooray!==
He's back! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 23:37, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

==Linking episodes to the Masterforce page==
Perhaps you should create links for episodes on the Masterforce cartoon page as you write the articles as that page is linked to our main page, it would be helpful. I've already linked up the one you have already completed (to my knowledge) *cheesy anime thumbs up* --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 18:00, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

== Fat Retarded Fuck ==

Fuck you uncle Fucka! You think everything is fuckin funny right? Well fuck You!<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Suki Brits

2007-09-23T05:05:44Z

69.234.145.190: /* Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker */

OH MY GOD YOU'RE REALLY NEALE DAVIDSON!!!! [[User:Hooper X|Hooper X]] 05:21, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

==Pat Lee==
But it IS factual! That's what he wrote on his webpage! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:09, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
:Holy friggin' crazy. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 20:31, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

==You are now an Admin==

Hi Suki Brits, I've made you and ItsWalky admins for this wiki. I'm glad you can help :) Let me know if there is anything you need help with or can't do. Please have a look at [[Wikicities:Help:Administrators' how-to guide]] for the basics, and let me know if you want more admins added - two should start you off, but you may want more in time. Thanks again -- [[User:Sannse|sannse]] [[User talk:Sannse|(talk)]] 12:53, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

...so 'sexy piece of autobot ass' goes, but 'masteurjailbate' stays? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 06:20, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

:Sure, why not. The captions aren't supposed to be serious, and mostly, I can't think of anything to put in there instead. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 06:33, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

::The image caption is also phrased in a way to not sound like it's endorsing pedophilia. Bonus points for that. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:40, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

== Ep Template comments ==

Hi. Thanks for your feedback. The bright colors had fit in better with the design of my personal TF website, which already had more color; thus it didn't stand out as much. But here I can see your point, as the style of this wiki is pretty plain to begin with, such bright colors do stand out, and I can sort of see how they might be distracting. I like the idea of having some color in the table to help as an extra visual identifier of the groups. I have therefore muted the colors. Please check it out and let me know if you find it less distracting now. [[User:Telet093|Telet093]] 18:22, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

== Re: "vandalism" ==

I'm very sorry you consider that editing an entry to reflect a neutral point of view is considered to be vandalism.

My experience with Wikis so far has been that they are information resources, and while I don't object to humour being used in an entry, there is a certain amount of self-indulgent college-humour that diminishes potential of the resource.

That said, I respect that I am a newcomer to the community, and will do my best to insert a fart joke into a suitable entry at the first opportunity, in order to gain editorial approval. :)

:Thanks for the reply. I think what concerned me with the [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]] article is that the caption that was there was expressing an opinion, *and* wasn't particularly funny. That being the case, I figured boring but accurate beat lame and indulgent, though it seems we differ on this.

:Like I say, I have no problem with things that are actually *funny*, but why leave something like [[Overhaul (G1)|this]] intact? It's restating something that's stated far better further down the page, and isn't actually funny, and has terrible grammar. When I changed it to something more sensible, it got reverted. Another example [[Abdul Fakkadi|here]] - this caption could be interpreted as a homosexual slur. To my mind, things like this *do* interfere with the quality of the articles. It looks amateurish, and this reflects on how worthwhile the wiki is as a whole.

::How could "Kneel before my epaulettes" '''possibly''' be taken as a homosexual slur? He's a self-important guy in a silly suit. The 'kneel' part is clearly imperious, not sexual. And why would kneeling inply ''homo''sexulity anyway? Can't girls kneel before the socialist might of Abdul Fakkadi? And even if it was- how is Abdul Fakkadi asking someone to serve him sexually a slur? Do you think any any homosexual act is inherntly degrading, and thus a slur?
::I mean, christ, get it right. Abdul Fakkadi is offensive to muslims, not gays.

::Look, here si what we concluded. "The main wikipedia has Transformers articles. If you can't figure out that orange guy is Grapple without a caption saying 'a picture of Grapple,' you belong there, not here. Teletraan 1 inherently assumes that you already have a decent-enough familiarity with Transformers to keep up with the way the articles are written. It's FOR FANS." And that means it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:50, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

:::The "homosexual slur" comment was regarding [http://transformers.wikia.com/index.php?title=Abdul_Fakkadi&oldid=21917 this caption]. Which was more making fun of people who WOULD make that joke, but since the joke had to be made in the process, it's easy to misinterpret. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:25, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Ha! I mean... ha.
::::Anyway, he's allowed to say that. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:44, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::True, it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. But neither does it have to be one huge puerile fanboy in-joke. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 01:24, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

:I know that this stuff relating to use of humour is kind of spelled out in "Tone and Voice", but are we just giving licence to subjective standards of humour that detract from the quality of the information overall? How much is too much? Is it only you and ItsWalky who decide? Is this the best place to discuss this? I really want to make a useful contribution to this wiki, and I'm happy to be advised on how to do that, but I need to feel that differences of interpretation and presentation are going to be respected, which is really about the only way that wikis can work. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 14:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
::"He blowed up real good", I believe, is perfectly fine to have in the bio of a hi-then-die character, even if it restates it in the fiction section. Of course, that's largely my history in newspaper journalism talking, where all the important information is included in the first paragraph and then everything is elaborated in further paragraphs. This way, someone can get an idea of the most important attributes of the character without having to read the entire page. With this in mind, it's perfectly fine to mention that the character only shows up to die in his profile. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:06, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

== Question regarding a broad topic ==
Hi there,

I was wondering if, as an admin, you could please advise me on something? How can I go about fielding a question/suggestion for general discussion in a more systemic way than just on individual talk pages? It's just that I have a differing perspective on the way that this wikia designates certain continuity issues, and it's something that effects many entries. Naturally I don't want to go around unilaterally changing things to reflect my point of view, but I can't see any more general forum to discuss this. On Wookieepedia, the Star Wars wiki, they have a page they call the Senate Hall where people can discuss general topics concerning the site. Is there any way we could do something similar here? Failing that, how would you advise me to go about raising my issues for borader discussion?

To just give you an idea of what I'm talking about: I approve of the way that the site views the various different continuity families as taking place in alternative realities (obviously), however, I find the consistant use of phrasing which treats the Optimus Prime (and Megatron) character in different continuities as wholly different people poblematic. I view Optimus Prime in G1, RID and the Unicron Trilogy (for example) as being alternate reality versions of the same character, rather than wholly different characters with the same name and very similar personalities, which seems to be the way this site treats them. Although there is some argument to be made that this is the case in Japan where Convoy, Fire Convoy and Galaxy Convoy are not neccessarily alts of the same person (especially given the proliferation of Prime-lookalike convoys in the BWII & BWNeo), I think that American fictions consistently portray them as being different versions of the same individual, ala the common device of different versions of the same person in alternate universes as used in sundry sci-fi. Now granted most other instances of name-reuse (particularly in the Unicron Trilogy) give no indication of implying that, say, Armada Cyclonus is in any way and alternate version of G1 Cyclonus, but I think that with Prime and Megs this is clearly different.

On a similar note, I disagree with the inclusion of IDW's "neo-G1" continuity being included in the pages relating to other G1 characters. Although clearly very closely based on G1, the IDWverse is extremely different from any prior incarnation of G1, and is certainly far more different from any prior version than any of the orginal G1 fictions (or even Dreamwave for that matter) differed from each other, if you follow my drift. The entire war/premise/scenario is radically different and most characters have different altmodes and/or transformation schemes. If the forthcoming live-action movie is being considered adequately different from G1 to be considered outside of the G1 continuity family, then I would argue that the IDWverse should be as well.

...Anyway, that gives you an idea of what I want to discuss. ;-) Can you please advise me how I could most effectively air these issues to the wider usership?

Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
===Central Discussion Area===
:Thanks for that to you and Steve-o. We've got a small trickle of discussion on my topic happening over there now. I invite you to join in. Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

==Blackarachnia 'vandalism'==
ENOUGH with the accusations of vandalism, alright? I'm a member of Ben Yee's Transformers board, and there was a discussion on BA's telekinesis in relation to her mind link with Tarantulas. Pretty much everyone on there agreed that the theory is viable (the thread has subsequently been deleted for a while, but I'm sure I can find it in the archives). I'm honestly shocked at how staunchly you guys are REFUSING to even consider it; all the evidence is right there clear as crystal in the cartoon. BA and Tarantulas shared a mind link with each other that lasted four episodes. The mind link went both ways and was forced on BA until it was terminated equally as forcefully in Tangled Web. BA retained, at the very least, a great deal of Tarantulas' memories after the link was severed. The link was so powerful, that Tarantulas felt the pain BA experienced from energon radiation when she threatened suicide, and would've destroyed them both through the link had she made good on her threat. The link was confirmed in dialogue to be psychic in nature, which is why Megatron didn't detect any communications transmissions when they used the link to communicate. And, miraculously, after she became TM2, BA gained telekinesis. Oh, and at ''no point'' is it stated that the TM2 process granted a Transformer new abilities besides enhancing their existing powers and granting them spark-powered healing abilities. Hence, BA's telekinesis must've come from ''somewhere'', and her former mind link with Tarantulas makes the most sense. If you want to talk about 'wild rumors', there's a thread on Ben Yee's boards on ''how'' Tarantulas initiated the link, with the most common theory that he 'downloaded' himself into her mind, which coincidentally further establishes the "BA's telekinesis was her mind link with Tarantulas upgraded" theory.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

* right, and all of the other theories and speculation remaining on the other wiki pages on this site are more substantiated. Please. Not only are many of them far fetched, but they don't even have one reference of evidence to support them. Watch Beast Wars again, and it's clear that this theory is implied in-show, if not stated directly. Seriously, I'm really starting to wonder if you guys even watch the shows, considering how little you seem to know about them.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

== CSS change ==

Hello Suiki, I'm requesting a change to the sitewide CSS file. I've tested these changes locally and everything seems to be working fine. Additionally- these changes are fully namespaced (which is to say they cannot cause accidental problems with other layout elements.)

Please edit the page at [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]], and replace everything after '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' with the full contents of the [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css|CSS talk page]].

This update consists of the new styles for the tobedeleted template (now merged with the old markup for the cleanup template) as well as some Wikimedia-standard table styles.-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:43, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:45, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you. I'll work on the actual template text to put it more in line with your wishes. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:46, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

=== CSS change 2 ===
Adding the the requested [[Template:Merge]], the actual ''text'' of the template is subject tt change, but the CSS is finalized for the requested image.

Can you please replace everything in [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]] between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''/* wikitable/prettytable class for skinning normal tables */''' with the contents of the discussion page: [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css]]? (For the future, is it easier to do this in parts like this, or should I put the entire modified monobook css in the discussion page for a simple cut-and-paste?)

This also includes a general-purpose 'tt1_nowrap' class, since Steve-o was looking for a way to do that a month or so back. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 3===
NN. Think this is the ''last'' of the requested templates. Could you please replace the parts between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

I'd put in links but- seriously, look up one paragraph. ;-) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done! --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 01:54, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 4===
Replace between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

Spoiler template ''someone'' suggested aeons ago, tough less obtrusive than the others. (I really hope this is the last one.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 04:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 5===
Hey Suki, could you add the following code to the end of the [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css|site Monobook file]]? The class is used by used the wikimedia-standard template [[Template:Reflist]].

<pre><nowiki>
/* small footnotes for the reflist template */

.references-small { font-size:92%; }
</nowiki></pre>
-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:It is done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 02:08, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you! Also, thanks for the revision of the Don Murphy article (before I blanked it.) Your note that was only one of 3 producers prompted a last minute change to my own version to reflect that. (I should have known, because I was just reading an article about those 3 squabbling to take sole credit for TF's success in the press.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 07:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

== Help please! ==
Hello there,
I'm hoping you can help me out, please. For some reason which is quite beyond my
understanding, It'sWalky has blocked me from Teletraan 1 (Re: Block ID is #49). The stated reason is "vandalism", which is patently absurd. Although I have strived to be polite at
all times, he has made more thanone hostile comments towards me over recent months
and I must protest that this current block is thoroughly unreasonable.
If the action which he is referring to as so-called "vandalism" is the incident
I THINK he means, then I respecfully suggest that he is grossly overstepping his
authority and quite possibly just has something against me personally, although
heaven knows why...

All I have done was post a very SHORT, admittedly somewhat gratuitous comment on
TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus of
a small number of users in a Community Portal discussion) of Teletraan 1's odd
categorisation of the IDW comic continuity as part of the larger G1 continuity
while contradictorily excluding the new G1-inspired film. My felt that they
should either both be included under the G1 continuity umberella, or neither.

But regardless, I'm not here to argue my point; the comments were removed by
another user and I'm happy to leave it there, so as far as I'm concerned that
should have been the end of it. My remarks certainly were not in ANY way
obscene, abusive, or in offensive by any possible standard. How this can be
considered "vandalism" is very mysterious to me. Perhaps if we were on Wikipedia
or Wookieepedia and dealing with their very strict rules about personal opinion,
but this site is rife with sarcastic, POV, wry and humorous content. Jam-packed
full, actually. I mean, for goodness sake; if anyone's concerned about
potentially ojectionable material, then I'd hate to be a Japanese person reading
this wiki given all the jibes made at their expense. One of the things I've come
to LOVE about this wiki is its sense of humour and creative, organic style. To
call my minor snarkiness "vandalism" seems totally at odds with the mood of
Teletraan 1, in my honest opinion.

I reiterate that I feel that this block is thoroughly unreasonable and I believe
is some kind of gross overraction and/or personal grudge on the part of
It'sWalky, although I can't for the life of me understand how I could have
managed to provoke such apparent emnity.

Can you please help me out?

Thanks,
[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
:"All I have done is post a... gratuitous comment on TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus... of users in a Community Portal discussion)." I think that pretty much covers it. There was a consensus. You blatantly defied the consensus on the grounds that you disagreed with the ruling. That's vandalism. End of story. Right? [[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 00:06, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
::There was consensus to leave it be. But not consensus on the issue itself. I think the movie belongs in the Generation 1 continuity family. IIRC so does Steve-o, and he's the most logical guy on the wiki. However- there's really not enough to say for sure one way or the other.
::Now, I think as sequels and more tie-ins pileup, the movieverse will become more and more G1-like to the point the argument will resolve itself in our favor. Less a consensus than ''dente'', "hold waiting further evidence."
::Of course, PacifistPrime wasn't around last time we went five rounds on the issue, so the subtlties of the 'both sides give up without having convinced the other' situation may have escaped him.
::That said Paci, it's bad form to go running to the other site admin before Walky even has a chance to reply. You don't even knwo what Walky banned you for, how is Suki supposed to pass judgement on whether or nto to override his fellow admin? Wait until Walky replies to clarify his reasoning, ''then'' disagree with him.
::It's polite to assume Walky's acting from a reasoned standpoint at least until you can ''prove'' it's his uterus making him crazy. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:34, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::With all due respect, Derik, I DID wait a few days for Walky to reply, and he's just ignored my email. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::Mistake #1. Derik does not have due respect. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::I've reposted the content of the email on his talk page in the hopes that will get a response, but it hasn't so far. Given that I've now been blocked for something on the order of a week or possibly more, I think it's hardly unreasonable for me to take this up with another admin, surely? And if you want to talk about what's "polite", I think it would hardly have been too much to ask for Walky to have at least put some kind of short note on my talk page explaining his overzealous block, don't you think?

:::Oh, and Awa, are you seriously telling me that "defying" the consensus of a small group of users with two SMALL comments (that I obviously knew would just get deleted straight away anyway) constitutes "vandalism"? Worthy of getting blocked over? For real?
:::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::I received no such email from you. And yell all you want on the talk pages. That's what they're for. Evidence may eventually shift your way! But, in the meantime, dumping your vitrolic grievances on the articles themselves is unacceptable. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:32, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::Paci... Paci... Paci... I gave you a perfectly good excuse of not having been part of the discussion last time and misunderstanding the consensus to hide behind... and you throw it all away.
:::::And for the rest- don't post something in the main article you know is going to be deleted <strike>without logging out first</strike>, post something that encourages your opponents, however grudgingly, to include that perspective in the article even if they rewrite your words. That's part of carrying on a conversation, creating truth through consensus. Anything else... is just throwing feces.
:::::Also, if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on [http://www.shortpacked.com/ his blog], not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting! -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
...! I'm baffled.

So now I'm being accused of "vitriolic grievances", "throwing feces" and "yelling".

What utter rubbish.

I have been polite at every turn, and the very WORST I can reasonably be accused of is sarcasm (in one isolated indicent, on the aforementioned two comments on movie pages, ONLY), something which hardly seems a foreign concept to this wiki.

Walky, I sent you an email the only way I knew how: I used the "email this user" button and clicked send. I got the sender's carbon copy just fine, so I can't explain why you didn't recieve it too. If I used the system incorrectly then I apologise, but I had no reason to believe that it hadn't worked. Oh, and Derik, if your comment "if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on his blog, not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting" is intentded to be some kind of oblique suggestion that I have an interest in harassing Walky; pleeease! I have much better things to do with my time, for goodness sakes. And as I've explained to Walky in the past; I have zero interest whatsoever in blogs.

I am still amazed that any of this is considered reasonable grounds to actually BLOCK me. Do you guys have a "0.5 Strikes & yer out!" policy or something? Considering all the casual rudeness that goes around on the talk pages here, I find it hard to believe that my treatment reflects standard policy. Or do you treat everyone like this?

Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked? And its that it? As far as I can tell my block is permanent. Is this so?

I am NOT a troublemaker, even though you seem to have already tried and convicted me as such. All I want to do is be a part of this wiki, make small contributions, start the occasional article and have polite, rational discussions. Am I really to be banned for using a little sarcasm...?

[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

P.S. Given that I addressed all of this to SukiBrits in the first place, I'd really appreciate it if Suki would weigh in at some point too, please. I'd really like to resolve this tiresome matter ASAP.

:''Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked?'' You were blocked for intentionally, blatantly defying the consensus of a protracted discussion which you instigated and in which you were the only person advocating your position. It was extremely un-gentlemanly, and moderately pissy. Based on what you've written in the last couple days, I can accept that you were just "lashing out" and didn't really expect your comments to stay in the articles, but personally I still consider that to be disrespectful. You shouldn't make an edit which you know/expect will be reverted. I thought the 3-month duration on your block was excessive (and it's now been reduced), but I don't think being blocked in the first place, temporarily, is beyond reason for something like that. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:43, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Other users, including the admin who banned you in the first place, have already weighed in on ''why'' you were banned. I was not responsible for doing it, so frankly, anything further I have to say on the subject would just be repeating the same. I think it's perfectly clear as it is.

I was going to post something about how I'd stick up for you if you actually gave me good reason to, but as it is, the terms of your ban have been changed to something shorter. As it is, you're back in a week. If I were you, I'd sit back and ask myself if it's ''really'' worth fighting over that.

So there's your second chance. If you come back in a week and respect what your fellow editors have told you not to do, you'll be fine. And if there really ''is'' something unfair, I'll listen and advocate for you. But I would keep in mind that you're on thin ice as it is, and playing this victim crap isn't going to help you out much. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:23, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

:He was whiny about it too. It's not like his approach was "seriously guys, this seems excessive and can I talk about it and demonstrate that your impression of my maturity was incorrect," it was really more "Noo! this is so ''unfair''! Why me? You all suck and I shouldn't be held accountable for my actions b'cause I knew someone else was going to clean up my slop!"
:It's probably ''fortunate'' that the original penalty was (accidentally?) excessive-- because opening the floor for a reassessment of penalties based on conduct you do not dispute and then acting like a ''whiny bitch'' practically '''begs''' for an admin to make it ''longer.''
:<small>(Why yes, i was arguing in his favor earlier! I like to cause trouble like that.)</small> -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:45, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::Oh, great: so now I'm a "''whiny bitch''" who's playing "''victim crap''", apparently.

::Charming! My goodness me, you people really are a hostile bunch aren't you?

::So, let me get this straight; [[User:FFN|FFN]] can rag on my ass every other week simply because he disagrees with me, but If I DARE to protest that I have been unreasonably treated over a sarcastic misdemeanor, then I'm a goddamn deviant leper, right? Unbelieveable...

::Okay, YES, I did a bad thing. I admit it was uncalled for, defying the consensus of, oh, about five people? Given the wide, nay EXTENSIVE use of sarcasm and fecetious comments all over this wiki I honestly didn't think it would be such a damn big deal. But okay, whatever. It was wrong, fair enough. MY BAD. All I have done since is POLITELY protest my treatment over this matter and all I've got in return is mockery, name-calling and outright hostility. I mean, seriously...! Talk about disproportionate reactions at every turn.

::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:::Sir, I would hardly call your behavior at this point "polite". I thought Suki's comment was a little much at this point because the matter had been resolved. I asked her to say something because you'd asked, but I didn't know what all she had to say.

:::Regardless, though, please cease the hostilities? Play the better man and ignore what may be said to you at this point. In only a week you'll be able to edit and work again, and then you can prove your worth that way. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 02:37, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::::Oh, so now I'M the one being hostile? How do you figure? Have I called anyone names like "whiny bitch"? No, that would be YOU guys. Have I accused other people of being "pissy" and "throwing feces"? Nup, that'd be you lot too.

::::But of course, if I have the sheer audacity to stand up for myself, well that just can't possibly be polite, I take it...

::::What a terrible, terrible person I must be. Next time I'll know to just shut up and take the abuse gratefully, since that's obviously all you folks will tolerate. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
:::::"[[Wikipedia:Martyr complex|Mew mew mew mew mew mew mew!]]"
::::: '''Not once''' have you apologized for or even acknowledged that you should be held culpable for defacing an article. You remand restitution while sneering that you should not have been punished in the first place. You throw a '''tantrum''' when someone, such as myself, tells you "Gee, while it may be true your punishment was excessive, you're acting like a whiny brat which makes me have no sympathy for you." I'm not calling for you to be re-banned- I'm pointing out a defect in your behavior I '''really''' wish you would fix in the future.
::::: Are you sure you don't want to change your user name to PassiveAgressivePrime?
::::: I don't really care what your original offense was, because you're being a colossal asshole right here, right now. ''It's a bad idea to go around pissing people off while appealing a punishment''. Just- in general. I started out basically on your side and you have none-too-gradually dis-endeared yourself of me.
::::: Please amend your stricken holier-than-thou attitude in the future. It's '''really''' annoying, and it's not at all conducive to an actual discussion of what you did or didn't do and what punishment is appropriate. It makes me want to shut you up by squashing you.
::::: And '''I'm''' the unhealthily detached one. I can't ''imagine'' what it makes someone who thinks with his woman-parts like Walky want to do. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 05:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It's interesting how I'm apparently the "colossal asshole" when it's you guys who are actually doing all the insult-hurling and name-calling. I haven't made one personal comment in this whole affair. Funny, that...

Oh, and for ther record, I HAVE apologised. More than once, actually. Get your facts straight, please.

But "PassiveAgressivePrime" is GOLD, by the way. I'd definitely declare that a genius call if it weren't such a laughable assertion.

Anyway, I've got much better things to do that take this abuse any longer. Think what you will.

Later, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:hahaha i just noticed this. GOODBYE TO ALL MY WIKI FRIENDS FOREVER!!! [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:15, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

== 3d Website ==

I remembered that you showed an interest in the Blackthorne scans and were disappointed.
Hope this is more your alley.
http://www.3dtransformers.com/ -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 12:44, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
:Yeah, I've seen that, actually. Thanks, though, it IS pretty neat. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 13:35, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

==Stubs==
I'm not arguing against removing the tag from G1 Bumblebee's page, but is there some hard-and-fast rule about what actually makes an article a stub? Feels silly asking this, and Wikipedia's article on the subject supports the "common sense" method, but I'm nothing if not stupidly cautious. I asked Walky once and he said "Empty headings = stub!", which I took to mean as "irregardless of the article length and other content".
Then again, maybe he gave such a short answer because it's a ridiculous question. But here I am asking anyway. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:38, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:I think that's a pretty good standard- if portions of the article are still stubbed in without even a overall summary, I think it qualifies as a stub. :(I agree with you that an article stops begin a stub '''before'' it is exhaustively complete.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 23:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:It's an article that's just been started and has a long way to go before completion. That's basically the definition; nothing further has been discussed or agreed on, and I don't think we NEED anything more than that. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:43, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::For clarification, I believe the article in question at the time was very much as Bumblebee's is now. It's more-or-less complete, with an introduction and many sections filled in with detail, but it also had a noteworthy number of sections that were just headers with no content.
::I ought to have been more clear with Walky way back when, I suppose. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:45, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I guess this is a discussion we DO need to have, then.
:::Wikipedia generally uses seperate stub templates for ''sections'' which aren't complete. I don't know if that's best for us, but I generally envision the stub category as being something that someone can look through for articles where ''anything'' can be added to them to be helpful; unlike Bumblebee, which while still not complete, is far from being in that state. If we really need something to indicate that the ''whole article'' isn't complete, maybe some distinction would be helpful. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:50, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::::I also want to add that I don't really feel that strongly on the matter. But I guess we probably should reach some sort of conclusion. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::I think another separate tag would be best. "Stub", as shown, could lead to more confusion down the road, but not tagging the articles I think could lead to people scanning them and not noticing empty sections which they would otherwise be able to fill in. This certainly isn't a large concern, however...
:::::This came up because of the apparent selection of Bumblebee as a featured article. Do we have some way of noting that, to spur work on it ensuring it's completed "in time"? I imagine if it's not done by July it will just be pushed back until later, but I don't see a problem in encouraging work on the Wiki. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 00:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

== Hello ==
*Hello Brits this is Troyb a admin and buericrate of your new sister or whatever wiki, its called transfanon and we need you to place the news on the front page so that we can get more users, thank you. Also I'll give you a link tommorow.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 22:59, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
: No, thank you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:19, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

*O.k. why not (Sigh...)[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 00:45, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

:Because... your fanon wiki appears to have absolutely nothing to do with actual Transformers. If it was fanon in the sense of a bunch of speculation or something, trying to fill in gaps or retcon errors... I could see linking to it someplace, as that might be useful to fans who are looking for information. But it appears to be basically a wiki for your personal fanfic or something. We don't just link to random fanfics, so why would we link to that wiki? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 14:26, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

*Fine fine fine. But it seems you hate fanon. So '''fanon hater''' I shall leave.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 21:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

==Main page links==
Hi Suki Brits. I hope you don't mind, but I added redirects to the TV and Toys pages that you'd previously deleted since these were linked from the main page and might be useful for people to find articles on those topics. [[User:Angela|Angela]]<staff /> ([[User talk:Angela|talk]]) 00:03, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

== Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73 ==

Could you click on the article link on [[Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73]] and complete the edit that it pops up with so we can get rid of the red link? --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:03, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:It would be a red link even if she did. We've broken fundamental laws of wiki reality, man.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:09, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::tested it on my talk page, and it does seem to break Wikiality. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:19, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::However it's still a redlink, in spite of your talk page undeniably existing. It's uncharted territory. If it gets any weirder it'll require Furmanisms to describe it.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::The link is hovering there, on the page, like a vast predatory bird... -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::That, or... talking like William... Shatner. --...[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:30, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::Suki did it. It's ''over''. FINISHED.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::::For me, personally... IT NEVER ENDS! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Let me give it the worst case of INDIGESTION it's ever had! --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 18:48, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:God, I'm choking on all the [[Furmanism]] here. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 19:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
But if Walky can survive the tide of Furmanisms CAN WE DO LESS?--[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]]

== Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker ==

Why the fuck you had to do the Blocking? Are you crazy? Now Nobody send messages to me. If I find you my F-35 Lightning II will fucking get you. We will forgive you if you unblock everything otherwise, the Tanks Transform and roll out.
:''"...so long as they are able to rail at the wind on their own talk page, the troublemaker's ire has a natural and nondestructive outlet. Denied that outlet, they will seek to learn how to evade bans, and armed with '''that''' knowledge their vengeance is unbound to range as it sees fit."'' -[[User:75.73.88.32|75.73.88.32]] 23:24, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::Except he was IP-bouncing already ''before any bans or locks were enacted''. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 00:06, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to hump you for saying that! My tanks will come and get you.

::Okay, that made me laugh for like five minutes. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 00:09, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
:::It's like watching a slow-motion train wreck... --[[User:TVsGrady|TVsGrady]] 00:56, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Any more blocks will result more fucking jets to get you.

Suki, You have such a fat tits that when you go walk down the street people go saying "AW FUCK THATS A FUCKING FAT TITS!"

Fuck You!<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Jazz (Movie)

2007-09-23T05:00:55Z

69.234.145.190: Permanent Death

Sorry is my question seems silly, but I'm new to this whole Wiki thing.
I recently purchased a Jazz movie toy from Target. My question is: Would it be legal/ethical to post the toy's bio text in the otherwise lacking article section? Further, would it be permitted to expound a bit on the toy's features? [[User:SilentSooYun|SilentSooYun]]
:Legal? Well, yeah. Ethical? Odd question. But either way, that's not something we do here. We have a pretty firm policy against cut-and-paste information from other sources, be it official bios or even wikipedia. Sum up the character in your own words. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 14:36, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
::I think he should wait until the street date, for the reasons stated under "Unofficial releases" on the [[Help:Coming_soon|Policy]] page. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 17:13, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
:::[http://www.shortpacked.com/comics/20070426adrenaline.png Fuck 'Street date' and the horse it rode in on.] -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:01, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
::::Ignoring its writer being an admin, I don't think off-site webcomics determine site policy. But what does everybody else say? --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 18:14, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
::: I understand and concede posting the bio, and I agree it would be best to wait for a more official ''movie'' source for more Jazz info. But would it still be acceptable to update the toy info? This ''is'' the actual toy, after all. [[User:SilentSooYun|SilentSooYun]] 18:27, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
::::That's probably safe. Hasbro's officially released at least pics of the toy (which are frequently the basis for toy write-ups,) go ahead. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:30, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
We don't just post verbatim transcripts, so... no. You can use it to write a proper bio for him though. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 14:34, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

== Permanent Death ==

Oh My God! They killed Jazz! You Basterds!<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Starscream (Armada)

2007-09-23T04:52:38Z

69.234.145.190: Don't put the crown on Starscream

There's bound to be a few bits of fiction left unlisted. Some of the kids' books, and he's gotta be in Legends SOMEWHERE. And I really don't feel like going over the DW Armada comic right now. But one at least that section's in, and we get some screen grabs and pictures in... I'd say we've got us another Featured Article. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 23:45, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Sorry for stupidly interfering in an inaccurate/unfunny/both way. Should I go sit in the corner? (the sorry is in no way sarcastic)

SL Nightscream is NOT a clone of Starscream. Who the hell keeps making this up? His story is the same as in Energon. He's Starscream's spark restored with energon. There isn't a single shred of evidence that he is anyone but Starscream with his mind wiped.

== Excuse me ==

In what episode does starscreem actualy get his powerlink form?
:Same one as everyone else.
::Episode 43, "Puppet" --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 09:49, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

== Power crazy ==

Why Starscream copies the Armada Thrust? IG his cloaking powers, his manipulations and even his power crazy behavior.
He bacame power crazy in Cybertron series, can teleport in Energon and even weird with that fucking crown. He even got popular as the Super Mario Brothers.

== Don't put the crown on Starscream ==

Don't put the crown on Starscream. If you do he will get large as a fucking skyscraper. It is not cool, last time, Bob put a crown on him and it tries to kill him. See? I told you not to put that fucking crown on Starscreams fucking head now did I? The lesson is don't put that fucking crown on Starscream.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Cyclonus (Armada)

2007-09-23T04:21:53Z

69.234.145.190: Fucking Retarded Acts

How are we going to do Snowstorm/Snowcat? [[User:X-BoB58|X-BoB58]] 00:30, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

A keyboard, I presume. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:17, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Ya know I never thought about that all this time I've been working on this wiki with my phone's fucking number pad [[User:X-BoB58|X-BoB58]] 02:35, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

The same way we did [[Smokescreen (UT)]]. The same way that Bumblebee/Goldbug will be handled. One character, one page. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]]

[http://members.aol.com/regenesis0/kitano.jpg Am I crazy] AM I CRAZY?

Tell me I'm cracy! -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 03:45, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Cracy? Sure, Derik, I'll remind you of your Craciness again.

Crazy? No. I see a passing resemblence myself.
--[[User:Richardstone|Richardstone]] 05:25, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Is it just me or did he have a weird drill mini-con in the series, and a mini-con that became the front face of the 'copter for his toy (so that he actually turned into a reasonably shaped helicopter, instead of a flat sawn-off looking one)? [[User:129.215.149.99|129.215.149.99]] 00:10, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
: Uh... those would be [[Drill Bit (Armada)]] and Crumplezone... aka one of the [[Destruction Mini-Con Team]] and Cyc's pack-in partner.

== A good guy vehicle into a bad guy robot... ==

Well it obviously happens the same way a good guy robot turns into a bad guy vehicle. Sheesh, hasn't any of you ever read the GI Joe/Transformers crossovers?

: Except it didn't happen "the same way". Here we're talking about Hasbro's design team taking one of their more iconic vehicle designs for one of their most iconic hero groups, and making a new toy of it as a villain character rather than the expected good-guy, with ZERO story reasoning behind it. The Joe crossover character designs is a purely fiction-driven deal that has nothing to do with toy design. The question is why the TOYMAKERS went this route. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 23:19, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

::Probably because the series was written by Japanese writers who'd never heard of Gi Joe?
::Or in more practical terms- it's difficult for 'specialty' vehicle forms like Snowcat's to work for heroes, who much bear the brunt of narrative focus for many episodes- and thus must 'work' in every environment. (As planes and cars do.) It's much easier to ignore Snowcat's incongruous altmode in a desert if he's only in 3 minutes of an episode vs. 12 minutes.. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:41, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
::: The Japanese writers comment makes no sense given that the toy was obviously always a Decepticon, given that he doesn't Powerlinx and has a Hyper gimmick instead. He was clearly a Decepticon from day one. Why he's a G.I. Joe vehicle despite this is the question, and has nothing to do with We've, I'm pretty sure. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:54, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
::::'Zactly. His being CYCLONUS is likely We've-tied, but the toy design itself... --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 02:53, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
:::Also the functionality of vehicle modes in Energon is totally inconsequential, since all they do is fly through space anyway. -[[User:LV|LV]] 03:40, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
::::Well since GI Joe doesn't even exist in the UT-continuity, him being either a good guy or a bad guy vehicle is not an issue since the said vehicle obviously doesn't exist in the said 'verse.
:::::It is as far as the DESIGN OF THE FUCKING TOY goes. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 03:21, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

'''
Cyclonus = Snowcat in Energon Comics?'''

-I swear I remember reading Snowcat himself Say he is cyclonus in the Energon comics... I brought the first couple of volumes of it, and I'm almost certain when Snowcat first appears, he says this... or is this someone else or appears later on saying "Yeah I am now this guy.... " and not giving any more explaination than that? I'll try to find my volumes, I think it is in the second volume.....

-My mistake, it's Mirage who appears saying "Remember me? I used to be Tidal Wave, but now I'm a completely different Transformer! Ha!" kind of thing.... Sorry, it was an easy mistake...

:The Omnicons made a joke about Slugslinger after Mirage announced he was the former Tidal Wave, "is this someone ''else'' in a new body?" It seems... odd to say that in response to Mirage's statement, but they had just fought Snowcat the issue prior, so if they knew he was Cyclonus...
:Snowcat isn't explicitly stated to be Cyclonus in Energon #25, but he's scornful of Scorponok, and makes several references to being familiar with Megatron which would seem to imply (strongly, given everything else) that yes, he's Cyclonus.
:But no, not stated outright.-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:22, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

== Fucking Retarded Acts ==

Megatron should have never turn Cyclonus into a Polar Vehicle. Flying is better than polar vehicles. Now that the helicopter is a noisy yoldler he will not fly at least. Helicopters like Apaches represents air is more advantageous than ground cars and fucking polar vehicles.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Starscream (Animated)

2007-09-23T04:14:48Z

69.234.145.190: Jet mode missing

Not being very familiar with Gundam, I tried to find images of the fighter that [[User:66.114.66.77]] has added. What I found was [http://www.mahq.net/Mecha/gundam/0083/lineart/rx-78gp03s-corefighter2-sp.jpg this], which doesn't have swept-forward wings at all. What am I missing? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 15:11, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

== Jet mode missing ==

Where is his fucking jet mode? The Funny Stays. I don't think Starscream will be a fucking Su-47 if I don't see his jet mode. Automobilebots(Autobots) would probably be fucking less edited. I can't believe his fucking chin got fucking fatter. I am going to send M2 Bradleys to hunt evil Decepti-Nazi Blockers that block shit.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Suki Brits

2007-09-23T04:09:00Z

69.234.145.190: /* Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker */

OH MY GOD YOU'RE REALLY NEALE DAVIDSON!!!! [[User:Hooper X|Hooper X]] 05:21, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

==Pat Lee==
But it IS factual! That's what he wrote on his webpage! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:09, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
:Holy friggin' crazy. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 20:31, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

==You are now an Admin==

Hi Suki Brits, I've made you and ItsWalky admins for this wiki. I'm glad you can help :) Let me know if there is anything you need help with or can't do. Please have a look at [[Wikicities:Help:Administrators' how-to guide]] for the basics, and let me know if you want more admins added - two should start you off, but you may want more in time. Thanks again -- [[User:Sannse|sannse]] [[User talk:Sannse|(talk)]] 12:53, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

...so 'sexy piece of autobot ass' goes, but 'masteurjailbate' stays? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 06:20, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

:Sure, why not. The captions aren't supposed to be serious, and mostly, I can't think of anything to put in there instead. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 06:33, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

::The image caption is also phrased in a way to not sound like it's endorsing pedophilia. Bonus points for that. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:40, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

== Ep Template comments ==

Hi. Thanks for your feedback. The bright colors had fit in better with the design of my personal TF website, which already had more color; thus it didn't stand out as much. But here I can see your point, as the style of this wiki is pretty plain to begin with, such bright colors do stand out, and I can sort of see how they might be distracting. I like the idea of having some color in the table to help as an extra visual identifier of the groups. I have therefore muted the colors. Please check it out and let me know if you find it less distracting now. [[User:Telet093|Telet093]] 18:22, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

== Re: "vandalism" ==

I'm very sorry you consider that editing an entry to reflect a neutral point of view is considered to be vandalism.

My experience with Wikis so far has been that they are information resources, and while I don't object to humour being used in an entry, there is a certain amount of self-indulgent college-humour that diminishes potential of the resource.

That said, I respect that I am a newcomer to the community, and will do my best to insert a fart joke into a suitable entry at the first opportunity, in order to gain editorial approval. :)

:Thanks for the reply. I think what concerned me with the [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]] article is that the caption that was there was expressing an opinion, *and* wasn't particularly funny. That being the case, I figured boring but accurate beat lame and indulgent, though it seems we differ on this.

:Like I say, I have no problem with things that are actually *funny*, but why leave something like [[Overhaul (G1)|this]] intact? It's restating something that's stated far better further down the page, and isn't actually funny, and has terrible grammar. When I changed it to something more sensible, it got reverted. Another example [[Abdul Fakkadi|here]] - this caption could be interpreted as a homosexual slur. To my mind, things like this *do* interfere with the quality of the articles. It looks amateurish, and this reflects on how worthwhile the wiki is as a whole.

::How could "Kneel before my epaulettes" '''possibly''' be taken as a homosexual slur? He's a self-important guy in a silly suit. The 'kneel' part is clearly imperious, not sexual. And why would kneeling inply ''homo''sexulity anyway? Can't girls kneel before the socialist might of Abdul Fakkadi? And even if it was- how is Abdul Fakkadi asking someone to serve him sexually a slur? Do you think any any homosexual act is inherntly degrading, and thus a slur?
::I mean, christ, get it right. Abdul Fakkadi is offensive to muslims, not gays.

::Look, here si what we concluded. "The main wikipedia has Transformers articles. If you can't figure out that orange guy is Grapple without a caption saying 'a picture of Grapple,' you belong there, not here. Teletraan 1 inherently assumes that you already have a decent-enough familiarity with Transformers to keep up with the way the articles are written. It's FOR FANS." And that means it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:50, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

:::The "homosexual slur" comment was regarding [http://transformers.wikia.com/index.php?title=Abdul_Fakkadi&oldid=21917 this caption]. Which was more making fun of people who WOULD make that joke, but since the joke had to be made in the process, it's easy to misinterpret. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:25, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Ha! I mean... ha.
::::Anyway, he's allowed to say that. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:44, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::True, it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. But neither does it have to be one huge puerile fanboy in-joke. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 01:24, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

:I know that this stuff relating to use of humour is kind of spelled out in "Tone and Voice", but are we just giving licence to subjective standards of humour that detract from the quality of the information overall? How much is too much? Is it only you and ItsWalky who decide? Is this the best place to discuss this? I really want to make a useful contribution to this wiki, and I'm happy to be advised on how to do that, but I need to feel that differences of interpretation and presentation are going to be respected, which is really about the only way that wikis can work. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 14:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
::"He blowed up real good", I believe, is perfectly fine to have in the bio of a hi-then-die character, even if it restates it in the fiction section. Of course, that's largely my history in newspaper journalism talking, where all the important information is included in the first paragraph and then everything is elaborated in further paragraphs. This way, someone can get an idea of the most important attributes of the character without having to read the entire page. With this in mind, it's perfectly fine to mention that the character only shows up to die in his profile. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:06, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

== Question regarding a broad topic ==
Hi there,

I was wondering if, as an admin, you could please advise me on something? How can I go about fielding a question/suggestion for general discussion in a more systemic way than just on individual talk pages? It's just that I have a differing perspective on the way that this wikia designates certain continuity issues, and it's something that effects many entries. Naturally I don't want to go around unilaterally changing things to reflect my point of view, but I can't see any more general forum to discuss this. On Wookieepedia, the Star Wars wiki, they have a page they call the Senate Hall where people can discuss general topics concerning the site. Is there any way we could do something similar here? Failing that, how would you advise me to go about raising my issues for borader discussion?

To just give you an idea of what I'm talking about: I approve of the way that the site views the various different continuity families as taking place in alternative realities (obviously), however, I find the consistant use of phrasing which treats the Optimus Prime (and Megatron) character in different continuities as wholly different people poblematic. I view Optimus Prime in G1, RID and the Unicron Trilogy (for example) as being alternate reality versions of the same character, rather than wholly different characters with the same name and very similar personalities, which seems to be the way this site treats them. Although there is some argument to be made that this is the case in Japan where Convoy, Fire Convoy and Galaxy Convoy are not neccessarily alts of the same person (especially given the proliferation of Prime-lookalike convoys in the BWII & BWNeo), I think that American fictions consistently portray them as being different versions of the same individual, ala the common device of different versions of the same person in alternate universes as used in sundry sci-fi. Now granted most other instances of name-reuse (particularly in the Unicron Trilogy) give no indication of implying that, say, Armada Cyclonus is in any way and alternate version of G1 Cyclonus, but I think that with Prime and Megs this is clearly different.

On a similar note, I disagree with the inclusion of IDW's "neo-G1" continuity being included in the pages relating to other G1 characters. Although clearly very closely based on G1, the IDWverse is extremely different from any prior incarnation of G1, and is certainly far more different from any prior version than any of the orginal G1 fictions (or even Dreamwave for that matter) differed from each other, if you follow my drift. The entire war/premise/scenario is radically different and most characters have different altmodes and/or transformation schemes. If the forthcoming live-action movie is being considered adequately different from G1 to be considered outside of the G1 continuity family, then I would argue that the IDWverse should be as well.

...Anyway, that gives you an idea of what I want to discuss. ;-) Can you please advise me how I could most effectively air these issues to the wider usership?

Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
===Central Discussion Area===
:Thanks for that to you and Steve-o. We've got a small trickle of discussion on my topic happening over there now. I invite you to join in. Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

==Blackarachnia 'vandalism'==
ENOUGH with the accusations of vandalism, alright? I'm a member of Ben Yee's Transformers board, and there was a discussion on BA's telekinesis in relation to her mind link with Tarantulas. Pretty much everyone on there agreed that the theory is viable (the thread has subsequently been deleted for a while, but I'm sure I can find it in the archives). I'm honestly shocked at how staunchly you guys are REFUSING to even consider it; all the evidence is right there clear as crystal in the cartoon. BA and Tarantulas shared a mind link with each other that lasted four episodes. The mind link went both ways and was forced on BA until it was terminated equally as forcefully in Tangled Web. BA retained, at the very least, a great deal of Tarantulas' memories after the link was severed. The link was so powerful, that Tarantulas felt the pain BA experienced from energon radiation when she threatened suicide, and would've destroyed them both through the link had she made good on her threat. The link was confirmed in dialogue to be psychic in nature, which is why Megatron didn't detect any communications transmissions when they used the link to communicate. And, miraculously, after she became TM2, BA gained telekinesis. Oh, and at ''no point'' is it stated that the TM2 process granted a Transformer new abilities besides enhancing their existing powers and granting them spark-powered healing abilities. Hence, BA's telekinesis must've come from ''somewhere'', and her former mind link with Tarantulas makes the most sense. If you want to talk about 'wild rumors', there's a thread on Ben Yee's boards on ''how'' Tarantulas initiated the link, with the most common theory that he 'downloaded' himself into her mind, which coincidentally further establishes the "BA's telekinesis was her mind link with Tarantulas upgraded" theory.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

* right, and all of the other theories and speculation remaining on the other wiki pages on this site are more substantiated. Please. Not only are many of them far fetched, but they don't even have one reference of evidence to support them. Watch Beast Wars again, and it's clear that this theory is implied in-show, if not stated directly. Seriously, I'm really starting to wonder if you guys even watch the shows, considering how little you seem to know about them.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

== CSS change ==

Hello Suiki, I'm requesting a change to the sitewide CSS file. I've tested these changes locally and everything seems to be working fine. Additionally- these changes are fully namespaced (which is to say they cannot cause accidental problems with other layout elements.)

Please edit the page at [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]], and replace everything after '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' with the full contents of the [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css|CSS talk page]].

This update consists of the new styles for the tobedeleted template (now merged with the old markup for the cleanup template) as well as some Wikimedia-standard table styles.-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:43, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:45, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you. I'll work on the actual template text to put it more in line with your wishes. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:46, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

=== CSS change 2 ===
Adding the the requested [[Template:Merge]], the actual ''text'' of the template is subject tt change, but the CSS is finalized for the requested image.

Can you please replace everything in [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]] between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''/* wikitable/prettytable class for skinning normal tables */''' with the contents of the discussion page: [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css]]? (For the future, is it easier to do this in parts like this, or should I put the entire modified monobook css in the discussion page for a simple cut-and-paste?)

This also includes a general-purpose 'tt1_nowrap' class, since Steve-o was looking for a way to do that a month or so back. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 3===
NN. Think this is the ''last'' of the requested templates. Could you please replace the parts between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

I'd put in links but- seriously, look up one paragraph. ;-) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done! --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 01:54, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 4===
Replace between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

Spoiler template ''someone'' suggested aeons ago, tough less obtrusive than the others. (I really hope this is the last one.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 04:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 5===
Hey Suki, could you add the following code to the end of the [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css|site Monobook file]]? The class is used by used the wikimedia-standard template [[Template:Reflist]].

<pre><nowiki>
/* small footnotes for the reflist template */

.references-small { font-size:92%; }
</nowiki></pre>
-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:It is done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 02:08, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you! Also, thanks for the revision of the Don Murphy article (before I blanked it.) Your note that was only one of 3 producers prompted a last minute change to my own version to reflect that. (I should have known, because I was just reading an article about those 3 squabbling to take sole credit for TF's success in the press.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 07:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

== Help please! ==
Hello there,
I'm hoping you can help me out, please. For some reason which is quite beyond my
understanding, It'sWalky has blocked me from Teletraan 1 (Re: Block ID is #49). The stated reason is "vandalism", which is patently absurd. Although I have strived to be polite at
all times, he has made more thanone hostile comments towards me over recent months
and I must protest that this current block is thoroughly unreasonable.
If the action which he is referring to as so-called "vandalism" is the incident
I THINK he means, then I respecfully suggest that he is grossly overstepping his
authority and quite possibly just has something against me personally, although
heaven knows why...

All I have done was post a very SHORT, admittedly somewhat gratuitous comment on
TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus of
a small number of users in a Community Portal discussion) of Teletraan 1's odd
categorisation of the IDW comic continuity as part of the larger G1 continuity
while contradictorily excluding the new G1-inspired film. My felt that they
should either both be included under the G1 continuity umberella, or neither.

But regardless, I'm not here to argue my point; the comments were removed by
another user and I'm happy to leave it there, so as far as I'm concerned that
should have been the end of it. My remarks certainly were not in ANY way
obscene, abusive, or in offensive by any possible standard. How this can be
considered "vandalism" is very mysterious to me. Perhaps if we were on Wikipedia
or Wookieepedia and dealing with their very strict rules about personal opinion,
but this site is rife with sarcastic, POV, wry and humorous content. Jam-packed
full, actually. I mean, for goodness sake; if anyone's concerned about
potentially ojectionable material, then I'd hate to be a Japanese person reading
this wiki given all the jibes made at their expense. One of the things I've come
to LOVE about this wiki is its sense of humour and creative, organic style. To
call my minor snarkiness "vandalism" seems totally at odds with the mood of
Teletraan 1, in my honest opinion.

I reiterate that I feel that this block is thoroughly unreasonable and I believe
is some kind of gross overraction and/or personal grudge on the part of
It'sWalky, although I can't for the life of me understand how I could have
managed to provoke such apparent emnity.

Can you please help me out?

Thanks,
[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
:"All I have done is post a... gratuitous comment on TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus... of users in a Community Portal discussion)." I think that pretty much covers it. There was a consensus. You blatantly defied the consensus on the grounds that you disagreed with the ruling. That's vandalism. End of story. Right? [[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 00:06, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
::There was consensus to leave it be. But not consensus on the issue itself. I think the movie belongs in the Generation 1 continuity family. IIRC so does Steve-o, and he's the most logical guy on the wiki. However- there's really not enough to say for sure one way or the other.
::Now, I think as sequels and more tie-ins pileup, the movieverse will become more and more G1-like to the point the argument will resolve itself in our favor. Less a consensus than ''dente'', "hold waiting further evidence."
::Of course, PacifistPrime wasn't around last time we went five rounds on the issue, so the subtlties of the 'both sides give up without having convinced the other' situation may have escaped him.
::That said Paci, it's bad form to go running to the other site admin before Walky even has a chance to reply. You don't even knwo what Walky banned you for, how is Suki supposed to pass judgement on whether or nto to override his fellow admin? Wait until Walky replies to clarify his reasoning, ''then'' disagree with him.
::It's polite to assume Walky's acting from a reasoned standpoint at least until you can ''prove'' it's his uterus making him crazy. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:34, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::With all due respect, Derik, I DID wait a few days for Walky to reply, and he's just ignored my email. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::Mistake #1. Derik does not have due respect. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::I've reposted the content of the email on his talk page in the hopes that will get a response, but it hasn't so far. Given that I've now been blocked for something on the order of a week or possibly more, I think it's hardly unreasonable for me to take this up with another admin, surely? And if you want to talk about what's "polite", I think it would hardly have been too much to ask for Walky to have at least put some kind of short note on my talk page explaining his overzealous block, don't you think?

:::Oh, and Awa, are you seriously telling me that "defying" the consensus of a small group of users with two SMALL comments (that I obviously knew would just get deleted straight away anyway) constitutes "vandalism"? Worthy of getting blocked over? For real?
:::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::I received no such email from you. And yell all you want on the talk pages. That's what they're for. Evidence may eventually shift your way! But, in the meantime, dumping your vitrolic grievances on the articles themselves is unacceptable. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:32, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::Paci... Paci... Paci... I gave you a perfectly good excuse of not having been part of the discussion last time and misunderstanding the consensus to hide behind... and you throw it all away.
:::::And for the rest- don't post something in the main article you know is going to be deleted <strike>without logging out first</strike>, post something that encourages your opponents, however grudgingly, to include that perspective in the article even if they rewrite your words. That's part of carrying on a conversation, creating truth through consensus. Anything else... is just throwing feces.
:::::Also, if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on [http://www.shortpacked.com/ his blog], not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting! -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
...! I'm baffled.

So now I'm being accused of "vitriolic grievances", "throwing feces" and "yelling".

What utter rubbish.

I have been polite at every turn, and the very WORST I can reasonably be accused of is sarcasm (in one isolated indicent, on the aforementioned two comments on movie pages, ONLY), something which hardly seems a foreign concept to this wiki.

Walky, I sent you an email the only way I knew how: I used the "email this user" button and clicked send. I got the sender's carbon copy just fine, so I can't explain why you didn't recieve it too. If I used the system incorrectly then I apologise, but I had no reason to believe that it hadn't worked. Oh, and Derik, if your comment "if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on his blog, not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting" is intentded to be some kind of oblique suggestion that I have an interest in harassing Walky; pleeease! I have much better things to do with my time, for goodness sakes. And as I've explained to Walky in the past; I have zero interest whatsoever in blogs.

I am still amazed that any of this is considered reasonable grounds to actually BLOCK me. Do you guys have a "0.5 Strikes & yer out!" policy or something? Considering all the casual rudeness that goes around on the talk pages here, I find it hard to believe that my treatment reflects standard policy. Or do you treat everyone like this?

Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked? And its that it? As far as I can tell my block is permanent. Is this so?

I am NOT a troublemaker, even though you seem to have already tried and convicted me as such. All I want to do is be a part of this wiki, make small contributions, start the occasional article and have polite, rational discussions. Am I really to be banned for using a little sarcasm...?

[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

P.S. Given that I addressed all of this to SukiBrits in the first place, I'd really appreciate it if Suki would weigh in at some point too, please. I'd really like to resolve this tiresome matter ASAP.

:''Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked?'' You were blocked for intentionally, blatantly defying the consensus of a protracted discussion which you instigated and in which you were the only person advocating your position. It was extremely un-gentlemanly, and moderately pissy. Based on what you've written in the last couple days, I can accept that you were just "lashing out" and didn't really expect your comments to stay in the articles, but personally I still consider that to be disrespectful. You shouldn't make an edit which you know/expect will be reverted. I thought the 3-month duration on your block was excessive (and it's now been reduced), but I don't think being blocked in the first place, temporarily, is beyond reason for something like that. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:43, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Other users, including the admin who banned you in the first place, have already weighed in on ''why'' you were banned. I was not responsible for doing it, so frankly, anything further I have to say on the subject would just be repeating the same. I think it's perfectly clear as it is.

I was going to post something about how I'd stick up for you if you actually gave me good reason to, but as it is, the terms of your ban have been changed to something shorter. As it is, you're back in a week. If I were you, I'd sit back and ask myself if it's ''really'' worth fighting over that.

So there's your second chance. If you come back in a week and respect what your fellow editors have told you not to do, you'll be fine. And if there really ''is'' something unfair, I'll listen and advocate for you. But I would keep in mind that you're on thin ice as it is, and playing this victim crap isn't going to help you out much. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:23, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

:He was whiny about it too. It's not like his approach was "seriously guys, this seems excessive and can I talk about it and demonstrate that your impression of my maturity was incorrect," it was really more "Noo! this is so ''unfair''! Why me? You all suck and I shouldn't be held accountable for my actions b'cause I knew someone else was going to clean up my slop!"
:It's probably ''fortunate'' that the original penalty was (accidentally?) excessive-- because opening the floor for a reassessment of penalties based on conduct you do not dispute and then acting like a ''whiny bitch'' practically '''begs''' for an admin to make it ''longer.''
:<small>(Why yes, i was arguing in his favor earlier! I like to cause trouble like that.)</small> -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:45, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::Oh, great: so now I'm a "''whiny bitch''" who's playing "''victim crap''", apparently.

::Charming! My goodness me, you people really are a hostile bunch aren't you?

::So, let me get this straight; [[User:FFN|FFN]] can rag on my ass every other week simply because he disagrees with me, but If I DARE to protest that I have been unreasonably treated over a sarcastic misdemeanor, then I'm a goddamn deviant leper, right? Unbelieveable...

::Okay, YES, I did a bad thing. I admit it was uncalled for, defying the consensus of, oh, about five people? Given the wide, nay EXTENSIVE use of sarcasm and fecetious comments all over this wiki I honestly didn't think it would be such a damn big deal. But okay, whatever. It was wrong, fair enough. MY BAD. All I have done since is POLITELY protest my treatment over this matter and all I've got in return is mockery, name-calling and outright hostility. I mean, seriously...! Talk about disproportionate reactions at every turn.

::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:::Sir, I would hardly call your behavior at this point "polite". I thought Suki's comment was a little much at this point because the matter had been resolved. I asked her to say something because you'd asked, but I didn't know what all she had to say.

:::Regardless, though, please cease the hostilities? Play the better man and ignore what may be said to you at this point. In only a week you'll be able to edit and work again, and then you can prove your worth that way. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 02:37, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::::Oh, so now I'M the one being hostile? How do you figure? Have I called anyone names like "whiny bitch"? No, that would be YOU guys. Have I accused other people of being "pissy" and "throwing feces"? Nup, that'd be you lot too.

::::But of course, if I have the sheer audacity to stand up for myself, well that just can't possibly be polite, I take it...

::::What a terrible, terrible person I must be. Next time I'll know to just shut up and take the abuse gratefully, since that's obviously all you folks will tolerate. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
:::::"[[Wikipedia:Martyr complex|Mew mew mew mew mew mew mew!]]"
::::: '''Not once''' have you apologized for or even acknowledged that you should be held culpable for defacing an article. You remand restitution while sneering that you should not have been punished in the first place. You throw a '''tantrum''' when someone, such as myself, tells you "Gee, while it may be true your punishment was excessive, you're acting like a whiny brat which makes me have no sympathy for you." I'm not calling for you to be re-banned- I'm pointing out a defect in your behavior I '''really''' wish you would fix in the future.
::::: Are you sure you don't want to change your user name to PassiveAgressivePrime?
::::: I don't really care what your original offense was, because you're being a colossal asshole right here, right now. ''It's a bad idea to go around pissing people off while appealing a punishment''. Just- in general. I started out basically on your side and you have none-too-gradually dis-endeared yourself of me.
::::: Please amend your stricken holier-than-thou attitude in the future. It's '''really''' annoying, and it's not at all conducive to an actual discussion of what you did or didn't do and what punishment is appropriate. It makes me want to shut you up by squashing you.
::::: And '''I'm''' the unhealthily detached one. I can't ''imagine'' what it makes someone who thinks with his woman-parts like Walky want to do. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 05:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It's interesting how I'm apparently the "colossal asshole" when it's you guys who are actually doing all the insult-hurling and name-calling. I haven't made one personal comment in this whole affair. Funny, that...

Oh, and for ther record, I HAVE apologised. More than once, actually. Get your facts straight, please.

But "PassiveAgressivePrime" is GOLD, by the way. I'd definitely declare that a genius call if it weren't such a laughable assertion.

Anyway, I've got much better things to do that take this abuse any longer. Think what you will.

Later, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:hahaha i just noticed this. GOODBYE TO ALL MY WIKI FRIENDS FOREVER!!! [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:15, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

== 3d Website ==

I remembered that you showed an interest in the Blackthorne scans and were disappointed.
Hope this is more your alley.
http://www.3dtransformers.com/ -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 12:44, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
:Yeah, I've seen that, actually. Thanks, though, it IS pretty neat. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 13:35, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

==Stubs==
I'm not arguing against removing the tag from G1 Bumblebee's page, but is there some hard-and-fast rule about what actually makes an article a stub? Feels silly asking this, and Wikipedia's article on the subject supports the "common sense" method, but I'm nothing if not stupidly cautious. I asked Walky once and he said "Empty headings = stub!", which I took to mean as "irregardless of the article length and other content".
Then again, maybe he gave such a short answer because it's a ridiculous question. But here I am asking anyway. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:38, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:I think that's a pretty good standard- if portions of the article are still stubbed in without even a overall summary, I think it qualifies as a stub. :(I agree with you that an article stops begin a stub '''before'' it is exhaustively complete.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 23:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:It's an article that's just been started and has a long way to go before completion. That's basically the definition; nothing further has been discussed or agreed on, and I don't think we NEED anything more than that. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:43, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::For clarification, I believe the article in question at the time was very much as Bumblebee's is now. It's more-or-less complete, with an introduction and many sections filled in with detail, but it also had a noteworthy number of sections that were just headers with no content.
::I ought to have been more clear with Walky way back when, I suppose. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:45, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I guess this is a discussion we DO need to have, then.
:::Wikipedia generally uses seperate stub templates for ''sections'' which aren't complete. I don't know if that's best for us, but I generally envision the stub category as being something that someone can look through for articles where ''anything'' can be added to them to be helpful; unlike Bumblebee, which while still not complete, is far from being in that state. If we really need something to indicate that the ''whole article'' isn't complete, maybe some distinction would be helpful. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:50, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::::I also want to add that I don't really feel that strongly on the matter. But I guess we probably should reach some sort of conclusion. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::I think another separate tag would be best. "Stub", as shown, could lead to more confusion down the road, but not tagging the articles I think could lead to people scanning them and not noticing empty sections which they would otherwise be able to fill in. This certainly isn't a large concern, however...
:::::This came up because of the apparent selection of Bumblebee as a featured article. Do we have some way of noting that, to spur work on it ensuring it's completed "in time"? I imagine if it's not done by July it will just be pushed back until later, but I don't see a problem in encouraging work on the Wiki. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 00:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

== Hello ==
*Hello Brits this is Troyb a admin and buericrate of your new sister or whatever wiki, its called transfanon and we need you to place the news on the front page so that we can get more users, thank you. Also I'll give you a link tommorow.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 22:59, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
: No, thank you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:19, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

*O.k. why not (Sigh...)[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 00:45, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

:Because... your fanon wiki appears to have absolutely nothing to do with actual Transformers. If it was fanon in the sense of a bunch of speculation or something, trying to fill in gaps or retcon errors... I could see linking to it someplace, as that might be useful to fans who are looking for information. But it appears to be basically a wiki for your personal fanfic or something. We don't just link to random fanfics, so why would we link to that wiki? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 14:26, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

*Fine fine fine. But it seems you hate fanon. So '''fanon hater''' I shall leave.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 21:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

==Main page links==
Hi Suki Brits. I hope you don't mind, but I added redirects to the TV and Toys pages that you'd previously deleted since these were linked from the main page and might be useful for people to find articles on those topics. [[User:Angela|Angela]]<staff /> ([[User talk:Angela|talk]]) 00:03, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

== Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73 ==

Could you click on the article link on [[Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73]] and complete the edit that it pops up with so we can get rid of the red link? --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:03, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:It would be a red link even if she did. We've broken fundamental laws of wiki reality, man.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:09, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::tested it on my talk page, and it does seem to break Wikiality. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:19, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::However it's still a redlink, in spite of your talk page undeniably existing. It's uncharted territory. If it gets any weirder it'll require Furmanisms to describe it.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::The link is hovering there, on the page, like a vast predatory bird... -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::That, or... talking like William... Shatner. --...[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:30, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::Suki did it. It's ''over''. FINISHED.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::::For me, personally... IT NEVER ENDS! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Let me give it the worst case of INDIGESTION it's ever had! --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 18:48, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:God, I'm choking on all the [[Furmanism]] here. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 19:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
But if Walky can survive the tide of Furmanisms CAN WE DO LESS?--[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]]

== Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker ==

Why the fuck you had to do the Blocking? Are you crazy? Now Nobody send messages to me. If I find you my F-35 Lightning II will fucking get you. We will forgive you if you unblock everything otherwise, the Tanks Transform and roll out.
:''"...so long as they are able to rail at the wind on their own talk page, the troublemaker's ire has a natural and nondestructive outlet. Denied that outlet, they will seek to learn how to evade bans, and armed with '''that''' knowledge their vengeance is unbound to range as it sees fit."'' -[[User:75.73.88.32|75.73.88.32]] 23:24, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::Except he was IP-bouncing already ''before any bans or locks were enacted''. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 00:06, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to hump you for saying that! My tanks will come and get you.

::Okay, that made me laugh for like five minutes. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 00:09, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
:::It's like watching a slow-motion train wreck... --[[User:TVsGrady|TVsGrady]] 00:56, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Any more blocks will result more fucking jets to get you.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Brawl (Movie)

2007-09-23T03:55:21Z

69.234.145.190: Weird Decepti-tank

==Not Megatron comment==

what inspired that? [[USER:GWolf]]
:Many people on various boards who can't get over the fact that movie Megs is neither a gun nor a tank. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 16:20, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

::More specifically, the ones who are ''so'' incapable of getting over it that they form elaborate conspiracy theories about how Megatron will get a tank altmode during the movie and Hasbro decided to call the corresponding toy "Brawl" to keep it a surprise. --[[User:Andrusi|Andrusi]] 03:29, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Brawl could have easily been named Overkill, if you ask me. His toy has an amount of weapons that border on goofy: His spring loaded cannon on his right arm, the fact that it can swivel 180 to reveal a more accurate to his design Gatling Gun molding, his behind the back secondary guns, his shoulder mounted missile launchers, his twin claw, AND the anti-personal cannon molded onto the twin claw's base. Sheeeeeesh. --[[User:Terrocon Blot|Terrocon Blot]] 19:30, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

==Devastator==

apparently, when they screened the movie in australia, little thing became apparent. His name's Devestator?

Opened, or screened? Because if it was a pre-screening, it may have been a rough cut of the movie-- several decepticons' names were changes later in production, and Devastator was an early name for Brawl.

You can count on this being corrected for the actual film release. Roberto Orci has [http://boards.transformersmovie.com/showpost.php?p=368555&postcount=4479 commented on it.] --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 04:20, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

They called it both a special screening event and a premiere. We rock. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 08:15, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey I just saw the movie on June 29th in a sneak preview in columbus ohio and they called him Devastator. And it seemed like scenes were missing from the movie

:I'm a little confused as to why "Devastator" isn't noted as a mistaken when the only place it appears is a single subtitle line in the actual movie whilst "Brawl" appears on... everything else ever. I mean, a Michael Bay forced mistake is still a mistake.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] 03:52, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

::"Forced mistake"? If he intended to call the tank Devastator and he called it Devastator, I'm not seeing the mistake. It's clearly different from every other appearance, but unless we're going to make a big deal about how purple cartoon Rumble is a mistake, there's no reason to make it sound like someone didn't know what his name was. "Brawl" is clearly the most parsimonious name for the page, but that doesn't change the fact that his name is Devastator in the movie. -[[User:67.149.204.113|67.149.204.113]] 04:44, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

:::Heh, until the DVD release. I don't see Hasbro sitting by on that one when they've got Brawl stamped on all the merchandise.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] 04:46, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

::: Brawl is the better name, they should save devastator for the sequel.

The cinema in Minnesota I just saw the movie at had the 'Devastator' cut. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:31, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
:Wait, what do you mean? Do you mean "cut" as in "the name Devastator was removed" or "cut" as in "the cut of the film that has Devastator," which would be the same as what everyone else has already seen? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 01:40, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
::The version where he's called Devastator. ...is there ''no'' version where he's called Brawl like the said or something? Now you've confused me. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:43, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
:::Nope. It's Devastator in every version.

:::Of course, it's still wrong. But there is no cut that says Brawl. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 01:49, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

::::It says "Brawl" in the credits, though. And as MCRG said, with "Brawl" on all the packaging I'm sure it'll be changed in time for the DVD release. - [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 02:40, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

So, uh, twice now people have removed the "Brawl (here called "Devastator")" bit from the movie summary with no explanation at all. I think that phrasing is important for the sake of clarification. Otherwise there's no real clear reason for him to be referred to as Devastator in the article as it's never actually stated before there that the name Devastator appears in the movie. Can somebody please justify this? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 21:44, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

:It was apparently LV that removed it. After it was put back today, he asked if he was alone in thinking it should be removed. I said it was a little weird to suddenly call the character Devastator with no explanation, and he seemed to give up immediately. I don't recall him actually justifying it, but I think it'd be easiest for you to ask. /:) --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 03:41, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Regarding current edit:
I don't think we should specifically denounce one name over the other, especially in the movie fiction section. Would the "Brawl (here called "Devastator")" thing work for the first mention, then just use pronouns for the rest of this specific section? [[User:Atomic spaceman|Atomic spaceman]] 21:15, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
:I don't think it's really denouncing- he was originally named Devastator, but his name was ''later changed'' to Brawl, it just didn't get fixed int he movie.
:Somehow I feel like that sounds ''less'' than, say, Jetfire begin called Skyfire int he Sunbow Cartoon. (I may change my tune if it's not fixed on the DVD) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 22:08, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

For the film's fiction subsection I have changed his name to Devastator. It's the only name he is given in that story, and the director of the film has apparently said he prefers that name. To me, that makes it his name. He simply has a different name in the film than in all his other appearances. Further: there is still a mention in the trivia that he is credited as Brawl. However, the last time I saw the movie with LV and Walky, they both scanned the voice credits (I was looking elsewhere) and didn't see him credited ''at all'', under either name. Can any editors personally attest to have seen the credit with their own eyes, or are we just repeating Some Guy's claim that it's there? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:35, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

:Old edit of mine from early June for the Sydney June 12th premiere, where the voice actors were finally revealed. IIRC it was posted by one of the people attending and I forgot to edit it out, and I didn't bother hanging around to watch the voice credits myself. Btw, do the Decepticons EVER refer to Sam as anything other than Ladiesman217? That's why I refer to him as such in all the Decepticon writeups I've done. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 23:18, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

==Image==
Does anyone have an actual image of Brawl in robot mode? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 16:40, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:No, he never appeared in any promotional materials to my knowledge, and is BARELY seen in only some of the tv spots. The first time we saw his movie design (and not just his toy) was that leaked concept design sheet at TFW2005. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 16:44, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::He shows up in various heavily illustrated material, but in group shots. Let me think...He's in the movie comic adaptation, and various storybooks. Meet The Decepticons (group shot), Movie Storybook (likely same), and so forth. If you want a render, it seems unlikely.
:::Doublechecked various books. Seems like the best image of Brawl we'll get is his first appearance in bot mode from the Movie adapation comic. Beyond that, he's either lost in crowds, or not drawn well. Or cropped badly. --[[User:Terrocon Blot|Terrocon Blot]] 21:25, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
::::The game guide has a pretty large promo render of Brawl. There are a couple screen shots clipping him, but I'll see what I can do. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 21:29, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
:::::So now that Brawl's gotten a released to the public concept art, we gonna ditch the CG one from the game, or keep using him? --[[User:Terrocon Blot|Terrocon Blot]] 01:14, 19 July 2007 (UTC)
::::::There is? --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 03:54, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

== Devastator and Michael Bay ==

"When queried, director Michael Bay said he had always preferred Devastator and that it is not a mistake."

I'd like to see a source for this. 'Cuz for everyone who brings this up, there's someone who will claim that Bay confirmed it as an error that will get fixed for the DVD. So unless someone can cite a source, I'm inclined to call this (as well as the "fixed for the DVD" version) a "fan rumor".

Oh, and "I seem to recall" or "I think I read somewhere" is not a source.--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 22:47, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

: Then fix it yourself. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 03:17, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
::Well, I can find it I think. Also, anyone remember his "If I wanna paint my house green" thing over flmaes and Prime s

== Weird Decepti-tank ==

Devastator doesn't look like an exact Abrams Tank. I thought Megatron is a tank but this one looks like a half Cybertronian and half American tank.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Suki Brits

2007-09-22T23:26:25Z

69.234.145.190: /* Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker */

OH MY GOD YOU'RE REALLY NEALE DAVIDSON!!!! [[User:Hooper X|Hooper X]] 05:21, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

==Pat Lee==
But it IS factual! That's what he wrote on his webpage! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:09, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
:Holy friggin' crazy. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 20:31, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

==You are now an Admin==

Hi Suki Brits, I've made you and ItsWalky admins for this wiki. I'm glad you can help :) Let me know if there is anything you need help with or can't do. Please have a look at [[Wikicities:Help:Administrators' how-to guide]] for the basics, and let me know if you want more admins added - two should start you off, but you may want more in time. Thanks again -- [[User:Sannse|sannse]] [[User talk:Sannse|(talk)]] 12:53, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

...so 'sexy piece of autobot ass' goes, but 'masteurjailbate' stays? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 06:20, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

:Sure, why not. The captions aren't supposed to be serious, and mostly, I can't think of anything to put in there instead. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 06:33, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

::The image caption is also phrased in a way to not sound like it's endorsing pedophilia. Bonus points for that. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:40, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

== Ep Template comments ==

Hi. Thanks for your feedback. The bright colors had fit in better with the design of my personal TF website, which already had more color; thus it didn't stand out as much. But here I can see your point, as the style of this wiki is pretty plain to begin with, such bright colors do stand out, and I can sort of see how they might be distracting. I like the idea of having some color in the table to help as an extra visual identifier of the groups. I have therefore muted the colors. Please check it out and let me know if you find it less distracting now. [[User:Telet093|Telet093]] 18:22, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

== Re: "vandalism" ==

I'm very sorry you consider that editing an entry to reflect a neutral point of view is considered to be vandalism.

My experience with Wikis so far has been that they are information resources, and while I don't object to humour being used in an entry, there is a certain amount of self-indulgent college-humour that diminishes potential of the resource.

That said, I respect that I am a newcomer to the community, and will do my best to insert a fart joke into a suitable entry at the first opportunity, in order to gain editorial approval. :)

:Thanks for the reply. I think what concerned me with the [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]] article is that the caption that was there was expressing an opinion, *and* wasn't particularly funny. That being the case, I figured boring but accurate beat lame and indulgent, though it seems we differ on this.

:Like I say, I have no problem with things that are actually *funny*, but why leave something like [[Overhaul (G1)|this]] intact? It's restating something that's stated far better further down the page, and isn't actually funny, and has terrible grammar. When I changed it to something more sensible, it got reverted. Another example [[Abdul Fakkadi|here]] - this caption could be interpreted as a homosexual slur. To my mind, things like this *do* interfere with the quality of the articles. It looks amateurish, and this reflects on how worthwhile the wiki is as a whole.

::How could "Kneel before my epaulettes" '''possibly''' be taken as a homosexual slur? He's a self-important guy in a silly suit. The 'kneel' part is clearly imperious, not sexual. And why would kneeling inply ''homo''sexulity anyway? Can't girls kneel before the socialist might of Abdul Fakkadi? And even if it was- how is Abdul Fakkadi asking someone to serve him sexually a slur? Do you think any any homosexual act is inherntly degrading, and thus a slur?
::I mean, christ, get it right. Abdul Fakkadi is offensive to muslims, not gays.

::Look, here si what we concluded. "The main wikipedia has Transformers articles. If you can't figure out that orange guy is Grapple without a caption saying 'a picture of Grapple,' you belong there, not here. Teletraan 1 inherently assumes that you already have a decent-enough familiarity with Transformers to keep up with the way the articles are written. It's FOR FANS." And that means it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:50, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

:::The "homosexual slur" comment was regarding [http://transformers.wikia.com/index.php?title=Abdul_Fakkadi&oldid=21917 this caption]. Which was more making fun of people who WOULD make that joke, but since the joke had to be made in the process, it's easy to misinterpret. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:25, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Ha! I mean... ha.
::::Anyway, he's allowed to say that. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:44, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::True, it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. But neither does it have to be one huge puerile fanboy in-joke. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 01:24, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

:I know that this stuff relating to use of humour is kind of spelled out in "Tone and Voice", but are we just giving licence to subjective standards of humour that detract from the quality of the information overall? How much is too much? Is it only you and ItsWalky who decide? Is this the best place to discuss this? I really want to make a useful contribution to this wiki, and I'm happy to be advised on how to do that, but I need to feel that differences of interpretation and presentation are going to be respected, which is really about the only way that wikis can work. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 14:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
::"He blowed up real good", I believe, is perfectly fine to have in the bio of a hi-then-die character, even if it restates it in the fiction section. Of course, that's largely my history in newspaper journalism talking, where all the important information is included in the first paragraph and then everything is elaborated in further paragraphs. This way, someone can get an idea of the most important attributes of the character without having to read the entire page. With this in mind, it's perfectly fine to mention that the character only shows up to die in his profile. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:06, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

== Question regarding a broad topic ==
Hi there,

I was wondering if, as an admin, you could please advise me on something? How can I go about fielding a question/suggestion for general discussion in a more systemic way than just on individual talk pages? It's just that I have a differing perspective on the way that this wikia designates certain continuity issues, and it's something that effects many entries. Naturally I don't want to go around unilaterally changing things to reflect my point of view, but I can't see any more general forum to discuss this. On Wookieepedia, the Star Wars wiki, they have a page they call the Senate Hall where people can discuss general topics concerning the site. Is there any way we could do something similar here? Failing that, how would you advise me to go about raising my issues for borader discussion?

To just give you an idea of what I'm talking about: I approve of the way that the site views the various different continuity families as taking place in alternative realities (obviously), however, I find the consistant use of phrasing which treats the Optimus Prime (and Megatron) character in different continuities as wholly different people poblematic. I view Optimus Prime in G1, RID and the Unicron Trilogy (for example) as being alternate reality versions of the same character, rather than wholly different characters with the same name and very similar personalities, which seems to be the way this site treats them. Although there is some argument to be made that this is the case in Japan where Convoy, Fire Convoy and Galaxy Convoy are not neccessarily alts of the same person (especially given the proliferation of Prime-lookalike convoys in the BWII & BWNeo), I think that American fictions consistently portray them as being different versions of the same individual, ala the common device of different versions of the same person in alternate universes as used in sundry sci-fi. Now granted most other instances of name-reuse (particularly in the Unicron Trilogy) give no indication of implying that, say, Armada Cyclonus is in any way and alternate version of G1 Cyclonus, but I think that with Prime and Megs this is clearly different.

On a similar note, I disagree with the inclusion of IDW's "neo-G1" continuity being included in the pages relating to other G1 characters. Although clearly very closely based on G1, the IDWverse is extremely different from any prior incarnation of G1, and is certainly far more different from any prior version than any of the orginal G1 fictions (or even Dreamwave for that matter) differed from each other, if you follow my drift. The entire war/premise/scenario is radically different and most characters have different altmodes and/or transformation schemes. If the forthcoming live-action movie is being considered adequately different from G1 to be considered outside of the G1 continuity family, then I would argue that the IDWverse should be as well.

...Anyway, that gives you an idea of what I want to discuss. ;-) Can you please advise me how I could most effectively air these issues to the wider usership?

Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
===Central Discussion Area===
:Thanks for that to you and Steve-o. We've got a small trickle of discussion on my topic happening over there now. I invite you to join in. Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

==Blackarachnia 'vandalism'==
ENOUGH with the accusations of vandalism, alright? I'm a member of Ben Yee's Transformers board, and there was a discussion on BA's telekinesis in relation to her mind link with Tarantulas. Pretty much everyone on there agreed that the theory is viable (the thread has subsequently been deleted for a while, but I'm sure I can find it in the archives). I'm honestly shocked at how staunchly you guys are REFUSING to even consider it; all the evidence is right there clear as crystal in the cartoon. BA and Tarantulas shared a mind link with each other that lasted four episodes. The mind link went both ways and was forced on BA until it was terminated equally as forcefully in Tangled Web. BA retained, at the very least, a great deal of Tarantulas' memories after the link was severed. The link was so powerful, that Tarantulas felt the pain BA experienced from energon radiation when she threatened suicide, and would've destroyed them both through the link had she made good on her threat. The link was confirmed in dialogue to be psychic in nature, which is why Megatron didn't detect any communications transmissions when they used the link to communicate. And, miraculously, after she became TM2, BA gained telekinesis. Oh, and at ''no point'' is it stated that the TM2 process granted a Transformer new abilities besides enhancing their existing powers and granting them spark-powered healing abilities. Hence, BA's telekinesis must've come from ''somewhere'', and her former mind link with Tarantulas makes the most sense. If you want to talk about 'wild rumors', there's a thread on Ben Yee's boards on ''how'' Tarantulas initiated the link, with the most common theory that he 'downloaded' himself into her mind, which coincidentally further establishes the "BA's telekinesis was her mind link with Tarantulas upgraded" theory.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

* right, and all of the other theories and speculation remaining on the other wiki pages on this site are more substantiated. Please. Not only are many of them far fetched, but they don't even have one reference of evidence to support them. Watch Beast Wars again, and it's clear that this theory is implied in-show, if not stated directly. Seriously, I'm really starting to wonder if you guys even watch the shows, considering how little you seem to know about them.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

== CSS change ==

Hello Suiki, I'm requesting a change to the sitewide CSS file. I've tested these changes locally and everything seems to be working fine. Additionally- these changes are fully namespaced (which is to say they cannot cause accidental problems with other layout elements.)

Please edit the page at [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]], and replace everything after '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' with the full contents of the [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css|CSS talk page]].

This update consists of the new styles for the tobedeleted template (now merged with the old markup for the cleanup template) as well as some Wikimedia-standard table styles.-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:43, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:45, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you. I'll work on the actual template text to put it more in line with your wishes. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:46, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

=== CSS change 2 ===
Adding the the requested [[Template:Merge]], the actual ''text'' of the template is subject tt change, but the CSS is finalized for the requested image.

Can you please replace everything in [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]] between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''/* wikitable/prettytable class for skinning normal tables */''' with the contents of the discussion page: [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css]]? (For the future, is it easier to do this in parts like this, or should I put the entire modified monobook css in the discussion page for a simple cut-and-paste?)

This also includes a general-purpose 'tt1_nowrap' class, since Steve-o was looking for a way to do that a month or so back. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 3===
NN. Think this is the ''last'' of the requested templates. Could you please replace the parts between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

I'd put in links but- seriously, look up one paragraph. ;-) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done! --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 01:54, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 4===
Replace between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

Spoiler template ''someone'' suggested aeons ago, tough less obtrusive than the others. (I really hope this is the last one.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 04:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 5===
Hey Suki, could you add the following code to the end of the [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css|site Monobook file]]? The class is used by used the wikimedia-standard template [[Template:Reflist]].

<pre><nowiki>
/* small footnotes for the reflist template */

.references-small { font-size:92%; }
</nowiki></pre>
-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:It is done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 02:08, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you! Also, thanks for the revision of the Don Murphy article (before I blanked it.) Your note that was only one of 3 producers prompted a last minute change to my own version to reflect that. (I should have known, because I was just reading an article about those 3 squabbling to take sole credit for TF's success in the press.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 07:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

== Help please! ==
Hello there,
I'm hoping you can help me out, please. For some reason which is quite beyond my
understanding, It'sWalky has blocked me from Teletraan 1 (Re: Block ID is #49). The stated reason is "vandalism", which is patently absurd. Although I have strived to be polite at
all times, he has made more thanone hostile comments towards me over recent months
and I must protest that this current block is thoroughly unreasonable.
If the action which he is referring to as so-called "vandalism" is the incident
I THINK he means, then I respecfully suggest that he is grossly overstepping his
authority and quite possibly just has something against me personally, although
heaven knows why...

All I have done was post a very SHORT, admittedly somewhat gratuitous comment on
TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus of
a small number of users in a Community Portal discussion) of Teletraan 1's odd
categorisation of the IDW comic continuity as part of the larger G1 continuity
while contradictorily excluding the new G1-inspired film. My felt that they
should either both be included under the G1 continuity umberella, or neither.

But regardless, I'm not here to argue my point; the comments were removed by
another user and I'm happy to leave it there, so as far as I'm concerned that
should have been the end of it. My remarks certainly were not in ANY way
obscene, abusive, or in offensive by any possible standard. How this can be
considered "vandalism" is very mysterious to me. Perhaps if we were on Wikipedia
or Wookieepedia and dealing with their very strict rules about personal opinion,
but this site is rife with sarcastic, POV, wry and humorous content. Jam-packed
full, actually. I mean, for goodness sake; if anyone's concerned about
potentially ojectionable material, then I'd hate to be a Japanese person reading
this wiki given all the jibes made at their expense. One of the things I've come
to LOVE about this wiki is its sense of humour and creative, organic style. To
call my minor snarkiness "vandalism" seems totally at odds with the mood of
Teletraan 1, in my honest opinion.

I reiterate that I feel that this block is thoroughly unreasonable and I believe
is some kind of gross overraction and/or personal grudge on the part of
It'sWalky, although I can't for the life of me understand how I could have
managed to provoke such apparent emnity.

Can you please help me out?

Thanks,
[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
:"All I have done is post a... gratuitous comment on TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus... of users in a Community Portal discussion)." I think that pretty much covers it. There was a consensus. You blatantly defied the consensus on the grounds that you disagreed with the ruling. That's vandalism. End of story. Right? [[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 00:06, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
::There was consensus to leave it be. But not consensus on the issue itself. I think the movie belongs in the Generation 1 continuity family. IIRC so does Steve-o, and he's the most logical guy on the wiki. However- there's really not enough to say for sure one way or the other.
::Now, I think as sequels and more tie-ins pileup, the movieverse will become more and more G1-like to the point the argument will resolve itself in our favor. Less a consensus than ''dente'', "hold waiting further evidence."
::Of course, PacifistPrime wasn't around last time we went five rounds on the issue, so the subtlties of the 'both sides give up without having convinced the other' situation may have escaped him.
::That said Paci, it's bad form to go running to the other site admin before Walky even has a chance to reply. You don't even knwo what Walky banned you for, how is Suki supposed to pass judgement on whether or nto to override his fellow admin? Wait until Walky replies to clarify his reasoning, ''then'' disagree with him.
::It's polite to assume Walky's acting from a reasoned standpoint at least until you can ''prove'' it's his uterus making him crazy. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:34, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::With all due respect, Derik, I DID wait a few days for Walky to reply, and he's just ignored my email. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::Mistake #1. Derik does not have due respect. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::I've reposted the content of the email on his talk page in the hopes that will get a response, but it hasn't so far. Given that I've now been blocked for something on the order of a week or possibly more, I think it's hardly unreasonable for me to take this up with another admin, surely? And if you want to talk about what's "polite", I think it would hardly have been too much to ask for Walky to have at least put some kind of short note on my talk page explaining his overzealous block, don't you think?

:::Oh, and Awa, are you seriously telling me that "defying" the consensus of a small group of users with two SMALL comments (that I obviously knew would just get deleted straight away anyway) constitutes "vandalism"? Worthy of getting blocked over? For real?
:::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::I received no such email from you. And yell all you want on the talk pages. That's what they're for. Evidence may eventually shift your way! But, in the meantime, dumping your vitrolic grievances on the articles themselves is unacceptable. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:32, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::Paci... Paci... Paci... I gave you a perfectly good excuse of not having been part of the discussion last time and misunderstanding the consensus to hide behind... and you throw it all away.
:::::And for the rest- don't post something in the main article you know is going to be deleted <strike>without logging out first</strike>, post something that encourages your opponents, however grudgingly, to include that perspective in the article even if they rewrite your words. That's part of carrying on a conversation, creating truth through consensus. Anything else... is just throwing feces.
:::::Also, if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on [http://www.shortpacked.com/ his blog], not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting! -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
...! I'm baffled.

So now I'm being accused of "vitriolic grievances", "throwing feces" and "yelling".

What utter rubbish.

I have been polite at every turn, and the very WORST I can reasonably be accused of is sarcasm (in one isolated indicent, on the aforementioned two comments on movie pages, ONLY), something which hardly seems a foreign concept to this wiki.

Walky, I sent you an email the only way I knew how: I used the "email this user" button and clicked send. I got the sender's carbon copy just fine, so I can't explain why you didn't recieve it too. If I used the system incorrectly then I apologise, but I had no reason to believe that it hadn't worked. Oh, and Derik, if your comment "if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on his blog, not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting" is intentded to be some kind of oblique suggestion that I have an interest in harassing Walky; pleeease! I have much better things to do with my time, for goodness sakes. And as I've explained to Walky in the past; I have zero interest whatsoever in blogs.

I am still amazed that any of this is considered reasonable grounds to actually BLOCK me. Do you guys have a "0.5 Strikes & yer out!" policy or something? Considering all the casual rudeness that goes around on the talk pages here, I find it hard to believe that my treatment reflects standard policy. Or do you treat everyone like this?

Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked? And its that it? As far as I can tell my block is permanent. Is this so?

I am NOT a troublemaker, even though you seem to have already tried and convicted me as such. All I want to do is be a part of this wiki, make small contributions, start the occasional article and have polite, rational discussions. Am I really to be banned for using a little sarcasm...?

[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

P.S. Given that I addressed all of this to SukiBrits in the first place, I'd really appreciate it if Suki would weigh in at some point too, please. I'd really like to resolve this tiresome matter ASAP.

:''Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked?'' You were blocked for intentionally, blatantly defying the consensus of a protracted discussion which you instigated and in which you were the only person advocating your position. It was extremely un-gentlemanly, and moderately pissy. Based on what you've written in the last couple days, I can accept that you were just "lashing out" and didn't really expect your comments to stay in the articles, but personally I still consider that to be disrespectful. You shouldn't make an edit which you know/expect will be reverted. I thought the 3-month duration on your block was excessive (and it's now been reduced), but I don't think being blocked in the first place, temporarily, is beyond reason for something like that. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:43, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Other users, including the admin who banned you in the first place, have already weighed in on ''why'' you were banned. I was not responsible for doing it, so frankly, anything further I have to say on the subject would just be repeating the same. I think it's perfectly clear as it is.

I was going to post something about how I'd stick up for you if you actually gave me good reason to, but as it is, the terms of your ban have been changed to something shorter. As it is, you're back in a week. If I were you, I'd sit back and ask myself if it's ''really'' worth fighting over that.

So there's your second chance. If you come back in a week and respect what your fellow editors have told you not to do, you'll be fine. And if there really ''is'' something unfair, I'll listen and advocate for you. But I would keep in mind that you're on thin ice as it is, and playing this victim crap isn't going to help you out much. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:23, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

:He was whiny about it too. It's not like his approach was "seriously guys, this seems excessive and can I talk about it and demonstrate that your impression of my maturity was incorrect," it was really more "Noo! this is so ''unfair''! Why me? You all suck and I shouldn't be held accountable for my actions b'cause I knew someone else was going to clean up my slop!"
:It's probably ''fortunate'' that the original penalty was (accidentally?) excessive-- because opening the floor for a reassessment of penalties based on conduct you do not dispute and then acting like a ''whiny bitch'' practically '''begs''' for an admin to make it ''longer.''
:<small>(Why yes, i was arguing in his favor earlier! I like to cause trouble like that.)</small> -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:45, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::Oh, great: so now I'm a "''whiny bitch''" who's playing "''victim crap''", apparently.

::Charming! My goodness me, you people really are a hostile bunch aren't you?

::So, let me get this straight; [[User:FFN|FFN]] can rag on my ass every other week simply because he disagrees with me, but If I DARE to protest that I have been unreasonably treated over a sarcastic misdemeanor, then I'm a goddamn deviant leper, right? Unbelieveable...

::Okay, YES, I did a bad thing. I admit it was uncalled for, defying the consensus of, oh, about five people? Given the wide, nay EXTENSIVE use of sarcasm and fecetious comments all over this wiki I honestly didn't think it would be such a damn big deal. But okay, whatever. It was wrong, fair enough. MY BAD. All I have done since is POLITELY protest my treatment over this matter and all I've got in return is mockery, name-calling and outright hostility. I mean, seriously...! Talk about disproportionate reactions at every turn.

::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:::Sir, I would hardly call your behavior at this point "polite". I thought Suki's comment was a little much at this point because the matter had been resolved. I asked her to say something because you'd asked, but I didn't know what all she had to say.

:::Regardless, though, please cease the hostilities? Play the better man and ignore what may be said to you at this point. In only a week you'll be able to edit and work again, and then you can prove your worth that way. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 02:37, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::::Oh, so now I'M the one being hostile? How do you figure? Have I called anyone names like "whiny bitch"? No, that would be YOU guys. Have I accused other people of being "pissy" and "throwing feces"? Nup, that'd be you lot too.

::::But of course, if I have the sheer audacity to stand up for myself, well that just can't possibly be polite, I take it...

::::What a terrible, terrible person I must be. Next time I'll know to just shut up and take the abuse gratefully, since that's obviously all you folks will tolerate. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
:::::"[[Wikipedia:Martyr complex|Mew mew mew mew mew mew mew!]]"
::::: '''Not once''' have you apologized for or even acknowledged that you should be held culpable for defacing an article. You remand restitution while sneering that you should not have been punished in the first place. You throw a '''tantrum''' when someone, such as myself, tells you "Gee, while it may be true your punishment was excessive, you're acting like a whiny brat which makes me have no sympathy for you." I'm not calling for you to be re-banned- I'm pointing out a defect in your behavior I '''really''' wish you would fix in the future.
::::: Are you sure you don't want to change your user name to PassiveAgressivePrime?
::::: I don't really care what your original offense was, because you're being a colossal asshole right here, right now. ''It's a bad idea to go around pissing people off while appealing a punishment''. Just- in general. I started out basically on your side and you have none-too-gradually dis-endeared yourself of me.
::::: Please amend your stricken holier-than-thou attitude in the future. It's '''really''' annoying, and it's not at all conducive to an actual discussion of what you did or didn't do and what punishment is appropriate. It makes me want to shut you up by squashing you.
::::: And '''I'm''' the unhealthily detached one. I can't ''imagine'' what it makes someone who thinks with his woman-parts like Walky want to do. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 05:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It's interesting how I'm apparently the "colossal asshole" when it's you guys who are actually doing all the insult-hurling and name-calling. I haven't made one personal comment in this whole affair. Funny, that...

Oh, and for ther record, I HAVE apologised. More than once, actually. Get your facts straight, please.

But "PassiveAgressivePrime" is GOLD, by the way. I'd definitely declare that a genius call if it weren't such a laughable assertion.

Anyway, I've got much better things to do that take this abuse any longer. Think what you will.

Later, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:hahaha i just noticed this. GOODBYE TO ALL MY WIKI FRIENDS FOREVER!!! [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:15, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

== 3d Website ==

I remembered that you showed an interest in the Blackthorne scans and were disappointed.
Hope this is more your alley.
http://www.3dtransformers.com/ -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 12:44, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
:Yeah, I've seen that, actually. Thanks, though, it IS pretty neat. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 13:35, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

==Stubs==
I'm not arguing against removing the tag from G1 Bumblebee's page, but is there some hard-and-fast rule about what actually makes an article a stub? Feels silly asking this, and Wikipedia's article on the subject supports the "common sense" method, but I'm nothing if not stupidly cautious. I asked Walky once and he said "Empty headings = stub!", which I took to mean as "irregardless of the article length and other content".
Then again, maybe he gave such a short answer because it's a ridiculous question. But here I am asking anyway. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:38, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:I think that's a pretty good standard- if portions of the article are still stubbed in without even a overall summary, I think it qualifies as a stub. :(I agree with you that an article stops begin a stub '''before'' it is exhaustively complete.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 23:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:It's an article that's just been started and has a long way to go before completion. That's basically the definition; nothing further has been discussed or agreed on, and I don't think we NEED anything more than that. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:43, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::For clarification, I believe the article in question at the time was very much as Bumblebee's is now. It's more-or-less complete, with an introduction and many sections filled in with detail, but it also had a noteworthy number of sections that were just headers with no content.
::I ought to have been more clear with Walky way back when, I suppose. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:45, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I guess this is a discussion we DO need to have, then.
:::Wikipedia generally uses seperate stub templates for ''sections'' which aren't complete. I don't know if that's best for us, but I generally envision the stub category as being something that someone can look through for articles where ''anything'' can be added to them to be helpful; unlike Bumblebee, which while still not complete, is far from being in that state. If we really need something to indicate that the ''whole article'' isn't complete, maybe some distinction would be helpful. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:50, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::::I also want to add that I don't really feel that strongly on the matter. But I guess we probably should reach some sort of conclusion. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::I think another separate tag would be best. "Stub", as shown, could lead to more confusion down the road, but not tagging the articles I think could lead to people scanning them and not noticing empty sections which they would otherwise be able to fill in. This certainly isn't a large concern, however...
:::::This came up because of the apparent selection of Bumblebee as a featured article. Do we have some way of noting that, to spur work on it ensuring it's completed "in time"? I imagine if it's not done by July it will just be pushed back until later, but I don't see a problem in encouraging work on the Wiki. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 00:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

== Hello ==
*Hello Brits this is Troyb a admin and buericrate of your new sister or whatever wiki, its called transfanon and we need you to place the news on the front page so that we can get more users, thank you. Also I'll give you a link tommorow.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 22:59, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
: No, thank you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:19, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

*O.k. why not (Sigh...)[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 00:45, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

:Because... your fanon wiki appears to have absolutely nothing to do with actual Transformers. If it was fanon in the sense of a bunch of speculation or something, trying to fill in gaps or retcon errors... I could see linking to it someplace, as that might be useful to fans who are looking for information. But it appears to be basically a wiki for your personal fanfic or something. We don't just link to random fanfics, so why would we link to that wiki? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 14:26, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

*Fine fine fine. But it seems you hate fanon. So '''fanon hater''' I shall leave.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 21:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

==Main page links==
Hi Suki Brits. I hope you don't mind, but I added redirects to the TV and Toys pages that you'd previously deleted since these were linked from the main page and might be useful for people to find articles on those topics. [[User:Angela|Angela]]<staff /> ([[User talk:Angela|talk]]) 00:03, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

== Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73 ==

Could you click on the article link on [[Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73]] and complete the edit that it pops up with so we can get rid of the red link? --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:03, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:It would be a red link even if she did. We've broken fundamental laws of wiki reality, man.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:09, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::tested it on my talk page, and it does seem to break Wikiality. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:19, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::However it's still a redlink, in spite of your talk page undeniably existing. It's uncharted territory. If it gets any weirder it'll require Furmanisms to describe it.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::The link is hovering there, on the page, like a vast predatory bird... -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::That, or... talking like William... Shatner. --...[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:30, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::Suki did it. It's ''over''. FINISHED.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::::For me, personally... IT NEVER ENDS! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Let me give it the worst case of INDIGESTION it's ever had! --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 18:48, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:God, I'm choking on all the [[Furmanism]] here. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 19:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
But if Walky can survive the tide of Furmanisms CAN WE DO LESS?--[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]]

== Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker ==

Why the fuck you had to do the Blocking? Are you crazy? Now Nobody send messages to me. If I find you my F-35 Lightning II will fucking get you. We will forgive you if you unblock everything otherwise, the Tanks Transform and roll out.
:''"...so long as they are able to rail at the wind on their own talk page, the troublemaker's ire has a natural and nondestructive outlet. Denied that outlet, they will seek to learn how to evade bans, and armed with '''that''' knowledge their vengeance is unbound to range as it sees fit."'' -[[User:75.73.88.32|75.73.88.32]] 23:24, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm going to hump you for saying that! My tanks will come and get you.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

United States military

2007-09-22T23:19:51Z

69.234.145.190: /* F-22 Raptor */

The '''United States military''', officially known as the United States Armed Forces, are charged with defending the people of the [[United States of America]] from all hostile military forces, be they foreign states, [[Cobra|terrorists]], or [[Transformer|killer alien robots]]. It is structured into the following five branches of service:

* United States Army
* United States Navy
* United States Marine Corps
* United States Air Force
* United States Coast Guard

They have a habit of getting involved in the [[Autobot]]/[[Decepticon]] war on Earth because... well really, most of it takes place on American soil. It's their job. Plus a lot of Transformers [[alternate mode|disguise]] themselves as US military vehicles, and that's just not right.

==Generation 1==
The US Armed Forces contain several specialized units whose branch of service is speculative.

* [[G.I. Joe]]
* [[Rapid Anti-robot Assault Team]]
* [[Armored Robot Hunters]]

The only named unit whose branch of service is known is the Air Force [[Uberhogs]] squadron.

==Transformers (2007)==

===Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT)===
Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT) is a subordinate unified command of US Central Command (USCENTCOM). It is responsible for planning special operations in peacetime and war.

SOCCENT operates a [[SOCCENT Forward Operations Base|Forward Operations Base]] in [[Qatar]], commanded by [[Colonel Sharp]], United States Marine Corps.

===United States Army===
====Army Rangers====
The 75th Ranger Regiment —also known as the United States Army Rangers— is an elite light infantry special operations force of the United States Army Special Operations Command (USASOC)

[[William Lennox|Captain William Lennox]] leads a Army Ranger special-operations unit, stationed out of SOCCENT Forward Operations Base. This unit includes:

*[[Sergeant Donnelly|First Sergeant Donnelly]]
*[[Robert Epps|Technical Sergeant Robert Epps]], United States Air Force (Air Force Combat Control officer)
*[[Jorge Figueroa|Chief Warrant Officer Jorge Figueroa]]

====Weapons and ground Vehicles====
The base was seen with a couple tanks and Humvees.

===United States Air Force===
====CV-22 Osprey====
[[Image:Movie_CV-22_Osprey1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|Someone's going to have a hard time explaining how they lost two of these babies.]]

The '''CV-22 Osprey''' is a tiltrotor aircraft that combines the vertical takeoff, hover, and vertical landing qualities of a helicopter with the long-range, fuel efficiency and speed characteristics of a turboprop aircraft. Its mission is to conduct long-range infiltration, exfiltration and resupply missions for special operations forces.

Two Ospreys out of SOCCENT transported Captain Lennox's Ranger unit back to the base after a mission.

'''Note:''' ''The two Ospreys featured in the movie are two of only three that the US Air Force has in its inventory.''

{{-}}

====A-10 Thunderbolt II====
[[Image:Movie_A-10_missilefire.jpg|thumb|right|250px|It is being brought.]]

The '''A-10 Thunderbolt II''' is a twin-engine ground-attack aircraft designed to provice close air support (CAS) to ground forces by by attacking tanks, armored vehicles, and [[Scorponok (Movie)|other ground targets]]. It is also called the '''Warthog''' about as often as its official name, in and out of the United States Air Force.

After recieving Captain Lennox's request for air support, [[the Pentagon]] ordered a nearby airbase roll in Strike Package Bravo, two A-10 Thunderbolt IIs fitted with AGM-65 Maverick air-to-ground missiles, to immediately give support to Lennox's beseiged unit. USAF Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry AWACS to have the A-10s direct their fire upon the target in killbox one-alpha, which was indicated by flares and painted with laser guidance markers. Approaching the villiage, the two A-10s strafed the robotic scorpion with 30 mm rounds from its Avenger gatling gun. Causing no noticable damage, the two planes followed up with their Maverick missiles, blowing up alot of sand but they missed as a result there was no appreciable effect on the mechanical beast.

{{-}}

====E-3 Sentry AWACS====
The '''E-3 Sentry''' is an Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS) aircraft that provides all-weather surveillance, command, control and communications to United States Military.

After Captain Lennox established communications with the Pentagon, Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry to have fire directed upon Scorponok. The E-3's crew provided command and control to the pair of A-10 Thunderbolt IIs in Strike Package Bravo and the AC-130 Spectre gunship that attacked Scorponok.

=====Crew=====
* Michael Adams (AWACS Controller #1)
* Ron Henry (AWACS Controller #2)
* Benjamin Hoffman (AWACS Controller #3)
* Michael McNabb (AWACS Controller #4)
* Jason White (AWACS Controller #5)

'''Note:''' ''Most of the crew of the E-3 Sentry seen in the movie are real crew of that particular aircraft. First Lieutenant Micheal McNabb (who played AWACS Controller #4) is a Transformers fan, and stated in [http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showthread.php?t=115126 an email to fansite TFW2005.com] that director [[Michael Bay]] allowed them to come up with lines that they would really say to other aircraft in order to make the scenes as realistic as possible.''

====AC-130 Spectre====
The '''AC-130 Spectre''' gunship is a heavily-armed ground attack airplane. It is used for close air support, air interdiction, and force protection. Close air support roles include supporting ground troops, escorting convoys, and flying urban operations.

With the lack of significant damage to Scorponok by the two A-10 Thunderbolts of Strike Package Bravo, Captain Lennox suggested the biggest barrels the Air Force has: the 105mm M102 howitzer cannons of AC-130 Spectre gunship. The Spectre pounded the Decepticon attack into the ground with a combination of 40 mm L60 Bofors cannon and 105mm sabot rounds, damaging Scorponok enough for it to retreat.

====F-22 Raptor====
The '''F-22 Raptor''' is a air-superiority fighter with stealth capabilities. It is the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world.

Two Raptors were launched to intercept and escort [[Blackout (Movie)|Blackout]] to SOCCENT. They were presumably destroyed when the Decepticon laid waste to the base.

Later, [[John Keller|Secretary of Defence Keller]] sucessfully contacted the Air Force, F-22 Raptors were launched to give air cover to the combined Ranger/Sector Seven/Autobot unit in [[Mission City]]. One of the Raptor squadrons took heavy damage when the Decepticon Starscream sucessfully infiltrated the group and destroyed several aircraft before being driven off. With the heat off their tails, the Raptors participated in the destruction of Blackout and [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]].

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b7/F-22_bomb.jpg/180px-F-22_bomb.jpg [Starscream bombs a fucker]

====C-17 Globemaster 3====
The cargo plane was seen in the military base.

====C-130 Hercules====
The cargo plane was seen in the military base.

==Real world==
[[Image:Militarysneakpreview.jpg|right|thumb|250px|A promotional flyer for early showings of ''Transformers'' (2007) at Little Creek Naval Air Base and Oceana Naval Air Station.]]

During filming of the ''Transformers'' [[Transformers (2007)|live action movie]], director [[Michael Bay]] worked closely with the [[Wikipedia:United States Department of Defense|United States Department of Defense]], who saw a high-profile summer action movie where US troops fight evil alien robots as a good promotional tool. It's not known if they are an official sponsor of the movie [[franchise]] like corporate partners [[General Motors]], [[Kraft Foods Inc.]], [[PepsiCo]], and [[Target]]. However, military personnel '''do''' get the opportunity to see the film free of charge before its American release.

{{stub}}
[[Category: United States military| ]]<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

United States military

2007-09-22T23:19:38Z

69.234.145.190: /* F-22 Raptor */

The '''United States military''', officially known as the United States Armed Forces, are charged with defending the people of the [[United States of America]] from all hostile military forces, be they foreign states, [[Cobra|terrorists]], or [[Transformer|killer alien robots]]. It is structured into the following five branches of service:

* United States Army
* United States Navy
* United States Marine Corps
* United States Air Force
* United States Coast Guard

They have a habit of getting involved in the [[Autobot]]/[[Decepticon]] war on Earth because... well really, most of it takes place on American soil. It's their job. Plus a lot of Transformers [[alternate mode|disguise]] themselves as US military vehicles, and that's just not right.

==Generation 1==
The US Armed Forces contain several specialized units whose branch of service is speculative.

* [[G.I. Joe]]
* [[Rapid Anti-robot Assault Team]]
* [[Armored Robot Hunters]]

The only named unit whose branch of service is known is the Air Force [[Uberhogs]] squadron.

==Transformers (2007)==

===Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT)===
Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT) is a subordinate unified command of US Central Command (USCENTCOM). It is responsible for planning special operations in peacetime and war.

SOCCENT operates a [[SOCCENT Forward Operations Base|Forward Operations Base]] in [[Qatar]], commanded by [[Colonel Sharp]], United States Marine Corps.

===United States Army===
====Army Rangers====
The 75th Ranger Regiment —also known as the United States Army Rangers— is an elite light infantry special operations force of the United States Army Special Operations Command (USASOC)

[[William Lennox|Captain William Lennox]] leads a Army Ranger special-operations unit, stationed out of SOCCENT Forward Operations Base. This unit includes:

*[[Sergeant Donnelly|First Sergeant Donnelly]]
*[[Robert Epps|Technical Sergeant Robert Epps]], United States Air Force (Air Force Combat Control officer)
*[[Jorge Figueroa|Chief Warrant Officer Jorge Figueroa]]

====Weapons and ground Vehicles====
The base was seen with a couple tanks and Humvees.

===United States Air Force===
====CV-22 Osprey====
[[Image:Movie_CV-22_Osprey1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|Someone's going to have a hard time explaining how they lost two of these babies.]]

The '''CV-22 Osprey''' is a tiltrotor aircraft that combines the vertical takeoff, hover, and vertical landing qualities of a helicopter with the long-range, fuel efficiency and speed characteristics of a turboprop aircraft. Its mission is to conduct long-range infiltration, exfiltration and resupply missions for special operations forces.

Two Ospreys out of SOCCENT transported Captain Lennox's Ranger unit back to the base after a mission.

'''Note:''' ''The two Ospreys featured in the movie are two of only three that the US Air Force has in its inventory.''

{{-}}

====A-10 Thunderbolt II====
[[Image:Movie_A-10_missilefire.jpg|thumb|right|250px|It is being brought.]]

The '''A-10 Thunderbolt II''' is a twin-engine ground-attack aircraft designed to provice close air support (CAS) to ground forces by by attacking tanks, armored vehicles, and [[Scorponok (Movie)|other ground targets]]. It is also called the '''Warthog''' about as often as its official name, in and out of the United States Air Force.

After recieving Captain Lennox's request for air support, [[the Pentagon]] ordered a nearby airbase roll in Strike Package Bravo, two A-10 Thunderbolt IIs fitted with AGM-65 Maverick air-to-ground missiles, to immediately give support to Lennox's beseiged unit. USAF Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry AWACS to have the A-10s direct their fire upon the target in killbox one-alpha, which was indicated by flares and painted with laser guidance markers. Approaching the villiage, the two A-10s strafed the robotic scorpion with 30 mm rounds from its Avenger gatling gun. Causing no noticable damage, the two planes followed up with their Maverick missiles, blowing up alot of sand but they missed as a result there was no appreciable effect on the mechanical beast.

{{-}}

====E-3 Sentry AWACS====
The '''E-3 Sentry''' is an Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS) aircraft that provides all-weather surveillance, command, control and communications to United States Military.

After Captain Lennox established communications with the Pentagon, Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry to have fire directed upon Scorponok. The E-3's crew provided command and control to the pair of A-10 Thunderbolt IIs in Strike Package Bravo and the AC-130 Spectre gunship that attacked Scorponok.

=====Crew=====
* Michael Adams (AWACS Controller #1)
* Ron Henry (AWACS Controller #2)
* Benjamin Hoffman (AWACS Controller #3)
* Michael McNabb (AWACS Controller #4)
* Jason White (AWACS Controller #5)

'''Note:''' ''Most of the crew of the E-3 Sentry seen in the movie are real crew of that particular aircraft. First Lieutenant Micheal McNabb (who played AWACS Controller #4) is a Transformers fan, and stated in [http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showthread.php?t=115126 an email to fansite TFW2005.com] that director [[Michael Bay]] allowed them to come up with lines that they would really say to other aircraft in order to make the scenes as realistic as possible.''

====AC-130 Spectre====
The '''AC-130 Spectre''' gunship is a heavily-armed ground attack airplane. It is used for close air support, air interdiction, and force protection. Close air support roles include supporting ground troops, escorting convoys, and flying urban operations.

With the lack of significant damage to Scorponok by the two A-10 Thunderbolts of Strike Package Bravo, Captain Lennox suggested the biggest barrels the Air Force has: the 105mm M102 howitzer cannons of AC-130 Spectre gunship. The Spectre pounded the Decepticon attack into the ground with a combination of 40 mm L60 Bofors cannon and 105mm sabot rounds, damaging Scorponok enough for it to retreat.

====F-22 Raptor====
The '''F-22 Raptor''' is a air-superiority fighter with stealth capabilities. It is the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world.

Two Raptors were launched to intercept and escort [[Blackout (Movie)|Blackout]] to SOCCENT. They were presumably destroyed when the Decepticon laid waste to the base.

Later, [[John Keller|Secretary of Defence Keller]] sucessfully contacted the Air Force, F-22 Raptors were launched to give air cover to the combined Ranger/Sector Seven/Autobot unit in [[Mission City]]. One of the Raptor squadrons took heavy damage when the Decepticon Starscream sucessfully infiltrated the group and destroyed several aircraft before being driven off. With the heat off their tails, the Raptors participated in the destruction of Blackout and [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]].

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b7/F-22_bomb.jpg/180px-F-22_bomb.jpg

====C-17 Globemaster 3====
The cargo plane was seen in the military base.

====C-130 Hercules====
The cargo plane was seen in the military base.

==Real world==
[[Image:Militarysneakpreview.jpg|right|thumb|250px|A promotional flyer for early showings of ''Transformers'' (2007) at Little Creek Naval Air Base and Oceana Naval Air Station.]]

During filming of the ''Transformers'' [[Transformers (2007)|live action movie]], director [[Michael Bay]] worked closely with the [[Wikipedia:United States Department of Defense|United States Department of Defense]], who saw a high-profile summer action movie where US troops fight evil alien robots as a good promotional tool. It's not known if they are an official sponsor of the movie [[franchise]] like corporate partners [[General Motors]], [[Kraft Foods Inc.]], [[PepsiCo]], and [[Target]]. However, military personnel '''do''' get the opportunity to see the film free of charge before its American release.

{{stub}}
[[Category: United States military| ]]<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Transformers Animated (franchise)

2007-09-22T23:18:23Z

69.234.145.190: /* Is the Autobots always going to be the Civilian ground vehicle? */

You know, I wasn't going to say anything, but you're getting a little too kneejerk about other people's kneejerk reactions. The list of previous series is fine and adaquately snarky, but is the "OMFG NAFF PASS END OF FRANCHISE SUX GONNA KILL TFS BARF CRAP" really needed? Just seems a bit more negatively charged than the wiki really needs.--[[User:UndeadScottsman|UndeadScottsman]] 05:39, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
:And I would have just edited it out, but I figured it would be more productive to discuss it first. 'Course, it seems Rotty took care of it anyway. :D--[[User:UndeadScottsman|UndeadScottsman]] 06:14, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

This article should really be at [[Animated]], shouldn't it? We don't have anything at [[Transformers Cybertron]], [[Transformers Armada]], etc. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 06:24, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
: I dunno. Considering the size of "Animated" compared to the REST of the logo... --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:29, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

:I think it should remain [[Transformers Animated]]. Just [[Animated]] is too confusing, and we can justifiably called it Transformers Animated by the logo. Go with the less confusing one. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 06:55, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

::It's confusing ANYWAY, since we now have the term "Transformers Animated continuity" to refer to Transformers Animated and "Animated continuity" to refer to the G1 cartoons. -[[User:Rotty|Rotty]] 06:58, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

:::Well if we just went with [[Animated]] we'd have an article named [[Animated (cartoon)]]. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 07:19, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
::::And if this franchise gets a comic, we'll have the "Animated animated continuity" and the "Animated comics continuity." Heh. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 09:00, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

::::And then if there's an official Flash animated comic strip, we'd have "animated continuity", "Animated animated continuity", "Animated comic continuity", and "animated comic continuity". -[[User:Rotty|Rotty]] 09:34, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

== TFA abbreviation? ==

I think, because of how common a word "animated" is and how many things on this Wiki it could refer to we should stick to the full "Transformers: Animated" to avoid confusion or weirdness. I'd also suggest the abreviation "TFA" to be its descriptor, thusly [[Optimus Prime (TFA)]].--[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 11:01, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

:I don't know. I'd prefer to stick with Animated. We could always change other uses of the phrase "animated continuity" to "cartoon continuity" if it became too confusing. Which might be a good idea anyway, given the use of (cartoon) for article titles. At any rate, we've got quite a a bit of time before we'll actually need to start making articles about this franchise. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:59, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

::I know it seems to be the way we're going, and so be it if so, but I want to state that, convention be damned, I really think refering to this continuity as JUST "Animated" is both counterintuitive and uneedingly confusing. There are times when breaking convention serves everyone better. The chategory "Animated characters" for instance is just screaming to be missunderstood. I just think the full Transformers: Animated, TF: Animated, or abreviating TFA would all be better choices. Just wanted to say it, however we finally choose to go.--ZacWilliam 03:24, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I don't see how "Transformers Animated characters" is any less confusing than "Animated characters" to a casual browser. It's not like that adjective narrows anything down on this wiki. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 04:03, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
::::Perhaps not, but [[Transformers: Animated]] is considerably less confusing than either. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 04:10, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::Except the series isn't "Transformers: Animated". The press materials call it --and even THEY put it in quotes-- "Transformers Animated". --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 04:34, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
::::::That's their problem. Why does that necessarily dictate our category names?
::::::We use <nowiki>[[Category: Beast Wars]] and not [[Category: Beast Wars Transformers]]</nowiki> even though the latter is the name of the franchise. We adjusted it to fit our needs. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 04:43, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::::I was going to abbreviate this series "AN," until I realized that talking about "AN episode" or "AN Optimus Prime" just makes you look like you're trying to be a hairsplitter. Transformers has been ruined, or at least my system of talking about it. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 15:17, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::::: Worse what hapens when there are multiple and you have to talk about "an AN episode" or "An An Optimus" that's just plain aweful. That's why I'm saying "TFA" I mean "TFA Megatron" or a "TFA episode" works fine.--[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 15:44, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
::::::::: You mean Transformers Armada Megatron or a Transformers Armada episode? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:24, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
::::::::::Well, if "Arm" and "UT" weren't pretty well established maybe, even so I'd call it the less confusing of the options other than just using the whole word as Derik says below, wich is slightly long to type, but IS plenty clear for a character tag I guess. --[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 20:22, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::::::::"Arm" is well-established? I've never SEEN it before! But I've seen TFA used for it plenty of times. But as Derik says, it's an irrelevant topic for the wiki, as nothing will have to abbreviate it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:04, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
:::::::::: ...how did this subject move to the disambig suffixes? Those will be (Animated). They're less prone to confusion than the categories and article titles. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 16:41, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
I move this discussion be '''shelved for a few months''' in the hopes that an appropriate nomenclature will arise in the fandom we can use. The series is slated for 2008, the scale of the changes we'll need to make this fall (if we choose to make changes) will still be manageable. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:50, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

==Scale==
Am I the only one who thinks there are going to be scale issues coming? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 22:02, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
:How would you even define "scale issues" in relation to TFs. Nothing Transformers has EVER been in scale with anything else.--[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 22:27, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
::I believe he's referrign to he fact that Ratchet seems to be ''exactly'' the same size in vehicle mode (which we will be able to see at some point) but it the size of Bulkhead's forearm in robot mode. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 22:30, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
:::It's interesting, but given all the size changing in G1 between modes (and not even the really obvious stuff) it's never going to be enough to put even a dent in the vast and eldritch disregard the Transformers franchise has always held for scale.--[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 22:33, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

===Sarcasm===

Am I the only one who thinks the level of sarcasm on this page is a bit much. We get the point.
:I kind of agree. The series isn't even out yet but already this page seems dated--it's like a time capsule to June. Lemme work on it. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 18:11, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
::I think it would be a disservice to not note the FACT that vast swaths of fandom treated this series as Worse Than Hitler at first glance. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 21:26, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
:::It is noted, in the second paragraph commenting on the inital over reaction. But the rest is just...well, mean really. I din't like the designs when the image was released either, but I'm looking forward to the series now. It just seems to be kinda nasty at the basic heart of it all.

:::Anyone think we need a <nowiki>{{toosnarky}}</nowiki> template? There's a lot of snark sneaking into articles that ought not be as snarky lately. We're weed-whacking it back into place with relative ease at the moment- but I think that for a lot of new users, the discussions about ''de-snarking'' are relatively invisible, while the snark in articles is easy to see. This creates a positive feedback scenario, where they perceive forces only encouraging the addition of snark, and do not notice the need for its moderation.
:::I believe a de-snarking "It's been suggested this page has too much funny and it's interfering with the delivery of information" template would make the need for it not to ''get in the way'' of articles more visible to users, who otherwise only see the jokes. (While also articulating to the anti-humor assholes that we're okay with humor as long as it ''doesn't'' interfere with the delivery of information.) -<span style="font-family: Monotype Corsiva; font-size: 15px;">[[User:Derik|Derik]]</span> 00:01, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

:but that doesn't point out something like "excessive sarcasm that just seems to be in for the wrong reasons". Which I think is the main problem. Funny good, gittery, bad. {{unsigned|84.18.160.11}}

::::I'd proposed an "excessive sarcasm" template or somesuch before. I even have the image to use and quote...
::::[[Image:Rattrap-smirk.gif]] "No, I mean take a ''submarine''!"
::::(Yeah, the image is from a different episode and quote, but I don't care.) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 00:10, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
::::[[Image:Toosnarky1.jpg]]
::::Man, it's hard to find a good Nightbeat icon for that which doesn't need dialogue. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:16, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Heh. Well, I want to have a BW-based template in there SOMEWHERE... and Rattrap and sarcasm just GO together. Wanna make sure our templates have franchise variety. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 00:23, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

== Is the Autobots always going to be the Civilian ground vehicle? ==

Is the Autobots(Automobile bots) going to be civilian ground vehicles like cars again, not anything flying nor military vehicles like C-17 Globemaster 3s? Is the Decepticons going to be the military vehicles and flying vehicles like always? The Decepticons are known for their air power due to the Seekers. I hope you know it.

:The Animated Autobots already have a non-civilian vehicle alt-mode: Ratchet (and the Dinobots aren't even vehicles). Police and Fire& Rescue vehicles are by definition not-civilian. There's only been a few time that the vehicular Autobots were all ground vehicles: G1 in 1984, RID prior to the release of Storm Jet (and all of ''Car Robots'') ''Armada'' prior to the release of Jetfire, and Classics prior to the release of Jetfire. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 18:58, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

You didn't answer the Decepticon question! How the fuck am I going to know that the factions are going to be unbalanced. OH by the way, The funny Stays!<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Suki Brits

2007-09-22T23:14:46Z

69.234.145.190: Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker

OH MY GOD YOU'RE REALLY NEALE DAVIDSON!!!! [[User:Hooper X|Hooper X]] 05:21, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

==Pat Lee==
But it IS factual! That's what he wrote on his webpage! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:09, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
:Holy friggin' crazy. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 20:31, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

==You are now an Admin==

Hi Suki Brits, I've made you and ItsWalky admins for this wiki. I'm glad you can help :) Let me know if there is anything you need help with or can't do. Please have a look at [[Wikicities:Help:Administrators' how-to guide]] for the basics, and let me know if you want more admins added - two should start you off, but you may want more in time. Thanks again -- [[User:Sannse|sannse]] [[User talk:Sannse|(talk)]] 12:53, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

...so 'sexy piece of autobot ass' goes, but 'masteurjailbate' stays? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 06:20, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

:Sure, why not. The captions aren't supposed to be serious, and mostly, I can't think of anything to put in there instead. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 06:33, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

::The image caption is also phrased in a way to not sound like it's endorsing pedophilia. Bonus points for that. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:40, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

== Ep Template comments ==

Hi. Thanks for your feedback. The bright colors had fit in better with the design of my personal TF website, which already had more color; thus it didn't stand out as much. But here I can see your point, as the style of this wiki is pretty plain to begin with, such bright colors do stand out, and I can sort of see how they might be distracting. I like the idea of having some color in the table to help as an extra visual identifier of the groups. I have therefore muted the colors. Please check it out and let me know if you find it less distracting now. [[User:Telet093|Telet093]] 18:22, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

== Re: "vandalism" ==

I'm very sorry you consider that editing an entry to reflect a neutral point of view is considered to be vandalism.

My experience with Wikis so far has been that they are information resources, and while I don't object to humour being used in an entry, there is a certain amount of self-indulgent college-humour that diminishes potential of the resource.

That said, I respect that I am a newcomer to the community, and will do my best to insert a fart joke into a suitable entry at the first opportunity, in order to gain editorial approval. :)

:Thanks for the reply. I think what concerned me with the [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]] article is that the caption that was there was expressing an opinion, *and* wasn't particularly funny. That being the case, I figured boring but accurate beat lame and indulgent, though it seems we differ on this.

:Like I say, I have no problem with things that are actually *funny*, but why leave something like [[Overhaul (G1)|this]] intact? It's restating something that's stated far better further down the page, and isn't actually funny, and has terrible grammar. When I changed it to something more sensible, it got reverted. Another example [[Abdul Fakkadi|here]] - this caption could be interpreted as a homosexual slur. To my mind, things like this *do* interfere with the quality of the articles. It looks amateurish, and this reflects on how worthwhile the wiki is as a whole.

::How could "Kneel before my epaulettes" '''possibly''' be taken as a homosexual slur? He's a self-important guy in a silly suit. The 'kneel' part is clearly imperious, not sexual. And why would kneeling inply ''homo''sexulity anyway? Can't girls kneel before the socialist might of Abdul Fakkadi? And even if it was- how is Abdul Fakkadi asking someone to serve him sexually a slur? Do you think any any homosexual act is inherntly degrading, and thus a slur?
::I mean, christ, get it right. Abdul Fakkadi is offensive to muslims, not gays.

::Look, here si what we concluded. "The main wikipedia has Transformers articles. If you can't figure out that orange guy is Grapple without a caption saying 'a picture of Grapple,' you belong there, not here. Teletraan 1 inherently assumes that you already have a decent-enough familiarity with Transformers to keep up with the way the articles are written. It's FOR FANS." And that means it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:50, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

:::The "homosexual slur" comment was regarding [http://transformers.wikia.com/index.php?title=Abdul_Fakkadi&oldid=21917 this caption]. Which was more making fun of people who WOULD make that joke, but since the joke had to be made in the process, it's easy to misinterpret. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:25, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Ha! I mean... ha.
::::Anyway, he's allowed to say that. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:44, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::True, it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. But neither does it have to be one huge puerile fanboy in-joke. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 01:24, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

:I know that this stuff relating to use of humour is kind of spelled out in "Tone and Voice", but are we just giving licence to subjective standards of humour that detract from the quality of the information overall? How much is too much? Is it only you and ItsWalky who decide? Is this the best place to discuss this? I really want to make a useful contribution to this wiki, and I'm happy to be advised on how to do that, but I need to feel that differences of interpretation and presentation are going to be respected, which is really about the only way that wikis can work. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 14:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
::"He blowed up real good", I believe, is perfectly fine to have in the bio of a hi-then-die character, even if it restates it in the fiction section. Of course, that's largely my history in newspaper journalism talking, where all the important information is included in the first paragraph and then everything is elaborated in further paragraphs. This way, someone can get an idea of the most important attributes of the character without having to read the entire page. With this in mind, it's perfectly fine to mention that the character only shows up to die in his profile. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:06, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

== Question regarding a broad topic ==
Hi there,

I was wondering if, as an admin, you could please advise me on something? How can I go about fielding a question/suggestion for general discussion in a more systemic way than just on individual talk pages? It's just that I have a differing perspective on the way that this wikia designates certain continuity issues, and it's something that effects many entries. Naturally I don't want to go around unilaterally changing things to reflect my point of view, but I can't see any more general forum to discuss this. On Wookieepedia, the Star Wars wiki, they have a page they call the Senate Hall where people can discuss general topics concerning the site. Is there any way we could do something similar here? Failing that, how would you advise me to go about raising my issues for borader discussion?

To just give you an idea of what I'm talking about: I approve of the way that the site views the various different continuity families as taking place in alternative realities (obviously), however, I find the consistant use of phrasing which treats the Optimus Prime (and Megatron) character in different continuities as wholly different people poblematic. I view Optimus Prime in G1, RID and the Unicron Trilogy (for example) as being alternate reality versions of the same character, rather than wholly different characters with the same name and very similar personalities, which seems to be the way this site treats them. Although there is some argument to be made that this is the case in Japan where Convoy, Fire Convoy and Galaxy Convoy are not neccessarily alts of the same person (especially given the proliferation of Prime-lookalike convoys in the BWII & BWNeo), I think that American fictions consistently portray them as being different versions of the same individual, ala the common device of different versions of the same person in alternate universes as used in sundry sci-fi. Now granted most other instances of name-reuse (particularly in the Unicron Trilogy) give no indication of implying that, say, Armada Cyclonus is in any way and alternate version of G1 Cyclonus, but I think that with Prime and Megs this is clearly different.

On a similar note, I disagree with the inclusion of IDW's "neo-G1" continuity being included in the pages relating to other G1 characters. Although clearly very closely based on G1, the IDWverse is extremely different from any prior incarnation of G1, and is certainly far more different from any prior version than any of the orginal G1 fictions (or even Dreamwave for that matter) differed from each other, if you follow my drift. The entire war/premise/scenario is radically different and most characters have different altmodes and/or transformation schemes. If the forthcoming live-action movie is being considered adequately different from G1 to be considered outside of the G1 continuity family, then I would argue that the IDWverse should be as well.

...Anyway, that gives you an idea of what I want to discuss. ;-) Can you please advise me how I could most effectively air these issues to the wider usership?

Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
===Central Discussion Area===
:Thanks for that to you and Steve-o. We've got a small trickle of discussion on my topic happening over there now. I invite you to join in. Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

==Blackarachnia 'vandalism'==
ENOUGH with the accusations of vandalism, alright? I'm a member of Ben Yee's Transformers board, and there was a discussion on BA's telekinesis in relation to her mind link with Tarantulas. Pretty much everyone on there agreed that the theory is viable (the thread has subsequently been deleted for a while, but I'm sure I can find it in the archives). I'm honestly shocked at how staunchly you guys are REFUSING to even consider it; all the evidence is right there clear as crystal in the cartoon. BA and Tarantulas shared a mind link with each other that lasted four episodes. The mind link went both ways and was forced on BA until it was terminated equally as forcefully in Tangled Web. BA retained, at the very least, a great deal of Tarantulas' memories after the link was severed. The link was so powerful, that Tarantulas felt the pain BA experienced from energon radiation when she threatened suicide, and would've destroyed them both through the link had she made good on her threat. The link was confirmed in dialogue to be psychic in nature, which is why Megatron didn't detect any communications transmissions when they used the link to communicate. And, miraculously, after she became TM2, BA gained telekinesis. Oh, and at ''no point'' is it stated that the TM2 process granted a Transformer new abilities besides enhancing their existing powers and granting them spark-powered healing abilities. Hence, BA's telekinesis must've come from ''somewhere'', and her former mind link with Tarantulas makes the most sense. If you want to talk about 'wild rumors', there's a thread on Ben Yee's boards on ''how'' Tarantulas initiated the link, with the most common theory that he 'downloaded' himself into her mind, which coincidentally further establishes the "BA's telekinesis was her mind link with Tarantulas upgraded" theory.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

* right, and all of the other theories and speculation remaining on the other wiki pages on this site are more substantiated. Please. Not only are many of them far fetched, but they don't even have one reference of evidence to support them. Watch Beast Wars again, and it's clear that this theory is implied in-show, if not stated directly. Seriously, I'm really starting to wonder if you guys even watch the shows, considering how little you seem to know about them.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

== CSS change ==

Hello Suiki, I'm requesting a change to the sitewide CSS file. I've tested these changes locally and everything seems to be working fine. Additionally- these changes are fully namespaced (which is to say they cannot cause accidental problems with other layout elements.)

Please edit the page at [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]], and replace everything after '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' with the full contents of the [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css|CSS talk page]].

This update consists of the new styles for the tobedeleted template (now merged with the old markup for the cleanup template) as well as some Wikimedia-standard table styles.-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:43, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:45, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you. I'll work on the actual template text to put it more in line with your wishes. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:46, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

=== CSS change 2 ===
Adding the the requested [[Template:Merge]], the actual ''text'' of the template is subject tt change, but the CSS is finalized for the requested image.

Can you please replace everything in [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]] between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''/* wikitable/prettytable class for skinning normal tables */''' with the contents of the discussion page: [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css]]? (For the future, is it easier to do this in parts like this, or should I put the entire modified monobook css in the discussion page for a simple cut-and-paste?)

This also includes a general-purpose 'tt1_nowrap' class, since Steve-o was looking for a way to do that a month or so back. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 3===
NN. Think this is the ''last'' of the requested templates. Could you please replace the parts between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

I'd put in links but- seriously, look up one paragraph. ;-) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done! --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 01:54, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 4===
Replace between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

Spoiler template ''someone'' suggested aeons ago, tough less obtrusive than the others. (I really hope this is the last one.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 04:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 5===
Hey Suki, could you add the following code to the end of the [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css|site Monobook file]]? The class is used by used the wikimedia-standard template [[Template:Reflist]].

<pre><nowiki>
/* small footnotes for the reflist template */

.references-small { font-size:92%; }
</nowiki></pre>
-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:It is done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 02:08, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you! Also, thanks for the revision of the Don Murphy article (before I blanked it.) Your note that was only one of 3 producers prompted a last minute change to my own version to reflect that. (I should have known, because I was just reading an article about those 3 squabbling to take sole credit for TF's success in the press.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 07:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

== Help please! ==
Hello there,
I'm hoping you can help me out, please. For some reason which is quite beyond my
understanding, It'sWalky has blocked me from Teletraan 1 (Re: Block ID is #49). The stated reason is "vandalism", which is patently absurd. Although I have strived to be polite at
all times, he has made more thanone hostile comments towards me over recent months
and I must protest that this current block is thoroughly unreasonable.
If the action which he is referring to as so-called "vandalism" is the incident
I THINK he means, then I respecfully suggest that he is grossly overstepping his
authority and quite possibly just has something against me personally, although
heaven knows why...

All I have done was post a very SHORT, admittedly somewhat gratuitous comment on
TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus of
a small number of users in a Community Portal discussion) of Teletraan 1's odd
categorisation of the IDW comic continuity as part of the larger G1 continuity
while contradictorily excluding the new G1-inspired film. My felt that they
should either both be included under the G1 continuity umberella, or neither.

But regardless, I'm not here to argue my point; the comments were removed by
another user and I'm happy to leave it there, so as far as I'm concerned that
should have been the end of it. My remarks certainly were not in ANY way
obscene, abusive, or in offensive by any possible standard. How this can be
considered "vandalism" is very mysterious to me. Perhaps if we were on Wikipedia
or Wookieepedia and dealing with their very strict rules about personal opinion,
but this site is rife with sarcastic, POV, wry and humorous content. Jam-packed
full, actually. I mean, for goodness sake; if anyone's concerned about
potentially ojectionable material, then I'd hate to be a Japanese person reading
this wiki given all the jibes made at their expense. One of the things I've come
to LOVE about this wiki is its sense of humour and creative, organic style. To
call my minor snarkiness "vandalism" seems totally at odds with the mood of
Teletraan 1, in my honest opinion.

I reiterate that I feel that this block is thoroughly unreasonable and I believe
is some kind of gross overraction and/or personal grudge on the part of
It'sWalky, although I can't for the life of me understand how I could have
managed to provoke such apparent emnity.

Can you please help me out?

Thanks,
[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
:"All I have done is post a... gratuitous comment on TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus... of users in a Community Portal discussion)." I think that pretty much covers it. There was a consensus. You blatantly defied the consensus on the grounds that you disagreed with the ruling. That's vandalism. End of story. Right? [[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 00:06, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
::There was consensus to leave it be. But not consensus on the issue itself. I think the movie belongs in the Generation 1 continuity family. IIRC so does Steve-o, and he's the most logical guy on the wiki. However- there's really not enough to say for sure one way or the other.
::Now, I think as sequels and more tie-ins pileup, the movieverse will become more and more G1-like to the point the argument will resolve itself in our favor. Less a consensus than ''dente'', "hold waiting further evidence."
::Of course, PacifistPrime wasn't around last time we went five rounds on the issue, so the subtlties of the 'both sides give up without having convinced the other' situation may have escaped him.
::That said Paci, it's bad form to go running to the other site admin before Walky even has a chance to reply. You don't even knwo what Walky banned you for, how is Suki supposed to pass judgement on whether or nto to override his fellow admin? Wait until Walky replies to clarify his reasoning, ''then'' disagree with him.
::It's polite to assume Walky's acting from a reasoned standpoint at least until you can ''prove'' it's his uterus making him crazy. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:34, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::With all due respect, Derik, I DID wait a few days for Walky to reply, and he's just ignored my email. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::Mistake #1. Derik does not have due respect. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::I've reposted the content of the email on his talk page in the hopes that will get a response, but it hasn't so far. Given that I've now been blocked for something on the order of a week or possibly more, I think it's hardly unreasonable for me to take this up with another admin, surely? And if you want to talk about what's "polite", I think it would hardly have been too much to ask for Walky to have at least put some kind of short note on my talk page explaining his overzealous block, don't you think?

:::Oh, and Awa, are you seriously telling me that "defying" the consensus of a small group of users with two SMALL comments (that I obviously knew would just get deleted straight away anyway) constitutes "vandalism"? Worthy of getting blocked over? For real?
:::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::I received no such email from you. And yell all you want on the talk pages. That's what they're for. Evidence may eventually shift your way! But, in the meantime, dumping your vitrolic grievances on the articles themselves is unacceptable. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:32, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::Paci... Paci... Paci... I gave you a perfectly good excuse of not having been part of the discussion last time and misunderstanding the consensus to hide behind... and you throw it all away.
:::::And for the rest- don't post something in the main article you know is going to be deleted <strike>without logging out first</strike>, post something that encourages your opponents, however grudgingly, to include that perspective in the article even if they rewrite your words. That's part of carrying on a conversation, creating truth through consensus. Anything else... is just throwing feces.
:::::Also, if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on [http://www.shortpacked.com/ his blog], not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting! -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
...! I'm baffled.

So now I'm being accused of "vitriolic grievances", "throwing feces" and "yelling".

What utter rubbish.

I have been polite at every turn, and the very WORST I can reasonably be accused of is sarcasm (in one isolated indicent, on the aforementioned two comments on movie pages, ONLY), something which hardly seems a foreign concept to this wiki.

Walky, I sent you an email the only way I knew how: I used the "email this user" button and clicked send. I got the sender's carbon copy just fine, so I can't explain why you didn't recieve it too. If I used the system incorrectly then I apologise, but I had no reason to believe that it hadn't worked. Oh, and Derik, if your comment "if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on his blog, not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting" is intentded to be some kind of oblique suggestion that I have an interest in harassing Walky; pleeease! I have much better things to do with my time, for goodness sakes. And as I've explained to Walky in the past; I have zero interest whatsoever in blogs.

I am still amazed that any of this is considered reasonable grounds to actually BLOCK me. Do you guys have a "0.5 Strikes & yer out!" policy or something? Considering all the casual rudeness that goes around on the talk pages here, I find it hard to believe that my treatment reflects standard policy. Or do you treat everyone like this?

Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked? And its that it? As far as I can tell my block is permanent. Is this so?

I am NOT a troublemaker, even though you seem to have already tried and convicted me as such. All I want to do is be a part of this wiki, make small contributions, start the occasional article and have polite, rational discussions. Am I really to be banned for using a little sarcasm...?

[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

P.S. Given that I addressed all of this to SukiBrits in the first place, I'd really appreciate it if Suki would weigh in at some point too, please. I'd really like to resolve this tiresome matter ASAP.

:''Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked?'' You were blocked for intentionally, blatantly defying the consensus of a protracted discussion which you instigated and in which you were the only person advocating your position. It was extremely un-gentlemanly, and moderately pissy. Based on what you've written in the last couple days, I can accept that you were just "lashing out" and didn't really expect your comments to stay in the articles, but personally I still consider that to be disrespectful. You shouldn't make an edit which you know/expect will be reverted. I thought the 3-month duration on your block was excessive (and it's now been reduced), but I don't think being blocked in the first place, temporarily, is beyond reason for something like that. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:43, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Other users, including the admin who banned you in the first place, have already weighed in on ''why'' you were banned. I was not responsible for doing it, so frankly, anything further I have to say on the subject would just be repeating the same. I think it's perfectly clear as it is.

I was going to post something about how I'd stick up for you if you actually gave me good reason to, but as it is, the terms of your ban have been changed to something shorter. As it is, you're back in a week. If I were you, I'd sit back and ask myself if it's ''really'' worth fighting over that.

So there's your second chance. If you come back in a week and respect what your fellow editors have told you not to do, you'll be fine. And if there really ''is'' something unfair, I'll listen and advocate for you. But I would keep in mind that you're on thin ice as it is, and playing this victim crap isn't going to help you out much. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:23, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

:He was whiny about it too. It's not like his approach was "seriously guys, this seems excessive and can I talk about it and demonstrate that your impression of my maturity was incorrect," it was really more "Noo! this is so ''unfair''! Why me? You all suck and I shouldn't be held accountable for my actions b'cause I knew someone else was going to clean up my slop!"
:It's probably ''fortunate'' that the original penalty was (accidentally?) excessive-- because opening the floor for a reassessment of penalties based on conduct you do not dispute and then acting like a ''whiny bitch'' practically '''begs''' for an admin to make it ''longer.''
:<small>(Why yes, i was arguing in his favor earlier! I like to cause trouble like that.)</small> -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:45, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::Oh, great: so now I'm a "''whiny bitch''" who's playing "''victim crap''", apparently.

::Charming! My goodness me, you people really are a hostile bunch aren't you?

::So, let me get this straight; [[User:FFN|FFN]] can rag on my ass every other week simply because he disagrees with me, but If I DARE to protest that I have been unreasonably treated over a sarcastic misdemeanor, then I'm a goddamn deviant leper, right? Unbelieveable...

::Okay, YES, I did a bad thing. I admit it was uncalled for, defying the consensus of, oh, about five people? Given the wide, nay EXTENSIVE use of sarcasm and fecetious comments all over this wiki I honestly didn't think it would be such a damn big deal. But okay, whatever. It was wrong, fair enough. MY BAD. All I have done since is POLITELY protest my treatment over this matter and all I've got in return is mockery, name-calling and outright hostility. I mean, seriously...! Talk about disproportionate reactions at every turn.

::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:::Sir, I would hardly call your behavior at this point "polite". I thought Suki's comment was a little much at this point because the matter had been resolved. I asked her to say something because you'd asked, but I didn't know what all she had to say.

:::Regardless, though, please cease the hostilities? Play the better man and ignore what may be said to you at this point. In only a week you'll be able to edit and work again, and then you can prove your worth that way. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 02:37, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::::Oh, so now I'M the one being hostile? How do you figure? Have I called anyone names like "whiny bitch"? No, that would be YOU guys. Have I accused other people of being "pissy" and "throwing feces"? Nup, that'd be you lot too.

::::But of course, if I have the sheer audacity to stand up for myself, well that just can't possibly be polite, I take it...

::::What a terrible, terrible person I must be. Next time I'll know to just shut up and take the abuse gratefully, since that's obviously all you folks will tolerate. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
:::::"[[Wikipedia:Martyr complex|Mew mew mew mew mew mew mew!]]"
::::: '''Not once''' have you apologized for or even acknowledged that you should be held culpable for defacing an article. You remand restitution while sneering that you should not have been punished in the first place. You throw a '''tantrum''' when someone, such as myself, tells you "Gee, while it may be true your punishment was excessive, you're acting like a whiny brat which makes me have no sympathy for you." I'm not calling for you to be re-banned- I'm pointing out a defect in your behavior I '''really''' wish you would fix in the future.
::::: Are you sure you don't want to change your user name to PassiveAgressivePrime?
::::: I don't really care what your original offense was, because you're being a colossal asshole right here, right now. ''It's a bad idea to go around pissing people off while appealing a punishment''. Just- in general. I started out basically on your side and you have none-too-gradually dis-endeared yourself of me.
::::: Please amend your stricken holier-than-thou attitude in the future. It's '''really''' annoying, and it's not at all conducive to an actual discussion of what you did or didn't do and what punishment is appropriate. It makes me want to shut you up by squashing you.
::::: And '''I'm''' the unhealthily detached one. I can't ''imagine'' what it makes someone who thinks with his woman-parts like Walky want to do. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 05:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It's interesting how I'm apparently the "colossal asshole" when it's you guys who are actually doing all the insult-hurling and name-calling. I haven't made one personal comment in this whole affair. Funny, that...

Oh, and for ther record, I HAVE apologised. More than once, actually. Get your facts straight, please.

But "PassiveAgressivePrime" is GOLD, by the way. I'd definitely declare that a genius call if it weren't such a laughable assertion.

Anyway, I've got much better things to do that take this abuse any longer. Think what you will.

Later, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:hahaha i just noticed this. GOODBYE TO ALL MY WIKI FRIENDS FOREVER!!! [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:15, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

== 3d Website ==

I remembered that you showed an interest in the Blackthorne scans and were disappointed.
Hope this is more your alley.
http://www.3dtransformers.com/ -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 12:44, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
:Yeah, I've seen that, actually. Thanks, though, it IS pretty neat. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 13:35, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

==Stubs==
I'm not arguing against removing the tag from G1 Bumblebee's page, but is there some hard-and-fast rule about what actually makes an article a stub? Feels silly asking this, and Wikipedia's article on the subject supports the "common sense" method, but I'm nothing if not stupidly cautious. I asked Walky once and he said "Empty headings = stub!", which I took to mean as "irregardless of the article length and other content".
Then again, maybe he gave such a short answer because it's a ridiculous question. But here I am asking anyway. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:38, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:I think that's a pretty good standard- if portions of the article are still stubbed in without even a overall summary, I think it qualifies as a stub. :(I agree with you that an article stops begin a stub '''before'' it is exhaustively complete.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 23:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:It's an article that's just been started and has a long way to go before completion. That's basically the definition; nothing further has been discussed or agreed on, and I don't think we NEED anything more than that. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:43, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::For clarification, I believe the article in question at the time was very much as Bumblebee's is now. It's more-or-less complete, with an introduction and many sections filled in with detail, but it also had a noteworthy number of sections that were just headers with no content.
::I ought to have been more clear with Walky way back when, I suppose. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:45, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I guess this is a discussion we DO need to have, then.
:::Wikipedia generally uses seperate stub templates for ''sections'' which aren't complete. I don't know if that's best for us, but I generally envision the stub category as being something that someone can look through for articles where ''anything'' can be added to them to be helpful; unlike Bumblebee, which while still not complete, is far from being in that state. If we really need something to indicate that the ''whole article'' isn't complete, maybe some distinction would be helpful. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:50, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::::I also want to add that I don't really feel that strongly on the matter. But I guess we probably should reach some sort of conclusion. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::I think another separate tag would be best. "Stub", as shown, could lead to more confusion down the road, but not tagging the articles I think could lead to people scanning them and not noticing empty sections which they would otherwise be able to fill in. This certainly isn't a large concern, however...
:::::This came up because of the apparent selection of Bumblebee as a featured article. Do we have some way of noting that, to spur work on it ensuring it's completed "in time"? I imagine if it's not done by July it will just be pushed back until later, but I don't see a problem in encouraging work on the Wiki. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 00:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

== Hello ==
*Hello Brits this is Troyb a admin and buericrate of your new sister or whatever wiki, its called transfanon and we need you to place the news on the front page so that we can get more users, thank you. Also I'll give you a link tommorow.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 22:59, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
: No, thank you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:19, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

*O.k. why not (Sigh...)[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 00:45, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

:Because... your fanon wiki appears to have absolutely nothing to do with actual Transformers. If it was fanon in the sense of a bunch of speculation or something, trying to fill in gaps or retcon errors... I could see linking to it someplace, as that might be useful to fans who are looking for information. But it appears to be basically a wiki for your personal fanfic or something. We don't just link to random fanfics, so why would we link to that wiki? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 14:26, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

*Fine fine fine. But it seems you hate fanon. So '''fanon hater''' I shall leave.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 21:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

==Main page links==
Hi Suki Brits. I hope you don't mind, but I added redirects to the TV and Toys pages that you'd previously deleted since these were linked from the main page and might be useful for people to find articles on those topics. [[User:Angela|Angela]]<staff /> ([[User talk:Angela|talk]]) 00:03, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

== Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73 ==

Could you click on the article link on [[Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73]] and complete the edit that it pops up with so we can get rid of the red link? --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:03, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:It would be a red link even if she did. We've broken fundamental laws of wiki reality, man.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:09, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::tested it on my talk page, and it does seem to break Wikiality. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:19, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::However it's still a redlink, in spite of your talk page undeniably existing. It's uncharted territory. If it gets any weirder it'll require Furmanisms to describe it.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::The link is hovering there, on the page, like a vast predatory bird... -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::That, or... talking like William... Shatner. --...[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:30, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::Suki did it. It's ''over''. FINISHED.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::::For me, personally... IT NEVER ENDS! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Let me give it the worst case of INDIGESTION it's ever had! --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 18:48, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:God, I'm choking on all the [[Furmanism]] here. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 19:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
But if Walky can survive the tide of Furmanisms CAN WE DO LESS?--[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]]

== Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker ==

Why the fuck you had to do the Blocking? Are you crazy? Now Nobody send messages to me. If I find you my F-35 Lightning II will fucking get you. We will forgive you if you unblock everything otherwise, the Tanks Transform and roll out.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

User talk:Suki Brits

2007-09-22T23:12:32Z

69.234.145.190: Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker

OH MY GOD YOU'RE REALLY NEALE DAVIDSON!!!! [[User:Hooper X|Hooper X]] 05:21, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

==Pat Lee==
But it IS factual! That's what he wrote on his webpage! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:09, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
:Holy friggin' crazy. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 20:31, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

==You are now an Admin==

Hi Suki Brits, I've made you and ItsWalky admins for this wiki. I'm glad you can help :) Let me know if there is anything you need help with or can't do. Please have a look at [[Wikicities:Help:Administrators' how-to guide]] for the basics, and let me know if you want more admins added - two should start you off, but you may want more in time. Thanks again -- [[User:Sannse|sannse]] [[User talk:Sannse|(talk)]] 12:53, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

...so 'sexy piece of autobot ass' goes, but 'masteurjailbate' stays? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 06:20, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

:Sure, why not. The captions aren't supposed to be serious, and mostly, I can't think of anything to put in there instead. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 06:33, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

::The image caption is also phrased in a way to not sound like it's endorsing pedophilia. Bonus points for that. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:40, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

== Ep Template comments ==

Hi. Thanks for your feedback. The bright colors had fit in better with the design of my personal TF website, which already had more color; thus it didn't stand out as much. But here I can see your point, as the style of this wiki is pretty plain to begin with, such bright colors do stand out, and I can sort of see how they might be distracting. I like the idea of having some color in the table to help as an extra visual identifier of the groups. I have therefore muted the colors. Please check it out and let me know if you find it less distracting now. [[User:Telet093|Telet093]] 18:22, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

== Re: "vandalism" ==

I'm very sorry you consider that editing an entry to reflect a neutral point of view is considered to be vandalism.

My experience with Wikis so far has been that they are information resources, and while I don't object to humour being used in an entry, there is a certain amount of self-indulgent college-humour that diminishes potential of the resource.

That said, I respect that I am a newcomer to the community, and will do my best to insert a fart joke into a suitable entry at the first opportunity, in order to gain editorial approval. :)

:Thanks for the reply. I think what concerned me with the [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]] article is that the caption that was there was expressing an opinion, *and* wasn't particularly funny. That being the case, I figured boring but accurate beat lame and indulgent, though it seems we differ on this.

:Like I say, I have no problem with things that are actually *funny*, but why leave something like [[Overhaul (G1)|this]] intact? It's restating something that's stated far better further down the page, and isn't actually funny, and has terrible grammar. When I changed it to something more sensible, it got reverted. Another example [[Abdul Fakkadi|here]] - this caption could be interpreted as a homosexual slur. To my mind, things like this *do* interfere with the quality of the articles. It looks amateurish, and this reflects on how worthwhile the wiki is as a whole.

::How could "Kneel before my epaulettes" '''possibly''' be taken as a homosexual slur? He's a self-important guy in a silly suit. The 'kneel' part is clearly imperious, not sexual. And why would kneeling inply ''homo''sexulity anyway? Can't girls kneel before the socialist might of Abdul Fakkadi? And even if it was- how is Abdul Fakkadi asking someone to serve him sexually a slur? Do you think any any homosexual act is inherntly degrading, and thus a slur?
::I mean, christ, get it right. Abdul Fakkadi is offensive to muslims, not gays.

::Look, here si what we concluded. "The main wikipedia has Transformers articles. If you can't figure out that orange guy is Grapple without a caption saying 'a picture of Grapple,' you belong there, not here. Teletraan 1 inherently assumes that you already have a decent-enough familiarity with Transformers to keep up with the way the articles are written. It's FOR FANS." And that means it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 18:50, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

:::The "homosexual slur" comment was regarding [http://transformers.wikia.com/index.php?title=Abdul_Fakkadi&oldid=21917 this caption]. Which was more making fun of people who WOULD make that joke, but since the joke had to be made in the process, it's easy to misinterpret. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 20:25, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::::Ha! I mean... ha.
::::Anyway, he's allowed to say that. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:44, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

::True, it doesn't have to be dry, informative and joyless. But neither does it have to be one huge puerile fanboy in-joke. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 01:24, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

:I know that this stuff relating to use of humour is kind of spelled out in "Tone and Voice", but are we just giving licence to subjective standards of humour that detract from the quality of the information overall? How much is too much? Is it only you and ItsWalky who decide? Is this the best place to discuss this? I really want to make a useful contribution to this wiki, and I'm happy to be advised on how to do that, but I need to feel that differences of interpretation and presentation are going to be respected, which is really about the only way that wikis can work. --[[User:Sofaman|Sofaman]] 14:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
::"He blowed up real good", I believe, is perfectly fine to have in the bio of a hi-then-die character, even if it restates it in the fiction section. Of course, that's largely my history in newspaper journalism talking, where all the important information is included in the first paragraph and then everything is elaborated in further paragraphs. This way, someone can get an idea of the most important attributes of the character without having to read the entire page. With this in mind, it's perfectly fine to mention that the character only shows up to die in his profile. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:06, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

== Question regarding a broad topic ==
Hi there,

I was wondering if, as an admin, you could please advise me on something? How can I go about fielding a question/suggestion for general discussion in a more systemic way than just on individual talk pages? It's just that I have a differing perspective on the way that this wikia designates certain continuity issues, and it's something that effects many entries. Naturally I don't want to go around unilaterally changing things to reflect my point of view, but I can't see any more general forum to discuss this. On Wookieepedia, the Star Wars wiki, they have a page they call the Senate Hall where people can discuss general topics concerning the site. Is there any way we could do something similar here? Failing that, how would you advise me to go about raising my issues for borader discussion?

To just give you an idea of what I'm talking about: I approve of the way that the site views the various different continuity families as taking place in alternative realities (obviously), however, I find the consistant use of phrasing which treats the Optimus Prime (and Megatron) character in different continuities as wholly different people poblematic. I view Optimus Prime in G1, RID and the Unicron Trilogy (for example) as being alternate reality versions of the same character, rather than wholly different characters with the same name and very similar personalities, which seems to be the way this site treats them. Although there is some argument to be made that this is the case in Japan where Convoy, Fire Convoy and Galaxy Convoy are not neccessarily alts of the same person (especially given the proliferation of Prime-lookalike convoys in the BWII & BWNeo), I think that American fictions consistently portray them as being different versions of the same individual, ala the common device of different versions of the same person in alternate universes as used in sundry sci-fi. Now granted most other instances of name-reuse (particularly in the Unicron Trilogy) give no indication of implying that, say, Armada Cyclonus is in any way and alternate version of G1 Cyclonus, but I think that with Prime and Megs this is clearly different.

On a similar note, I disagree with the inclusion of IDW's "neo-G1" continuity being included in the pages relating to other G1 characters. Although clearly very closely based on G1, the IDWverse is extremely different from any prior incarnation of G1, and is certainly far more different from any prior version than any of the orginal G1 fictions (or even Dreamwave for that matter) differed from each other, if you follow my drift. The entire war/premise/scenario is radically different and most characters have different altmodes and/or transformation schemes. If the forthcoming live-action movie is being considered adequately different from G1 to be considered outside of the G1 continuity family, then I would argue that the IDWverse should be as well.

...Anyway, that gives you an idea of what I want to discuss. ;-) Can you please advise me how I could most effectively air these issues to the wider usership?

Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
===Central Discussion Area===
:Thanks for that to you and Steve-o. We've got a small trickle of discussion on my topic happening over there now. I invite you to join in. Thanks, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

==Blackarachnia 'vandalism'==
ENOUGH with the accusations of vandalism, alright? I'm a member of Ben Yee's Transformers board, and there was a discussion on BA's telekinesis in relation to her mind link with Tarantulas. Pretty much everyone on there agreed that the theory is viable (the thread has subsequently been deleted for a while, but I'm sure I can find it in the archives). I'm honestly shocked at how staunchly you guys are REFUSING to even consider it; all the evidence is right there clear as crystal in the cartoon. BA and Tarantulas shared a mind link with each other that lasted four episodes. The mind link went both ways and was forced on BA until it was terminated equally as forcefully in Tangled Web. BA retained, at the very least, a great deal of Tarantulas' memories after the link was severed. The link was so powerful, that Tarantulas felt the pain BA experienced from energon radiation when she threatened suicide, and would've destroyed them both through the link had she made good on her threat. The link was confirmed in dialogue to be psychic in nature, which is why Megatron didn't detect any communications transmissions when they used the link to communicate. And, miraculously, after she became TM2, BA gained telekinesis. Oh, and at ''no point'' is it stated that the TM2 process granted a Transformer new abilities besides enhancing their existing powers and granting them spark-powered healing abilities. Hence, BA's telekinesis must've come from ''somewhere'', and her former mind link with Tarantulas makes the most sense. If you want to talk about 'wild rumors', there's a thread on Ben Yee's boards on ''how'' Tarantulas initiated the link, with the most common theory that he 'downloaded' himself into her mind, which coincidentally further establishes the "BA's telekinesis was her mind link with Tarantulas upgraded" theory.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

* right, and all of the other theories and speculation remaining on the other wiki pages on this site are more substantiated. Please. Not only are many of them far fetched, but they don't even have one reference of evidence to support them. Watch Beast Wars again, and it's clear that this theory is implied in-show, if not stated directly. Seriously, I'm really starting to wonder if you guys even watch the shows, considering how little you seem to know about them.[[User:66.233.183.59|66.233.183.59]] 23:11, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

== CSS change ==

Hello Suiki, I'm requesting a change to the sitewide CSS file. I've tested these changes locally and everything seems to be working fine. Additionally- these changes are fully namespaced (which is to say they cannot cause accidental problems with other layout elements.)

Please edit the page at [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]], and replace everything after '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' with the full contents of the [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css|CSS talk page]].

This update consists of the new styles for the tobedeleted template (now merged with the old markup for the cleanup template) as well as some Wikimedia-standard table styles.-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:43, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:45, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you. I'll work on the actual template text to put it more in line with your wishes. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:46, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

=== CSS change 2 ===
Adding the the requested [[Template:Merge]], the actual ''text'' of the template is subject tt change, but the CSS is finalized for the requested image.

Can you please replace everything in [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css]] between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''/* wikitable/prettytable class for skinning normal tables */''' with the contents of the discussion page: [[MediaWiki_talk:Monobook.css]]? (For the future, is it easier to do this in parts like this, or should I put the entire modified monobook css in the discussion page for a simple cut-and-paste?)

This also includes a general-purpose 'tt1_nowrap' class, since Steve-o was looking for a way to do that a month or so back. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 20:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 3===
NN. Think this is the ''last'' of the requested templates. Could you please replace the parts between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

I'd put in links but- seriously, look up one paragraph. ;-) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done! --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 01:54, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 4===
Replace between '''/* Teletran-1 specicic bits */''' and '''.tt1_nowrap''' with the contents of the discussion page?

Spoiler template ''someone'' suggested aeons ago, tough less obtrusive than the others. (I really hope this is the last one.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
:Done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 04:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

===CSS change 5===
Hey Suki, could you add the following code to the end of the [[MediaWiki:Monobook.css|site Monobook file]]? The class is used by used the wikimedia-standard template [[Template:Reflist]].

<pre><nowiki>
/* small footnotes for the reflist template */

.references-small { font-size:92%; }
</nowiki></pre>
-[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
:It is done. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 02:08, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
::Thank you! Also, thanks for the revision of the Don Murphy article (before I blanked it.) Your note that was only one of 3 producers prompted a last minute change to my own version to reflect that. (I should have known, because I was just reading an article about those 3 squabbling to take sole credit for TF's success in the press.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 07:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

== Help please! ==
Hello there,
I'm hoping you can help me out, please. For some reason which is quite beyond my
understanding, It'sWalky has blocked me from Teletraan 1 (Re: Block ID is #49). The stated reason is "vandalism", which is patently absurd. Although I have strived to be polite at
all times, he has made more thanone hostile comments towards me over recent months
and I must protest that this current block is thoroughly unreasonable.
If the action which he is referring to as so-called "vandalism" is the incident
I THINK he means, then I respecfully suggest that he is grossly overstepping his
authority and quite possibly just has something against me personally, although
heaven knows why...

All I have done was post a very SHORT, admittedly somewhat gratuitous comment on
TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus of
a small number of users in a Community Portal discussion) of Teletraan 1's odd
categorisation of the IDW comic continuity as part of the larger G1 continuity
while contradictorily excluding the new G1-inspired film. My felt that they
should either both be included under the G1 continuity umberella, or neither.

But regardless, I'm not here to argue my point; the comments were removed by
another user and I'm happy to leave it there, so as far as I'm concerned that
should have been the end of it. My remarks certainly were not in ANY way
obscene, abusive, or in offensive by any possible standard. How this can be
considered "vandalism" is very mysterious to me. Perhaps if we were on Wikipedia
or Wookieepedia and dealing with their very strict rules about personal opinion,
but this site is rife with sarcastic, POV, wry and humorous content. Jam-packed
full, actually. I mean, for goodness sake; if anyone's concerned about
potentially ojectionable material, then I'd hate to be a Japanese person reading
this wiki given all the jibes made at their expense. One of the things I've come
to LOVE about this wiki is its sense of humour and creative, organic style. To
call my minor snarkiness "vandalism" seems totally at odds with the mood of
Teletraan 1, in my honest opinion.

I reiterate that I feel that this block is thoroughly unreasonable and I believe
is some kind of gross overraction and/or personal grudge on the part of
It'sWalky, although I can't for the life of me understand how I could have
managed to provoke such apparent emnity.

Can you please help me out?

Thanks,
[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
:"All I have done is post a... gratuitous comment on TWO Movie-related pages regarding my opinion (which went against a consensus... of users in a Community Portal discussion)." I think that pretty much covers it. There was a consensus. You blatantly defied the consensus on the grounds that you disagreed with the ruling. That's vandalism. End of story. Right? [[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 00:06, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
::There was consensus to leave it be. But not consensus on the issue itself. I think the movie belongs in the Generation 1 continuity family. IIRC so does Steve-o, and he's the most logical guy on the wiki. However- there's really not enough to say for sure one way or the other.
::Now, I think as sequels and more tie-ins pileup, the movieverse will become more and more G1-like to the point the argument will resolve itself in our favor. Less a consensus than ''dente'', "hold waiting further evidence."
::Of course, PacifistPrime wasn't around last time we went five rounds on the issue, so the subtlties of the 'both sides give up without having convinced the other' situation may have escaped him.
::That said Paci, it's bad form to go running to the other site admin before Walky even has a chance to reply. You don't even knwo what Walky banned you for, how is Suki supposed to pass judgement on whether or nto to override his fellow admin? Wait until Walky replies to clarify his reasoning, ''then'' disagree with him.
::It's polite to assume Walky's acting from a reasoned standpoint at least until you can ''prove'' it's his uterus making him crazy. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:34, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::With all due respect, Derik, I DID wait a few days for Walky to reply, and he's just ignored my email. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::Mistake #1. Derik does not have due respect. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::I've reposted the content of the email on his talk page in the hopes that will get a response, but it hasn't so far. Given that I've now been blocked for something on the order of a week or possibly more, I think it's hardly unreasonable for me to take this up with another admin, surely? And if you want to talk about what's "polite", I think it would hardly have been too much to ask for Walky to have at least put some kind of short note on my talk page explaining his overzealous block, don't you think?

:::Oh, and Awa, are you seriously telling me that "defying" the consensus of a small group of users with two SMALL comments (that I obviously knew would just get deleted straight away anyway) constitutes "vandalism"? Worthy of getting blocked over? For real?
:::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]]
::::I received no such email from you. And yell all you want on the talk pages. That's what they're for. Evidence may eventually shift your way! But, in the meantime, dumping your vitrolic grievances on the articles themselves is unacceptable. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:32, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::Paci... Paci... Paci... I gave you a perfectly good excuse of not having been part of the discussion last time and misunderstanding the consensus to hide behind... and you throw it all away.
:::::And for the rest- don't post something in the main article you know is going to be deleted <strike>without logging out first</strike>, post something that encourages your opponents, however grudgingly, to include that perspective in the article even if they rewrite your words. That's part of carrying on a conversation, creating truth through consensus. Anything else... is just throwing feces.
:::::Also, if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on [http://www.shortpacked.com/ his blog], not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting! -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:56, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
...! I'm baffled.

So now I'm being accused of "vitriolic grievances", "throwing feces" and "yelling".

What utter rubbish.

I have been polite at every turn, and the very WORST I can reasonably be accused of is sarcasm (in one isolated indicent, on the aforementioned two comments on movie pages, ONLY), something which hardly seems a foreign concept to this wiki.

Walky, I sent you an email the only way I knew how: I used the "email this user" button and clicked send. I got the sender's carbon copy just fine, so I can't explain why you didn't recieve it too. If I used the system incorrectly then I apologise, but I had no reason to believe that it hadn't worked. Oh, and Derik, if your comment "if you ''really'' want to get Walky's attention, hit him on his blog, not via e-mail. He allows anonymous posting" is intentded to be some kind of oblique suggestion that I have an interest in harassing Walky; pleeease! I have much better things to do with my time, for goodness sakes. And as I've explained to Walky in the past; I have zero interest whatsoever in blogs.

I am still amazed that any of this is considered reasonable grounds to actually BLOCK me. Do you guys have a "0.5 Strikes & yer out!" policy or something? Considering all the casual rudeness that goes around on the talk pages here, I find it hard to believe that my treatment reflects standard policy. Or do you treat everyone like this?

Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked? And its that it? As far as I can tell my block is permanent. Is this so?

I am NOT a troublemaker, even though you seem to have already tried and convicted me as such. All I want to do is be a part of this wiki, make small contributions, start the occasional article and have polite, rational discussions. Am I really to be banned for using a little sarcasm...?

[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

P.S. Given that I addressed all of this to SukiBrits in the first place, I'd really appreciate it if Suki would weigh in at some point too, please. I'd really like to resolve this tiresome matter ASAP.

:''Could someone PLEASE do me the simple courtesy of giving me a reasonable explanation why I deserve to be blocked?'' You were blocked for intentionally, blatantly defying the consensus of a protracted discussion which you instigated and in which you were the only person advocating your position. It was extremely un-gentlemanly, and moderately pissy. Based on what you've written in the last couple days, I can accept that you were just "lashing out" and didn't really expect your comments to stay in the articles, but personally I still consider that to be disrespectful. You shouldn't make an edit which you know/expect will be reverted. I thought the 3-month duration on your block was excessive (and it's now been reduced), but I don't think being blocked in the first place, temporarily, is beyond reason for something like that. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:43, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Other users, including the admin who banned you in the first place, have already weighed in on ''why'' you were banned. I was not responsible for doing it, so frankly, anything further I have to say on the subject would just be repeating the same. I think it's perfectly clear as it is.

I was going to post something about how I'd stick up for you if you actually gave me good reason to, but as it is, the terms of your ban have been changed to something shorter. As it is, you're back in a week. If I were you, I'd sit back and ask myself if it's ''really'' worth fighting over that.

So there's your second chance. If you come back in a week and respect what your fellow editors have told you not to do, you'll be fine. And if there really ''is'' something unfair, I'll listen and advocate for you. But I would keep in mind that you're on thin ice as it is, and playing this victim crap isn't going to help you out much. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:23, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

:He was whiny about it too. It's not like his approach was "seriously guys, this seems excessive and can I talk about it and demonstrate that your impression of my maturity was incorrect," it was really more "Noo! this is so ''unfair''! Why me? You all suck and I shouldn't be held accountable for my actions b'cause I knew someone else was going to clean up my slop!"
:It's probably ''fortunate'' that the original penalty was (accidentally?) excessive-- because opening the floor for a reassessment of penalties based on conduct you do not dispute and then acting like a ''whiny bitch'' practically '''begs''' for an admin to make it ''longer.''
:<small>(Why yes, i was arguing in his favor earlier! I like to cause trouble like that.)</small> -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:45, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::Oh, great: so now I'm a "''whiny bitch''" who's playing "''victim crap''", apparently.

::Charming! My goodness me, you people really are a hostile bunch aren't you?

::So, let me get this straight; [[User:FFN|FFN]] can rag on my ass every other week simply because he disagrees with me, but If I DARE to protest that I have been unreasonably treated over a sarcastic misdemeanor, then I'm a goddamn deviant leper, right? Unbelieveable...

::Okay, YES, I did a bad thing. I admit it was uncalled for, defying the consensus of, oh, about five people? Given the wide, nay EXTENSIVE use of sarcasm and fecetious comments all over this wiki I honestly didn't think it would be such a damn big deal. But okay, whatever. It was wrong, fair enough. MY BAD. All I have done since is POLITELY protest my treatment over this matter and all I've got in return is mockery, name-calling and outright hostility. I mean, seriously...! Talk about disproportionate reactions at every turn.

::[[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:::Sir, I would hardly call your behavior at this point "polite". I thought Suki's comment was a little much at this point because the matter had been resolved. I asked her to say something because you'd asked, but I didn't know what all she had to say.

:::Regardless, though, please cease the hostilities? Play the better man and ignore what may be said to you at this point. In only a week you'll be able to edit and work again, and then you can prove your worth that way. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 02:37, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

::::Oh, so now I'M the one being hostile? How do you figure? Have I called anyone names like "whiny bitch"? No, that would be YOU guys. Have I accused other people of being "pissy" and "throwing feces"? Nup, that'd be you lot too.

::::But of course, if I have the sheer audacity to stand up for myself, well that just can't possibly be polite, I take it...

::::What a terrible, terrible person I must be. Next time I'll know to just shut up and take the abuse gratefully, since that's obviously all you folks will tolerate. [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].
:::::"[[Wikipedia:Martyr complex|Mew mew mew mew mew mew mew!]]"
::::: '''Not once''' have you apologized for or even acknowledged that you should be held culpable for defacing an article. You remand restitution while sneering that you should not have been punished in the first place. You throw a '''tantrum''' when someone, such as myself, tells you "Gee, while it may be true your punishment was excessive, you're acting like a whiny brat which makes me have no sympathy for you." I'm not calling for you to be re-banned- I'm pointing out a defect in your behavior I '''really''' wish you would fix in the future.
::::: Are you sure you don't want to change your user name to PassiveAgressivePrime?
::::: I don't really care what your original offense was, because you're being a colossal asshole right here, right now. ''It's a bad idea to go around pissing people off while appealing a punishment''. Just- in general. I started out basically on your side and you have none-too-gradually dis-endeared yourself of me.
::::: Please amend your stricken holier-than-thou attitude in the future. It's '''really''' annoying, and it's not at all conducive to an actual discussion of what you did or didn't do and what punishment is appropriate. It makes me want to shut you up by squashing you.
::::: And '''I'm''' the unhealthily detached one. I can't ''imagine'' what it makes someone who thinks with his woman-parts like Walky want to do. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 05:09, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
It's interesting how I'm apparently the "colossal asshole" when it's you guys who are actually doing all the insult-hurling and name-calling. I haven't made one personal comment in this whole affair. Funny, that...

Oh, and for ther record, I HAVE apologised. More than once, actually. Get your facts straight, please.

But "PassiveAgressivePrime" is GOLD, by the way. I'd definitely declare that a genius call if it weren't such a laughable assertion.

Anyway, I've got much better things to do that take this abuse any longer. Think what you will.

Later, [[User:PacifistPrime|PacifistPrime]].

:hahaha i just noticed this. GOODBYE TO ALL MY WIKI FRIENDS FOREVER!!! [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:15, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

== 3d Website ==

I remembered that you showed an interest in the Blackthorne scans and were disappointed.
Hope this is more your alley.
http://www.3dtransformers.com/ -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 12:44, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
:Yeah, I've seen that, actually. Thanks, though, it IS pretty neat. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 13:35, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

==Stubs==
I'm not arguing against removing the tag from G1 Bumblebee's page, but is there some hard-and-fast rule about what actually makes an article a stub? Feels silly asking this, and Wikipedia's article on the subject supports the "common sense" method, but I'm nothing if not stupidly cautious. I asked Walky once and he said "Empty headings = stub!", which I took to mean as "irregardless of the article length and other content".
Then again, maybe he gave such a short answer because it's a ridiculous question. But here I am asking anyway. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:38, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:I think that's a pretty good standard- if portions of the article are still stubbed in without even a overall summary, I think it qualifies as a stub. :(I agree with you that an article stops begin a stub '''before'' it is exhaustively complete.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 23:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:It's an article that's just been started and has a long way to go before completion. That's basically the definition; nothing further has been discussed or agreed on, and I don't think we NEED anything more than that. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:43, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::For clarification, I believe the article in question at the time was very much as Bumblebee's is now. It's more-or-less complete, with an introduction and many sections filled in with detail, but it also had a noteworthy number of sections that were just headers with no content.
::I ought to have been more clear with Walky way back when, I suppose. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 23:45, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I guess this is a discussion we DO need to have, then.
:::Wikipedia generally uses seperate stub templates for ''sections'' which aren't complete. I don't know if that's best for us, but I generally envision the stub category as being something that someone can look through for articles where ''anything'' can be added to them to be helpful; unlike Bumblebee, which while still not complete, is far from being in that state. If we really need something to indicate that the ''whole article'' isn't complete, maybe some distinction would be helpful. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 23:50, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
::::I also want to add that I don't really feel that strongly on the matter. But I guess we probably should reach some sort of conclusion. --[[User:Suki Brits|Suki Brits]] 00:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::I think another separate tag would be best. "Stub", as shown, could lead to more confusion down the road, but not tagging the articles I think could lead to people scanning them and not noticing empty sections which they would otherwise be able to fill in. This certainly isn't a large concern, however...
:::::This came up because of the apparent selection of Bumblebee as a featured article. Do we have some way of noting that, to spur work on it ensuring it's completed "in time"? I imagine if it's not done by July it will just be pushed back until later, but I don't see a problem in encouraging work on the Wiki. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 00:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

== Hello ==
*Hello Brits this is Troyb a admin and buericrate of your new sister or whatever wiki, its called transfanon and we need you to place the news on the front page so that we can get more users, thank you. Also I'll give you a link tommorow.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 22:59, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
: No, thank you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:19, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

*O.k. why not (Sigh...)[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 00:45, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

:Because... your fanon wiki appears to have absolutely nothing to do with actual Transformers. If it was fanon in the sense of a bunch of speculation or something, trying to fill in gaps or retcon errors... I could see linking to it someplace, as that might be useful to fans who are looking for information. But it appears to be basically a wiki for your personal fanfic or something. We don't just link to random fanfics, so why would we link to that wiki? --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 14:26, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

*Fine fine fine. But it seems you hate fanon. So '''fanon hater''' I shall leave.[[User:Troyb|Troyb]]<sup>[[User talk:Troyb|(CIS ShadowFeed)]] [[Special:Contributions/User:Troyb|contribs]]</sup>[[Image:Troyb2.jpg|20px]] 21:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

==Main page links==
Hi Suki Brits. I hope you don't mind, but I added redirects to the TV and Toys pages that you'd previously deleted since these were linked from the main page and might be useful for people to find articles on those topics. [[User:Angela|Angela]]<staff /> ([[User talk:Angela|talk]]) 00:03, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

== Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73 ==

Could you click on the article link on [[Talk:User talk:69.234.144.73]] and complete the edit that it pops up with so we can get rid of the red link? --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:03, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:It would be a red link even if she did. We've broken fundamental laws of wiki reality, man.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:09, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::tested it on my talk page, and it does seem to break Wikiality. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:19, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::However it's still a redlink, in spite of your talk page undeniably existing. It's uncharted territory. If it gets any weirder it'll require Furmanisms to describe it.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 03:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::The link is hovering there, on the page, like a vast predatory bird... -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::That, or... talking like William... Shatner. --...[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 03:30, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::Suki did it. It's ''over''. FINISHED.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
::::::For me, personally... IT NEVER ENDS! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:45, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::::Let me give it the worst case of INDIGESTION it's ever had! --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 18:48, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
:God, I'm choking on all the [[Furmanism]] here. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 19:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
But if Walky can survive the tide of Furmanisms CAN WE DO LESS?--[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]]

== Evil Decepti-Nazi Blocker ==

Why the fuck you had to do the Blocking? Are you crazy? Now Nobody send messages to me. If I find you my F-35 Lightning II will fucking get you.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

United States military

2007-09-22T23:00:48Z

69.234.145.190: /* United States Air Force */

The '''United States military''', officially known as the United States Armed Forces, are charged with defending the people of the [[United States of America]] from all hostile military forces, be they foreign states, [[Cobra|terrorists]], or [[Transformer|killer alien robots]]. It is structured into the following five branches of service:

* United States Army
* United States Navy
* United States Marine Corps
* United States Air Force
* United States Coast Guard

They have a habit of getting involved in the [[Autobot]]/[[Decepticon]] war on Earth because... well really, most of it takes place on American soil. It's their job. Plus a lot of Transformers [[alternate mode|disguise]] themselves as US military vehicles, and that's just not right.

==Generation 1==
The US Armed Forces contain several specialized units whose branch of service is speculative.

* [[G.I. Joe]]
* [[Rapid Anti-robot Assault Team]]
* [[Armored Robot Hunters]]

The only named unit whose branch of service is known is the Air Force [[Uberhogs]] squadron.

==Transformers (2007)==

===Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT)===
Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT) is a subordinate unified command of US Central Command (USCENTCOM). It is responsible for planning special operations in peacetime and war.

SOCCENT operates a [[SOCCENT Forward Operations Base|Forward Operations Base]] in [[Qatar]], commanded by [[Colonel Sharp]], United States Marine Corps.

===United States Army===
====Army Rangers====
The 75th Ranger Regiment —also known as the United States Army Rangers— is an elite light infantry special operations force of the United States Army Special Operations Command (USASOC)

[[William Lennox|Captain William Lennox]] leads a Army Ranger special-operations unit, stationed out of SOCCENT Forward Operations Base. This unit includes:

*[[Sergeant Donnelly|First Sergeant Donnelly]]
*[[Robert Epps|Technical Sergeant Robert Epps]], United States Air Force (Air Force Combat Control officer)
*[[Jorge Figueroa|Chief Warrant Officer Jorge Figueroa]]

====Weapons and ground Vehicles====
The base was seen with a couple tanks and Humvees.

===United States Air Force===
====CV-22 Osprey====
[[Image:Movie_CV-22_Osprey1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|Someone's going to have a hard time explaining how they lost two of these babies.]]

The '''CV-22 Osprey''' is a tiltrotor aircraft that combines the vertical takeoff, hover, and vertical landing qualities of a helicopter with the long-range, fuel efficiency and speed characteristics of a turboprop aircraft. Its mission is to conduct long-range infiltration, exfiltration and resupply missions for special operations forces.

Two Ospreys out of SOCCENT transported Captain Lennox's Ranger unit back to the base after a mission.

'''Note:''' ''The two Ospreys featured in the movie are two of only three that the US Air Force has in its inventory.''

{{-}}

====A-10 Thunderbolt II====
[[Image:Movie_A-10_missilefire.jpg|thumb|right|250px|It is being brought.]]

The '''A-10 Thunderbolt II''' is a twin-engine ground-attack aircraft designed to provice close air support (CAS) to ground forces by by attacking tanks, armored vehicles, and [[Scorponok (Movie)|other ground targets]]. It is also called the '''Warthog''' about as often as its official name, in and out of the United States Air Force.

After recieving Captain Lennox's request for air support, [[the Pentagon]] ordered a nearby airbase roll in Strike Package Bravo, two A-10 Thunderbolt IIs fitted with AGM-65 Maverick air-to-ground missiles, to immediately give support to Lennox's beseiged unit. USAF Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry AWACS to have the A-10s direct their fire upon the target in killbox one-alpha, which was indicated by flares and painted with laser guidance markers. Approaching the villiage, the two A-10s strafed the robotic scorpion with 30 mm rounds from its Avenger gatling gun. Causing no noticable damage, the two planes followed up with their Maverick missiles, blowing up alot of sand but they missed as a result there was no appreciable effect on the mechanical beast.

{{-}}

====E-3 Sentry AWACS====
The '''E-3 Sentry''' is an Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS) aircraft that provides all-weather surveillance, command, control and communications to United States Military.

After Captain Lennox established communications with the Pentagon, Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry to have fire directed upon Scorponok. The E-3's crew provided command and control to the pair of A-10 Thunderbolt IIs in Strike Package Bravo and the AC-130 Spectre gunship that attacked Scorponok.

=====Crew=====
* Michael Adams (AWACS Controller #1)
* Ron Henry (AWACS Controller #2)
* Benjamin Hoffman (AWACS Controller #3)
* Michael McNabb (AWACS Controller #4)
* Jason White (AWACS Controller #5)

'''Note:''' ''Most of the crew of the E-3 Sentry seen in the movie are real crew of that particular aircraft. First Lieutenant Micheal McNabb (who played AWACS Controller #4) is a Transformers fan, and stated in [http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showthread.php?t=115126 an email to fansite TFW2005.com] that director [[Michael Bay]] allowed them to come up with lines that they would really say to other aircraft in order to make the scenes as realistic as possible.''

====AC-130 Spectre====
The '''AC-130 Spectre''' gunship is a heavily-armed ground attack airplane. It is used for close air support, air interdiction, and force protection. Close air support roles include supporting ground troops, escorting convoys, and flying urban operations.

With the lack of significant damage to Scorponok by the two A-10 Thunderbolts of Strike Package Bravo, Captain Lennox suggested the biggest barrels the Air Force has: the 105mm M102 howitzer cannons of AC-130 Spectre gunship. The Spectre pounded the Decepticon attack into the ground with a combination of 40 mm L60 Bofors cannon and 105mm sabot rounds, damaging Scorponok enough for it to retreat.

====F-22 Raptor====
The '''F-22 Raptor''' is a air-superiority fighter with stealth capabilities. It is the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world.

Two Raptors were launched to intercept and escort [[Blackout (Movie)|Blackout]] to SOCCENT. They were presumably destroyed when the Decepticon laid waste to the base.

Later, [[John Keller|Secretary of Defence Keller]] sucessfully contacted the Air Force, F-22 Raptors were launched to give air cover to the combined Ranger/Sector Seven/Autobot unit in [[Mission City]]. One of the Raptor squadrons took heavy damage when the Decepticon Starscream sucessfully infiltrated the group and destroyed several aircraft before being driven off. With the heat off their tails, the Raptors participated in the destruction of Blackout and [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]].

====C-17 Globemaster 3====
The cargo plane was seen in the military base.

====C-130 Hercules====
The cargo plane was seen in the military base.

==Real world==
[[Image:Militarysneakpreview.jpg|right|thumb|250px|A promotional flyer for early showings of ''Transformers'' (2007) at Little Creek Naval Air Base and Oceana Naval Air Station.]]

During filming of the ''Transformers'' [[Transformers (2007)|live action movie]], director [[Michael Bay]] worked closely with the [[Wikipedia:United States Department of Defense|United States Department of Defense]], who saw a high-profile summer action movie where US troops fight evil alien robots as a good promotional tool. It's not known if they are an official sponsor of the movie [[franchise]] like corporate partners [[General Motors]], [[Kraft Foods Inc.]], [[PepsiCo]], and [[Target]]. However, military personnel '''do''' get the opportunity to see the film free of charge before its American release.

{{stub}}
[[Category: United States military| ]]<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

United States military

2007-09-22T22:58:04Z

69.234.145.190: /* United States Army */

The '''United States military''', officially known as the United States Armed Forces, are charged with defending the people of the [[United States of America]] from all hostile military forces, be they foreign states, [[Cobra|terrorists]], or [[Transformer|killer alien robots]]. It is structured into the following five branches of service:

* United States Army
* United States Navy
* United States Marine Corps
* United States Air Force
* United States Coast Guard

They have a habit of getting involved in the [[Autobot]]/[[Decepticon]] war on Earth because... well really, most of it takes place on American soil. It's their job. Plus a lot of Transformers [[alternate mode|disguise]] themselves as US military vehicles, and that's just not right.

==Generation 1==
The US Armed Forces contain several specialized units whose branch of service is speculative.

* [[G.I. Joe]]
* [[Rapid Anti-robot Assault Team]]
* [[Armored Robot Hunters]]

The only named unit whose branch of service is known is the Air Force [[Uberhogs]] squadron.

==Transformers (2007)==

===Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT)===
Special Operations Command Central (SOCCENT) is a subordinate unified command of US Central Command (USCENTCOM). It is responsible for planning special operations in peacetime and war.

SOCCENT operates a [[SOCCENT Forward Operations Base|Forward Operations Base]] in [[Qatar]], commanded by [[Colonel Sharp]], United States Marine Corps.

===United States Army===
====Army Rangers====
The 75th Ranger Regiment —also known as the United States Army Rangers— is an elite light infantry special operations force of the United States Army Special Operations Command (USASOC)

[[William Lennox|Captain William Lennox]] leads a Army Ranger special-operations unit, stationed out of SOCCENT Forward Operations Base. This unit includes:

*[[Sergeant Donnelly|First Sergeant Donnelly]]
*[[Robert Epps|Technical Sergeant Robert Epps]], United States Air Force (Air Force Combat Control officer)
*[[Jorge Figueroa|Chief Warrant Officer Jorge Figueroa]]

====Weapons and ground Vehicles====
The base was seen with a couple tanks and Humvees.

===United States Air Force===
====CV-22 Osprey====
[[Image:Movie_CV-22_Osprey1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|Someone's going to have a hard time explaining how they lost two of these babies.]]

The '''CV-22 Osprey''' is a tiltrotor aircraft that combines the vertical takeoff, hover, and vertical landing qualities of a helicopter with the long-range, fuel efficiency and speed characteristics of a turboprop aircraft. Its mission is to conduct long-range infiltration, exfiltration and resupply missions for special operations forces.

Two Ospreys out of SOCCENT transported Captain Lennox's Ranger unit back to the base after a mission.

'''Note:''' ''The two Ospreys featured in the movie are two of only three that the US Air Force has in its inventory.''

{{-}}

====A-10 Thunderbolt II====
[[Image:Movie_A-10_missilefire.jpg|thumb|right|250px|It is being brought.]]

The '''A-10 Thunderbolt II''' is a twin-engine ground-attack aircraft designed to provice close air support (CAS) to ground forces by by attacking tanks, armored vehicles, and [[Scorponok (Movie)|other ground targets]]. It is also called the '''Warthog''' about as often as its official name, in and out of the United States Air Force.

After recieving Captain Lennox's request for air support, [[the Pentagon]] ordered a nearby airbase roll in Strike Package Bravo, two A-10 Thunderbolt IIs fitted with AGM-65 Maverick air-to-ground missiles, to immediately give support to Lennox's beseiged unit. USAF Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry AWACS to have the A-10s direct their fire upon the target in killbox one-alpha, which was indicated by flares and painted with laser guidance markers. Approaching the villiage, the two A-10s strafed the robotic scorpion with 30 mm rounds from its Avenger gatling gun. Causing no noticable damage, the two planes followed up with their Maverick missiles, blowing up alot of sand but they missed as a result there was no appreciable effect on the mechanical beast.

{{-}}

====E-3 Sentry AWACS====
The '''E-3 Sentry''' is an Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS) aircraft that provides all-weather surveillance, command, control and communications to United States Military.

After Captain Lennox established communications with the Pentagon, Sergeant Epps coordinated with an E-3 Sentry to have fire directed upon Scorponok. The E-3's crew provided command and control to the pair of A-10 Thunderbolt IIs in Strike Package Bravo and the AC-130 Spectre gunship that attacked Scorponok.

=====Crew=====
* Michael Adams (AWACS Controller #1)
* Ron Henry (AWACS Controller #2)
* Benjamin Hoffman (AWACS Controller #3)
* Michael McNabb (AWACS Controller #4)
* Jason White (AWACS Controller #5)

'''Note:''' ''Most of the crew of the E-3 Sentry seen in the movie are real crew of that particular aircraft. First Lieutenant Micheal McNabb (who played AWACS Controller #4) is a Transformers fan, and stated in [http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showthread.php?t=115126 an email to fansite TFW2005.com] that director [[Michael Bay]] allowed them to come up with lines that they would really say to other aircraft in order to make the scenes as realistic as possible.''

====AC-130 Spectre====
The '''AC-130 Spectre''' gunship is a heavily-armed ground attack airplane. It is used for close air support, air interdiction, and force protection. Close air support roles include supporting ground troops, escorting convoys, and flying urban operations.

With the lack of significant damage to Scorponok by the two A-10 Thunderbolts of Strike Package Bravo, Captain Lennox suggested the biggest barrels the Air Force has: the 105mm M102 howitzer cannons of AC-130 Spectre gunship. The Spectre pounded the Decepticon attack into the ground with a combination of 40 mm L60 Bofors cannon and 105mm sabot rounds, damaging Scorponok enough for it to retreat.

====F-22 Raptor====
The '''F-22 Raptor''' is a air-superiority fighter with stealth capabilities. It is the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world.

Two Raptors were launched to intercept and escort [[Blackout (Movie)|Blackout]] to SOCCENT. They were presumably destroyed when the Decepticon laid waste to the base.

Later, [[John Keller|Secretary of Defence Keller]] sucessfully contacted the Air Force, F-22 Raptors were launched to give air cover to the combined Ranger/Sector Seven/Autobot unit in [[Mission City]]. One of the Raptor squadrons took heavy damage when the Decepticon Starscream sucessfully infiltrated the group and destroyed several aircraft before being driven off. With the heat off their tails, the Raptors participated in the destruction of Blackout and [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]].

==Real world==
[[Image:Militarysneakpreview.jpg|right|thumb|250px|A promotional flyer for early showings of ''Transformers'' (2007) at Little Creek Naval Air Base and Oceana Naval Air Station.]]

During filming of the ''Transformers'' [[Transformers (2007)|live action movie]], director [[Michael Bay]] worked closely with the [[Wikipedia:United States Department of Defense|United States Department of Defense]], who saw a high-profile summer action movie where US troops fight evil alien robots as a good promotional tool. It's not known if they are an official sponsor of the movie [[franchise]] like corporate partners [[General Motors]], [[Kraft Foods Inc.]], [[PepsiCo]], and [[Target]]. However, military personnel '''do''' get the opportunity to see the film free of charge before its American release.

{{stub}}
[[Category: United States military| ]]<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Megatron (Movie)

2007-09-22T22:43:50Z

69.234.145.190: Weird Jet

== Human Name jokes ==

We might as well make the article play on his human-given names.

== Megatron's Cybertronian form ==

Has anyone else noticed that Megatron's vehicle form bares more than a passing resemblance to the ''Swordfish'', the personal ship flown by Spike Spiegel in ''Cowboy BeBop''? [[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 02:39, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

::Not really, no. --[[User:EricMarrs|EricMarrs]] 12:07, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

:::The only difference is it's A. silver, and B. has three guns instead of one.

:I agree, it looks very similar. The wings in particular. I mean, it doesn't exactly look like THE Swordfish, but it looks like a 'mono-racer' from Bebop at least.

::::It looks more like the Zone of the Enders version of the Vic Viper than the Swordfish, at least to me it does.--[[User:Carrion|Carrion]] 03:58, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
== Earth Mode ==

According to Wikipedia and IGN, Megatron turns into a stealth bomber. [[User:Hunter-113|Hunter-113]] 22:36, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
: Until either one is verified by anything official, we're not including that "info". --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 22:38, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
::Reading the IGN article, they said they got this from playing an early version of the Movie's game. [[User:Hunter-113|Hunter-113]] 01:52, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
:::Still makes it somewhere between unconfirmed second-hand report and leaked info. With this sort of thing patience is best. IF it is true we'll all no for sure soon enough and it can go up then.n--[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 02:51, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
::::Seibertron reported recently that some of the production staff hinted at Megatron not getting an Earth form after all, at least in this movie. I'd say wait until the movie comes out, because even if they make a toy it's still not confirmed. [[User:King Starscream]] 13:28, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::From the book media I've perused, Megatron stays silvery and alieny the entire course of it all. There's other things I saw, but I shan't go into them since all these books come out tomorrow and you can spoil yourself then. [[User:Terrocon Blot]]
::::::Which book? Sounds interesting. [[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 03:30, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
:::::::All the kids books that come out tomorrow. The I can read, storybook, junior novels, etc. Heck, a few of the books have Megatron and Brawl standing side by side. He ain't Brawl. All these books come out tomorrow, and will be on display in your local book stores. (Seriously, this is screwed up. I can't seem to edit pages when I'm logged in.) [[User:Terrocon Blot]]
::::::::Looking at game footage, either the Stealth-Bomber Megs was an early idea that was discarded, or he gets an Earth mode later in the game. -- [[User:Hunter-113|Hunter-113]] 19:57, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

==Sibling status==
I strongly question the inclusion of he and Optimus being brothers in the main bio, unless that is backed up by the movie itself, or some future toy bio, or other source stronger than books based on earlier drafts of the script. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 02:23, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
: If the movie does not contradict it, surely it is still true. :)
: FOr what it's worth- the prequel comics had this vibe goigng too, the ADF novelization mentions brushes by it,t he junior novelization says it explicitly... and I think there's at least 1 more source. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 02:30, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
: The DS game says so. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:34, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
::As does the console version. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 02:47, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
:::Okay, yeah. The game counts a stonger source. Although if it's not mentioned in the movie itself, I think it's going to require a footnote notation citing the places it is. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 02:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
::::The Decepticon DS version also says it flat out.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] 07:45, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::What we have now is correct, and there is no need to change anything. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 09:48, 23 June 2007 (UTC)
::::::For the record to future peoples, Optimus does call Megatron his bro in the movie.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] 03:52, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

==*More* Misassemblies==

Yeah. I just got Super Megs and, uh, his hands are flipped. Or rather, I guess it's his thumbs and pinkies. Look at the box and compare. This should probably be noted... [[User:71.61.152.122|71.61.152.122]] 07:53, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
:Geeeeez, you're right. Is there anything assembled ''right'' on this guy?--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] 04:20, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
::I'm comparing photos at Seibertron.com, and um...I'm not seeing it.
:::It's most noticable in the picture of his macehand, but you can see it in the big one too. Don't look at 'pics' of the box, look at it with your own two eyes. >.> [[User:71.60.159.181|71.60.159.181]] 09:49, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

== Galvatron ==

I strongly belive that the allspark will resurect megatron in a future sequel and possibly reformat him into galvatron. It'll probebly bring him back to life at least
:I don't deny that I think the AllSpark will play a part in Megs's revival, but I highly doubt (and strongly hope) that he won't become Galvatron.

== Marinas Trench ==

I realize Keller said the Decepticons were dropped into the deepest section of ocean in the world, but he calls it specifically something other than the Marinas Trench. To that end, using "Marinas Trench" doesn't seem exactly right to me. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to quite decipher what he DID call it. Was anybody else? And what does other media say about the location? --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 15:19, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

I concur that the trench name from the film should be used here instead of the Marianas. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 15:48, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
:Keller says "Laurentian Trench," which is a real ocean feature but by no means its deepest. He also says it's the deepest spot on the ocean at over 7 miles deep, which is correct for the Marianas. So, a fact-finding flub. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 18:23, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

::How dare the Secretary of Defense not be completely up to speed on the name of the deepest part of the ocean. (seriously, it's entirely possible that Keller had no idea what hte fuck he was talking about.) [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 18:27, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

== Megatron head article photo ==

the onepresent right now is a little blurry, wouldn'tthat one be better? [http://www.slashfilm.com/wp/wp-content/images/tfbay5.jpg]--[[User:GUIGUI|GUIGUI]] 18:39, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
: No, because that one doesn't have the right head. We replaced the one you suggested with the current version. (Blurry? It's a sized-down version of a gigantic-ass render straight from Dreamworks.) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:59, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

== video game info ==

should we edit it to have more info on megatron in the game?
:...Deathy? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 16:49, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

== Weird Jet ==

God Damn that is one weird Cybertronian jet. He would have been a YF-23 Black Widow and that would be fucking scary.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Transformers: Energon (cartoon)

2007-09-22T22:43:11Z

69.234.145.190: Hurry up and edit

Just because the person adding the entry feels the show was "suffering" for American viewers does not make it fact. That entry will be deleted and should be, as it's entirely and only a matter of opinion and doesn't relate to the Energon storyline or toyline. -Bodycount

"Many fans found Energon an improvement over Armada in story and writing" at first, but the later part is debatible X-BoB58

==Episode list==

I've pasted in the episode lists from the templates that were here before we started working on the wiki. However, I'm not sure on what basis the list is split into two seasons. I've left it split for now, but, does anybody have a justification for this split?

--[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:16, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Why is there no entry or potential entry for "Distribution", aka "Special Dream Match" aka "The writers took a day off"?--Squidhead

----

Just wondering if these pages are going to get general Series Summaries/Overviews at some point? Fact is for a variety of reasons I havn't watched a TF toon regularly since the middle of Armada so I'd really love detailed summaries of Energon and Cybertron (and the end of Arm. to make it up here.

Well, yes, eventually. I think the problem is, though, MOST of us were utterly lost or disinterested with the Energon cartoon, so, well, even summarising is going to be tricky. Persoanlly, I can't even remember which epsiode is which... at least with Armada and cybertron there are "guides" available (Micron Legend Yearbook and the CN site)... Energon? eeg. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 20:50, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
:Add to that that there are quite a few episodes where it literally seemed like nothing happened. Such was the pacing of Energon.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] 04:31, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

== Hurry up and edit ==

You edit too slow ever since the Unicron Trilogy ended in peace. How is anyone going to like 99 Billion fucking red links on this Wiki? Oh by the way the Funny Stays remember?<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Thrust (Armada)

2007-09-22T22:41:17Z

69.234.145.190: /* ''Energon'' */

{{disambig3|Thrust}}

:''Thrust is a [[Decepticon]] from the [[Armada]] portion of the [[Unicron Trilogy]] continuity family.''

[[Image:Thrust-AR-DVD.jpg|300px|right|thumb|Now a regular on "Spongebob Squarepants"]]

'''Thrust''' is one of [[Megatron (Armada)|Megatron]]'s higher-ranking Decepticon soldiers. His occasional [[Mini-Con]] partner is [[Inferno (Armada)|Inferno]], plus sometimes he commands the [[Air Military Mini-Con Team]].

:''('''Note''': Thrust's personality varied significantly between the comic and cartoon, see entries below for details.)''

==Fiction==
===Animated continuity===
====''Armada''====
:''Voice actor:'' [[Colin Murdoch]] (US) ??? (Japan)

Thrust was a renowned tactician who joined [[Megatron (Armada)|Megatron]] on [[Earth]] in an attempt to improve his soldiers' relations. Thrust led the Decepticons to some short victories and summoned the giant battleship [[Tidal Wave]] to aid them, but was quickly dethroned of his rank after his failures began to stack up. Hated by all the other Decepticons due to his superior attitude, Thrust began to shrink into himself and got more desperate to prove his power.

Eventually, Thrust joined [[Sideways]] with the lure of ultimate power, and managed to steal the three [[Mini-Con]] weapons that were the keys to reactivating [[Unicron]]'s body. Thrust met his demise when he demanded Unicron attack his former master, Galvatron, only to have Unicron act totally unaware of Thrust's presence. Thrust fell into a seam on Unicron's surface which began to tighten and close as Unicron moved, and was crushed to death as Galvatron walked away.

===Dreamwave Comic continuity===
====''Armada''====
Thrust was a somewhat cowboy-like entity that served loyally the Decepticons. He was devoted to Megatron, and followed his orders faithfully. Thrust first appeared via [[transwarp]] from [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]], carrying rocket boosters so the Decepticons could fly to the moon and capture the Mini-Cons stationed there.

Later, Thrust was sent to northern Alaska to back up [[Cyclonus (Armada)|Cyclonus]], who was there to retrieve a fallen Mini-Con escape pod. First Thrust took a torch-blast to the face from [[Dune Runner]] of the [[Adventure Mini-Con Team]], who was there to save his allies. Then he was knocked around by Cyclonus, who was feeling the effects of a triple-[[Powerlinx]] with the entire [[Destruction Mini-Con Team]], which began to burn out his circuits and drive him mad with pain. When he finally came to, between Cyclonus' breakdown, the arrival of the Autobots, and [[Megatron (Armada)|Megatron]] using an orbiting [[solar scalpel]] to melt the ice that buried the escape pod, Thrust decided maybe he'd better get the heck outta Dodge.

Later, Thrust followed [[Starscream (Armada)|Starscream]] to a building lot in San Fransisco, to investigate a weird [[transwarp]] disturbance. He got there just in time to get shot down by [[Galvatron (G1)|a herald of Unicron]], who was seeking the refugee [[Mini-Con]] [[Over-Run (Armada)|Over-Run]].

When Megatron left to attack the Autobot base on Earth, Thrust was left behind to guard their [[Silver Ridge]] headquarters. He quickly had the crap kicked out of him by the ''other'' heralds of [[Unicron]]. Not a fatal beating, though, as he was repaired in time to journey back to Cybertron and face the planet-eater.

====''Energon''====
After the destruction of Unicron and the apparent death of Megatron, Thrust became a security officer in the new peacetime. He joined [[Hot Shot (Armada)|Hot Shot's]] unit and defended Toronto from the [[Terrorcon (Energon)|Terrorcon]] [[Divebomb (Energon)|Divebomb]] clone-hordes when they attacked Earth. When [[Megatron (Armada)|Megatron]] reappeared, Thrust tried to rejoin his former leader, but Megatron completely ignored him, warping to his next destination. Where is an image of him in Energon?

==Toys==
===Armada===
[[Image:ArmadaThrust_toy.jpg|left|thumb|"Hehehe... flathead.... boy, I can really dish it out!"]]

*'''Thrust with Inferno''' (Deluxe, 2003)
:''Japanese ID number:'' '''MD-05'''

: Thrust transforms into a dark green [[Wikipedia:F-35 Lightning II|F-35 Lightning II]] fighter jet. In jet mode, he has two pressure-launch missile launchers, and a space to store his Mini-Con partner Inferno in his (Inferno's) truck mode. Aside from his robot mode, he also has an "assault" robot mode, which turns his torso around 180 degrees and extends his winged backpack; attaching a Mini-Con to the [[Powerlinx]] plug on his chest and pushing it up and down causes the backpack to move as a spinning blade.

: This mold was also used to make ''[[Universe]]'' [[Sunstorm (Universe)|Sunstorm]].

*'''Thrust and Thunder with Air Military Micron''' (Multi-pack, 2003)
:''Japanese ID number:''

: In Japan, Thrust was available both as an individual (well, with Inferno) and in a larger boxed set that also included the [[Air Military Mini-Con Team]]. There are no notable difference between the Japanese and US releases.
{{-}}
*'''Powerlinx Thrust with Powerlinx Inferno''' (Deluxe, 2003)

: Part of the later-series "Powerlinx" line of [[redeco]]s, Powerlinx Thrust got a new color scheme that was a "reversal" of the [[Generation 1]] "[[conehead]]" [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]], primarily light brown with dark blue and black accents.

: The packaging for this release, however, showed him in a color scheme more like his [[Thrust (G1)|G1 namesake]], burgundy with black (and some bone-white accents). His coloration was changed to the brown-and-blue too late to change the packaging photography.

[[Image:PL_Red_Thrust_toy.jpg|right|thumb|You did not own this.]]

: The change was made due to Takara choosing a mostly red color scheme for [[Demolisher]] (Demolisher's name in Japan was [[Ironhide]] and the color scheme was based on the G1 version of said character). Originally Hasbro had different plans for their redeco of Demolisher. But as a result changed their plans for Demolisher to match the animation, which was already based on Takara's products. Hasbro then thought there would be too much red on the shelves at the time, so Powerlinx Thrust's coloration was modified, as the figure would not appear on the cartoon. There are some similar colors used between the two versions of the toy, likely due to the quick change in scheme.

: Later on, [[Takara]] produced this red color version of Thrust as a "[[USA Edition]]" [[exclusive]], though reportedly some were sold at retail in Israel and found in Australia, of all places.

{{-}}

==Trivia==
* Thrust's demeanor and speech in the comics are very reminiscent of ''[[Beast Wars]]'' [[Quickstrike (BW)|Quickstrike]], to the point of him even using the phrase "What in tarnation?" in one issue. Amusingly, [[Colin Murdoch]] voiced both characters in each respective animated series. It is unknown if this was an intentional move on writer [[Simon Furman]]'s part or simply a coincidence.

==External links==
*[http://www.tfu.info/2003/Decepticon/Thrust/thrust.htm Thrust at TFU.info]

[[Category: Armada characters]]
[[Category: Decepticons]]
[[Category: Strategists]]
[[Category: Unicron-related characters]]<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Thrust (Armada)

2007-09-22T22:39:12Z

69.234.145.190: Problem

I'm not really sure that Thrust's minor involvement with Unicron in the cartoon really qualifies him for the Unicron-Related Characters category. If it does, then you'd have to add Starscream (G1) to that category as well, in addition to just about every other character who's encountered the Chaos Bringer and not died/killed him. - [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 11:31, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
:Thrust allied himself with Sideways, betrayed the Decepticons, and became a servant of Unicron. That qualifies as "related" in my book --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 11:42, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

== Problem ==

How Thrust appeared in Energon? Only Energon can reborn him. His power obsession went to Starscream in Cybertron series. Starscream started copying him in Transformers Cybertron. Show an image of Thrust in Energon. I never seen Fucking Thrust in Energon.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Starscream (Armada)

2007-09-22T22:35:05Z

69.234.145.190: Power crazy

There's bound to be a few bits of fiction left unlisted. Some of the kids' books, and he's gotta be in Legends SOMEWHERE. And I really don't feel like going over the DW Armada comic right now. But one at least that section's in, and we get some screen grabs and pictures in... I'd say we've got us another Featured Article. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 23:45, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Sorry for stupidly interfering in an inaccurate/unfunny/both way. Should I go sit in the corner? (the sorry is in no way sarcastic)

SL Nightscream is NOT a clone of Starscream. Who the hell keeps making this up? His story is the same as in Energon. He's Starscream's spark restored with energon. There isn't a single shred of evidence that he is anyone but Starscream with his mind wiped.

== Excuse me ==

In what episode does starscreem actualy get his powerlink form?
:Same one as everyone else.
::Episode 43, "Puppet" --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 09:49, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

== Power crazy ==

Why Starscream copies the Armada Thrust? IG his cloaking powers, his manipulations and even his power crazy behavior.
He bacame power crazy in Cybertron series, can teleport in Energon and even weird with that fucking crown. He even got popular as the Super Mario Brothers.<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Talk:Starscream (Movie)

2007-09-22T22:32:15Z

69.234.145.190: Long time popular character

==Accuracy disputes==
I've noticed that there is some argument about the accuracy of Starscream's toy. Some thing that the vehicle mode is accurate, while others think not. Judging from the toy gallery on Seibertron.com, it looks very accurate except for the blasters formed from his hands, which are severly oversized compared to both the movie model and the toy itself. Other than this though, the majority of the figure seems to be pretty accurate.

:If you know anything about fighters, then you'll know its an appallingly bad representation of an F-22 Raptor (has details closer to a YF-22, if I recall correctly). Hasbro/Takara have unfortunately produced better F-22-type planes in the past with Energon Starscream, and the cancelled NATF swing-wing version of the fighter with G2 Hooligan. I'm not really surprised that most Transformers fans can't tell the difference, as they generally aren't that well-versed in military hardware. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 23:32, 3 May 2007 (UTC)
::Yeah, we tend to be more focused on consumer goods. --[[User:Andrusi|Andrusi]] 02:42, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

::To be perfectly honest, I will agree that it fits closer to the submodel than the main fighter, but at the same time I was looking at the two pictures side-by-side. In cases such as this, color is irrelevent considering Gen 1 Starscream was originally considered a highly unlikely paint-job for an F-15... until they adopted it. Admittedly, the arms and undercarriage do make the toy itself look less like the actual jet than the movie model, but they are also grossly different; Starscream's triple guns on his hands in the movie are MUCH smaller, and had to be enlarged for the toy to meet safety regulations. And while I do not exactly have a degree in the field, I do like to study up on military hardware, especially jets, tanks, and some of the newer guns (the XM-8 in particular). I was kind of hoping they'd go with the newer F-35B, but I think it was still in the experimental stage when the movie was being scripted. [[User:Dracokanji|Dracokanji]] 03:39, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
:::G1 Starscream's own hull colour is very similar to the grey they used on F-15s of the 80s. I don't recall that the USAF used any of G1 Starscream's decos, did they? As I explained on [[Talk:Starscream (G1)|G1 Starscream's talk page]], Classics Starscream's colour scheme was made up from photos of the F-15 prototype that the Air Force doctored... for some reason. Real one was light blue with rather bright orange.

:::The F-35 is a piece of overpriced crap compared to the Raptor. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 08:03, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

::::And you're SURE these photos are doctored, and they don't just have a few or even a single fighter in that color scheme (especially since it was a prototype)? if you can cite documented proof with a link specifically saying so, I'll accept it. I might add that while not a seperate series, G2 Starscream had a more salmon/coral and bluish color scheme than G1 did (pretty much what I saw on the F-15 photos). While the detailing isn't exactly the same, the colors are fairly close. I will also clairify that I didn't mean the Air Force didn't adopt the color scheme BECAUSE of G1, but they just happened to use a similar paint scheme at one time.
::::I'll also remind you that your OPINION of the F-35 is not a fact, but regardless of that I stand by my statement on it.
[[User:Dracokanji|Dracokanji]] 12:28, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

:::::Yeah, I am sure. One of the moderators over at Macross World (pretty much chock full of fighter enthusiasts there) provided me with a photo of an F-15 prototype in its original, ugly colours. Same pattern as Classics Starscream, but with a light blue hull colour and orange where red is. G1 SS's own hull colour is close to FS 36375, the main grey used on real F-15's of the 80's.

:::::As for my opinion on the F-35 Lightning II, its fine here on this talk page because its not in the actual article. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 16:26, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

== Barrel Roll Blaster ==

It's merchandise released to coincide with the movie, yes, but the jet mode isn't particularly based on the design of Movie Starscream, and the hand is pretty clearly based on G1 Starscream. Should the Barrel Roll Blaster be considered a toy for G1 Starscream instead of for Movie Starscream?

(And while we're at it, same thing for the [[Optimus_Prime_(Movie)#Merchandise|Big Rig Blaster]]--the trailer's very G1, the truck cab is halfway between G1 and Movie, and the hand's clearly G1.)

After all, Optimash and the Robot Heroes are getting listed among their G1 counterparts. Are the Nerf guys more G1 or movie?

[[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 08:15, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
:Amazing, almost as if the movie were part of the g1 continuity family... -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 08:26, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
::Not particularly, no, considering the design elements that ARE clearly movie or ARE clearly G1 are fairly distinct from one another. I'd say it's more like they were handled by a design team external to the Transformers brand... say, the Nerf team... and weren't given particularly clear instructions on whether to follow a G1 or a Movie aestetic. However, that's just baseless conjecture and is getting off-topic from the question at hand.--[[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 08:45, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
:::I'd say the real reason is they want to use these sculpts after the movie for other lines. I figger that's why the Prime one is some weird place between a flatnose and a longnose semi. You make the fist inside one of those movie claws, and that's gonna be incongruous if you redeco it for Animated or whatever. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:58, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
::::That makes just as much sense, if not more. But in any case... does that make them more G1 Character toys than Movie Character toys? --[[User:Awa64|Awa64]] 16:26, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
:::::No. Prime's got the flames, and Starscream's in solid gray. Movie roleplay. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:30, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
:::Way to harsh my hellow. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 08:51, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

==Mission City battle details==
In [http://transformers.wikia.com/index.php?title=Starscream_%28Movie%29&curid=13176&diff=76575&oldid=76454 this revision], FFN added several details including some stuff about the RBFATE that I wanted to get confirmation on: First, that Starscream ''rejoined'' the human raptor squardon and himself fired upon Megatron. Second, that this assault from the jets damaged Megatron's armor, providing a place for Sam to shove the All Spark in. Granted I've only seen the movie twice, but, I didn't pick up on either of those things, even remotely. Are those details from the novelization or comic adaptation? I feel like we should indicate in some way when expanding on movie synopses with supplemental material. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 00:18, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
: The last missile assault we see shows direct hits on the front of Megatron's chest, and pieces fly all over. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:32, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
:: However, although it's entirely possible that Starscream takes part in that attack, I don't believe there is enough evidence to state it conclusively in the wiki as it currently appears. It is spec. [[User:Swift|Swift]] 23:04, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
:::Watching the flick for the 3rd time I specifically looked for this... and dudes, I really don't think it's there. When bombarding Megatron, the F-22s are onscreen for about 1.5 seconds and at a pretty good distance. I didn't see any way to tell any of them apart, let alone identify one of them as Starscream. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 18:49, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
:::: From what i have seen there is some credebility to the claim. While there is no way to verify if Starscream fired on Megatron i beleive that after Starscream transforms into his altmode for the last time you see him barrel roll to the right as an order to pursue him is given. Immediately after the entire squadren pursues a raptor that is smoking. As far as I can tell that is not Starscream and the military haslost sight of him and mistakenly assumed that due to the heavy beating he has just taken that he must be the most damaged raptor. It trivially worth mentioning that Starscream appears to be fine in his last appearace and no such damage as would indicate that he actually was that plane. Addtionally I would just like to mention one thing, treating this as f it were all true; Starscream tricked the United States military into shooting down one of their own and might have then used that to his advantage to assassinate Megatron. I take back anything and everything i said about movie Starscream being out of character. {{unsigned|68.194.98.116}}

:What you describe here is that the film is ''consistent'' with the idea that Starscream participated in the attack. That is ''very differenet'' than if the film actually ''supported'' that viewpoint. From what have seen, including your description here, there is nothing in the film to support the idea. It is simply one of infinitely many things that are "possible" to have happened offscreen. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 07:01, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
::I should note that at the time of rewriting the fiction section, I did not originate the 'Starscream shooting Megatron' bit. I was unsure so I just left it there. I personally don't believe it until somebody officially confirms it. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 17:06, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

==Spare pic==
[[Image:moviescream.jpg|thumb|right|150px|]]

==Masterpiece==
Shouldn't the Masterpiece Starscream section be on the G1 page? -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 02:13, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
:''"Though the toy is based on G1 Starscream, and the design has been used in appalling G1-universe fiction, it serves double duty as movie Starscream thanks to the Sector Seven alternate-reality game."''
:--[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:18, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
::But doesn't that mean that Grimlock, VW Bunblebee, Kickback, and Laserbeak should also get linked to the movie section? They were in the Sector 7 clips too.--[[User:Carrion|Carrion]] 02:43, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
:::I think those things should all be included as trivia notes, nothing more. Listing Masterpiece Starscream as one of Movie Starscream's toys seems highly dubious to me. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 02:48, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
:::Starscream's a unique instance, as he's a real movie character. But ff we had a page on N.B.E. Whatevernumber, I'd think that linking him to the G1 toy wouldn't be out of line. [[User:Chip|Chip]] 03:25, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

::::I kinda agree. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 03:03, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
:::::Weird that they have the same toy though, almsot liek the movie was part of the Generation 1 Continuity Family... -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 03:11, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

:::::You agree There should be a page for every NBE number, listing them as a seperate character?
:::::That doesn't sound like you Walky. -03:28, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Technically there isn't actually anything internal to the ARG that says that the NBE who was cited multiple times in 1982 is the same character as Movie Starscream, is there? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 03:38, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

== Long time popular character ==

God Damn! Optimus, Megatron and Starscream are the 3 most popular everywhere. The 3 had been featured in Unicron Trilogy, Generation 1 and 2 and almost everywhere. How come Starscream got a high popular rating equal to everyone?<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>