MediaWiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:Swoop (G1)

2010-01-28T20:10:13Z

70.234.139.84:

That can't [i]seriously[/i] be the only picture of Swoop we have. --[[User:Andrusi|Andrusi]] 23:21, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I was gonna change it, but this one was so funny-lookin'. Kinda like the main pic at [[Grimlock (G1)|Grimlock]]. Not the most prominant image of the character, but ''someone'' thought it was funny. --[[User:DrSpengler|DrSpengler]] 23:27, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

IIRC, Walky's in unrequited lust with this Swoop color scheme, so I'm guessing that explains all. ;-)

== Ugly Duckling ==

On a side note, I think it's interesting that we have some idea of the Transformer race's sense of aesthetics dealing with personal beauty. Swoop's beast mode is considered particularly ugly and terrifying to TF sensibillities as is Grotusque's alt-mode. On the other hand, Lightspeed is considered to be particularly atractive and handsome. Makes me wonder if there's enough for a small "Culture" article on "Transformer Beauty Standards". [[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 00:13, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

==Coloring book==
Does this actually belong under the Marvel heading, or does it need to be moved? And do we know the title? [[User:Chip|Chip]] 16:56, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

==Classic Swoop size==
On page 19 of the Timelines 2007 comic Strongarm and Swoop free Mirage. Swoop is in robot mode and is only about as big as Mirage's arm. So it seems he is Mini-Con sized.

== Veteran ==

Furman also ''directly'' named the Veteran as Swoop in the story he did where Optimus Prime finally went to [[J'nwan]] during the time of the [[Maximal Upgrade]]--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 16:09, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

== Marvel Comics model ==
The trivia section mentions that Swoop's Marvel model uses the Diaclone toy's gold bits. Er.... when did this occur? I don't want to delete it outright if that color scheme did show up at some point. [[User:Chip|Chip]] 07:41, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

== Animated Continuity ==
"While guarding a mysterious meteorite, the original Dinobots, Grimlock, Slag and Sludge, were fooled by Megatron into joining the side of the Decepticons. To counter the threat of their former comrades, the Autobots constructed two new Dinobots; Snarl and Swoop."

This isn't accurate. According to "War of the Dinobots" Optimus Prime commissions Ratchet and Wheeljack to build two new Dinobots because he's pleased with the originals, not specifically to fight the others (Although that is what happens later. How fortuitous.).--[[User:Suzyprime|Suzyprime]] 02:40, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

==Not a Dinosaur==
Sense when? Blasphemy I say! But seriously, sense when?--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]

Talk:Beast Wars timeline

2010-01-25T20:19:40Z

70.234.139.84: /* Fun Publications and 3H Comics */

==Depth Charge==
If we're specifically mentioning Ravage's journey from the future to the past, we should include Depth Charge's similar trip as well. [[User:JW|JW]] 16:26, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
:That's just because it still waits to be added. Ha ha ;D --[[User:TX55|TX55]] 16:33, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
==Fun Publications and 3H Comics==
What make them any more canon than the IDW comics? I understand that they tie into Beast Wars, but so does the IDW Comics. I also understand that IDW doesn't connect to the Fun and 3H comics..but I don't see them as any more canon than the IDW Comics. Thus, I propose a split. (Its difficult to tell which is Beast Wars the Cartoon and which parts are Comic only stuff anyways, so it'd also help to show others which is from which canon.) I'm surprised it took until now for someone to suggest it really.--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]
:The comic stuff should be put in ''italics'' like the [[Transformers Animated timeline]]. Other than that, I don't think a split is necessary. The IDW comics are canon, but brings elements from Japanese fiction into English continuity, so the backstory is a little different than the English Beast Era continuity that is recorded here. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 17:27, 22 December 2009 (EST)
::This page is a "Beast Era timeline." The 3H/FP material covers Beast Machines and Universe, which are so far ignored by IDW's material. IDW's stuff would be a "Beast Wars timeline" only. EDIT: Yeah, that's exactly what we do. Note that the IDW stuff is at [[Beast Wars timeline (IDW)]], not "Beast Era." --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:42, 22 December 2009 (EST)
Alright, well, then is anyone going it italicize the comic parts or something? As it stands, its hard to tell which is from Comics and which is from the Beast Wars (and Beast Machines) show.--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]

Thanks for the changes..but I feel my terminology, while corrected..I have to ask again because, I still don't understand how IDW is any less canon to the Beast Era than Fun or 3H. Sure they don't work with each other, but to me, putting those comics with the Cartoon over IDW seems like someones idea of [[Personal_canon]], which doesn't constitute being included in my opinion.EDIT: Forgive the edit, just felt I should space apart from my other post better, as I didn't notice it when I first hit preview.--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]

Okay. Two questions: 1. No one answered my last statement. How is it not Personal Canon to say they are any more canon than IDW. Yes, it includes things from the Japanese series, and the others do not. However, they are just as in canon with the Cartoons as 3H and Fun, so whose to say which one is more canon than the other? 2.Is there any way to purchase any of the Universe and Wreckers Comics? I'd like to buy them if at all possible..[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]
:Your question was answered. The IDW comics do not portray the same events as other Beast-era media. They completely omit BM and completely contradict 3H--there is no way for any one timeline to contain all the events of the 3H and IDW comics because they plainly do not exist in the same timeline. This is not "personal canon," just explain Tripredacus Agent if they're all the same story. We don't have a "G1" timeline including every single story from every medium because it would be impossible; we break them down by continuity, thus "G1 cartoon" and "IDW G1", etc. The main Beast timeline came first and so it gets the main article; IDW came later and contradicts it, so it gets spun off. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 16:28, 2 January 2010 (EST)

What was answered was why IDW and 3H+fun could not go together. What I don't understand is how IDW contradicts the Beast Era Cartoons in any way, which is the ONLY way 3H and fun could be more canon than IDW (Unless Hasbro said it themselves or something of course)...and now you sat it doesn't include Beast Machines? True, it doesn't, but whose to say its just set before it. Though I kinda see now what you're saying. So let me see if I got this straight.

IDW only covers the Beast Wars part of the Beast Era, and includes the Japanese Cartoon in its own wierd way...so even though it doesn't contradict the American Cartoons in any way (thus making it possibly canon), its not canon because 3H and Fun can go together, and go with the Beast Era Cartoon only just as much as IDW's, but doesn't include the Japanese Cartoon in any way, and DOES include Beast Machines, thus its automatically made canon....wieeerd. But I'm not so sure that constitutes it being canon..it just says it has more content than IDW, has gotten to Beast Machines, contradicts the other comics but not the american cartoon in any way, and doesn't include the Japanese Canon in any way..that doesn't automatically make one more canon than the other. All it means is they don't go TOGETHER, not that one is canon and one is not. I'm sorry, I don't mean to be rude or a hardass but, I still just don't see it. Is there something I'm missing here?--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]
:I think it goes like this: There are two timelines. One that includes American Beast Wars + Beast Machines + 3H + fun club. The other timline is American Beast Wars + some version of Japanese Beast Wars + IDW + Beast Machines. A lot of this timeline including the cartoon could be duplicated on the "IDW Beast Wars timeline" page, but they are different.
:Also, IDW ''does'' include Beast Machines. The ending of [[The Ascending]] leads directly into the Beast Machines era. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 12:06, 7 January 2010 (EST)

:You just answered your own question. It doesn't go together with the main BW continuity, so it gets its own individual spin-off continuity under our organization scheme. It has nothing to do with one being less canon than the other, since as far as we're concerned, everything's canon. That doesn't mean everything is canon for the same continuity, however. --[[User:Jeysie|Jeysie]] 12:20, 7 January 2010 (EST)

No I did not. It does not go with 3H and Fun's Beast Era Continuity but it DOES fit with the Cartoons Continuities, it even fits into Beast Machines by showing how Megatron got in just at the right time after the Ascending, thus its just as much canon as 3H and Fun are. Thus really, BOTH are seperate canons that are EQUALLY able to fit with the Cartoons. Just because you like what 3h and Fun wrote more doesn't mean its more canon to the cartoons then IDW's.--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]

==Waspinator==
Since when did Waspinator fly back to Cybertron from past-Earth with the Wreckers? I thought that entire episode was never explained more than "took forever!". --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 17:09, 22 December 2009 (EST)
: That entry is properly storylinked, so I'm not sure what your question is about. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:39, 22 December 2009 (EST)
:: I'm confused too - the entry, describing Apelinq and company's return to Cybertron, is storylinked to Apelinq's War Journals, but the journals end with Omega Point, with no coverage of said return. [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 20:11, 22 December 2009 (EST)
::: Ah, there's another one? I read the one that was linked to Primeval Dawn. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:33, 22 December 2009 (EST)
:::: Oh, yeah, I see it now, further up the timeline... so I take it that was one of those things that ''would'' have happened if the comic was finished, but wasn't in any of the actual published stuff? Not read the BotCon stuff... - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 20:50, 22 December 2009 (EST)
::::: Yeah, we should add a note that it was planned and not published. (I believe the only place on the wiki where this is documented completely is on [[Primal Prime]]'s page. I never got around to copypasting that information to other pages. Definitely something to put on my TO DO list as I've been filling in this Universe stuff lately.) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:52, 22 December 2009 (EST)
::Yeah, none of the Primeval Dawn pages mention Waspinator at all. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 21:21, 22 December 2009 (EST)

Talk:2005 IDW continuity

2010-01-24T22:07:50Z

70.234.139.84:

== Avengers crossover? ==

It's my understanding that while this is portrayed at a specific point in both New Avengers and IDW's Transformers, it's actually in continuity for neither. So perhaps this needs to be a special note rather than sandwiched between Infiltration and Escalation.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 17:03, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
: I know nothing about it aside from what I've been told here and there, which was just "it goes between Infiltration and Escalation." Is this in an official source somewhere? -- [[User:Repowers|Repowers]] 17:52, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
: It's definitely part of IDW continuity, but not Marvel continuity. Spotlight: Ramjet spins off from one of its threads. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:33, 1 November 2007 (UTC)
: I think that when it comes to this issue, we might be best to wait for Spotlight: Ramjet and see if it addresses the continuity wierdness at all. - Chris McFeely (not signed in)

== Alternate Modes list ==
Hot Rod should be added to this list, if anybody knows what he's supposed to be. And Blitzwing and Megatron. Astrotrain, Hardhead and Nightbeat too, I suppose, though we haven't seen them transform. -- [[User:Repowers|Repowers]] 19:36, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
:Oh, easily. I was just lifting it from Infiltration's page, as it doesn't belong there.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]] 19:51, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
::Megatron's entry there seems to imply that he's still a Walther P38. I don't think that's true. If I knew what model gun he is now, I'd've changed it myself. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 21:24, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Megatron's own character entry identifies his altmode as a P99:

<i>Megatron stayed to guide the second stage of the Decepticons' plans, wishing to try out his new Earth-inspired handgun (Walther P99) altmode. {{storylink|Escalation (IDW)|Escalation}}</i>

:::[[:Image:Massdisplacement.jpg|This image]] and [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walther_P99 some real-life references] can support this assertation, as best as I can make out the comic scan. The details are difficult to be certain of in the final iteration of Megs in that scan, though, and many pistols have similar details. It would have to be a pretty exact match, I think, to certainly say it's any particular gun. --[[User:Sntint|Sntint]] 22:12, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

== New evidence that IDW is not G1 ==

[http://forum.idwpublishing.com/viewtopic.php?p=143991#143991 DonFig]: "...and the thing is, I don't consider IDW's take as 'G1'. the stories are not a continuation of the ones from the 80's cartoon or the Marvel stuff. they didn't crash on earth 4 millions years ago and get lodged in a volcano, it doesn't even fit into Beast wars.

sure it's got the same names and elements from G1, but that can also be said with every other series that came and went since G1.

Armada, Energon, Cybertron, Animated, the Movie.. All have elements of G1 in them, all have an Optimus who's a red truck and there's a Yellow car that younger people can relate to. references to Matrixes, Unicrons..etc, but they're not G1." - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 21:46, 24 July 2009 (EDT)
:That's not "evidence," that's an opinion, and not one that is related to the wiki's classification system. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 21:55, 24 July 2009 (EDT)
::Agreed. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 02:29, 27 July 2009 (EDT)
:::The redesigns for the ongoing would also indicate to me that it isn't G1. Also, it may be a small point, but the differing origin for characters and gimmicks—that don't match G1 bios—would seem to indicate that it isn't G1. Scourge, Goldbug, Micromasters, Dropshot. Even Nightbeat never being a headmaster. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 18:33, 16 January 2010 (EST)
::::The original cartoon didn't match the G1 bios! Their Shockwave wasn't a calculating betrayer, their Sludge wasn't born on Cybertron, their Galvatron wasn't the City Commander. And it had differing origins from other continuities. Were the Dinobots born on Earth or Cybertron? Were the Constructions built on Earth or were they one of the other two origins also presented by the cartoon? Were the Aerialbots brought to life by Vector Sigma or the Creation Matrix? Was Blaster a brooding anti-hero or a hip-hop deejay? These things you bring up in favor of IDW not being part of G1 can be applied to every other aspect of what we all agree is G1. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:51, 16 January 2010 (EST)
:::::Are you proposing that the IDW comics are a franchise independent of the G1 franchise, Starfield? Because that's kind of silly. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 18:55, 16 January 2010 (EST)
::::::'Too Late' is never a reason to do, or not do, something. However, by just about any meaningful definition that I can think of, IDW is a 'G1' continuity. Virtually every Transformer is recognizably based on one of the original G1 toys. Their personalities draw broadly from these sources. The mechanics of the universe seem far more in keeping with prior G1 incarnations than other continuities. (By which I mean - no minicons or cyberkeys or energon weapons, no Magnus as the Autobot head-honcho, etc.) I just don't see it, at all. Even a little bit. Even the War for Cybertron, which is being touted as a continuity reboot, may prove to be 'G1,' so I'm gonna have to say I just don't see a case here. --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] 19:33, 16 January 2010 (EST)
::::::That is what "DonFig" is proposing. "I don't consider IDW's take as 'G1'.... sure it's got the same names and elements from G1, but that can also be said with every other series that came and went since G1." Maybe it is silly, but it can't be ''that'' far off. I was just posting some evidence in favor of it being a different franchise. For posterity? In case it splits more? It wouldn't entirely surprise me if it retroactively tied into a new "War for Cybertron" continuity. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 19:51, 16 January 2010 (EST)
:::::I admit the bio mismatch is a small thing. But I think the Micromasters take that to a new level. They aren't even Autobots and Decepticons. Are they even Cybertronian Transformers or were they from Gorlam Prime? I wasn't clear on that. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 19:51, 16 January 2010 (EST)
:As noted... that's an opinion, not evidence. And really, within context, he's talking about it not being a very SPECIFIC iteration of G1. Splitting it would be pointlessly stupid, especially since now we'd have what, an extra hundred-plus pages of characters with (IDW) now or someshit, when they're pretty much just G1 and are better served within the G1 character articles? Or are we going to split out all the guys who appeared in "Hearts of Steel" too? --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 20:43, 16 January 2010 (EST)

==Recommended reading order==
For a long time, I've been thinking that this wiki should provide the service to our readers of untangling all the IDW-G1 mini-series, maxi-series, and stand-alones into one "recommended reading order". I've given it quite a bit of thought, and I've come up with this: [[:User:Jackpot/Sandbox/IDW-G1 recommended reading order]] I explain my rationales on its [[:User talk:Jackpot/Sandbox/IDW-G1 recommended reading order|talk page]]. While I admit that some subjectivity had to come into play, I have the hope that the community can either accept the list as-is or come to its own alternate consensus. And, ultimately, I would love to see it incorporated into the navigation, maybe in a similar fashion to how we have parallel navs for the Marvel US and UK comics. The reader really ''should'' be able to just click-click-click through the entire IDW-G1 series in a simple and linear way the way they can with almost any other. We editors are as smart and obsessed as they come - IDW's capricious marketing schemes should be no obstacle for the likes of us. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 02:29, 27 July 2009 (EDT)

==-ations Cast==
Call me slow but, is the cast list for the Ations series the full cast? Because its made unclear. If not..is there a place I can see every Autobot and Decepticon that appears in said series? Because I'm curious to know who all shows up in them and to me the list seems too small to be ALL of the Transformers who show up in them. (Or at least the ones that have more than just minor appearances)--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]