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Void Rivals issue 25

2026-04-09T05:35:21Z

Bumblebee2000: I honestly was surprised to see this was not already documented but when I picked this issue up on release day, there was a single copy of a secret cover A. The comic staff were aware of the secret but I know nothing more

{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Void Rivals]]'' #25
|prev=Void Rivals issue 24
|next=Void Rivals issue 26
|image=Void Rivals 25 Cover A.jpg
|caption=Looks like the Void Rivals have an egghead problem!
|title=
|publisher=[[Image Comics]] [[Skybound Entertainment]]
|date=[[December 24]], [[2025]]
|coverdate=December 2025
|written by=[[Robert Kirkman]]
|art by=[[Andrei Bressan]]
|colors by=[[Patricio Delpeche]]
|letters by=[[Rus Wooton]]
|editor=[[Ben Abernathy]]
|continuity=[[Energon Universe]]
|chronology=
}}

'''Right as the dust has settled after Unity nearly ends them all, the Zertonians and Agorrians are swiftly invaded by the dreaded Quintessons, marking the beginning of the Quintesson War.'''

==Synopsis==
In Premiere [[Zalilak]]'s throne room, he holds a meeting with several [[Zertonian]]s over the current state of their city after [[Unity]] nearly destroyed the [[Sacred Ring]]. The meeting is interrupted by a furious [[Proximus]], who has had enough of Zalilak's lies and engages him in a brawl. The fight takes the two outside the castle and down to a city street, just as he is about to deliver a finishing blow, Proximus looks upon a massive spacecraft that has Zalilak distracted, a [[Quintesson Cruiser]]! The Cruiser begins to make contact with the surface, prompting Zalilak and Promixus to save and evacuate any nearby citizens. The Cruiser soon lands in [[Zertonia]], devastating the city, and nearly ends the lives of Proximus and Zalilak until it comes to an abrupt halt. Terrified of its arrival, the two Zertonians stare at the cruiser in disbelief, believing that [[Beta (G1)|Zerta]] has forsaken them.

In [[Agorria]], [[Handroid]] and [[Darak]] have a conversation in the latter's quarters about the former's true sentience. Darak calls upon the similar robotic beings [[Springer (G1)|Springer]] and [[Hot Rod (G1)|Hot Rod]]'s sentience as proof that Handroid is truly alive, deepening the bond between the two. Handroid also calls upon Darak's friendship with [[Solila]], which Darak writes off as not really a friendship, to which Handroid reaffirms that Solila is Darak's best friend. Suddenly, an alarm blares, calling all pilots to action.

In Minister [[Dulin]]'s throne room, he is confronted by Grand General [[Dukan]], seemingly outraged at a lack of a medal ceremony for his actions in the war against the Zertonians. The two [[Agorrian]]s laugh it off, revealing Dukan to be Dulin's brother. Their reunion is cut short, however, as an Agorrian runs inside to warn Dulin of several unknown objects approaching the Sacred Ring.

In Agorrian airspace, Darak is awoken by Handroid, who is still getting accustomed to treating Darak as a friend rather than a mere pilot. Darak calls to his squadron, to which [[Gamut]] reports the squadron has successfully arrived. In formation, they all exchange information on what they have been given, agreeing to stay away from Zertonia after "recent events" reminding [[Garad]] of his fear of [[Goliant]]. Without any time, the squadron is suddenly ambushed by another Quintesson Cruiser, destroying Garad's jumpjet.

In the [[Temple of Zerta's Light]], Solila and her Handroid are trying to figure out how to escape from the restraints, to which Handroid has no luck. Just as Handroid offers a solution, Solila hears the call of Zerta, who orders her to serve one final time now that the Quintesssons have invaded the Sacred Ring.

==Featured characters==
Characters in ''italic text'' appear only in flashbacks. 
{{Featuredcharacters
|h4=[[Agorrian]]s|c4=
* [[Darak]] (8)
* [[Dukan]] (9)
* [[Dulin]] (10)
* [[Gamut]] (11)
* [[Krint]] (12)
* [[Garad]] (13)

|h5=[[Zertonian]]s|c5=
* [[Gulan]] (1)
* [[Mulak]] (2)
* [[Culah]] (3)
* [[Kanela]] (4)
* [[Zalilak]] (5)
* [[Proximus]] (6)
* [[Solila]] (14)

|h6=Others|c6=
* Red [[Handroid]] (7)
* Blue Handroid (15)
* [[Beta (G1)|Zerta Trion]] (16)
}}

==Quotes==

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* The Zertonians are still dealing with the aftermath of almost achieving Unity from [[Void Rivals issue 23|issue #23]].
* Kanela finally returns after last being seen in [[Void Rivals issue 6|issue #6]].
* Proximus mentions the Sacred Texts, which he has mentioned reading before in [[Void Rivals issue 7|issue #7]]. He also mentions hearing the voice of Zerta, which we saw in [[Void Rivals issue 21|issue #21]].
* The Quintessons finally arrive to the Sacred Ring, after first coming across it in [[Void Rivals issue 15|issue #15]].
* Darak calls on the revelations about Zerta, Goliant, and the Zertonians being wrong about it all, all of which we saw from [[Void Rivals issue 22|issues #22]] through [[Void Rivals issue 24|issue #24]].
* Darak and Garad mention avoiding Zertonia "in light of recent events", and being scared of Goliant, all seen in [[Void Rivals issue 23|issue #23]].
* Looks like Garad got a new Jump Jet after his was apparently damaged beyond repair in [[Void Rivals issue 23|issue #23]]. Sadly, his new one gets destroyed immediately at the end of this issue, bummer.

===Errors===
* On page 22, panel 3, Darak calls on his squadron to report what they're seeing, but his second speech bubble does not include a question mark when he asks "What are we looking at here."

===Other notes===
* Energon Experience: Presented by Skybound Executive Editor Ben Abernathy
** '''Character Spotlight:''' Dulin
** '''Hand it Over!:''' After a lack of Handroid in recent issues, readers should be happy after his bigger role in this issue. Now that Darak and Solila each have their own Handroid, they should come in real handy!
** '''Creator Q&A:''' Ben asks Andrei Bressan who his best friend and worst enemy would be in Void Rivals. Bressan answers Dukan for his best friend, and Lord Gyconi for his worst enemy.

===Covers (11)===
* '''Cover A:''' Darak and Solila face a Quintesson Judge, by [[Lorenzo De Felici]].
* '''Cover A:''' Spot the difference, by Lorenzo De Felici.
* '''Cover B:''' Darak and Solila fight a Sharkticon, by [[Andrei Bressan]] and [[Adriano Lucas]].
* '''Cover C:''' Solila, by [[Ben Oliver]].
* '''Cover D (1:25 Copy Incentive):''' Quintesson Bailiff takes down Darak, by [[Carmine Di Giandomenico]].
* '''Cover E (1:50 Copy Incentive):''' Solila, by [[Lesley Li]].
* '''Cover F (1:100 Copy Incentive):''' Proximus fights a hoarde of Sharkticons, by [[Ludo Lullabi]].
* '''Cover G:''' Blank Variant.
* '''Cover H:''' Foil Variant of Cover A, by [[Lorenzo De Felici]].
* '''Cover I:''' Darak Mask Wraparound Die-Cut Foil, by [[Andrea Milana]] and [[Andres Juarez]].
* '''Cover J:''' Solila Mask Wraparound Die-Cut Foil, by Andrea Milana and Andres Juarez.
* '''Cover K:''' Die-Cut, by [[Eric Canete]].

<gallery>
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover A.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover A Rage Version.jpeg
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover B.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover C.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover D.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover E.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover F.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover G.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover H.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover I.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover J.jpg|
File:Void Rivals 25 Cover K.jpg|
</gallery>

===Advertisement===
* Explore the Energon Universe in ''[[Transformers (2023 comic)|Transformers]]'' [[Transformers (2023) issue 28|#28]] and ''[[G.I. Joe (2024 comic)|G.I. Joe]]'' [[G.I. Joe (2024) issue 17|#17]] and [[G.I. Joe (2024) issue 18|#18]].

===Reprints===
* '''''Void Rivals Volume 5: Quintesson War''''' ([[July 21]], [[2026]]) ISBN 1534332515 / ISBN 978-1534332515 
** Collects issues #25-30.
** Trade paperback format.

<gallery>
File:Void Rivals V5.jpg|'''''Volume 5: Quintesson War''''' - cover art by Lorenzo De Felici
</gallery>

==External links==

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Void Rivals issues]]

File:Void Rivals 25 Cover A Rage Version.jpeg

2026-04-09T05:20:49Z

Bumblebee2000: {{SkyboundEU |description= A secret version of the cover A of this issue featuring the face of Rage rather than Death, otherwise the same image. This was shipped in some ratio of regular cover A {{art|art=Lorenzo De Felici}} |series=voidrivals |cov...

{{SkyboundEU
|description= A secret version of the cover A of this issue featuring the face of Rage rather than Death, otherwise the same image. This was shipped in some ratio of regular cover A
{{art|art=[[Lorenzo De Felici]]}}
|series=voidrivals
|cover=Cover A Alt Variant
|excerpt=
|issueno=25
|storylink=
|storytitle=
|year=25}}

[[Category:Images by Lorenzo De Felici]]

Transformers (2023) issue 11

2025-06-14T10:29:14Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Covers */ added second and third printing covers

{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Transformers (2023 comic)|Transformers]]'' #11
|prev=Transformers (2023) issue 10
|next=Transformers (2023) issue 12
|image=Transformers 2023 11 Cover A.jpg
|caption=
|title=
|publisher=[[Image Comics]] [[Skybound Entertainment]]
|date=[[August 14]], [[2024]]
|coverdate=August 2024
|written by=[[Daniel Warren Johnson]]
|art by=[[Jorge Corona]]
|colors by=[[Mike Spicer]]
|letters by=[[Rus Wooton]]
|editor=[[Ben Abernathy]]
|continuity=[[Energon Universe]]
|chronology=
}}

'''The Autobots must rescue their captured comrades from Shockwave’s clutches as the ultimate doom rains down upon them.'''

==Synopsis==
Using a high-tech surfboard, [[Beachcomber (G1)|Beachcomber]] investigates the whirlpool created by [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]]'s attempt to bring [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] into [[Earth]] orbit.

Meanwhile, on the ''[[Ark (G1)|Ark]]'', [[Arcee (G1)|Arcee]] speaks to an unconcious [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]], guilt-ridden for leaving him to be tortured by Shockwave. [[Elita One (G1)|Elita One]] chastises Arcee for leaving as well, causing Arcee to deck her in anger. Witnessing this exchange, [[Carly (G1)|Carly]] asks what happened to him, leading Arcee to reveal that this is what happens to bots captured by Shockwave, meaning that [[Cliffjumper (G1)|Cliffjumper]] and [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] are likely being tortured as they speak. The idea horrifies Carly. [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] confers with [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] about Magnus’s repairs, but Wheeljack is unable to fully repair Ultra Magnus without [[Ratchet (G1)|Ratchet]], and doing so would use up their remaining [[Energon]]. Wheeljack suggests that they could keep him in his current state and revive more [[Autobot]]s instead, but Magnus awakens and pleads with Optimus that he wants to fight as part of this new resistance.

Aboard the ''[[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]]'', [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] asks Shockwave to take [[Ravage (G1)|Ravage]] back to Cybertron to be repaired, but Shockwave insists that there are more important matters to be attended to. He then returns to Cybertron himself and orders the [[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticon]]s to ready their defenses against any potential attacks from the remaining Autobot rebels. When the Combaticons inquire about the status of [[Brawl (G1)|Brawl]] and [[Onslaught (G1)|Onslaught]], Shockwave brushes aside their concerns as well.

The Autobots quickly deduce that the [[space bridge]] bringing Cybertron is connected between the ''Nemesis'' and [[Shockwave's Tower|Shockwave' fortress]], using that to siphon the energy collected from Earth into Energon stores in the fortress. If they can destroy the ''Nemesis'', they can cut that connection off, but it's likely Shockwave already has enough Energon stored up to crush the remaining Autobots on Cybertron. Carly insists that their first priority should be rescuing Cliffjumper, to which Optimus agrees. However, Elita balks at this. She chastises Prime for leaving her and the rest of the Autobots alone on Cybertron for centuries and letting Shockwave's forces slowly destroy them. She does not want to risk losing their home to the [[Decepticon]]s to save this new world. Optimus merely says that he is confident in their abilities and old friends. Arcee, enraged by what the Decepticons did to Magnus, prepares for battle while Carly—surprised at the turn her [[Iron Intercessor]] has taken—looks on. Elita One tells her that she is proud to see her fire returning.

The Autobots formulate a plan: using [[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]]'s teleportation abilities, now connected to [[Teletraan I]], they will teleport inside the ''Nemesis'' and use a series of explosives to destroy the Decepticon flagship, severing its space bridge connection. Carly insists on coming along, believing rescuing Cliffjumper to be her responsibility, but both Optimus and Arcee refuse, promising to bring him home for her.

[[File:TF2023 no.11 - Ultra Magnus and Wheeljack.jpg|thumb|200px|left|[[Derek Yaniger|Yaniger]] would be proud.]]

Beachcomber returns to where he left [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike]] and [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]] and tells Spike of what he saw. Spike asks if they should do something, but Beachcomber solemnly states that there's nothing they can do. He leaves a canister of Energon for Astrotrain before taking Spike to find another quiet part of the world to wait for the inevitable end. As they walk through the woods, Spike sees a deer and recalls when Optimus first stepped foot on the planet. Spike tells Beachcomber that while he knows the fighting is wrong, that doesn't mean they can just run away.

Aboard the ''Nemesis'', Shockwave continues to torture Jazz and Cliffjumper, but is interrupted by the arrival of Optimus Prime and the other Autobots. As Optimus frees their comrades and Elita finishes planting the charges, Arcee threatens to execute Shockwave, but Prime stops her, fearing what might happen if she gives into her anger. Unfortunately, her hesitation gives Shockwave an opening to attack, taking Cliffjumper hostage and escaping. The Decepticon leader orders the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicon]]s to form [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]], but Optimus isn't worried: teleporting in behind them are Wheeljack and the now fully restored Ultra Magnus!

However, upon seeing Shockwave again, Magnus freezes. He can't do it. In a fit of panic, he drops his weapon and retreats, apologizing all the while. As their strongest warrior drives off, Shockwave gloats. He broke the mind of the mighty Ultra Magnus, and now he’ll break the rest of the Autobots' bodies!
{{--}}

==Featured characters==
Characters in ''italic text'' appear only in flashbacks. 
{{Featuredcharacters
|c1=
* [[Beachcomber (G1)|Beachcomber]] (1)
* [[Arcee (G1)|Arcee]] (2)
* [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]] (3)
* [[Elita One (G1)|Elita One]] (4)
* [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] (6)
* [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] (7)
* ''[[Ratchet (G1)|Ratchet]]'' (15)
* [[Cliffjumper (G1)|Cliffjumper]] (18)
* [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] (19)

|c2=
* [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (8)
* [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] (9)
* [[Ravage (G1)|Ravage]] (10)
* [[Vortex (G1)|Vortex]] (11)
* [[Blast Off (G1)|Blast Off]] (12)
* [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]] (13)
* [[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]] (14)
* [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]] (17)
* [[Mixmaster (G1)|Mixmaster]] (18)
* [[Scrapper (G1)|Scrapper]] (19)
* [[Scavenger (G1)|Scavenger]] (20)
* [[Bonecrusher (G1)|Bonecrusher]] (21)
* [[Hook (G1)|Hook]] (22)
* [[Long Haul (G1)|Long Haul]] (23)
* [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] (24)

|c3=
* [[Carly (G1)|Carly]] (5)
* [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike Witwicky]] (16)
}}

==Quotes==
"I know how you feel, Beachcomber. It feels... 'wrong' to fight. But I don't think I have to. I just know I can't run away."
:—'''Spike''' finds his resolve.

"Ratchet said I was too concerned with this world. But I brought this war to them. They need us now." 
"We have our own problems, Optimus." 
"That is true. But I am beginning to think we need them to survive, as well."
:—'''Optimus Prime''' and '''Elita One''' talk objectives.

"HAHAHA! I broke his mind! And now I will break your bodies!"
:—'''Shockwave''' celebrates over the Autobots

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* Soundwave has been trying to repair Ravage ever since Optimus damaged him back in [[Transformers (2023) issue 1|issue #1]].
* The Combaticons were shown to be defending Shockwave's fortress in [[Transformers (2023) issue 7|issue #7]].
* Skywarp's willingness to help the Autobots is likely due to the combination of wanting revenge for what Soundwave and [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] did to him back in [[Transformers (2023) issue 4|issue #4]], as well as Arcee saving him from Carly’s attack in [[Transformers (2023) issue 8|issue #8]].
* Spike recalls Optimus's unfortunate encounter with another deer from [[Transformers (2023) issue 2|issue #2]].

===''Transformers'' references===
* Beachcomber's use of a surfboard is likely a reference to a similar scene in the [[The Transformers (cartoon)|Generation 1 cartoon]] episode “[[The Ultimate Doom, Part 3]]” - the multi-part epic this arc is largely based on - where the Autobots must surf to reach the [[sea funnel]].
* Just as in [[Transformers (2023) issue 9|issue #9]], Shockwave is shown as highly emotional, even laughing. He continues to be starkly out-of-character compared to everybody else, in a way that sure ''looks'' deliberate....

===Real-world references===
* Shockwave's battle cry is "[[X-Men|To me, my Decepticons!!!]]".

===Errors===
*Soundwave informs Shockwave that the portal to Cybertron has been repaired. Shockwave already knows this, as last issue, he himself told Soundwave the very same thing! (And no, nothing seems to have happened to it in between issues.)
*Once rebuilt, Ultra Magnus’s head antennas are now colored blue, as opposed to them being white (like his G1 Counterpart) when He is first shown in Arcee’s flashback in issue 7.

===Other trivia===

===Covers===
{{comicstub|13/17 covers documented}}
* '''Cover A:''' Shockwave fires on Optimus, by Daniel Warren Johnson and Mike Spicer.
* '''Cover B:''' Shockwave attacks Elita, by Jorge Corona and Mike Spicer.
* '''Cover C (1:10 Copy Incentive):''' Connecting cover, by [[Karen S. Darboe]].
* '''Cover D (1:25 Copy Incentive):''' Elita fires a blast, by [[Ludo Lullabi]].
* '''Cover E (1:50 Copy Incentive):''' Shockwave stands over a fallen Optimus, by [[Wes Craig]].
* '''Carnivore Comics Cover:''' by [[Ryan G. Browne]].
* '''Big Time Collectables Cover:''' by [[Ivan Tao]].
* '''The 616 Comics Cover A:''' by [[Tiago da Silva]].
* '''The 616 Comics Cover B:''' by Tiago da Silva.
* '''Ultramega homage surprise cover (Limited to 1 per store):''' by [[James Harren]].
* '''Second Printing Variant Cover A:''' Onslaught, by [[Jason Howard]]
* '''Second Printing Variant Cover B:''' Beachcomber, by Jason Howard
* '''Third Printing Variant Cover:''' Arcee and Carly ready for battle, by [[Jay Anacleto]] and [[Romula Fajardo Jr]]
<gallery>
File:Transformers 2023 11 Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 Cover C.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 Cover D.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 Cover E.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 Carnivore Comics Cover.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 Big Time Collectibles Cover.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 The 616 Comics Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 The 616 Comics Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 James Harren Cover.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 11 second printing A Onslaught Jason Howard.jpg
File:Transformers 2023 11 second printing B Beachcomber Jason Howard.jpg
File:Transformers 2023 11 third printing Anacleto cover.jpg|
</gallery>

===Advertisements===
* Explore the Energon Universe in ''[[Scarlett (comic)|Scarlett]]'' [[Scarlett issue 4|#4]] and ''[[Destro (comic)|Destro]]'' [[Destro issue 4|#4]].
* ''Invincible: The Hero-Building Game''
* ''Impact Winter''
* Experience the Energon Universe in the trade paperbacks for ''Transformers'', ''[[Void Rivals]]'', ''[[Duke (comic)|Duke]]'', and ''[[Cobra Commander (comic)|Cobra Commander]]''
* Skybound Insiders

===Reprints===
* '''''Transformers Volume 2: Transport to Oblivion''''' ([[November 27]], [[2024]]) ISBN 1534345272 / ISBN 978-1534345270 
** Collects issues #7–12.
** Trade paperback format.

<gallery>
File:Transformers 2023 V2.jpg|'''''Volume 2: Transport to Oblivion''''' – cover art by Daniel Warren Johnson and Mike Spicer
</gallery>

==External links==

==References==
{{reflist|2}}

[[Category:Transformers (2023) issues]]

Transformers (2023) issue 14

2025-06-13T06:53:14Z

Bumblebee2000: added second printing covers

{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Transformers (2023 comic)|Transformers]]'' #14
|prev=Transformers (2023) issue 13
|next=Transformers (2023) issue 15
|image=Transformers 2023 14 Cover B.jpg
|caption=We're sure this is going to end splendidly for everyone involved.
|title=
|publisher=[[Image Comics]] [[Skybound Entertainment]]
|date=[[November 13]], [[2024]]
|coverdate=November 2024
|written by=[[Daniel Warren Johnson]]
|art by=[[Jason Howard]]
|colors by=[[Mike Spicer]]
|letters by=[[Rus Wooton]]
|editor=[[Ben Abernathy]]
|production design=[[Andres Juarez]]
|production=[[Ashby Florence]]
|continuity=[[Energon Universe]]
|chronology=
}}

'''Though wounded, Starscream's ambitions remain strong. With a new group of allies at his side, he is determined to regain control of the Decepticons.'''

==Synopsis==
Having recovered the body of [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]], [[M.A.R.S.]] commander [[Horton]] and his team have decided to affix the [[Decepticon]] warrior to their [[H.I.S.S. tank]], complete with a remote control for the vehicle. However, after completing their project, Starscream awakens, horrified at what they've done to him. He tries to kill the humans (along with [[Razz|Private Razz]]'s [[cat]]), but is weak without [[energon]] and unable to control his movements. Horton offers to help Starscream, which the angry [[Seeker (body-type)|Seeker]] rebuffs. However, Horton reveals that they took the precaution of installing explosives in Starscream's body while he was out, forcing Starscream to capitulate to him. Starscream goes along with Horton, sensing that they both have the same desire for power.

''Years ago, on [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]], [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] and Starscream attack a group of [[Autobot]]s. Taking them prisoner, Megatron offers them the chance to join the Decepticons. When they refuse, Megatron transforms into his gun mode and orders Starscream to use him to execute their enemies. Starscream is hesitant, not wanting to murder prisoners of war. However, Megatron compels him and Starscream follows through, apologizing all the while. Over the course of the war, the pair kill more and more Autobots, Megatron turning Starscream into his "hand of death."''

[[File:TF2023 no.14 - StarscreamsBrigade.jpg|left|thumb|250px]]

As Starscream and the M.A.R.S. troops travel, they come across the chained-up [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]], much to Starscream's surprise. Astrotrain reveals that [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] released him from the ''[[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]]'', offering him revenge on Megatron to join his plan. Starscream balks at the idea that Soundwave would willingly give up his master, but frees Astrotrain and assures him that if the [[Triple Changer]] joins him, he will deliver on Soundwave’s false promise. Horton is about to object, but the conversation is interrupted by a piece of Cybertron falling from the sky into the [[Pacific Ocean]]. As the piece's impact causes a tidal wave, the humans begin to flee while Astrotrain transforms to transport Starscream away. However, Horton uses the controller to prevent Starscream from boarding his ally. Starscream demands Horton get him onto Astrotrain, offering to get the M.A.R.S. team to safety as well.

Aboard Astrotrain's shuttle mode, Horton reminds Starscream that he's in charge of their arrangement. Astrotrain then alerts Starscream to the sight of [[Onslaught (G1)|Onslaught]] and [[Brawl (G1)|Brawl]] in the water. The Decepticons rescue their allies, much to the irritation of Horton as he loses more and more control over the situation. Horton orders his team to be taken down to the surface, but at that moment, Astrotrain hits a rogue wave, sending the humans tumbling and knocking Horton unconscious.

When he awakes, Horton finds himself on the chunk of Cybertron, with Starscream being hailed as leader by Astrotrain and the reassembled roster of the [[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticon]]s. Starscream tells his assembly that their first order of business will be to take the fight to Soundwave and his Decepticons, but they are interrupted by Horton, who has realized Starscream has double-crossed him. The M.A.R.S. commander threatens Starscream with the explosives his team placed in him, but when he presses the button, nothing happens. Razz and the rest of the team emerge and reveal Starscream promised to free them if they removed the explosives. Starscream thanks Razz for her help... then squashes her with his hand before turning his [[null-ray]]s on Clayton and squishing Horton under his tank treads, leaving only Razz's cat and Martin alive. He orders Martin to begin sketching, wanting the artist to document his rise to power.
{{--}}

==Featured characters==
Characters in ''italic text'' appear only in flashbacks. 
{{Featuredcharacters
|c1=
* ''Autobot prisoners'' (7)

|c2=
* [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] (5)
* ''[[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]]'' (6)
* [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]] (8)
* [[Onslaught (G1)|Onslaught]] (9)
* [[Brawl (G1)|Brawl]] (10)
* [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]] (11)
* [[Vortex (G1)|Vortex]] (12)
* [[Blast Off (G1)|Blast Off]] (13)

|h3=[[M.A.R.S.]]|c3=
* [[Horton]] (1)
* [[Razz|Private Razz]] (2)
* [[Martin (Energon Universe)|Private Martin]] (3)
* [[Clayton|Private Clayton]] (4)
}}

==Quotes==
“'''WAIT!!!!''' You were in '''lava!''' (Holds up rough sketch) '''See??!''' Your legs were '''gone! ''' We saved you!” 
“That…is '''ALL WRONG!''' My proportions are '''completely off! Draw me again, and do it right this time!!!'''
:—'''Private Martin''' and '''Starscream''' have different priorities.

"Do not fight this, Starscream. It is better this way." 
"Please... I don’t... I don’t want to--" 
"What you desire matters not. You are mine now. You will obey my command."
:—'''Megatron''' exerts his will over a still reluctant '''Starscream'''.

"'''Never again''' will I be the property of '''anyone! I will be the master of my own destiny. The captain of my own fate.'''"
:—'''Starscream'''

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* The events of this issue take place alongside that of the previous arc, with Starscream and Astrotrain witnessing the piece of Cybertron that [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] accidentally blew off in [[Transformers (2023) issue 12|issue #12]] falling into the ocean.
* Starscream's reluctance to kill the Autobot prisoners runs in stark contrast to his murder of the deactivated [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] in [[Transformers (2023) issue 1|issue #1]], meaning that this flashback can't have taken place too much longer after the final flashback segment of [[Transformers (2023) issue 13|last issue]]. More important, though, is the reveal of why this version of Starscream sought to take down Megatron: the Decepticon leader used some sort of mind-control power to force Starscream into killing Autobot after Autobot using his pistol mode.
** Reminder that, even with Megatron regularly taking away his autonomy, Starscream's aligned with the Decepticons because he has good reason to believe that the Autobots are responsible for his best buddy [[Genvo]]'s death. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend," after all...
* Astrotrain was freed from the ''Nemesis'' by Soundwave in [[Transformers (2023) issue 8|issue #8]], and chained up by [[Beachcomber (G1)|Beachcomber]] in [[Transformers (2023) issue 10|issue #10]]. He’s been eager for revenge on Megatron ever since, which Starscream uses to recruit him. Of course, Starscream believes he already finished off their leader, as seen in the [[Transformers Energon Universe Special story]].
* Brawl is still missing his lower half after being bisected by the closing [[space bridge]] in [[Transformers (2023) issue 9|issue #9]]. Onslaught followed Brawl to Earth that same issue, while [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]], [[Blast Off (G1)|Blast Off]], and [[Vortex (G1)|Vortex]] were last seen fleeing from Optimus in issue 12. Notably, the latter three are first seen aboard the blown-off piece of Cybertron rather than in the ocean with their teammates, which is consistent with #12, where they retreated further into Shockwave's lair rather than through the portal to Earth.
* Brawl mentions that he and Onslaught overheard Soundwave plotting against Shockwave earlier, referring to Soundwave's conversation with [[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]] towards the end of issue #10, which Onslaught was shown listening in on as he kept the bisected Brawl company.
** While it wasn't fully explicit if Optimus crushing Shockwave's head was a full-on death in issue #12, Brawl here refers to him as having been killed. Given this is Shockwave, however, it remains to be seen as to how long this will stick.

===''Transformers'' references===
* Starscream recruiting the Combaticons for a coup d'état against the established Decepticon forces echoes the [[The Transformers (cartoon)|Generation 1 cartoon]] episode “[[Starscream's Brigade]]”. The cartoon also saw Starscream convince Astrotrain and his fellow Decepticon Triple Changer [[Blitzwing (G1)|Blitzwing]] to join him in claiming Decepticon leadership in the episode "[[Triple Takeover]]". Notably, both the Combaticons ''and'' the Triple Changers turned on Starscream in their respective episodes, so we'll have to wait and see if history repeats itself again...

===Errors===
* Horton's first speech bubble on page 14 is rendered in the square shape of the Transformers rather than the traditionally rounded style used by human characters.

===Other trivia===
* The nature of Megatron's gun [[alternate mode]] is further explored in this issue. As in several episodes of the Generation 1 cartoon, the Decepticon leader requires someone else to use him when he transforms due to the limits of his power.

===Covers===
{{comicstub|10/11 covers documented}}
* '''Cover A:''' Astrotrain in chains, by Daniel Warren Johnson and Mike Spicer.
* '''Cover B:''' Starscream firing with his new H.I.S.S. form, by [[Jorge Corona]] and Mike Spicer.
* '''Cover C:''' Connecting cover by [[Viktor Bogdanovic]].
* '''Cover D:''' A very '80s inspired Optimus Prime, by [[Jorge Fornés]].
* '''Cover E:''' Optimus Prime, Jazz, and Arcee in an homage to Generation 1 toy packaging, by [[Derrick Chew]].
* '''Big Time Collectibles Cover A:''' Megatron standing before a graffiti-covered building in the rain, by [[Ivan Tao]]
* '''Big Time Collectibles Cover B:''' Megatron atop a pile of rubble, by [[Kael Ngu]].
* '''East Side Comics Cover:''' Bruticus, by [[Alan Quah]].
* '''TopShelfComic Cover A:''' Megatron atop a pile of rubble in the rain, by [[Jimbo Salgado]].
* '''TopShelf Comic Cover B:''' Optimus Prime leading the Autobots into battle, by [[Livio Ramondelli]].
* '''Second Printing Variant cover A:''' Starscream affixed to H.I.S.S Tank, by [[Jason Howard]]
* '''Second Printing Variant cover B:''' Swindle, by [[Jason Howard]]

<gallery>
File:Transformers 2023 14 Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 Cover C.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 Cover D.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 Cover E.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 Big Time Collectibles Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 Big Time Collectibles Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 East Side Comics Cover.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 TopShelfComic Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 14 TopShelfComic Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 14 2nd Ptg Cover A.jpeg|
File:Transformers 14 2nd Ptg Cover B.jpg|
</gallery>

===Advertisements===
* The biggest comic book of the decade is here: ''[[G.I. Joe (2024 comic)|G.I. Joe]]''!
* A new era from Larry Hama in ''[[G.I. Joe (comic)|G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero]]''
* The Energon Universe has arrived in trade paperbacks for ''[[Duke (comic)|Duke]]'', ''[[Cobra Commander (comic)|Cobra Commander]]'', ''[[Scarlett (comic)|Scarlett]]'', ''[[Void Rivals]]'', and ''Transformers''

===Reprints===
* '''''Transformers Volume 3: Combiner Chaos''''' ([[May 28]], [[2025]]) ISBN 153432559X / ISBN 978-1534325593 
** Collects issues #13–18 and the [[Transformers Energon Universe Special story|''Transformers'' story]] from ''[[Energon Universe Special 2024]]''.
** Trade paperback format.

<gallery>
File:Transformers 2023 V3.jpg|'''''Volume 3: Combiner Chaos''''' – cover art by Daniel Warren Johnson and Mike Spicer
</gallery>

==External links==

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Transformers (2023) issues]]

Transformers (2023) issue 16

2025-06-13T06:37:40Z

Bumblebee2000: cannot find clean images of the second printing covers without "artwork not final" marks even though the Trailbreaker cover at my comic shop seems identical so added without image?

{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Transformers (2023 comic)|Transformers]]'' #16
|prev=Transformers (2023) issue 15
|next=Transformers (2023) issue 17
|image=Transformers 2023 16 Cover A.jpg
|caption=
|title=
|publisher=[[Image Comics]] [[Skybound Entertainment]]
|date=[[January 8]], [[2025]]
|coverdate=January 2025
|written by=[[Daniel Warren Johnson]]
|art by=[[Jorge Corona]]
|colors by=[[Sarah Stern]]
|letters by=[[Rus Wooton]]
|editor=[[Ben Abernathy]]
|production design=[[Andres Juarez]]
|production=[[Ashby Florence]]
|continuity=[[Energon Universe]]
|chronology=
}}

'''The Autobots are caught in the crossfire of a Decepticon civil war, and the only hope to end it may be the return of an even greater evil.'''

==Synopsis==
[[File:TF2023 no. 16 - BruticusVsDevastator.jpg|left|250px|thumb]]
Despite her reservations, [[Elita One (G1)|Elita One]] leads [[Cliffjumper (G1)|Cliffjumper]] and [[Bluestreak (G1)|Bluestreak]] across the war-torn wastes of [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] to what was once the home of Cliffjumper's [[clan]], long forgotten by the [[Decepticon]]s ever since they destroyed it in a bombing campaign. Cliffjumper digs through the rubble to find a [[spark canister]] he had hidden away; though there isn't enough remaining to bring back any of his friends, he says there's the possibility it can be used to create something new.

On [[Earth]], [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] orders the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicon]]s to merge into [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] to combat [[Bruticus (G1)|Bruticus]]. As [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]], Soundwave, and their respective troops clash, [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]], [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]], and [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] are caught in the middle of the carnage. [[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]] tries to reason with Starscream, but the one-time Decepticon leader is too obsessed with revenge and reveals the truth of what he and Soundwave did to [[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]]. As Starscream rants about the universe being made only for the strong, Thundercracker uses the [[H.I.S.S. tank]] remote control to steer Starscream's body off a ledge. The blue [[Seeker (body-type)|Seeker]] then transforms and flies away, abandoning Soundwave to the fury of [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]]. Optimus decides the [[Autobot]]s must intervene, fearing that the Decepticons’ senseless violence could damage the dam and endanger the humans. However, he is again overcome with visions and rage, firing his [[fusion cannon]] straight at the dam. Water bursts through the structure and sweeps away all the [[Transformer]]s. As the water rushes through the woods, Optimus spots two children on bikes fleeing from the waves. He tries to save them but is unable to reach them. Luckily, they are saved by the timely arrival of [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]], who uses his force field to protect the “strange little creatures,” who managed to survive nearly being crushed by the combiners.

Back on Cybertron, the Autobots return to their makeshift headquarters and Elita explains to Cliffjumper that they’ve been unable to communicate with any other Autobot resistances and that they could be the only ones left. Elita asks Cliff what he plans to do with the sparks in the canister, and he reveals his plan to take them to the [[Well of All Sparks|Well of Sparks]]. Elita reveals that the Well is deep in Decepticon-controlled territory, but Cliff insists that they need a new warrior to help them, something Bluestreak echoes. And afterward, Cliff will return to Earth. To [[Carly (G1)|Carly]].

Meanwhile, Carly and [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike]] set off on their search for [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]] with [[Arcee (G1)|Arcee]] and [[Beachcomber (G1)|Beachcomber]]. Elsewhere, in some desert, [[Laserbeak (G1)|Laserbeak]] finds that which he was sent to find: [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]], sitting in a cave, wounded and blinded. Megatron thanks Laserbeak as he grabs the bird, pulls out some of his cables and connects them to his eyes; he orders Laserbeak to act as his eyes and guide him to the Decepticons.

==Featured characters==
Characters in ''italic text'' appear only in flashbacks. 
{{Featuredcharacters
|c1=
* [[Bluestreak (G1)|Bluestreak]] (1)
* [[Elita One (G1)|Elita One]] (2)
* [[Cliffjumper (G1)|Cliffjumper]] (3)
* [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] (13)
* [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] (14)
* [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] (15)
* [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] (21)
* [[Warpath (G1)|Warpath]] (22)
* [[Beachcomber (G1)|Beachcomber]] (25)
* [[Arcee (G1)|Arcee]] (26)

|c2=
* [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (4)
* [[Bonecrusher (G1)|Bonecrusher]] (5)
* [[Mixmaster (G1)|Mixmaster]] (6)
* [[Scrapper (G1)|Scrapper]] (7)
* [[Long Haul (G1)|Long Haul]] (8)
* [[Hook (G1)|Hook]] (9)
* [[Scavenger (G1)|Scavenger]] (10)
* [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] (11)
* [[Bruticus (G1)|Bruticus]] (12)
* [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] (16)
* [[Astrotrain (G1)|Astrotrain]] (19)
* [[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]] (20)
* ''[[Thrust (G1)|Thrust]]'' (23)
* [[Laserbeak (G1)|Laserbeak]] (27)
* [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] (28)

||c3=
* Kevin (17)
* Kevin's friend (18)
* [[Carly (G1)|Carly]] (24)
* [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike Witwicky]] (26)
}}

==Quotes==
"You think Soundwave is any different than me?! It was '''both''' of us that tore your precious Skywarp to pieces, all for his useful metals!!!" 
"You-- you lie!" 
"Wake up from your naïveté, Thundercracker!!! The universe is only for the strong!!! [[Turborat]] eat turborat! Spark versus spark! '''METAL ON METAL!'''"
:—'''Starscream''' shocks '''Thundercracker''' with news about their brother.

"Sorry I'm late to the party, I woke up and almost got crushed by [[Devastator_(G1)#Energon Universe|those]] [[Bruticus_(G1)#Energon Universe|two]]! What in the spark is going on?" 
"Chaos."
:—A newly reactivated '''Trailbreaker''' finds '''Optimus Prime''' in a bad spot.

"My old friend. It has been too long. I must thank you. For finding me, wandering this desolate landscape. But thanks to your temporary sacrifice... I can now, see. Now guide me to my warriors."
:—No longer blind, '''Megatron''' has returned.

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* We first learned about the destruction of Cliffjumper's clan in [[Transformers (2023) issue 4|issue #4]].
* Thundercracker initially believed the Autobots to be responsible for what became of Skywarp when he was revived in [[Transformers (2023) issue 5|issue #5]], but now knows that it was Starscream and Soundwave that used the Seeker to rebuild [[Teletraan I]].
* This is the first time Astrotrain has used his steam train mode in the Energon Universe.
* It was unknown why Astrotrain was locked away aboard the ''[[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]]'' other than his rage against Megatron when we first saw him back in [[Transformers (2023) issue 8|issue #8]]. Here, we learn that Megatron was responsible for "ending his love."
* Optimus Prime has been experiencing strange visions ever since [[Sparkplug Witwicky|Sparky]] entered the [[Matrix of Leadership]] in [[Transformers (2023) issue 6|issue #6]]. However, these visions have been growing more and more corrupted, along with Optimus' eyes turning purple with rage, since [[Transformers (2023) issue 12|issue #12]].
* MEGATRON RETURNS! The Decepticon leader was last seen in the series proper to be frozen in a block of ice in issue #4, though readers of ''[[Cobra Commander (comic)|Cobra Commander]]'' know that he was taken by the denizens of [[Cobra-La]] to be studied. He escaped from [[Cobra-La]] in [[Transformers Energon Universe Special story|the ''Transformers'' segment]] of the ''[[Energon Universe 2024 Special]]'', though losing his (remaining) eye to [[Golobulus]] in the process.

===''Transformers'' references===
* Devastator says, "Prepare for Devastation, Bruticus!", a line spoken in [[All Hail Megatron]] by Devastator himself.
* Starscream's line, "Sniveling FOOL! You cannot kill what is unkillable!", to Soundwave, during their fight, is an obvious reference to multiple pieces of Transformers media where Starscream survives death through various ways. Such as surviving as a ghost, having an immortal spark, or by having a piece of the AllSpark connected to him.
* Thundercracker’s decision to abandon the Decepticons fits in with earlier portrayals of him, calling to mind both his original toy file card and his appearances in the [[2005 IDW continuity]].
* The Well of Sparks, more commonly known as the "Well of All Sparks" is a longtime piece of ''Transformers'' mythology, first appearing in the [[Dreamwave Generation One continuity]] in ''[[Transformers: War Within: The Dark Ages]]'' [[Conflagration|#6]].

===Covers===
* '''Cover A:''' Bruticus vs. Devastator, by Daniel Warren Johnson and [[Mike Spicer]].
* '''Cover B:''' Bruticus emerges from a smoking forest, by Jorge Corona and Mike Spicer.
* '''Cover C:''' Connecting cover by [[Karl Kerschl]].
* '''Cover D:''' Soundwave vs Starscream, by [[Manabu Yashiro]].
* '''Cover E:''' Laserbeak perches on Megatron’s arm, by [[Homare]].
* '''Second Printing Variant cover A:''' Blast Off, by [[Jason Howard]]
* '''Second Printing Variant cover B:''' Trailbreaker, by [[Jason Howard]]

<gallery>
File:Transformers 2023 16 Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Cover C.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Cover D.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Cover E.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Unknown Comics Cover.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Big Time Collectibles Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 The 616 Comics Cover A.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 The 616 Comics Cover B.jpg|
File:Transformers 2023 16 Big Time Collectibles Cover B.jpg|
</gallery>

===Advertisements===
* Explore the Energon Universe in ''[[G.I. Joe (2024 comic)|G.I. Joe]]'' [[G.I. Joe (2024) issue 3|#3]], ''[[Void Rivals]]'' [[Void Rivals issue 16|#16]], and Transformers #17.
* Four-page preview for ''Invincible Universe: Battle Beast''

===Reprints===
* '''''Transformers Volume 3: Combiner Chaos''''' ([[May 28]], [[2025]]) ISBN 153432559X / ISBN 978-1534325593 
** Collects issues #13–18 and the [[Transformers Energon Universe Special story|''Transformers'' story]] from ''[[Energon Universe 2024 Special]]''.
** Trade paperback format.

<gallery>
File:Transformers 2023 V3.jpg|'''''Volume 3: Combiner Chaos''''' – cover art by Daniel Warren Johnson and Mike Spicer
</gallery>

==External links==

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Transformers (2023) issues]]

Prowl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity

2023-03-23T10:57:35Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Transformers '84 */ so that was supposed to be the preview button... there we go!

{{factions|autobot|autobotg2|maximal}}
{{suite}}
[[File:TFU Prowl.jpg|thumb|Just look at those adorable toes.]]
'''Prowl''': Prick since [[1984]].

==Marvel ''The Transformers'' comics==
{{noteukonly}}
[[File:Magnificent6_crop.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.6]]
''Early in Cybertron's [[Great War (G1)|civil war]], before [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus]] became leader, Prowl was part of a strike team comprising himself, [[Jazz (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Jazz]], [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]], [[Sunstreaker (G1)|Sunstreaker]], [[Wheeljack (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Wheeljack]] and [[Stampede]]. Together, they were tasked with infiltrating Decepticon territories to sow chaos from within. During a mission to the [[neutral]]ist town of [[Yuss]], they defeated a small band of Decepticons and were hailed as heroes by the locals. Regarding the war as little more than fun and games at the time, Prowl dubbed his team the "[[Magnificent Six]]", and started to think himself untouchable. This opinion was challenged when a retaliatory attack came, this time involving far deadlier opponents. The Magnificent Six held Yuss's borders for a week despite being up against [[Megadeath (G1)|Megadeath]] and his elite cadre, but the once-grateful neutralists grew to resent the Autobots. The siege ended with the neutralists betraying Prowl's band to the enemy.''

''As Megadeath's captives, the six were subject to tortures and humiliations for seven days. In one of his sadistic games, Megadeath gave five of the six blasters, and offered them a chance to win their freedom; they only needed to stop him from killing Stampede, the only unarmed member. Prowl and the others failed to even take up arms, so thoroughly had Megadeath succeeded in breaking them by that point. Megadeath then gave the Autobots two hours to find his neutralist prisoners before he detonated five Neutronic bombs to obliterate the entire region. Finding their mettle, the Autobots forewent any attempt to rescue either themselves or the civilians for the Decepticon's entertainment. They instead hid, and ambushed Megadeath when he came to investigate their lack of action. Though Prowl and Wheeljack nearly died in battle, the remaining three Autobots crippled their torturer. Megadeath refused to divulge where he had stashed the neutralists, so the Autobots left him behind to die to his own device. When later questioned about what had transpired during their mission, the survivors lied and claimed not to remember any of it.'' {{storylink|The Magnificent Six!}}

[[File:Marvel71 neversurrender.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6]]
''Prowl was at Prime's side when, upon being promoted to Autobot supreme commander, he thwarted Megatron's earliest attempt at taking [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]].'' {{storylink|And There Shall Come...a Leader!}} He was also present at the battle of [[Jan-Ja]], where Optimus Prime rallied the troops in the defense of Iacon ''once more''. {{storylink|Surrender!}}

[[File:Prowlg1marvelfirst.jpg|upright=0.8|thumb|left|Well somebody's character model was ready.]]
Prowl was one of the select Autobots chosen by [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus Prime]] to travel aboard the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]], and ended up in stasis lock for four million years at the base of [[Mount St. Hilary]] with the rest of the crew. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} {{storylink|Cold Comfort and Joy!}} Once the volcano exploded, Optimus chose Prowl to lead the first away mission into civilization. Prowl's group was the first to observe humans in the flesh, so to speak, and to understand that they were the dominant life form on the planet. After a battle with the Decepticons at a drive-in theater, Prowl ordered a retreat since the organic lifeforms did not seem capable of self-defense. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} Prowl took part in a skirmish at a human auto repair facility, managing a direct hit on [[Buzzsaw (G1)|Buzzsaw]] during the altercation, {{storylink|Power Play!}} though the battle left him and his comrades drained of increasingly scarce fuel. Prowl took part in an effort to rescue the kidnapped Sparkplug Witwicky, {{storylink|Prisoner of War!}} and was later among the Autobots working to repair the damaged Ark. {{storylink|The Last Stand}}

''During work on one piece of machinery, a strong electrical feedback struck [[Brawn (G1)|Brawn]], and Prowl was forced to violently rip out the device's power cord to save his comrade. But as Brawn recovered, Prowl and the other Autobots found their teammate acting uncharacteristically violent. Brawn burst out of the Ark and began rampaging in a nearby town, forcing Prowl and the others to forcibly subdue him. Though another electrical shock allegedly returned Brawn to normal, Optimus couldn't be sure that his soldier wouldn't lash out once more. The test of Brawn's loyalty wound up being a trial by combat against [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]], which ended in what Prowl thought was the Autobot's demise. In reality, [[Mirage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Mirage]] had projected an illusion to dupe Starscream into thinking he had annihilated his foe. Upon Brawn's return and re-induction in the Autobot ranks, Prowl welcomed him with open arms.'' {{storylink|The Enemy Within!}}

''Soon thereafter, Megatron led his troops on a siege against the Autobots within the Ark. In the clash, Prowl was tackled down by [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]], despite his best efforts to gun the Decepticon down. The scuffle was interrupted when the Ark's computer, [[Aunty|Auntie]], was activated with a circuit malfunction. Auntie magnetized the Ark's walls, restraining all combatants and effectively putting their battle on hold. Autobots and Decepticons alike were only freed thanks to the only two unaffected robots, Ravage and [[Windcharger (G1)|Windcharger]], teaming up and shutting down the deranged computer. Even though the Decepticons were then driven out of the Autobots' headquarters, Prowl sustained significant damage, and required extensive reconstruction before he could take on active duty once more.'' {{storylink|Raiders of the Last Ark}}

[[File:Optimus prowl decepticon dam busters.jpg|thumb|upright=1.3]]
''At a later time, the Autobots came to fight against the Decepticons as the evil robots besieged a [[Sherman Dam|hydro-electric dam]]. Prowl helped charge the Decepticon troops while Optimus Prime dueled Megatron atop of the dam itself. But Optimus was defeated by his nemesis, and Megatron destroyed the dam before fleeing. Scrambling his troops in response to the ensuing flood, Optimus sent Prowl ahead to lead the fastest Autobots, tasking them with impeding the water's progress in whichever way they could. Though the trenches and barriers the Autobots made slowed the flood, a great portion of it still reached a nearby town. The Autobots managed to prevent any loss of life, but were vilified by the humans nonetheless, as they weren't able to tell the difference between Autobots and Decepticons.'' {{storylink|Decepticon Dam-Busters!}}

[[File:TheWrathOfGuardian ProwlCliffhanger.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.3|Prowl begins his career of cursing Grimlock's decisions.]]
After the Decepticons' next assault on the Ark, Prowl ended up deactivated and held captive by [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]] and the Decepticons along nearly all his comrades. The Autobots' inert forms were strung up from the Ark's ceiling, intended to be used as spare parts to build a new army of Decepticons. {{storylink|The New Order}} [[Ratchet (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ratchet]], the last surviving Autobot, beheld Prowl dangling limply alongside the others when he managed to infiltrate the now Decepticon-controlled ship. {{storylink|Warrior School!}} ''Prowl was eventually revived when Ratchet and the [[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]] reclaimed control of the Ark from Shockwave's drone, [[Guardian (Marvel)|Guardian]]. Upon his awakening, Prowl learned alongside Wheeljack and Ratchet that the drone had been booby-trapped with a thermo-nuclear bomb, which threatened to blow all within the Ark to smithereens should Grimlock deliver a killing blow to it.'' {{storylink|The Wrath of Guardian!}} ''Though Prowl was helpless to do anything about their situation, Wheeljack managed to prevent their demise by remote-controlling Optimus Prime's headless body, and stopping Grimlock from blasting Guardian's head off. Guardian fled, and the Dinobots reconvened with the rest of the Autobots. Remembering the last time they had to deal with a rogue Guardian unit, Prowl suggested that Ratchet fix up Windcharger next, so that they could magnetize the droid to the Ark's walls. Guardian returned before they could fully implement this plan however, forcing [[Swoop (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Swoop]] to fly Guardian up into the sky, where the bomb was detonated far away from the rest of the Autobots. Believing that Swoop had perished in his rescue, Prowl and the others held a mourning ceremony for their lost comrade.'' {{storylink|The Wrath of Grimlock!}}

[[File:PrimeTime-ultimatelyfutile.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.4|This injury would knock Prowl out of the American stories for a while, but over in the UK they had better health care.]]
With Optimus Prime's head still in Decepticon possession, Prowl took command of the Autobots until their true leader could be restored. At Jazz's suggestion, he forged an alliance with human fuel magnate [[G.B. Blackrock]], arranging an exchange of free gasoline for the Autobots for their help in protecting Blackrock's facilities from the Decepticons. {{storylink|DIS-Integrated Circuits!}} He set the Autobots to various vital repair tasks around the crashed Ark, gave Blackrock a tour of the Ark in an effort to build trust with their new ally, and sent a team out to stop the Decepticons from constructing a communications dish. {{storylink|The Next Best Thing to Being There!}} On learning that their friend Buster was in danger, he dispatched Bluestreak and Bumblebee to defend him. Prowl personally led an expedition to recover Optimus Prime's head, {{storylink|Brainstorm!}} but the team was ambushed by the Decepticons and a false Prime. Prowl suffered a mangled arm, but was among the last Autobots standing when the real Prime arrived and put an end to the battle. {{storylink|Prime Time!}}

{{note|In the US series, the injuries sustained by Prowl in this story resulted in him going offline, as seen in "[[Rock and Roll-Out!]]" In the UK comic, however, he remained operational and starred in several further stories.}}

''As [[Christmas]] rolled around, Prowl became dumbfounded by Optimus' willingness to indulge Buster in what he believed to be a bizarre charade. He and Bluestreak discussed the matter as Buster supervised the construction of a Christmas tree within the Autobots' headquarters, and Optimus paraded about in a big red suit. Bluestreak suggested that Prime simply felt endebted to Buster for carrying the Matrix of Creation in the Autobots' time of need, an explanation that Prowl readily accepted.'' {{storylink|Christmas Breaker!}}

[[File:Prowlg1crisisofcommand.jpg|upright=1.75|thumb|left|Some even call me a prick! And why? Because I dared to dream of my own race of atomic monsters!]]
''Shortly thereafter, Prowl was the ringleader of a group of Autobots strongly requesting that Prime use his [[Matrix of Leadership|Creation Matrix]] to create [[Ultimate Autobot]] super-warriors to wipe out the Decepticons for them. The lethal efficiency of Prowl's stance was just as strongly opposed by another faction who saw such action as a perversion of their sacred lifeforce, and the potential for laying waste to Earth. Prime's long absence and relative weakness after his recent ordeals left Prowl and the others less deferential than normal to his will, but after he single-handedly fought through the Decepticons to rescue [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]], Prowl and the other Ultimate Autobot proponents backed down and accepted Prime's final word on the subject.'' {{storylink|Crisis of Command!}}

''When an unidentified flying transformer approached the Ark, Prowl and the other able-bodied troops went out to meet it, only to find themselves under attack by a mind-controlled Swoop. Though the Autobots were unable to subdue the Dinobot, Optimus prompted Swoop to wrestle free from the mind-control by issuing the rebellious bot an order. Swoop flew off to the lab of the [[Peter Anthony Morris|human]] who had taken control of him, with Prowl and the others in pursuit. Upon their arrival, Swoop handed the fleshling over to Optimus for judgement... only to go into a wild rage and attack the Autobots once more.'' {{storylink|The Icarus Theory}} ''Swoop was knocked offline, but the Autobots learned that the other Dinobots were also being driven feral by their primitive circuitry. After tracking them down, Prowl nearly sacrificed himself crashing a shuttlecraft straight into the feuding [[Grimlock (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Grimlock]] and [[Sludge (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Sludge]].'' {{storylink|Dinobot Hunt!}}

[[File:Optimus prime prowl jazz mirage to a power unknown.jpg|thumb|right|upright=2.2|Prowl is actually unaffected - he's just enjoying being able to be his true self.]]
''While on a mission to build friendly relations with the people of [[Pinewoodsville]], Prowl and his fellow Autobots were hit with a strange energy blast that temporarily reversed their personalities. The group rampaged through the town, ruining months of goodwill work. Tracking the source of the blast to England, the Autobots flew overseas to put an end to what they assumed was a Decepticon plot. But the Decepticons had also been affected by the blast, and were likewise tracking its origin. Prowl, Jazz, Sideswipe, and Mirage holed up inside Optimus's trailer to conserve energy, but were shaken out of their hiding spot by Starscream just as another personality-reversing blast hit the group. Optimus was sent crashing into a tree off the road, and his troops began calling for a violent mutiny. The Autobots returned to their senses before they dealt out any permanent damage, but Optimus was left too banged-up to carry on with the mission. The culprit behind the energy blasts turned out to be a human invention, the "[[Purnel's Auto-Reverse Defence|PARD]]." It was destroyed, along with [[Zeke Heilmann|a spy]] trying to steal it, after Starscream battled Jazz over both. With the threat neutralized, the Autobots carried Optimus back to their UK Base, where Ratchet was waiting to fix him up.'' {{storylink|To a Power Unknown!}}

[[File:DistantThunder ProwlLethalForce.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.2]]
''Prowl was [[Mass substitution|displaced]] to [[Limbo]] along with Optimus Prime and Ratchet when [[Galvatron (G1)|Galvatron]], [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] and [[Scourge (G1)|Scourge]] [[time travel]]ed from the future.'' {{storylink|Target: 2006}} ''Joined later by [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]], [[Thundercracker (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Thundercracker]] and [[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]], they found themselves in the middle of a war between the peaceful, cat-like [[Cloran]] and evil, monkey-like invaders led by [[Zenag]]. Optimus's refusal to use lethal force left the more pragmatic Shockwave in a better position forge alliances, but it was ultimately discovered that the whole set-up was only an illusion. Once said illusion was dispelled, Prowl and the others found that they had been sharing a dream fabricated by [[Limbo parasite]]s in order to be made to feel violent emotions, the latter's sustenance.'' {{storylink|Distant Thunder!}} ''When Galvatron's group returned to their own time, Prowl was released from Limbo.''

[[File:PerchanceToDream ProwlDoneWithRules.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.6|For the rest of the issue, the role of Prowl will be played by Nicholas Cage.]]
''Prowl was next in action during the [[Battlecharger]]s' rampage, and attempted to bring them in despite the endangerment of human life. After narrowly preventing a gas station from exploding due to his opponents' sabotage, and avoiding a car pile-up, Prowl grew enraged and readied to unleash his full fury on the Decepticons. However, Optimus then turned up, having easily found the battle scene due to the extensive collateral damage it had caused. The Autobot leader talked Prowl out of pursuing the 'Cons, and berated him for being so reckless in his pursuit.'' {{storylink|...Perchance to Dream}}

''Prior to Christmas [[1986]], the Autobots learned that the Decepticons had taken control of a [[NASA]] space-monitoring system. Prowl swiftly organized a strike team to interfere, himself at its helm, with Trailbreaker and Jetfire backing him up. In his attempt to reach [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] on the battlefield, Prowl was confronted by [[Kickback (G1)|Kickback]], who held him at bay. Prowl ordered Jetfire to take out Soundwave and interrupt the Decepticons' transmission to Cybertron, but the jet opted to instead help with Kickback. Kickback easily outmaneuvered the larger Autobot by shrinking down to his insect mode, and the Decepticons beat a hasty retreat. Infuriated that Jetfire had flubbed at his task, Prowl gave him a chewing out.'' {{storylink|The Gift}}

[[File:Hoist prowl tracks night the transformers saved christmas.jpg|thumb|left|upright=0.9]]
On Christmas Eve, Prowl, Bumblebee, Tracks, and [[Hoist (G1)|Hoist]] foiled Soundwave's plan to steal electricity from a power plant near [[Midville]]. Outnumbered, Soundwave and Laserbeak retreated upon the Autobots' approach. Prowl had Bumblebee and Tracks pursue the Decepticons while he and Hoist attempted to repair the damage they had done to the plant. Prowl and Hoist were unsuccessful in getting the plant up and running again, and later followed Tracks into town after he reported that he and Bumblebee had similarly met with failure. They then watched as Bumblebee got into the spirit of giving, and supplied power to Midville's Christmas tree so the humans could partake in their holiday traditions. {{storylink|The Night the Transformers Saved Christmas}}

''Having grown dissatisfied with his troops' performances during his recent absences, Optimus Prime planed to fake his own death, so that the Autobots could learn to better fend for themselves. To this end, he informed his soldiers that he would be heading out on a solo scouting mission near Decepticon territory. Prowl reacted poorly to this, insisting that one of the more expendable Autobots carry out the mission instead. But Optimus was adamant in carrying out the task himself, leading to Prowl's fears being seemingly confirmed a half-hour later; he was among a group of Autobots who came upon a facsimile construct of Prime, torn to shreds by the Decepticons.'' {{storylink|Prey!}} ''A funeral was held for the Autobots' fallen leader, attended by all. At least, until Optimus spontaneously reappeared on Earth standing atop his headstone, and the whole matter was quickly forgotten.'' {{storylink|Resurrection!}}

[[File:FuneralForAFriend-GETAWAYFROMME.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.45]]
''Deactivated by means unknown, Prowl lay in stasis in the Ark's repair bay for many months.'' Ratchet managed to briefly revive him in order to exploit his police car mode against a human thief named the [[Mechanic]] who had infiltrated the Ark, but Prowl still needed rest and was spent after this brief period of activity. {{storylink|Funeral for a Friend!}} Prowl was fully revived by the time the Ark was relaunched; he was among the many Autobots who welcomed Blaster back into the fold, asking him to take over leadership of the Autobots from Grimlock. Prowl went so far as to advise him to stay on the Ark rather than tangle with the Dinobots to rescue a [[Spacehikers|quartet of children]] he had befriended, which Grimlock had ensnared in a trap to draw his rival out. But Blaster surrendered himself in order to secure the kids' safety. {{storylink|Spacehikers!}} Prowl was later among the crowd who gathered for Grimlock and [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]]'s grudge match on the moon; when the Decepticons launched a sneak attack, he was the first to realize what was happening and call for the Autobots to turn and fight; he joined the battle alongside the combined crews of the Ark and ''[[Steelhaven (G1)|Steelhaven]]'' against the Decepticon party-crashers. {{storylink|Totaled!}} Unfortunately, it wasn't too long afterwards that Prowl was once again knocked off-line, this time battling the [[Underbase]]-charged Starscream in [[New York City|New York]]. {{storylink|Dark Star}} {{storylink|Flashback!}}

''Despite him being out of action, a [[solid light simulation]] of Prowl was used in a training mission for the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]]. Said simulation contained both high-ranking Autobot officers and Autobot "non-entities" though, so it's unknown how worthy of an opponent Prowl was considered by the Decepticons.'' {{storylink|The Hunting Party (Marvel)|The Hunting Party}}

[[File:OnTheEdgeOfExtinction ProwlGrimlock.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.8]]
After Ratchet seemingly perished, Optimus Prime fell into a deep melancholy, and had the Ark's computer recount to him all those who had fallen under his command. Prowl was among those name-dropped. {{storylink|Yesterday's Heroes!}}

He would remain in stasis for some time, until Grimlock acquired a large supply of super-energy known as [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]], and pumped it into all of the Ark's stasis chambers. {{storylink|The Void! (US)|The Void!}} Prowl found himself revived just in time to engage the Chaos-Bringer known as [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]] for the sake of all Cybertron. Grimlock led the charge by ramming the Ark in Unicron's face, sending the ship plummeting down towards Cybertron's surface. Prowl berated him for this foolish course of action, only for Grimlock to respond by pitching Prowl out of the ship. Prowl made it to the surface safely, and arrived to the battlefront in time to see his long-term friend and leader, Optimus Prime, sacrifice himself to destroy Unicron. {{storylink|On the Edge of Extinction!}}

[[File:Wheeljack-stilllife.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7|right]]
After Unicron's destruction however, Prowl was surprised to find that Optimus's tattered remains still clung onto a semblance of life. Optimus named Grimlock his successor before finally expiring, much to Prowl's bemoanment. He subsequently delivered this news to the Dinobot, only to find that Grimlock was apparently unaware of the responsibility that now fell upon him; though Prowl insisted that Grimlock needed to nurture the fragile alliance the Autobots had forged with the Decepticons, Grimlock instead opted to seek out the Ark and the Autobots that still remained inoperative within it. Prowl at least managed to get Grimlock to promise that he would uphold Prime's ideals before he went off with the Dinobots. {{storylink|Still Life!}}

[[File:Prowlg1exodus.jpg|left|upright=1.1|thumb|You'd be a prick too if Grimlock kept getting promoted over you.]]
As such, Prowl found himself working almost alone trying to maintain the tenuous peace between the Autobots and Decepticons. To make matters worse, he and Blaster discovered that Cybertron was tearing itself apart; without Primus's consciousness to maintain it, the planet was losing its cohesion. Prowl continued to implore Grimlock to step up into his role and make a speech that would assure everyone that the situation was well in hand. But Grimlock continued to eschew such responsibilities and reminded Prowl that Optimus had trusted him solely to lead, enraging Prowl to no end. The final straw came when Grimlock participated in a petty brawl like a common thug, prompting Prowl to chew him out in public. [[Bludgeon (G1)|Bludgeon]] used the opportunity to demand assurances out of the Autobots, and Prowl was forced to comply, revealing prematurely where the ships they planed to leave the planet with were parked. Thus Prowl ended up overplaying his hand: Bludgeon took got the chance to betray the Autobots, leaving them trapped on the dying world, without transport, while the Decepticons fled to conquer new civilizations. {{storylink|Exodus!}}

[[File:LastAutobot-Silverbolt.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8|right]]
Berating his lack of foresight and common sense, Prowl wandered outside, waiting for the inevitable end. Luckily for Prowl, Grimlock had anticipated the Decepticons' treachery (by Primus, how'd he manage that?!?) and had secured alternate starships. The Dinobot surprised Prowl and Blaster by parking said vessels, Decepticon Battle Cruisers, right in front of the Autobots' headquarters. Prowl suddenly found himself very grateful for Grimlock's rebellious streak. {{storylink|A Savage Circle}}

[[File:EndOfTheRoad-finalfive.jpg|thumb|left]]
The Autobots tracked the Decepticons to the planet [[Klo]], and Prowl partook in some back-seat driving as he urged Silverbolt to reach their destination as quickly as possible. Irritated that with every moment that the Decepticons were left to their devices meant more innocent lives lost, he turned to Grimlock and demanded to know why he couldn't have commandeered a faster ship. The latter and Nightbeat both made their best attempts at talking Prowl down, insisting he save his energy for the conflict that lay ahead. {{storylink|The Last Autobot?}} As the Autobots prepared to make planetfall, Prowl suggested they be cautious in their approach. Grimlock disregarded this advice, a charged into the fray blindly, prompting most of his troops to do likewise. The ensuing battle wound up having a disastrous outcome; the Decepticons had been anticipating the Autobots' arrival, and slaughtered all but five of their members in an initial ambush. Those left standing were Grimlock, Prowl, Blaster, Slag, and Kup. Despite the group's best attempts at hiding their scents, they were tracked down by a hunting party, though miraculously managed to overcome their attackers. Doubling back for a final stand, Prowl's group found the resurrected Optimus Prime and the legendary [[Last Autobot]] already turning the tide against Bludgeon's forces. With the Last Autobot reviving all those who had fallen, the Autobots drove off Bludgeon's forces, sending them into a temporary exile. {{storylink|End of the Road! (US)|End of the Road!}}
{{-}}

===Transformers Annual 1985===
{{note|Due to being published early in the franchise, these stories are out of continuity with the above.<ref>"Plague of the Insecticons!" was later designated as [[universal stream]] [[Primax 1285.0 Gamma]] by [[Vector Prime]].</ref>}}

[[File:UKAnnual86 ProwlhitbySplinterGrenade.jpg|upright=1.0|thumb|right|A prick laid low by dozens of smaller pricks.]]
Realizing that their mission on Earth would be infinitely more difficult without capable human allies, Optimus attempted to open a dialogue with the American government. Planning the meeting in utmost secrecy, he, [[Warpath (G1)|Warpath]], and Prowl managed to secure an audience with the [[Ronald Reagan|President of the United States]]. The three Autobots drove to the White House, and were warmly received by their host. But their talk was interrupted by the [[Insecticon (G1)|Insecticons]]. The Autobots did their best to take down the trio, only for [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] to loudly proclaim that Optimus was his leader, and he was off to attack [[Washington, D.C.|the city]] as per his orders. Prowl was especially outraged at this act of slander. Unfortunately, the President's soldier escorts were quick to turn on the Autobots, having assumed that Bombshell had revealed the robots' true intent.

Prowl and Warpath were sent to deal with the Insecticons, while Optimus went off on his own to "cut them off at their source." Though Warpath was confused over what Optimus had just said, Prowl assured him not to bother himself with it; they had a mission to do, and that was the only thing they needed to think about. They drove to downtown Washington, finding that their foes had wasted no time in reducing the scene to a warzone. Prowl fought hard to bring an end to the carnage, though he was downed by one of [[Shrapnel (G1)|Shrapnel]]'s [[Shrapnel grenade|splinter grenades]]. Thankfully, Optimus's [[Roller (G1)|Roller]] drone came to Warpath's aid. Optimus was successful on his end of the mission, bringing down [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]], responsible for remote-controlling the Insecticons. With the battle over, Optimus and his troops fled the scene; they felt that the humans would not believe them should they try and explain the situation, and that the Decepticon had already sullied their reputation beyond repair. {{storylink|Plague of the Insecticons!}}

[[File:UKAnnual86 Prowlspiesmetal.jpg|upright=1.1|thumb|left|"If there's one thing I know by sight alone, it's Ravage's dandruff!"]]
After the bulk of the Autobot forces left on a mission, Prowl and Bumblebee were relegated to monitoring news broadcasts for any signs of Decepticon activity. Prowl struck gold upon discovering footage of [[John Butler|a man]] being rescued by a woman, spotting a sliver of Cybertronian metal at the man's feet. Analyzing the story, Prowl came to the conclusion that Ravage had attacked the man, and attempted to contact Optimus on the matter. But upon finding that his signal wasn't getting through, Prowl resolved himself to wait until their commander returned. Bumblebee managed to change his mind, pointing out that the Decepticon threat would only grow should they stay idle. Prowl, Bumblebee, [[Topspin (G1)|Topspin]] and [[Twin Twist]] headed out to investigate.

Prowl remained nervous during the outing, suggesting to his compatriots they return to the Ark at the first obstruction in their path. The others wouldn't hear it however, and they soon picked up Ravage's trail. Following it, the group traveled for days until they happened upon the Decepticons' hideout. There, Megatron's soldiers were excavating rare crystals that could bring new Decepticons to life. Prowl suggested that the Autobots hold their position and contact the Ark for reinforcements, prompting a debate within the group. While the others were distracted by their argument, Bumblebee took it upon himself to push on alone, only to be caught in [[Thrust (G1)|Thrust]] and [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]]'s cross-hairs. Prowl and the [[Jumpstarter]]s were forced to head down to his rescue. But they found themselves paralyzed with fear partway through their descent; [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]] had also been posted as a guard, and was using his fear-inducing engines on the Autobots. Thankfully, Prowl was able to work through his paralysis, and gunned Dirge down with a few [[acid pellet]]s. The Autobots then managed to down Starscream and send him crashing into Megatron's mine, destroying it utterly. Thrust retaliated by burying the Autobots in an avalanche, and by the time Prowl clawed his way back out, the Decepticons had already fled the scene. {{storylink|Hunted!}}

===Marvel UK future timelines===
{{note|The movie adaptation, originally published by Marvel US, is in italics}}
[[File:ThePlanetEater wasnt no ice chunk.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.8]]
''In one alternate timeline, the Decepticons succeeded in conquering all of Cybertron by the year [[2005]], forcing all of the Autobots off-world. Prowl was among those who wound up posted at [[Moonbase One]], and left the satellite alongside Ironhide, Ratchet, and Brawn to make an Energon run to Earth. Partway to their destination however, they were boarded by a Decepticon party. Prowl was fatally shot down by Megatron in following confrontation.'' {{storylink|The Planet-Eater!}}

A time traveler from the distant future, [[Dicet Alpha-zero]], would one day traverse the time-stream to observe several key moments in the Transformers' war, witnessing Prowl fighting back against the Decepticons aboard the Ark prior to it crashing on Earth, and an impostor Optimus Prime gunning down Prowl and Sideswipe. {{storylink|The Quest!}}
{{-}}

===Rhythms of Darkness!===
[[File:RhythmsofDarkness SurvivingAutobots.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1|[[Magnificent Six|The Magnificent Three]]?]]
In an alternate [[2009]], Prowl was one of only seven Autobots left alive after [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] and his Decepticons took over America. With Cybertron destroyed by [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]] and the various Primes dead, things looked bleak. Prowl and Jazz led a last-ditch assault on the Decepticon fortress, though [[Getaway]] broke rank early on and attacked [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] and [[Scourge (G1)|Scourge]] early in the mission. Quickly adapting to the situation, Prowl ordered [[Guzzle (G1)|Guzzle]] and [[Chainclaw (G1)|Chainclaw]] to help Getaway in distracting the guards while the rest of the team pushed forward. Miraculously, they managed to send a signal to the rest of the world that America was still alive and fighting. When some [[Hook, Line, and Sinker|mysterious travelers]] shang-haied Galvatron from the field of battle, Prowl joined Jazz and [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]] (the last of their kind) in fighting alongside their human allies with renewed vigor. Perhaps the war could yet be won! {{storylink|Rhythms of Darkness!}}

Later on in [[Primax 490.0 Gamma]], the reformed [[Cybertronian (faction)|Cybertronian Empire]] dispatched [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] to Earth to enlist the aid of the Trio in the fight against Unicron. Together, Autobot, Decepticon, and Cybertronian stood as one and vanquished the Chaos-Bringer. {{storylink|Ask Vector Prime}}
{{-}}

===Earthforce===
{{earthforcefiction}}
[[File:Prowllittlemen.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|Prowl was GEEWUN before it was fashionable.]]
At some point during the conflict on Earth, Prowl faced off against Blitzwing on a highway, dodging the Decepticon tank's artillery as he drove. {{storylink|Once upon a Time...}}

{{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Ironhide profile}}

Deactivated following his battle with the [[Underbase]]-enhanced Starscream, Prowl lay recuperating within a lifepod in the Ark for months, until the [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] of a parallel future intervened. Using a "[[mind bug]]" device, Galvatron manipulated the baser instincts of several Autobots, attempting to revive them as pawns he could use for his own purposes. Instead they revived intent on opposing him. Prowl joined [[Wheeljack (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Wheeljack]], [[Sunstreaker (G1)|Sunstreaker]], [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]] and [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] in overpowering and capturing the renegade Decepticon. Wheeljack cobbled together a device that turned Galvatron's own technology against him, and Prowl slapped it on the villain's head, leaving him trapped in his own nightmares. {{storylink|...Perchance to Dream}} Prowl would emerge from this experience as a stable individual, possibly free from any mental issues as he'd been activated sooner and had longer to adjust, as well as due to his logical mind. {{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Prowl profile}}

As the days passed, Prowl attempted to readjust to the war, despite how it had changed around him. Along with Wheeljack, he lamented about the proliferation of newer types of Transformers, claiming these newcomers gave him a headache just thinking about them. Luckily, their patrol turned up several familiar enemies, including the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]] and [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] working under [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]]'s command. Megatron had formulated a scheme to destroy Earth's atmosphere with a [[Global warming satellite|deadly rocket]], and reap the excess energy that would no longer be filtered out before reaching the planet's surface. {{storylink|Starting Over!}} While Wheeljack engaged the Decepticons, Prowl leaped aboard the flying rocket, knocking it off course so that its deadly poison never reached the proper altitude. {{storylink|Desert Island Risks!}} He crashed down in the backwoods of Louisiana, and befriended some locals who helped fix him up over the next few days. Prowl also neutralized the rocket's poison, and got a good chuckle out of watching the two Decepticon factions arrive days later and begin fighting over a useless cargo. {{storylink|Life in the Slow Lane}} His newly relaxed nature would sometimes impair with quick decision making. {{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Prowl profile}}

[[File:Snaptrapflashback.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.4]]
A new team of Autobots called [[Earthforce]] had been formed, partly to help recover Prowl and the atmospheric rocket, and he quickly joined the organization once reunited with his fellow Autobots. Working under Grimlock's overall command, Prowl acted as second lieutenant, providing a voice of reason and strategy for the Dinobot Commander. On one occasion, Prowl sabotaged Megatron's attempt to alter the timeline using a [[Flashback Doorway]]. The two opponents traveled back in time to the battle with Starscream, where Megatron possessed the body of [[Snaptrap (G1)|Snaptrap]], and attempted to lead the [[Seacon (G1)|Seacons]] to safety in order to receive their services in the present. Prowl possessed his own past form and ensured the Seacons' destruction, as well as that of his own past self, before returning to the present. {{storylink|Flashback!}} He also talked Grimlock into accepting the [[Survivors]] into Earthforce, and joined them in assaulting the island base of the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]] to rescue their Decepticon member, [[Carnivac (G1)|Carnivac]]. Upon arrival, the Autobots overpowered the remaining Mayhems, but were stopped short of granting any of them a "warrior's death" by Carnivac. Impressed by what he viewed as an act of mercy, Prowl formally welcomed Carnivac in the Autobot fold. {{storylink|Where Wolf?}}

Prowl and the rest of the Earthforce were forced to respond when a "concerned citizen" alerted them to Megatron and Shockwave's battle at [[Memphis Airport]], though they (rightfully) suspected that the situation was a set-up put into play by an unseen party. {{storylink|Internal Affairs!}}

[[File:Earthforce house that wheeljack built.jpg|thumb|upright=2]]
When the Autobot [[Earthbase]] was finished, Prowl gathered with all the other Autobots outside to witness Wheeljack's handiwork. Ever cautious and critical, Prowl commented on the noticeable lack of defenses. Wheeljack then turned on the defense grid and tossed a rock towards the base, triggering a series of underground weapon systems that annihilated the projectile. Prowl still wasn't convinced, and began asking how the defenses might be knocked off-line once activated. Wheeljack assured him the defenses were so completely fool proof that NO ONE could shut them off once they had been activated unless they were sitting at the control console inside the base. Prowl then gave Wheeljack his "Everybody's dumb but me" look, and did a headcount of the ''entire'' Earthforce who had come outside for the demonstration... meaning no one was inside who could shut off the deadly defense grid. In order to get back inside their base, Prowl volunteered to brave the perils and reach the console himself. With [[Jazz (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Jazz]], [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]] and the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]] spotting him, Prowl navigated his way through lasers, [[Heat Seeker (G1)|Heat Seekers]], [[Acid Bat]]s, and electrified tentacles before finally shutting off the system. {{storylink|The House that Wheeljack Built!}} Wheeljack went to work decentralizing the base's defenses, which unfortunately left it vulnerable to attack. The Autobots' lack of defenses coincided with the Decepticons finding the location of their headquarters, and summarily launching an all-out siege against it. Thankfully, the attack was nothing more than a distraction for an attempted hijacking of an oil tanker, and when the Survivors foiled the theft, Starscream ordered the Decepticons to retreat. Prowl saw Soundwave, Divebomb, and Hook off as they fled the scene. {{storylink|Divide and Conquer!}}

When Bludgeon, Stranglehold, and Octopunch managed to escape their cell within the Earthbase, Prowl reported the incident to Grimlock and assured him that their guard, Inferno, would survive despite getting stabbed in the back during the breakout. {{storylink|Shut Up!}}

[[File:Earthforce external forces.jpg|thumb|left|upright=2]]
Later on, [[Snarl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Snarl]] began suffering from a case of [[Corrodia Gravis]], and the Autobots were forced to go to Starscream in order to get a compatible systems boost to save the Dinobot's life. Not destined to be an easy mission in the best of cases, Prowl, Ironhide and the remaining Dinobots walked in on an assassination in progress and the former Decepticon leaders attempted to remove the current ones from their former thrones. As was often the case, it fell on Prowl to re-explain to Grimlock why it wasn't a good thing that Starscream's life was in danger. {{storylink|External Forces!|External Forces!}} After Megatron, Shockwave and their assassins were chased off, Prowl and Grimlock made a deal with Starscream to gain his help, in exchange for agreeing to step in if Megatron ever tried to overthrow their current Decepticon regime again. {{storylink|The Lesser Evil!}}

When [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] injected [[Superion (G1)|Superion]] with a [[cerebro-shell]] and caused him to go wild, Earthforce was in dire straits trying to find a means of stopping the warrior juggernaut. Prowl found a human reporter on the scene named [[Irwin Spoon]], and made a deal with him for an exclusive interview in exchange for Irwin's help removing the shell from the inside. {{storylink|Inside Story!}} Irwin was successful and got his interview. Prowl hoped the good publicity would help the Autobots establish better relations with humanity, despite Grimlock's grumbling. It seemed the Decepticons had the same notion, and so Starscream and Soundwave sent the Stunticons to kidnap Irwin from Earthbase before he could publish his story, taking him right out from under Prowl's olfactory receptor. {{storylink|Front Line! (issue)|Front Line!}} Prowl tried to chase down [[Motormaster (G1)|Motormaster]] and recover the human, but was bashed off the side of the highway, and had to be recovered by Wheeljack. {{storylink|End of the Road! (UK)|End of the Road!}}

In [[1990]], Optimus unwittingly reunited the surviving members of the [[Magnificent Six]] for a mission to the [[Acid Wastes]]. He suspected the [[Underbase]]'s ruins still held a connection to Cybertron's core, which they could tap into to defeat [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]]. Despite the mission's urgency, Prowl and the others made excuses to be excluded from it. Optimus was bewildered by this apparent display of cowardice, and sent them forth anyways, with [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] along to round out the team.

[[File:Magnificent Six the end.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7]]
As the five delved deeper into the Wastes, their traumatic memories seeped to the forefront of their minds, culminating in their paralysis upon reaching the remnants of [[Yuss]]. There, they were accosted by mutated mechs, survivors of the Neutronic holocaust that they had failed to prevent millions of years ago. But another ghost from their past held even greater sway over their psyches: [[Megadeath (G1)|Megadeath]] had survived as well, and took the group captive once more! Having realized in the interim that his teammates were plagued by past trauma, Silverbolt sought to stir Prowl and the others out of their stupor through ridicule, calling the five "the Autobots' resident losers." This riled them enough for the truth of what had transpired in Yuss to finally come out. Silverbolt convinced his comrades that they were stronger than they thought, and the group's confidence slowly returned. With hate and cold fury driving them, Prowl, Sunstreaker, Wheeljack, Inferno, and Jazz confronted Megadeath while Silverbolt saw to the mutated neutralists being freed from his control. Prowl's group battered down their former torturer, only stopping short of the killing blow. But Megadeath would rather kill himself, while taking the Autobots with him, than admit defeat; he breached his own nuclear core, beginning a destructive chain reaction. The Autobots fled to once more avoid annihilation.

Having found closure, the Autobots continued on with their mission, and reached the former site of the Underbase with the neutralists in tow. Prowl turned to Jazz and suggested that, with Silverbolt along to replace [[Stampede]], it was almost as though they were the magnificent six once more. But Jazz replied that they couldn't go back to the way things were; they had grown too much, and seen for themselves the ugliest side of war. {{storylink|The Magnificent Six!}}
{{-}}

===Another Time & Place===
[[File:Prime prowl another time & place.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.8|Prowl had a ''G2'' neck before it was cool.]]
Several months after the incident on [[Klo]], Prowl caught wind of Grimlock running off on his own again, this time back to [[Hydrus Four]]. Prowl alerted Optimus Prime at [[Nova Point]] to the situation, but was surprised when his leader harshly rebuked him for bringing it to his attention. When Prime made it clear he didn't want anything to do with Prowl's report, the Autobot strategist stormed off to consider the problem himself. After some solitary computation, Prowl decided that the threat of Decepticons following Grimlock to Hydrus Four and acquiring [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]] was too perilous to ignore. He was rushing out of his chambers, ready to throw together a squad of Autobots regardless of what Optimus Prime thought, when he ran smack into Optimus himself. Prime apologized to Prowl for "hiding his head in the sand"—he had wanted the war to be over so badly, for his fellow Autobots' sake and not his, that he was willing to ignore an obvious threat. The two old friends shook hands and proceeded to gather their strike team.

[[File:Another Time Place Fangry.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4]]
On Hydrus Four, Prowl joined a small group of commandos including [[Springer (G1)|Springer]], [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]] and [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]] to scout the enemy position. They dispatched [[Fangry (G1)|Fangry]] with little effort, and sent in [[Roadhandler (G1)|Roadhandler]] and some [[Micromaster]]s to free Grimlock and the Dinobots quietly before the main offensive began. Nothing ever goes quietly with the Dinobots, though, and so once the shooting started inside, the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]] were sent in to bomb the facility and let the Decepticons know they were in for it. Prowl and his fellow Autobots assaulted the base and, in little time at all, Bludgeon and his crew were dismantled and the day was won yet again. {{storylink|Another Time & Place}}
{{--}}

==Marvel ''Generation 2'' comic==
[[File:Prowlg2muzzle.jpg|left|upright=0.6|thumb|Prowl and Grimlock's sexual tension continues.]]
When Optimus Prime and Grimlock discovered the threat of the [[Cybertronian (faction)|Cybertronians]], they called in Autobots scattered across the galaxy, including Prowl. As one of Prime's most loyal supporters, Prowl did not participate in Grimlock's ill-advised strike on the [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Liege Centuro]] and his fleet. Instead, he helped Optimus free Grimlock and his strike team after they had been taken prisoners by the enemy. {{storylink|Devices and Desires! (Marvel)|Devices and Desires!}} Still, Prowl would not completely ignore Grimlock's opinions: when Optimus Prime decreed that he be left alone to entreat Megatron for peace, Grimlock convinced Prowl that Prime made a bad call, and they arrived with a rescue battalion just in time to keep Megatron from destroying his old nemesis. {{storylink|The Gathering Darkness}}

[[File:Jazz silverbolt prowl escalation.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8]]
Optimus recuperated from his injuries for a few days afterwards, only for Megatron to burst into the medical bay following a brief off-world absence. Prowl rushed to Optimus's aid, only to find that Megatron had come to forge an alliance. Grimlock was scoffed at the very notion, and Prowl was forced to restrain the Dinobot after Megatron suggested that Prime muzzle his petulant soldier. Though an alliance was agreed upon, the Autobots were soon called to the planet [[Ethos]] to repel invaders, a conflict Megatron refused to involve himself in. {{storylink|Escalation!|Tales of Earth Part Five}} The Autobots found the culprit behind the invasion once more to be Jhiaxus's army, and Prowl helped in staving off an impeding genocide. But the Cybertronians proved as formidable as ever, and Prowl, Optimus, and Bumblebee were soon entrenched and surrounded, with little hope of victory in sight. The tide turned with Megatron's arrival, who had allegedly changed his mind upon learning who it was that the Autobots were fighting. {{storylink|Escalation!}}
{{--}}

==''Classics''==
{{noteclassics}}
[[File:BWSG-prowlbeastmode.jpg|thumb|upright=1.5|left|I'm brushing up on looking down, I'm working on my roar!]]
After the war, Prowl eagerly took on the task of assigning new civilian roles for Autobot soldiers to better help them adjust to peacetime. {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 18|Optimus Prime's profile in Club magazine #18}}

Some time later, Prowl, was given command over Cybertron while Optimus was dealing with Megatron's forces on Earth. Deciding that there was no more room for rogue heroics among the Autobot ranks, he traveled to Azure alongside [[Silverbolt (G1)#Classics|Silverbolt]] and [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity#Classics|Ironhide]] to reel Grimlock back into the Autobot forces. The trio tracked down Slag and Sludge and arranged through them a meeting with their leader. This meeting wound up being cut short by a distress call from Earth, and Grimlock agreed to accompany the Autobots aboard the ''[[Graviton (Classics)|Graviton]]'' to respond to it. {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 50|Grimlock's profile in Club magazine #50}}

During their journey, the ''Graviton'' was pulled into [[Primax -408.24 Epsilon|the negative polarity universe]] and deposited near that reality's prehistoric [[Earth]]. Despite his best attempts, the ship was shot down by the ''[[Talon (Classics)|Talon]]'', and Prowl had to come up with a way for the Autobots to survive the ambient [[energon radiation]]. They adopted organic alternate modes, with Prowl taking the form of a lion. {{storylink|Shattered Time}} On discovering that three [[stasis pod]]s were missing from the ship, Prowl piloted a [[sky-sled]] which was shot down by [[Seawing (G1)|Seawing]] and [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]]. By the time they reached the pods on foot, [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]] had activated them as Decepticons. Prowl, [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]], and [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] were blasted by [[Autojetter]], and it was only the arrival of [[Depth Charge (BW)|Depth Charge]] and recovery of [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ultra Magnus]] that saved them. {{storylink|Shattered Expectations (BWSG)|Shattered Expectations}}

[[File:BWSG-prowlrobotmode.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.0|No, Prowl! Fruit is ''bad'' for cats!]]
The Autobots retreated across a rock bridge, and watched as Magnus faced off against Megatron, dealing their foe a temporary defeat. Back at the ''Graviton'', Depth Charge gave the "Maximals" more of an explanation regarding his presence. {{storylink|Shattered Paths}} When they located their missing energy purifier, the Maximals went out to fetch it. Despite the new ability of Ironhide, Prowl, and Silverbolt to merge into [[Magnaboss (BW)|Magnaboss]], they were trounced by [[Piranacon (G1)#Classics|God Neptune]]. {{storylink|Shattered Hope}}

[[File:AnotherLight ironhide.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.0|Suddenly feeling very [[Derrick J. Wyatt|''Wyatt-y'']]...]]
Returning to the ship, the Maximals fueled up before joining Depth Charge, who had located the Matrix he was seeking. The Maximals kept a security system occupied long enough for Magnus to retrieve the Matrix in question, however a short time later they were confronted by Megatron piloting a giant mech. {{storylink|Shattered Balance}} Prowl again took part in merging into Magnaboss, but the combiner was soundly defeated by Megatron's [[Gigastorm Armor]]. The Maximals were moments later pulled into a dimensional rift created by Ultra Magnus. {{storylink|Shattered Destiny}}

Prowl and his Maximal compatriots wound up on modern era Cybertron in the negative polarity universe. After exchanging stories, they agreed to return to their own Earth (orbiting near this Cybertron) in order to confront Ultra Mammoth's [[Ultra Magnus (SG)|insane doppelgänger]], the instigator of their universal collapse. {{storylink|Falling into Place}}

After receiving a new motorcycle mode from designers [[Needlenose (SG)|Needlenose]] and [[Spinister (SG)|Spinister]], Prowl traveled by [[stellar spanner]] back to his Earth and joined the battle. {{storylink|Distant Fissures}} He was present when [[Nexus Prime]] arrived and reclaimed the [[Terminus Blade]], defeating evil Magnus. {{storylink|Restoration}}
{{-}}
==''Regeneration One''==
{{noteRG1}}
[[File:Autobots v zombies loose ends.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8]]
When Optimus Prime went to confront Megatron on the devastated Earth, he took Prowl and a detachment of Autobots with him. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 3}} They arrived on the scene just as the insane tyrant was about to kill [[Springer (G1)|Springer]]. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 4}} Prowl then fought against Megatron's reanimated [[zombie]] army as the two leaders clashed. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 5}}

After the battle, Prowl and [[Skids (G1)|Skids]] attended to [[Kup (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Kup]] as he recovered from a [[Scraplet]] infection. {{storylink|Natural Selection, Part One}} Upon returning to Cybertron aboard the ''[[Valiant (G1)|Valiant]]'', Prowl attended an emergency council with [[Hot Rod (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Hot Rod]], Kup, [[First Aid (G1)|First Aid]], [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]], [[Perceptor (G1)|Perceptor]], and [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]] to address the effects of [[Scorponok (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Scorponok]]'s [[Gene Key]] on the population. When Hot Rod later tried to help the situation with a rousing speech at [[Eugenesis Plaza]] it fell to Prowl, [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]], [[Streetwise (G1)|Streetwise]], and the [[Wreckers]] to contain the ensuing riot. {{storylink|Destiny, Part One}}

[[File:Prowl blaster destiny.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.9]]
Prowl and [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] checked in on [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]], [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]], and [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]] at the [[Garage]] after they were fitted out with new [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]]-free bodies. Although they offered to help with the worsening situation outside, he was adamant that they should stay out of it until their new bodies had been thoroughly tested. Once Prowl had left, Baster decided to try anyway and by tapping into Decepticon communications discovered that [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] was broadcasting an irritant subsonic signal that increased aggression levels. After defeating the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]], the four Autobots reported this information to Prowl who shut down the intracomm for "essential maintenance", leaving Cybertron effectively blind to approaching threats. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Two}}

[[File:Prowl streetwise runamuck destiny.jpg|thumb|upright=2]]
Out on patrol with Red Alert and Streetwise, Prowl conferred with [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ultra Magnus]] regarding the Neo-Decepticons' strategy as they pulled over and arrested [[Runamuck (G1)|Runamuck]]. He reasoned that since all the key Neo-Decepticons had dropped out of sight, leaving only the small fry, the Autobots should conserve their resources and wait and see what the insurgents did next. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Three}}

Prowl was proven correct as a full-scale Decepticon assault soon began on Cybertron. The [[Warworld]] appeared over the planet and fired a horde of [[Blitz Engine]]s at its surface. At the [[Presidium (facility)|Presidium]], Prowl ordered Kup to be patient and hold the Wreckers in reserve until the proper surgical strike point for the unit could be identified. After some analysis, Prowl and Perceptor determined the Warworld must be broadcasting to the Blitz Engines, making it the Wreckers' target. When the Warworld fired a massive blast at the surface, Prowl ordered [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]] into action to combat the Blitz Engines. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Four}} Prowl then joined Ultra Magnus and others in holding the Presidium until the battle was finished. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Five}}

Afterwards, Prowl attended the leadership conference where Optimus officially ceded authority to the newly risen Rodimus Prime. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 1}} He was captured and held at [[Corral|The Corral]] when the Autobots went to war with [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] and the [[Hub (G2)|Hub Network]], but escaped with most of the warriors. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 4}} When they returned to Cybertron, the Autobots found it overrun by [[Shadow-leech|shadow-demons]] of the [[Dark Matrix]]. Prowl helped eliminate the entity's possessed puppets [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] and [[Fortress Maximus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Fortress Maximus]] on Earth and Nebulos, but Cybertron was lost. The Autobots left for the stars after that, hoping to spread peace instead of war. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 5}}
{{-}}

==''Transformers '84''==
{{storylink|Secrets & Lies issue 1|Secrets & Lies #1}}
After an "explosion" diverted the course of the planet Cybertron into the path of [[Stellae Cimeterium]], Double agent [[Punch (G1)|Punch]] was sent to inform the Autobots of Ratbat's suspicions; that Shockwave had intentionally fired one of the planet's turbines. Prowl chose to handle the problem without informing Optimus, with the Autobot Leader's attention focused on the Ark launch. He sent in Perceptor and the Dynobots to investigate deep in enemy territory. {{storylink|Secrets & Lies issue 1|Secrets & Lies #1}} Prowl took a group of Autobots to view the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]] for the first time before they launched. While everyone was mostly in high spirits, he reminded them that the mission they would undertake was extremely perilous and vital to Cybertron's safety. He was among the ship's crew when it was attacked by Megatron. And so began the story of... THE TRANSFORMERS {{storylink|Transformers '84 issue 0|'84 #0}}

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Action Masters]]
[[Category:Autobot leaders]]
[[Category:Classics Autobots]]
[[Category:Marvel Generation 1 Autobots]]
[[Category:Marvel Generation 2 Autobots]]
[[Category:Regeneration One Autobots]]
[[Category:Security officers]]
[[Category:Strategists]]

Prowl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity

2023-03-23T10:56:22Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Transformers '84 */ always preview for typos, d'oh

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[[File:TFU Prowl.jpg|thumb|Just look at those adorable toes.]]
'''Prowl''': Prick since [[1984]].

==Marvel ''The Transformers'' comics==
{{noteukonly}}
[[File:Magnificent6_crop.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.6]]
''Early in Cybertron's [[Great War (G1)|civil war]], before [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus]] became leader, Prowl was part of a strike team comprising himself, [[Jazz (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Jazz]], [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]], [[Sunstreaker (G1)|Sunstreaker]], [[Wheeljack (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Wheeljack]] and [[Stampede]]. Together, they were tasked with infiltrating Decepticon territories to sow chaos from within. During a mission to the [[neutral]]ist town of [[Yuss]], they defeated a small band of Decepticons and were hailed as heroes by the locals. Regarding the war as little more than fun and games at the time, Prowl dubbed his team the "[[Magnificent Six]]", and started to think himself untouchable. This opinion was challenged when a retaliatory attack came, this time involving far deadlier opponents. The Magnificent Six held Yuss's borders for a week despite being up against [[Megadeath (G1)|Megadeath]] and his elite cadre, but the once-grateful neutralists grew to resent the Autobots. The siege ended with the neutralists betraying Prowl's band to the enemy.''

''As Megadeath's captives, the six were subject to tortures and humiliations for seven days. In one of his sadistic games, Megadeath gave five of the six blasters, and offered them a chance to win their freedom; they only needed to stop him from killing Stampede, the only unarmed member. Prowl and the others failed to even take up arms, so thoroughly had Megadeath succeeded in breaking them by that point. Megadeath then gave the Autobots two hours to find his neutralist prisoners before he detonated five Neutronic bombs to obliterate the entire region. Finding their mettle, the Autobots forewent any attempt to rescue either themselves or the civilians for the Decepticon's entertainment. They instead hid, and ambushed Megadeath when he came to investigate their lack of action. Though Prowl and Wheeljack nearly died in battle, the remaining three Autobots crippled their torturer. Megadeath refused to divulge where he had stashed the neutralists, so the Autobots left him behind to die to his own device. When later questioned about what had transpired during their mission, the survivors lied and claimed not to remember any of it.'' {{storylink|The Magnificent Six!}}

[[File:Marvel71 neversurrender.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6]]
''Prowl was at Prime's side when, upon being promoted to Autobot supreme commander, he thwarted Megatron's earliest attempt at taking [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]].'' {{storylink|And There Shall Come...a Leader!}} He was also present at the battle of [[Jan-Ja]], where Optimus Prime rallied the troops in the defense of Iacon ''once more''. {{storylink|Surrender!}}

[[File:Prowlg1marvelfirst.jpg|upright=0.8|thumb|left|Well somebody's character model was ready.]]
Prowl was one of the select Autobots chosen by [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus Prime]] to travel aboard the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]], and ended up in stasis lock for four million years at the base of [[Mount St. Hilary]] with the rest of the crew. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} {{storylink|Cold Comfort and Joy!}} Once the volcano exploded, Optimus chose Prowl to lead the first away mission into civilization. Prowl's group was the first to observe humans in the flesh, so to speak, and to understand that they were the dominant life form on the planet. After a battle with the Decepticons at a drive-in theater, Prowl ordered a retreat since the organic lifeforms did not seem capable of self-defense. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} Prowl took part in a skirmish at a human auto repair facility, managing a direct hit on [[Buzzsaw (G1)|Buzzsaw]] during the altercation, {{storylink|Power Play!}} though the battle left him and his comrades drained of increasingly scarce fuel. Prowl took part in an effort to rescue the kidnapped Sparkplug Witwicky, {{storylink|Prisoner of War!}} and was later among the Autobots working to repair the damaged Ark. {{storylink|The Last Stand}}

''During work on one piece of machinery, a strong electrical feedback struck [[Brawn (G1)|Brawn]], and Prowl was forced to violently rip out the device's power cord to save his comrade. But as Brawn recovered, Prowl and the other Autobots found their teammate acting uncharacteristically violent. Brawn burst out of the Ark and began rampaging in a nearby town, forcing Prowl and the others to forcibly subdue him. Though another electrical shock allegedly returned Brawn to normal, Optimus couldn't be sure that his soldier wouldn't lash out once more. The test of Brawn's loyalty wound up being a trial by combat against [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]], which ended in what Prowl thought was the Autobot's demise. In reality, [[Mirage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Mirage]] had projected an illusion to dupe Starscream into thinking he had annihilated his foe. Upon Brawn's return and re-induction in the Autobot ranks, Prowl welcomed him with open arms.'' {{storylink|The Enemy Within!}}

''Soon thereafter, Megatron led his troops on a siege against the Autobots within the Ark. In the clash, Prowl was tackled down by [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]], despite his best efforts to gun the Decepticon down. The scuffle was interrupted when the Ark's computer, [[Aunty|Auntie]], was activated with a circuit malfunction. Auntie magnetized the Ark's walls, restraining all combatants and effectively putting their battle on hold. Autobots and Decepticons alike were only freed thanks to the only two unaffected robots, Ravage and [[Windcharger (G1)|Windcharger]], teaming up and shutting down the deranged computer. Even though the Decepticons were then driven out of the Autobots' headquarters, Prowl sustained significant damage, and required extensive reconstruction before he could take on active duty once more.'' {{storylink|Raiders of the Last Ark}}

[[File:Optimus prowl decepticon dam busters.jpg|thumb|upright=1.3]]
''At a later time, the Autobots came to fight against the Decepticons as the evil robots besieged a [[Sherman Dam|hydro-electric dam]]. Prowl helped charge the Decepticon troops while Optimus Prime dueled Megatron atop of the dam itself. But Optimus was defeated by his nemesis, and Megatron destroyed the dam before fleeing. Scrambling his troops in response to the ensuing flood, Optimus sent Prowl ahead to lead the fastest Autobots, tasking them with impeding the water's progress in whichever way they could. Though the trenches and barriers the Autobots made slowed the flood, a great portion of it still reached a nearby town. The Autobots managed to prevent any loss of life, but were vilified by the humans nonetheless, as they weren't able to tell the difference between Autobots and Decepticons.'' {{storylink|Decepticon Dam-Busters!}}

[[File:TheWrathOfGuardian ProwlCliffhanger.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.3|Prowl begins his career of cursing Grimlock's decisions.]]
After the Decepticons' next assault on the Ark, Prowl ended up deactivated and held captive by [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]] and the Decepticons along nearly all his comrades. The Autobots' inert forms were strung up from the Ark's ceiling, intended to be used as spare parts to build a new army of Decepticons. {{storylink|The New Order}} [[Ratchet (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ratchet]], the last surviving Autobot, beheld Prowl dangling limply alongside the others when he managed to infiltrate the now Decepticon-controlled ship. {{storylink|Warrior School!}} ''Prowl was eventually revived when Ratchet and the [[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]] reclaimed control of the Ark from Shockwave's drone, [[Guardian (Marvel)|Guardian]]. Upon his awakening, Prowl learned alongside Wheeljack and Ratchet that the drone had been booby-trapped with a thermo-nuclear bomb, which threatened to blow all within the Ark to smithereens should Grimlock deliver a killing blow to it.'' {{storylink|The Wrath of Guardian!}} ''Though Prowl was helpless to do anything about their situation, Wheeljack managed to prevent their demise by remote-controlling Optimus Prime's headless body, and stopping Grimlock from blasting Guardian's head off. Guardian fled, and the Dinobots reconvened with the rest of the Autobots. Remembering the last time they had to deal with a rogue Guardian unit, Prowl suggested that Ratchet fix up Windcharger next, so that they could magnetize the droid to the Ark's walls. Guardian returned before they could fully implement this plan however, forcing [[Swoop (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Swoop]] to fly Guardian up into the sky, where the bomb was detonated far away from the rest of the Autobots. Believing that Swoop had perished in his rescue, Prowl and the others held a mourning ceremony for their lost comrade.'' {{storylink|The Wrath of Grimlock!}}

[[File:PrimeTime-ultimatelyfutile.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.4|This injury would knock Prowl out of the American stories for a while, but over in the UK they had better health care.]]
With Optimus Prime's head still in Decepticon possession, Prowl took command of the Autobots until their true leader could be restored. At Jazz's suggestion, he forged an alliance with human fuel magnate [[G.B. Blackrock]], arranging an exchange of free gasoline for the Autobots for their help in protecting Blackrock's facilities from the Decepticons. {{storylink|DIS-Integrated Circuits!}} He set the Autobots to various vital repair tasks around the crashed Ark, gave Blackrock a tour of the Ark in an effort to build trust with their new ally, and sent a team out to stop the Decepticons from constructing a communications dish. {{storylink|The Next Best Thing to Being There!}} On learning that their friend Buster was in danger, he dispatched Bluestreak and Bumblebee to defend him. Prowl personally led an expedition to recover Optimus Prime's head, {{storylink|Brainstorm!}} but the team was ambushed by the Decepticons and a false Prime. Prowl suffered a mangled arm, but was among the last Autobots standing when the real Prime arrived and put an end to the battle. {{storylink|Prime Time!}}

{{note|In the US series, the injuries sustained by Prowl in this story resulted in him going offline, as seen in "[[Rock and Roll-Out!]]" In the UK comic, however, he remained operational and starred in several further stories.}}

''As [[Christmas]] rolled around, Prowl became dumbfounded by Optimus' willingness to indulge Buster in what he believed to be a bizarre charade. He and Bluestreak discussed the matter as Buster supervised the construction of a Christmas tree within the Autobots' headquarters, and Optimus paraded about in a big red suit. Bluestreak suggested that Prime simply felt endebted to Buster for carrying the Matrix of Creation in the Autobots' time of need, an explanation that Prowl readily accepted.'' {{storylink|Christmas Breaker!}}

[[File:Prowlg1crisisofcommand.jpg|upright=1.75|thumb|left|Some even call me a prick! And why? Because I dared to dream of my own race of atomic monsters!]]
''Shortly thereafter, Prowl was the ringleader of a group of Autobots strongly requesting that Prime use his [[Matrix of Leadership|Creation Matrix]] to create [[Ultimate Autobot]] super-warriors to wipe out the Decepticons for them. The lethal efficiency of Prowl's stance was just as strongly opposed by another faction who saw such action as a perversion of their sacred lifeforce, and the potential for laying waste to Earth. Prime's long absence and relative weakness after his recent ordeals left Prowl and the others less deferential than normal to his will, but after he single-handedly fought through the Decepticons to rescue [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]], Prowl and the other Ultimate Autobot proponents backed down and accepted Prime's final word on the subject.'' {{storylink|Crisis of Command!}}

''When an unidentified flying transformer approached the Ark, Prowl and the other able-bodied troops went out to meet it, only to find themselves under attack by a mind-controlled Swoop. Though the Autobots were unable to subdue the Dinobot, Optimus prompted Swoop to wrestle free from the mind-control by issuing the rebellious bot an order. Swoop flew off to the lab of the [[Peter Anthony Morris|human]] who had taken control of him, with Prowl and the others in pursuit. Upon their arrival, Swoop handed the fleshling over to Optimus for judgement... only to go into a wild rage and attack the Autobots once more.'' {{storylink|The Icarus Theory}} ''Swoop was knocked offline, but the Autobots learned that the other Dinobots were also being driven feral by their primitive circuitry. After tracking them down, Prowl nearly sacrificed himself crashing a shuttlecraft straight into the feuding [[Grimlock (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Grimlock]] and [[Sludge (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Sludge]].'' {{storylink|Dinobot Hunt!}}

[[File:Optimus prime prowl jazz mirage to a power unknown.jpg|thumb|right|upright=2.2|Prowl is actually unaffected - he's just enjoying being able to be his true self.]]
''While on a mission to build friendly relations with the people of [[Pinewoodsville]], Prowl and his fellow Autobots were hit with a strange energy blast that temporarily reversed their personalities. The group rampaged through the town, ruining months of goodwill work. Tracking the source of the blast to England, the Autobots flew overseas to put an end to what they assumed was a Decepticon plot. But the Decepticons had also been affected by the blast, and were likewise tracking its origin. Prowl, Jazz, Sideswipe, and Mirage holed up inside Optimus's trailer to conserve energy, but were shaken out of their hiding spot by Starscream just as another personality-reversing blast hit the group. Optimus was sent crashing into a tree off the road, and his troops began calling for a violent mutiny. The Autobots returned to their senses before they dealt out any permanent damage, but Optimus was left too banged-up to carry on with the mission. The culprit behind the energy blasts turned out to be a human invention, the "[[Purnel's Auto-Reverse Defence|PARD]]." It was destroyed, along with [[Zeke Heilmann|a spy]] trying to steal it, after Starscream battled Jazz over both. With the threat neutralized, the Autobots carried Optimus back to their UK Base, where Ratchet was waiting to fix him up.'' {{storylink|To a Power Unknown!}}

[[File:DistantThunder ProwlLethalForce.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.2]]
''Prowl was [[Mass substitution|displaced]] to [[Limbo]] along with Optimus Prime and Ratchet when [[Galvatron (G1)|Galvatron]], [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] and [[Scourge (G1)|Scourge]] [[time travel]]ed from the future.'' {{storylink|Target: 2006}} ''Joined later by [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]], [[Thundercracker (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Thundercracker]] and [[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]], they found themselves in the middle of a war between the peaceful, cat-like [[Cloran]] and evil, monkey-like invaders led by [[Zenag]]. Optimus's refusal to use lethal force left the more pragmatic Shockwave in a better position forge alliances, but it was ultimately discovered that the whole set-up was only an illusion. Once said illusion was dispelled, Prowl and the others found that they had been sharing a dream fabricated by [[Limbo parasite]]s in order to be made to feel violent emotions, the latter's sustenance.'' {{storylink|Distant Thunder!}} ''When Galvatron's group returned to their own time, Prowl was released from Limbo.''

[[File:PerchanceToDream ProwlDoneWithRules.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.6|For the rest of the issue, the role of Prowl will be played by Nicholas Cage.]]
''Prowl was next in action during the [[Battlecharger]]s' rampage, and attempted to bring them in despite the endangerment of human life. After narrowly preventing a gas station from exploding due to his opponents' sabotage, and avoiding a car pile-up, Prowl grew enraged and readied to unleash his full fury on the Decepticons. However, Optimus then turned up, having easily found the battle scene due to the extensive collateral damage it had caused. The Autobot leader talked Prowl out of pursuing the 'Cons, and berated him for being so reckless in his pursuit.'' {{storylink|...Perchance to Dream}}

''Prior to Christmas [[1986]], the Autobots learned that the Decepticons had taken control of a [[NASA]] space-monitoring system. Prowl swiftly organized a strike team to interfere, himself at its helm, with Trailbreaker and Jetfire backing him up. In his attempt to reach [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] on the battlefield, Prowl was confronted by [[Kickback (G1)|Kickback]], who held him at bay. Prowl ordered Jetfire to take out Soundwave and interrupt the Decepticons' transmission to Cybertron, but the jet opted to instead help with Kickback. Kickback easily outmaneuvered the larger Autobot by shrinking down to his insect mode, and the Decepticons beat a hasty retreat. Infuriated that Jetfire had flubbed at his task, Prowl gave him a chewing out.'' {{storylink|The Gift}}

[[File:Hoist prowl tracks night the transformers saved christmas.jpg|thumb|left|upright=0.9]]
On Christmas Eve, Prowl, Bumblebee, Tracks, and [[Hoist (G1)|Hoist]] foiled Soundwave's plan to steal electricity from a power plant near [[Midville]]. Outnumbered, Soundwave and Laserbeak retreated upon the Autobots' approach. Prowl had Bumblebee and Tracks pursue the Decepticons while he and Hoist attempted to repair the damage they had done to the plant. Prowl and Hoist were unsuccessful in getting the plant up and running again, and later followed Tracks into town after he reported that he and Bumblebee had similarly met with failure. They then watched as Bumblebee got into the spirit of giving, and supplied power to Midville's Christmas tree so the humans could partake in their holiday traditions. {{storylink|The Night the Transformers Saved Christmas}}

''Having grown dissatisfied with his troops' performances during his recent absences, Optimus Prime planed to fake his own death, so that the Autobots could learn to better fend for themselves. To this end, he informed his soldiers that he would be heading out on a solo scouting mission near Decepticon territory. Prowl reacted poorly to this, insisting that one of the more expendable Autobots carry out the mission instead. But Optimus was adamant in carrying out the task himself, leading to Prowl's fears being seemingly confirmed a half-hour later; he was among a group of Autobots who came upon a facsimile construct of Prime, torn to shreds by the Decepticons.'' {{storylink|Prey!}} ''A funeral was held for the Autobots' fallen leader, attended by all. At least, until Optimus spontaneously reappeared on Earth standing atop his headstone, and the whole matter was quickly forgotten.'' {{storylink|Resurrection!}}

[[File:FuneralForAFriend-GETAWAYFROMME.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.45]]
''Deactivated by means unknown, Prowl lay in stasis in the Ark's repair bay for many months.'' Ratchet managed to briefly revive him in order to exploit his police car mode against a human thief named the [[Mechanic]] who had infiltrated the Ark, but Prowl still needed rest and was spent after this brief period of activity. {{storylink|Funeral for a Friend!}} Prowl was fully revived by the time the Ark was relaunched; he was among the many Autobots who welcomed Blaster back into the fold, asking him to take over leadership of the Autobots from Grimlock. Prowl went so far as to advise him to stay on the Ark rather than tangle with the Dinobots to rescue a [[Spacehikers|quartet of children]] he had befriended, which Grimlock had ensnared in a trap to draw his rival out. But Blaster surrendered himself in order to secure the kids' safety. {{storylink|Spacehikers!}} Prowl was later among the crowd who gathered for Grimlock and [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]]'s grudge match on the moon; when the Decepticons launched a sneak attack, he was the first to realize what was happening and call for the Autobots to turn and fight; he joined the battle alongside the combined crews of the Ark and ''[[Steelhaven (G1)|Steelhaven]]'' against the Decepticon party-crashers. {{storylink|Totaled!}} Unfortunately, it wasn't too long afterwards that Prowl was once again knocked off-line, this time battling the [[Underbase]]-charged Starscream in [[New York City|New York]]. {{storylink|Dark Star}} {{storylink|Flashback!}}

''Despite him being out of action, a [[solid light simulation]] of Prowl was used in a training mission for the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]]. Said simulation contained both high-ranking Autobot officers and Autobot "non-entities" though, so it's unknown how worthy of an opponent Prowl was considered by the Decepticons.'' {{storylink|The Hunting Party (Marvel)|The Hunting Party}}

[[File:OnTheEdgeOfExtinction ProwlGrimlock.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.8]]
After Ratchet seemingly perished, Optimus Prime fell into a deep melancholy, and had the Ark's computer recount to him all those who had fallen under his command. Prowl was among those name-dropped. {{storylink|Yesterday's Heroes!}}

He would remain in stasis for some time, until Grimlock acquired a large supply of super-energy known as [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]], and pumped it into all of the Ark's stasis chambers. {{storylink|The Void! (US)|The Void!}} Prowl found himself revived just in time to engage the Chaos-Bringer known as [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]] for the sake of all Cybertron. Grimlock led the charge by ramming the Ark in Unicron's face, sending the ship plummeting down towards Cybertron's surface. Prowl berated him for this foolish course of action, only for Grimlock to respond by pitching Prowl out of the ship. Prowl made it to the surface safely, and arrived to the battlefront in time to see his long-term friend and leader, Optimus Prime, sacrifice himself to destroy Unicron. {{storylink|On the Edge of Extinction!}}

[[File:Wheeljack-stilllife.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7|right]]
After Unicron's destruction however, Prowl was surprised to find that Optimus's tattered remains still clung onto a semblance of life. Optimus named Grimlock his successor before finally expiring, much to Prowl's bemoanment. He subsequently delivered this news to the Dinobot, only to find that Grimlock was apparently unaware of the responsibility that now fell upon him; though Prowl insisted that Grimlock needed to nurture the fragile alliance the Autobots had forged with the Decepticons, Grimlock instead opted to seek out the Ark and the Autobots that still remained inoperative within it. Prowl at least managed to get Grimlock to promise that he would uphold Prime's ideals before he went off with the Dinobots. {{storylink|Still Life!}}

[[File:Prowlg1exodus.jpg|left|upright=1.1|thumb|You'd be a prick too if Grimlock kept getting promoted over you.]]
As such, Prowl found himself working almost alone trying to maintain the tenuous peace between the Autobots and Decepticons. To make matters worse, he and Blaster discovered that Cybertron was tearing itself apart; without Primus's consciousness to maintain it, the planet was losing its cohesion. Prowl continued to implore Grimlock to step up into his role and make a speech that would assure everyone that the situation was well in hand. But Grimlock continued to eschew such responsibilities and reminded Prowl that Optimus had trusted him solely to lead, enraging Prowl to no end. The final straw came when Grimlock participated in a petty brawl like a common thug, prompting Prowl to chew him out in public. [[Bludgeon (G1)|Bludgeon]] used the opportunity to demand assurances out of the Autobots, and Prowl was forced to comply, revealing prematurely where the ships they planed to leave the planet with were parked. Thus Prowl ended up overplaying his hand: Bludgeon took got the chance to betray the Autobots, leaving them trapped on the dying world, without transport, while the Decepticons fled to conquer new civilizations. {{storylink|Exodus!}}

[[File:LastAutobot-Silverbolt.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8|right]]
Berating his lack of foresight and common sense, Prowl wandered outside, waiting for the inevitable end. Luckily for Prowl, Grimlock had anticipated the Decepticons' treachery (by Primus, how'd he manage that?!?) and had secured alternate starships. The Dinobot surprised Prowl and Blaster by parking said vessels, Decepticon Battle Cruisers, right in front of the Autobots' headquarters. Prowl suddenly found himself very grateful for Grimlock's rebellious streak. {{storylink|A Savage Circle}}

[[File:EndOfTheRoad-finalfive.jpg|thumb|left]]
The Autobots tracked the Decepticons to the planet [[Klo]], and Prowl partook in some back-seat driving as he urged Silverbolt to reach their destination as quickly as possible. Irritated that with every moment that the Decepticons were left to their devices meant more innocent lives lost, he turned to Grimlock and demanded to know why he couldn't have commandeered a faster ship. The latter and Nightbeat both made their best attempts at talking Prowl down, insisting he save his energy for the conflict that lay ahead. {{storylink|The Last Autobot?}} As the Autobots prepared to make planetfall, Prowl suggested they be cautious in their approach. Grimlock disregarded this advice, a charged into the fray blindly, prompting most of his troops to do likewise. The ensuing battle wound up having a disastrous outcome; the Decepticons had been anticipating the Autobots' arrival, and slaughtered all but five of their members in an initial ambush. Those left standing were Grimlock, Prowl, Blaster, Slag, and Kup. Despite the group's best attempts at hiding their scents, they were tracked down by a hunting party, though miraculously managed to overcome their attackers. Doubling back for a final stand, Prowl's group found the resurrected Optimus Prime and the legendary [[Last Autobot]] already turning the tide against Bludgeon's forces. With the Last Autobot reviving all those who had fallen, the Autobots drove off Bludgeon's forces, sending them into a temporary exile. {{storylink|End of the Road! (US)|End of the Road!}}
{{-}}

===Transformers Annual 1985===
{{note|Due to being published early in the franchise, these stories are out of continuity with the above.<ref>"Plague of the Insecticons!" was later designated as [[universal stream]] [[Primax 1285.0 Gamma]] by [[Vector Prime]].</ref>}}

[[File:UKAnnual86 ProwlhitbySplinterGrenade.jpg|upright=1.0|thumb|right|A prick laid low by dozens of smaller pricks.]]
Realizing that their mission on Earth would be infinitely more difficult without capable human allies, Optimus attempted to open a dialogue with the American government. Planning the meeting in utmost secrecy, he, [[Warpath (G1)|Warpath]], and Prowl managed to secure an audience with the [[Ronald Reagan|President of the United States]]. The three Autobots drove to the White House, and were warmly received by their host. But their talk was interrupted by the [[Insecticon (G1)|Insecticons]]. The Autobots did their best to take down the trio, only for [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] to loudly proclaim that Optimus was his leader, and he was off to attack [[Washington, D.C.|the city]] as per his orders. Prowl was especially outraged at this act of slander. Unfortunately, the President's soldier escorts were quick to turn on the Autobots, having assumed that Bombshell had revealed the robots' true intent.

Prowl and Warpath were sent to deal with the Insecticons, while Optimus went off on his own to "cut them off at their source." Though Warpath was confused over what Optimus had just said, Prowl assured him not to bother himself with it; they had a mission to do, and that was the only thing they needed to think about. They drove to downtown Washington, finding that their foes had wasted no time in reducing the scene to a warzone. Prowl fought hard to bring an end to the carnage, though he was downed by one of [[Shrapnel (G1)|Shrapnel]]'s [[Shrapnel grenade|splinter grenades]]. Thankfully, Optimus's [[Roller (G1)|Roller]] drone came to Warpath's aid. Optimus was successful on his end of the mission, bringing down [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]], responsible for remote-controlling the Insecticons. With the battle over, Optimus and his troops fled the scene; they felt that the humans would not believe them should they try and explain the situation, and that the Decepticon had already sullied their reputation beyond repair. {{storylink|Plague of the Insecticons!}}

[[File:UKAnnual86 Prowlspiesmetal.jpg|upright=1.1|thumb|left|"If there's one thing I know by sight alone, it's Ravage's dandruff!"]]
After the bulk of the Autobot forces left on a mission, Prowl and Bumblebee were relegated to monitoring news broadcasts for any signs of Decepticon activity. Prowl struck gold upon discovering footage of [[John Butler|a man]] being rescued by a woman, spotting a sliver of Cybertronian metal at the man's feet. Analyzing the story, Prowl came to the conclusion that Ravage had attacked the man, and attempted to contact Optimus on the matter. But upon finding that his signal wasn't getting through, Prowl resolved himself to wait until their commander returned. Bumblebee managed to change his mind, pointing out that the Decepticon threat would only grow should they stay idle. Prowl, Bumblebee, [[Topspin (G1)|Topspin]] and [[Twin Twist]] headed out to investigate.

Prowl remained nervous during the outing, suggesting to his compatriots they return to the Ark at the first obstruction in their path. The others wouldn't hear it however, and they soon picked up Ravage's trail. Following it, the group traveled for days until they happened upon the Decepticons' hideout. There, Megatron's soldiers were excavating rare crystals that could bring new Decepticons to life. Prowl suggested that the Autobots hold their position and contact the Ark for reinforcements, prompting a debate within the group. While the others were distracted by their argument, Bumblebee took it upon himself to push on alone, only to be caught in [[Thrust (G1)|Thrust]] and [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]]'s cross-hairs. Prowl and the [[Jumpstarter]]s were forced to head down to his rescue. But they found themselves paralyzed with fear partway through their descent; [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]] had also been posted as a guard, and was using his fear-inducing engines on the Autobots. Thankfully, Prowl was able to work through his paralysis, and gunned Dirge down with a few [[acid pellet]]s. The Autobots then managed to down Starscream and send him crashing into Megatron's mine, destroying it utterly. Thrust retaliated by burying the Autobots in an avalanche, and by the time Prowl clawed his way back out, the Decepticons had already fled the scene. {{storylink|Hunted!}}

===Marvel UK future timelines===
{{note|The movie adaptation, originally published by Marvel US, is in italics}}
[[File:ThePlanetEater wasnt no ice chunk.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.8]]
''In one alternate timeline, the Decepticons succeeded in conquering all of Cybertron by the year [[2005]], forcing all of the Autobots off-world. Prowl was among those who wound up posted at [[Moonbase One]], and left the satellite alongside Ironhide, Ratchet, and Brawn to make an Energon run to Earth. Partway to their destination however, they were boarded by a Decepticon party. Prowl was fatally shot down by Megatron in following confrontation.'' {{storylink|The Planet-Eater!}}

A time traveler from the distant future, [[Dicet Alpha-zero]], would one day traverse the time-stream to observe several key moments in the Transformers' war, witnessing Prowl fighting back against the Decepticons aboard the Ark prior to it crashing on Earth, and an impostor Optimus Prime gunning down Prowl and Sideswipe. {{storylink|The Quest!}}
{{-}}

===Rhythms of Darkness!===
[[File:RhythmsofDarkness SurvivingAutobots.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1|[[Magnificent Six|The Magnificent Three]]?]]
In an alternate [[2009]], Prowl was one of only seven Autobots left alive after [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] and his Decepticons took over America. With Cybertron destroyed by [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]] and the various Primes dead, things looked bleak. Prowl and Jazz led a last-ditch assault on the Decepticon fortress, though [[Getaway]] broke rank early on and attacked [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] and [[Scourge (G1)|Scourge]] early in the mission. Quickly adapting to the situation, Prowl ordered [[Guzzle (G1)|Guzzle]] and [[Chainclaw (G1)|Chainclaw]] to help Getaway in distracting the guards while the rest of the team pushed forward. Miraculously, they managed to send a signal to the rest of the world that America was still alive and fighting. When some [[Hook, Line, and Sinker|mysterious travelers]] shang-haied Galvatron from the field of battle, Prowl joined Jazz and [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]] (the last of their kind) in fighting alongside their human allies with renewed vigor. Perhaps the war could yet be won! {{storylink|Rhythms of Darkness!}}

Later on in [[Primax 490.0 Gamma]], the reformed [[Cybertronian (faction)|Cybertronian Empire]] dispatched [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] to Earth to enlist the aid of the Trio in the fight against Unicron. Together, Autobot, Decepticon, and Cybertronian stood as one and vanquished the Chaos-Bringer. {{storylink|Ask Vector Prime}}
{{-}}

===Earthforce===
{{earthforcefiction}}
[[File:Prowllittlemen.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|Prowl was GEEWUN before it was fashionable.]]
At some point during the conflict on Earth, Prowl faced off against Blitzwing on a highway, dodging the Decepticon tank's artillery as he drove. {{storylink|Once upon a Time...}}

{{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Ironhide profile}}

Deactivated following his battle with the [[Underbase]]-enhanced Starscream, Prowl lay recuperating within a lifepod in the Ark for months, until the [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] of a parallel future intervened. Using a "[[mind bug]]" device, Galvatron manipulated the baser instincts of several Autobots, attempting to revive them as pawns he could use for his own purposes. Instead they revived intent on opposing him. Prowl joined [[Wheeljack (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Wheeljack]], [[Sunstreaker (G1)|Sunstreaker]], [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]] and [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] in overpowering and capturing the renegade Decepticon. Wheeljack cobbled together a device that turned Galvatron's own technology against him, and Prowl slapped it on the villain's head, leaving him trapped in his own nightmares. {{storylink|...Perchance to Dream}} Prowl would emerge from this experience as a stable individual, possibly free from any mental issues as he'd been activated sooner and had longer to adjust, as well as due to his logical mind. {{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Prowl profile}}

As the days passed, Prowl attempted to readjust to the war, despite how it had changed around him. Along with Wheeljack, he lamented about the proliferation of newer types of Transformers, claiming these newcomers gave him a headache just thinking about them. Luckily, their patrol turned up several familiar enemies, including the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]] and [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] working under [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]]'s command. Megatron had formulated a scheme to destroy Earth's atmosphere with a [[Global warming satellite|deadly rocket]], and reap the excess energy that would no longer be filtered out before reaching the planet's surface. {{storylink|Starting Over!}} While Wheeljack engaged the Decepticons, Prowl leaped aboard the flying rocket, knocking it off course so that its deadly poison never reached the proper altitude. {{storylink|Desert Island Risks!}} He crashed down in the backwoods of Louisiana, and befriended some locals who helped fix him up over the next few days. Prowl also neutralized the rocket's poison, and got a good chuckle out of watching the two Decepticon factions arrive days later and begin fighting over a useless cargo. {{storylink|Life in the Slow Lane}} His newly relaxed nature would sometimes impair with quick decision making. {{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Prowl profile}}

[[File:Snaptrapflashback.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.4]]
A new team of Autobots called [[Earthforce]] had been formed, partly to help recover Prowl and the atmospheric rocket, and he quickly joined the organization once reunited with his fellow Autobots. Working under Grimlock's overall command, Prowl acted as second lieutenant, providing a voice of reason and strategy for the Dinobot Commander. On one occasion, Prowl sabotaged Megatron's attempt to alter the timeline using a [[Flashback Doorway]]. The two opponents traveled back in time to the battle with Starscream, where Megatron possessed the body of [[Snaptrap (G1)|Snaptrap]], and attempted to lead the [[Seacon (G1)|Seacons]] to safety in order to receive their services in the present. Prowl possessed his own past form and ensured the Seacons' destruction, as well as that of his own past self, before returning to the present. {{storylink|Flashback!}} He also talked Grimlock into accepting the [[Survivors]] into Earthforce, and joined them in assaulting the island base of the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]] to rescue their Decepticon member, [[Carnivac (G1)|Carnivac]]. Upon arrival, the Autobots overpowered the remaining Mayhems, but were stopped short of granting any of them a "warrior's death" by Carnivac. Impressed by what he viewed as an act of mercy, Prowl formally welcomed Carnivac in the Autobot fold. {{storylink|Where Wolf?}}

Prowl and the rest of the Earthforce were forced to respond when a "concerned citizen" alerted them to Megatron and Shockwave's battle at [[Memphis Airport]], though they (rightfully) suspected that the situation was a set-up put into play by an unseen party. {{storylink|Internal Affairs!}}

[[File:Earthforce house that wheeljack built.jpg|thumb|upright=2]]
When the Autobot [[Earthbase]] was finished, Prowl gathered with all the other Autobots outside to witness Wheeljack's handiwork. Ever cautious and critical, Prowl commented on the noticeable lack of defenses. Wheeljack then turned on the defense grid and tossed a rock towards the base, triggering a series of underground weapon systems that annihilated the projectile. Prowl still wasn't convinced, and began asking how the defenses might be knocked off-line once activated. Wheeljack assured him the defenses were so completely fool proof that NO ONE could shut them off once they had been activated unless they were sitting at the control console inside the base. Prowl then gave Wheeljack his "Everybody's dumb but me" look, and did a headcount of the ''entire'' Earthforce who had come outside for the demonstration... meaning no one was inside who could shut off the deadly defense grid. In order to get back inside their base, Prowl volunteered to brave the perils and reach the console himself. With [[Jazz (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Jazz]], [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]] and the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]] spotting him, Prowl navigated his way through lasers, [[Heat Seeker (G1)|Heat Seekers]], [[Acid Bat]]s, and electrified tentacles before finally shutting off the system. {{storylink|The House that Wheeljack Built!}} Wheeljack went to work decentralizing the base's defenses, which unfortunately left it vulnerable to attack. The Autobots' lack of defenses coincided with the Decepticons finding the location of their headquarters, and summarily launching an all-out siege against it. Thankfully, the attack was nothing more than a distraction for an attempted hijacking of an oil tanker, and when the Survivors foiled the theft, Starscream ordered the Decepticons to retreat. Prowl saw Soundwave, Divebomb, and Hook off as they fled the scene. {{storylink|Divide and Conquer!}}

When Bludgeon, Stranglehold, and Octopunch managed to escape their cell within the Earthbase, Prowl reported the incident to Grimlock and assured him that their guard, Inferno, would survive despite getting stabbed in the back during the breakout. {{storylink|Shut Up!}}

[[File:Earthforce external forces.jpg|thumb|left|upright=2]]
Later on, [[Snarl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Snarl]] began suffering from a case of [[Corrodia Gravis]], and the Autobots were forced to go to Starscream in order to get a compatible systems boost to save the Dinobot's life. Not destined to be an easy mission in the best of cases, Prowl, Ironhide and the remaining Dinobots walked in on an assassination in progress and the former Decepticon leaders attempted to remove the current ones from their former thrones. As was often the case, it fell on Prowl to re-explain to Grimlock why it wasn't a good thing that Starscream's life was in danger. {{storylink|External Forces!|External Forces!}} After Megatron, Shockwave and their assassins were chased off, Prowl and Grimlock made a deal with Starscream to gain his help, in exchange for agreeing to step in if Megatron ever tried to overthrow their current Decepticon regime again. {{storylink|The Lesser Evil!}}

When [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] injected [[Superion (G1)|Superion]] with a [[cerebro-shell]] and caused him to go wild, Earthforce was in dire straits trying to find a means of stopping the warrior juggernaut. Prowl found a human reporter on the scene named [[Irwin Spoon]], and made a deal with him for an exclusive interview in exchange for Irwin's help removing the shell from the inside. {{storylink|Inside Story!}} Irwin was successful and got his interview. Prowl hoped the good publicity would help the Autobots establish better relations with humanity, despite Grimlock's grumbling. It seemed the Decepticons had the same notion, and so Starscream and Soundwave sent the Stunticons to kidnap Irwin from Earthbase before he could publish his story, taking him right out from under Prowl's olfactory receptor. {{storylink|Front Line! (issue)|Front Line!}} Prowl tried to chase down [[Motormaster (G1)|Motormaster]] and recover the human, but was bashed off the side of the highway, and had to be recovered by Wheeljack. {{storylink|End of the Road! (UK)|End of the Road!}}

In [[1990]], Optimus unwittingly reunited the surviving members of the [[Magnificent Six]] for a mission to the [[Acid Wastes]]. He suspected the [[Underbase]]'s ruins still held a connection to Cybertron's core, which they could tap into to defeat [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]]. Despite the mission's urgency, Prowl and the others made excuses to be excluded from it. Optimus was bewildered by this apparent display of cowardice, and sent them forth anyways, with [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] along to round out the team.

[[File:Magnificent Six the end.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7]]
As the five delved deeper into the Wastes, their traumatic memories seeped to the forefront of their minds, culminating in their paralysis upon reaching the remnants of [[Yuss]]. There, they were accosted by mutated mechs, survivors of the Neutronic holocaust that they had failed to prevent millions of years ago. But another ghost from their past held even greater sway over their psyches: [[Megadeath (G1)|Megadeath]] had survived as well, and took the group captive once more! Having realized in the interim that his teammates were plagued by past trauma, Silverbolt sought to stir Prowl and the others out of their stupor through ridicule, calling the five "the Autobots' resident losers." This riled them enough for the truth of what had transpired in Yuss to finally come out. Silverbolt convinced his comrades that they were stronger than they thought, and the group's confidence slowly returned. With hate and cold fury driving them, Prowl, Sunstreaker, Wheeljack, Inferno, and Jazz confronted Megadeath while Silverbolt saw to the mutated neutralists being freed from his control. Prowl's group battered down their former torturer, only stopping short of the killing blow. But Megadeath would rather kill himself, while taking the Autobots with him, than admit defeat; he breached his own nuclear core, beginning a destructive chain reaction. The Autobots fled to once more avoid annihilation.

Having found closure, the Autobots continued on with their mission, and reached the former site of the Underbase with the neutralists in tow. Prowl turned to Jazz and suggested that, with Silverbolt along to replace [[Stampede]], it was almost as though they were the magnificent six once more. But Jazz replied that they couldn't go back to the way things were; they had grown too much, and seen for themselves the ugliest side of war. {{storylink|The Magnificent Six!}}
{{-}}

===Another Time & Place===
[[File:Prime prowl another time & place.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.8|Prowl had a ''G2'' neck before it was cool.]]
Several months after the incident on [[Klo]], Prowl caught wind of Grimlock running off on his own again, this time back to [[Hydrus Four]]. Prowl alerted Optimus Prime at [[Nova Point]] to the situation, but was surprised when his leader harshly rebuked him for bringing it to his attention. When Prime made it clear he didn't want anything to do with Prowl's report, the Autobot strategist stormed off to consider the problem himself. After some solitary computation, Prowl decided that the threat of Decepticons following Grimlock to Hydrus Four and acquiring [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]] was too perilous to ignore. He was rushing out of his chambers, ready to throw together a squad of Autobots regardless of what Optimus Prime thought, when he ran smack into Optimus himself. Prime apologized to Prowl for "hiding his head in the sand"—he had wanted the war to be over so badly, for his fellow Autobots' sake and not his, that he was willing to ignore an obvious threat. The two old friends shook hands and proceeded to gather their strike team.

[[File:Another Time Place Fangry.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4]]
On Hydrus Four, Prowl joined a small group of commandos including [[Springer (G1)|Springer]], [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]] and [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]] to scout the enemy position. They dispatched [[Fangry (G1)|Fangry]] with little effort, and sent in [[Roadhandler (G1)|Roadhandler]] and some [[Micromaster]]s to free Grimlock and the Dinobots quietly before the main offensive began. Nothing ever goes quietly with the Dinobots, though, and so once the shooting started inside, the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]] were sent in to bomb the facility and let the Decepticons know they were in for it. Prowl and his fellow Autobots assaulted the base and, in little time at all, Bludgeon and his crew were dismantled and the day was won yet again. {{storylink|Another Time & Place}}
{{--}}

==Marvel ''Generation 2'' comic==
[[File:Prowlg2muzzle.jpg|left|upright=0.6|thumb|Prowl and Grimlock's sexual tension continues.]]
When Optimus Prime and Grimlock discovered the threat of the [[Cybertronian (faction)|Cybertronians]], they called in Autobots scattered across the galaxy, including Prowl. As one of Prime's most loyal supporters, Prowl did not participate in Grimlock's ill-advised strike on the [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Liege Centuro]] and his fleet. Instead, he helped Optimus free Grimlock and his strike team after they had been taken prisoners by the enemy. {{storylink|Devices and Desires! (Marvel)|Devices and Desires!}} Still, Prowl would not completely ignore Grimlock's opinions: when Optimus Prime decreed that he be left alone to entreat Megatron for peace, Grimlock convinced Prowl that Prime made a bad call, and they arrived with a rescue battalion just in time to keep Megatron from destroying his old nemesis. {{storylink|The Gathering Darkness}}

[[File:Jazz silverbolt prowl escalation.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8]]
Optimus recuperated from his injuries for a few days afterwards, only for Megatron to burst into the medical bay following a brief off-world absence. Prowl rushed to Optimus's aid, only to find that Megatron had come to forge an alliance. Grimlock was scoffed at the very notion, and Prowl was forced to restrain the Dinobot after Megatron suggested that Prime muzzle his petulant soldier. Though an alliance was agreed upon, the Autobots were soon called to the planet [[Ethos]] to repel invaders, a conflict Megatron refused to involve himself in. {{storylink|Escalation!|Tales of Earth Part Five}} The Autobots found the culprit behind the invasion once more to be Jhiaxus's army, and Prowl helped in staving off an impeding genocide. But the Cybertronians proved as formidable as ever, and Prowl, Optimus, and Bumblebee were soon entrenched and surrounded, with little hope of victory in sight. The tide turned with Megatron's arrival, who had allegedly changed his mind upon learning who it was that the Autobots were fighting. {{storylink|Escalation!}}
{{--}}

==''Classics''==
{{noteclassics}}
[[File:BWSG-prowlbeastmode.jpg|thumb|upright=1.5|left|I'm brushing up on looking down, I'm working on my roar!]]
After the war, Prowl eagerly took on the task of assigning new civilian roles for Autobot soldiers to better help them adjust to peacetime. {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 18|Optimus Prime's profile in Club magazine #18}}

Some time later, Prowl, was given command over Cybertron while Optimus was dealing with Megatron's forces on Earth. Deciding that there was no more room for rogue heroics among the Autobot ranks, he traveled to Azure alongside [[Silverbolt (G1)#Classics|Silverbolt]] and [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity#Classics|Ironhide]] to reel Grimlock back into the Autobot forces. The trio tracked down Slag and Sludge and arranged through them a meeting with their leader. This meeting wound up being cut short by a distress call from Earth, and Grimlock agreed to accompany the Autobots aboard the ''[[Graviton (Classics)|Graviton]]'' to respond to it. {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 50|Grimlock's profile in Club magazine #50}}

During their journey, the ''Graviton'' was pulled into [[Primax -408.24 Epsilon|the negative polarity universe]] and deposited near that reality's prehistoric [[Earth]]. Despite his best attempts, the ship was shot down by the ''[[Talon (Classics)|Talon]]'', and Prowl had to come up with a way for the Autobots to survive the ambient [[energon radiation]]. They adopted organic alternate modes, with Prowl taking the form of a lion. {{storylink|Shattered Time}} On discovering that three [[stasis pod]]s were missing from the ship, Prowl piloted a [[sky-sled]] which was shot down by [[Seawing (G1)|Seawing]] and [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]]. By the time they reached the pods on foot, [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]] had activated them as Decepticons. Prowl, [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]], and [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] were blasted by [[Autojetter]], and it was only the arrival of [[Depth Charge (BW)|Depth Charge]] and recovery of [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ultra Magnus]] that saved them. {{storylink|Shattered Expectations (BWSG)|Shattered Expectations}}

[[File:BWSG-prowlrobotmode.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.0|No, Prowl! Fruit is ''bad'' for cats!]]
The Autobots retreated across a rock bridge, and watched as Magnus faced off against Megatron, dealing their foe a temporary defeat. Back at the ''Graviton'', Depth Charge gave the "Maximals" more of an explanation regarding his presence. {{storylink|Shattered Paths}} When they located their missing energy purifier, the Maximals went out to fetch it. Despite the new ability of Ironhide, Prowl, and Silverbolt to merge into [[Magnaboss (BW)|Magnaboss]], they were trounced by [[Piranacon (G1)#Classics|God Neptune]]. {{storylink|Shattered Hope}}

[[File:AnotherLight ironhide.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.0|Suddenly feeling very [[Derrick J. Wyatt|''Wyatt-y'']]...]]
Returning to the ship, the Maximals fueled up before joining Depth Charge, who had located the Matrix he was seeking. The Maximals kept a security system occupied long enough for Magnus to retrieve the Matrix in question, however a short time later they were confronted by Megatron piloting a giant mech. {{storylink|Shattered Balance}} Prowl again took part in merging into Magnaboss, but the combiner was soundly defeated by Megatron's [[Gigastorm Armor]]. The Maximals were moments later pulled into a dimensional rift created by Ultra Magnus. {{storylink|Shattered Destiny}}

Prowl and his Maximal compatriots wound up on modern era Cybertron in the negative polarity universe. After exchanging stories, they agreed to return to their own Earth (orbiting near this Cybertron) in order to confront Ultra Mammoth's [[Ultra Magnus (SG)|insane doppelgänger]], the instigator of their universal collapse. {{storylink|Falling into Place}}

After receiving a new motorcycle mode from designers [[Needlenose (SG)|Needlenose]] and [[Spinister (SG)|Spinister]], Prowl traveled by [[stellar spanner]] back to his Earth and joined the battle. {{storylink|Distant Fissures}} He was present when [[Nexus Prime]] arrived and reclaimed the [[Terminus Blade]], defeating evil Magnus. {{storylink|Restoration}}
{{-}}
==''Regeneration One''==
{{noteRG1}}
[[File:Autobots v zombies loose ends.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8]]
When Optimus Prime went to confront Megatron on the devastated Earth, he took Prowl and a detachment of Autobots with him. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 3}} They arrived on the scene just as the insane tyrant was about to kill [[Springer (G1)|Springer]]. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 4}} Prowl then fought against Megatron's reanimated [[zombie]] army as the two leaders clashed. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 5}}

After the battle, Prowl and [[Skids (G1)|Skids]] attended to [[Kup (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Kup]] as he recovered from a [[Scraplet]] infection. {{storylink|Natural Selection, Part One}} Upon returning to Cybertron aboard the ''[[Valiant (G1)|Valiant]]'', Prowl attended an emergency council with [[Hot Rod (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Hot Rod]], Kup, [[First Aid (G1)|First Aid]], [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]], [[Perceptor (G1)|Perceptor]], and [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]] to address the effects of [[Scorponok (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Scorponok]]'s [[Gene Key]] on the population. When Hot Rod later tried to help the situation with a rousing speech at [[Eugenesis Plaza]] it fell to Prowl, [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]], [[Streetwise (G1)|Streetwise]], and the [[Wreckers]] to contain the ensuing riot. {{storylink|Destiny, Part One}}

[[File:Prowl blaster destiny.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.9]]
Prowl and [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] checked in on [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]], [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]], and [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]] at the [[Garage]] after they were fitted out with new [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]]-free bodies. Although they offered to help with the worsening situation outside, he was adamant that they should stay out of it until their new bodies had been thoroughly tested. Once Prowl had left, Baster decided to try anyway and by tapping into Decepticon communications discovered that [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] was broadcasting an irritant subsonic signal that increased aggression levels. After defeating the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]], the four Autobots reported this information to Prowl who shut down the intracomm for "essential maintenance", leaving Cybertron effectively blind to approaching threats. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Two}}

[[File:Prowl streetwise runamuck destiny.jpg|thumb|upright=2]]
Out on patrol with Red Alert and Streetwise, Prowl conferred with [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ultra Magnus]] regarding the Neo-Decepticons' strategy as they pulled over and arrested [[Runamuck (G1)|Runamuck]]. He reasoned that since all the key Neo-Decepticons had dropped out of sight, leaving only the small fry, the Autobots should conserve their resources and wait and see what the insurgents did next. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Three}}

Prowl was proven correct as a full-scale Decepticon assault soon began on Cybertron. The [[Warworld]] appeared over the planet and fired a horde of [[Blitz Engine]]s at its surface. At the [[Presidium (facility)|Presidium]], Prowl ordered Kup to be patient and hold the Wreckers in reserve until the proper surgical strike point for the unit could be identified. After some analysis, Prowl and Perceptor determined the Warworld must be broadcasting to the Blitz Engines, making it the Wreckers' target. When the Warworld fired a massive blast at the surface, Prowl ordered [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]] into action to combat the Blitz Engines. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Four}} Prowl then joined Ultra Magnus and others in holding the Presidium until the battle was finished. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Five}}

Afterwards, Prowl attended the leadership conference where Optimus officially ceded authority to the newly risen Rodimus Prime. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 1}} He was captured and held at [[Corral|The Corral]] when the Autobots went to war with [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] and the [[Hub (G2)|Hub Network]], but escaped with most of the warriors. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 4}} When they returned to Cybertron, the Autobots found it overrun by [[Shadow-leech|shadow-demons]] of the [[Dark Matrix]]. Prowl helped eliminate the entity's possessed puppets [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] and [[Fortress Maximus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Fortress Maximus]] on Earth and Nebulos, but Cybertron was lost. The Autobots left for the stars after that, hoping to spread peace instead of war. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 5}}
{{-}}

==''Transformers '84''==
{{storylink|Secrets & Lies issue 1|Secrets & Lies #1}}
After an "explosion" diverted the course of the planet Cybertron into the path of [[Stellae Cimetera]], Double agent [[Punch (G1)|Punch]] was sent to inform the Autobots of Ratbat's suspicions; that Shockwave had intentionally fired one of the planet's turbines. Prowl chose to handle the problem without informing Optimus, with the Autobot Leader's attention focused on the Ark launch. He sent in Perceptor and the Dynobots to investigate deep in enemy territory. {{storylink|Secrets & Lies issue 1|Secrets & Lies #1}} Prowl took a group of Autobots to view the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]] for the first time before they launched. While everyone was mostly in high spirits, he reminded them that the mission they would undertake was extremely perilous and vital to Cybertron's safety. He was among the ship's crew when it was attacked by Megatron. And so began the story of... THE TRANSFORMERS {{storylink|Transformers '84 issue 0|'84 #0}}

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Action Masters]]
[[Category:Autobot leaders]]
[[Category:Classics Autobots]]
[[Category:Marvel Generation 1 Autobots]]
[[Category:Marvel Generation 2 Autobots]]
[[Category:Regeneration One Autobots]]
[[Category:Security officers]]
[[Category:Strategists]]

Prowl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity

2023-03-23T10:55:56Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Transformers '84 */

{{factions|autobot|autobotg2|maximal}}
{{suite}}
[[File:TFU Prowl.jpg|thumb|Just look at those adorable toes.]]
'''Prowl''': Prick since [[1984]].

==Marvel ''The Transformers'' comics==
{{noteukonly}}
[[File:Magnificent6_crop.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.6]]
''Early in Cybertron's [[Great War (G1)|civil war]], before [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus]] became leader, Prowl was part of a strike team comprising himself, [[Jazz (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Jazz]], [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]], [[Sunstreaker (G1)|Sunstreaker]], [[Wheeljack (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Wheeljack]] and [[Stampede]]. Together, they were tasked with infiltrating Decepticon territories to sow chaos from within. During a mission to the [[neutral]]ist town of [[Yuss]], they defeated a small band of Decepticons and were hailed as heroes by the locals. Regarding the war as little more than fun and games at the time, Prowl dubbed his team the "[[Magnificent Six]]", and started to think himself untouchable. This opinion was challenged when a retaliatory attack came, this time involving far deadlier opponents. The Magnificent Six held Yuss's borders for a week despite being up against [[Megadeath (G1)|Megadeath]] and his elite cadre, but the once-grateful neutralists grew to resent the Autobots. The siege ended with the neutralists betraying Prowl's band to the enemy.''

''As Megadeath's captives, the six were subject to tortures and humiliations for seven days. In one of his sadistic games, Megadeath gave five of the six blasters, and offered them a chance to win their freedom; they only needed to stop him from killing Stampede, the only unarmed member. Prowl and the others failed to even take up arms, so thoroughly had Megadeath succeeded in breaking them by that point. Megadeath then gave the Autobots two hours to find his neutralist prisoners before he detonated five Neutronic bombs to obliterate the entire region. Finding their mettle, the Autobots forewent any attempt to rescue either themselves or the civilians for the Decepticon's entertainment. They instead hid, and ambushed Megadeath when he came to investigate their lack of action. Though Prowl and Wheeljack nearly died in battle, the remaining three Autobots crippled their torturer. Megadeath refused to divulge where he had stashed the neutralists, so the Autobots left him behind to die to his own device. When later questioned about what had transpired during their mission, the survivors lied and claimed not to remember any of it.'' {{storylink|The Magnificent Six!}}

[[File:Marvel71 neversurrender.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6]]
''Prowl was at Prime's side when, upon being promoted to Autobot supreme commander, he thwarted Megatron's earliest attempt at taking [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]].'' {{storylink|And There Shall Come...a Leader!}} He was also present at the battle of [[Jan-Ja]], where Optimus Prime rallied the troops in the defense of Iacon ''once more''. {{storylink|Surrender!}}

[[File:Prowlg1marvelfirst.jpg|upright=0.8|thumb|left|Well somebody's character model was ready.]]
Prowl was one of the select Autobots chosen by [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus Prime]] to travel aboard the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]], and ended up in stasis lock for four million years at the base of [[Mount St. Hilary]] with the rest of the crew. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} {{storylink|Cold Comfort and Joy!}} Once the volcano exploded, Optimus chose Prowl to lead the first away mission into civilization. Prowl's group was the first to observe humans in the flesh, so to speak, and to understand that they were the dominant life form on the planet. After a battle with the Decepticons at a drive-in theater, Prowl ordered a retreat since the organic lifeforms did not seem capable of self-defense. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} Prowl took part in a skirmish at a human auto repair facility, managing a direct hit on [[Buzzsaw (G1)|Buzzsaw]] during the altercation, {{storylink|Power Play!}} though the battle left him and his comrades drained of increasingly scarce fuel. Prowl took part in an effort to rescue the kidnapped Sparkplug Witwicky, {{storylink|Prisoner of War!}} and was later among the Autobots working to repair the damaged Ark. {{storylink|The Last Stand}}

''During work on one piece of machinery, a strong electrical feedback struck [[Brawn (G1)|Brawn]], and Prowl was forced to violently rip out the device's power cord to save his comrade. But as Brawn recovered, Prowl and the other Autobots found their teammate acting uncharacteristically violent. Brawn burst out of the Ark and began rampaging in a nearby town, forcing Prowl and the others to forcibly subdue him. Though another electrical shock allegedly returned Brawn to normal, Optimus couldn't be sure that his soldier wouldn't lash out once more. The test of Brawn's loyalty wound up being a trial by combat against [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]], which ended in what Prowl thought was the Autobot's demise. In reality, [[Mirage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Mirage]] had projected an illusion to dupe Starscream into thinking he had annihilated his foe. Upon Brawn's return and re-induction in the Autobot ranks, Prowl welcomed him with open arms.'' {{storylink|The Enemy Within!}}

''Soon thereafter, Megatron led his troops on a siege against the Autobots within the Ark. In the clash, Prowl was tackled down by [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]], despite his best efforts to gun the Decepticon down. The scuffle was interrupted when the Ark's computer, [[Aunty|Auntie]], was activated with a circuit malfunction. Auntie magnetized the Ark's walls, restraining all combatants and effectively putting their battle on hold. Autobots and Decepticons alike were only freed thanks to the only two unaffected robots, Ravage and [[Windcharger (G1)|Windcharger]], teaming up and shutting down the deranged computer. Even though the Decepticons were then driven out of the Autobots' headquarters, Prowl sustained significant damage, and required extensive reconstruction before he could take on active duty once more.'' {{storylink|Raiders of the Last Ark}}

[[File:Optimus prowl decepticon dam busters.jpg|thumb|upright=1.3]]
''At a later time, the Autobots came to fight against the Decepticons as the evil robots besieged a [[Sherman Dam|hydro-electric dam]]. Prowl helped charge the Decepticon troops while Optimus Prime dueled Megatron atop of the dam itself. But Optimus was defeated by his nemesis, and Megatron destroyed the dam before fleeing. Scrambling his troops in response to the ensuing flood, Optimus sent Prowl ahead to lead the fastest Autobots, tasking them with impeding the water's progress in whichever way they could. Though the trenches and barriers the Autobots made slowed the flood, a great portion of it still reached a nearby town. The Autobots managed to prevent any loss of life, but were vilified by the humans nonetheless, as they weren't able to tell the difference between Autobots and Decepticons.'' {{storylink|Decepticon Dam-Busters!}}

[[File:TheWrathOfGuardian ProwlCliffhanger.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.3|Prowl begins his career of cursing Grimlock's decisions.]]
After the Decepticons' next assault on the Ark, Prowl ended up deactivated and held captive by [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]] and the Decepticons along nearly all his comrades. The Autobots' inert forms were strung up from the Ark's ceiling, intended to be used as spare parts to build a new army of Decepticons. {{storylink|The New Order}} [[Ratchet (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ratchet]], the last surviving Autobot, beheld Prowl dangling limply alongside the others when he managed to infiltrate the now Decepticon-controlled ship. {{storylink|Warrior School!}} ''Prowl was eventually revived when Ratchet and the [[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]] reclaimed control of the Ark from Shockwave's drone, [[Guardian (Marvel)|Guardian]]. Upon his awakening, Prowl learned alongside Wheeljack and Ratchet that the drone had been booby-trapped with a thermo-nuclear bomb, which threatened to blow all within the Ark to smithereens should Grimlock deliver a killing blow to it.'' {{storylink|The Wrath of Guardian!}} ''Though Prowl was helpless to do anything about their situation, Wheeljack managed to prevent their demise by remote-controlling Optimus Prime's headless body, and stopping Grimlock from blasting Guardian's head off. Guardian fled, and the Dinobots reconvened with the rest of the Autobots. Remembering the last time they had to deal with a rogue Guardian unit, Prowl suggested that Ratchet fix up Windcharger next, so that they could magnetize the droid to the Ark's walls. Guardian returned before they could fully implement this plan however, forcing [[Swoop (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Swoop]] to fly Guardian up into the sky, where the bomb was detonated far away from the rest of the Autobots. Believing that Swoop had perished in his rescue, Prowl and the others held a mourning ceremony for their lost comrade.'' {{storylink|The Wrath of Grimlock!}}

[[File:PrimeTime-ultimatelyfutile.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.4|This injury would knock Prowl out of the American stories for a while, but over in the UK they had better health care.]]
With Optimus Prime's head still in Decepticon possession, Prowl took command of the Autobots until their true leader could be restored. At Jazz's suggestion, he forged an alliance with human fuel magnate [[G.B. Blackrock]], arranging an exchange of free gasoline for the Autobots for their help in protecting Blackrock's facilities from the Decepticons. {{storylink|DIS-Integrated Circuits!}} He set the Autobots to various vital repair tasks around the crashed Ark, gave Blackrock a tour of the Ark in an effort to build trust with their new ally, and sent a team out to stop the Decepticons from constructing a communications dish. {{storylink|The Next Best Thing to Being There!}} On learning that their friend Buster was in danger, he dispatched Bluestreak and Bumblebee to defend him. Prowl personally led an expedition to recover Optimus Prime's head, {{storylink|Brainstorm!}} but the team was ambushed by the Decepticons and a false Prime. Prowl suffered a mangled arm, but was among the last Autobots standing when the real Prime arrived and put an end to the battle. {{storylink|Prime Time!}}

{{note|In the US series, the injuries sustained by Prowl in this story resulted in him going offline, as seen in "[[Rock and Roll-Out!]]" In the UK comic, however, he remained operational and starred in several further stories.}}

''As [[Christmas]] rolled around, Prowl became dumbfounded by Optimus' willingness to indulge Buster in what he believed to be a bizarre charade. He and Bluestreak discussed the matter as Buster supervised the construction of a Christmas tree within the Autobots' headquarters, and Optimus paraded about in a big red suit. Bluestreak suggested that Prime simply felt endebted to Buster for carrying the Matrix of Creation in the Autobots' time of need, an explanation that Prowl readily accepted.'' {{storylink|Christmas Breaker!}}

[[File:Prowlg1crisisofcommand.jpg|upright=1.75|thumb|left|Some even call me a prick! And why? Because I dared to dream of my own race of atomic monsters!]]
''Shortly thereafter, Prowl was the ringleader of a group of Autobots strongly requesting that Prime use his [[Matrix of Leadership|Creation Matrix]] to create [[Ultimate Autobot]] super-warriors to wipe out the Decepticons for them. The lethal efficiency of Prowl's stance was just as strongly opposed by another faction who saw such action as a perversion of their sacred lifeforce, and the potential for laying waste to Earth. Prime's long absence and relative weakness after his recent ordeals left Prowl and the others less deferential than normal to his will, but after he single-handedly fought through the Decepticons to rescue [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]], Prowl and the other Ultimate Autobot proponents backed down and accepted Prime's final word on the subject.'' {{storylink|Crisis of Command!}}

''When an unidentified flying transformer approached the Ark, Prowl and the other able-bodied troops went out to meet it, only to find themselves under attack by a mind-controlled Swoop. Though the Autobots were unable to subdue the Dinobot, Optimus prompted Swoop to wrestle free from the mind-control by issuing the rebellious bot an order. Swoop flew off to the lab of the [[Peter Anthony Morris|human]] who had taken control of him, with Prowl and the others in pursuit. Upon their arrival, Swoop handed the fleshling over to Optimus for judgement... only to go into a wild rage and attack the Autobots once more.'' {{storylink|The Icarus Theory}} ''Swoop was knocked offline, but the Autobots learned that the other Dinobots were also being driven feral by their primitive circuitry. After tracking them down, Prowl nearly sacrificed himself crashing a shuttlecraft straight into the feuding [[Grimlock (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Grimlock]] and [[Sludge (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Sludge]].'' {{storylink|Dinobot Hunt!}}

[[File:Optimus prime prowl jazz mirage to a power unknown.jpg|thumb|right|upright=2.2|Prowl is actually unaffected - he's just enjoying being able to be his true self.]]
''While on a mission to build friendly relations with the people of [[Pinewoodsville]], Prowl and his fellow Autobots were hit with a strange energy blast that temporarily reversed their personalities. The group rampaged through the town, ruining months of goodwill work. Tracking the source of the blast to England, the Autobots flew overseas to put an end to what they assumed was a Decepticon plot. But the Decepticons had also been affected by the blast, and were likewise tracking its origin. Prowl, Jazz, Sideswipe, and Mirage holed up inside Optimus's trailer to conserve energy, but were shaken out of their hiding spot by Starscream just as another personality-reversing blast hit the group. Optimus was sent crashing into a tree off the road, and his troops began calling for a violent mutiny. The Autobots returned to their senses before they dealt out any permanent damage, but Optimus was left too banged-up to carry on with the mission. The culprit behind the energy blasts turned out to be a human invention, the "[[Purnel's Auto-Reverse Defence|PARD]]." It was destroyed, along with [[Zeke Heilmann|a spy]] trying to steal it, after Starscream battled Jazz over both. With the threat neutralized, the Autobots carried Optimus back to their UK Base, where Ratchet was waiting to fix him up.'' {{storylink|To a Power Unknown!}}

[[File:DistantThunder ProwlLethalForce.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.2]]
''Prowl was [[Mass substitution|displaced]] to [[Limbo]] along with Optimus Prime and Ratchet when [[Galvatron (G1)|Galvatron]], [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] and [[Scourge (G1)|Scourge]] [[time travel]]ed from the future.'' {{storylink|Target: 2006}} ''Joined later by [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]], [[Thundercracker (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Thundercracker]] and [[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]], they found themselves in the middle of a war between the peaceful, cat-like [[Cloran]] and evil, monkey-like invaders led by [[Zenag]]. Optimus's refusal to use lethal force left the more pragmatic Shockwave in a better position forge alliances, but it was ultimately discovered that the whole set-up was only an illusion. Once said illusion was dispelled, Prowl and the others found that they had been sharing a dream fabricated by [[Limbo parasite]]s in order to be made to feel violent emotions, the latter's sustenance.'' {{storylink|Distant Thunder!}} ''When Galvatron's group returned to their own time, Prowl was released from Limbo.''

[[File:PerchanceToDream ProwlDoneWithRules.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.6|For the rest of the issue, the role of Prowl will be played by Nicholas Cage.]]
''Prowl was next in action during the [[Battlecharger]]s' rampage, and attempted to bring them in despite the endangerment of human life. After narrowly preventing a gas station from exploding due to his opponents' sabotage, and avoiding a car pile-up, Prowl grew enraged and readied to unleash his full fury on the Decepticons. However, Optimus then turned up, having easily found the battle scene due to the extensive collateral damage it had caused. The Autobot leader talked Prowl out of pursuing the 'Cons, and berated him for being so reckless in his pursuit.'' {{storylink|...Perchance to Dream}}

''Prior to Christmas [[1986]], the Autobots learned that the Decepticons had taken control of a [[NASA]] space-monitoring system. Prowl swiftly organized a strike team to interfere, himself at its helm, with Trailbreaker and Jetfire backing him up. In his attempt to reach [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] on the battlefield, Prowl was confronted by [[Kickback (G1)|Kickback]], who held him at bay. Prowl ordered Jetfire to take out Soundwave and interrupt the Decepticons' transmission to Cybertron, but the jet opted to instead help with Kickback. Kickback easily outmaneuvered the larger Autobot by shrinking down to his insect mode, and the Decepticons beat a hasty retreat. Infuriated that Jetfire had flubbed at his task, Prowl gave him a chewing out.'' {{storylink|The Gift}}

[[File:Hoist prowl tracks night the transformers saved christmas.jpg|thumb|left|upright=0.9]]
On Christmas Eve, Prowl, Bumblebee, Tracks, and [[Hoist (G1)|Hoist]] foiled Soundwave's plan to steal electricity from a power plant near [[Midville]]. Outnumbered, Soundwave and Laserbeak retreated upon the Autobots' approach. Prowl had Bumblebee and Tracks pursue the Decepticons while he and Hoist attempted to repair the damage they had done to the plant. Prowl and Hoist were unsuccessful in getting the plant up and running again, and later followed Tracks into town after he reported that he and Bumblebee had similarly met with failure. They then watched as Bumblebee got into the spirit of giving, and supplied power to Midville's Christmas tree so the humans could partake in their holiday traditions. {{storylink|The Night the Transformers Saved Christmas}}

''Having grown dissatisfied with his troops' performances during his recent absences, Optimus Prime planed to fake his own death, so that the Autobots could learn to better fend for themselves. To this end, he informed his soldiers that he would be heading out on a solo scouting mission near Decepticon territory. Prowl reacted poorly to this, insisting that one of the more expendable Autobots carry out the mission instead. But Optimus was adamant in carrying out the task himself, leading to Prowl's fears being seemingly confirmed a half-hour later; he was among a group of Autobots who came upon a facsimile construct of Prime, torn to shreds by the Decepticons.'' {{storylink|Prey!}} ''A funeral was held for the Autobots' fallen leader, attended by all. At least, until Optimus spontaneously reappeared on Earth standing atop his headstone, and the whole matter was quickly forgotten.'' {{storylink|Resurrection!}}

[[File:FuneralForAFriend-GETAWAYFROMME.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.45]]
''Deactivated by means unknown, Prowl lay in stasis in the Ark's repair bay for many months.'' Ratchet managed to briefly revive him in order to exploit his police car mode against a human thief named the [[Mechanic]] who had infiltrated the Ark, but Prowl still needed rest and was spent after this brief period of activity. {{storylink|Funeral for a Friend!}} Prowl was fully revived by the time the Ark was relaunched; he was among the many Autobots who welcomed Blaster back into the fold, asking him to take over leadership of the Autobots from Grimlock. Prowl went so far as to advise him to stay on the Ark rather than tangle with the Dinobots to rescue a [[Spacehikers|quartet of children]] he had befriended, which Grimlock had ensnared in a trap to draw his rival out. But Blaster surrendered himself in order to secure the kids' safety. {{storylink|Spacehikers!}} Prowl was later among the crowd who gathered for Grimlock and [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]]'s grudge match on the moon; when the Decepticons launched a sneak attack, he was the first to realize what was happening and call for the Autobots to turn and fight; he joined the battle alongside the combined crews of the Ark and ''[[Steelhaven (G1)|Steelhaven]]'' against the Decepticon party-crashers. {{storylink|Totaled!}} Unfortunately, it wasn't too long afterwards that Prowl was once again knocked off-line, this time battling the [[Underbase]]-charged Starscream in [[New York City|New York]]. {{storylink|Dark Star}} {{storylink|Flashback!}}

''Despite him being out of action, a [[solid light simulation]] of Prowl was used in a training mission for the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]]. Said simulation contained both high-ranking Autobot officers and Autobot "non-entities" though, so it's unknown how worthy of an opponent Prowl was considered by the Decepticons.'' {{storylink|The Hunting Party (Marvel)|The Hunting Party}}

[[File:OnTheEdgeOfExtinction ProwlGrimlock.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.8]]
After Ratchet seemingly perished, Optimus Prime fell into a deep melancholy, and had the Ark's computer recount to him all those who had fallen under his command. Prowl was among those name-dropped. {{storylink|Yesterday's Heroes!}}

He would remain in stasis for some time, until Grimlock acquired a large supply of super-energy known as [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]], and pumped it into all of the Ark's stasis chambers. {{storylink|The Void! (US)|The Void!}} Prowl found himself revived just in time to engage the Chaos-Bringer known as [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]] for the sake of all Cybertron. Grimlock led the charge by ramming the Ark in Unicron's face, sending the ship plummeting down towards Cybertron's surface. Prowl berated him for this foolish course of action, only for Grimlock to respond by pitching Prowl out of the ship. Prowl made it to the surface safely, and arrived to the battlefront in time to see his long-term friend and leader, Optimus Prime, sacrifice himself to destroy Unicron. {{storylink|On the Edge of Extinction!}}

[[File:Wheeljack-stilllife.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7|right]]
After Unicron's destruction however, Prowl was surprised to find that Optimus's tattered remains still clung onto a semblance of life. Optimus named Grimlock his successor before finally expiring, much to Prowl's bemoanment. He subsequently delivered this news to the Dinobot, only to find that Grimlock was apparently unaware of the responsibility that now fell upon him; though Prowl insisted that Grimlock needed to nurture the fragile alliance the Autobots had forged with the Decepticons, Grimlock instead opted to seek out the Ark and the Autobots that still remained inoperative within it. Prowl at least managed to get Grimlock to promise that he would uphold Prime's ideals before he went off with the Dinobots. {{storylink|Still Life!}}

[[File:Prowlg1exodus.jpg|left|upright=1.1|thumb|You'd be a prick too if Grimlock kept getting promoted over you.]]
As such, Prowl found himself working almost alone trying to maintain the tenuous peace between the Autobots and Decepticons. To make matters worse, he and Blaster discovered that Cybertron was tearing itself apart; without Primus's consciousness to maintain it, the planet was losing its cohesion. Prowl continued to implore Grimlock to step up into his role and make a speech that would assure everyone that the situation was well in hand. But Grimlock continued to eschew such responsibilities and reminded Prowl that Optimus had trusted him solely to lead, enraging Prowl to no end. The final straw came when Grimlock participated in a petty brawl like a common thug, prompting Prowl to chew him out in public. [[Bludgeon (G1)|Bludgeon]] used the opportunity to demand assurances out of the Autobots, and Prowl was forced to comply, revealing prematurely where the ships they planed to leave the planet with were parked. Thus Prowl ended up overplaying his hand: Bludgeon took got the chance to betray the Autobots, leaving them trapped on the dying world, without transport, while the Decepticons fled to conquer new civilizations. {{storylink|Exodus!}}

[[File:LastAutobot-Silverbolt.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8|right]]
Berating his lack of foresight and common sense, Prowl wandered outside, waiting for the inevitable end. Luckily for Prowl, Grimlock had anticipated the Decepticons' treachery (by Primus, how'd he manage that?!?) and had secured alternate starships. The Dinobot surprised Prowl and Blaster by parking said vessels, Decepticon Battle Cruisers, right in front of the Autobots' headquarters. Prowl suddenly found himself very grateful for Grimlock's rebellious streak. {{storylink|A Savage Circle}}

[[File:EndOfTheRoad-finalfive.jpg|thumb|left]]
The Autobots tracked the Decepticons to the planet [[Klo]], and Prowl partook in some back-seat driving as he urged Silverbolt to reach their destination as quickly as possible. Irritated that with every moment that the Decepticons were left to their devices meant more innocent lives lost, he turned to Grimlock and demanded to know why he couldn't have commandeered a faster ship. The latter and Nightbeat both made their best attempts at talking Prowl down, insisting he save his energy for the conflict that lay ahead. {{storylink|The Last Autobot?}} As the Autobots prepared to make planetfall, Prowl suggested they be cautious in their approach. Grimlock disregarded this advice, a charged into the fray blindly, prompting most of his troops to do likewise. The ensuing battle wound up having a disastrous outcome; the Decepticons had been anticipating the Autobots' arrival, and slaughtered all but five of their members in an initial ambush. Those left standing were Grimlock, Prowl, Blaster, Slag, and Kup. Despite the group's best attempts at hiding their scents, they were tracked down by a hunting party, though miraculously managed to overcome their attackers. Doubling back for a final stand, Prowl's group found the resurrected Optimus Prime and the legendary [[Last Autobot]] already turning the tide against Bludgeon's forces. With the Last Autobot reviving all those who had fallen, the Autobots drove off Bludgeon's forces, sending them into a temporary exile. {{storylink|End of the Road! (US)|End of the Road!}}
{{-}}

===Transformers Annual 1985===
{{note|Due to being published early in the franchise, these stories are out of continuity with the above.<ref>"Plague of the Insecticons!" was later designated as [[universal stream]] [[Primax 1285.0 Gamma]] by [[Vector Prime]].</ref>}}

[[File:UKAnnual86 ProwlhitbySplinterGrenade.jpg|upright=1.0|thumb|right|A prick laid low by dozens of smaller pricks.]]
Realizing that their mission on Earth would be infinitely more difficult without capable human allies, Optimus attempted to open a dialogue with the American government. Planning the meeting in utmost secrecy, he, [[Warpath (G1)|Warpath]], and Prowl managed to secure an audience with the [[Ronald Reagan|President of the United States]]. The three Autobots drove to the White House, and were warmly received by their host. But their talk was interrupted by the [[Insecticon (G1)|Insecticons]]. The Autobots did their best to take down the trio, only for [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] to loudly proclaim that Optimus was his leader, and he was off to attack [[Washington, D.C.|the city]] as per his orders. Prowl was especially outraged at this act of slander. Unfortunately, the President's soldier escorts were quick to turn on the Autobots, having assumed that Bombshell had revealed the robots' true intent.

Prowl and Warpath were sent to deal with the Insecticons, while Optimus went off on his own to "cut them off at their source." Though Warpath was confused over what Optimus had just said, Prowl assured him not to bother himself with it; they had a mission to do, and that was the only thing they needed to think about. They drove to downtown Washington, finding that their foes had wasted no time in reducing the scene to a warzone. Prowl fought hard to bring an end to the carnage, though he was downed by one of [[Shrapnel (G1)|Shrapnel]]'s [[Shrapnel grenade|splinter grenades]]. Thankfully, Optimus's [[Roller (G1)|Roller]] drone came to Warpath's aid. Optimus was successful on his end of the mission, bringing down [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]], responsible for remote-controlling the Insecticons. With the battle over, Optimus and his troops fled the scene; they felt that the humans would not believe them should they try and explain the situation, and that the Decepticon had already sullied their reputation beyond repair. {{storylink|Plague of the Insecticons!}}

[[File:UKAnnual86 Prowlspiesmetal.jpg|upright=1.1|thumb|left|"If there's one thing I know by sight alone, it's Ravage's dandruff!"]]
After the bulk of the Autobot forces left on a mission, Prowl and Bumblebee were relegated to monitoring news broadcasts for any signs of Decepticon activity. Prowl struck gold upon discovering footage of [[John Butler|a man]] being rescued by a woman, spotting a sliver of Cybertronian metal at the man's feet. Analyzing the story, Prowl came to the conclusion that Ravage had attacked the man, and attempted to contact Optimus on the matter. But upon finding that his signal wasn't getting through, Prowl resolved himself to wait until their commander returned. Bumblebee managed to change his mind, pointing out that the Decepticon threat would only grow should they stay idle. Prowl, Bumblebee, [[Topspin (G1)|Topspin]] and [[Twin Twist]] headed out to investigate.

Prowl remained nervous during the outing, suggesting to his compatriots they return to the Ark at the first obstruction in their path. The others wouldn't hear it however, and they soon picked up Ravage's trail. Following it, the group traveled for days until they happened upon the Decepticons' hideout. There, Megatron's soldiers were excavating rare crystals that could bring new Decepticons to life. Prowl suggested that the Autobots hold their position and contact the Ark for reinforcements, prompting a debate within the group. While the others were distracted by their argument, Bumblebee took it upon himself to push on alone, only to be caught in [[Thrust (G1)|Thrust]] and [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]]'s cross-hairs. Prowl and the [[Jumpstarter]]s were forced to head down to his rescue. But they found themselves paralyzed with fear partway through their descent; [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]] had also been posted as a guard, and was using his fear-inducing engines on the Autobots. Thankfully, Prowl was able to work through his paralysis, and gunned Dirge down with a few [[acid pellet]]s. The Autobots then managed to down Starscream and send him crashing into Megatron's mine, destroying it utterly. Thrust retaliated by burying the Autobots in an avalanche, and by the time Prowl clawed his way back out, the Decepticons had already fled the scene. {{storylink|Hunted!}}

===Marvel UK future timelines===
{{note|The movie adaptation, originally published by Marvel US, is in italics}}
[[File:ThePlanetEater wasnt no ice chunk.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.8]]
''In one alternate timeline, the Decepticons succeeded in conquering all of Cybertron by the year [[2005]], forcing all of the Autobots off-world. Prowl was among those who wound up posted at [[Moonbase One]], and left the satellite alongside Ironhide, Ratchet, and Brawn to make an Energon run to Earth. Partway to their destination however, they were boarded by a Decepticon party. Prowl was fatally shot down by Megatron in following confrontation.'' {{storylink|The Planet-Eater!}}

A time traveler from the distant future, [[Dicet Alpha-zero]], would one day traverse the time-stream to observe several key moments in the Transformers' war, witnessing Prowl fighting back against the Decepticons aboard the Ark prior to it crashing on Earth, and an impostor Optimus Prime gunning down Prowl and Sideswipe. {{storylink|The Quest!}}
{{-}}

===Rhythms of Darkness!===
[[File:RhythmsofDarkness SurvivingAutobots.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1|[[Magnificent Six|The Magnificent Three]]?]]
In an alternate [[2009]], Prowl was one of only seven Autobots left alive after [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] and his Decepticons took over America. With Cybertron destroyed by [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]] and the various Primes dead, things looked bleak. Prowl and Jazz led a last-ditch assault on the Decepticon fortress, though [[Getaway]] broke rank early on and attacked [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] and [[Scourge (G1)|Scourge]] early in the mission. Quickly adapting to the situation, Prowl ordered [[Guzzle (G1)|Guzzle]] and [[Chainclaw (G1)|Chainclaw]] to help Getaway in distracting the guards while the rest of the team pushed forward. Miraculously, they managed to send a signal to the rest of the world that America was still alive and fighting. When some [[Hook, Line, and Sinker|mysterious travelers]] shang-haied Galvatron from the field of battle, Prowl joined Jazz and [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]] (the last of their kind) in fighting alongside their human allies with renewed vigor. Perhaps the war could yet be won! {{storylink|Rhythms of Darkness!}}

Later on in [[Primax 490.0 Gamma]], the reformed [[Cybertronian (faction)|Cybertronian Empire]] dispatched [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] to Earth to enlist the aid of the Trio in the fight against Unicron. Together, Autobot, Decepticon, and Cybertronian stood as one and vanquished the Chaos-Bringer. {{storylink|Ask Vector Prime}}
{{-}}

===Earthforce===
{{earthforcefiction}}
[[File:Prowllittlemen.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|Prowl was GEEWUN before it was fashionable.]]
At some point during the conflict on Earth, Prowl faced off against Blitzwing on a highway, dodging the Decepticon tank's artillery as he drove. {{storylink|Once upon a Time...}}

{{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Ironhide profile}}

Deactivated following his battle with the [[Underbase]]-enhanced Starscream, Prowl lay recuperating within a lifepod in the Ark for months, until the [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] of a parallel future intervened. Using a "[[mind bug]]" device, Galvatron manipulated the baser instincts of several Autobots, attempting to revive them as pawns he could use for his own purposes. Instead they revived intent on opposing him. Prowl joined [[Wheeljack (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Wheeljack]], [[Sunstreaker (G1)|Sunstreaker]], [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]] and [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] in overpowering and capturing the renegade Decepticon. Wheeljack cobbled together a device that turned Galvatron's own technology against him, and Prowl slapped it on the villain's head, leaving him trapped in his own nightmares. {{storylink|...Perchance to Dream}} Prowl would emerge from this experience as a stable individual, possibly free from any mental issues as he'd been activated sooner and had longer to adjust, as well as due to his logical mind. {{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Prowl profile}}

As the days passed, Prowl attempted to readjust to the war, despite how it had changed around him. Along with Wheeljack, he lamented about the proliferation of newer types of Transformers, claiming these newcomers gave him a headache just thinking about them. Luckily, their patrol turned up several familiar enemies, including the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]] and [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] working under [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]]'s command. Megatron had formulated a scheme to destroy Earth's atmosphere with a [[Global warming satellite|deadly rocket]], and reap the excess energy that would no longer be filtered out before reaching the planet's surface. {{storylink|Starting Over!}} While Wheeljack engaged the Decepticons, Prowl leaped aboard the flying rocket, knocking it off course so that its deadly poison never reached the proper altitude. {{storylink|Desert Island Risks!}} He crashed down in the backwoods of Louisiana, and befriended some locals who helped fix him up over the next few days. Prowl also neutralized the rocket's poison, and got a good chuckle out of watching the two Decepticon factions arrive days later and begin fighting over a useless cargo. {{storylink|Life in the Slow Lane}} His newly relaxed nature would sometimes impair with quick decision making. {{storylink|Transformers Annual 1990|1990 Prowl profile}}

[[File:Snaptrapflashback.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.4]]
A new team of Autobots called [[Earthforce]] had been formed, partly to help recover Prowl and the atmospheric rocket, and he quickly joined the organization once reunited with his fellow Autobots. Working under Grimlock's overall command, Prowl acted as second lieutenant, providing a voice of reason and strategy for the Dinobot Commander. On one occasion, Prowl sabotaged Megatron's attempt to alter the timeline using a [[Flashback Doorway]]. The two opponents traveled back in time to the battle with Starscream, where Megatron possessed the body of [[Snaptrap (G1)|Snaptrap]], and attempted to lead the [[Seacon (G1)|Seacons]] to safety in order to receive their services in the present. Prowl possessed his own past form and ensured the Seacons' destruction, as well as that of his own past self, before returning to the present. {{storylink|Flashback!}} He also talked Grimlock into accepting the [[Survivors]] into Earthforce, and joined them in assaulting the island base of the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]] to rescue their Decepticon member, [[Carnivac (G1)|Carnivac]]. Upon arrival, the Autobots overpowered the remaining Mayhems, but were stopped short of granting any of them a "warrior's death" by Carnivac. Impressed by what he viewed as an act of mercy, Prowl formally welcomed Carnivac in the Autobot fold. {{storylink|Where Wolf?}}

Prowl and the rest of the Earthforce were forced to respond when a "concerned citizen" alerted them to Megatron and Shockwave's battle at [[Memphis Airport]], though they (rightfully) suspected that the situation was a set-up put into play by an unseen party. {{storylink|Internal Affairs!}}

[[File:Earthforce house that wheeljack built.jpg|thumb|upright=2]]
When the Autobot [[Earthbase]] was finished, Prowl gathered with all the other Autobots outside to witness Wheeljack's handiwork. Ever cautious and critical, Prowl commented on the noticeable lack of defenses. Wheeljack then turned on the defense grid and tossed a rock towards the base, triggering a series of underground weapon systems that annihilated the projectile. Prowl still wasn't convinced, and began asking how the defenses might be knocked off-line once activated. Wheeljack assured him the defenses were so completely fool proof that NO ONE could shut them off once they had been activated unless they were sitting at the control console inside the base. Prowl then gave Wheeljack his "Everybody's dumb but me" look, and did a headcount of the ''entire'' Earthforce who had come outside for the demonstration... meaning no one was inside who could shut off the deadly defense grid. In order to get back inside their base, Prowl volunteered to brave the perils and reach the console himself. With [[Jazz (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Jazz]], [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]] and the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]] spotting him, Prowl navigated his way through lasers, [[Heat Seeker (G1)|Heat Seekers]], [[Acid Bat]]s, and electrified tentacles before finally shutting off the system. {{storylink|The House that Wheeljack Built!}} Wheeljack went to work decentralizing the base's defenses, which unfortunately left it vulnerable to attack. The Autobots' lack of defenses coincided with the Decepticons finding the location of their headquarters, and summarily launching an all-out siege against it. Thankfully, the attack was nothing more than a distraction for an attempted hijacking of an oil tanker, and when the Survivors foiled the theft, Starscream ordered the Decepticons to retreat. Prowl saw Soundwave, Divebomb, and Hook off as they fled the scene. {{storylink|Divide and Conquer!}}

When Bludgeon, Stranglehold, and Octopunch managed to escape their cell within the Earthbase, Prowl reported the incident to Grimlock and assured him that their guard, Inferno, would survive despite getting stabbed in the back during the breakout. {{storylink|Shut Up!}}

[[File:Earthforce external forces.jpg|thumb|left|upright=2]]
Later on, [[Snarl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Snarl]] began suffering from a case of [[Corrodia Gravis]], and the Autobots were forced to go to Starscream in order to get a compatible systems boost to save the Dinobot's life. Not destined to be an easy mission in the best of cases, Prowl, Ironhide and the remaining Dinobots walked in on an assassination in progress and the former Decepticon leaders attempted to remove the current ones from their former thrones. As was often the case, it fell on Prowl to re-explain to Grimlock why it wasn't a good thing that Starscream's life was in danger. {{storylink|External Forces!|External Forces!}} After Megatron, Shockwave and their assassins were chased off, Prowl and Grimlock made a deal with Starscream to gain his help, in exchange for agreeing to step in if Megatron ever tried to overthrow their current Decepticon regime again. {{storylink|The Lesser Evil!}}

When [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] injected [[Superion (G1)|Superion]] with a [[cerebro-shell]] and caused him to go wild, Earthforce was in dire straits trying to find a means of stopping the warrior juggernaut. Prowl found a human reporter on the scene named [[Irwin Spoon]], and made a deal with him for an exclusive interview in exchange for Irwin's help removing the shell from the inside. {{storylink|Inside Story!}} Irwin was successful and got his interview. Prowl hoped the good publicity would help the Autobots establish better relations with humanity, despite Grimlock's grumbling. It seemed the Decepticons had the same notion, and so Starscream and Soundwave sent the Stunticons to kidnap Irwin from Earthbase before he could publish his story, taking him right out from under Prowl's olfactory receptor. {{storylink|Front Line! (issue)|Front Line!}} Prowl tried to chase down [[Motormaster (G1)|Motormaster]] and recover the human, but was bashed off the side of the highway, and had to be recovered by Wheeljack. {{storylink|End of the Road! (UK)|End of the Road!}}

In [[1990]], Optimus unwittingly reunited the surviving members of the [[Magnificent Six]] for a mission to the [[Acid Wastes]]. He suspected the [[Underbase]]'s ruins still held a connection to Cybertron's core, which they could tap into to defeat [[Unicron/Generation 1|Unicron]]. Despite the mission's urgency, Prowl and the others made excuses to be excluded from it. Optimus was bewildered by this apparent display of cowardice, and sent them forth anyways, with [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] along to round out the team.

[[File:Magnificent Six the end.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7]]
As the five delved deeper into the Wastes, their traumatic memories seeped to the forefront of their minds, culminating in their paralysis upon reaching the remnants of [[Yuss]]. There, they were accosted by mutated mechs, survivors of the Neutronic holocaust that they had failed to prevent millions of years ago. But another ghost from their past held even greater sway over their psyches: [[Megadeath (G1)|Megadeath]] had survived as well, and took the group captive once more! Having realized in the interim that his teammates were plagued by past trauma, Silverbolt sought to stir Prowl and the others out of their stupor through ridicule, calling the five "the Autobots' resident losers." This riled them enough for the truth of what had transpired in Yuss to finally come out. Silverbolt convinced his comrades that they were stronger than they thought, and the group's confidence slowly returned. With hate and cold fury driving them, Prowl, Sunstreaker, Wheeljack, Inferno, and Jazz confronted Megadeath while Silverbolt saw to the mutated neutralists being freed from his control. Prowl's group battered down their former torturer, only stopping short of the killing blow. But Megadeath would rather kill himself, while taking the Autobots with him, than admit defeat; he breached his own nuclear core, beginning a destructive chain reaction. The Autobots fled to once more avoid annihilation.

Having found closure, the Autobots continued on with their mission, and reached the former site of the Underbase with the neutralists in tow. Prowl turned to Jazz and suggested that, with Silverbolt along to replace [[Stampede]], it was almost as though they were the magnificent six once more. But Jazz replied that they couldn't go back to the way things were; they had grown too much, and seen for themselves the ugliest side of war. {{storylink|The Magnificent Six!}}
{{-}}

===Another Time & Place===
[[File:Prime prowl another time & place.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.8|Prowl had a ''G2'' neck before it was cool.]]
Several months after the incident on [[Klo]], Prowl caught wind of Grimlock running off on his own again, this time back to [[Hydrus Four]]. Prowl alerted Optimus Prime at [[Nova Point]] to the situation, but was surprised when his leader harshly rebuked him for bringing it to his attention. When Prime made it clear he didn't want anything to do with Prowl's report, the Autobot strategist stormed off to consider the problem himself. After some solitary computation, Prowl decided that the threat of Decepticons following Grimlock to Hydrus Four and acquiring [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]] was too perilous to ignore. He was rushing out of his chambers, ready to throw together a squad of Autobots regardless of what Optimus Prime thought, when he ran smack into Optimus himself. Prime apologized to Prowl for "hiding his head in the sand"—he had wanted the war to be over so badly, for his fellow Autobots' sake and not his, that he was willing to ignore an obvious threat. The two old friends shook hands and proceeded to gather their strike team.

[[File:Another Time Place Fangry.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4]]
On Hydrus Four, Prowl joined a small group of commandos including [[Springer (G1)|Springer]], [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]] and [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]] to scout the enemy position. They dispatched [[Fangry (G1)|Fangry]] with little effort, and sent in [[Roadhandler (G1)|Roadhandler]] and some [[Micromaster]]s to free Grimlock and the Dinobots quietly before the main offensive began. Nothing ever goes quietly with the Dinobots, though, and so once the shooting started inside, the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]] were sent in to bomb the facility and let the Decepticons know they were in for it. Prowl and his fellow Autobots assaulted the base and, in little time at all, Bludgeon and his crew were dismantled and the day was won yet again. {{storylink|Another Time & Place}}
{{--}}

==Marvel ''Generation 2'' comic==
[[File:Prowlg2muzzle.jpg|left|upright=0.6|thumb|Prowl and Grimlock's sexual tension continues.]]
When Optimus Prime and Grimlock discovered the threat of the [[Cybertronian (faction)|Cybertronians]], they called in Autobots scattered across the galaxy, including Prowl. As one of Prime's most loyal supporters, Prowl did not participate in Grimlock's ill-advised strike on the [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Liege Centuro]] and his fleet. Instead, he helped Optimus free Grimlock and his strike team after they had been taken prisoners by the enemy. {{storylink|Devices and Desires! (Marvel)|Devices and Desires!}} Still, Prowl would not completely ignore Grimlock's opinions: when Optimus Prime decreed that he be left alone to entreat Megatron for peace, Grimlock convinced Prowl that Prime made a bad call, and they arrived with a rescue battalion just in time to keep Megatron from destroying his old nemesis. {{storylink|The Gathering Darkness}}

[[File:Jazz silverbolt prowl escalation.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8]]
Optimus recuperated from his injuries for a few days afterwards, only for Megatron to burst into the medical bay following a brief off-world absence. Prowl rushed to Optimus's aid, only to find that Megatron had come to forge an alliance. Grimlock was scoffed at the very notion, and Prowl was forced to restrain the Dinobot after Megatron suggested that Prime muzzle his petulant soldier. Though an alliance was agreed upon, the Autobots were soon called to the planet [[Ethos]] to repel invaders, a conflict Megatron refused to involve himself in. {{storylink|Escalation!|Tales of Earth Part Five}} The Autobots found the culprit behind the invasion once more to be Jhiaxus's army, and Prowl helped in staving off an impeding genocide. But the Cybertronians proved as formidable as ever, and Prowl, Optimus, and Bumblebee were soon entrenched and surrounded, with little hope of victory in sight. The tide turned with Megatron's arrival, who had allegedly changed his mind upon learning who it was that the Autobots were fighting. {{storylink|Escalation!}}
{{--}}

==''Classics''==
{{noteclassics}}
[[File:BWSG-prowlbeastmode.jpg|thumb|upright=1.5|left|I'm brushing up on looking down, I'm working on my roar!]]
After the war, Prowl eagerly took on the task of assigning new civilian roles for Autobot soldiers to better help them adjust to peacetime. {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 18|Optimus Prime's profile in Club magazine #18}}

Some time later, Prowl, was given command over Cybertron while Optimus was dealing with Megatron's forces on Earth. Deciding that there was no more room for rogue heroics among the Autobot ranks, he traveled to Azure alongside [[Silverbolt (G1)#Classics|Silverbolt]] and [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity#Classics|Ironhide]] to reel Grimlock back into the Autobot forces. The trio tracked down Slag and Sludge and arranged through them a meeting with their leader. This meeting wound up being cut short by a distress call from Earth, and Grimlock agreed to accompany the Autobots aboard the ''[[Graviton (Classics)|Graviton]]'' to respond to it. {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 50|Grimlock's profile in Club magazine #50}}

During their journey, the ''Graviton'' was pulled into [[Primax -408.24 Epsilon|the negative polarity universe]] and deposited near that reality's prehistoric [[Earth]]. Despite his best attempts, the ship was shot down by the ''[[Talon (Classics)|Talon]]'', and Prowl had to come up with a way for the Autobots to survive the ambient [[energon radiation]]. They adopted organic alternate modes, with Prowl taking the form of a lion. {{storylink|Shattered Time}} On discovering that three [[stasis pod]]s were missing from the ship, Prowl piloted a [[sky-sled]] which was shot down by [[Seawing (G1)|Seawing]] and [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]]. By the time they reached the pods on foot, [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]] had activated them as Decepticons. Prowl, [[Ironhide (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ironhide]], and [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]] were blasted by [[Autojetter]], and it was only the arrival of [[Depth Charge (BW)|Depth Charge]] and recovery of [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ultra Magnus]] that saved them. {{storylink|Shattered Expectations (BWSG)|Shattered Expectations}}

[[File:BWSG-prowlrobotmode.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.0|No, Prowl! Fruit is ''bad'' for cats!]]
The Autobots retreated across a rock bridge, and watched as Magnus faced off against Megatron, dealing their foe a temporary defeat. Back at the ''Graviton'', Depth Charge gave the "Maximals" more of an explanation regarding his presence. {{storylink|Shattered Paths}} When they located their missing energy purifier, the Maximals went out to fetch it. Despite the new ability of Ironhide, Prowl, and Silverbolt to merge into [[Magnaboss (BW)|Magnaboss]], they were trounced by [[Piranacon (G1)#Classics|God Neptune]]. {{storylink|Shattered Hope}}

[[File:AnotherLight ironhide.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.0|Suddenly feeling very [[Derrick J. Wyatt|''Wyatt-y'']]...]]
Returning to the ship, the Maximals fueled up before joining Depth Charge, who had located the Matrix he was seeking. The Maximals kept a security system occupied long enough for Magnus to retrieve the Matrix in question, however a short time later they were confronted by Megatron piloting a giant mech. {{storylink|Shattered Balance}} Prowl again took part in merging into Magnaboss, but the combiner was soundly defeated by Megatron's [[Gigastorm Armor]]. The Maximals were moments later pulled into a dimensional rift created by Ultra Magnus. {{storylink|Shattered Destiny}}

Prowl and his Maximal compatriots wound up on modern era Cybertron in the negative polarity universe. After exchanging stories, they agreed to return to their own Earth (orbiting near this Cybertron) in order to confront Ultra Mammoth's [[Ultra Magnus (SG)|insane doppelgänger]], the instigator of their universal collapse. {{storylink|Falling into Place}}

After receiving a new motorcycle mode from designers [[Needlenose (SG)|Needlenose]] and [[Spinister (SG)|Spinister]], Prowl traveled by [[stellar spanner]] back to his Earth and joined the battle. {{storylink|Distant Fissures}} He was present when [[Nexus Prime]] arrived and reclaimed the [[Terminus Blade]], defeating evil Magnus. {{storylink|Restoration}}
{{-}}
==''Regeneration One''==
{{noteRG1}}
[[File:Autobots v zombies loose ends.jpg|thumb|upright=1.8]]
When Optimus Prime went to confront Megatron on the devastated Earth, he took Prowl and a detachment of Autobots with him. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 3}} They arrived on the scene just as the insane tyrant was about to kill [[Springer (G1)|Springer]]. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 4}} Prowl then fought against Megatron's reanimated [[zombie]] army as the two leaders clashed. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 5}}

After the battle, Prowl and [[Skids (G1)|Skids]] attended to [[Kup (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Kup]] as he recovered from a [[Scraplet]] infection. {{storylink|Natural Selection, Part One}} Upon returning to Cybertron aboard the ''[[Valiant (G1)|Valiant]]'', Prowl attended an emergency council with [[Hot Rod (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Hot Rod]], Kup, [[First Aid (G1)|First Aid]], [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]], [[Perceptor (G1)|Perceptor]], and [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]] to address the effects of [[Scorponok (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Scorponok]]'s [[Gene Key]] on the population. When Hot Rod later tried to help the situation with a rousing speech at [[Eugenesis Plaza]] it fell to Prowl, [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]], [[Streetwise (G1)|Streetwise]], and the [[Wreckers]] to contain the ensuing riot. {{storylink|Destiny, Part One}}

[[File:Prowl blaster destiny.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.9]]
Prowl and [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] checked in on [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]], [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]], [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]], and [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]] at the [[Garage]] after they were fitted out with new [[Nucleon (substance)|Nucleon]]-free bodies. Although they offered to help with the worsening situation outside, he was adamant that they should stay out of it until their new bodies had been thoroughly tested. Once Prowl had left, Baster decided to try anyway and by tapping into Decepticon communications discovered that [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] was broadcasting an irritant subsonic signal that increased aggression levels. After defeating the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]], the four Autobots reported this information to Prowl who shut down the intracomm for "essential maintenance", leaving Cybertron effectively blind to approaching threats. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Two}}

[[File:Prowl streetwise runamuck destiny.jpg|thumb|upright=2]]
Out on patrol with Red Alert and Streetwise, Prowl conferred with [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ultra Magnus]] regarding the Neo-Decepticons' strategy as they pulled over and arrested [[Runamuck (G1)|Runamuck]]. He reasoned that since all the key Neo-Decepticons had dropped out of sight, leaving only the small fry, the Autobots should conserve their resources and wait and see what the insurgents did next. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Three}}

Prowl was proven correct as a full-scale Decepticon assault soon began on Cybertron. The [[Warworld]] appeared over the planet and fired a horde of [[Blitz Engine]]s at its surface. At the [[Presidium (facility)|Presidium]], Prowl ordered Kup to be patient and hold the Wreckers in reserve until the proper surgical strike point for the unit could be identified. After some analysis, Prowl and Perceptor determined the Warworld must be broadcasting to the Blitz Engines, making it the Wreckers' target. When the Warworld fired a massive blast at the surface, Prowl ordered [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]] into action to combat the Blitz Engines. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Four}} Prowl then joined Ultra Magnus and others in holding the Presidium until the battle was finished. {{storylink|Destiny, Part Five}}

Afterwards, Prowl attended the leadership conference where Optimus officially ceded authority to the newly risen Rodimus Prime. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 1}} He was captured and held at [[Corral|The Corral]] when the Autobots went to war with [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] and the [[Hub (G2)|Hub Network]], but escaped with most of the warriors. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 4}} When they returned to Cybertron, the Autobots found it overrun by [[Shadow-leech|shadow-demons]] of the [[Dark Matrix]]. Prowl helped eliminate the entity's possessed puppets [[Galvatron II|Galvatron]] and [[Fortress Maximus (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Fortress Maximus]] on Earth and Nebulos, but Cybertron was lost. The Autobots left for the stars after that, hoping to spread peace instead of war. {{storylink|The War to End All Wars, Part 5}}
{{-}}

==''Transformers '84''==
{{storylink|Secrets & Lies issue 1|Secrets & Lies #1}}
After an "explosion" diverted the course of the planet Cybertron into the path of [[Stwllae Cimetera]], Double agent [[Punch (G1)|Punch]] was sent to inform the Autobots of Ratbat's suspicions; that Shockwave had intentionally fired one of the planet's turbines. Prowl chose to handle the problem without informing Optimus, with the Autobot Leader's attention focused on the Ark launch. He sent in Perceptor and the Dynobots to investigate deep in enemy territory. {{storylink|Secrets & Lies issue 1|Secrets & Lies #1}} Prowl took a group of Autobots to view the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]] for the first time before they launched. While everyone was mostly in high spirits, he reminded them that the mission they would undertake was extremely perilous and vital to Cybertron's safety. He was among the ship's crew when it was attacked by Megatron. And so began the story of... THE TRANSFORMERS {{storylink|Transformers '84 issue 0|'84 #0}}

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Action Masters]]
[[Category:Autobot leaders]]
[[Category:Classics Autobots]]
[[Category:Marvel Generation 1 Autobots]]
[[Category:Marvel Generation 2 Autobots]]
[[Category:Regeneration One Autobots]]
[[Category:Security officers]]
[[Category:Strategists]]

Bluestreak (G1)

2023-03-23T10:35:14Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Transformers '84 */

{{factions|autobot|cobra|wreckers|primusvanguard}}
{{disambig3|Bluestreak}}{{suite}}
:''Bluestreak is an [[Autobot]] from the [[Generation 1 continuity family|Generation 1]] [[continuity family]].''
[[File:Anime Bluestreak boxart.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|I'm f***ing PONDEROUS, man. PONDEROUS, f***in' PONDEROUS.]]
'''Bluestreak''' (aka '''Silverstreak'''<ref name="silver">"Silverstreak" was [[Hasbro]]'s substitute name for numerous new toys of Bluestreak between 2004 and 2010 because the name "Bluestreak" was not available to them as a [[trademark]] at the time. Hasbro finally managed to reacquire the name "Bluestreak" in 2010 and first used it for a toy of a [[Bluestreak (Speed Stars)|new character]] from the [[live-action film series]] simply to keep the trademark. In the meantime, the name "Silverstreak" had also been used in fiction, namely in [[IDW Publishing|IDW]]'s [[The Transformers (IDW)|2009-2011 ongoing series]] and the 2010 [[The Transformers: Ironhide|''Ironhide'' miniseries]]. He was finally referred to as "Bluestreak" again in 2012's [[City on Fire|issue 12]] of ''[[The Transformers: Robots in Disguise|Robots in Disguise]]''. Surprisingly, the name "Silverstreak" was ''still'' used in the 2012-onwards [[Transformers Legends (mobile game)|''Transformers Legends'' mobile game]].</ref>) is a talker. He talks a lot. Any subject, any time of the day, his lips are flapping while his Autobot comrades are rolling their eyes. Could be about things on Earth, could be about things on Cybertron, could be about just about anything, but the point is, y'know, he's talking. Words are coming out of his mouth in a near constant prattling stream. Some think he's vapid, that his mouth just moves a billion times faster than his brain, if his brain is moving at all. Or they imagine that he's a fool who doesn't know when to shut up, that he drones on and on and on and on because maybe he just likes to hear himself speak or something.

His friends realize, however, that his jabbering hides a deeper pain. At the beginning of the [[Great War (G1)|war]], Bluestreak's [[Praxus|home city]] was totally destroyed by [[Decepticon]]s. He was the only survivor. It's as if by talking he tries to drown out his own fears and memories somehow. "There's some demons runnin' loose inside that boy," says [[Hound (G1)|Hound]], "and sometimes I think they grab hold of him and won't let him go." He hated war, he still does, but ever since, he's hated Decepticons even more. It is odd to see a bot of peace so willingly take up arms, but Bluestreak's got a score to settle.

Talk may be cheap, but it keeps him sane.

==Fiction==
===Marvel Comics continuity===
====Marvel ''The Transformers'' comics====
{{noteukonly}}
[[File:Bluestreakandthereshallcome.jpg|left|upright=0.85|thumb|"The War Within" forgot about this design... thankfully!]]
''Millions of years ago on [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]], Bluestreak was escorted by [[Fusion]] on a mission to deliver shatter bombs to the Autobot military commander [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus Prime]]. Fusion was focused on picking off the Decepticon jets which were hounding his partner when a blast from one of these Decepticons killed Fusion. Bluestreak was able to complete the mission thanks to his friend's efforts, but he swore revenge.'' {{storylink|And There Shall Come...a Leader!}}

[[File:Miragebluestreakfirst.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|You can taste his sarcasm. To be fair, nobody likes Mirage.]]
Bluestreak arrived on [[Earth]] with his fellow Autobots four million years ago and remained inactive until [[1984]]. Along with [[Mirage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Mirage]] and [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]], Bluestreak was one of the less sympathetic of the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]]'s crew when it came to humans. {{storylink|The Transformers (issue)|The Transformers}} In an early mission in the [[United Kingdom]], he provided covering fire for an Autobot convoy, using his sharpshooting skills to knock [[Thundercracker (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Thundercracker]] out of the sky with '''one shot'''. Don't mess. {{storylink|Man of Iron (issue)|Man of Iron}}

He suggested repairing the Ark and simply abandoning Earth's people to the Decepticons after learning that [[Sparkplug Witwicky]] had allegedly provided their foes with a fuel conversion process while he was their prisoner. Despite their conflicting views, Optimus Prime still recognized Bluestreak's skill as a sharpshooter and chose him to be one of the five Autobots recharged in the [[Tubes of Transference]], in the hopes that at least some Autobots would be at full capacity when the inevitable Decepticon attack came. When it did, Bluestreak was brazen enough to attack [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]] himself, head-on. Despite their temporary victory, the battle-weary Autobots were blindsided by the returning Decepticon [[Shockwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Shockwave]], who knocked them all down with a single blast. {{storylink|The Last Stand}}

Bluestreak was hung from the ceiling of the Ark, prepared by Shockwave to be used as spare parts for the next generation of Decepticons. {{storylink|The New Order}} [[Ratchet (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ratchet]] beheld him in this sad state as the last surviving Autobot infiltrated the now Decepticon-controlled ship {{storylink|Warrior School!}} but the medic managed to re-secure the Ark, and Bluestreak was subsequently rebuilt. Afterwards, to make sure all of the Autobots were back in fighting shape, Ratchet had Bluestreak and the others go on a diagnostics run through the open plains. {{storylink|DIS-Integrated Circuits!}}

[[File:Bumblebeebluestreakbrainstorm.jpg|left|upright=1.4|thumb|Will talk without end for forever about nothing at all, yet doesn't mention that Prowl is speaking from Ratchet's body.]]
During a mission to stop [[Soundwave (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Soundwave]] from broadcasting a transmission to their Decepticon brethren back on Cybertron, Bluestreak was one of the first Autobots to confront the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]]. This effort almost ended badly when the Constructicons revealed they could merge into the mighty [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]], but Bluestreak and the others were saved by Huffer and the human trucker [[Bomber Bill]]. {{storylink|The Next Best Thing to Being There!}} It soon became apparent to the Autobots that [[Buster Witwicky (G1)|Buster Witwicky]]'s life was in danger so long as he carried the [[Matrix of Leadership|Creation Matrix]] while the Decepticons kept hostage the head of Optimus Prime, so Bluestreak and [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]] were assigned to guard him. Bluestreak's embarrassing line of questioning about what [[kiss]]ing entailed was interrupted when he and Bumblebee were attacked by [[Laserbeak (G1)|Laserbeak]]. Bluestreak reacted quickly, taking the Decepticon out with a blast from his [[Ion-charge disperser rifle|ion-dispenser rifle]], but was less prepared when the pair were assaulted by the Decepticon prototype warrior [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]]. After he suffered heavy wounds, his life was saved once again by a human; Buster Witwicky used the power of the Creation Matrix to disassemble Jetfire before their eyes. {{storylink|Brainstorm!}}

[[File:Arkchristmastree.jpg|right|thumb|250px|This moment where Bluestreak tells someone ELSE to be quiet will be stricken from the record.]]

''As the Witwickys celebrated [[Christmas]] at the Ark, Bluestreak argued with [[Prowl (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Prowl]] over the strategic value and social utility of a Christmas tree. The two Autobots concluded that Optimus participated in the Earth's bizarre rituals as a show of gratitude towards Buster for carrying the Matrix of Creation for him in the Autobots' time of need.'' {{storylink|Christmas Breaker!}} ''Bluestreak was one of the Autobots involved in the argument over Prowl's plan to create dedicated Autobot warriors using the Matrix, siding with those in favor of creating "[[Ultimate Autobot]]s." {{storylink|Crisis of Command!}} He was also at the Ark when attacked by [[Peter Anthony Morris]] using the Dinobot, [[Swoop (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Swoop]].'' {{storylink|The Icarus Theory}}

While Bluestreak and Bumblebee were helping Buster, Optimus Prime had been restored, but not without cost to the Autobot ranks. To help offset this, Bluestreak and Mirage assisted with the [[Rite of the Autobrand]] on Jetfire, whom Optimus Prime had recently given life. {{storylink|Rock and Roll-Out!}}

''During the Dinobot Hunt, Bluestreak was sent with [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] and [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]] to [[Doonstown]] to capture the berserk [[Grimlock (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Grimlock]], but they were surprised to find Grimlock locked in battle with [[Sludge (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Sludge]]. Bluestreak was the first member of the team down, deactivated by the crazed Dinobots before he had a chance to react.'' {{storylink|Dinobot Hunt!}}

When Bumblebee was targeted by the Decepticons, Bluestreak was part of the Autobot squad dispatched to intercept the enemy and rescue his friend. {{storylink|Plight of the Bumblebee!}} ''He was also present at the Ark shortly before Optimus Prime's first encounter with the [[Predacon (G1)|Predacons]].'' {{storylink|Prey!}}

[[File:Newyorkunderbase.jpg|upright=0.85|thumb|left|And the rest... is silence.]]

During Grimlock's command, Bluestreak left the Ark to cheer beside the other Autobots as they watched Grimlock fight [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]] on Earth's [[Moon (moon)|moon]] for Autobot leadership. The bout was interrupted by a Decepticon attack, and though the evil robots managed to strike a devastating first blow, Blaster and Grimlock managed to put their differences aside long enough to lead their troops together. Many Autobots were badly damaged in the ensuing scuffle, though Bluestreak was still standing after the Decepticons had been sent into a retreat. {{storylink|Totaled!}} After Blaster rejoined the Autobots, Bluestreak helped put him through his paces in a training exercise. {{storylink|Club Con!}} Later, Bluestreak was among the Autobots who responded to a distress call sent by Buster in close proximity to the Decepticons' Arctic base. A battle between the two factions erupted, though it came to an abrupt end when all involved learned that [[Starscream (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Starscream]] was manipulating them. Autobots and Decepticons joined forces to stop the treacherous Seeker from absorbing the power of the [[Underbase]], but Starscream managed to take into himself enough to render him nigh-unstoppable. Several squads were formed and planted in key cities to stop Starscream's rampage across the globe, Bluestreak getting stationed in [[New York City|New York]]. There, he was overwhelmed by Starscream, but not before some choice words. Starscream noted that Bluestreak spoke "freely, but foolishly," and ended his life, along many others', with little effort. {{storylink|Dark Star}}
{{-}}

====''Transformers '84''====
Four million years ago, Bluestreak was among a group of Autobots who joined Optimus Prime as part of the Ark's crew. Hoping for a change of scenery, he was unaware of the missions true purpose; the sacrifice of Optimus and some of the Autobot's finest in a trap to save the universe from Megatron's tyranny. With The Ark's hull breached by Megatron and his Decepticon forces, the crew valiantly fight for their lives. And so begins the story of... THE TRANSFORMERS {{storylink|Transformers '84 issue 0|'84 #0}}

===Generation 1 cartoon continuity===
====''The Transformers'' cartoon====
{{voiceactor|[[Casey Kasem]] (English), [[Kōki Kataoka]] (Japanese), [[Masashi Ebara]] (Japanese, "More Than Meets the Eye, Part 3", "Divide and Conquer" & "SOS Dinobots"), [[Takurō Kitagawa]] (Japanese, "The Immobilizer"), [[Yoku Shioya]] (Japanese, "Enter the Nightbird"), [[Toshio Ishii]] (Japanese, "Microbots"), [[Kenyū Horiuchi]] (Japanese, "Trans-Europe Express"), [[Keiichi Nanba]] (Japanese, "Fire on the Mountain"), [[Katsumi Suzuki]] (Japanese, "Attack of the Autobots", "Day of the Machines")|[[Liu Qin]] (Chinese), [[Ulises Cuadra]] (Latin-American Spanish), [[Mário Monjardim]] (Brazilian Portuguese), [[Dario de Castro]] (Portuguese, "S.O.S. Dinobots" & "War of the Dinobots"), [[Ayrton Cardoso]] (Portuguese, "The Ultimate Doom, Part 2"), [[Christian Weygand]] (German, ''Generation 2'' dubs of "More Than Meets The Eye, Part 3" & "S.O.S. Dinobots"), [[Georges Atlas]] (European French), [[Jacques Ferrière]] (European French, "City of Steel", "Enter the Nightbird" & "A Prime Problem"), [[Henry Djanik]] (European French, "Trans-Europe Express")}}

[[File:MTMTE3 Bluestreak rescues Ironhide.jpg|thumb|upright=1.34|Bluestreak talks about how he's gonna save Ironhide]]
Bluestreak was one of the original crew members of the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]] when it set off from Cybertron in search of new sources of fuel and energy. Attacked en route by the Decepticon flagship ''[[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]]'', the Ark crashed into a volcano, and the Autobots lay dormant for millions of years. When the volcano erupted and activated [[Teletraan I]] in 1984, Bluestreak was reformatted into a Datsun 280Z. Shortly after Hound and [[Cliffjumper (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Cliffjumper]] discovered [[Megatron (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Megatron]]'s plans, Bluestreak was part of the Autobot battle group dispatched to follow Megatron's raid on an off-shore oil rig, despite not having been ordered to do so. {{storylink|More than Meets the Eye, Part 1}}

After rescuing the humans, he was also among the Autobots who responded to the Decepticon attack on [[Sherman Dam]] and the [[ruby crystal mines of Burma]]. {{storylink|More than Meets the Eye, Part 2}}. Then, when the Decepticons managed to extricate themselves from the mine explosion, Bluestreak and [[Ironhide (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Ironhide]] took to the air and engaged in a dogfight with [[Skywarp (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Skywarp]]. He avoided injury, but abandoned the chase when Ironhide was shot down and managed to drag his friend to safety after a water landing. {{storylink|More than Meets the Eye, Part 3}}

[[File:G1 Prowl Bluestreak Rollforit.jpg|left|upright=1.1|thumb|Prowl always dreads the family reunions.]]
After Megatron was seemingly lost forever inside the [[space bridge]], the Autobots thwarted an ill-planned Decepticon attack on yet another hydroelectric power plant under the command of [[Starscream (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Starscream]]. Chasing after the escaping Decepticons, Bluestreak managed to damage both Starscream and Thundercracker significantly with a single blast from his shoulder cannons. He and [[Prowl (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Prowl]] followed the fleeing villains to a human aircraft hangar, from which the Decepticons were scavenging parts. Bluestreak accused Starscream of having a [[Anatomic euphemism#Manifold|manifold]] for a mouth. It was hilarious, but both Autobots were outnumbered when [[Soundwave (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Soundwave]] unleashed [[Ravage (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Ravage]]. Fortunately, their human friend [[Chip Chase]] took control of Prowl's systems and sent the Decepticons packing. {{storylink|Roll for It}}

Bluestreak accompanied Ironhide, [[Bumblebee (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Bumblebee]], and [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] to Cybertron to get a [[cosmitron]] for the dying [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Optimus Prime]]. He was attacked by the [[Rainmaker]]s' [[acid rain]] just outside of [[Wheeljack's workshop]] and was nearly deactivated. Once given a pep talk by [[Chip Chase]], he shot down the Rainmakers, enabling the Autobots to get the cosmitron. {{storylink|Divide and Conquer}} Bluestreak was present during the unveiling of the [[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]] and responded in awe. Later on, he was with the Autobots during the Decepticon ambush at the [[Great Falls]]. He shot at [[Rumble (G1)|Rumble]], but was unable to hit him. Defeated, the Autobots were all tied up by the Decepticons. [[Wheeljack (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Wheeljack]] used Bluestreak's bolt gun to give the Autobots an instant recharge {{storylink|S.O.S. Dinobots}} Bluestreak was in the Autobot group who flew with [[Jetfire (G1)|Skyfire]] to [[Peru]]. He fried [[Laserbeak (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Laserbeak]] during one of the skirmishes, and used his lights so Skyfire could see Wheeljack. {{storylink|Fire on the Mountain (episode)|Fire on the Mountain}} When the New Dinobots were created, Bluestreak was one of the Autobots selected for a mock battle against [[Snarl (G1)|Snarl]] and [[Swoop (G1)|Swoop]]. He was defeated along with the rest of the group and jokingly commented on the battle saying they would have won if it was real... Maybe. {{storylink|War of the Dinobots}}

[[File:UltimateDoom2 Bluestreak and Windcharger.jpg|thumb|upright=1.45|Sometimes I wish I could [[Star Trek|boldly go where no man has gone before]], but I'll probably just stay in Aurora. What're you thinking about?]]
Bluestreak's skill as a gunner was frequently employed in combat. On one occasion, Laserbeak was trying to fly off with [[Spike Witwicky (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Spike Witwicky]], and Bluestreak was able to target and shoot one of the tin turkey's legs without hitting Spike to free him. {{storylink|The Ultimate Doom, Part 2}} When the Autobots surfed towards the Decepticons, he was the first to notice the tidal wave about to engulf the group. {{storylink|The Ultimate Doom, Part 3}} He was present with the rest of Autobots during the staged battle between Optimus Prime and Megatron. {{storylink|Heavy Metal War}}

Some of Bluestreak's spare parts were used on Sparkplug's [[Autobot X (G1)|Autobot X]], including one of the door-wings. Later Bluestreak was one of the Autobots that went to go help Autobot Spike during his confusion. {{storylink|Autobot Spike}} Bluestreak was one of the Autobots that reacted to a Decepticon attack at a mining colony and also present at the Ark when Megatron's solar needle caused an avalanche. He had to run away from a boulder to avoid being crushed by it. {{storylink|Changing Gears}} Bluestreak accompanied Optimus Prime to [[New York City]] to stop Megatron from converting the city into his base. He was the first to notice Prime's missing arm on top of the [[Empire State Building]] and later blasted a subway car piloted by [[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]]. {{storylink|City of Steel (episode)|City of Steel}}

[[File:Bluestreakg1.jpg|left|upright=1.34|thumb|You get the feeling Blurr trained under this guy at some point.]]
Bluestreak was a victim of Megatron's [[personality destabilizer device]] that was placed in the Autobots' recharging chambers. Once under Decepticon control, Bluestreak attacked Bumblebee and tried to make him recharge, but was disabled by [[Jazz (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Jazz]]. After regaining consciousness, he was the first to be brought back using Sparkplug's new invention, the [[attitude exchanger]]. Afterward, he accompanied Jazz and Sparkplug to return the other Autobots to normal. When they needed to get Skyfire's attention, Bluestreak fired at him with the results they wanted. {{storylink|Attack of the Autobots (episode)|Attack of the Autobots}}

Bluestreak was present in the Ark when Cliffjumper first accused Mirage of being a traitor and also present later when Mirage was being repaired and Cliffjumper was accusing him again. {{storylink|Traitor (episode)|Traitor}} Bluestreak was the second Autobot to be hit by the Immobilizer when the Autobots went to retrieve it. {{storylink|The Immobilizer}}

[[File:Immobilizer Bluestreak immobilized.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|Now I really am Silverstreak!]]
Bluestreak participated in the Autobot race for charity. He was hit by the [[Transfixatron]], rendering him unable to transform. Then [[Starscream (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Starscream]] and [[Thundercracker (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Thundercracker]] disabled him. He was later one of the first to be restored by the [[anti-transfixation grenade]]. {{storylink|The Autobot Run}} Bluestreak assisted with the Autobot attempt to recapture the irreplaceable robot ninja [[Nightbird (G1)|Nightbird]] for the famous scientist [[Doctor Fujiyama the Famous Scientist|Doctor Fujiyama]] after the Decepticons turned her against humanity. Optimus Prime was insistent the Autobots not shoot or harm Nightbird, but Bluestreak saved Prime anyway from the attacking ninja by cleanly shooting Nightbird's laser [[sword]] out of her hands. {{storylink|Enter the Nightbird}}

Bluestreak was around when the Autobots were confused about who was the real Optimus Prime when Megatron's clone infiltrated the Autobot base. {{storylink|A Prime Problem}} He was part of the attack against the Decepticons to try to get [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] on the Autobot side. He succeeded in knocking all three seeker jets out of the sky with a missile barrage, but was later kicked down by Devastator. {{storylink|The Core}} Bluestreak suddenly appeared in the group of Autobots that attacked the Decepticons in [[South America]]. {{storylink|Microbots}} Bluestreak was present when Optimus Prime thanked Spike, Carly, and the Dinobots for what they did for the Autobots. {{storylink|Desertion of the Dinobots, Part 2}}

Bluestreak was in the group of Autobots that responded to the distress call from the [[Haley Observatory]]. They were late and Megatron got away with the [[Voltronic Galaxer]]. {{storylink|Blaster Blues}} Bluestreak was part of the second Autobot group that tried to attack the electrum-covered Decepticons, but was defeated. He was later present in the battle at the golden lagoon, which ended in victory for the Autobots {{storylink|The Golden Lagoon (episode)|The Golden Lagoon}} When [[Kremzeek]], attacked Bluestreak was one of the many Autobots deactivated before [[Sparkplug Witwicky]] was able to coat a few with insulating foam. {{storylink|Kremzeek!}}

[[File:TripleTakeover Bluestreak Altmode.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.1]]
Bluestreak entered [[Blitzwing (G1)|Blitzwing]]'s zone defense around the football stadium, but was severely damaged and built into a throne by [[Scrapper (G1)|Scrapper]]. {{storylink|Triple Takeover}} When the Decepticons took control of the [[Key to Vector Sigma]], Bluestreak left the base when the Autobots left to attack them. {{storylink|The Key to Vector Sigma, Part 2}}

[[File:TransEuropeExpress riding Wildrider.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgUbRpdUN1w|"What did they expect? THIS!"]]]
Along with several fellow Autobots, Bluestreak participated in the [[Europa 2000]], an international charity race stretching from Paris to Istanbul. When the arrogant racing driver [[Auggie Cahnay (G1)|Auggie Cahnay]] cut across Bumblebee, an indignant Bluestreak helped his understandably angry friend catch up to the American and attempt to teach him some manners. Later, after running afoul of the [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]], Bluestreak learned of Megatron's plan for the [[Pearl of Bahoudin]] from [[Teranova|Professor Teranova]] and deduced that the missing Autobots must have been disabled by the Stunticons.

[[File:Trans-europe-express-bluestreak-reacts.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.1]] After Cahnay's car was stolen by the Decepticons to use as raw materials for a weather control machine, Bluestreak allowed the hotshot driver to race him to victory at the finish line. Together, Bluestreak, [[Tracks (G1)|Tracks]] and Bumblebee headed out to confront the Decepticons, but when the Pearl was lost in a tornado, Megatron unleashed [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]] onto the Autobots. Ironically, it was Cahnay who defeated Menasor by sacrificing his car, much to Bluestreak's surprise. {{storylink|Trans-Europe Express}} Bluestreak was at the Autobot base after the Stunticons were captured by the other Autobots. {{storylink|Masquerade}}

In the year [[2005]], Bluestreak helped [[Kup (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Kup]] move a roadblock on [[Lookout Mountain]], just before [[Hot Rod (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Hot Rod]] and [[Daniel Witwicky (G1)|Daniel Witwicky]] crashed through it. {{storylink|The Transformers: The Movie}}

{{note|The noticeable lack of shoulder cannons means the [[Character model|animation model]] used for Bluestreak's brief appearance in ''The Transformers: The Movie'' was actually Prowl's.}}
{{charstubfiction|{{storylink|The Ultimate Doom, Part 1}} {{storylink|Megatron's Master Plan, Part 1}} {{storylink|Megatron's Master Plan, Part 2}} {{storylink|Prime Target (episode)|Prime Target}}}}

====Japanese Generation 1 cartoon continuity====
=====''The Transformers Collection'' bios=====
On [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]], [[Ricochet (Headmasters)|Ricochet]] often had marksmanship contests with his friends [[Fusion]] and Bluestreak. {{storylink|Ricochet (Headmasters)#The Transformers Collection|''The Transformers Collection'' Ricochet bio}}

=====''The Battle of the Star Gate''=====
Bluestreak was part of a team of Autobots who attended the field-test for the [[C-X]]. As Optimus and the C-X unit battled one another during the test, Bluestreak suggested ways to improve the C-X's A.I. and targeting systems. When the C-X suddenly went berserk, Bluestreak jumped into action to help out Optimus Prime against it. The C-X unit simply kicked Bluestreak out of its way, leaving Optimus to disable it on his own. {{storylink|Divided Views}}

Bluestreak was amongst the Autobots who once more confronted Megatron and his Decepticons at the'' [[Trigger]]'' in Earth orbit. When Starscream combined himself with the Trigger to create a powerful new body for himself, Bluestreak had to contend with the volley of asteroids thrown towards both Autobots and Decepticons from Starscream's star gate. He was then almost sucked into a portal to a black hole when Starscream neared defeat, but was instead sent plummeting down to Earth when Optimus and Megatron worked together to defeat Starscream. {{storylink|The Battle of the Star Gate}}

=====''Story of Binaltech''=====
[[File:BinaltechStreakBoxArt.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|Doors of silver, nerves of steel.]]
Suffering from the [[Cosmic Rust (disease)|Cosmic Rust]] virus, Bluestreak was one of the first Autobots reconstructed using [[Binaltech (technology)|Binaltech]] technology. Alongside [[Smokescreen (G1)|Smokescreen]], [[Hound (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Hound]], [[Tracks (G1)|Tracks]], and [[Sideswipe (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Sideswipe]], he helped [[Earth Defense Command]] drive the Decepticons off of Earth. Bluestreak continued serving on Earth at Autobot City, under [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Ultra Magnus]]'s overall command. {{storylink|Binaltech Is... (Chapter 2)|Binaltech Is...}}

======BT World======
As the conflict raged on, thanks to the time- and space-warping actions of both [[Ravage (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Ravage]] and a mysterious entity known as [[Optimus Primal (BW)/Beast Wars cartoon continuity|The Protector]], the events of the Binaltech conflict were branched off to become their own, distinct parallel universe (the "[[BT World]]") separate from [[G1 World|the "mainstream" timeline]]. {{storylink|Binal Time}}

When the spark of Prowl from the "BT World" was lost in interdimensional [[unspace|subspace]], it re-emerged in the mainstream timeline, and was discovered by Bluestreak and the other Autobots. Soon after, a strange energy surge came across the dimensions from the "BT World" and made contact with Prowl's spark, driving into a dangerously unstable state. To save the life of this Prowl he had never even known, Bluestreak tracked the energy back across the dimensions and traveled to the "BT World", meeting up with the local versions of [[Grimlock (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Grimlock]] and "[[Prowl II]]" (a duplicate Prowl powered by the consciousness of [[Chip Chase]]). The pair brought him back to the Autobots' headquarters, where he explained the situation to Ultra Magnus. {{storylink|Unfinished Business, Part 1}}

Jazz used the data Bluestreak had brought with him to pinpoint the source of the energy surge. During the subsequent raid, Bluestreak and the Autobots discovered that the surge was the work of [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]] and the [[Concurrence]], who were using a subspace node to drain energy from Prowl's spark, which they then used to power a giant robot made of synthetic [[electrum]]. Once Jazz had taken out the node, Bluestreak took down the robot with some well-placed shots. They were then contacted by [[Overdrive]] from Bluestreak's dimension, who reported that Prowl's spark had stabilized, but that it would be too dangerous to send it back through subspace unshielded. Instead, Chip's consciousness was removed from the "Prowl II" body and returned to his human frame, and the Binaltech shell was then taken back across the dimensions by Bluestreak so Prowl's spark could be implanted in it. {{storylink|Unfinished Business, Part 2}}

=====Controverse=====
Bluestreak was present at the trial of [[Primacron]] when the Decepticons crashed the party. {{storylink|Controverse}}

=====''Masterpiece'' toy bios=====
Unknown to Bluestreak, a genetic command was secretly implanted into him by [[Anterior Zeta]] of the [[Diadem]] facility. Inspired by [[Spin-Out (G1)|Spin-Out]]'s data from another universe, it was an anti-[[Waruder]] program that activated when Bluestreak was met with a [[Probe Insecter]] {{storylink|Spin-Out (G1)#Masterpiece|''Masterpiece'' Spin-Out bio}} in [[Asia]]. His colors changing to a blue scheme inspired by his [[Diaclone (faction)|Diaclone]] counterpart, Bluestreak went awry and into hiding, to the confusion of the [[Autobot]]s, who didn't know who this unknown, yet similar to Bluestreak, robot was. {{storylink|Bluestreak (G1)/toys#MP18B|''Masterpiece'' Bluestreak bio}}

====''Cloud''====
The Bluestreak of "OG001 Spacetime" was caught up in the tussle between the [[Optimus Prime (Cloud)|Optimus Prime]] and [[Megatron (Cloud)|Megatron]] of [[Cloud World]] when they came to his spacetime. {{storylink|TFC-A01}}

===Marvel Storybooks continuity===
Bluestreak was among the Autobots who confronted Megatron at the Decepticon fortress over the Global building crisis. {{storylink|Battle for Earth}}

===Marvel coloring books===
With Sparkplug acting as their referee, Bluestreak and Sideswipe raced one another in order to determine who was the fastest. The race ended in a tie, with Sparkplug declaring them both winners. Just then, Thundercracker and Starscream swooped down onto the trio, and cast [[Sleep Net]]s unto them, rendering them unconscious. Bluestreak was brought to Megatron's newly constructed prison, and was incarcerated within. Luckily, Bumblebee had not been captured, and managed to free the other Autobots. Upon their escape, Bluestreak and Sideswipe shot Starscream and Thundercracker out of the sky. {{storylink|Bumblebee to the Rescue!}}

Bluestreak spotted the Decepticons attacking Sparkplug and Buster Witwicky. He charged to their rescue, and with the help of the other Autobots, saved both of the humans. He later helped the Autobots protect the Hoover Dam. {{storylink|The Deadly Fuel Shortage}}

Bluestreak was one of the many Autobots who followed Optimus into battle when it was discovered that the Decepticons were stealing fuel from all across the globe with the help of a [[molecular transfer device]]. {{storylink|Summertime Coloring Book}}

{{charstubfiction|{{storylink|A Message From Outer Space}} {{storylink|Bumblebee's Dangerous Mission}} {{storylink|The Big Book of Coloring Fun}}}}

===Big Looker storybooks continuity===
Upon awakening on Earth after being offline for about 65 million years, Bluestreak was one of the Autobots who attempted to take the Decepticons by surprise while the evil robots still did not know what Earth forms the Autobots had taken. Though they successfully took by surprise a squadron of Decepticons, the Autobots had not anticipated a second group flying in from the opposite direction. Thanks to a warning from Spike and Sparkplug, the Autobots managed to fend off the Decepticons, and came to accept Earth as their new home. {{storylink|Battle for Cybertron}}

===Decepticon Poison===
{{notemultipath}}
Bluestreak was amongst the Autobots getting topped up with their latest batch of fuel when Red Alert burst into Autobot headquarters, warning everyone about Ramjet being spotted nearby. The Autobots’ latest batch of fuel had been poisoned by the fleeing Decepticon, leaving Bluestreak unable to transform.

In one possible sequence of events that ensued, Perceptor gave out the right amount of an antidote the Autobot scientist had created, allowing Bluestreak to resume his robot form and take arms against an incoming squadron of Decepticons. The antidote having given Bluestreak and the rest of the cured Autobots a case of battle fever, the bunch were eager to take on the Decepticons head on in combat. The more level-head Prowl suggested instead a more conniving approach, where the Autobots would ambush their assailants.

If Optimus allowed Bluestreak and the rest of the refuelled Autobots to venture headlong into battle, the group fond themselves fighting against Megatron himself, accompanied by a squad of Decepticon jets. Though Bluestreak's squad started out strong, they soon found themselves overpowered by Megatron, prompting Optimus to lead a second wave into battle. The second wave soon ran out of fuel, prompting the Autobots to call a retreat. Thankfully, the Decepticons were damaged enough through the course of the battle, causing them to retreat as well.

If Optimus instead followed Prowl's plan, he instructed Bluestreak and the others to transform into [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]] and play dead. The Decepticons, believing the Autobots to be already dead, disarmed themselves in order to carry out the Autobots’ “carcasses.” Now with the element of surprise against unarmed opponent, the Autobots Transformed and were able to easily defeat the evil robots.

In another possible turn of events, Perceptor gave out too much of his antidote to each Autobot. Though Bluestreak initially cheered, finding himself able to transform once more, he soon found himself literally falling to pieces. The Autobots finding themselves completely outmatched against an all-out Decepticon attack were made short work of by the Decepticons.

In yet another possible scenario, the Autobots used the tainted fuel to create a toxic cloud that successfully fended off the Decepticons attack. This plan gave Perceptor the time he needed to cure Bluestreak and the others with his antidote. Their ranks fully replenished and the Decepticons turning tail meant the Autobots had earned themselves another victory.

In completely different possible sequence of events, Optimus successfully retrieved the antidote to the poison from the Decepticons’ poison lab, and with Ratchet's help, brought Bluestreak and the rest of the poisoned Autobots back from the precipice of death. Now cured, the Autobots discussed their next course of action; they had to prevent the Decepticons from poisoning the nearby water reservoir.

If Optimus decided to head for the water reservoir, Bluestreak was one of the Autobots who accompanied him. In one possible scenario, confronted with a swarm of Decepticon jets crowding over the water reservoir, Bluestreak and the other Autobots attempted to lure the Decepticons away from the reservoir, and into a nearby forest where the Autobots would have some cover. Finding themselves under heavy fire before they could reach the treeline, the Autobots were forced to fight back in the open. Bluestreak was then killed by Megatron. {{storylink|Decepticon Poison}}

===Ladybird Books continuity===
Bluestreak chuckled at [[Gears (G1)|Gears]] and [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]]'s efforts to create a lightning collector, while giving what can only be described as a demon-hillbilly grin that will haunt your dreams until your dying day. {{storylink|Autobots' Lightning Strike}}

===Dreamwave ''Generation One'' continuity===
{{notekeepers}}
When the Autobot/Decepticon war first erupted over 8.7 million years ago, Bluestreak's home city-state of [[Praxus]] was utterly destroyed. ''The entire population of Praxus was killed, with Bluestreak, who had been protected by [[Ramjet (G1)|Ramjet]]'s troops, being the sole exception. This was a deliberate action on Megatron's part, as he wanted a sole survivor to bear witness to his power, and spread his message of terror.'' {{storylink|Transformers: Hardwired|Hardwired}} Originally a merchant, Bluestreak then joined the Autobot army. 500,000 years later, he visited his friend [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optronix]] at the [[Vaults]] and related [[Sentinel Prime (G1)|Sentinel Prime]]'s death, {{storylink|The War Within issue 1|The War Within #1}} and later served in the last-ditch attempt to defend [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]] from [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]]'s forces. {{storylink|The War Within issue 5|The War Within #5}}

7.4 million years ago, Bluestreak remained with the Autobot faction after the apparent death of Optimus Prime. He and [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] remained at [[Autobase]] while [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] led a task force against [[Trypticon (G1)|Trypticon]]. While there, they met [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]] and apprised him of the current situation on [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]. {{storylink|Devastation}} Prowl's task force soon ran into trouble however, as Trypticon turned out to be more than they could handle. Bluestreak headed out into the field as part of a group of reinforcements to aid in the conflict. Everything the Autobots threw at Trypticon still wasn't enough to defeat the giant however, and the Autobots only survived because their enemy was called away mid-battle. {{storylink|Revelation (The Dark Ages)|Revelation}} 1.4 million years later, Bluestreak and an Autobot/Decepticon/[[Ultracon]] force helped defend a peace ceremony at [[Tyger Pax]] from the [[Predacon (War Within)|Predacons]]. They were successful against the Predacons, but soon fell before the return of Megatron, and his [[Air Warrior|Aerospace Extermination Squadron]], ushering in the Age of Internment. {{storylink|The Age of Wrath}} At this time, Bluestreak was among the many unfortunate Autobots who were captured an enslaved, forced to dig down to Cybertron's core in one of the Decepticons' labor camps. {{storylink|The Age of Wrath Pt.2}}

{{unreleased WW comic}}
Optimus returned to Cybertron, and the Autobots were freed from slavery. {{Storylink|The Age of Wrath Pt.6}}

Bluestreak was among the crew of the ''[[Ark (G1)|Ark]]'' when it crashed on [[Earth]] 4 million years ago, and awoke in 1984 to battle the Decepticons. After years of fighting, Bluestreak and the other Autobots took part in [[Operation Liberation]] in 1998, a joint human/Autobot operation that defeated and captured the Earth-bound Decepticons. However, the ''[[Ark II]]'', which was meant to convey the Autobots, the captured Decepticons, and a number of humans back to Cybertron, was sabotaged by General [[Robert Hallo]], sending Bluestreak and his comrades to the bottom of the [[Arctic|Arctic Ocean]].

Bluestreak was later recovered by the sinister [[Lazarus]], and his deactivated form was used to power [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron's]] deadly metal virus weapon, after the Decepticons broke free of Lazarus's control. By the time he was rescued by Optimus Prime, Bluestreak's energy had been almost fatally depleted. {{storylink|Prime Directive issue 4|Prime Directive #4}}

''Bluestreak recovered, however, and rejoined his newly active comrades. He was with Optimus Prime and [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] in Tokyo, Japan, trying to rebuild their rep with the humans when Megatron attacked. During the battle, a lattice of red and blue energy struck down from the heavens, scooping up the four Transformers and over 200 humans in the immediate area, blasting them back out into space. Their hosts were a group of enigmatic beings known as the [[Keeper (species)|Keepers]], who were transporting them through deep space to their base of operations, the [[Labyrinth]]. During their travels, Bluestreak was forced to experience a full-sensory recreation of Praxus, and its last hours before Megatron destroyed it. The Keepers also showed Bluestreak, for the first time, how Megatron used him as a messenger of doom. Horrified at the part he unwittingly played in the Decepticon war engine, Bluestreak swore to destroy Megatron.''

''In the Labyrinth, the Keepers forced the Transformers to participate in battledome combat, fighting alien opponents and each other, with their lives and the lives of the humans taken with them hanging in the balance. Bluestreak and Jazz were forced to fight each other to the death amidst a random assortment of humans, held in place around the battledome by the Keepers' power. Failure to continue the battle resulted in a "penalty", where the Keepers would callously murder the humans to keep the Autobots fighting, but the fighting itself was just as potentially dangerous for the civilians in the arena. The battle only ended when Bluestreak deliberately took a critical blast from Jazz's [[photon rifle]] in order to save one of the humans from certain death. The Keepers forced Jazz to finish the job, executing his friend at point blank range to avoid any additional deaths. Bluestreak died consoling Jazz that he had done the right thing.''

''But he did not die for long. After the Keepers were revealed as vast techno-organic lifeforms, Optimus Prime was able to manipulate the [[Matrix of Leadership|Matrix]] to help bring him, Megatron, Jazz and the surviving humans back home. Unfortunately, the Keepers came too, having assembled a menagerie of host bodies for themselves in order to more directly interact with other beings. One of those host bodies was Bluestreak's animated corpse.'' {{storylink|Transformers: Hardwired|Hardwired}}

''The Keepers took up residence in [[Las Vegas]], a city [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] had claimed in the Decepticon name with Megatron absent. Through their host Bluestreak, the Keepers attempted to make Starscream submit to their rule. When he refused, Keeper-Bluestreak overloaded him with raw energy, bringing Starscream to the brink of death so that his body could be taken by the Keepers as well. The remaining Decepticons loyal to Starscream were contained behind an impenetrable energy barrier.''

''The free Autobots and Decepticons of Earth joined forces with the human military forces in an effort to retake Las Vegas. The Keepers possessing Bluestreak and Starscream were immensely powerful, but their host bodies were still damaged during the conflict. To better confront their adversaries, they merged the two Cybertronians into a single, massive host. This proved to be their undoing. Bluestreak's consciousness survived, lost in an astral void while the Keeper controlled his body, unable to communicate or interact with anything. Starscream was in the same state until their bodies merged, allowing their minds to touch as well. Together, Bluestreak and Starscream exerted their will over their unwanted passengers, forcing the Keepers out and reclaiming their own separate bodies. In the end, Optimus Prime used the power of the Matrix to capture and redirect the force of a nuclear missile strike and a vein of pure Energon to eradicate the Keepers.'' {{storylink|Transformers: Annihilation|Annihilation}}

''Unfortunately, the Keepers were not done yet. Not quite. They still existed in the Void, a non-space outside of the dimensional walls. Their human agent, [[Franklin Townsend]], was able to use the lingering power of the Keepers to take control of Bluestreak and Starscream, forcing them to serve him in paving the way for the Keepers' return. This was not true possession, however, but a form of mental compulsion, which Bluestreak was able to at least partially resist. Despite this, Townsend was still able to acquire the Matrix and the services of [[Allister Greaves]], a human who was forced to create a gateway for the Keepers.''

''A final battle occurred at Greaves estate, where the gateway was constructed. Optimus and Megatron arrived with support from [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] and the [[Omega Sentinel (G1)|Omega Sentinel]]. As Bluestreak and Starscream were forced to defend the gateway, the Autobot finally broke free of his mental domination. He was ready to kill Franklin in cold blood for revenge, but [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] arrived and tried to talk him out of it. As they were arguing, Franklin attacked [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike Witwicky]] to regain control of the gateway, and Bluestreak blasted him in order to save Spike. Optimus finally sealed the gateway and the Keepers were trapped in the Void forever.'' {{storylink|Transformers: Fusion|Fusion}}

When Shockwave came to Earth and announced that the Autobot/Decepticon wars were over and that the two factions had been united, Bluestreak was more than skeptical, suggesting it was a trick. The memory of his destroyed home-city still haunted him, and he would not believe the same beings who killed innocents could change their ways. His views clashed those of with [[Gears (G1)|Gears]], who did not see the point in fighting wars that had been ended. {{storylink|New World Order}} Despite his objections, Bluestreak was among the Autobots who joined Optimus Prime in surrendering to Shockwave's lieutenant, [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]]. {{storylink|Brothers' Burden}} Ferried back to Cybertron by [[Sky Lynx (G1)|Sky Lynx]], Bluestreak and the others were imprisoned and scheduled for execution, but were freed by [[Broadside (G1)|Broadside]] and taken to an underground hideout. {{storylink|Cold War (issue)|Cold War}} En route to meeting the resistance's leaders, Bluestreak tried to have Gears fess up that it had been foolish to trust Shockwave in the first place. Bitter over where events had taken them, Gears replied that Bluestreak should "blow it out of [his] waste regulator!" {{storylink|Passive Aggression}} Afterwards, Bluestreak fought in the battle to retake Iacon, ultimately ending in the Autobots' favor. With Shockwave's regime successfully toppled, Bluestreak and his comrades began to rebuild their planet. {{storylink|Revelation (War and Peace)|Revelation}}

Shortly after Ultra Magnus recovered from injuries he suffered when the Autobots overthrew Shockwave, Bluestreak and the rest of the ''Ark''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s crew were approached by Prowl about returning to Earth. {{storylink|Original Sin}} Prowl wanted to establish a more permanent Autobot presence on Earth, due in part to some curious data he had come across while researching the clone entity known as [[Sunstorm (G1)|Sunstorm]]. Bluestreak was by far the most talkative of the Autobots at the meeting, weighing in on both sides of the discussion as the debate over returning raged back and forth. Unfortunately for Bluestreak, no one was listening to a word he said. {{storylink|Atonement}} Prowl eventually convinced all of the ''Ark''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s crew to return with him and begin construction of [[Autobot City (G1)|Autobot City]] on Earth, and they departed from Cybertron shortly thereafter. {{storylink|Lost and Found (issue)|Lost and Found}}

===''G.I. Joe vs. the Transformers''===
[[File:GIJoevsTF5 Autobots.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|If Bluestreak's the one in the red, shouldn't he be called Redstreak?]]
Bluestreak was among the deactivated Transformers found, rebuilt and reprogrammed by [[Cobra]], who proceeded to use the alien robots for their plan to conquer the world. Along with Prowl, Bluestreak now transformed into a Cobra [[Firebat]] jet, but was eventually freed from the humans' control by [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack's]] tampering. Joining Prowl, [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailbreaker]] and [[Gears (G1)|Gears]], he confronted [[Cobra Commander]] and fought against his [[S.N.A.K.E.]] guards. Bluestreak was horrified when [[Storm Shadow]] killed Trailbreaker during the fight, but the shock quickly turned to anger, and he and his comrades attacked the human and ripped his mech apart. {{storylink|G.I. Joe vs. the Transformers issue 5|G.I. Joe vs. the Transformers #5}} Bluestreak was later seen fighting Decepticon [[Seeker (body-type)|Seekers]] in the sky when the [[SPS Satellite]] went out of control and started firing at [[Cobra Island]] randomly. {{storylink|G.I. Joe vs. the Transformers issue 6|G.I. Joe vs. the Transformers #6}}
{{-}}

===''The Beast Within''===
After a brutal battle during which [[Beast (G1)|The Beast]], a monstrous gestalt of unimaginable power, was released, Bluestreak's butchered form lay smoldering in a mass grave of both Autobot and Decepticon corpses. {{storylink|The Beast Within Part 2, Consequences}}
{{-}}

===''Hearts of Steel''===
[[File:Bluestreakdinobody-HOS1.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.0|And then he died.]]
Bluestreak was among the Autobot forces who fought the Decepticons on Earth in the distant past until an incoming ice age threatened to deactivate all the Transformers. Both sides went into hiding underground until the danger had passed, remaining in stasis until the mid-19th century. When they woke up, the war against the Decepticons started anew, though Bluestreak was not seen partaking in any of the action. {{storylink|Hearts of Steel issue 1|Hearts of Steel #1}}
{{-}}

=== 2005 IDW continuity===

{{first|[[Stormbringer issue 1|''Stormbringer'' #1]]}}

{{note|IDW continuity is inconsistent about Bluestreak's name, calling him Bluestreak in most stories but Silverstreak in the [[The Transformers (IDW)|2009-2011 ongoing series]] and ''[[The Transformers: Ironhide|Ironhide]]'' miniseries.}}
Bluestreak hailed from [[Praxus]]. {{storylink|The One Where They Go to Earth}} At the very beginning of the [[Great War (G1)|Cybertronian civil war]], Bluestreak worked in Security Services under [[Sentinel Prime (G1)|Sentinel Prime]]. {{storylink|Megatron Origin issue 4|Megatron Origin #4}} Later, but still very early in the war, Bluestreak helped defend the planet from [[Trypticon (G1)|Trypticon]] as part of [[Blurr (G1)|Blurr]]'s harassment team. {{storylink|The Illusion of Control}} At a later point still, he was part of an extraction team led by [[Ironhide (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Ironhide]] that retrieved a damaged [[Jazz (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Jazz]] and [[Tracks (G1)|Tracks]] from their skirmishing with the [[Predacon (G1)|Predacons]]. Bluestreak's sharpshooting skills took out [[Razorclaw (G1)|Razorclaw]] just in time to keep Jazz on-line. {{storylink|Spotlight: Jazz}}

[[File:The Iron Age Streak drinks.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.6]]
Bluestreak would become the longest-standing patient of Autobot psycho-analyst [[Rung (G1)|Rung]]. {{storylink|Bullets}}

Four million years ago, <s>Bluestreak</s> <s>Silverstreak</s> good ol' Streak was present at a victory celebration after the Autobots successfully prevented a supply of energon from reaching the enemy camp. He was too busy getting drunk on energon to really heed Ironhide's security concerns about a [[Axer (G1)|suspicious-looking Autobot]] at the party. {{storylink|The Iron Age}} 500,000 years ago he fought Decepticons during [[Metroplex (G1)|Metroplex]]'s final stand. {{storylink|Earthfall Part 1: Hello Cruel World|Hello Cruel World}} {{storylink|Earthfall Part 5: I Dream of Wires|I Dream of Wires}}

Roughly 500 years ago, Bluestreak was on [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]]'s orbital array during the Decepticons' post-[[Thunderwing (G1)|Thunderwing]] advance, shortly before the planet was abandoned, and fought against their final big push. {{storylink|Spotlight: Blaster}}

Much later, Bluestreak was in command of the Autobot tactical response unit, seen briefly on the Autobots' orbital command hub. {{storylink|Stormbringer issue 1|Stormbringer #1}} On [[Varas Centralus]], in the [[Kol System]], Bluestreak's unit was joined by the [[Wreckers]] during Phase Six. The Wreckers assaulted the Decepticon [[Infiltration protocol|siege mode armature]], but Bluestreak kept his own squad out of the fighting, citing the planet as a lost cause. [[Springer (G1)|Springer]] attempted to talk Bluestreak into attacking the Decepticons with the Wreckers, before Springer's crew were pulled from Varas Centralus to deal with the crisis created by the revival of [[Thunderwing (G1)|Thunderwing]]. The final fate of Varas Centralus is unknown, but probably could be categorized as "not good". {{storylink|Stormbringer issue 2|Stormbringer #2}}

Bluestreak later returned to [[Autobot Orbital Command Hub]] in order to greet Blaster personally upon his revival. Because he had been present on the orbital array when Blaster was first attacked and went missing centuries ago, however, Bluestreak was one of the Autobots (along with [[Inferno (G1)|Inferno]], [[Beachcomber (G1)|Beachcomber]] and [[Mirage (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Mirage]]) suspected of trying to assassinate Blaster. {{storylink|Spotlight: Blaster}}

[[File:IDWBluestreakSilverstreak.jpg|upright=2.0|thumb|Oh, come on!]]
After the [[Surge (event)|Surge]], Bluestreak was in command of a unit operating on [[Hydrus 5]]. One of his subordinates was [[Flattop (Autobot)|Flattop]]. {{storylink|Bullets}}

Silverstreak was among the Autobots who ended up on Earth following the effects of the Surge. Like several others he grew sick of hiding on the planet and joined [[Hot Rod (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Hot Rod]] when he defected. {{storylink|Things Fall Apart, Part 1: "New Arrivals, Old Encounters"|New Arrivals, Old Encounters}} Despite this, he was seen with the Autobots who stayed behind, cheering for [[Bumblebee (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Bumblebee]] when he was chosen to lead them. {{storylink|The Hanging Sword}} Silverstreak helped with the construction of a space cruiser alongside Hot Rod and [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]]'s united faction. {{storylink|Things Fall Apart, Part 3: "Seasons in Flight"|Seasons in Flight}}

{{note|Bluestreak's appearance in [[The Transformers: Bumblebee]] may simply be an error. Another possibility, though less likely, is that Bluestreak and Silverstreak are two different characters in IDW, much like Bumblebee and [[Goldbug (IDW)|Goldbug]] or [[Megatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Megatron]] and [[Galvatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Galvatron]].}}

[[File:03 Earthworks What a coward.jpg|thumb|left|upright=2.0]]
Like many Autobots, Silverstreak had some difficulties working with the Decepticons. He got suspicious when Swindle and the [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] spent so much time working to repair [[Breakdown (G1)|Breakdown]], the latest Decepticon they had rescued from [[Skywatch]]. Hot Rod (now calling himself "Rodimus") told him to let the old mistrust between the factions go, but Silverstreak proved to have good instincts—Swindle had installed combiner technology in the Stunticons, creating the menace of [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]] which he turned against their new Autobot "comrades". {{storylink|Things Fall Apart, Part 4: "Enemies of the System"|Enemies of the System}} After Menasor was defeated, Silverstreak chastized Rodimus for failing to predict someone named "Swindle" might be less than trustworthy. As Rodimus fled Earth in [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Ultra Magnus]]'s shuttle, Silverstreak, [[Jetfire (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Jetfire]] and the rest of the splinter faction apparently rejoined Bumblebee and the rest of the Autobots. {{storylink|Things Fall Apart, Part 5: "Earthworks"|Earthworks}}

[[File:04 Hawk Among the Sparrows Red Alert and Streak Drink.jpg|thumb|upright=1.7]]
After the Autobot factions reunited, they formed an alliance with Skywatch. When the [[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticons]] were causing trouble in [[South Korea]], several Autobots were sent to fight them while Silverstreak was left behind in a Skywatch hangar, where he was forced to listen to [[Brawn (G1)|Brawn]] complain about not being picked. He decided to give his "unpleasant" comrade some constructive criticism, telling him that nobody likes angry and moping whiners. On the other hand, everybody loves optimists, like for example Silverstreak! Somehow, this didn't improve Brawn's mood any, so Silverstreak went back to drinking with [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]]. {{storylink|International Incident Part 3: "Hawk Among the Sparrows"|Hawk Among the Sparrows}} When the Autobots in Korea were faced with the [[Predacon (G1)|Predacons]], Silverstreak was horrified that he couldn't help them, and asked [[Kyle Pennington|Pennington]] what a "nightmare" was so that he could properly compare the situation to one. The battle was eventually won, though it led to the secret Autobot-Skywatch alliance getting revealed to the world. Silverstreak and Brawn stood by Bumblebee as he tried to calm the human crowds, but failed to protect him from a human assassin with an energy gun. {{storylink|International Incident Part 4: "All My Sins Remembered"|All My Sins Remembered}}

[[File:Demolished Man Sonic Scream.jpg|thumb|upright=1.3|left]]
Things only went downhill from there. The human riots continued, the energy gun appeared to be none other than Megatron himself, the plane carrying the Korea team home was shot down, and finally the Decepticons returned to Earth and attacked the Skywatch base where Silverstreak and the others were based. The Autobots were incapacitated by [[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]]'s sonic attacks and failed to stop the Decepticons from freeing their captured brethren. {{storylink|Revenge of the Decepticons Part 1: The Demolished Man|The Demolished Man}} Ultra Magnus took command and had the base evacuated, though Silverstreak worried about moving an injured Pennington around. {{storylink|Revenge of the Decepticons Part 2: Altered Carbon|Altered Carbon}} As they fled towards [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]], the Autobots were attacked by more angry humans with energy guns (now known to only be replicas of Megatron's [[alternate mode]]) and Silverstreak sustained damage to a tire. Then things went downhill again, with Megatron himself showing up in a new, more powerful form and defeating the entire Autobot convoy single-handedly. {{storylink|Revenge of the Decepticons Part 3: Woken Furies|Woken Furies}}

[[File:Genesis Streak.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4]]
The injured Autobots were dumped in [[Albuquerque]] to be held hostage by additional armed, paranoid humans. They were saved, but at the cost of Jazz killing one of the humans, which only served to further ruin their reputation amongst humanity. {{storylink|Revenge of the Decepticons Part 4: Burning Chrome|Burning Chrome}} Silverstreak and [[Huffer (G1)|Huffer]] escorted the shell-shocked Jazz away from the ensuing chaos. {{storylink|Earthfall Part 4: Full Fathom Five|Full Fathom Five}}

Some six weeks later, Silverstreak was shocked to learn that Rodimus had returned to Earth with the [[Matrix of Leadership]] and several Autobots who were thought dead or long lost, and brought these news to a repaired Bumblebee. After relaxing with [[Wheelie (G1)|Wheelie]], he joined the rest of the Autobots in volunteering to return to Cybertron and fight [[Galvatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Galvatron]]. {{storylink|Space Opera—Final Tableaux: Orphans of the Helix|Orphans of the Helix}} On the way home, Silverstreak listened to Ironhide tell the story about the time he met [[Alpha Trion (G1)|Alpha Trion]]. {{storylink|Chaos Part One: Lamentations|Lamentations}} On Cybertron, as the battle against Galvatron's [[Sweep (G1)|Sweeps]] raged on, he bore witness to Megatron's battle with the monstrous "[[Deceptigod]]". {{storylink|Chaos Part Four: Genesis|Genesis}}

[[File:A Better Tomorrow Maccadams.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.5]]
Once the war was over and Cybertron was restored, Silverstreak tried to sign up for the ''[[Lost Light]]''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s journey but didn't make it in. {{storylink|World, Shut Your Mouth Part 1: Towards Peace|Towards Peace}} Remaining on Cybertron, he was seen wandering around in a crowd of [[NAIL]]s who had returned home after the war. {{storylink|The Autonomy Lesson (issue)|The Autonomy Lesson}} Later, he was on patrol in the reclamation tunnels where captured Decepticons worked and guarded [[Dirge (G1)|Dirge]] after he witnessed [[Skydive (Predator)|Skydive]]'s murder. {{storylink|Devisive}} Together with [[Cliffjumper (G1)|Cliffjumper]] and [[Sky Lynx (G1)|Sky Lynx]], Silverstreak visited [[Maccadam's Old Oil House]] the morning it reopened for business. {{storylink|A Better Tomorrow}} He apparently really liked the place, as he was still there when Bumblebee came to talk to the bartender, Blurr. {{storylink|Night and the City}} Later, Silverstreak was present when Megatron's returned from the Cybertronian wilderness. After the Decepticon had been subdued and imprisoned, Streak was on guard duty at the makeshift prison in the city. When [[Starscream (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Starscream]] came in for a friendly chat with his former leader, he referred to Streak as "Bluestreak." {{storylink|City on Fire}} Shortly afterwards, the Decepticons invaded the prison in order to free Megatron. Bluestreak was confident that he, [[Warpath (G1)|Warpath]] and Jetfire could defend the place all by themselves, but instead became the first one to fall after taking a shot to the head. {{storylink|The Verge}} He survived the injury and was safely hidden away from the Decepticons by none other than Swindle. {{storylink|Heavy Is the Head}} Meanwhile, on the ''Lost Light'', a clip of Bluestreak saying the word "injecting" was used by [[Rewind (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Rewind]] in his stitched-together final message to [[Chromedome (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Chromedome]]. {{storylink|The Gloaming}}

After recovering, Bluestreak was banished into the wilderness alongside his comrades when Iacon became a neutrals-only city. {{storylink|Dark Dawn: Dark Cybertron Chapter 1|Dark Dawn}} He returned after the [[Quintessa (IDW)|Necrotitan]] was taken down, celebrating its defeat at [[Swerve's]] alongside [[Brainstorm (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Brainstorm]]. {{storylink|The Becoming: Dark Cybertron Chapter 10|The Becoming}} As the ''Lost Light'' prepared to take off again, Bluestreak made his second attempt to sign up only to be stopped by [[Swerve (G1)|Swerve]], who told him during the "crewditions" that people who looked like [[Prowl (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Prowl]] weren't allowed on board. He was then present for Megatron's [[Moonbase Two|Luna 2]] trial. {{storylink|World, Shut Your Mouth Part 1: Towards Peace|Towards Peace}} Swerve was just messing around, though, and Bluestreak was indeed allowed to join the crew, now under the unexpected command of a reformed Megatron. {{storylink|World, Shut Your Mouth Part 2: Words Hang in the Air|Words Hang in the Air}} He was seen hanging about [[Swerve's]] shortly before takeoff. {{storylink|No Guns, No Swords, No Briefcases}} Bluestreak was appointed entertainments officer aboard the ship and began regular screenings of Earth movies such as ''[[Zulu]]'' in Swerve's, though circumstances dictated that he evacuate the ship along with everyone else when the ''Lost Light'' literally began to disappear around them. {{storylink|World, Shut Your Mouth Part 3: Predestination: A Beginner's Guide|Predestination: A Beginner's Guide}}

Setting their shuttle down on [[Ofsted XVII]], Bluestreak, [[Mainframe (G1)|Mainframe]], [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailcutter]] and [[First Aid (G1)|First Aid]] found an unidentifiable injured Cybertronian. Bluestreak and Mainframe were mostly interested in figuring out which side he was on, though their investigating caused his condition to worsen to the point where he needed an urgent energon infusion. Having discovered a removable, spiked faceplate that pointed towards his being a Decepticon, the two left the room, refusing to donate their energon to help the enemy. First Aid fetched them after the Decepticon revealed himself to be a ''very'' ungrateful [[Vos (G1)|Vos]] of the [[Decepticon Justice Division]], but they returned too late to save Trailcutter from being killed by Vos's compatriot [[Kaon (G1)|Kaon]]. {{storylink|Births, Deaths, and Interventions}} The D.J.D. went on to blow up their shuttle, but the three survived and returned to the ''Lost Light''. {{storylink|The Custom-Made Now - An Elegant Chaos Prologue|The Custom-Made Now}}

[[File:Father Ted's Big Bang Community.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.5|"Do I have to sleep with all of them? At once?"]]
As an Earth cultural expert, Bluestreak volunteered to be in the first holomatter avatar rescue squad to "[[Swearth]]", a hologram world where Swerve's consciousness was hiding. (Expert Bluestreak assumed "Humanity 101" was a reference to the film "''101 Damnations''") In a female human guise, Bluestreak discovered their 'base camp's' neighbours were a trio of whacky dudes who got into ''ker-raaazzy'' hijinks like settling a dispute with corridor paintball! This, and the recurring oddities like canned laughter and everybody saying jokes but never laughing, indicated to Bluestreak that Swerve had made this world in the image of his beloved sitcoms. Once everyone worked out that Swerve ''was'' the three neighbours and that his obsession was down to crippling loneliness and depression, they were able to convince him he was loved. {{storylink|The One Where They Go to Earth}}

[[File:HowBrightTheirFrailDeeds-LostLightmutiny.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6|"Actually, I just wanted to kick Swerve off the ship. Why? Because he stole my personality quirk, and now I'm taking it back!"]]
At some point, Bluestreak was approached by [[Getaway]] and [[Atomizer]] and vouched that he would support them in the event of a mutiny against Megatron, Rodimus and their supporters. When the time came, they had Megatron, Rodimus, and the rest get stranded on the [[Necroworld]], and Bluestreak stood by as Getaway took the ''Lost Light'' and sent one final message to their former captains. {{storylink|The Dying of the Light: (1) How Bright Their Frail Deeds|How Bright Their Frail Deeds}} However, when it was revealed that the Decepticon Justice Division was on its way to eliminate Rodimus and his group, the crew immediately voiced their disproval of the plan and Getaway. To maintain control, Getaway would release the mad [[Sunder]], who would alter the memories of Bluestreak and everyone else, making them think that Megatron, Rodimus, and their group left everyone else behind willingly to pursue Cyberutopia quicker for themselves. {{storylink|The Plotters' Club (Part 2): Filling in the Blanks}} Later, when First Aid, Mirage and the rest of the [[Protectobot (G1)|Protectobots]] caught up with the Lost Light, Bluestreak would drink with Hoist and other mutineers at [["Visages"]], explaining their memory-altered version of events to First Aid. {{storylink|The Plotters' Club (Part 1): Full Circle}}

{{charfictionstub|{{storylink|The Plotters' Club (Part 1): Full Circle|Full Circle}} {{storylink|The Plotters' Club (Part 2): Filling in the Blanks|Filling in the Blanks}}}}
{{-}}

===''Henkei! Henkei!'' pack-in manga===
Bluestreak and [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] were unwittingly both chasing the same Decepticon, the [[Triple Changer]] [[Octane]]. Once he revealed himself, the two Autobots teamed up against Octane. Bluestreak got buried face-first in the fight, but Sideswipe drove off their attacker. {{storylink|Henkei! Henkei! volume 6|Henkei! Henkei! #6}}

===''Henkei! Henkei! Transformers -Visualize-''===
{{charstubfiction|{{storylink|Visualize Shot 8}}}}

===''Kre-O'' cartoon===
[[File:Bluestreak-Kreon-Last-Bot-Standing.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.2|:D]]
Bluestreak was among the spectators at a boxing match in which [[Optimus Prime (Kre-O)|Optimus Prime]] and [[Bumblebee (Kre-O)|Bumblebee]] faced [[Megatron (Kre-O)|Megatron]] and [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]], and cheered when Optimus defeated Megatron. {{storylink|Last Bot Standing}} He was in the audience of a dance competition too. {{storylink|Bot Stars}}

Bluestreak was also part of a crowd that waited at the finish line of a race between Optimus, Bumblebee, and Megatron. He cheered for Bumblebee as he finished the race, though it turned out Optimus had already won the competition. {{storylink|The Big Race}}
{{-}}

===''Kre-O'' online manga===
Alongside [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] and [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]], Bluestreak was sent to search for the legendary [[Red Bucket]], only to find it in the possession of [[Bludgeon (G1)#Kre-O online manga|Bludgeon]]'s Decepticons. Bluestreak attacked, breaking Bludgeon's armor with a flying kick, only to be buried in blocks when Bludgeon tipped the bucket over on him and Jazz. Jazz then turned the tables on him by using the very same blocks to build a giant Mega-Jazz robot, allowing him and to Bluestreak defeat the Decepticons and bring the contents of the Red Bucket back home. {{storylink|Treasure Competition! Defeat with Block Power!}} Bluestreak later helped rebuild [[Metroplex (Kre-O)|Metroplex]] after the Decepticons broke him. {{storylink|Two Giant Bases! Everybody Getting Along, Come On, Fight!}}

===''Q-Transformers'' cartoon===
{{voiceactor|[[Fukujurō Katayama]] (Japanese)}}
{{Charstubfiction|{{storylink|Mystery of Game Balance}} {{storylink|Mystery of a Certain Psychic}} {{storylink|Mystery of Return of Convoy}}}}

===Ask Vector Prime===
[[File:Silverstreak-SpyChanger-AskVectorPrime.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.5]]

In [[Primax 085.0 Eta]], Silverstreak was selected to be a member of team which was to travel to [[Gargent 087.0 Kappa|an alternate universe]], designated the 22nd Strata, to find and stop the source of a series of environmental disasters threatening Cybertron. [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]], [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]], [[Hoist (G1)|Hoist]], [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]], [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]], and Silverstreak composed the team; they dubbed themselves [[Spychanger|Spy Changers]] because they aimed to achieve their goal with stealth and diplomacy. The Spy Changers modified their bodies to match Strata 22's native cyborgs using data acquired from the [[Sky Spy]] and then crossed over. However, they were soon attacked by the local [[Guardian (GoBots)|Guardian]]s, who mistakenly presumed them to be [[Renegade]]s. The Spy Changers were then rescued by the real Renegades, who presumed them to be potential allies and took them back to their flagship, ''[[Rogue Star]]''. Renegade leader [[Cy-Kill (GoBots)|Cy-Kill]] attempted to court the Spy Changers as allies, but Optimus saw through Cy-Kill's deception. Eventually, the Autobots formed a secret alliance with the Guardians as well as discovered the cause of Cybertron's troubles: Renegade bases on [[Moebius]] were draining the planet's energy. The planet's geometry had turned it into a crude [[Dimensional Interfacer]], and Moebius was tapping into Cybertron to sustain itself. Hoist was able to end the crisis by triggering the bases' remote detonation sequence; in the ensuing battle, the Autobot-Guardian alliance triumphed over the Renegades. Optimus Prime and [[Leader-1 (GoBots)|Leader-1]] shook hands, and the Autobots returned to their home reality, secure in the knowledge that they had allies in places as distant as alternate realities. {{storylink|Ask Vector Prime#Facebook|Ask Vector Prime, 2015/09/30}}

Silverstreak and the Spy Changers pursued [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] to an alternate reality when he kidnapped Optimus Prime. They battled the [[Society of Ultimate Villainy]] while dogging the Decepticons' various raids on human facilities. They eventually learned the Decepticons had upgraded Spy Changer technology to become second generation Go-Bots. Worse still, Optimus Prime had been corrupted into [[Nemesis Prime]] by the [[Brainwave Scanner]] Megatron had stolen.

[[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]] challenged Prowl's leadership due to these setbacks, and he, Trailbreaker and Silverstreak struck out on their own. They caught up with the Decepticon Go-Bots in Wuhan, China. With the help of Li Shaoshao and the People's Liberation Army Paranormal Taskforce, the Decepticons were defeated. Prowl's team had also beaten other Decepticons in Nevada, leading to the return of Optimus Prime. Silverstreak and the reunited Autobots tracked Megatron to his lair, but the Go-Bot leader leapt through a Reality Bridge and disappeared. The Spy Changers were recruited by a dimensional agent named [[Thrustinator]] to pursue Megatron for many further adventures. {{storylink|Transformers: Renegade Rhetoric|Renegade Rhetoric (2)}}

===''Of Masters and Mayhem''===
[[File:LivelyPursuit Wreckers.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6|"...more like a mentor to the rest of the team, ya know? I see how they could be doing their jobs better? It don't matter how busy I am. I'll drop what I'm doin' and I'll tell 'em, and you know why?" "We ran out of film five hours ago-" "I'll tell ya why. Because I'm a team player. Probably the best team player of the team-" "'''We ran out of film five hours ago.'''"]]

One of Optimus Prime's elite, Bluestreak was left stranded on the dead Cybertron following [[Thunder Mayhem]]'s apocalyptic attack, filling his days by talking to corpses. Bluestreak was eventually found by [[Cergo]] and the [[Teklaan]]s, the alien robots offering to rebuild his planet, restoring a portion of its surface as proof. As the Teklaans needed Cybertronian samples, Bluestreak lured the [[Wreckers]] to Cybertron and turned them over to the aliens for dissection. After conferring with Cergo, Bluestreak tried to convince his fellow Cybertronians of his cause, mentioning the good that the Teklaans had done to [[Maarin]] which allowed [[Fractyl]] to remember that Teklaan constructs came with "perfect" viruses. When the Wreckers broke free, a skeptical Bluestreak still considered letting the Teklaans finish their work before he learnt that Cergo was planning to recreate Cybertronian viruses. After Cergo had been disabled, the Wreckers incorporated Bluestreak into [[Wreckage (G1)|Wreckage]], boosting the combiner's intellect and allowing them to defeat the Teklaans. As Bluestreak, now a Wrecker, left Cybertron with his new team, Impactor told him that his plan to restore Cybertron had been a viable one but only if Thunder Mayhem was defeated. {{storylink|Lively Pursuit}}

The Wreckers caught up with Thunder Mayhem on the planet Earth, saving Megatron from [[Ramjet (Universe)|Ramjet]]. {{storylink|Pandora's Gift}} Combining to fight the combiner, the Wreckers received backup from Megatron, Optimus Prime and some locals, finally de-combining the monster. After taking the [[Mayhem Attack Squad]] into custody, the Wreckers left Earth. {{storylink|Finale (OMAM)|Finale}}

===''War for Cybertron Trilogy'' marketing material===
During the war for Cybertron, Bluestreak was a [[Cybertronian military insignia|Ground Command Artillery Private]]. {{storylink|Bluestreak (G1)/toys#War for Cybertron: Siege|''Siege'' toy packaging}}

===Precursor World===
A [[Primus Vanguard|Warrior of the Seven Lights]] resembling a blue Bluestreak was a member of the [[Blue Order]] of the [[Primus Vanguard]]. He and his comrades followed their commander [[Blue Big Convoy]] into battle when a duel between [[G1 World|dimension-tossed]] future warriors [[Megatron (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity#Generations Selects Special Comic (1)|Ultra Megatron]] and [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Star Convoy]] threatened the [[Blue Planet (GS)|Blue Planet]] and [[Beast People|its people]]. {{Storylink|Super Megatron comic 2}}
{{--}}

==Games==
===Adventure Game: Defeat the Decepticons===
When Optimus embarked on his mission to rescue the Autobots' [[Mini Vehicle|Minicar]] troops from the Decepticons, Bluestreak could come to Optimus Prime's aid, helping him navigate more quickly through the Decepticons' maze-like base. {{storylink|Adventure Game: Defeat the Decepticons|Adventure Game: Defeat the Decepticons packaging blurb and game}}
===''The Transformers'' (PS2)===
{{Note|Bluestreak is a non-playable character. He appears among the legion of Autobot duplicates in the Decepticon campaign.}}

{{storylink|The Transformers (PS2)|The Transformers}}
{{-}}

===''Transformers Legends''===
Silverstreak was among the Autobots handpicked by [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] for a mission to deliver energon to a hidden Autobot base. Unfortunately their plan was foiled by the interference of [[Rampage (G1)|Rampage]], [[Tantrum (G1)|Tantrum]] and [[Headstrong (G1)|Headstrong]]. {{storylink|Road to Ruin}} He was among the Autobots affected by Megatron's sabotage of the Autobot [[recharging chamber]] and began to act erratically. He was the only one left when the other Autobots went to attack [[Rutter U.S. Military Base|Rutter Military Base]] and was subdued by Jazz and [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]], who had escaped the affliction. He and the other Autobots were returned to normal by [[Sparkplug Witwicky|Sparkplug]]'s [[attitude exchanger]]. {{storylink|Attack of the Autobots (Legends)|Attack of the Autobots}}

Silverstreak, [[Cliffjumper (G1)|Cliffjumper]] and [[Gears (G1)|Gears]] were sent to [[South America]] where the Decepticons were attempting to build a cannon to harness the energy of the [[Crystal of Power]]. Even joined by [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]], the Autobots were unable to prevent the cannon's completion, but later destroyed it and capped the shaft on which the crystal had stood. {{storylink|Fire on the Mountain (Legends)|Fire on the Mountain}} When Spike had the genius idea of holding a charity race, Silverstreak and [[Trailbreaker (G1)|Trailcutter]] talked the other Autobots into it. Unfortunately the Constructicons zapped them all with the [[Transfixatron]] during the race, and the Autobots, now stuck in [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]], had to hold the Decepticons off long enough for their scientists to reverse the effects. {{storylink|Autobot Run}}

===''Angry Birds Transformers''===
{{main|Blues#As Bluestreak}}
Bluestreak appears as a character unlockable in Challenge Events and in Special Missions. He is portrayed by The Blues. {{storylink|Angry Birds Transformers (mobile game)|Angry Birds Transformers}}

===''Transformers Online'' (2017 video game)===
[[File:Bluestreak_TFO.jpg|thumb|right|"No one can hide from my sights"]]
{{bigquote|I've never met a Decepticon I don't hate.}}

During the Cybertronian civil war, the Decepticons laid waste to the Transformers' home planet. For Bluestreak, this was a tragedy that would forever haunt his memories. As one of the survivors of the destruction, Bluestreak joined the Autobots in their long-lasting warfare to defeat the Decepticons. However, it wasn't easy for this friendly, reticent Transformer to develop into a true warrior. Bluestreak could only speak nonsensically to mask his own vulnerability left by the damage done from his past nightmare.

In battle, Bluestreak wielded the "[[Thunderbolt Electromagnetic Baton]]" and the "[[Fated Death]]". His active skill was "Infrared Scope":
*'''Infrared Scope''' — For 8 seconds, Bluestreak's sonar tracker reveals and marks all incoming opponents in the distance for him and his allies to target more easily. {{storylink|Transformers Online (2017 video game)|Transformers Online}} <ref>[http://tfol.qq.com/act/a20160726data/hero4.shtml Bluestreak on the Transformers Online website]</ref>
{{-}}

==Toys==
{{main|Bluestreak (G1)/toys}}

==Merchandise==
{{main|Bluestreak (G1)/toys#Merchandise}}

==Notes==
[[File:Bluebluestreak.jpg|upright=1.1|thumb|Sadly, we can't just put this note in the "Does not exist" category.]]
====Color====
The ''[[Diaclone]]'' Fairlady Z Car Robots release that would become the [[Bluestreak (G1)/toys#Generation 1|original Bluestreak toy]] was available in two different colorations. While neither ended up being used for Bluestreak himself – who instead used a ''Transformers''-original silver deco – both color schemes had lasting influences on the character:

*The ''Diaclone'' toy's first color scheme featured the car alternate mode largely in blue, with a silver hood and roof. Photographs of this toy were used in Bluestreak's [[Instructions|instruction sheet]], as well as the original 1984 [[Catalog|toy catalogs]],<ref name="catalog">[http://botchthecrab.com/galleryImage.asp?gallery=10&image=268 1984 Transformers pack-in catalog]</ref> and its coloration was evident in Bluestreak's [[Package art|box art]] (in truth, tweaked art held over from the ''Diaclone'' release). This consequently led to one of the longest-running [[Misconceptions and urban legends about Transformers|myths about ''Transformers'']]: that a "blue-sided Bluestreak" was available in the original toyline, perhaps as a super rare or foreign market [[variant]]. Oddly enough, numerous other ''Transformers'' toys from that era were depicted in both catalogs and packaging art with colors they were never released in —[[Perceptor (G1)/toys|Perceptor]], [[Astrotrain (G1)/toys|Astrotrain]], and the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]], for example— yet Bluestreak is the only one to be (mis)remembered in this manner, perhaps because his name is ''Blue''streak, so he had to have been blue, right? In fact, it was this originally intended color scheme that had inspired [[Marvel Comics|Marvel]] writer [[Bob Budiansky]] to coin the name "Bluestreak" in the first place,<ref name="budiansky">{{twitter|Blue Streak must have been blue in the early stages. The painted art on the original toy box shows him as having blue components, even though the toy is grey. So I worked with whatever I was given, even though Hasbro apparently changed color scheme later.|https://twitter.com/BobBudiansky/status/1422579495656116227|Bob Budiansky|2021|08|03}}</ref> although it was originally intended to be spelled in two words, "Blue Streak", according to notes obtained from Bob Budiansky at [[Unofficial conventions|Iacon One]] in 2006.<ref name="twowords">[https://www.seibertron.com/news/view.php?id=7899 Article at Seibertron, 2006/07/11]</ref> Budiansky then created a characterization that would have made the name a double pun, referencing the phrase [https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/talk_a_blue_streak "to talk a blue streak"], an American English idiom for talking a lot. The spelling of "Blue Streak" as two words was erroneously used for the reprint of Budiansky's full-length bio for Bluestreak in Marvel's ''[[The Transformers Universe (Marvel)|Transformers Universe]]''.
*The ''Diaclone'' toy's second and less common color scheme was largely silver, with a black hood and roof, and it was this variant that was the basis for Bluestreak's [[Character model|animation model]]. It would take until 2002 for things to come full circle, when [[e-HOBBY]] released a [[Bluestreak (G1)/toys#Anime|''Transformers''-branded version]] of the original ''Diaclone'' figure: the first toy of Bluestreak in his cartoon color scheme.

In recent years, as [[Hasbro]] and [[TakaraTomy]] have tended towards [[Show-accuracy|accuracy]] to ''Transformers''' most prominent pieces of media, the silver-and-black color scheme seems to have "won out" as the primary version of Bluestreak. The blue coloration sees occasional use in toy and media appearances, while his original release's all-silver deco seems to have fallen by the wayside.

====Other notes====
*The Bluestreak/Prowl head design was used as the basis for the head of [[Natron]], the Autobot [[Tyco]] [[Electric Racing Set]] car.
*Some comic-reading fans vaguely recollect [[IDW Publishing]] editor [[Andy Schmidt]] stating circa 2009 that "Bluestreak" and "Silverstreak" were separate characters in IDW continuity à la [[Megatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Megatron]] and [[Galvatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Galvatron]], but this statement, if it did happen, has since vanished into the ether of the Internet. Given that this notion was never picked up again, and IDW's then-spotty reputation for maintaining continuity at the time, one's mileage may vary on taking this statement seriously.

===Foreign names===
[[File:DiacloneBluestreakColours.jpg|right|upright=1.34|thumb|All three color schemes considered for the show. The winner was picked in a game of "Eeny, meeny, miny, moe".]]
*''Japanese:'' '''Streak''' (ストリーク ''Sutorīku''), '''Silverstreak''' (シルバーストリーク ''Shirubāsutorīku''), '''Bluestreak''' (ブルーストリーク ''Burūsutorīku'')
*''Czech:'' '''Modrý Blesk'''
*''French:'' '''Jaseur''' (Canada, "Chatty")
*''Hungarian:'' '''Kékvillám''' ("Blue Lightning")
*''Italian:'' '''Ariete''' ("Ram")
*''Mandarin:'' '''Lán Wén''' (Taiwan, 藍紋, "Blue Streak"), '''Lán Pīlì''' (China, 蓝霹雳, "Blue Thunderbolt")
*''Portuguese:'' '''Raio Azul''' (Portugal comic, "Blue Ray"), '''Raio''' (Brazil comic, "Ray")
*''Russian:'' '''Molniyevik''' (Молниевик, "Lightning-Maker")

==References==
{{Reflist|2}}

[[Category:Alternators Autobots]]
[[Category:Bartenders]]
[[Category:Blue Order]]
[[Category:Classics Autobots]]
[[Category:Cloud Autobots]]
[[Category:Dimension hoppers]]
[[Category:Dreamwave Generation 1 Autobots]]
[[Category:Generation 1 Autobots]]
[[Category:Gunners]]
[[Category:Henkei! Henkei! Autobots]]
[[Category:IDW (2005) Autobots]]
[[Category:Kre-O Autobots]]
[[Category:Kreons]]
[[Category:Law enforcement]]
[[Category:Lost Light crew]]
[[Category:Merchants]]
[[Category:Universe (2008)]]
[[Category:Universe Autobots]]
[[Category:Wreckers]]

Talk:Grimlock (G1)/toys

2023-03-16T13:41:22Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Page split? */ new section

== Kinda sorta not quite Grimlocks ==

Should the Beast Machines T-Wrecks and Energon Grimlocks REALLY be listed as toys of G1 Grimlock? I can see having them mentioned (trivia maybe?), but having them in the actual list of toys seems to be giving out MIS-information. [[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:39, 27 September 2009 (EDT)
:Yea that is pretty weird, going by this articles logic Megabolt Megatron should be listed under Beast Wars Megatron and not Megatron RID. [[User:Dead Metal|Dead Metal]] 16:31, 27 September 2009 (EDT)

== Henkei figure ==

Me user has him Grimlock Henkei toy. Can me uploads picture? (I'm asking this cos I'm not sure what to do, I don't know how to find Takaratomy stock photos since [[Transformers Wiki:Images]] doesn't tell me how, so taking my own seems to be the best I can do for that) [[User:Item42|Item42]] 00:14, 20 February 2010 (EST)
:Yes. You can upload your own picture. That would be good. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 10:44, 20 February 2010 (EST)

== Me Metalstar not get bandicoots joke ==

Is this a crash reference? Also if I ever talk like that again please kill me.--[[User:Metalstar|Metalstar]] ([[User talk:Metalstar|talk]]) 13:05, 22 February 2019 (EST)
:You have read the notes on your talk page about chatting, right?--[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 15:23, 22 February 2019 (EST)
::I did. I'm just saying I don't get the joke. I'm asking what the joke is.--[[User:Metalstar|Metalstar]] ([[User talk:Metalstar|talk]]) 10:03, 25 February 2019 (EST)
:::This is exactly the sort of chatting you have been told not to engage in. There's lots of jokes on here that I don't get. I just ignore them and move on.--[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:16, 25 February 2019 (EST)
::::Just explain the joke and we can move on with our lives. It's not that hard. Plus it's a legitimate question!--[[User:Metalstar|Metalstar]] ([[User talk:Metalstar|talk]]) 13:07, 26 February 2019 (EST)
:::::Don't know what it's about, don't care what it's about. IT DOESN'T MATTER. It's a joke someone posted and it's none of your business to jibber jabber about it. And we can move on with our lives when you actually start paying attention to what you have been told over and over and over again. Quit chatting and start working.--[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 23:01, 26 February 2019 (EST)

== Galaxial Rocket Launcher ==

Hey, so what's the criteria for weapons to get their own pages?

'Cause I think Grimlock's rocket launcher might deserve its own page. [[User:Banannixx|Banannixx]] ([[User talk:Banannixx|talk]]) 02:50, 15 November 2020 (EST)

== Q-Transformers ==
Could someone please add a section about the cancelled Q-Transformers Grimlock? I am completely inept at adding images so some help would be very appreciated--[[User:Magnoburst|Magnoburst]] ([[User talk:Magnoburst|talk]]) 08:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)

== Page split? ==

:The merchandise and toy sections in my mind at least seem large enough for a split at this point, and its Grimlock so they are sure to grow. Idk if there is an exact science to this decision but I feel like characters have gotten a toy merch split for less, or a toy fiction split. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 09:41, 16 March 2023 (EDT)

Transformers: EarthSpark (toyline)

2023-03-13T05:52:25Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Notes */

{{nav-earthspark}}
First unveiled at [[San Diego Comic-Con#2022|San Diego Comic-Con 2022]], '''''Transformers: EarthSpark''''' is a toyline for the [[Transformers: EarthSpark (cartoon)|accompanying cartoon]], primarily aimed at a younger demographic. It is largely similar to the previous ''[[Transformers: Cyberverse (toyline)|Cyberverse]]'' toyline, with many toys revolving around a [[gimmick]], as well as sharing three [[size class]]es: 1-Step Changer (now renamed to "1-Step ''Flip'' Changer"), Warrior Class, and Deluxe Class. The two new size classes, Tacticons and Spin Changers, are the smallest and largest size classes, respectively. ''EarthSpark'' also includes [[redeco]]es from the previous toyline, ''Cyberverse''.

{{TOCclear}}

==Toys==
===Tacticons===
The smallest size class, the Tacticons are bite-sized toys that can transform while on your finger to "forge a connection with ''Transformers'' robots like never before."<ref name="facebook">[[July 22]] Official [https://www.facebook.com/transformers/posts/pfbid02nnAWS39noniUYrdV235kArQf1gKdW7KsTit9MKSUqEzvKUjBt9yPB5efN4PrMs9Ul Transformers Facebook post] revealing the ''EarthSpark'' toyline: "Forge a connection with #Transformers robots like never before with Transformers: EarthSpark Tacticon figures that convert around a finger! Fun in every flip! Convert 1-Step Flip Changer figures from robot mode to alt. mode in 1 exciting step by flipping the bot in the air!"</ref>
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Bumblebee (ES)#Tacticon|Bumblebee]]}}
{{Bp-d1|[[Megatron (ES)#Tacticon|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Optimus Prime (ES)#Tacticon|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|[[File:TF-Earthspark-Tacticon-Megatron.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|Tacticon [[Megatron (ES)#Tacticon|Megatron]]]]
|}

===1-Step Flip Changers===
Carried over from the ''Cyberverse'' 1-Step Changers, the 1-Step Flip Changers have a greater emphasis on "flipping the bot in the air."<ref name="facebook"/> Of course, this means multiple toys have the 'switchblade' transformation used since ''[[Transformers: Age of Extinction (toyline)|Age of Extinction]]''.
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Bumblebee (ES)#1-Step Changers|Bumblebee]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Optimus Prime (ES)#1-Step Flip Changers|Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Wheeljack (ES)#Toys|Wheeljack]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 2'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d1|[[Soundwave (ES)#Toys|Soundwave]]}}
{{Bp-d1|[[Swindle (ES)#Toys|Swindle]]}}
</ul>
|[[File:TF-Earthspark-1-Step-Optimus-Prime.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|1-Step Flip Changer [[Optimus Prime (ES)#1-Step Flip Changers|Optimus Prime]]]]
|}

===Warrior Class===
Much like ''Cyberverse'', the ''Warrior Class'' toys are more articulated than most size classes but with a focus on an attack gimmick.
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Elita-1 (ES)#Toys|Elita-1]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Optimus Prime (ES)#Warrior Class|Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-d1|[[Skywarp (ES)#Toys|Skywarp]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 2'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d1|[[Megatron (ES)#Warrior Class|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Thrash (ES)#Toys|Terran Thrash]]}}
</ul>
|[[File:Transformers-EarthSpark-Warrior-Class-Elita-1.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|Warrior Class [[Elita-1 (ES)#Toys|Elita-1]]]]
|}

{{comingsoontoy|Wave 2}}

===Deluxe Class===
The ''[[Transformers: Generations (toyline)|Generations]]''-esque Deluxe Class toys focus greater on [[show-accuracy]], accessories, and [[articulation]]. Each toy includes a piece for a [[Build a Figure]] of [[Mandroid]], with one swappable arm. While similar to the ''Cyberverse'' Deluxe Class, these debuted at the start of the toyline. Befitting the more collector-orientated designs, the Deluxe Class toys are available on [[Hasbro Pulse]].
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Bumblebee (ES)#Deluxe Class|Bumblebee]]}}
{{Bp-d1|[[Megatron (ES)#Deluxe Class|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Twitch#Toys|Terran Twitch]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 2'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Optimus Prime (ES)#Deluxe Class|Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-d1|[[Shockwave (ES)#Toys|Shockwave]]}}
</ul>
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 3'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Grimlock (ES)#Toys|Grimlock]]}}
*[[Nightshade (ES)#Toys|Nightshade]]
</ul>
|[[File:Transformers-EarthSpark-Deluxe-Class-Twitch.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|[[Twitch#Toys|Terran Twitch]]]]
|}

{{comingsoontoy|Wave 2 and Wave 3}}

===Spin Changers===
The largest size class, the Spin Changers each include a human figurine that can interact with the larger robot, via a circular base or an accessory.
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Bumblebee (ES)#Spin Changers|Bumblebee]] & [[Mo Malto#Toys|Mo Malto]]}}
{{Bp-a1|[[Optimus Prime (ES)#Spin Changers|Optimus Prime]] & [[Robby Malto#Toys|Robby Malto]]}}
</ul>
|
|}

==Notes==
*''EarthSpark'' is the first cartoon tie-in toyline to use the plastic-free packaging first introduced in ''[[War for Cybertron: Kingdom]]'' for every toy. Each size class has an open window except for the Tacticons, which use closed boxes.
*The deluxe class packaging features [[Alphabet|Autobot Script]] on the inner tray, reading "Earthspark".

==References==
{{Reflist}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:EarthSpark (toyline)}}
[[Category:EarthSpark| (toyline)]]
[[Category:Toylines]]

File:AerialbotWarrior.jpg

2023-03-11T12:38:57Z

Bumblebee2000: Bumblebee2000 uploaded a new version of "File:AerialbotWarrior.jpg": new screenshot, better visibility

Aerialbot Warrior as seen in ''[[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (Xbox 360/PS3/PC)|Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen: The Game]]'' for 360/PS3/PC.
{{ROTFXbox360PS3PCcap}}

Talk:Bumblebee (Movie)/toys

2023-03-09T14:31:00Z

Bumblebee2000: /* This page is desperately in need of splitting. */

==Split AGAIN?==
Apparently this page is 52 KB, which is fuckoff huge by Wiki standards. I propose splitting it into Bumblebee/toys and Bumblebee/merchandise. Any opposition? [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 09:31, 15 November 2009 (EST)
:52 kB isn't that large—only old browsers have trouble editing. 100 kB is a better point to split it. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 20:27, 15 November 2009 (EST)

==Leader Bumblebee==

http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-news-rumors/285964-5th-rotf-leader-class-mold.html

Is it time to add a new sub section? [[User:Dinoman96|Dinoman96]] 13:13, 4 January 2010 (EST)
: Not until we get official confirmation, and not something stolen or leaked. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:01, 4 January 2010 (EST)

== Battle Blade Bumblebee losing his head? ==

I got Battle Blade Bumblebee today (the first of any of the Movieverse Bumblebees I've ever gotten) and the head seems to come off fairly easy when I convert him. For article noting purposes, I would like to know if anybody else has had this problem with this particular toy. - [[User:Zadok Rox|Zadok Rox]] 22:42, 2 August 2010 (EDT)
:Nope, and sorry, but you're better off asking a message board, because this question is not a discussion about the content of the article. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 23:06, 2 August 2010 (EDT)
::I only ask because if this problem is widespread, it should be noted like other flaws with toys (ROTF's Sideswipe's torso problem, for example). However, I'll yield and drop the subject (no more message boards for me). - [[User:Zadok Rox|Zadok Rox]] 10:08, 3 August 2010 (EDT)
:::I've seen some with the heads somewhere rattling around in the box.--[[User:TOM|TOM]] 14:49, 19 February 2011 (EST)
::::Never had a problem with mine and I've owned it since August. I'm not aware of the Sideswipe problem either as never had an issue with any of the three different Sideswipes I have had (I only own Sidearms now having sold off the others) {{Unsigned|86.29.57.94}}

== DOTM ==

I think someoneshould add a DOTM secton. But not me. Who knows what I could mess up!--[[User:TOM|TOM]] 14:52, 19 February 2011 (EST)

==DOTM Deluxe Bee==

Before we get into ANOTHER edit-war, could SOMEONE ELSE kindly clarify whether Deluxe Bee is a retool or a remold? --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] 14:12, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
: I really have no idea. I don't own Battle Blades Bumblebee, and I didn't pay much attention to deluxe Bee at Toy Fair, either. I do wonder how TOM can claim to know DOTM Bee is "smaller," though. Officially, that is. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:18, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:: In this video from Optibotimus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpqamRtmGRE Quote: because this figure is smaller than any other version of bumblebee, they technically are all brand new parts. They couldn't reuse any other Bumblebee parts cause they no longer would fit. -Optibotimus --[[User:TOM|TOM]] 14:48, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
: So like I said. You got this information from illegal sources. How many times have I asked you to not do that? Would you say one million times? What will it take to make you learn, or do I just have to get rid of you? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:50, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:: Illegal? How?--[[User:TOM|TOM]] 14:56, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:::The toy has not been released for sale. Therefore, anyone who has one has acquired it through illegal means. THEY ARE STOLEN!!!!!!! --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 14:58, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:::: Peaugh hs one LEAGALY; he bought it from KAPOW! Toys. I even asked a guy who reviews the toys for the company, and he said KAPOW! is 100% legit, and they DO NOT sell stolen items!--[[User:TOM|TOM]] 15:02, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::Because people who sell stolen items always say that. THEY HAVEN'T BEEN RELEASED FOR SALE. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:08, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::''He'' doesn't sell them, he just reviews them for the company.--[[User:TOM|TOM]] 15:11, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::Kapow Toys's own site says that: "PRE-ORDER Transformers Dark of the Moon Deluxe Bumblebee US Card PRE-ORDER DUE MAY - JUNE 2011". How can he have it from them if they won't have it for another month? And what company does he do the reviews for? And how do you know? --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:13, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::He is still reviewing stolen property. The release date for these toys is not for several months. Because you can't seem to learn, and me telling you to stop adding stolen information to our wiki is at least a once-a-week occurrence that has gone on for as long as you've been editing this wiki, you are going on an extended vacation. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 15:14, 26 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::: What's the Deluxe Bee that has a weapon hole on his hood rather than the roof? I saw a pic of it somewhere but can't seem to find it again. {{Unsigned|86.29.57.94}}
:::::::::: The cries of "ILLEGAL" sound awfully corporate to me. What moral obligation are you pulling here to disregard sources of information that aren't press releases? "Stolen information" is one of the most pompous things I've seen on this site, and that's saying a lot seeing as how more than half it is dedicated to proxy rage against raging fans. {{Unsigned|74.63.112.139}}
:::::::::::Familiarize yourself with [[Help:Official info#Stolen toys are bad|this]]. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 04:16, 12 July 2011 (EDT)

== Lunchables ==

What with the lockdown, I can't correct the following errors in the Lunchables section: plateform ---> platform, creatre ---> create, itiration ---> iteration. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 16:59, 26 March 2011 (EDT)

== Redeco Jokes ==

Yes, there's a billion Bumblebee redecos. We all know that. Can we stop making caption jokes about it? [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 19:40, 17 June 2011 (EDT)

== Nitro 'bee ==
Is Nitro 'bee's molded license plate a new thing for Transformers? Usually it's either a sticker, or just a flat space, but Nitro 'bee has the whole thing molded on his back-end.--[[User:Carrion|Carrion]] 15:37, 30 July 2011 (EDT)

==Leader writeup==
The previous edit's writeup wasn't great, but it wasn't worthless, either. I was going to rewrite it myself based on what our anonymous editor contributed, but I don't have the toy so I can't figure out quite what he means about some of it. Still, I think someone should try to overhaul it rather than just revert it outright to a version of the entry with no information at all. -[[User:LV|LV]] 14:11, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
:This was the previous entry:
"Leader class Bumblebee is a new mold made to be more movie accurate like all other figures under the leader class title. Bumblebee has no electronics or voice capabilities in the figure itself. Instead all the electronics are found in a jet pack/ weapon pack that can be clipped to either his back or the rear end of the car. The pack includes three weapons, a non firing shoulder cannon and two non firing missile packs that can be angled around his shoulders however you want it. The shoulder cannon plays a firing noise when pressed as well as deploys a scope that is entirely useless to the character for it comes nowhere near his face. the rocket launchers play a different noise of rockets being fired when pressed. The only other sound is the pack has a switch that, when pushed forward or pulled back, deploys/retracts the weapons and plays to notably different sounding transformation sounds between retracting and deploying (it also flashes blue or yellwolights when the above mentioned sounds play). ''Besides the pack, Bumblebee's only packaged weapon is the pulse cannon on his right arm. this cannon can't be replaced with a normal hand but it does telepathically pop out'' and the yellow piece on the lower arm can come forward (this doesn't happen on the other arm)to create what looks like a blade weapon.on his The Cameron mode can be put the weapon pack on and give him a sort of attack mode, likely based off the scene when Bumblebee briefly used weapons while in vehicle form. The form changes basically nothing, just opens the hood parts and reveals the arms where the door used to be (the door hangs over them now). Bumblebee has four five millimeter holes for the mech tech feature, one on the top of his shoulder (though the one on the side of his shoulder is to small for mech tech weapons) and one on his lower arms. The weapon system/ jet pack has five, two on the body of the pack, the third on the middle cannon, and one on each of the rocket launchers. The two launchers packs can be equiped with a c joint rung each. The alt mode has none but the attack form has the same four located on his arms as well as it includes the wepaon pack's seven mech tech points. In total, Bumblebee can store up to nine mech weapons. The pack can't really be placed on any other mech tech characters due to it's massive size and the connector peg, though the Deluxe calss Laserbeak can be plugged onto it and his arms if you want." --[[User:Primo|Primo]] 16:31, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

== Citation needed ==

As the person who added the bit that was given the "citation needed" treatment, I can confirm that there was a weird version of the checklist on Hasbro's website a few years ago that listed all sorts of unreleased toys (that list is where we got the name "Halloween Horrorcons" from) which also listed all the Screen Battles sets with four instead of three human figures. That list should be long gone by now.--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 20:01, 29 May 2012 (EDT)

== "Impossible!" ==
As I was editing the page myself (not sure if it will still be kept on or not), I found it daunting trying to edit the page because it was so long it is nearly impossible to go where you need to be, or your mind is just screwed.

So my Idea to rectify the problem (and perhaps to make the "Bumblebee toys" a little less overwhelming for those who read or edit it), is perhaps to split the page apart to equal sections (as in parts to continue) or towards which movie (e.g. Bumblee toys ROTF) with a hint of what came afterwards (e.g. the 2010 line) before moving to the next page (Bumblebee toys DOTM) and so forth.

Not sure if anyone could agree on this, but It is I hope a good point on a result of why we hate Bumblebee so much.[[User:Go(toby070)Bots|Go(toby070)Bots]] ([[User talk:Go(toby070)Bots|talk]]) 10:53, 10 May 2014 (EDT)
:That's what the headers and table of contents are for. Ctrl+F is your best friend. Besides, this isn't even the longest page.

:And who's this "we" you're talking about? --[[User:Inkblot|Inkblot]] ([[User talk:Inkblot|talk]]) 22:40, 10 May 2014 (EDT)

== Studio Series toy ==

Any consensus from owners on whether ''Studio Series'' Bumblebee best qualifies as a heavy retool or a partial-tool? [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 23:56, 6 March 2018 (EST)

== mpm07 ==

mpm07 beatle bumblebee needs to be added {{unsigned|Optimusprimerotfrocks}}
:The listng has no pictures and comes from an unofficial affiliate of Hasbro, therefore, it constitutes as leak, and has no place on the wiki. [[User:Notirishman|--notirishman]] ([[User talk:Notirishman|talk]]) 20:32, 1 September 2018 (EDT)

mpm07 has been listed on tfsource for preorder and has been revealed on tfw2005 by hasbro
http://news.tfw2005.com/2018/09/21/tranformers-masterpiece-movie-mpm-07-bumblebee-vw-beetle-official-images-and-announcement-372059 {{unsigned|Optimusprimerotfrocks}}
:We already have the toy up. [[User:Notirishman|--notirishman]] ([[User talk:Notirishman|talk]]) 20:49, 22 September 2018 (EDT)

== This page is desperately in need of splitting. ==

Right now this page ranks as eighth longest page on the wiki, and it is surprising that loading all the images does not crash my browser. Something has to give. Where would be an adequate point to partition Bumblebee toys? Unfortunately, it is possible the 2018 ''Bumblebee'' movie is an insufficient benchmark to trim down the first page of toys to a manageable user experience. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 07:25, 16 June 2022 (EDT)
:Why not split the six movie franchise evenly in half? Same for Movie OP. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 08:26, 16 June 2022 (EDT)
::Probably the best place to split right now would be from the ''Age of Extinction'' toyline onward, as both pages would have approximately the same lenght. But considering that this Bumblebee is inevitably going to keep getting ''a lot'' of toys in the foreseeable future, I'd suggest we split the first decade (2007-2016) from everything past 2017. Basically the split would happen between ''Q-Transformers'' and ''Movie the Best'', allowing for the second page to keep growing to the lenght of the first one until we reach 2026 and decide if yet another split becomes a necessity. --[[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 17:39, 16 June 2022 (EDT)

:::I think give the sheer length another split may be needed down the road, but I do agree that the original trilogy is a workable boundary line for now! [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 14:01, 26 June 2022 (EDT)
Reviving this topic because we all know this page is only going to grow bigger next year and we'll have to split it sooner or later. MrRald has suggested on the Discord that we start by splitting the ''Studio Series'' toys (along with ''Buzzworthy SS'' and ''Premium Finish'') to their own page separate from all the other toys. While I personally agree that it's a good starting point, I also think that we could just go straight to the "second phase of the split"—so to speak—where we keep the first page with everything from 2007 to 2017 and the second page with everything else starting with 2018, conveniently splitting the original 10 years of the Bayverse from this new era of softly-rebooted movies and toylines that started with ''Bumblebee'' and ''Studio Series''. It's only a matter of time until we get loads of ''Rise of the Beasts'' toys anyway so it wouldn't hurt to be prepared for their eventual arrival. Does anyone else agree with this proposal? --[[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 22:09, 7 December 2022 (EST)

While I have no strong feelings on which way we split the page, I second the need to split this page as soon as possible for the sake of making it stable and navigable.
The reason I chose the studio series toyline for the split is because it's been going for 5 years, it shows no sign of stopping and Bumblebee gets the most toys in it. Therefore, it's gonna be our main source of bloating from here on. The upcoming Rise of The Beasts Tie-in toyline will probably also feature a lot of Bumblebee merchandise, so I find sensitive to move it alongside the Studio Series toys as it will be another source of bloating.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 22:20, 7 December 2022 (EST)

:I think keeping the five Bay films' toylines and the attached lines (TF2010, Kre-O, etc) on one page, then starting a second page for ''Bumblebee'', ''Studio'', ''Beasts'' and forward would probably be as clean and intuitive a breakpoint as possible. Start the soft page reboot at the soft franchise reboot. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 02:23, 8 December 2022 (EST)

::My thought process is: he got a new body in AOE, so that might be a good place to split off. Leave Movie, ROTF and DOTM on this page, along with any depictions of him in that body. Have AOE, TLK, Bumblebee, and ROTB on another. Don't know how useful that would be, but that's my two cents. [[User:ThatGuy79|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79|talk]]) 11:59, 8 March 2023 (EST)

:::So what you're saying is we should split the Studio Series section in two separate pages on an arbitrary basis. That doesn't sound helpful at all. -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 12:08, 8 March 2023 (EST)
::::I support Sipher's plan. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 12:57, 8 March 2023 (EST)
:::::Looking at my argument, I have come to the conclusion that it was dumb. I'm with Fritz and Sipher on this one. [[User:ThatGuy79|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79|talk]]) 13:45, 8 March 2023 (EST)

I think enough people have agreed on the split and so I propose we move the discussion to the next topic that needs a consensus: how do we name the pages? I personally can't think of anything other than "/toys (2007-2017)" and "/toys (2018 onwards)", but I'm not saying it's the best option. Any better ideas? -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 14:23, 8 March 2023 (EST)
:I'm gonna cast my vote for "/toys (pre-''Bumblebee'')" and "/toys (post-''Bumblebee''). [[User:ThatGuy79|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79|talk]]) 18:22, 8 March 2023 (EST)
:...oops. Yes. Yes, I did. Thank you. [[User:ThatGuy79|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79|talk]]) 19:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)
:For lack of a better idea, (2007-2017) and (2018 onwards) seem about as concise a parenthetical as any. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 01:21, 9 March 2023 (EST)
: (2007-2017) and (2018-) makes sense to me. Clean, simple and descriptive. No nice words that are more representative of the split that I can think of. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 09:30, 9 March 2023 (EST)
:My take is put SS in its own separate category since G1 Prime and Megatron do that, and then sort those SS toys by movie.[[User:Poliwag06|Poliwag06]] ([[User talk:Poliwag06|talk]]) 01:48, 9 March 2023 (EST)

== Construct-Bots ==

Does anyone have the Construct-Bots Dinobot Warrior Bumblebee? If so, are you willing to take a picture of him combined with Nosecone? [[User:ThatGuy79|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79|talk]]) 11:57, 8 March 2023 (EST)

MediaWiki talk:Community Portal

2023-03-04T23:41:36Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Nonbinary Character Category */ indent fix, sorry

__NEWSECTIONLINK__

This is the place for discussion of topics that affect the entire wiki. For less wide-reaching subjects, either use articles' individual talk pages or [https://discord.gg/N99Bygq our Discord server].

Some topics that would ordinarily be here have merited their own pages:

{{chapters|title=Specific Discussion Subjects|align=left|content=
<div class="list-header">'''Moving From Wikia:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving|Arriving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving|Leaving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki:Community Portal/Complaints|Complaints]]
 <div class="list-header">'''New Ad Policy:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki:Ads|Ads]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Bookworm Database-Crash:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Damage Control Central|Damage Control Central]]
* [[Project:Bookworm Crash]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving2|Leaving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Server Move:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving2|Arriving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Relicensing:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Relicensing|Relicensing]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Dealing With Vandalism:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Vandalism|Vandalism]]
 <div class="list-header">'''GoBots Sister Wiki:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/GoBots|Discussion on the place of GoBots in this wiki]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Wiki Technical Information:'''</div>
* [[Transformers_Wiki:Tech|A Not So Brief Summary of the Horrible Things That McFly and Co. Have Done To Keep This Wiki From Melting Down]]
}} 

{{:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}/Archive}}


== Site Logo revamp ==

Up until now, our rotating logo on the main page tends to have a batch of logos pointing to pages from the most recent franchises and series, plus a few from older franchises that we forgot or didn't bother to remove. I'd like to rework this system a bit to have a more even balance franchise-wise. I think we should have one character for every franchise that has had a cartoon or movie (including the JG1 shows), plus one from each of the major English-language comic runs (Marvel, Dreamwave, IDW1, and IDW2 at the bare minimum). This would be a good way to demonstrate the breadth of the franchise scope of the wiki, and help drive new readers towards legacy content. (Of course, we'd still have a few extra banners based on whatever is currently running for the "Hey, I know that guy!" factor. Would love to get some thoughts on this, and potentially character suggestions for each franchise. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 00:59, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:I think this is a great idea! Though, I'm unsure on which characters from each show would be good to use. Like, would we go most popular/memorable characters or just some really random left field obscurities like G1 Skids who appeared in only two episodes of ''The Transformers'', just to get some more eyes on character articles from franchises newer fans may not be fully aware of? Also, would Japanese-exclusive shows include ''Go!'', ''Q-Transformers'' and ''Robotmasters''? If so, maybe even an image from ''Portal'' (the Russian show) would be worthwhile too. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 02:47, 18 December 2021 (EST)
::Obscure/minor stuff risks just being the GO! Boxes again, and we already have those. For the big logo, best to go with majorish characters from majorish media. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 07:19, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:This sounds like a great idea. We could break it down like this:
G1 Seasons 1 and 2 - Optimus Prime,
TFTM/G1 Seasons 3 and 4 - Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime,
G1 Marvel - Ratchet,
Headmasters - Fort Max,
Masterforce - Minerva,
Victory - Star Saber,
Idk if we would do Zone or any of the Japanese G1 stories that came after,
Beast Wars - Megatron,
Beast Wars II - Lio Convoy,
Beast Wars Neo - Magmatron,
RID/Car Robots - Side Burn,
I've never read Dreamwave so I don't know a good character that represents it,
Unicron Trilogy - Hot Shot,
IDW could be broken into a few character reps because of how long it went on,
IDW Furman Era - IDW Bumblebee,
IDW Post Furman - IDW Galvatron,
IDW MTMTE/LL - Nautica,
IDW RID/OP - IDW Optimus Prime,
Animated - Bulkhead,
Movies - Bumblebee,
WFC Games - Bruticus,
Prime - Starscream,
RID15 - Strongarm,
Cyberverse - Windblade,
WFC Trilogy - G1 Megatron,
And then we can have a few slots open for characters from the latest shows/movies. This list would give new readers an idea on how big the franchise truly is and how diverse the characters are. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Certainly if anyone's gonna represent CR/RiD'01, it's gonna be Sky-Byte, the breakout star of the show, and not Side Burn, the Autobot womanizer. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:26, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Funilly enough I meant to put him there lol. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 20:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Dreamwave, I'd pick War Within Grimlock. Certainly Shockwave should be part of 2005 IDW since he's responsible for the whole sha-bang.--[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] ([[User talk:MistaTee|talk]]) 18:40, 5 January 2022 (EST)

== Splitting Cloud characters ==

So now we have some sorta adequate translations, I'm being increasingly convinced that merging them just on the basis of AVP was a mistake and that the Cloud characters should be split out for simplicity and ease of explanation. Notably, the central conceit is far more similar to TransTech than G1—and more different to G1 than Cyberverse, for instance. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 02:44, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I was against it then and I'm against it now. They're nothing like the TransTech; they are practically nigh identical to the G1 guys, there's a war going on in their universe, and the "central conceit" of them being multiversal guardians is more akin to Alternity than it is to TransTech, who for the majority of their fiction were at most passive observers. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I am declining to weigh in personally until I finish first pass translations but please at least pretend to look over the translated material before repeating the same arguments. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:19, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::I have looked over it. Nothing is convincing me that it's all that separate from G1 stuff. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 12:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::"War going on" describes most of Transformer fiction. What makes Cyberverse "not G1", but Cloud G1, other than convenience for us editors? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:02, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::: As far as I can tell, there is no basic divergence, aside from Grimlock's origins, from the Cloud characters to the G1 counterparts. I could point to a fair few examples on the side of Cyberverse that rank higher than that (Grimlock's presenations, the origins of the Quintessons and Sharkticons, Skywarp, Acid Storm, etc etc.) [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:23, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::We can be here all day debating over character minutiae, but the point is that Cyberverse ultimately doesn't diverge that much from G1 in its general premise as opposed to Cloud. G1 is bloated enough as it is; it doesn't hurt to take out the one thing that doesn't really fit in and make it its own thing. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::: Well that just comes right back to my question: what actually makes Cloud World's core conceit any different from G1 beyond the fact that they have technology that allows them dimensional travel? Because if it is just that, I simply do not believe that is enough to justify a split for characters who are almost all made to look like and have the same personality as the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:51, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I agree for the sake of wiki presentation. *Cloud* is more like *TransTech* than it is like *Alternity*. *Cloud* characters got to travel to both the G1 and MD worlds as equally separate destinations. TakaraTomy used the *Generations War for Cybertron* moulds as the *United* series, which is G1 and not Aligned by our classification. *Cloud* recycling unused *Generations Fall of Cybertron* toys in a non-Aligned setting strikes me as more evidence that we can allow *Cloud* to live on its own rather than as another G1 setting. And *Cloud* was chosen by e-HOBBY over the competing proposal *Prime Shattered Glass* which would also have been on separate wiki pages despite employing purely redeco mould choiceis. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:08, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I'm not convinced by the idea that them saying "G1 World" is an indicator of separateness when there is also designations for "BW Spacetime" and "MF Spacetime." Brawn is depicted as practically identical in appearance to G1 Brawn before being upgraded. As for the Prime Shattered Glass choice, I think it's pretty obvious why that would be completely separate from this particular issue. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 16:25, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::The only reason Brawn is shown as the G1 body is if you take consideration that all Cloud members are drawn according to the latest toy or model available... he got no real toy before that, the only options were either G1 Sunbow, G1 toy or the tiny Universe 2.0 Legends. Now if you remove their appearance and focus on the story, Cloud is still more akin to Transtech than Alternity, Deadlock for example even got to visit the Legends World, a Aligned world (possibly the Adventure toyline) and the Ehobby spin-off dimension (now called Precursor World) -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 17:55, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::Yes, I am aware of how Cloud repurposings work. Nothing prevents one G1 universe from visiting another. And aside from that, Japan has had barely any non-JG1 cartoon related G1 fiction; of course Cloud World, which isn't directly JG1 related, would be indicated as different; that doesn't mean that it's not able to be categorized as G1. If it were an American storyline, where we have always had multiple G1 storylines, I feel that this would not nearly be as much of a point of contention. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I'm in favor of splitting Cloud from G1. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 19:32, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I haven't read any of the Cloud fiction myself, but I know that if our translation team collectively agrees on something based on the material available, then that's more than enough convincing for me to agree with them also. In other words, I agree with a split. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:52, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I'd vastly prefer if we could get someone like McFeely to weigh in on this. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:56, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::i'm in favour of the split. The cloud people have enough characteristics to distonguist them from theur jg1 counterpatts.--[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 20:14, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::Alright, seriously, what characteristics are there actually to distinguish them from G1? Because nobody has been able to give me a concrete example so far. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 21:17, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::::dinobot, heavy usage of aligned designs, hellwarp --[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 21:36, 28 December 2021 (EST)
Looks like Escargon is the only voice against the split thus far. Still, I suggest the discussion should remain open longer than usual, out of courtesy for people not checking the wiki as regularly given the holiday season. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 21:47, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:As the translations are still ongoing, I think the most we can suggest at this time is a note regarding its a classification as a Primax setting by AVP. As more information comes to light I'm becoming increasingly convinced that it was a decision made on shaky logic. Unlike the Alternity there doesn't seem to be any evidence of these guys being derived in-universe from G1 guys. And as fiction, it's about a bunch of super advanced parallel universe monitor guys who regularly travel to other universes. If it's literally just "the cast is mostly recolours of toys with G1 fiction" then maybe we need to start talking about listing the War for Cybertron games as G1 too. [[User:Star Spangled Sam|Star Spangled Sam]] ([[User talk:Star Spangled Sam|talk]]) 01:44, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::What exactly is super-advanced about them beyond SARA, who, as far as I can tell, is a gift from some being and not even their own creation? Because otherwise, they seem to be basic Transformers. Not a single person has been able to tell me that so far, and I'd be far more willing to listen if someone would just spell out what exactly makes them so distinct that means they can't be G1. It's not about in-universe stuff, because for all intents and purposes, the characters themselves are nigh-identical to the Generation 1 characters; you look at Cloud Megatron or Cloud Rodimus and it is obvious that, irregardless of whatever the fiction might say, they are being sold as new versions of the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 04:29, 29 December 2021 (EST)
:::By the same logic, then why not put the FOC and WFC games under the G1 banner since it heavly takes inspirations from it, same settings (war on cybertron, the resources are becoming low, escaping to another world), closest designs to G1.. hell they were more marketed towards G1 than the Movies and Prime in mind (let's face it.. that's what Hasbro always does).. but the further Hasbro tied them to Aligned and they became their own thing.. Cloud is about that, maybe marketed as G1 at first but they became their own thing at the end -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 13:20, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::::The WFC games are their own case that, despite what you say, were always clearly a part of Hasbro's ideas for the Aligned continuity, which is something that I'm not going to bother going into here. Nothing about Cloud registers to me as being somehow so separate that it requires us splitting off things into their own pages. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 13:24, 29 December 2021 (EST)
Bumping for more opinions. If there's no overall opposition to it by Friday or so, I'll start splitting. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:07, 4 January 2022 (EST)
:The Cloud fiction prominently features the Cloud characters interacting with their own G1 counterparts. If nothing else, it should be split on same basis as [[Galvatron II]]. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:50, 4 January 2022 (EST)
::We've seen that with other fiction. I'm not sure why it would justify them having their whole separate pages (Galvatron II is a unique case). If that's what it takes though to not go through some inane total split, though, then fine, whatever. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:If there is to be movement on this in the immediate future I suppose I should go ahead and weigh in. As the one doing the translation I broadly agree with Riptide. While I am unmoved by philosophical discussions on what constitutes "G1-ness" or "Transtech-ness," I believe it is important to return to our guiding principle of the end user experience. Given the already convoluted nature of the material as well as the cast's consistent interaction with both various Generation 1 continuities in general and their own incarnations in specific, I believe it will be in the best interests of intelligibility for the reader to split out Cloud from Generation 1. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:25, 5 January 2022 (EST)

We are not going to pretend that these are completely separate from the Generation 1 characters. Put up a suite or a "see [X] article for more information" because it is completely ridiculous to pretend that Cloud is it's own little continuity. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:38, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I disagree. Cloud should be split off entirely. So let's have an official vote and resolve this. I say '''Split'''. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 10:28, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::The articles have already been split. You'll forgive me if I don't show confidence in the decision from people who blew me off when I pointed out their original reason for splitting was incorrect (that supposedly the Almanac had come out before Cloud was truly explained, but in fact it had come after almost all of it had been published). [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:35, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::This discussion has been open for twelve days. An unofficial tally shows at least 7-to-1 in favor of splitting. No one else has openly agreed with your position. Given that, and that Saix announced days in advance he would start splitting if there was no further discussion, it wasn't unreasonable for him to begin. But maybe there's a different split of opinions on the Discord or wherever, so it's certainly appropriate to ask for an official vote. Beyond that...the decision is just not up to you alone. The point of democracy is for all voices to be heard, not to leave every voice feeling satisfied with the outcome. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 11:08, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::I have no idea what's going on in the Discord server; I'm barred from it. I certainly hope there's not more discussion going on over there, because I was told that there would be a push to have these sorts of big discussions to be on the wiki. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:42, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::With all due respect: You need to stop putting so much emphasis on the in-universe designation, which AVP itself pointed out was ultimately arbitrary. I understand that AVP and the Almanacs are important to you, but Jim is not infallible, and while I'm sure he had good reasons for calling it "Primax" that's ultimately just ''his opinion''. Cloud being "its own thing" isn't some essential property; it's a matter of how to organise the wiki in order to make the fiction clear. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:47, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I also vote '''Split''' if only because of how better translations now has pointed out various past errors/assumptions/presumptions that needed correcting, and thus updating is needed so as to make things easier to categorize and organize here. Any wiki really worth their salt and wanting to do proper service to their respective franchises' fandoms would do the same. --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] ([[User talk:Lonegamer78|talk]]) 14:43, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::I ''still'' haven't got an answer for what makes Cloud so different that makes it ''need'' to be split. If there were a crossover between say, Marvel and Sunbow, nobody in their right mind we should completely separate, say, Huffer from Huffer. I'm willing to admit that I might just be missing something, but nothing in the stories themselves, as far as I can see, suggests it, beyond the aforementioned Cloud World classification, which for me is not enough of a justification. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:33, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::Neither Marvel nor Sunbow consists primarily of crossovers with another G1 continuity. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:20, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::If that's the main avenue of justification then frankly I don't think I'm ever going to agree with that line of reasoning, but I can clearly see I'm outvoted on this. I wish there would have been more people asked before the split was done, though, because I can see that this could very easily end up being another whole "retitling things to FSRLF" situation. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:00, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::We functionally split out Marvel and Sunbow versions for a lot of characters anyway. We're at the point where we draw lines based on how easy/hard it is for the information to be conveyed, not whether it's G1 enough or not. We think Cloud, as its own fullblown storyline/premise, falls on the side of "it's easier to read and parse it if they get their own shebang" instead of burying them in overlong G1 articles. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 21:11, 8 January 2022 (EST)

I'm not gonna argue further on this because I recognize it's a losing battle, but I think that the line of thought of "this one bit of media shouldn't be kept in an article because it won't get out there otherwise" sets a bad precedent that could easily be misused in the future. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:39, 8 January 2022 (EST)

Should the Cloud toys also be removed from the G1 character's pages? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 09:21, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:Yeah no, It vould be too convoluted, example look at the redirections [[Transformers_Cloud#Toys|there]]... where should each toy be redirected?? + the fiction regarding said toys has their own page now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 10:58, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::...What on earth are you talking about? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:16, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::Srry I misread his question.. I thought he meant "added" not "removed" from the G1 pages...
:Not entirely certain what you're asking, but the eight toys in the Cloud toyline (plus Deadlock) have already been moved to the Cloud pages in conjunction with the fiction, as they solely represent Cloud characters. The remaining Cloud characters repurpose existing toys. The writeups for those toys remain on the original pages with duplicates on the repurpose pages, as is standard practice. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:54, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::I mean, for example, [[Blaster_(G1)/toys#Generations|G1 Blaster's toy page]] has FOC Blaster on it, due to FOC Blaster being repurposed as Cloud Blaster. Should that repurposing be removed from G1 Blaster's page, since Cloud Blaster isn't considered to be G1 Blaster anymore? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 12:34, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::I believe yeah, the splitting between G1 and Cloud was recent (done last month) so there's still leftover traces on the wiki, if you can take your time to remove them why not -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 16:44, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::::Ok, good. I just wanted to check I wasn't missing anything. [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 17:13, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::::Oh! Yes those should go, good eye! -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 10:52, 18 February 2022 (EST)

==Split Movie Character Toy lists?==
Just as what happened with [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys]] and [[Megatron (G1)/toys]], I suggest we split certain Movie toy pages such as [[Bumblebee (Movie)/toys]] and [[Optimus Prime (Movie)/toys]] as both pages have become excessively bloated. I suggest we separate them by having the original Bay film toylines (07, ROFT, DOTM, AOE, TLK, and any pre SS sub lines) have their own page and starting a new one that Contains SS, BB, and the upcoming ROTB toylines, alongside any future movie toylines until the new page itself becomes heavily bloated [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Sorry for being this late but given that ROTB toys are apparently coming this spring, I suggest you split like one part contains all 5 movies while the other starts with SS and BB until now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 15:26, 22 January 2022 (EST)

== Multi-part comic stories ==

For old Marvel UK multi-part stories like [[Target: 2006]] or [[Time Wars]], we put the whole thing under a single article, but for modern-day ones like each storyline in [[Transformers (2019 comic)]] we have a separate article for each issue. Is there a good reason for the discrepancy, or are the old ones just an artefact of a time in the wiki's history that didn't follow our current standards? --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:36, 22 January 2022 (EST)
:The thing with that is that it's a result of how the UK comic was written; there'd be about 8 or so pages per issue, meaning that we'd have a lot of little articles that are easier just grouped together. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:16, 22 January 2022 (EST)
::Makes sense, although that's essentially what we have for [[The Transformers: Autocracy]] et al., which are also 8 pages per issue. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 15:38, 23 January 2022 (EST)
:::The difference with Autocracy lies mostly in that pretty much all of those issues have a beginning and end, and also have different titles. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:47, 23 January 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I always thought our headings on the Marvel UK story pages ''were'' the issue titles. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 01:21, 24 January 2022 (EST)

== Composite characters and page transclusion ==

This is something I've had the idea about for a while, but I've finally had a look at how the markup for it works and have come up with a proposal. The pages for [[Greatshot]] and [[Sixshot (G1)]] contain an entirely duplicated section set around the ''Victory'' cartoon owing to a retcon that occurred in the much later Legends manga. This is not an ideal solution because, among other reasons, any edits to Greatshot's cartoon section necessitates making the same edit to Sixshot's section.

Over in my sandbox, I've whipped up the page [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test]], containing only the events that happened to both Greatshot and the retconned Sixshot. By inserting <nowiki>{{:User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test}}</nowiki> into the relevant parts of Greatshot and Sixshot's pages (also sandboxed [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot|here]] and [[User:TheLastGherkin/Sixshot|here]]), the same information is automatically transcluded. And clicking "Edit" on, for example, the Legends manga section on Sixshot's page automatically redirects the user to editing that portion of Greatshot-test, thus updating all three pages at once.

If we go forward with this, I can see it being used for other characters in similar situations, like BWU [[Wolfang (Maximal)#Beast Wars: Uprising|Wolfang]], or Unite Warriors [[Roller (IDW)#Unite Warriors|Roller]], or putting the lion's share (pun intended) of [[Victory Leo]]'s fictional appearances back onto Victory Leo's page. With refinements, like say a <nowiki><noinclude></nowiki> explanation for what each subpage is for the layperson ("This page covers the events of the Japanese Generation 1 continuity, where Greatshot and Sixshot are the same individual...") and maybe a [[:Category:Transcluded pages]], I could see this really working, and it could probably be bent into shape for repurposed toys as well. [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 12:48, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:If we cannot avoid this sort of duplicated information entirely, this does seem like a pretty ideal solve to mitigate the constant peril of copy editing flubs maintaining multiple copies of one write-up entails. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:56, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Is there any way to get rid of the "This section is transcluded from another page. To edit it, please edit the transcluded page." notice? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:06, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:::There is! I just put that there manually while experimenting and also to make clear where the transcluded section is. In practice, since clicking "Edit" on a transcluded section takes you to the source page, a notice like that can be relegated to a commented-out note for editors who click to Edit the entire page (or a larger section). [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 16:16, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I thought it was automatic software stuff. Whoops, never mind. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:22, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Also, this works for fiction, but I see it running into issues when it comes to toys. (Thinking of Sixshot/Greatshot, Sixshot always gets toys first with Greatshot as the retool later in the same line.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:14, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:I've made some tweaks to my sandboxes, including standardising the transcluded page. Are there any objections before I start implementing this (in fiction sections)? [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 07:10, 12 February 2022 (EST)
::I sense that there could be an issue in the future where, for whatever reason, these sorts of characters diverge back into separate ones, whether it be through alternate continuities or whatever. Also, in the case of Greatshot, I feel like at the very beginning of his entry, there has to be something different to set up the Sixshot retcon, and just having the same opening text doesn't do that. 08:57, 12 February 2022 (EST)
:::His toy bio that mentions Sixshot as a separate person could go there. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 00:21, 16 February 2022 (EST)
:This could also be applied to Primus and Vector Sigma for their 3H comics sections since they are one and the same in that continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 19:26, 26 February 2022 (EST)

== What makes a franchise? Or, does "Precursor World" exist? ==

So, browsing around the wiki, as one does, and came across this: [[Precursor World (franchise)]]

Now, I'm not as well-versed in the Legends + Selects comics, so maybe this is incorrect, but to the best of my understanding, the branding "Precursor World" doesn't exist — this story was told across Generations Selects and Legends, and no toy or story was ever released branded as "Precursor World". It doesn't seem like the name even existed until pretty recently.

This...isn't a franchise, right? It's a long-running story told across various medium, but it's not a franchise, and calling it such implies something that isn't true.

Particularly, the idea that there is a "toyline" seems a bit of a stretch. There are only three listed "official" toys, but none of them were released under the "Precursor World" branding (which near as I can tell does not exist) and the list of "repurposings" seems almost entirely just "this toy/characters showed up in this story" which doesn't seem like anything's been repurposed to me. The IDW comics used a bunch of existing/prior toys, but that doesn't create a toyline of that comic series.

Am I off base here? --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:16, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:Okay there's a lot to unpack here but to begin with every single one of those toys is being repurposed as a separate object/character in a separate setting a la, for example, [[Green Tender Convoy]] and the [[Matrix Buster|Red Matrix]]. Most of the unnamed crowdfillers are minimized to footnotes on existing articles to avoid generating a bazillion stubs. The closest analogue I can give you is the [[Transformers: Shattered Glass (toyline)|toyline]] for the original ''Timelines'' iteration of Shattered Glass. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:35, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I'll grant that those indeed seem to be repurposings, but the vast majority of toys on this list merely link to the toy entry for the toy on the regular character's page. I don't think having a list of members of these groups is bad (it's good!) but I don't think this is a toyline. Again, crucially, Shattered Glass has a brand, with the official toys released under that brand, whereas precursor world does not. IDW repurposed WfC/FoC/aligned toys as G1 characters, but this didn't create a virtual toyline associated with that comic. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:46, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:::Arguably Shattered Glass toys weren't really released under their own brand either until the recent Hasbro Pulse stuff, until then the figures were all just released under the ''Timelines'' banner or whatever else Fun Pub used at the time - the idea of a singular "Shattered Glass toyline" was just as much of a constructed idea until like a year ago. I can't say "franchise" and "toyline" ''aren't'' slightly more non-literal labels than usual in this context, but I do think there's value in having the info collated like this, and I can't think of ''better'' labels that aren't something stupid like "(meta franchise)". [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 12:57, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::::To be honest, I'm inclined to agree re: Shattered Glass, and would not be opposed to restructuring the toyline page to delineate between the "Shatted Glass Collection" and "Shattered Glass toys released via Timelines" or something. Shattered Glass does, however, have a leg up on Precursor World given that every official SG toy was branded as "Shattered Glass" in some way, though perhaps not as a "franchise". The box set is called Shattered Glass, and every official toy was called "Shattered Glass". There's some nuance there, of course, as arguably those are part of the character's names ala "Prime Universe Bulkhead" is still a Legacy toy, not a Prime toy, but I'd be happy to have a debate around the best way to frame Shattered Glass stuff given those discrepancies. Allll that said, Shattered Glass is today a franchise, but there have been zero anythings released with Precursor World branding or labeling. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 13:06, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I don't think the page should be removed or even severely modified, but I do think the terminology is flawed. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 16:02, 3 March 2022 (EST)
Precursor World is definitely not a "franchise" and should not have that label. The model to look at here is the [[Beast Wars: Uprising]] article, which gives an overview of the thing, lists it's stories and toys, but does not use the "franchise" label, and doesn't ''need'' to use it. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] ([[User talk:KilMichaelMcC|talk]]) 15:07, 3 March 2022 (EST)

Yeah, no, this is not a "franchise", and the page should not be labeled as such. It is a ''setting''. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:I like the solution that AzimuthAcolyte gave on Discord: move "Precursor World (franchise)" to "Precursor World continuity" (with all uses of the word "franchise" changed to "continuity") and "Precursor World (toyline)" to "List of Precursor World toys". Simple and elegant. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:55, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Seconded.[[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:::That seems reasonable to me. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::::I'm for that. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::That's fair. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 23:59, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Works for me, somewhat obviously! If there are no major objections over the next day or two I'll get those moved over. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:48, 4 March 2022 (EST)
::Ohhh, That works -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 18:19, 4 March 2022 (EST)
Alrighty as it's been a day or so with no objections I am proceeding with the moves away from (franchise) and (toyline). --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 18:06, 5 March 2022 (EST)

== Episode Order ==
It's come to my attention that all cartoons have been listed in production order '''except''' Beast Wars, RID01, RB, and RBA. While I understand production order is not available for the latter two I suggest we change the first two for consistency's sake - Unless I'm wrong and they are ''not'' all in production order. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:48, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:We're not touching Beast Wars. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
::Beast Wars and RiD'01 not being in production order are accepted exceptions to the norm. We leave them as they are for reasons specific to each. But as for RB and RBA, we do have an idea of the production orders for each, but we instead use a weird mixture of production order and airing order that is consistent with no other series we cover. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 13:53, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:OK quick correction to myself, turns out that it's all supposed to be chronological order; That just happens to be production order for everything but those four. Sorry! [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 14:09, 16 March 2022 (EDT)

==Help with statues / figurines==
I wrote up many of the [[Transformers ULTIMATES!|ULTIMATES!]] entries, simply because no one else had. I don't actually care about that sort of merch and it ended up being me paraphrasing from press releases and copying their pics. Just today I learned there are 3 waves of TF [[Minimates]] that have no coverage here at all. It definitely seems like a lot of high-end statues are falling through the cracks as well. Is there someone who is willing to make that stuff more of a project? If not, could we perhaps put out a call for submissions on our Twitter feed? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:47, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I fear this is just... going to continue to be an Issue. The wiki is a labor of love, and the brand is at a point where there's a lot of stuff out there... well, that a lot of people probably aren't gonna love. Hasbro's moichandized the everloving HELL out of TF over the years, with more and more niche "G1" stuff that seemingly would never appeal to people for whom G1 is the big center of their fandom. I mean I just found some Micro Figures merch at a Big Lots, I've never seen these before, and I don't know offhand if they're on the wiki. They're kind of a nothing. It's hard to keep up. Same for stuff like phone games. 
:I don't know if there's an actual solution. ''Someone'' certainly needs to step up, but I kinda got my plate overflowing with my own pet (ha ha) niche chunk of TF history to exhaustively document, never mind dealing with stuff I am almost aggressively disinterested in. (Seriously what little Minimates experience I have left me with a worse impression of them than I already had from their hideous aesthetic alone.) Asking Twitter for people more well-versed in this stuff might could help for phone games, but... IS there anyone into Minimates as a whole Brand and not just in a "I get the licenses I like" sense to fill in gaps? --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 21:20, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::Once I had composed the thought "Hey, it's bad that there are a lot of Minimates out with us not covering them at all," it was too late, and I just had to burn 40 minutes on some cut-and-paste writups for the entire series. That's one "solution," I guess, but even ''my'' obsessive-compulsiveness can only go so far. Editing this site really should not feel like a job... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:18, 22 March 2022 (EDT)

==Implementing galleries==
I propose making galleries on character pages a wiki standard. The current mainpic + show screenshots format doesn't cover images like character models (Unless used as a mainpic), concept art, appearances in posters or toy murals, comic book covers, etc.
Other wikis have successfully implemented galleries, I think the Hololive Wiki galleries in particular work well as an example https://hololive.wiki/wiki/Tokino_Sora#Media.
This gallery header covers character models and has suites for concept art and even character uses in collaborative merch.[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:27, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Seconded. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:30, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I would say some version of this concept for a section has merit, if nothing else as a solve for major characters with several prominent character models, perhaps as a fairly unobtrusive method of documenting alt modes, etc etc. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:38, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::I'm for this. As a good example, the BotBots characters all look to have been radically redesigned for the show. By default the current standard is to keep the original stock art look will appear as the mainpic each page. Having a gallery option would be a good way to show both versions. [[User:ParadoxFactor|ParadoxFactor]] ([[User talk:ParadoxFactor|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Oppose. There is no reason for these to take up space on the character pages. Would not oppose separate "gallery" pages. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:57, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::If we are open to workshopping implementation I do agree a separate "gallery page" in the style we already use for more conceptual articles here and there would probably be cleaner. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 14:06, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I love the gallery idea. There's a question of how much to include, and the exact implementation details of how to portion out overflow if there's too many images. It's a shame there isn't some way to generate them automatically just by tagging images with the characters they depict. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::A separate page seems like it would be overkill for someone like [[Flamewar (G1)|Flamewar]], who would only take a few images to cover appearances not already covered by fiction section images. I assume if a small gallery was to be used on a character's page, it would be near the bottom at any rate? --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 15:22, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Yes, at the bottom would be ideal, no different from any of the galleries on our artist pages. IMO, separate gallery pages should only be used in instances where the number of images can't be comfortably fit onto one or two lines. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:33, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::I agree with Cyberlink. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 16:29, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Fair; Using gallery sections for those with few images and gallery pages for those with many images might make sense. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 15:46, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::See [[Megatron (G1)/gallery|G1 Megatron]] and [[Megatron (BW)/gallery|BW Megatron]] for examples of characters with enough images to justify separate gallery pages. [[Rhinox (BW)/gallery|BW Rhinox]], as it is now, is probably right on the line between "split it off" and "stick it at the bottom of the page". -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:58, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
I think choosing between a header at the bottom or a suite depending on image amount is a good solution instead of sticking to just one method.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 11:29, 22 March 2022 (EDT)
:Yeah, I think that would be good, as has been pointed out earlier. I do have to ask - because sometimes the artistic difference between characters in comics is slight with details only a little different in shape or kibble - would those fall under gallery stuff? Because they're effectively different per artist interpretation. I would be inclined to say yes, because effectively a different artist's rendition is shown usually of the same character without having reformatted or taken up armor or so forth. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 10:56AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I am very much on board with this idea. Having a gallery section or page depending on the character would be great, especially for characters like Flamewar who have a extremely prominent new design that we can't use as a main pic and for characters who have tons of designs, especially in the case of IDW where some characters change bodies every Tuesday. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:35 AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I think artistic liberty vs. new design would have to be on a case by case basis. Burcham's art of the BW cast wouldn't count for gallery purposes, in my opinion. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:08, 27 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I think it would be cool to have art of the same designs in different artstyles, but I agree it should probably be on case by case basis. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 6:17 PM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I currently have a sandbox to test galleries using Tigatron https://tfwiki.net/wiki/User:MrRald/sandbox/Tigatron#Gallery. I'd appreciate any feedback on things to add or change! [[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 23:44, 1 April 2022 (EDT)
::: I like what you have so far, I think we should maybe add a few more versions of Tigatron, like his different comic appearances and such. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]])

: Now that we're actually going ahead with this... I have to ask, what are the galleries actually ''for''? When we were discussing this I was under the impression that they were going to be for "behind-the-scenes" images that wouldn't otherwise have a place on the wiki, like out-of-universe character models, character concept art, or full-body renders from stuff like guidebooks. Right now, a lot of the galleries just feel redundant, given that they're just a bunch of cartoon and comic screengrabs taken from the relevant section and removed of all context... and a lot of them, like [[Blaster (G1)/gallery]] are just completely empty. The fact that every character ''can'' have a gallery does not mean that all of them ''should'', especially if most of them are just going to be redundant or mostly empty. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 18:57, 4 August 2022 (EDT)
::Agreed, I feel like this is bloating the wiki and toeing over the line of our vague remit. Despite having a LOT of images, we're not an image repository. Also, a lot of these could probably be done as a single subsection of the characters' mainpage under below "Notes" of whatever rather than as separate mostly-blank-space sub-pages full of sub-headers with like two images total in them. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 06:11, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, I didn't think they'd be separate pages. What I was expecting was whichever of the cartoon character model, Dreamwave profile art or package art weren't being used for the mainpic, plus behind-the-scenes stuff, plus maybe extra bits from artbooks, covers, or sources like that. Stuff that can't just be slotted into a fiction writeup—and I don't mean "comic crops we don't have room for because equivalent/better panels are already in the fiction section". —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:35, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
My intentions for the gallery pages were for users to actually do the work in uploading character models, renders, et al., not dumping whatever cartoon screencaps we already have in fiction sections. And separate pages would be on a case by case basis. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:46, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
I don't see the point, honestly. It seems like pretty much any significant body a significant enough character has will appear on the wiki at some point in a comic panel or a toy info image or a screenshot or something, somewhere. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs solving. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] ([[User talk:Hooper X|talk]]) 20:36, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

===G1 model images===
To branch off of this topic, how would we feel about using [https://www.allspark.com/forums/threads/the-most-accurately-coloured-g1-animation-models-online.301/ DM's coloured models] for the G1 cartoon model galleries? The last time I brought this topic up (on Discord), some people were against the idea, due to them being fan-colour works and not official, but a few newer developments have been made since I last brought it up.

To clarify, for those unaware of DM's works:

* All of the line art is original and unedited (unlike several of the models in ''The Ark'' books, which had been tweaked, altered and traced by Bill Forster to make them presentable for publishing).
* The models are the final ones used throughout the majority of the cartoon (in Toei-animated episodes at least). Note: several of the models in ''The Ark'' books we have also come to discover were unfinalized ones, due to the internet and more stuff being made public since what was originally found around 2007—not to discredit Jim and Bill's hard work in putting those books together, it's just some of what we knew then isn't entirely correct now.
* And finally, the colours (which was the big thing some people were against). Unlike the handful of fan-coloured models that were originally uploaded to the wiki in the past, which eye dropped colors straight from poor quality episode masters, DM's colours are based directly on Toei and Marvel Productions' model colour guides, colour codes, charts, colour chips found by a member of the ''Dragon Ball'' fandom (who has scanned and digitized said colour chips) and other original production materials, meaning that the colours DM has used are all coming from the ''original'' original source.

An alternative Mr. Rald had brought up on Discord is that we could possibly look at using the uncoloured model line art instead, if people feel strongly against using fan-coloured works, but I think in order to present the G1 character models fully as references, you kinda need the colours included, especially given how poor the cartoon production was, what with all the animation errors (even in Toei episodes) etc, making it hard to gather decent references for the characters, which is mostly what these galleries are for.

Also, for the record, DM has given us permission to use his colourings on the wiki.

Let me know you thoughts. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 01:39, 6 April 2022 (EDT)

: I personally think that we should use DM's coloured models, they are as official as coloured models are going to get, and it's not like DM just randomly picked and chose want colours to use as FOCS said. We could just have the model and the colour guide, but at that point, just have the model sheet coloured. I would however be in favour of the uncoloured models with colour guides and the sheets with the fully coloured models to cover all our bases. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:16 AM, 6 April 2022 (PDT)

== Making a page for the Unreal Engine? ==

War for Cybertron, Dark of the Moon (PS3/X360), Fall of Cybertron, and Rise of the Dark Spark all run on Unreal Engine, specifically Unreal Engine 3. Why isn't there a page for it. It could have good info on those wanting to mod those games.

Unrelated, but there's a server revival project being worked on for those games. Right now it's only on PC, and progress is slow, but should we include info for it in the pages for those games? It's not official btw, there's a Discord server for it and a few YouTube vids about it.[[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]]) 17:29, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not sure what information we could put on an Unreal Engine page that would be useful to modders. An Unreal Engine page would be general info on the engine and a list of games which use it. Diving into technical details isn't really something we do. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 17:52, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I think linking to {{W|Unreal Engine|Wikipedia}} should be sufficient. That's what I did when I ''unfortunately'' had to document the Funko NFTs. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:11, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I don't see what value there would be to this. Unreal warrants, at ''most'', a mention on the relevant game pages. We don't have pages for every program used to make every piece of TF media/product. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:33, 24 March 2022 (EDT)

== Category for characters with no established gender ==

So I just had this idea and decided to share it here because why not? We have categories for female characters and variable gender characters but not for characters with undetermined genders. Many BotBots for example don't have genders and I think this category could be a useful way of grouping them together. And who knows, maybe someday it could even help official creators specifically looking for genderless characters to establish a gender to them. Does anyone agree to implement this category? -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:06, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:This concept has been discussed before in the past, and generally the feeling has been that this would be a bit too much like the wiki actively trying to shape canon. Don't get me wrong, creators taking advantage of characters with no official pronouns is neat and I'm all for it, but IMO the wiki shouldn't directly serve up them. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 19:26, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
::Interestingly, I can't seem to find a prior community portal discussion about this matter, though I know it has come up on the Discord server more than once, to the conclusion Jalaguy mentioned. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 19:35, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:::Just to clarify, I thought of "official creators using it" as a quick example in favor of the category, but now I can totally see how it sounded like trying to influence canon too much. Regardless, I'd still be down for having the category if we agreed on it being useful for any other reason. -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:51, 3 April 2022 (EDT)

== Category for trans characters ==

We had a productive conversation about the no established gender thing on the wiki discord and it made me realize that there should be a transgender category for the five established trans characters that there are so far, Arcee (who has established trans characterization on two different pages), Howlback, Arcadis, Anode, and Lug. Jalaguy mentioned that this has been discussed and people thought it was a good idea but it hasn't happened, so I just thought I'd ask for go-ahead on this. I figured that transgender rather than just trans could be a good word to use for this, due to them all being people who have gender. The term trans is merely more broad and could cover different kinds of transness than that or aesthetic stuff that is similar to gender, but we have no confirmation of being there yet in canon. Thus I think transgender would be the most accurate and desirable term here, and the umbrella trans can always be tacked on later if we need to. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 5:40PM 3 April 2022 (PDT) (edited 5:48PM PDT for clarity)
:Seconded. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 5:53 PM, 3 April 2022 (PDT)
::Since there are no objections, I'll go ahead. :3 -- [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 4:19AM, 11 April 2022 (PDT)

==Streamlining disambig headers (revist)==
So I remember this conversation from last year about streamlining the disambiguation headers. I checked back on the talk page discussion (link to said discussion archive here https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal/Archive69#Streamlining_disambig_headers) to see what happened and even though there was a lot of people who liked the idea with some who did not, it did not seem like it went anywhere. I thought I'd see if anyone else would like to revisit this idea as I feel like this would streamline things more, especially for Movie and Aligned and maybe a bit of UT especially for the guys who show up in all 3 shows or those don't have other bots who are completely different sharing the same name within the trilogy. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 9:01 PM, 12 April 2022 (PDT)

== Disambig tags and suites for Masterforce paired pages ==

We need to balance out our page titles for ''Masterforce'' human + transtector character pairs. Right now we have among extant pages and tentative redlinks:

Bullhorn (G1), Cab (human), Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (human), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (robot), [something], Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (robot)

I propose either we do human gets no species tag with the robot getting a species tag as the splinter page:

Bullhorn (G1) | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

or the human does get a species tag to equally balance with the robot:

Bullhorn (G1)/human | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

This would eliminate the need to have any longer-within-parentheses tag like "Minerva (G1 robot)" which would be affected by future continuities which may not yet have happened. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:55, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
:I would prefer either the human gets the "default" continuity tag with no further disambiguation or (human)/(robot) (with needed variations for disambiguation). The slash system is ugly to me. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:59, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::I'm of the opinion that the slash option for both feels the most fair. While the human versions were the first and thus feel the most deserving of the "default" tag, the robot versions are likely to become more commonplace and relevant as newer fiction dips its toes into using more Japanese characters. On a similar note, it was decided not to give the "BW" tag to either BW Silverbolt out of fairness, so while a similar "human/robot" concept could be implemented, there is the problem with Minerva having an Animated counterpart who is also a robot, Cancer having an Animated counterpart who is also a human, there being a Kre-O Bullhorn who is also a robot, a G.I. Joe Lightfoot who is also a human, and an IDW Wilder who is also a human. "Minerva (Headmaster)" also doesn't work for the G1 robot since the human was a Headmaster too. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 16:29, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::The slash system may not be entirely visually pleasant, but I consider having "Minerva (G1 robot)" in parentheses worse. In my proposal, all transtector characters would be unified symmetrically as "(robot)". [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 17:47, 24 April 2022 (EDT)

Here are three proposals to unify the namespaces:

Possibility 1: humans get nothing and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1), Cab, Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai, Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (G1), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 2: both humans and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1)/human, Cab/human, Cancer (G1)/human, Clouder/human, Ginrai/human, Shūta Gō/human, Lightfoot (G1)/human, Minerva (G1)/human, Ranger/human, Road King/human, Wilder (G1)/human

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 3: both humans and robots get parentheses

Bullhorn (G1 human), Cab (human), Cancer (G1 human), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1 human), Minerva (G1 human), Ranger (human), Road King (human), Wilder (G1 human)

Bullhorn (G1 robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (G1 robot), Doubleclouder, Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1 robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (G1 robot)

Thoughts? [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 01:12, 12 June 2022 (EDT)
:Isn't Option 1 one basically just a slightly different version of what we're already using and what you're proposing to change in the first place? Anyway, like I said above, Option 2 is the most fair between the human and robot depictions (as Option 1 feels like we're saying "The human versions are the more important versions" when it's the robot versions that are more likely to get any representation in future comic appearances), and it reduces the amount of multiple-word parentheses tags that we usually dislike using and try to avoid as best we can (which is the exact opposite of what Option 3 is proposing). Though, drop the "/human" from Clouder and Shūta Gō since their names already differ from "Doubleclouder" and "Goshooter". No need to complicate those two. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 08:45, 12 June 2022 (EDT)

==Transformers: Armada (Trading Card Collection)==
I recently discovered that Fleer published a Trading Card collection in 2003 for Transformers Armada.
I've documented everything I could find about it - including an Energon (preview) Scorponok card I got from a local retro game store.
[[Iacon0/Sandbox]]
Is it alright if I roll this out? [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 12:52, 1 May 2022 (EDT)

== WFC/FOC Reenergized Server Project info? ==

Info: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLO5yzrWE9yVT56Rgxl9oqntVysxWr2k7e

Basically, it brings back the multiplayer servers for the Cybertron games, PC and PS3. Should this be talked about in the pages for those games? (ROTDS and ROTF aren't online at the moment, and 360 versions won't have support) [[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]])}
:It's not official, so no, it shouldn't. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:54, 27 June 2022 (EDT)

== Handling of "former GoBots" and "former Diaclone" characters on the wiki ==

So recently we've been seeing multiple characters that had previously been portrayed as dimension-hoppers from non-Transformers realities, but using Transformers designs — [[Bug Bite (GoBots)]], [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]] and [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]] — appearing as "normal" Transformers ([[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]], [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]]). There's some heavy dispute over whether we should put them on the same page or split them out (e.g. "since the GoBots Bug Bite isn't ''originally'' from a G1 universe, he shouldn't go on the G1 Bug Bite page), so I thought we should probably have a centralised place to put together a comprehensive set of standards.

My take, personally, is that GoBots and Diaclone are *not* continuity families, they're their own properties that happen to cross over with Transformers, and so shouldn't be split on that basis. I feel that Burn Out and Lift-Ticket, regardless of them being portrayed as Diaclone mecha in their initial appearance, are the same basic concept as the likes of Road Rage and Tigertrack — "Transformers versions" of existing Diaclone toys and decoes. It helps that [[Spin-Out (G1)]] inherently blurs the lines, having first appeared as a "normal" Transformer ''before'' he was portrayed as a former Diaclone mech.

For the GoBots characters, I'd frankly be tempted to go even more radical and just merge ''all'' of them — put all the [[Cy-Kill (disambiguation)|Cy-Kill]] cameos on one page, like we do for other external property characters. Even in the edge cases like [[Fracture (Movie)|Fracture]], there's the precedent of her actually being intended as just ''being'' the GoBot. It feels a lot simpler to me than the headache of having Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, and Bug Bite, the ''other'' white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, having separate pages on a technicality. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:57, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Hard disagree on GoBots. By virtue of covering the Scioli comic in full, we have a GoBots continuity family to put them in. I say keep the ones who are explicitly GoBots at (GoBots), and put the ones who are Transformers (or ambiguous) at their respective continuity families. Basically, what we're doing for Bug Bite, do for all of them. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:23, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:I don't agree on movie-Fracture in specific and the mass-merge of ''all'' GoBots-based characters in general. Fracture's a movie-universe character who premiered in a movie-based toyline and appeared in movie-timeline fiction. "The toy was originally conceived as" holds very little water there in light of all the rest of that. I'm not wild about merging characters from different continuity families (aka "major franchise umbrellas", the point of that divide was always less "fiction-detail based" and more "real-world Hasbro/Takara starting over based" as an organizational tool), as that leans heavily towards the Wikipedia style "just lump 'em all together" manner that... doesn't really work for our scope. There's SG Bug Bite and Crasher too, I don't think they should go under a giant singular page for the character concept.
: But ''in general'' I agree with keeping stuff like Lift-Ticket and Burn Out together because the distinction is really too nitpicky to be useful. If we get an EarthSpark Lift-Ticket who is a red Hoist-like bot, then they can go on a separate page because "new major franchise umbrella" gives a decent degree of separation. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:25, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: Oh, well, the SG GoBots are an obvious exception. If it's a "mirror universe" I feel like it should never share a page because the point is that it's the opposite.
:: That said, there are other nuances I admit I skimmed over — stuff like Wings Universe Cop-Tur, who's based on the original but is a secret genius and a good guy, I'm not sure he should be merged in. At the same time, though, splitting the Bug Bites feels disingenuous, and I'm not sure whether there's a good middle ground between "split 'em all" and "merge 'em all". --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:44, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I also agree there isn't really a good middle ground. But here's the thing: If GoBots wasn't a factor and it was just G1 and Cyberverse, we wouldn't be having this conversation. At the end of the day, they're from another IP, but they're also genuine Transformers characters, and thus they should remain split like other Transformers characters. And that includes treating the genuine GoBot incarnations as separate entities. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:51, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I am, honestly, not sold either way on splitting/merging re: the "very distinctly the Tonka GoBots who originated from the Tonka GoBots franchise". I feel that there are '''''definitely''''' some bots that should not be merged with the Tonkas, by virtue of being from different continuity-families/hub-franchises (bots from the live action movies and Cyberverse, for example, should really stay separate). I'm less concerned about "in-fiction origin" because that's a clusterfuck all its own since 1984 best just left alone and we already disregard that for like Nebulans and stuff anyway, though I'd also argue that like, it should be taken into consideration the diff between an homage and an iteration (I'd argue ''Timelines'' Cop-Tur is the former and probably shouldn't be merged). But even just looking at them from the real-world staggered integration of the franchises, GoBots ARE a weird edge case (whaaat, something Scioli was involved in got weird? ''nnnoooOOOOOooooo'') and it kinda feels off to not treat them as a separate thing given their ultimate origins. But like, they are, functionally, "G1" characters as far as "how they were brought to TF" goes in the real world, and I'm not convinced that splitting out WFC Bug Bite is really a good idea or terribly helpful. So like, I dunno. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 02:06, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::::And then there's the ''very'' unique case of GoBots Stretch having been given a retroactive backstory of being born in the world of Transformers Animated before he crossed dimensions and became a GoBot. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 02:23, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::::If anything, Stretch is a Transformer pretending to be a GoBot.
:::::The criteria that keep this wiki running and readable have always had some smudgy bits, and if you stare too long at any of them pretty soon all one sees is the smudge, not the dividing line or even the story itself. Cyberverse and Prime are each ''basically'' a retelling of G1, and if they didn't have a few features we've accepted as clear dividers from "real" G1, they could have gone within G1 just as much as the IDW comics have. The divisions are necessary to keep information from being a useless, unstructured, unnavigable mess; hopefully we can draw the lines in a way that comes to require the fewest exceptions later. '''My thoughts''': when there's a Bug Bite whose origin is explicitly "I'm not a Transformer, I'm hiding among them, creatures like myself find Transformers to be nauseating uncanny valley aliens," then that's a pretty extreme division, more extreme than many others we've been holding up for years without controversy, and should stay very much separate from any other Bug Bites who are just plain ol' white car Transformers. The various Cy-Kill cameos in G1 and Armada should stay separate, just because that's how we handle other hi-and-die cameos across firm storyline borders (Animated Overlord, SG Krok). I agreed at first with splitting the Burnouts/Lift-Tickets, but if it is really causing a huge dilemma I do not object to re-merging them. Each pair exists within the G1 storytelling universe. It is not essential that we build 2 different pages for G1 universe Lift-Tickets where one of them is a Diaclone mech and the other looks just like it and comes from someplace called Diaclone. We could paper that over with a "Note" explanation. The really important part is that both the Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket cases must get the same resolution. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 05:10, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:I vote for split. I regret ever pushing for merging similar concepts around the time of ''Ask Vector Prime'' because a decade ago this wouldn't have been a question, it would have been settled with "obvious they're different characters." [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:38, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Strongly in favor of putting the Diaclones back together so long as they remain essentially G1 guys. Especially since we now have ''two nigh-identical Burn-Out pages that differ only by which sliver of fiction section they possess''. Moderately in favor of putting all the dumb Cy-Kill cameos together because, like, it's only moderately funny to split out Cy-Kill (Armada) on a technicality. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 20:47, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: I'm going to stay out of the Bugbite / Fracture question. I'm too involved on the creative side. I think Walky nails it about Burn-Out & Lift-Ticket. And probably the Cy-Kill cameos too. --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 21:11, 29 July 2022 (EDT)

:I have to ask: if this is a concern, why did we split out the Cloud articles a month ago. Because they also are clearly designed to look like G1 characters, and aside from some minor changes in personality and dimension hopping stuff (which also applies to these three examples here), are near-identical in fiction to their Generation 1 counterparts. What makes them different from Bug Bite, Burn Out, and Lift-Ticket? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:29, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Lead Cloud translator here. As we discussed in-depth at the time, the Cloud characters do nothing *but* dimension hop and frequently cross over with the Japanese Generation 1 cartoon continuity and their own G1 incarnations, rendering them nigh unintelligible when buried in A-list G1 articles. The Cloud issue was one of logistics and readability, not one on the philosophy of intrinsic "G1-ness," as I believe was said at the time. I would also argue something on the scale of Cloud is a different discussion entirely from the current topic of merging two one-paragraph articles.

::On a most practical level re-merging a thoroughly deliberated and reasonably large scale split from a couple months ago just strikes me as kind of a waste of community resources.

::For those that missed it the impetus was translating the other 80-90% of the prose and the discussion can be found [[Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal#Splitting_Cloud_characters|here]]. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

Had a brainwave about a potential way to handle the GoBots characters—as a compromise between "treating them like full Transformers characters" and "treating them like external properties", use the GoBots page as a "hub" for the others. I've mocked up a couple of sandboxes for [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Cy-Kill|Cy-Kill]] and [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Bug Bite|Bug Bite]]. Any thoughts? --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:16, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:If we absolutely have to (which I still really don't agree with) I'd prefer this over full fledged merging. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:02, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:I think this is a good compromise. The important thing is that there's a clear delineation between the dimension-hopping GoBots and native Cybertronians, and I think this fits the bill. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:03, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
::I still don't like the idea of rolling in the ''Cyberverse'' Bug Bite or any other not-G1-franchise iterations on the GB character concepts (like movieverse Fracture), even in the proposed super-abridged-and-linked-to-main-article format. For the appearances within the franchise of TF-origin, sure, I think this works. Cy-Kill's multiverse of murder... ehn. I'm not really feeling strongly either way but like we got hi-then-die charcater micropages aplenty, I don't think Cy is something terribly unique to not get them. Like... we got a page for "the many deaths of Optimus Prime", I feel like "the many deaths of Cy-Kill" could probably stand to be its own thing if we REALLY wanted to hammer the point of how stupid and hack it is home. Which, come to think about it, I kinda DO. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:42, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Ah, see, Fracture was something I was specifically thinking of here — I thought it would work to accomodate both the original intent and how she's been tied back to Crasher in <s>Jim's nonsense</s> fan-targeted media while still respecting the practical reality of Fracture as her own, movieverse character. That said, I do understand your reluctance, so if the majority is against this I'm not too fussed. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:22, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, it feels like "Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee" is its own Transformers thing at this point. He may have originated as a GoBots transplant (both in real life and in fiction), but that doesn't automatically make every iteration of Bug Bite a GoBot, any more than every subsequent iteration of Lockdown or Lugnut is considered an Animated character. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 04:34, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::::I appreciate the work Riptide put into this and like the writing / presentation style employed... and I just still don't think it's necessary. Between disambigs and "You Look Familiar...", we already have ways to cope with characters who look alike across different continuities but who aren't the same character. Most of these transplanted GoBots are absolutely not the same characters as each other - most of the Cy-Kill cameos, Cyberverse Bug Bite. There is no need for us to build a new way to unite those cross-continuity characters when nothing unites them more than the "basic concepts" that we've kept separate on hundreds of other name / appearance reuses. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 08:43, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::I adore this brain blast, over and above what I proposed below (as it actually accommodates, in Cy-Kill's case, say, the ''Armada/TransTech/Animated'' cameos), and think the fact that people on both sides of this polarising issue aren't immediately opposed to it makes it strike me as a really good compromise. I still would prefer the ''Diaclone'' pages to be merged with their G1 counterparts, but whether or not it's a full merge or just the "main article" structure here, the intro phrasing proposed with Cy-Kill and Bug-Bite is perfect in my opinion. The key thing for me is that, when people look up info on Cy-Kill or Burn Out, they still find a pointer to the relevant information at the exact point they'd expect it to be, and not only that, but they can chart the entire conceptual history of the character on one page (I know the disambigs theoretically do the same, but in practise Jo's approach is much more effective). Assuming the same policy isn't applied to ''Uprising'' appearances, I still think something should be done about those—but otherwise I'd be very happy with this. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:16, 1 August 2022 (EDT)

So as I understand it, the consensus is that Diaclone characters should share a page with their G1 counterparts, and that — at least for the moment — GoBot characters should be left as-is, with White Bumblebee's G1 adventures split between the GoBot and G1 pages? Would appreciate some more input before we begin implementing this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:09, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:I still don't like the Diaclone thing but clearly I'm outvoted. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:48, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:More or less. I'm fine with rolling G1 WFC Bug Bite in with the explicitly-GoBots one in the manner test-bedded above on the same grounds as the whole "Nebulan/Cybertronian" deal with Targetmaster gun-bots we've done forever; I think the proposed format both works with the way we've handled disparate depictions between different fictions within the same franchise chunk for a very long time now while noting the important real-world issues with these transplanted characters. And it's not like the combo page would be anywhere near big enough to make a split-out necessary. But I'm willing to table that for the moment while moving ahead with rolling the Diaclones back in. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:15, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
::I agree with this completely. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:11, 3 August 2022 (EDT)
:Diaclone characters should share pages with G1 counterparts who are also canonically said to be Diaclone-y. If we ever get a "Gobots Universe Bug Bite" that would be merged too - but just "white car Bug Bite" should not. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:21, 3 August 2022 (EDT)

==Proposal re: G1 pages==
I'm not expecting anything other than a hard "no" on this from the vast majority of editors, but a few people impelled me to post it, so here goes. In particular, I think this perspective is one held by many casual readers of the wiki. As I said over on [[Talk:Burn Out (Diaclone)|Burn Out's talk page]], I think both camps feel a sense of "''obviously'' these are (not) the same character", depending on whether they're coming from a strictly in-universe perspective or not. I want to put that whole discussion into an even broader perspective. Plus, I think the list of characters below is an interesting resource in its own right.

For ages, the wiki's had it so G1 appearances of characters originating in ''Robots in Disguise''—such as [[Sky-Byte (RID)]]—just get put on those pages. My understanding is that RID was considered something of a special case, because of how it was originally conceived as an in-continuity G1 thing, and remained such in Japanese continuity. For a less-prominent example, see also ''[[Power Core Combiners]]'', which similarly lists the IDW G1 appearances of [[Smolder (PCC)]] and [[Steamhammer (PCC)]] just on those pages. Again, this was a special case, because PCC was never concretely established as being a live-action movieverse thing or a G1 thing (which makes sense, because in Hasbro's eyes at the time, that wasn't a distinction that mattered to them).

There are other areas on the wiki that take a continuity-agnostic approach; I think it's just character pages that are handled so strictly. Check out [[Noisemaze Mass Production Type Version]]—which honestly ''is'' a character page in every way that matters—for a recently-made-relevant-again example. For many bigger-picture concept pages, a similar approach is used to great effect: [[Transformation]], [[Scanning]], [[Energon]], [[Protoform]], [[Spark]], [[Living metal]], [[Mini-Con]], [[Energon mutation]], just to grab a few random examples.

To draw attention to one last point, which I predict will resonate a lot with people who already agree with me and not at all with people who don't: any and all ''Beast Wars'' or ''Beast Machines'' original characters are exempt from this issue—despite, on a real-world level, there not really being any difference between those franchises and the likes of ''Armada'' or ''Animated''. It's just the lore connection that keeps it tethered, despite the wiki treating it as its ''own'' continuity family in basically every other way that matters.

My specific proposal is this: '''for characters originating ''outside of G1'', don't keep separate G1 pages.''' Treat those characters as we do Sky-Byte, ignoring the "continuity family" divide, and put the appearances on the page where they're most relevant. Here are the salient benefits of this approach:
*Have all the information on many popular post-G1 characters in the place where most casual readers would expect to look.
*Cut the Gordian knot of the GoBots/Diaclone debate.
*Finally ditch all those (BWU) pages consisting of a single sentence and a duplicated toy entry.
*Fewer redundant toy writeups which need to be maintained in parallel.
*Far, far fewer awkward paragraphs in Notes sections talking about "continuity transplants" like those are a real thing.

Here is a list of pages which I think would be affected, sorted by continuity, just from an hour or so of searching:
*'''''Diaclone''''': [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]]
*'''''GoBots''''': [[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Crasher (G1)]], [[Cy-Kill (G1)]], [[Leader-1 (G1)]], [[Rest-Q (G1)]], [[Cop-Tur (G1)]] (!)
*'''''Armada''''': [[Hot Shot (G1)]], [[Red Alert (IDW)]], [[Demolisher (G1)]], [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Sideways (RM)]] (!), [[Treadshot (IDW)]]
*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Override (BWU)]], [[Ransack (IDW)]], [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Signal Lancer (G1)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Barricade (IDW)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Breacher (G1)]], [[Terradive (G1)]], [[Hailstorm (G1)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''Animated''''': [[Bulkhead (G1)]] (!), [[Lugnut (TF 2010)]], [[Lockdown (G1)]], [[Slipstream (G1)]] (!), [[Oil Slick (G1)]], [[Lightbright (G1)]], [[Lickety-Split (G1)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Breakdown (IDW)]], [[Airachnid (G1)]], [[Predaking (Kingdom)]], [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Rescue Bots''''': [[Medix (G1)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Scatterspike (G1)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Headlock (G1)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Transit (G1)]], [[Fracture (Cybertron)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Cyberverse''''': [[Shadow Striker (G1)]], [[Croaton (G1)]], [[Meteorfire (G1)]], [[Wildwheel (G1)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Doomwings (G1)]], [[Ursa Major (G1)]], [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': (deep breath) [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Twirl (G1)]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Sky Blast (G1)]], [[Sureshock (G1)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]
I assuredly missed some, so feel free to edit the lists above to add any other characters that would be affected by this proposal which are omitted!

Again, the vast majority of these are from ''Beast Wars Uprising'', which does have some weird lingering cases that would need further individual discussion, I think: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]]. But for the most part, I really don't see any reason why there should be all these tiny nothing pages; the only reason all those Mini-Cons were not called Mini-Cons is that in the ''Uprising'' universe, Mini-Cons are called Micromasters instead (which is the lore equivalent of "[[Barricade (G1)]] doesn't look like he's made of knives"). This is even ''less'' an irreconcilable lore detail than, for example, the organic/robotic split for Targetmasters and the like. My main goal with sharing this is to revisit the ''Uprising'' policy, because from where I'm sitting, it's resulted in exactly the same horribly inconvenient setup as the ''Diaclone'' stuff. A different, specific policy there would deal with most of the examples above, and I'd be very happy; what I've suggested is just a one-size-fits-all policy.

The weirdest victim of this stated policy, I think, is that of [[Bulkhead (G1)]], who technically originated with Animated, but whose appearances in G1 media have all drawn specifically from the ''Prime'' version. [[Slipstream (G1)]] is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: [[Slipstream (Animated)]], [[Slipstream (WFC)]] and [[Slipstream (Cyberverse)]], depending on which specific version is being depicted. That means all of the Bulkhead appearances would actually go on the ''Prime'' page. I really don't feel strongly on this detail, though. [[Cop-Tur (G1)]], as mentioned in the above discussion, is another edge case. One more strange case ''not'' listed above is that of [[Emissary (IDW)]], who homages the ''Robots in Disguise'' character but genuinely has what I'd consider to be a radically different portrayal, likely inspired as much by the ''Titans Return'' figure as anything.

To be clear, I consider G1 a special case because of how it's a catch-all label for anything that isn't Hasbro's newest ground-up reboot du jour. Like it or not, G1 usually doesn't actually mean "G1" any more, it just means ''Transformers''. I absolutely wouldn't want to start merging anything from other continuity families—that way pure madness lies. But I think this proposal has clear-cut criteria for inclusion, and would feel more consistent with other areas of existing wiki policy. To give a specific, relevant example: I don't think [[Fracture (Movie)]]'s appearances should be folded onto her merged ''GoBots'' page as some have suggested, ''but'' I do think her toy writeup should be on both without any "blah blah repurposed" hedging, and likewise for the other movieverse characters based on redecos designed by [[Joe Kyde]] contemporaneously with Classics and Universe with specific G1 characters (mostly Micromasters) in mind, some of which were even intended to be released as part of the ''Universe'' toyline. These being: [[Fracture (Movie)]], [[Big Daddy (Movie)]], [[Jolt (Movie)]], [[Grindcore (Movie)]], [[Breakaway (Movie)]], and [[Crankcase (Movie)]]. [[Mudflap (Movie)]] and [[Inferno (Movie)]] are basically the exact same but nobody ever talks about that.

Finally, I think [[Gigatron (G1)]]/[[Overlord (G1)]], [[Zaptrap]]/[[Kuwagatrer]], and [[Rotorbolt (Timelines)]]/[[Skyklik]]/[[Fumes]] should prrrooobably be revisited? In the former two cases, they exist due to niche media establishing them as separate individuals within the same continuity, but we already have precedent for dealing with that—see [[Hot Shot (G1)]]. I will concede that the Rotorbolt situation is quite funny.

I understand that the wiki is structured the way it is for good reasons, but the post-[[Evergreen]] state of the franchise is one where most writers are plucking characters from anywhere in the franchise's history without any significant changes to their depiction. The existing policy will only become more cumbersome as time goes on, in my eyes—I know for many editors, the list of pages above is a horrible scary list of Exceptions, but from where I'm sitting, they feel more like exceptions as they already stand? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 07:25, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:As someone who is basically sympathetic to your goals and not knee-jerk opposed to the idea, this:
:::"Slipstream (G1) is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: Slipstream (Animated), Slipstream (WFC) and Slipstream (Cyberverse), depending on which specific version is being depicted."
:is the worst thing I've ever read. Just, why? --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 08:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I was mostly being glib, I don't have a good answer there! Just wanted to draw attention to the fact that it ''would'' be a problem with the proposal. It's also been pointed out that all of [[Lockdown (G1)|Lockdown]]'s appearances are visually based on the ''Revenge of the Fallen'' toy! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:56, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Absolutely not. There's so much here that's based on false assumptions/incorrect information that I absolutely refuse to take any of this seriously. Concepts are on the same page because they are just that: concepts. There's so much to pick apart here but because I have important things to do, I'll just say that right now, the only reason why there was ''ever'' any confusion over Power Core Combiners is because fans took behind the scenes information from the company overly literally. You actually look at the one piece of information about the toyline (the brief history provided directly by Hasbro the club) and it makes it abundantly clear that it was always meant to be movieverse; I even argued back at the time about Smoulder and Steamhammer being put on that page, and the only reason why it's still that way is because the argument just fizzled out. And once again, I really have to ask: why the hell are we pushing forward merges based on "vibes" when we still keep the Sideways' (someone who is actually said in fiction to all be the same guy) apart based on moronic, petty reasons? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:01, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Yeah, no, sorry, I think this is ultimately unhelpful and going to cause more accessibility issues than it solves. "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in" is perhaps a little confusing to new readers, but it's ultimately fairly self-consistent and easy to navigate once you understand the basic concept; "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in, with the exception of RID01 which shares its pages with G1, and any latter-day characters imported into G1, which go on the pages of their non-G1 incarnations" is very confusing and requires you to be deep in the sauce to understand which characters are and are not exceptions to the rule. I obviously think that flexibility of the system is a good thing — the RID/G1 merge, while less than ideal, is definitely the best way to solve a very unintuitive issue — but the more holes we poke in the tower the closer it comes to collapsing, if you catch my drift.
:Ultimately I think the occasional silliness of "Shadow Striker (G1) who is identical to Shadow Striker (Cyberverse)" and such is the price we pay for having any structure whatsoever. The more we make exceptions on the basis of ultimately arbitrary "well this one's SO similar" the less consistent the wiki overall gets, and the harder it gets to navigate. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Basically, this. And I don't even think that drawing the franchise-based chunk distinction is all that confusing given I think most people grok the idea that characters will pop up across sub-fictions of major multi-media franchises with varying levels of similarity to prior incarnations that are still "oh, it's a wholly separate storyline, okay". That's just how these things ''do''. (and like "multiverse" has kinda become a ''thing'' in other franchises the last several years) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 10:00, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:"We've always put RID guys appearing in G1 as still being the RID character, look at Sky Byte" - what other examples make this an "always"? There WERE two Sky Byte pages, for years. We only stopped having a Sky-Byte (G2) when its character model in the IDW G1 comic was explicitly based off the new T30 toy sculpt which wound up with like half of these separate articles duplicating each other. It was argued on that talk page for a long while. The only other case I can think of at all is Gigatron (G1), and we ''don't'' treat him like Megatron (RID).
:"We treat BW as a continuity family like Armada, it looks like we are showing favoritism to them" - we treat it like a franchise within G1, which is what it is. And we disambig by franchise, not by continuity family. "Chase (RB)", not "Chase (Aligned)" or "Chase (Prime)". This was one of the concerns I raised last year when we turned Victory, Masterforce et al into G1 because they had no separate box branding of their own, wait it turned out they did, welp whattaya gonna do, no backsies.
:'''Last but MOST''', I'd say that, yes, "lore connections" mean a great deal here, it is a feature not a bug. This is a fiction-centric wiki as surely as it's an English-centric one. We put character writeups first, above the toys. We give the toys the character names and say "his stickers", not "its stickers" and talk about how it represents the character, not about how many micrograms of silicon it contains. Separating characters because they come from different storyline eras / offerings is entirely normal and reasonable for us. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 09:43, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I don't disagree in general, but G1/IDW Gigatron DOES share a page with RID Megatron. [[Gigatron (G1)]] is the Overlord repurpose. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:49, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Oof. Don't know why I clearly remembered them as being separate, but in any case I regret the error. Thank you.--[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
There's no way to organize something like this place without something somewhere seeming arbitrary. I think the existing structure is arbitrary in the best way that makes the most sense, and trying to "mitigate" that arbitrariness just creates different arbitrariness. A lot of this "but what if we redid all this to fix this particular thing" shuffling just relitigates why we already do the stuff we already do. so, like: no --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 09:54, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

== The Discord ==

Alright, seriously, we need to talk about this. It is beyond frustrating that a greater than 50% chunk of discussion about what big edits will happen on the wiki are happening on an app that people either aren't on or (in my case) aren't allowed on. I was told it was going to just to get voices onto things but that clearly isn't how it's working out. We need either some sort of archival dump of all these posts or something because I'm tired of getting into arguments where half the responses haven't even happened on the main site itself. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:45, 17 August 2022 (EDT)
: I think you're drastically overestimating how much discussion about big edits is happening on the Discord. No actual big decisions are getting made there, and we make it a point to repeatedly remind people that discussion for major changes needs to happen here before anything gets decided. But we also can't stop anyone from simply talking about things there the same way we couldn't stop discussion on the AllSpark thread when that was a thing, and having a public log of discussions from the editing channel is both infeasible and frankly unnecessary. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 09:09, 17 August 2022 (EDT)

==Designer bylines on toy writeups==

As those of us who have been tuning in to the [[Hasbro Pulse#Livestreams|Hasbro Pulse livestreams]] have no doubt noticed, one side effect of the unprecedented transparency of the current team on the ''Generations'' franchise is that we are now pretty consistently being blasted with a fire hose of toy designer credits. While there's been a scramble to record them on the designers' pages as best we can, this rapidly growing body of information is not doing the average reader a whole lot of good sequestered away on pages that require them to already know the designers by name. As such, I've put together a template to act as a designer byline for relevant toy write-ups, largely following the formatting of our existing voice actor template.

Documentation for the prototype template which I've named '''<nowiki>{{toydesigner}}</nowiki>''' can be found here:

*[[:Template:Toydesigner-Prototype]]

And a variety of examples of implementation can be found here:

*[[User:AzimuthAcolyte/Sandbox/Toy credits demo]]

Is this something we would be interested in implementing?

Questions, concerns, suggestions etc are welcome. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:33, 22 August 2022 (EDT)

:I support adding this template, it's valid information and helps put names and faces in a historically anonymous industry due to the lack of credits in the products themselves.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:38, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I think this is a great idea. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I really like it. The only possible negative is that unless a whole bunch of people are very dedicated to this (or one brave soul is ''extremely'' dedicated to it) we might end up seeing it only appear on a small handful of toy entries and most will never feature it. I vote for going ahead with it regardless.
:::While we are addressing the "designer credits" issue, can we also please find a better phrase to use on the designer pages than "Toys So-and-so is known to have had a hand in creating"? It's just so overwrought. I think "Design Team Credits Include:" gets the point across much more naturally.... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 13:54, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::::This is a fair point. Maybe something as blunt as "Known Design Work" mirroring the "Published Works" thing we use for writers/artists? -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Looks good to me. Hope we can scrounge together sources and lists for older design teams too. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 15:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I can't see any reason not to do this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not a toy person, but that looks really cool! --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 16:23, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
Oh wow, I'm blown away by the universally positive reception here! If there are no concerns in the next few days I guess I'll get started rolling this out. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Alrighty it's been a fair bit with no further concerns, so I have pushed the template live to [[:Template:Toydesigner]] and will begin implementing it as I have time. Any and all help is appreciated, as this will of course be a huge job. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 16:13, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Wiki Toy Photo Quality Standards ==
So we know (and had long suspected anyway) that Hasbro designers are sometimes pulling Wiki photos for reference. That's great, but we've got some toy photography on here that's a good bit off from what the figures look like in reality for one reason or another. Is there any way to flag shots that are out of whack so that they might get tweaked or replaced? This issue comes to mind since, while I've been here more or less since the Wiki started, I don't recall there being a formal set of standards for photos since it just wasn't really a big deal before now. Oversaturation is my main complaint, since one user a long while ago was going through, taking existing shots into Photoshop and oversaturating the hell out of them without regard to the actual toy, and I've noticed some updated photography like [[Prowl (Magnaboss)]] that does basically the same. It's a larger photo, but that Prowl is definitely not blazing yellow in person. Apologies in advance and please disregard if this has already been discussed elsewhere or before.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:10, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:For the record, my lighting set up is very warm, hence why Prowl's colours appear so bright. I haven't figured out the right balance in Photoshop to get the colours of figures to look spot on so figures either appear too bright or too dull in the finished product. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 17:30, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::Oh, I'm not intending to put you on the spot, that's just the first example I had on hand of a wider issue that we probably need to start being careful about since it appears to be (hilariously) affecting actual figures now, like Titans Return PMOP or Legacy Iguanus. When it was the one guy tweaking things to be inaccurate "because it looked better", I could follow him and revert stuff, but I can't when there's nothing to revert in most cases.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 18:38, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::I recommend ring lights, you can get some pretty cheap, they've good at spreading light out rather than heavy-focus, and they have adjustable brightness and warm/cool light settings: use "cool" (aka white/blue-tinted). Even before I got ring lights, I used "cool" light bulbs in the lamps. The problem is these are nowhere as common as the "normal" yellow-tinted bulbs, thus, go with the ring lights.
::As for "standards"... well, good luck with that. Every camera's a little different. Every MONITOR is a little different. Hell, I have a double-monitor setup with different models and they have small but distinct differences in brightness & etc; honestly I'm good with it since it lets me check how things may look to different people. But I think maybe a tag for photos that we are CERTAIN are too far off from final product (be they user-made or stock images) may not be a bad idea. Assuming we notice. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 22:44, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, a tag we can throw on to a photo just to make it at least visible that it's incorrect would be useful. And would probably prompt a deco designer to gather some secondary reference material, assuming the tag's obvious. I like the idea.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:29, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I've noticed that the quality of the UT stuff in the toys section flunctuates greatly-- for example, ML Starscream still uses the guidebook picture, and Superlink ver of the combining Optimus downright doesn't exist. I've started to collect UT toys since Hasbro has been updating UT stuff with more commitment and I have 0 faith in them doing it right, and most of the stuff I've gotten are the JP versions. For minor alterations like ML/ Armada Megs, is it worth uploading a completely new picture of ML Megatron onto his page? Another issue worth regarding discussing is "cartoon accuracy". Whilst Hasbro is indeed working on making more accurate figures, they obviously aren't 100% accurate, like 86 starscream using the commonly accepted G1 logo instead of the sunbow accurate one with the spike in the middle, and even from a sculpt and proportional standppint the ER mold is far from accurate compared to the sunbow model, let alone MP52. I actually cleaned up the page for TM2 Megatron because he deviates pretty heavily if you compare the CG model to the final toy, and changed the claim that Skids is "toon" accurate as he is blantently based on the original toy in deco. The same goes for Starscream, aside from the forearms and forehead hes blatently based on the T30 toy. I also had to edit that bit --[[User: Pixelmaster|Pixelmaster]] 3:31 HKT

==Reconsolidating some of our pages==
This is something I've been thinking about for a while, but I'd like to propose re-merging some of our excessively split articles back into something more manageable. It seems like that once a page is split out, a) we get a lot less editorial oversight, as the recent toy page trimming has revealed, b), stuff does not get updated nearly as often as they would be on their respective mainpages, and c) it makes information harder to find by pushing it behind a subpage that's not readily accessible.

Obviously I understand that splits are necessary for the really long pages like [[Optimus Prime (G1)]], [[Megatron (G1)]], and soforth, but when you get down to like, [[Mirage (G1)]] or [[Hound (G1)]] or [[Hot Shot (Armada)]], there's barely anything of any significance on their main pages beyond Dreamwave or the odd IDW cameo. Are, for instance, [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]]'s Marvel adventures that major that they can't fit into the main page? Are [[Hook (G1)/toys|Hook]] or [[Warpath (G1)#Toys|Warpath]] really that inundated with toys that they need their own subpage? If it's a problem of just ''length'', then a lot of the subpaged articles or mainpage stuff like the storybooks could just be trimmed down into something more manageable—as I did with G1 Cliffjumper's Marvel section earlier this year. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 17:00, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:I 100% agree with this. --[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:04, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Fully in favour. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 17:20, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Sub-pages should, on their own, be significantly sizable pages to justify making readers link-jump. A dozen toys does not strike me as remotely enough to justify a subpage split. Being ''in'' a major long-running fiction but mostly having appearances in a minority of installments that can be summed up in two sentences doesn't justify a split. New editing tools are fun and all, but just 'cuz you gotta new hammer doesn't mean you have to go hunting for anything that looks vaguely nail-like. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 18:18, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Incoming maintenance ==

Just a heads up, our host is going to be doing some maintenance in about an hour that may cause problems with the site, so if you have trouble reaching it and therefore cannot read this message, that's what it is. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 00:11, 23 November 2022 (EST)

== Foreign names ==

A dispute came up recently on the [[Megatron (ES)]] page. User:Kiké Prime has been providing Hungarian names for all the characters, but this one apparently is just "Megatron". Cyberlink420 removed it. I disputed it, pointing out that not listing it leaves the implication that we do not know the name of the character in the language. Despite having my reversion again reverted, I still find deliberately leaving blanks in our name lists odd. I am thus bringing the matter here for further discussion. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 12:16, 5 December 2022 (EST)
:My understanding has always been that we only add foreign names if they are different from the English name. Per pages like [[Megatron (G1)]], this includes examples where the name is the same, but is spelled with a diacritic or using a different alphabet. So "Megatron" wouldn't be different enough to justify inclusion, but examples like Mégatron, Megatrón, Мегатрон and メガトロン would. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:10, 5 December 2022 (EST)

== Nonbinary Character Category ==

So, we now have another nonbinary character (who actually used their pronouns during the media no less), [[Nightshade (ES)|Nightshade]] from [[Earthspark]] (Nightshade at time of posting doesn't have a page yet)! The other fully for certain fully intentional one is [[Screwball]] from [[Beast Wars Uprising]] while [[Acid Storm (Cyberverse)|Acid Storm]] was at least an out of media by writer retcon of animation, and [[Overlord_(G1)#Ask_Vector_Prime|Overlord's]] gender is somewhat nebulous on where that fits beyond being gender expansive due to being [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#December 23, 2015|"what some would call genderfluid"]] but that at least puts us at three. Given that we have a trans category now we thought it best to at this point suggestion a nonbinary category for the sake of users (including gender expansive people) easily finding nonbinary characters on here. Obviously adding Nightshade will have to wait until they have a page but any thoughts on this yea or nay? [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 18:28, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:I forgot about Screwball. I think with three confirmed examples, even without the edge case of Overlord, that's probably enough to justify one. Care will have to be taken, however, to only include confirmed examples and not use it as a dumping ground for any character whose gender has never been explicitly identified. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 18:37, 8 December 2022 (EST)
::Authorial intent and all, but I can say that if I had the option to go back and rewrite it I would have used the term non binary for Overlord. I feel like Acid Storm is more of an edge case; it’s what one person said on their account to justify it. Whenever Acid Storm actually says something they’re animated with a female face; it’s not done at random.[[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:47, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::Acid Storm changes from masculine male to feminine female and back. Gender-fluid, sure, but definitely non-binary? As for Overlord, in the Legends manga Mega gives Overlord a female-presenting face - is there a pronoun change during that time? Would we have more candidates for inclusion in a Gender-fluid category first? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 20:17, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::::Thank for the notes folks, that does help to piece this together! Just want to note that a pronoun change is not necessary for a gender being experienced in fluidity to be the one expressed or what have you, so unless the Legends manga actually has some sort of statement about Overlord's fluidity that kind of puts us back with an umbrella term of nonbinary (which we are unsure as not having read the Legends manga if that would work for that Overlord so we can't speak to where/if Overlord falls under gender expansiveness beyond the fact that Overlord's presentation changes depending on the binary bond partner right?). Acid Storm is an edge case yes but if we do count the edge case that they are we think it is worth noting that for Acid Storm what Catt said was specifically that changing expression is just something they do, and "any pronouns" work for Acid Storm, no statement about the binary. Of course, we only see two faces which are the two different Seeker faces that were otherwise delineated by gender, but at this point we're getting into the opt-in thing of 'x person is genderfluid and thus considers themself nonbinary' or 'z person is genderfluid and only considers themself as under the multigender umbrella'. Which we don't have detail on really if Acid Storm is genderfluid as how they know themselves right? Because that's just a thing that was written in the Female Transformers page because of (no blame being given, it's understandable) the user finding that to be the term that fit best? Feel like we've ended up just pointing out an need for just a gender expansive category instead but ah well. [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 21:46, 1 January 2023 (EST)
::::::We seem to have killed this with a non-solution for the nonbinary category by pointing out that gender expansive is more certain than saying genderfluid. If we count Nightshade, Overlord, and Screwball, is that a go on nonbinary, or should we just have a gender expansive category at this point that would also be one trans characters use? For people wondering what gender expansive means you can find a definition here https://www.diversitystyleguide.com/glossary/gender-expansive/ https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/08/gender-expansive-mean/ [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 23:18, 6 February 2023 (EST)
:::::::Respectfully, I think needing to invoke a glossary suggests the term is so little-used in common parlance that it would not be useful for our needs and style. We don't have a category tag at the bottom of a bunch of BW characters saying "tetrapods" or "perissodactyls" (we ''do'' talk like that on [[Popular beast alternate modes]], maybe a grouping ''page'' would be a better approach? Just a thought...). If we are looking for a category tag I think it would be better to find the term that unambiguously covers the largest number of candidates, without a need to rely on edge cases, maintaining both accuracy and readability. I see three characters that could sensibly go in a Gender-fluid tag, one that could go in a Non-binary tag (meaning we wouldn't make the latter). We may be facing a case where there are few enough disparate examples that there isn't one single category tag that usefully unites them. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:55, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::::::::With the most recent block of EarthSpark episodes having further explored Nightshade's character and introduced a new nonbinary character in the form of Sam (this also saw the term nonbinary used in the show for the first time), we have been discussing the topic of introducing a Nonbinary characters category on the Discord. Doing some research, AVP also confirmed the Tigerhawk of Primax 496.22 Alpha (the Beast Wars cartoon continuity) to be nonbinary, so that's another character to justify that category. It's been suggested by an expert on the matter that we could introduce a "Gender expansive characters" category as an umbrella category, with Genderfluid characters, Nonbinary characters, and Transgender characters existing as subcategories as a way of future-proofing our coverage of gender expansive characters, while also ensuring we don't lump every gender expansive character together into a single broad category and hopefully making these concepts easier to navigate for casual readers. - [[User:Archforce|Archforce]] ([[User talk:Archforce|talk]]) 17:26, 4 March 2023 (EST)
:::::::::In sequence you replied to my post of Feb 7 but seem to have side-stepped the part where I questioned the usefulness of a category tag that will not be widely understood. Also, creating such a category exactly ''is'' "lumping them all together into a single broad category." So is that approach desirable or not? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 17:43, 4 March 2023 (EST)
:::::::::: They said the word nonbinary in the show. In a show full of nonbinary rep. And then nonbinary characters exists outside of that show, and it would not be a dangerous bet to expect this to continue. But people are born with an innate understanding of what an Alpha Primax 9384u743 is, or Transmetals, or Powermasters, but not what a nonbinary person is so yeah maybe we are going too far on this website for nerds who want to learn more about things related to Transformers (like nonbinary characters). We have a category called council members. Literally for any character who has served on any council. I did not understand what "council members" actually refered to before I clicked on it, assumed it was more specific than it was, but in fact it took me two seconds to figure it out. A non-binary category and/or gender-expansive category would surely be the same. And as Archforce says, make these concepts easier to navigate. Or if that was too long, what Walky said. Seriously. You also appear to misunderstand what is meant by lumping together. Because putting all non-binary people in a non-binary category is accurate, and is something I and at least some others want, putting all non-binary people on a transgender page would be a misrepresentative "all of these are the same thing right?". Gender-expansive on the other hand comes from someone familiar with the matter, and as a non-binary person myself, as someone who has researched gender representation in media at an honours level (to flex some credentials that yeah I could be making up), I agree with what is being said on the Discord. Gender expansive as an umbrella provides the room to not lump everyone together while recognising yeah there is something shared in any act of gender that is not one of cisgender conformity. Having transgender and nonbinary characters on the same page while called out as two seperate subcategories I again think helps casual readers navigate based on this. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 18:40, 4 March 2023 (EST)
::::::::::Not using the best useful terms because they're not understood by enough people is extremely self-defeating. I reject that line of thinking. (also, like, c'mon, the first complete article for this wiki was gaddang Robot-Master, not Optimus Prime, so I think we can say the words "gender expansive" even if someone hasn't heard of them) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 17:49, 4 March 2023 (EST)

== Adding an informative table to each character page ==
I was thinking about it since it's striking.. lack.. There should be a way to tell people in which and how many episodes/issues/movies each character appears in the continuity they belong to, their debut episode/issue movie, what aliases they have had and nicknames they were given by other characters, a more centered area for the voice or live actors, a link to their gallery pages(if they have any) and one to their disambiguation pages etc. The kind of information that one would prefer to find with greater ease, especially if they aren't members. And talking about their appearances, that should prove quite useful for future page edits, since we'll know exactly where to look especially when it's about latecomers or characters that don't appear on a regular basis. I just think it'd be useful. [[User:Darthrone|Darthrone]] ([[User talk:Darthrone|talk]]) 15:44, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:This kind of infobox was discussed at the very earliest days of this wiki, and it was decided that there was just way, way too much information for it to work... and this was in 2006, BEFORE the franchise exploded. TF is such a fragmented kludge of fictions from multiple sources and creators spanning 40 years that any major character would end up with one ultra-massive thing of dubious use (can't say I see the value in a "number of appearances" tally, aside from the headache of keeping that accurate over time and arguing "what counts"), or a billion splintered ones spread across the page for the different fictions. And "nicknames" is always a minefield as those tend to turn into a massive list of "someone called them this once" which is... not helpful. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:46, 2 February 2023 (EST)
::Even if it had been a day-1 thing, I don't see how this is more informative than our current style. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 17:58, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:::I'm for infoboxes, but the information you're asking for is far too abstract and meaningless in this franchise. (We are absolutely not doing "nicknames". No.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:09, 2 February 2023 (EST)

==The (BWU) tag==
I understand the reasons why [[#Proposal re: G1 pages|my previous proposal]] regarding the proliferation of (G1) pages for random newer characters was soundly rejected. However, my main motivation for raising it was that I find the huge quantity of (BWU) pages for "repurposed" Mini-Cons and bestial Transformers to be reader-unfriendly, so I wanted to make a case for making an exception for ''[[Beast Wars: Uprising]]'' cameos. ''Uprising'' was an obscure barely-canon multi-continuity-drifting web serial which we are very unlikely to get further instalments of, and most of the relevant characters are similarly very deep pulls who will assuredly not be appearing again in future stories, and who will otherwise be stuck with tiny stub-pages forever. Most of these are Mini-Cons (here Micromasters) or bestial Transformers (here Protoformers), with a few boats or Constructicons from "[[Derailment]]". In many cases, I perceive ''Uprising'' as having tried to give these toys a hint of fiction where previously they had none at all, much like [[Ask Vector Prime]] before it. It's a very different phenomenon to most so-called "continuity transplants" we've seen in other series (such as with, say, [[Hot Shot (G1)]]), which are instead rooted in the popularity of those characters.

I think the problem here is that strictly speaking ''Uprising'' is a "Primax" continuity, sure, but it lifts dozens of characters (let alone concepts) unchanged from later stories. Slavishly hewing to that label when it's such an intertextual melting pot has resulted in this unfriendly setup. It feels like a fair decision made at the time (was [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive64#Derailment & Uprising pages|this discussion]] the one?) but in my opinion the wiki's policy kinda fails here. If we get rid of the (BWU) tag, the (G1) back-ports remaining (a minority!) will be for more significant characters, often adapted more radically. Here's the list of tiny pages we could be rid of, just like that:

*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]

There's a handful of ''Uprising'' characters that need a (G1) page anyway for non-''Uprising'' reasons; I'm totally ambivalent about where the ''Uprising'' content ends up for these: [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Override (BWU)]] (!), [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Twirl (G1)]].

Finally there's a few weird cases that would merit individual discussion but would probably just need to keep their own pages: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]].

Here is a ([https://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=500&offset=0&redirs=1&profile=all&search=%22from+the%22+%22continuity+families%22 probably non-exhaustive]) list of existing cases of multi-continuity drifting you should probably consider before weighing in:
* [[Buckethead]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 31, 2015|this Ask Vector Prime answer]])
* [[Drydock (TF 2010)]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 13, 2015|this answer]] which explicitly has him travel from one continuity to another)
* [[Drelnar Feh'd]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 17, 2015|this one]])
* [[Scorpia (G2)]], [[Autoceptor]], [[Deceptor]], and [[Kaltor]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#June 12, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Night Rescue Team]], [[Clear Skies Team]], [[Rapid Intervention Team]], [[Prehistoric Team]], [[Demolition Team]], [[Dirt Digger Team]], [[Heavy Load (Universe)]] and the [[Mobile Fortification Team]], and [[Detectas]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]]).
**However, exceptions from these Mini-Con teams are [[Nightscream (Cybertron)|Nightscream]], [[Offshoot (Cybertron)|Offshoot]], [[Strongarm (Cybertron)|Strongarm]] and [[Knockdown (Cybertron)|Knockdown]], who all have separate (Cybertron) basis on the basis of receiving separate bios after being packed in with ''Cybertron'' Primus...
**...but then [[Liftor]] is all on a single page, despite his ''Classics'' bio.
**[[Snarl (Classics)|Snarl]], [[Sledge (Classics)|Sledge]], [[Wideload (Classics)|Wideload]], [[Knockdown (Classics)|Knockdown]], and [[Steel Wind]] already have ''Uprising'' content on their pages, but that makes sense as these were originally ''Classics'' guys.
* The [[Saurian Strike Team]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Minicon 8 Pack]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 24, 2015|this one]])
* The ''Dark of the Moon'' Mini-Cons [[Dualor (DOTM)]], [[Triceradon (DOTM)]], [[Rav (DOTM)]], and [[Catilla (DOTM)]], plus [[Ironlunge]], [[Reptix]], [[Sling (AOE)]], [[Gnashteeth]], [[Wedge Shape]], [[Brimstone (Universe)]], [[Apexus]], [[Gredator]], and [[Dragoyell]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#August 13, 2015|this one]])
** Weirdly, we ''separately'' have a page for [[Rav (BWU)]], but Catilla has Unicron Trilogy, movie, and ''Uprising'' appearances covered all on the one page!
* [[Galadria]] and [[Ramak]] (because of [[Source:Transformers: Spacewarp's Log#December 5, 2015|this post]])
* Am I to understand that [[Wind Sheer (RID)]], [[Skyfire (RID)]] and the [[Dimensional Patrol]] each have just a single page because (RID) ''is'' part of the G1 continuity family sometimes...?
* And I understand that [[Primus Vanguard]] cameos just go on their original pages because that's a weird thing kinda outside of G1 anyway (at least from an in-universe perspective, if not a real-world one).
* ''Diaclone'' examples like [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]], [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]], and [[Chifumi Takahashi]] have been discussed to death.
* [[Monsterous]] was retconned to originally be from an Aligned universe (in [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#October 21, 2015|this post]], though I can't actually find any mention of Uniend? EDIT: [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#November 7, 2015|found it]]!)
* [[Primacron]] was apparently mentioned in ''[[Transformers Animated: The AllSpark Almanac II| The AllSpark Almanac II]]''.
* And [[Sentinel Supreme]] is just an Easter egg that everyone seemed to shrug about at the time.

To those who say the exception I'm proposing would be confusing, I submit these existing examples where we've apparently neglected to split something out as evidence that the only people this confuses are wiki editors like me wondering why they're not all that way. Maybe I'm just unaware of some aspect of the existing policy which accounts for all these cases? But is it really helpful to anyone to have a given toy's associated fiction squirrelled away somewhere separate you have to go into the disambiguation to find? We recently merged [[Chromhorn]] (another Sorenson job) on the basis that "There's literally no reason for these to be on different pages. They are the same thing." Can we not do the same for these Sorenson-penned cases that are basically going "look, the exact same guy shows up in multiple universes, alright?" And if the answer is no, will someone go through and split all these out? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 18:27, 6 February 2023 (EST)

:I think my response to your earlier G1-import proposal still applies here: the more exceptions we make to our system for the sake of "accessibility", the harder the overall structure becomes to grok for a new reader, and thus ironically it all becomes ''less'' accessible. Why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steel Jaw]], but ''Uprising'' Bisk be at [[Bisk (RID)]]? Or, conversely, why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steeljaw (RID)]], but LBS Steeljaw be at [[Steel Jaw|Steeljaw (IDW)]]? Neither solution is good.
:As for the current list of exceptions, I'd argue everything you list from Buckethead to the DOTM Mini-Cons should probably be split. Galadria and Ramak are characters from outside media, so we don't split them across continuity lines. Wind Sheer and Skyfire have one page for consistency with the other RID guys. The source on Monsterous being Aligned is [[Source:Ask_Vector_Prime/Facebook#November_7.2C_2015|here]], but I would argue that's just giving an origin to the GoBot and so they should share a page anyway.
:Lastly - I object to you bringing the Chromhorn thing into this, as I don't think it's a fair comparison. Chromhorn wasn't making any exception to our categorisation system; it was one page saying "Chromhorn is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT" and another saying "Chromhorn Forest Type is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT", and the former was somehow a "repurposing" of the fictionless latter. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:24, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::Totally get the Steeljaw example—although it ''is'' crazy that we're currently disambiguating G1 wolf Steeljaw simply by [[Steel Jaw]]. You should post about the disambiguation tag policy change you suggested on Discord, I think a lot of people were thinking along similar lines there. Agree with your interpretation of the current policy as to which of the examples listed should be split and which shouldn't—although the more I think about the Primus Vanguard, the more I think those should technically be split too. While I guess the [[Time Warrior (AVP)|Time Warrior]]s are multiversal travellers like Drydock. RE: Chromhorn, I understand why it's technically different; I brought it up because I think it speaks to the tenor of ''Ask Vector Prime'' answers—in spirit, I think its aim was exactly the same as with the Mini-Con examples I've given.
::What do I mean by that? To match your Steeljaw example, from the opposite angle: say I'm your typical fan scrolling [[Transformers: Dark of the Moon (toyline)]], and I click on, say, [[Dualor (DOTM)]], wondering if he's ever shown up in anything. In their current state, I get my answer immediately. With the proposed split for consistency, I instead get a page telling me that Dualor (DOTM) is a dinosaur Mini-Con from ''Dark of the Moon'', some info about the toy, ''maybe'' ending with an inscrutable note about how he was "repurposed" as an identical guy. Now, there's ''already'' an unrelated [[Dualor (Armada)]], so we'd need to make a disambiguation page. We can see this already by looking at [[Snow Cat (Universe)]], which is barren (the very scenario AVP so often tried to address!), and doesn't even admit to the existence of [[Snow Cat (BWU)]] aside from a general Snow Cat disambiguation tag. In some existing cases like [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], we've mirrored a toy writeup, which needs upkeep in parallel; in others, like Snow Cat, we're asking the user to visit the other page to read about the toy ''anyway''. To my mind, this is inarguably less accessible. I don't understand arguments made about accessibility here which are predicated on readers having learned editing policy to begin with, and I don't think this proposal would actually make it any harder to learn the system.
::I regret not listing out all the individual members of those Mini-Con teams above, to better communicate the sheer number of pages that would need to be made (and pages that would need to be renamed, in case of conflicts) to create this inconvenience in service of a rule we've already been ignoring without issue. Nobody wants to do this work, and I think it's less that no-one cares, and more that some people think it'd actually make the wiki worse, and the rest don't particularly think it'd make the wiki better.
::What about just making an exception for Mini-Cons/Micromasters? I've talked about ''Uprising'', but obviously the vast majority of cases that theoretically need splitting aren't from ''Uprising'' at all. Could probably even do a generic template like "X exists in multiple continuity families, and is a Micromaster/Maximal/Predacon in those without Mini-Cons". Thus your Steeljaws and Bisks and Overrides go unchanged, no problems or ambiguity there! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
:Once upon a time, I probably would have pushed for something like this, but where we are now: I am not a fan of any push towards treating something differently based on how "relevant" something is or not. It goes against the very spirit this wiki was founded on, because that is what was happening to the Wikipedia coverage of Transformers where they were just getting rid of things wholesale because of "relevancy." I can understand the basic point behind this, but I feel that doing so would set a bad precedent that could be exploited in the future.
:I'd be fine with splitting most of these out. I've said it before elsewhere but by and large a lot of the inconsistencies were largely the result of different contributors adding stuff or splitting stuff without a general consensus, and they haven't been cleaned up afterwards. Also, a minor note, but the Liftor thing was mainly cause no one noticed at the time until I wrote up about the profile years after the fact. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:26, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::If I gave the impression "relevancy" was the main thrust of my argument here, I didn't mean to! Like, it goes both ways—would we be merging because ''Uprising'' is so irrelevant that we shouldn't devote all these random stub pages to it, ''or'' are we merging because it's sufficiently relevant that we shouldn't be hiding that content in stub pages nobody visits? Either is true! I'm arguing for convenience and clarity. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::: This definitely feels like the strongest argument to the merge in my mind. The wiki is no stranger to niche pages, pages for nameless, fictionless, toyless nonentities. But I believe these fictionless toys and toyless fiction which are really the same thing would be a richer niche page for the merges. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 20:36, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::: I really think that once again, this overrates the number of people who would be confused by this, and underrates the number of people who would be able to figure out where to go if they wish to find the information. Like, I hate to do the whole "I was able to figure it out" thing but I was a small child with a single-digit age when I first discovered the wiki and I was able to figure out pretty quick why it was laid out the way it was. I'm not saying there's no room for improvement; I think there's a lot of cases in which the way we have things set up now is kind of ridiculous. But in this particular case, I don't really see how merging things would be any more convenient than just leaving them the way they are and splitting out the cases that we never got around to. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:52, 7 February 2023 (EST)

Just found some more pages that would need splitting under current policy: [[Crystal Widow]], [[Seawave]], [[Cradon]], [[Freefall (Kre-O)]], [[Liftoff]], and [[Epsilon Holdings]]. All due to ''Uprising'' and ''The Allspark Almanac''. Really hoping someone can propose a solution here that doesn't involve creating a billion pages and disambigs. --[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 09:24, 18 February 2023 (EST)
:We don't split businesses/locations/organizations, so Epsilon Holdings isn't one we need to consider. Kre-O doesn't really occupy a continuity family in our organization and I would just split the rest, especially Crystal Widow. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 09:28, 18 February 2023 (EST)

MediaWiki talk:Community Portal

2023-03-04T23:40:16Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Nonbinary Character Category */

__NEWSECTIONLINK__

This is the place for discussion of topics that affect the entire wiki. For less wide-reaching subjects, either use articles' individual talk pages or [https://discord.gg/N99Bygq our Discord server].

Some topics that would ordinarily be here have merited their own pages:

{{chapters|title=Specific Discussion Subjects|align=left|content=
<div class="list-header">'''Moving From Wikia:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving|Arriving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving|Leaving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki:Community Portal/Complaints|Complaints]]
 <div class="list-header">'''New Ad Policy:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki:Ads|Ads]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Bookworm Database-Crash:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Damage Control Central|Damage Control Central]]
* [[Project:Bookworm Crash]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving2|Leaving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Server Move:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving2|Arriving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Relicensing:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Relicensing|Relicensing]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Dealing With Vandalism:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Vandalism|Vandalism]]
 <div class="list-header">'''GoBots Sister Wiki:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/GoBots|Discussion on the place of GoBots in this wiki]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Wiki Technical Information:'''</div>
* [[Transformers_Wiki:Tech|A Not So Brief Summary of the Horrible Things That McFly and Co. Have Done To Keep This Wiki From Melting Down]]
}} 

{{:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}/Archive}}


== Site Logo revamp ==

Up until now, our rotating logo on the main page tends to have a batch of logos pointing to pages from the most recent franchises and series, plus a few from older franchises that we forgot or didn't bother to remove. I'd like to rework this system a bit to have a more even balance franchise-wise. I think we should have one character for every franchise that has had a cartoon or movie (including the JG1 shows), plus one from each of the major English-language comic runs (Marvel, Dreamwave, IDW1, and IDW2 at the bare minimum). This would be a good way to demonstrate the breadth of the franchise scope of the wiki, and help drive new readers towards legacy content. (Of course, we'd still have a few extra banners based on whatever is currently running for the "Hey, I know that guy!" factor. Would love to get some thoughts on this, and potentially character suggestions for each franchise. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 00:59, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:I think this is a great idea! Though, I'm unsure on which characters from each show would be good to use. Like, would we go most popular/memorable characters or just some really random left field obscurities like G1 Skids who appeared in only two episodes of ''The Transformers'', just to get some more eyes on character articles from franchises newer fans may not be fully aware of? Also, would Japanese-exclusive shows include ''Go!'', ''Q-Transformers'' and ''Robotmasters''? If so, maybe even an image from ''Portal'' (the Russian show) would be worthwhile too. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 02:47, 18 December 2021 (EST)
::Obscure/minor stuff risks just being the GO! Boxes again, and we already have those. For the big logo, best to go with majorish characters from majorish media. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 07:19, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:This sounds like a great idea. We could break it down like this:
G1 Seasons 1 and 2 - Optimus Prime,
TFTM/G1 Seasons 3 and 4 - Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime,
G1 Marvel - Ratchet,
Headmasters - Fort Max,
Masterforce - Minerva,
Victory - Star Saber,
Idk if we would do Zone or any of the Japanese G1 stories that came after,
Beast Wars - Megatron,
Beast Wars II - Lio Convoy,
Beast Wars Neo - Magmatron,
RID/Car Robots - Side Burn,
I've never read Dreamwave so I don't know a good character that represents it,
Unicron Trilogy - Hot Shot,
IDW could be broken into a few character reps because of how long it went on,
IDW Furman Era - IDW Bumblebee,
IDW Post Furman - IDW Galvatron,
IDW MTMTE/LL - Nautica,
IDW RID/OP - IDW Optimus Prime,
Animated - Bulkhead,
Movies - Bumblebee,
WFC Games - Bruticus,
Prime - Starscream,
RID15 - Strongarm,
Cyberverse - Windblade,
WFC Trilogy - G1 Megatron,
And then we can have a few slots open for characters from the latest shows/movies. This list would give new readers an idea on how big the franchise truly is and how diverse the characters are. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Certainly if anyone's gonna represent CR/RiD'01, it's gonna be Sky-Byte, the breakout star of the show, and not Side Burn, the Autobot womanizer. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:26, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Funilly enough I meant to put him there lol. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 20:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Dreamwave, I'd pick War Within Grimlock. Certainly Shockwave should be part of 2005 IDW since he's responsible for the whole sha-bang.--[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] ([[User talk:MistaTee|talk]]) 18:40, 5 January 2022 (EST)

== Splitting Cloud characters ==

So now we have some sorta adequate translations, I'm being increasingly convinced that merging them just on the basis of AVP was a mistake and that the Cloud characters should be split out for simplicity and ease of explanation. Notably, the central conceit is far more similar to TransTech than G1—and more different to G1 than Cyberverse, for instance. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 02:44, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I was against it then and I'm against it now. They're nothing like the TransTech; they are practically nigh identical to the G1 guys, there's a war going on in their universe, and the "central conceit" of them being multiversal guardians is more akin to Alternity than it is to TransTech, who for the majority of their fiction were at most passive observers. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I am declining to weigh in personally until I finish first pass translations but please at least pretend to look over the translated material before repeating the same arguments. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:19, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::I have looked over it. Nothing is convincing me that it's all that separate from G1 stuff. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 12:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::"War going on" describes most of Transformer fiction. What makes Cyberverse "not G1", but Cloud G1, other than convenience for us editors? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:02, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::: As far as I can tell, there is no basic divergence, aside from Grimlock's origins, from the Cloud characters to the G1 counterparts. I could point to a fair few examples on the side of Cyberverse that rank higher than that (Grimlock's presenations, the origins of the Quintessons and Sharkticons, Skywarp, Acid Storm, etc etc.) [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:23, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::We can be here all day debating over character minutiae, but the point is that Cyberverse ultimately doesn't diverge that much from G1 in its general premise as opposed to Cloud. G1 is bloated enough as it is; it doesn't hurt to take out the one thing that doesn't really fit in and make it its own thing. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::: Well that just comes right back to my question: what actually makes Cloud World's core conceit any different from G1 beyond the fact that they have technology that allows them dimensional travel? Because if it is just that, I simply do not believe that is enough to justify a split for characters who are almost all made to look like and have the same personality as the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:51, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I agree for the sake of wiki presentation. *Cloud* is more like *TransTech* than it is like *Alternity*. *Cloud* characters got to travel to both the G1 and MD worlds as equally separate destinations. TakaraTomy used the *Generations War for Cybertron* moulds as the *United* series, which is G1 and not Aligned by our classification. *Cloud* recycling unused *Generations Fall of Cybertron* toys in a non-Aligned setting strikes me as more evidence that we can allow *Cloud* to live on its own rather than as another G1 setting. And *Cloud* was chosen by e-HOBBY over the competing proposal *Prime Shattered Glass* which would also have been on separate wiki pages despite employing purely redeco mould choiceis. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:08, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I'm not convinced by the idea that them saying "G1 World" is an indicator of separateness when there is also designations for "BW Spacetime" and "MF Spacetime." Brawn is depicted as practically identical in appearance to G1 Brawn before being upgraded. As for the Prime Shattered Glass choice, I think it's pretty obvious why that would be completely separate from this particular issue. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 16:25, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::The only reason Brawn is shown as the G1 body is if you take consideration that all Cloud members are drawn according to the latest toy or model available... he got no real toy before that, the only options were either G1 Sunbow, G1 toy or the tiny Universe 2.0 Legends. Now if you remove their appearance and focus on the story, Cloud is still more akin to Transtech than Alternity, Deadlock for example even got to visit the Legends World, a Aligned world (possibly the Adventure toyline) and the Ehobby spin-off dimension (now called Precursor World) -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 17:55, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::Yes, I am aware of how Cloud repurposings work. Nothing prevents one G1 universe from visiting another. And aside from that, Japan has had barely any non-JG1 cartoon related G1 fiction; of course Cloud World, which isn't directly JG1 related, would be indicated as different; that doesn't mean that it's not able to be categorized as G1. If it were an American storyline, where we have always had multiple G1 storylines, I feel that this would not nearly be as much of a point of contention. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I'm in favor of splitting Cloud from G1. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 19:32, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I haven't read any of the Cloud fiction myself, but I know that if our translation team collectively agrees on something based on the material available, then that's more than enough convincing for me to agree with them also. In other words, I agree with a split. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:52, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I'd vastly prefer if we could get someone like McFeely to weigh in on this. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:56, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::i'm in favour of the split. The cloud people have enough characteristics to distonguist them from theur jg1 counterpatts.--[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 20:14, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::Alright, seriously, what characteristics are there actually to distinguish them from G1? Because nobody has been able to give me a concrete example so far. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 21:17, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::::dinobot, heavy usage of aligned designs, hellwarp --[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 21:36, 28 December 2021 (EST)
Looks like Escargon is the only voice against the split thus far. Still, I suggest the discussion should remain open longer than usual, out of courtesy for people not checking the wiki as regularly given the holiday season. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 21:47, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:As the translations are still ongoing, I think the most we can suggest at this time is a note regarding its a classification as a Primax setting by AVP. As more information comes to light I'm becoming increasingly convinced that it was a decision made on shaky logic. Unlike the Alternity there doesn't seem to be any evidence of these guys being derived in-universe from G1 guys. And as fiction, it's about a bunch of super advanced parallel universe monitor guys who regularly travel to other universes. If it's literally just "the cast is mostly recolours of toys with G1 fiction" then maybe we need to start talking about listing the War for Cybertron games as G1 too. [[User:Star Spangled Sam|Star Spangled Sam]] ([[User talk:Star Spangled Sam|talk]]) 01:44, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::What exactly is super-advanced about them beyond SARA, who, as far as I can tell, is a gift from some being and not even their own creation? Because otherwise, they seem to be basic Transformers. Not a single person has been able to tell me that so far, and I'd be far more willing to listen if someone would just spell out what exactly makes them so distinct that means they can't be G1. It's not about in-universe stuff, because for all intents and purposes, the characters themselves are nigh-identical to the Generation 1 characters; you look at Cloud Megatron or Cloud Rodimus and it is obvious that, irregardless of whatever the fiction might say, they are being sold as new versions of the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 04:29, 29 December 2021 (EST)
:::By the same logic, then why not put the FOC and WFC games under the G1 banner since it heavly takes inspirations from it, same settings (war on cybertron, the resources are becoming low, escaping to another world), closest designs to G1.. hell they were more marketed towards G1 than the Movies and Prime in mind (let's face it.. that's what Hasbro always does).. but the further Hasbro tied them to Aligned and they became their own thing.. Cloud is about that, maybe marketed as G1 at first but they became their own thing at the end -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 13:20, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::::The WFC games are their own case that, despite what you say, were always clearly a part of Hasbro's ideas for the Aligned continuity, which is something that I'm not going to bother going into here. Nothing about Cloud registers to me as being somehow so separate that it requires us splitting off things into their own pages. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 13:24, 29 December 2021 (EST)
Bumping for more opinions. If there's no overall opposition to it by Friday or so, I'll start splitting. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:07, 4 January 2022 (EST)
:The Cloud fiction prominently features the Cloud characters interacting with their own G1 counterparts. If nothing else, it should be split on same basis as [[Galvatron II]]. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:50, 4 January 2022 (EST)
::We've seen that with other fiction. I'm not sure why it would justify them having their whole separate pages (Galvatron II is a unique case). If that's what it takes though to not go through some inane total split, though, then fine, whatever. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:If there is to be movement on this in the immediate future I suppose I should go ahead and weigh in. As the one doing the translation I broadly agree with Riptide. While I am unmoved by philosophical discussions on what constitutes "G1-ness" or "Transtech-ness," I believe it is important to return to our guiding principle of the end user experience. Given the already convoluted nature of the material as well as the cast's consistent interaction with both various Generation 1 continuities in general and their own incarnations in specific, I believe it will be in the best interests of intelligibility for the reader to split out Cloud from Generation 1. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:25, 5 January 2022 (EST)

We are not going to pretend that these are completely separate from the Generation 1 characters. Put up a suite or a "see [X] article for more information" because it is completely ridiculous to pretend that Cloud is it's own little continuity. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:38, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I disagree. Cloud should be split off entirely. So let's have an official vote and resolve this. I say '''Split'''. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 10:28, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::The articles have already been split. You'll forgive me if I don't show confidence in the decision from people who blew me off when I pointed out their original reason for splitting was incorrect (that supposedly the Almanac had come out before Cloud was truly explained, but in fact it had come after almost all of it had been published). [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:35, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::This discussion has been open for twelve days. An unofficial tally shows at least 7-to-1 in favor of splitting. No one else has openly agreed with your position. Given that, and that Saix announced days in advance he would start splitting if there was no further discussion, it wasn't unreasonable for him to begin. But maybe there's a different split of opinions on the Discord or wherever, so it's certainly appropriate to ask for an official vote. Beyond that...the decision is just not up to you alone. The point of democracy is for all voices to be heard, not to leave every voice feeling satisfied with the outcome. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 11:08, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::I have no idea what's going on in the Discord server; I'm barred from it. I certainly hope there's not more discussion going on over there, because I was told that there would be a push to have these sorts of big discussions to be on the wiki. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:42, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::With all due respect: You need to stop putting so much emphasis on the in-universe designation, which AVP itself pointed out was ultimately arbitrary. I understand that AVP and the Almanacs are important to you, but Jim is not infallible, and while I'm sure he had good reasons for calling it "Primax" that's ultimately just ''his opinion''. Cloud being "its own thing" isn't some essential property; it's a matter of how to organise the wiki in order to make the fiction clear. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:47, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I also vote '''Split''' if only because of how better translations now has pointed out various past errors/assumptions/presumptions that needed correcting, and thus updating is needed so as to make things easier to categorize and organize here. Any wiki really worth their salt and wanting to do proper service to their respective franchises' fandoms would do the same. --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] ([[User talk:Lonegamer78|talk]]) 14:43, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::I ''still'' haven't got an answer for what makes Cloud so different that makes it ''need'' to be split. If there were a crossover between say, Marvel and Sunbow, nobody in their right mind we should completely separate, say, Huffer from Huffer. I'm willing to admit that I might just be missing something, but nothing in the stories themselves, as far as I can see, suggests it, beyond the aforementioned Cloud World classification, which for me is not enough of a justification. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:33, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::Neither Marvel nor Sunbow consists primarily of crossovers with another G1 continuity. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:20, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::If that's the main avenue of justification then frankly I don't think I'm ever going to agree with that line of reasoning, but I can clearly see I'm outvoted on this. I wish there would have been more people asked before the split was done, though, because I can see that this could very easily end up being another whole "retitling things to FSRLF" situation. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:00, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::We functionally split out Marvel and Sunbow versions for a lot of characters anyway. We're at the point where we draw lines based on how easy/hard it is for the information to be conveyed, not whether it's G1 enough or not. We think Cloud, as its own fullblown storyline/premise, falls on the side of "it's easier to read and parse it if they get their own shebang" instead of burying them in overlong G1 articles. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 21:11, 8 January 2022 (EST)

I'm not gonna argue further on this because I recognize it's a losing battle, but I think that the line of thought of "this one bit of media shouldn't be kept in an article because it won't get out there otherwise" sets a bad precedent that could easily be misused in the future. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:39, 8 January 2022 (EST)

Should the Cloud toys also be removed from the G1 character's pages? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 09:21, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:Yeah no, It vould be too convoluted, example look at the redirections [[Transformers_Cloud#Toys|there]]... where should each toy be redirected?? + the fiction regarding said toys has their own page now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 10:58, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::...What on earth are you talking about? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:16, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::Srry I misread his question.. I thought he meant "added" not "removed" from the G1 pages...
:Not entirely certain what you're asking, but the eight toys in the Cloud toyline (plus Deadlock) have already been moved to the Cloud pages in conjunction with the fiction, as they solely represent Cloud characters. The remaining Cloud characters repurpose existing toys. The writeups for those toys remain on the original pages with duplicates on the repurpose pages, as is standard practice. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:54, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::I mean, for example, [[Blaster_(G1)/toys#Generations|G1 Blaster's toy page]] has FOC Blaster on it, due to FOC Blaster being repurposed as Cloud Blaster. Should that repurposing be removed from G1 Blaster's page, since Cloud Blaster isn't considered to be G1 Blaster anymore? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 12:34, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::I believe yeah, the splitting between G1 and Cloud was recent (done last month) so there's still leftover traces on the wiki, if you can take your time to remove them why not -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 16:44, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::::Ok, good. I just wanted to check I wasn't missing anything. [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 17:13, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::::Oh! Yes those should go, good eye! -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 10:52, 18 February 2022 (EST)

==Split Movie Character Toy lists?==
Just as what happened with [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys]] and [[Megatron (G1)/toys]], I suggest we split certain Movie toy pages such as [[Bumblebee (Movie)/toys]] and [[Optimus Prime (Movie)/toys]] as both pages have become excessively bloated. I suggest we separate them by having the original Bay film toylines (07, ROFT, DOTM, AOE, TLK, and any pre SS sub lines) have their own page and starting a new one that Contains SS, BB, and the upcoming ROTB toylines, alongside any future movie toylines until the new page itself becomes heavily bloated [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Sorry for being this late but given that ROTB toys are apparently coming this spring, I suggest you split like one part contains all 5 movies while the other starts with SS and BB until now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 15:26, 22 January 2022 (EST)

== Multi-part comic stories ==

For old Marvel UK multi-part stories like [[Target: 2006]] or [[Time Wars]], we put the whole thing under a single article, but for modern-day ones like each storyline in [[Transformers (2019 comic)]] we have a separate article for each issue. Is there a good reason for the discrepancy, or are the old ones just an artefact of a time in the wiki's history that didn't follow our current standards? --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:36, 22 January 2022 (EST)
:The thing with that is that it's a result of how the UK comic was written; there'd be about 8 or so pages per issue, meaning that we'd have a lot of little articles that are easier just grouped together. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:16, 22 January 2022 (EST)
::Makes sense, although that's essentially what we have for [[The Transformers: Autocracy]] et al., which are also 8 pages per issue. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 15:38, 23 January 2022 (EST)
:::The difference with Autocracy lies mostly in that pretty much all of those issues have a beginning and end, and also have different titles. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:47, 23 January 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I always thought our headings on the Marvel UK story pages ''were'' the issue titles. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 01:21, 24 January 2022 (EST)

== Composite characters and page transclusion ==

This is something I've had the idea about for a while, but I've finally had a look at how the markup for it works and have come up with a proposal. The pages for [[Greatshot]] and [[Sixshot (G1)]] contain an entirely duplicated section set around the ''Victory'' cartoon owing to a retcon that occurred in the much later Legends manga. This is not an ideal solution because, among other reasons, any edits to Greatshot's cartoon section necessitates making the same edit to Sixshot's section.

Over in my sandbox, I've whipped up the page [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test]], containing only the events that happened to both Greatshot and the retconned Sixshot. By inserting <nowiki>{{:User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test}}</nowiki> into the relevant parts of Greatshot and Sixshot's pages (also sandboxed [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot|here]] and [[User:TheLastGherkin/Sixshot|here]]), the same information is automatically transcluded. And clicking "Edit" on, for example, the Legends manga section on Sixshot's page automatically redirects the user to editing that portion of Greatshot-test, thus updating all three pages at once.

If we go forward with this, I can see it being used for other characters in similar situations, like BWU [[Wolfang (Maximal)#Beast Wars: Uprising|Wolfang]], or Unite Warriors [[Roller (IDW)#Unite Warriors|Roller]], or putting the lion's share (pun intended) of [[Victory Leo]]'s fictional appearances back onto Victory Leo's page. With refinements, like say a <nowiki><noinclude></nowiki> explanation for what each subpage is for the layperson ("This page covers the events of the Japanese Generation 1 continuity, where Greatshot and Sixshot are the same individual...") and maybe a [[:Category:Transcluded pages]], I could see this really working, and it could probably be bent into shape for repurposed toys as well. [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 12:48, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:If we cannot avoid this sort of duplicated information entirely, this does seem like a pretty ideal solve to mitigate the constant peril of copy editing flubs maintaining multiple copies of one write-up entails. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:56, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Is there any way to get rid of the "This section is transcluded from another page. To edit it, please edit the transcluded page." notice? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:06, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:::There is! I just put that there manually while experimenting and also to make clear where the transcluded section is. In practice, since clicking "Edit" on a transcluded section takes you to the source page, a notice like that can be relegated to a commented-out note for editors who click to Edit the entire page (or a larger section). [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 16:16, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I thought it was automatic software stuff. Whoops, never mind. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:22, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Also, this works for fiction, but I see it running into issues when it comes to toys. (Thinking of Sixshot/Greatshot, Sixshot always gets toys first with Greatshot as the retool later in the same line.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:14, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:I've made some tweaks to my sandboxes, including standardising the transcluded page. Are there any objections before I start implementing this (in fiction sections)? [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 07:10, 12 February 2022 (EST)
::I sense that there could be an issue in the future where, for whatever reason, these sorts of characters diverge back into separate ones, whether it be through alternate continuities or whatever. Also, in the case of Greatshot, I feel like at the very beginning of his entry, there has to be something different to set up the Sixshot retcon, and just having the same opening text doesn't do that. 08:57, 12 February 2022 (EST)
:::His toy bio that mentions Sixshot as a separate person could go there. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 00:21, 16 February 2022 (EST)
:This could also be applied to Primus and Vector Sigma for their 3H comics sections since they are one and the same in that continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 19:26, 26 February 2022 (EST)

== What makes a franchise? Or, does "Precursor World" exist? ==

So, browsing around the wiki, as one does, and came across this: [[Precursor World (franchise)]]

Now, I'm not as well-versed in the Legends + Selects comics, so maybe this is incorrect, but to the best of my understanding, the branding "Precursor World" doesn't exist — this story was told across Generations Selects and Legends, and no toy or story was ever released branded as "Precursor World". It doesn't seem like the name even existed until pretty recently.

This...isn't a franchise, right? It's a long-running story told across various medium, but it's not a franchise, and calling it such implies something that isn't true.

Particularly, the idea that there is a "toyline" seems a bit of a stretch. There are only three listed "official" toys, but none of them were released under the "Precursor World" branding (which near as I can tell does not exist) and the list of "repurposings" seems almost entirely just "this toy/characters showed up in this story" which doesn't seem like anything's been repurposed to me. The IDW comics used a bunch of existing/prior toys, but that doesn't create a toyline of that comic series.

Am I off base here? --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:16, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:Okay there's a lot to unpack here but to begin with every single one of those toys is being repurposed as a separate object/character in a separate setting a la, for example, [[Green Tender Convoy]] and the [[Matrix Buster|Red Matrix]]. Most of the unnamed crowdfillers are minimized to footnotes on existing articles to avoid generating a bazillion stubs. The closest analogue I can give you is the [[Transformers: Shattered Glass (toyline)|toyline]] for the original ''Timelines'' iteration of Shattered Glass. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:35, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I'll grant that those indeed seem to be repurposings, but the vast majority of toys on this list merely link to the toy entry for the toy on the regular character's page. I don't think having a list of members of these groups is bad (it's good!) but I don't think this is a toyline. Again, crucially, Shattered Glass has a brand, with the official toys released under that brand, whereas precursor world does not. IDW repurposed WfC/FoC/aligned toys as G1 characters, but this didn't create a virtual toyline associated with that comic. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:46, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:::Arguably Shattered Glass toys weren't really released under their own brand either until the recent Hasbro Pulse stuff, until then the figures were all just released under the ''Timelines'' banner or whatever else Fun Pub used at the time - the idea of a singular "Shattered Glass toyline" was just as much of a constructed idea until like a year ago. I can't say "franchise" and "toyline" ''aren't'' slightly more non-literal labels than usual in this context, but I do think there's value in having the info collated like this, and I can't think of ''better'' labels that aren't something stupid like "(meta franchise)". [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 12:57, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::::To be honest, I'm inclined to agree re: Shattered Glass, and would not be opposed to restructuring the toyline page to delineate between the "Shatted Glass Collection" and "Shattered Glass toys released via Timelines" or something. Shattered Glass does, however, have a leg up on Precursor World given that every official SG toy was branded as "Shattered Glass" in some way, though perhaps not as a "franchise". The box set is called Shattered Glass, and every official toy was called "Shattered Glass". There's some nuance there, of course, as arguably those are part of the character's names ala "Prime Universe Bulkhead" is still a Legacy toy, not a Prime toy, but I'd be happy to have a debate around the best way to frame Shattered Glass stuff given those discrepancies. Allll that said, Shattered Glass is today a franchise, but there have been zero anythings released with Precursor World branding or labeling. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 13:06, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I don't think the page should be removed or even severely modified, but I do think the terminology is flawed. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 16:02, 3 March 2022 (EST)
Precursor World is definitely not a "franchise" and should not have that label. The model to look at here is the [[Beast Wars: Uprising]] article, which gives an overview of the thing, lists it's stories and toys, but does not use the "franchise" label, and doesn't ''need'' to use it. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] ([[User talk:KilMichaelMcC|talk]]) 15:07, 3 March 2022 (EST)

Yeah, no, this is not a "franchise", and the page should not be labeled as such. It is a ''setting''. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:I like the solution that AzimuthAcolyte gave on Discord: move "Precursor World (franchise)" to "Precursor World continuity" (with all uses of the word "franchise" changed to "continuity") and "Precursor World (toyline)" to "List of Precursor World toys". Simple and elegant. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:55, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Seconded.[[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:::That seems reasonable to me. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::::I'm for that. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::That's fair. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 23:59, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Works for me, somewhat obviously! If there are no major objections over the next day or two I'll get those moved over. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:48, 4 March 2022 (EST)
::Ohhh, That works -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 18:19, 4 March 2022 (EST)
Alrighty as it's been a day or so with no objections I am proceeding with the moves away from (franchise) and (toyline). --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 18:06, 5 March 2022 (EST)

== Episode Order ==
It's come to my attention that all cartoons have been listed in production order '''except''' Beast Wars, RID01, RB, and RBA. While I understand production order is not available for the latter two I suggest we change the first two for consistency's sake - Unless I'm wrong and they are ''not'' all in production order. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:48, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:We're not touching Beast Wars. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
::Beast Wars and RiD'01 not being in production order are accepted exceptions to the norm. We leave them as they are for reasons specific to each. But as for RB and RBA, we do have an idea of the production orders for each, but we instead use a weird mixture of production order and airing order that is consistent with no other series we cover. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 13:53, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:OK quick correction to myself, turns out that it's all supposed to be chronological order; That just happens to be production order for everything but those four. Sorry! [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 14:09, 16 March 2022 (EDT)

==Help with statues / figurines==
I wrote up many of the [[Transformers ULTIMATES!|ULTIMATES!]] entries, simply because no one else had. I don't actually care about that sort of merch and it ended up being me paraphrasing from press releases and copying their pics. Just today I learned there are 3 waves of TF [[Minimates]] that have no coverage here at all. It definitely seems like a lot of high-end statues are falling through the cracks as well. Is there someone who is willing to make that stuff more of a project? If not, could we perhaps put out a call for submissions on our Twitter feed? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:47, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I fear this is just... going to continue to be an Issue. The wiki is a labor of love, and the brand is at a point where there's a lot of stuff out there... well, that a lot of people probably aren't gonna love. Hasbro's moichandized the everloving HELL out of TF over the years, with more and more niche "G1" stuff that seemingly would never appeal to people for whom G1 is the big center of their fandom. I mean I just found some Micro Figures merch at a Big Lots, I've never seen these before, and I don't know offhand if they're on the wiki. They're kind of a nothing. It's hard to keep up. Same for stuff like phone games. 
:I don't know if there's an actual solution. ''Someone'' certainly needs to step up, but I kinda got my plate overflowing with my own pet (ha ha) niche chunk of TF history to exhaustively document, never mind dealing with stuff I am almost aggressively disinterested in. (Seriously what little Minimates experience I have left me with a worse impression of them than I already had from their hideous aesthetic alone.) Asking Twitter for people more well-versed in this stuff might could help for phone games, but... IS there anyone into Minimates as a whole Brand and not just in a "I get the licenses I like" sense to fill in gaps? --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 21:20, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::Once I had composed the thought "Hey, it's bad that there are a lot of Minimates out with us not covering them at all," it was too late, and I just had to burn 40 minutes on some cut-and-paste writups for the entire series. That's one "solution," I guess, but even ''my'' obsessive-compulsiveness can only go so far. Editing this site really should not feel like a job... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:18, 22 March 2022 (EDT)

==Implementing galleries==
I propose making galleries on character pages a wiki standard. The current mainpic + show screenshots format doesn't cover images like character models (Unless used as a mainpic), concept art, appearances in posters or toy murals, comic book covers, etc.
Other wikis have successfully implemented galleries, I think the Hololive Wiki galleries in particular work well as an example https://hololive.wiki/wiki/Tokino_Sora#Media.
This gallery header covers character models and has suites for concept art and even character uses in collaborative merch.[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:27, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Seconded. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:30, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I would say some version of this concept for a section has merit, if nothing else as a solve for major characters with several prominent character models, perhaps as a fairly unobtrusive method of documenting alt modes, etc etc. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:38, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::I'm for this. As a good example, the BotBots characters all look to have been radically redesigned for the show. By default the current standard is to keep the original stock art look will appear as the mainpic each page. Having a gallery option would be a good way to show both versions. [[User:ParadoxFactor|ParadoxFactor]] ([[User talk:ParadoxFactor|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Oppose. There is no reason for these to take up space on the character pages. Would not oppose separate "gallery" pages. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:57, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::If we are open to workshopping implementation I do agree a separate "gallery page" in the style we already use for more conceptual articles here and there would probably be cleaner. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 14:06, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I love the gallery idea. There's a question of how much to include, and the exact implementation details of how to portion out overflow if there's too many images. It's a shame there isn't some way to generate them automatically just by tagging images with the characters they depict. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::A separate page seems like it would be overkill for someone like [[Flamewar (G1)|Flamewar]], who would only take a few images to cover appearances not already covered by fiction section images. I assume if a small gallery was to be used on a character's page, it would be near the bottom at any rate? --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 15:22, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Yes, at the bottom would be ideal, no different from any of the galleries on our artist pages. IMO, separate gallery pages should only be used in instances where the number of images can't be comfortably fit onto one or two lines. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:33, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::I agree with Cyberlink. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 16:29, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Fair; Using gallery sections for those with few images and gallery pages for those with many images might make sense. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 15:46, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::See [[Megatron (G1)/gallery|G1 Megatron]] and [[Megatron (BW)/gallery|BW Megatron]] for examples of characters with enough images to justify separate gallery pages. [[Rhinox (BW)/gallery|BW Rhinox]], as it is now, is probably right on the line between "split it off" and "stick it at the bottom of the page". -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:58, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
I think choosing between a header at the bottom or a suite depending on image amount is a good solution instead of sticking to just one method.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 11:29, 22 March 2022 (EDT)
:Yeah, I think that would be good, as has been pointed out earlier. I do have to ask - because sometimes the artistic difference between characters in comics is slight with details only a little different in shape or kibble - would those fall under gallery stuff? Because they're effectively different per artist interpretation. I would be inclined to say yes, because effectively a different artist's rendition is shown usually of the same character without having reformatted or taken up armor or so forth. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 10:56AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I am very much on board with this idea. Having a gallery section or page depending on the character would be great, especially for characters like Flamewar who have a extremely prominent new design that we can't use as a main pic and for characters who have tons of designs, especially in the case of IDW where some characters change bodies every Tuesday. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:35 AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I think artistic liberty vs. new design would have to be on a case by case basis. Burcham's art of the BW cast wouldn't count for gallery purposes, in my opinion. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:08, 27 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I think it would be cool to have art of the same designs in different artstyles, but I agree it should probably be on case by case basis. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 6:17 PM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I currently have a sandbox to test galleries using Tigatron https://tfwiki.net/wiki/User:MrRald/sandbox/Tigatron#Gallery. I'd appreciate any feedback on things to add or change! [[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 23:44, 1 April 2022 (EDT)
::: I like what you have so far, I think we should maybe add a few more versions of Tigatron, like his different comic appearances and such. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]])

: Now that we're actually going ahead with this... I have to ask, what are the galleries actually ''for''? When we were discussing this I was under the impression that they were going to be for "behind-the-scenes" images that wouldn't otherwise have a place on the wiki, like out-of-universe character models, character concept art, or full-body renders from stuff like guidebooks. Right now, a lot of the galleries just feel redundant, given that they're just a bunch of cartoon and comic screengrabs taken from the relevant section and removed of all context... and a lot of them, like [[Blaster (G1)/gallery]] are just completely empty. The fact that every character ''can'' have a gallery does not mean that all of them ''should'', especially if most of them are just going to be redundant or mostly empty. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 18:57, 4 August 2022 (EDT)
::Agreed, I feel like this is bloating the wiki and toeing over the line of our vague remit. Despite having a LOT of images, we're not an image repository. Also, a lot of these could probably be done as a single subsection of the characters' mainpage under below "Notes" of whatever rather than as separate mostly-blank-space sub-pages full of sub-headers with like two images total in them. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 06:11, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, I didn't think they'd be separate pages. What I was expecting was whichever of the cartoon character model, Dreamwave profile art or package art weren't being used for the mainpic, plus behind-the-scenes stuff, plus maybe extra bits from artbooks, covers, or sources like that. Stuff that can't just be slotted into a fiction writeup—and I don't mean "comic crops we don't have room for because equivalent/better panels are already in the fiction section". —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:35, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
My intentions for the gallery pages were for users to actually do the work in uploading character models, renders, et al., not dumping whatever cartoon screencaps we already have in fiction sections. And separate pages would be on a case by case basis. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:46, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
I don't see the point, honestly. It seems like pretty much any significant body a significant enough character has will appear on the wiki at some point in a comic panel or a toy info image or a screenshot or something, somewhere. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs solving. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] ([[User talk:Hooper X|talk]]) 20:36, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

===G1 model images===
To branch off of this topic, how would we feel about using [https://www.allspark.com/forums/threads/the-most-accurately-coloured-g1-animation-models-online.301/ DM's coloured models] for the G1 cartoon model galleries? The last time I brought this topic up (on Discord), some people were against the idea, due to them being fan-colour works and not official, but a few newer developments have been made since I last brought it up.

To clarify, for those unaware of DM's works:

* All of the line art is original and unedited (unlike several of the models in ''The Ark'' books, which had been tweaked, altered and traced by Bill Forster to make them presentable for publishing).
* The models are the final ones used throughout the majority of the cartoon (in Toei-animated episodes at least). Note: several of the models in ''The Ark'' books we have also come to discover were unfinalized ones, due to the internet and more stuff being made public since what was originally found around 2007—not to discredit Jim and Bill's hard work in putting those books together, it's just some of what we knew then isn't entirely correct now.
* And finally, the colours (which was the big thing some people were against). Unlike the handful of fan-coloured models that were originally uploaded to the wiki in the past, which eye dropped colors straight from poor quality episode masters, DM's colours are based directly on Toei and Marvel Productions' model colour guides, colour codes, charts, colour chips found by a member of the ''Dragon Ball'' fandom (who has scanned and digitized said colour chips) and other original production materials, meaning that the colours DM has used are all coming from the ''original'' original source.

An alternative Mr. Rald had brought up on Discord is that we could possibly look at using the uncoloured model line art instead, if people feel strongly against using fan-coloured works, but I think in order to present the G1 character models fully as references, you kinda need the colours included, especially given how poor the cartoon production was, what with all the animation errors (even in Toei episodes) etc, making it hard to gather decent references for the characters, which is mostly what these galleries are for.

Also, for the record, DM has given us permission to use his colourings on the wiki.

Let me know you thoughts. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 01:39, 6 April 2022 (EDT)

: I personally think that we should use DM's coloured models, they are as official as coloured models are going to get, and it's not like DM just randomly picked and chose want colours to use as FOCS said. We could just have the model and the colour guide, but at that point, just have the model sheet coloured. I would however be in favour of the uncoloured models with colour guides and the sheets with the fully coloured models to cover all our bases. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:16 AM, 6 April 2022 (PDT)

== Making a page for the Unreal Engine? ==

War for Cybertron, Dark of the Moon (PS3/X360), Fall of Cybertron, and Rise of the Dark Spark all run on Unreal Engine, specifically Unreal Engine 3. Why isn't there a page for it. It could have good info on those wanting to mod those games.

Unrelated, but there's a server revival project being worked on for those games. Right now it's only on PC, and progress is slow, but should we include info for it in the pages for those games? It's not official btw, there's a Discord server for it and a few YouTube vids about it.[[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]]) 17:29, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not sure what information we could put on an Unreal Engine page that would be useful to modders. An Unreal Engine page would be general info on the engine and a list of games which use it. Diving into technical details isn't really something we do. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 17:52, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I think linking to {{W|Unreal Engine|Wikipedia}} should be sufficient. That's what I did when I ''unfortunately'' had to document the Funko NFTs. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:11, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I don't see what value there would be to this. Unreal warrants, at ''most'', a mention on the relevant game pages. We don't have pages for every program used to make every piece of TF media/product. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:33, 24 March 2022 (EDT)

== Category for characters with no established gender ==

So I just had this idea and decided to share it here because why not? We have categories for female characters and variable gender characters but not for characters with undetermined genders. Many BotBots for example don't have genders and I think this category could be a useful way of grouping them together. And who knows, maybe someday it could even help official creators specifically looking for genderless characters to establish a gender to them. Does anyone agree to implement this category? -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:06, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:This concept has been discussed before in the past, and generally the feeling has been that this would be a bit too much like the wiki actively trying to shape canon. Don't get me wrong, creators taking advantage of characters with no official pronouns is neat and I'm all for it, but IMO the wiki shouldn't directly serve up them. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 19:26, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
::Interestingly, I can't seem to find a prior community portal discussion about this matter, though I know it has come up on the Discord server more than once, to the conclusion Jalaguy mentioned. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 19:35, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:::Just to clarify, I thought of "official creators using it" as a quick example in favor of the category, but now I can totally see how it sounded like trying to influence canon too much. Regardless, I'd still be down for having the category if we agreed on it being useful for any other reason. -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:51, 3 April 2022 (EDT)

== Category for trans characters ==

We had a productive conversation about the no established gender thing on the wiki discord and it made me realize that there should be a transgender category for the five established trans characters that there are so far, Arcee (who has established trans characterization on two different pages), Howlback, Arcadis, Anode, and Lug. Jalaguy mentioned that this has been discussed and people thought it was a good idea but it hasn't happened, so I just thought I'd ask for go-ahead on this. I figured that transgender rather than just trans could be a good word to use for this, due to them all being people who have gender. The term trans is merely more broad and could cover different kinds of transness than that or aesthetic stuff that is similar to gender, but we have no confirmation of being there yet in canon. Thus I think transgender would be the most accurate and desirable term here, and the umbrella trans can always be tacked on later if we need to. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 5:40PM 3 April 2022 (PDT) (edited 5:48PM PDT for clarity)
:Seconded. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 5:53 PM, 3 April 2022 (PDT)
::Since there are no objections, I'll go ahead. :3 -- [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 4:19AM, 11 April 2022 (PDT)

==Streamlining disambig headers (revist)==
So I remember this conversation from last year about streamlining the disambiguation headers. I checked back on the talk page discussion (link to said discussion archive here https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal/Archive69#Streamlining_disambig_headers) to see what happened and even though there was a lot of people who liked the idea with some who did not, it did not seem like it went anywhere. I thought I'd see if anyone else would like to revisit this idea as I feel like this would streamline things more, especially for Movie and Aligned and maybe a bit of UT especially for the guys who show up in all 3 shows or those don't have other bots who are completely different sharing the same name within the trilogy. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 9:01 PM, 12 April 2022 (PDT)

== Disambig tags and suites for Masterforce paired pages ==

We need to balance out our page titles for ''Masterforce'' human + transtector character pairs. Right now we have among extant pages and tentative redlinks:

Bullhorn (G1), Cab (human), Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (human), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (robot), [something], Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (robot)

I propose either we do human gets no species tag with the robot getting a species tag as the splinter page:

Bullhorn (G1) | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

or the human does get a species tag to equally balance with the robot:

Bullhorn (G1)/human | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

This would eliminate the need to have any longer-within-parentheses tag like "Minerva (G1 robot)" which would be affected by future continuities which may not yet have happened. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:55, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
:I would prefer either the human gets the "default" continuity tag with no further disambiguation or (human)/(robot) (with needed variations for disambiguation). The slash system is ugly to me. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:59, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::I'm of the opinion that the slash option for both feels the most fair. While the human versions were the first and thus feel the most deserving of the "default" tag, the robot versions are likely to become more commonplace and relevant as newer fiction dips its toes into using more Japanese characters. On a similar note, it was decided not to give the "BW" tag to either BW Silverbolt out of fairness, so while a similar "human/robot" concept could be implemented, there is the problem with Minerva having an Animated counterpart who is also a robot, Cancer having an Animated counterpart who is also a human, there being a Kre-O Bullhorn who is also a robot, a G.I. Joe Lightfoot who is also a human, and an IDW Wilder who is also a human. "Minerva (Headmaster)" also doesn't work for the G1 robot since the human was a Headmaster too. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 16:29, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::The slash system may not be entirely visually pleasant, but I consider having "Minerva (G1 robot)" in parentheses worse. In my proposal, all transtector characters would be unified symmetrically as "(robot)". [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 17:47, 24 April 2022 (EDT)

Here are three proposals to unify the namespaces:

Possibility 1: humans get nothing and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1), Cab, Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai, Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (G1), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 2: both humans and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1)/human, Cab/human, Cancer (G1)/human, Clouder/human, Ginrai/human, Shūta Gō/human, Lightfoot (G1)/human, Minerva (G1)/human, Ranger/human, Road King/human, Wilder (G1)/human

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 3: both humans and robots get parentheses

Bullhorn (G1 human), Cab (human), Cancer (G1 human), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1 human), Minerva (G1 human), Ranger (human), Road King (human), Wilder (G1 human)

Bullhorn (G1 robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (G1 robot), Doubleclouder, Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1 robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (G1 robot)

Thoughts? [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 01:12, 12 June 2022 (EDT)
:Isn't Option 1 one basically just a slightly different version of what we're already using and what you're proposing to change in the first place? Anyway, like I said above, Option 2 is the most fair between the human and robot depictions (as Option 1 feels like we're saying "The human versions are the more important versions" when it's the robot versions that are more likely to get any representation in future comic appearances), and it reduces the amount of multiple-word parentheses tags that we usually dislike using and try to avoid as best we can (which is the exact opposite of what Option 3 is proposing). Though, drop the "/human" from Clouder and Shūta Gō since their names already differ from "Doubleclouder" and "Goshooter". No need to complicate those two. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 08:45, 12 June 2022 (EDT)

==Transformers: Armada (Trading Card Collection)==
I recently discovered that Fleer published a Trading Card collection in 2003 for Transformers Armada.
I've documented everything I could find about it - including an Energon (preview) Scorponok card I got from a local retro game store.
[[Iacon0/Sandbox]]
Is it alright if I roll this out? [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 12:52, 1 May 2022 (EDT)

== WFC/FOC Reenergized Server Project info? ==

Info: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLO5yzrWE9yVT56Rgxl9oqntVysxWr2k7e

Basically, it brings back the multiplayer servers for the Cybertron games, PC and PS3. Should this be talked about in the pages for those games? (ROTDS and ROTF aren't online at the moment, and 360 versions won't have support) [[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]])}
:It's not official, so no, it shouldn't. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:54, 27 June 2022 (EDT)

== Handling of "former GoBots" and "former Diaclone" characters on the wiki ==

So recently we've been seeing multiple characters that had previously been portrayed as dimension-hoppers from non-Transformers realities, but using Transformers designs — [[Bug Bite (GoBots)]], [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]] and [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]] — appearing as "normal" Transformers ([[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]], [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]]). There's some heavy dispute over whether we should put them on the same page or split them out (e.g. "since the GoBots Bug Bite isn't ''originally'' from a G1 universe, he shouldn't go on the G1 Bug Bite page), so I thought we should probably have a centralised place to put together a comprehensive set of standards.

My take, personally, is that GoBots and Diaclone are *not* continuity families, they're their own properties that happen to cross over with Transformers, and so shouldn't be split on that basis. I feel that Burn Out and Lift-Ticket, regardless of them being portrayed as Diaclone mecha in their initial appearance, are the same basic concept as the likes of Road Rage and Tigertrack — "Transformers versions" of existing Diaclone toys and decoes. It helps that [[Spin-Out (G1)]] inherently blurs the lines, having first appeared as a "normal" Transformer ''before'' he was portrayed as a former Diaclone mech.

For the GoBots characters, I'd frankly be tempted to go even more radical and just merge ''all'' of them — put all the [[Cy-Kill (disambiguation)|Cy-Kill]] cameos on one page, like we do for other external property characters. Even in the edge cases like [[Fracture (Movie)|Fracture]], there's the precedent of her actually being intended as just ''being'' the GoBot. It feels a lot simpler to me than the headache of having Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, and Bug Bite, the ''other'' white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, having separate pages on a technicality. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:57, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Hard disagree on GoBots. By virtue of covering the Scioli comic in full, we have a GoBots continuity family to put them in. I say keep the ones who are explicitly GoBots at (GoBots), and put the ones who are Transformers (or ambiguous) at their respective continuity families. Basically, what we're doing for Bug Bite, do for all of them. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:23, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:I don't agree on movie-Fracture in specific and the mass-merge of ''all'' GoBots-based characters in general. Fracture's a movie-universe character who premiered in a movie-based toyline and appeared in movie-timeline fiction. "The toy was originally conceived as" holds very little water there in light of all the rest of that. I'm not wild about merging characters from different continuity families (aka "major franchise umbrellas", the point of that divide was always less "fiction-detail based" and more "real-world Hasbro/Takara starting over based" as an organizational tool), as that leans heavily towards the Wikipedia style "just lump 'em all together" manner that... doesn't really work for our scope. There's SG Bug Bite and Crasher too, I don't think they should go under a giant singular page for the character concept.
: But ''in general'' I agree with keeping stuff like Lift-Ticket and Burn Out together because the distinction is really too nitpicky to be useful. If we get an EarthSpark Lift-Ticket who is a red Hoist-like bot, then they can go on a separate page because "new major franchise umbrella" gives a decent degree of separation. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:25, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: Oh, well, the SG GoBots are an obvious exception. If it's a "mirror universe" I feel like it should never share a page because the point is that it's the opposite.
:: That said, there are other nuances I admit I skimmed over — stuff like Wings Universe Cop-Tur, who's based on the original but is a secret genius and a good guy, I'm not sure he should be merged in. At the same time, though, splitting the Bug Bites feels disingenuous, and I'm not sure whether there's a good middle ground between "split 'em all" and "merge 'em all". --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:44, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I also agree there isn't really a good middle ground. But here's the thing: If GoBots wasn't a factor and it was just G1 and Cyberverse, we wouldn't be having this conversation. At the end of the day, they're from another IP, but they're also genuine Transformers characters, and thus they should remain split like other Transformers characters. And that includes treating the genuine GoBot incarnations as separate entities. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:51, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I am, honestly, not sold either way on splitting/merging re: the "very distinctly the Tonka GoBots who originated from the Tonka GoBots franchise". I feel that there are '''''definitely''''' some bots that should not be merged with the Tonkas, by virtue of being from different continuity-families/hub-franchises (bots from the live action movies and Cyberverse, for example, should really stay separate). I'm less concerned about "in-fiction origin" because that's a clusterfuck all its own since 1984 best just left alone and we already disregard that for like Nebulans and stuff anyway, though I'd also argue that like, it should be taken into consideration the diff between an homage and an iteration (I'd argue ''Timelines'' Cop-Tur is the former and probably shouldn't be merged). But even just looking at them from the real-world staggered integration of the franchises, GoBots ARE a weird edge case (whaaat, something Scioli was involved in got weird? ''nnnoooOOOOOooooo'') and it kinda feels off to not treat them as a separate thing given their ultimate origins. But like, they are, functionally, "G1" characters as far as "how they were brought to TF" goes in the real world, and I'm not convinced that splitting out WFC Bug Bite is really a good idea or terribly helpful. So like, I dunno. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 02:06, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::::And then there's the ''very'' unique case of GoBots Stretch having been given a retroactive backstory of being born in the world of Transformers Animated before he crossed dimensions and became a GoBot. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 02:23, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::::If anything, Stretch is a Transformer pretending to be a GoBot.
:::::The criteria that keep this wiki running and readable have always had some smudgy bits, and if you stare too long at any of them pretty soon all one sees is the smudge, not the dividing line or even the story itself. Cyberverse and Prime are each ''basically'' a retelling of G1, and if they didn't have a few features we've accepted as clear dividers from "real" G1, they could have gone within G1 just as much as the IDW comics have. The divisions are necessary to keep information from being a useless, unstructured, unnavigable mess; hopefully we can draw the lines in a way that comes to require the fewest exceptions later. '''My thoughts''': when there's a Bug Bite whose origin is explicitly "I'm not a Transformer, I'm hiding among them, creatures like myself find Transformers to be nauseating uncanny valley aliens," then that's a pretty extreme division, more extreme than many others we've been holding up for years without controversy, and should stay very much separate from any other Bug Bites who are just plain ol' white car Transformers. The various Cy-Kill cameos in G1 and Armada should stay separate, just because that's how we handle other hi-and-die cameos across firm storyline borders (Animated Overlord, SG Krok). I agreed at first with splitting the Burnouts/Lift-Tickets, but if it is really causing a huge dilemma I do not object to re-merging them. Each pair exists within the G1 storytelling universe. It is not essential that we build 2 different pages for G1 universe Lift-Tickets where one of them is a Diaclone mech and the other looks just like it and comes from someplace called Diaclone. We could paper that over with a "Note" explanation. The really important part is that both the Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket cases must get the same resolution. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 05:10, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:I vote for split. I regret ever pushing for merging similar concepts around the time of ''Ask Vector Prime'' because a decade ago this wouldn't have been a question, it would have been settled with "obvious they're different characters." [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:38, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Strongly in favor of putting the Diaclones back together so long as they remain essentially G1 guys. Especially since we now have ''two nigh-identical Burn-Out pages that differ only by which sliver of fiction section they possess''. Moderately in favor of putting all the dumb Cy-Kill cameos together because, like, it's only moderately funny to split out Cy-Kill (Armada) on a technicality. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 20:47, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: I'm going to stay out of the Bugbite / Fracture question. I'm too involved on the creative side. I think Walky nails it about Burn-Out & Lift-Ticket. And probably the Cy-Kill cameos too. --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 21:11, 29 July 2022 (EDT)

:I have to ask: if this is a concern, why did we split out the Cloud articles a month ago. Because they also are clearly designed to look like G1 characters, and aside from some minor changes in personality and dimension hopping stuff (which also applies to these three examples here), are near-identical in fiction to their Generation 1 counterparts. What makes them different from Bug Bite, Burn Out, and Lift-Ticket? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:29, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Lead Cloud translator here. As we discussed in-depth at the time, the Cloud characters do nothing *but* dimension hop and frequently cross over with the Japanese Generation 1 cartoon continuity and their own G1 incarnations, rendering them nigh unintelligible when buried in A-list G1 articles. The Cloud issue was one of logistics and readability, not one on the philosophy of intrinsic "G1-ness," as I believe was said at the time. I would also argue something on the scale of Cloud is a different discussion entirely from the current topic of merging two one-paragraph articles.

::On a most practical level re-merging a thoroughly deliberated and reasonably large scale split from a couple months ago just strikes me as kind of a waste of community resources.

::For those that missed it the impetus was translating the other 80-90% of the prose and the discussion can be found [[Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal#Splitting_Cloud_characters|here]]. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

Had a brainwave about a potential way to handle the GoBots characters—as a compromise between "treating them like full Transformers characters" and "treating them like external properties", use the GoBots page as a "hub" for the others. I've mocked up a couple of sandboxes for [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Cy-Kill|Cy-Kill]] and [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Bug Bite|Bug Bite]]. Any thoughts? --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:16, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:If we absolutely have to (which I still really don't agree with) I'd prefer this over full fledged merging. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:02, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:I think this is a good compromise. The important thing is that there's a clear delineation between the dimension-hopping GoBots and native Cybertronians, and I think this fits the bill. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:03, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
::I still don't like the idea of rolling in the ''Cyberverse'' Bug Bite or any other not-G1-franchise iterations on the GB character concepts (like movieverse Fracture), even in the proposed super-abridged-and-linked-to-main-article format. For the appearances within the franchise of TF-origin, sure, I think this works. Cy-Kill's multiverse of murder... ehn. I'm not really feeling strongly either way but like we got hi-then-die charcater micropages aplenty, I don't think Cy is something terribly unique to not get them. Like... we got a page for "the many deaths of Optimus Prime", I feel like "the many deaths of Cy-Kill" could probably stand to be its own thing if we REALLY wanted to hammer the point of how stupid and hack it is home. Which, come to think about it, I kinda DO. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:42, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Ah, see, Fracture was something I was specifically thinking of here — I thought it would work to accomodate both the original intent and how she's been tied back to Crasher in <s>Jim's nonsense</s> fan-targeted media while still respecting the practical reality of Fracture as her own, movieverse character. That said, I do understand your reluctance, so if the majority is against this I'm not too fussed. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:22, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, it feels like "Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee" is its own Transformers thing at this point. He may have originated as a GoBots transplant (both in real life and in fiction), but that doesn't automatically make every iteration of Bug Bite a GoBot, any more than every subsequent iteration of Lockdown or Lugnut is considered an Animated character. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 04:34, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::::I appreciate the work Riptide put into this and like the writing / presentation style employed... and I just still don't think it's necessary. Between disambigs and "You Look Familiar...", we already have ways to cope with characters who look alike across different continuities but who aren't the same character. Most of these transplanted GoBots are absolutely not the same characters as each other - most of the Cy-Kill cameos, Cyberverse Bug Bite. There is no need for us to build a new way to unite those cross-continuity characters when nothing unites them more than the "basic concepts" that we've kept separate on hundreds of other name / appearance reuses. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 08:43, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::I adore this brain blast, over and above what I proposed below (as it actually accommodates, in Cy-Kill's case, say, the ''Armada/TransTech/Animated'' cameos), and think the fact that people on both sides of this polarising issue aren't immediately opposed to it makes it strike me as a really good compromise. I still would prefer the ''Diaclone'' pages to be merged with their G1 counterparts, but whether or not it's a full merge or just the "main article" structure here, the intro phrasing proposed with Cy-Kill and Bug-Bite is perfect in my opinion. The key thing for me is that, when people look up info on Cy-Kill or Burn Out, they still find a pointer to the relevant information at the exact point they'd expect it to be, and not only that, but they can chart the entire conceptual history of the character on one page (I know the disambigs theoretically do the same, but in practise Jo's approach is much more effective). Assuming the same policy isn't applied to ''Uprising'' appearances, I still think something should be done about those—but otherwise I'd be very happy with this. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:16, 1 August 2022 (EDT)

So as I understand it, the consensus is that Diaclone characters should share a page with their G1 counterparts, and that — at least for the moment — GoBot characters should be left as-is, with White Bumblebee's G1 adventures split between the GoBot and G1 pages? Would appreciate some more input before we begin implementing this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:09, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:I still don't like the Diaclone thing but clearly I'm outvoted. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:48, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:More or less. I'm fine with rolling G1 WFC Bug Bite in with the explicitly-GoBots one in the manner test-bedded above on the same grounds as the whole "Nebulan/Cybertronian" deal with Targetmaster gun-bots we've done forever; I think the proposed format both works with the way we've handled disparate depictions between different fictions within the same franchise chunk for a very long time now while noting the important real-world issues with these transplanted characters. And it's not like the combo page would be anywhere near big enough to make a split-out necessary. But I'm willing to table that for the moment while moving ahead with rolling the Diaclones back in. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:15, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
::I agree with this completely. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:11, 3 August 2022 (EDT)
:Diaclone characters should share pages with G1 counterparts who are also canonically said to be Diaclone-y. If we ever get a "Gobots Universe Bug Bite" that would be merged too - but just "white car Bug Bite" should not. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:21, 3 August 2022 (EDT)

==Proposal re: G1 pages==
I'm not expecting anything other than a hard "no" on this from the vast majority of editors, but a few people impelled me to post it, so here goes. In particular, I think this perspective is one held by many casual readers of the wiki. As I said over on [[Talk:Burn Out (Diaclone)|Burn Out's talk page]], I think both camps feel a sense of "''obviously'' these are (not) the same character", depending on whether they're coming from a strictly in-universe perspective or not. I want to put that whole discussion into an even broader perspective. Plus, I think the list of characters below is an interesting resource in its own right.

For ages, the wiki's had it so G1 appearances of characters originating in ''Robots in Disguise''—such as [[Sky-Byte (RID)]]—just get put on those pages. My understanding is that RID was considered something of a special case, because of how it was originally conceived as an in-continuity G1 thing, and remained such in Japanese continuity. For a less-prominent example, see also ''[[Power Core Combiners]]'', which similarly lists the IDW G1 appearances of [[Smolder (PCC)]] and [[Steamhammer (PCC)]] just on those pages. Again, this was a special case, because PCC was never concretely established as being a live-action movieverse thing or a G1 thing (which makes sense, because in Hasbro's eyes at the time, that wasn't a distinction that mattered to them).

There are other areas on the wiki that take a continuity-agnostic approach; I think it's just character pages that are handled so strictly. Check out [[Noisemaze Mass Production Type Version]]—which honestly ''is'' a character page in every way that matters—for a recently-made-relevant-again example. For many bigger-picture concept pages, a similar approach is used to great effect: [[Transformation]], [[Scanning]], [[Energon]], [[Protoform]], [[Spark]], [[Living metal]], [[Mini-Con]], [[Energon mutation]], just to grab a few random examples.

To draw attention to one last point, which I predict will resonate a lot with people who already agree with me and not at all with people who don't: any and all ''Beast Wars'' or ''Beast Machines'' original characters are exempt from this issue—despite, on a real-world level, there not really being any difference between those franchises and the likes of ''Armada'' or ''Animated''. It's just the lore connection that keeps it tethered, despite the wiki treating it as its ''own'' continuity family in basically every other way that matters.

My specific proposal is this: '''for characters originating ''outside of G1'', don't keep separate G1 pages.''' Treat those characters as we do Sky-Byte, ignoring the "continuity family" divide, and put the appearances on the page where they're most relevant. Here are the salient benefits of this approach:
*Have all the information on many popular post-G1 characters in the place where most casual readers would expect to look.
*Cut the Gordian knot of the GoBots/Diaclone debate.
*Finally ditch all those (BWU) pages consisting of a single sentence and a duplicated toy entry.
*Fewer redundant toy writeups which need to be maintained in parallel.
*Far, far fewer awkward paragraphs in Notes sections talking about "continuity transplants" like those are a real thing.

Here is a list of pages which I think would be affected, sorted by continuity, just from an hour or so of searching:
*'''''Diaclone''''': [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]]
*'''''GoBots''''': [[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Crasher (G1)]], [[Cy-Kill (G1)]], [[Leader-1 (G1)]], [[Rest-Q (G1)]], [[Cop-Tur (G1)]] (!)
*'''''Armada''''': [[Hot Shot (G1)]], [[Red Alert (IDW)]], [[Demolisher (G1)]], [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Sideways (RM)]] (!), [[Treadshot (IDW)]]
*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Override (BWU)]], [[Ransack (IDW)]], [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Signal Lancer (G1)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Barricade (IDW)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Breacher (G1)]], [[Terradive (G1)]], [[Hailstorm (G1)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''Animated''''': [[Bulkhead (G1)]] (!), [[Lugnut (TF 2010)]], [[Lockdown (G1)]], [[Slipstream (G1)]] (!), [[Oil Slick (G1)]], [[Lightbright (G1)]], [[Lickety-Split (G1)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Breakdown (IDW)]], [[Airachnid (G1)]], [[Predaking (Kingdom)]], [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Rescue Bots''''': [[Medix (G1)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Scatterspike (G1)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Headlock (G1)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Transit (G1)]], [[Fracture (Cybertron)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Cyberverse''''': [[Shadow Striker (G1)]], [[Croaton (G1)]], [[Meteorfire (G1)]], [[Wildwheel (G1)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Doomwings (G1)]], [[Ursa Major (G1)]], [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': (deep breath) [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Twirl (G1)]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Sky Blast (G1)]], [[Sureshock (G1)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]
I assuredly missed some, so feel free to edit the lists above to add any other characters that would be affected by this proposal which are omitted!

Again, the vast majority of these are from ''Beast Wars Uprising'', which does have some weird lingering cases that would need further individual discussion, I think: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]]. But for the most part, I really don't see any reason why there should be all these tiny nothing pages; the only reason all those Mini-Cons were not called Mini-Cons is that in the ''Uprising'' universe, Mini-Cons are called Micromasters instead (which is the lore equivalent of "[[Barricade (G1)]] doesn't look like he's made of knives"). This is even ''less'' an irreconcilable lore detail than, for example, the organic/robotic split for Targetmasters and the like. My main goal with sharing this is to revisit the ''Uprising'' policy, because from where I'm sitting, it's resulted in exactly the same horribly inconvenient setup as the ''Diaclone'' stuff. A different, specific policy there would deal with most of the examples above, and I'd be very happy; what I've suggested is just a one-size-fits-all policy.

The weirdest victim of this stated policy, I think, is that of [[Bulkhead (G1)]], who technically originated with Animated, but whose appearances in G1 media have all drawn specifically from the ''Prime'' version. [[Slipstream (G1)]] is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: [[Slipstream (Animated)]], [[Slipstream (WFC)]] and [[Slipstream (Cyberverse)]], depending on which specific version is being depicted. That means all of the Bulkhead appearances would actually go on the ''Prime'' page. I really don't feel strongly on this detail, though. [[Cop-Tur (G1)]], as mentioned in the above discussion, is another edge case. One more strange case ''not'' listed above is that of [[Emissary (IDW)]], who homages the ''Robots in Disguise'' character but genuinely has what I'd consider to be a radically different portrayal, likely inspired as much by the ''Titans Return'' figure as anything.

To be clear, I consider G1 a special case because of how it's a catch-all label for anything that isn't Hasbro's newest ground-up reboot du jour. Like it or not, G1 usually doesn't actually mean "G1" any more, it just means ''Transformers''. I absolutely wouldn't want to start merging anything from other continuity families—that way pure madness lies. But I think this proposal has clear-cut criteria for inclusion, and would feel more consistent with other areas of existing wiki policy. To give a specific, relevant example: I don't think [[Fracture (Movie)]]'s appearances should be folded onto her merged ''GoBots'' page as some have suggested, ''but'' I do think her toy writeup should be on both without any "blah blah repurposed" hedging, and likewise for the other movieverse characters based on redecos designed by [[Joe Kyde]] contemporaneously with Classics and Universe with specific G1 characters (mostly Micromasters) in mind, some of which were even intended to be released as part of the ''Universe'' toyline. These being: [[Fracture (Movie)]], [[Big Daddy (Movie)]], [[Jolt (Movie)]], [[Grindcore (Movie)]], [[Breakaway (Movie)]], and [[Crankcase (Movie)]]. [[Mudflap (Movie)]] and [[Inferno (Movie)]] are basically the exact same but nobody ever talks about that.

Finally, I think [[Gigatron (G1)]]/[[Overlord (G1)]], [[Zaptrap]]/[[Kuwagatrer]], and [[Rotorbolt (Timelines)]]/[[Skyklik]]/[[Fumes]] should prrrooobably be revisited? In the former two cases, they exist due to niche media establishing them as separate individuals within the same continuity, but we already have precedent for dealing with that—see [[Hot Shot (G1)]]. I will concede that the Rotorbolt situation is quite funny.

I understand that the wiki is structured the way it is for good reasons, but the post-[[Evergreen]] state of the franchise is one where most writers are plucking characters from anywhere in the franchise's history without any significant changes to their depiction. The existing policy will only become more cumbersome as time goes on, in my eyes—I know for many editors, the list of pages above is a horrible scary list of Exceptions, but from where I'm sitting, they feel more like exceptions as they already stand? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 07:25, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:As someone who is basically sympathetic to your goals and not knee-jerk opposed to the idea, this:
:::"Slipstream (G1) is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: Slipstream (Animated), Slipstream (WFC) and Slipstream (Cyberverse), depending on which specific version is being depicted."
:is the worst thing I've ever read. Just, why? --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 08:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I was mostly being glib, I don't have a good answer there! Just wanted to draw attention to the fact that it ''would'' be a problem with the proposal. It's also been pointed out that all of [[Lockdown (G1)|Lockdown]]'s appearances are visually based on the ''Revenge of the Fallen'' toy! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:56, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Absolutely not. There's so much here that's based on false assumptions/incorrect information that I absolutely refuse to take any of this seriously. Concepts are on the same page because they are just that: concepts. There's so much to pick apart here but because I have important things to do, I'll just say that right now, the only reason why there was ''ever'' any confusion over Power Core Combiners is because fans took behind the scenes information from the company overly literally. You actually look at the one piece of information about the toyline (the brief history provided directly by Hasbro the club) and it makes it abundantly clear that it was always meant to be movieverse; I even argued back at the time about Smoulder and Steamhammer being put on that page, and the only reason why it's still that way is because the argument just fizzled out. And once again, I really have to ask: why the hell are we pushing forward merges based on "vibes" when we still keep the Sideways' (someone who is actually said in fiction to all be the same guy) apart based on moronic, petty reasons? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:01, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Yeah, no, sorry, I think this is ultimately unhelpful and going to cause more accessibility issues than it solves. "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in" is perhaps a little confusing to new readers, but it's ultimately fairly self-consistent and easy to navigate once you understand the basic concept; "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in, with the exception of RID01 which shares its pages with G1, and any latter-day characters imported into G1, which go on the pages of their non-G1 incarnations" is very confusing and requires you to be deep in the sauce to understand which characters are and are not exceptions to the rule. I obviously think that flexibility of the system is a good thing — the RID/G1 merge, while less than ideal, is definitely the best way to solve a very unintuitive issue — but the more holes we poke in the tower the closer it comes to collapsing, if you catch my drift.
:Ultimately I think the occasional silliness of "Shadow Striker (G1) who is identical to Shadow Striker (Cyberverse)" and such is the price we pay for having any structure whatsoever. The more we make exceptions on the basis of ultimately arbitrary "well this one's SO similar" the less consistent the wiki overall gets, and the harder it gets to navigate. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Basically, this. And I don't even think that drawing the franchise-based chunk distinction is all that confusing given I think most people grok the idea that characters will pop up across sub-fictions of major multi-media franchises with varying levels of similarity to prior incarnations that are still "oh, it's a wholly separate storyline, okay". That's just how these things ''do''. (and like "multiverse" has kinda become a ''thing'' in other franchises the last several years) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 10:00, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:"We've always put RID guys appearing in G1 as still being the RID character, look at Sky Byte" - what other examples make this an "always"? There WERE two Sky Byte pages, for years. We only stopped having a Sky-Byte (G2) when its character model in the IDW G1 comic was explicitly based off the new T30 toy sculpt which wound up with like half of these separate articles duplicating each other. It was argued on that talk page for a long while. The only other case I can think of at all is Gigatron (G1), and we ''don't'' treat him like Megatron (RID).
:"We treat BW as a continuity family like Armada, it looks like we are showing favoritism to them" - we treat it like a franchise within G1, which is what it is. And we disambig by franchise, not by continuity family. "Chase (RB)", not "Chase (Aligned)" or "Chase (Prime)". This was one of the concerns I raised last year when we turned Victory, Masterforce et al into G1 because they had no separate box branding of their own, wait it turned out they did, welp whattaya gonna do, no backsies.
:'''Last but MOST''', I'd say that, yes, "lore connections" mean a great deal here, it is a feature not a bug. This is a fiction-centric wiki as surely as it's an English-centric one. We put character writeups first, above the toys. We give the toys the character names and say "his stickers", not "its stickers" and talk about how it represents the character, not about how many micrograms of silicon it contains. Separating characters because they come from different storyline eras / offerings is entirely normal and reasonable for us. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 09:43, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I don't disagree in general, but G1/IDW Gigatron DOES share a page with RID Megatron. [[Gigatron (G1)]] is the Overlord repurpose. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:49, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Oof. Don't know why I clearly remembered them as being separate, but in any case I regret the error. Thank you.--[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
There's no way to organize something like this place without something somewhere seeming arbitrary. I think the existing structure is arbitrary in the best way that makes the most sense, and trying to "mitigate" that arbitrariness just creates different arbitrariness. A lot of this "but what if we redid all this to fix this particular thing" shuffling just relitigates why we already do the stuff we already do. so, like: no --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 09:54, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

== The Discord ==

Alright, seriously, we need to talk about this. It is beyond frustrating that a greater than 50% chunk of discussion about what big edits will happen on the wiki are happening on an app that people either aren't on or (in my case) aren't allowed on. I was told it was going to just to get voices onto things but that clearly isn't how it's working out. We need either some sort of archival dump of all these posts or something because I'm tired of getting into arguments where half the responses haven't even happened on the main site itself. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:45, 17 August 2022 (EDT)
: I think you're drastically overestimating how much discussion about big edits is happening on the Discord. No actual big decisions are getting made there, and we make it a point to repeatedly remind people that discussion for major changes needs to happen here before anything gets decided. But we also can't stop anyone from simply talking about things there the same way we couldn't stop discussion on the AllSpark thread when that was a thing, and having a public log of discussions from the editing channel is both infeasible and frankly unnecessary. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 09:09, 17 August 2022 (EDT)

==Designer bylines on toy writeups==

As those of us who have been tuning in to the [[Hasbro Pulse#Livestreams|Hasbro Pulse livestreams]] have no doubt noticed, one side effect of the unprecedented transparency of the current team on the ''Generations'' franchise is that we are now pretty consistently being blasted with a fire hose of toy designer credits. While there's been a scramble to record them on the designers' pages as best we can, this rapidly growing body of information is not doing the average reader a whole lot of good sequestered away on pages that require them to already know the designers by name. As such, I've put together a template to act as a designer byline for relevant toy write-ups, largely following the formatting of our existing voice actor template.

Documentation for the prototype template which I've named '''<nowiki>{{toydesigner}}</nowiki>''' can be found here:

*[[:Template:Toydesigner-Prototype]]

And a variety of examples of implementation can be found here:

*[[User:AzimuthAcolyte/Sandbox/Toy credits demo]]

Is this something we would be interested in implementing?

Questions, concerns, suggestions etc are welcome. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:33, 22 August 2022 (EDT)

:I support adding this template, it's valid information and helps put names and faces in a historically anonymous industry due to the lack of credits in the products themselves.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:38, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I think this is a great idea. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I really like it. The only possible negative is that unless a whole bunch of people are very dedicated to this (or one brave soul is ''extremely'' dedicated to it) we might end up seeing it only appear on a small handful of toy entries and most will never feature it. I vote for going ahead with it regardless.
:::While we are addressing the "designer credits" issue, can we also please find a better phrase to use on the designer pages than "Toys So-and-so is known to have had a hand in creating"? It's just so overwrought. I think "Design Team Credits Include:" gets the point across much more naturally.... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 13:54, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::::This is a fair point. Maybe something as blunt as "Known Design Work" mirroring the "Published Works" thing we use for writers/artists? -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Looks good to me. Hope we can scrounge together sources and lists for older design teams too. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 15:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I can't see any reason not to do this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not a toy person, but that looks really cool! --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 16:23, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
Oh wow, I'm blown away by the universally positive reception here! If there are no concerns in the next few days I guess I'll get started rolling this out. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Alrighty it's been a fair bit with no further concerns, so I have pushed the template live to [[:Template:Toydesigner]] and will begin implementing it as I have time. Any and all help is appreciated, as this will of course be a huge job. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 16:13, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Wiki Toy Photo Quality Standards ==
So we know (and had long suspected anyway) that Hasbro designers are sometimes pulling Wiki photos for reference. That's great, but we've got some toy photography on here that's a good bit off from what the figures look like in reality for one reason or another. Is there any way to flag shots that are out of whack so that they might get tweaked or replaced? This issue comes to mind since, while I've been here more or less since the Wiki started, I don't recall there being a formal set of standards for photos since it just wasn't really a big deal before now. Oversaturation is my main complaint, since one user a long while ago was going through, taking existing shots into Photoshop and oversaturating the hell out of them without regard to the actual toy, and I've noticed some updated photography like [[Prowl (Magnaboss)]] that does basically the same. It's a larger photo, but that Prowl is definitely not blazing yellow in person. Apologies in advance and please disregard if this has already been discussed elsewhere or before.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:10, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:For the record, my lighting set up is very warm, hence why Prowl's colours appear so bright. I haven't figured out the right balance in Photoshop to get the colours of figures to look spot on so figures either appear too bright or too dull in the finished product. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 17:30, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::Oh, I'm not intending to put you on the spot, that's just the first example I had on hand of a wider issue that we probably need to start being careful about since it appears to be (hilariously) affecting actual figures now, like Titans Return PMOP or Legacy Iguanus. When it was the one guy tweaking things to be inaccurate "because it looked better", I could follow him and revert stuff, but I can't when there's nothing to revert in most cases.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 18:38, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::I recommend ring lights, you can get some pretty cheap, they've good at spreading light out rather than heavy-focus, and they have adjustable brightness and warm/cool light settings: use "cool" (aka white/blue-tinted). Even before I got ring lights, I used "cool" light bulbs in the lamps. The problem is these are nowhere as common as the "normal" yellow-tinted bulbs, thus, go with the ring lights.
::As for "standards"... well, good luck with that. Every camera's a little different. Every MONITOR is a little different. Hell, I have a double-monitor setup with different models and they have small but distinct differences in brightness & etc; honestly I'm good with it since it lets me check how things may look to different people. But I think maybe a tag for photos that we are CERTAIN are too far off from final product (be they user-made or stock images) may not be a bad idea. Assuming we notice. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 22:44, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, a tag we can throw on to a photo just to make it at least visible that it's incorrect would be useful. And would probably prompt a deco designer to gather some secondary reference material, assuming the tag's obvious. I like the idea.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:29, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I've noticed that the quality of the UT stuff in the toys section flunctuates greatly-- for example, ML Starscream still uses the guidebook picture, and Superlink ver of the combining Optimus downright doesn't exist. I've started to collect UT toys since Hasbro has been updating UT stuff with more commitment and I have 0 faith in them doing it right, and most of the stuff I've gotten are the JP versions. For minor alterations like ML/ Armada Megs, is it worth uploading a completely new picture of ML Megatron onto his page? Another issue worth regarding discussing is "cartoon accuracy". Whilst Hasbro is indeed working on making more accurate figures, they obviously aren't 100% accurate, like 86 starscream using the commonly accepted G1 logo instead of the sunbow accurate one with the spike in the middle, and even from a sculpt and proportional standppint the ER mold is far from accurate compared to the sunbow model, let alone MP52. I actually cleaned up the page for TM2 Megatron because he deviates pretty heavily if you compare the CG model to the final toy, and changed the claim that Skids is "toon" accurate as he is blantently based on the original toy in deco. The same goes for Starscream, aside from the forearms and forehead hes blatently based on the T30 toy. I also had to edit that bit --[[User: Pixelmaster|Pixelmaster]] 3:31 HKT

==Reconsolidating some of our pages==
This is something I've been thinking about for a while, but I'd like to propose re-merging some of our excessively split articles back into something more manageable. It seems like that once a page is split out, a) we get a lot less editorial oversight, as the recent toy page trimming has revealed, b), stuff does not get updated nearly as often as they would be on their respective mainpages, and c) it makes information harder to find by pushing it behind a subpage that's not readily accessible.

Obviously I understand that splits are necessary for the really long pages like [[Optimus Prime (G1)]], [[Megatron (G1)]], and soforth, but when you get down to like, [[Mirage (G1)]] or [[Hound (G1)]] or [[Hot Shot (Armada)]], there's barely anything of any significance on their main pages beyond Dreamwave or the odd IDW cameo. Are, for instance, [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]]'s Marvel adventures that major that they can't fit into the main page? Are [[Hook (G1)/toys|Hook]] or [[Warpath (G1)#Toys|Warpath]] really that inundated with toys that they need their own subpage? If it's a problem of just ''length'', then a lot of the subpaged articles or mainpage stuff like the storybooks could just be trimmed down into something more manageable—as I did with G1 Cliffjumper's Marvel section earlier this year. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 17:00, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:I 100% agree with this. --[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:04, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Fully in favour. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 17:20, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Sub-pages should, on their own, be significantly sizable pages to justify making readers link-jump. A dozen toys does not strike me as remotely enough to justify a subpage split. Being ''in'' a major long-running fiction but mostly having appearances in a minority of installments that can be summed up in two sentences doesn't justify a split. New editing tools are fun and all, but just 'cuz you gotta new hammer doesn't mean you have to go hunting for anything that looks vaguely nail-like. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 18:18, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Incoming maintenance ==

Just a heads up, our host is going to be doing some maintenance in about an hour that may cause problems with the site, so if you have trouble reaching it and therefore cannot read this message, that's what it is. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 00:11, 23 November 2022 (EST)

== Foreign names ==

A dispute came up recently on the [[Megatron (ES)]] page. User:Kiké Prime has been providing Hungarian names for all the characters, but this one apparently is just "Megatron". Cyberlink420 removed it. I disputed it, pointing out that not listing it leaves the implication that we do not know the name of the character in the language. Despite having my reversion again reverted, I still find deliberately leaving blanks in our name lists odd. I am thus bringing the matter here for further discussion. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 12:16, 5 December 2022 (EST)
:My understanding has always been that we only add foreign names if they are different from the English name. Per pages like [[Megatron (G1)]], this includes examples where the name is the same, but is spelled with a diacritic or using a different alphabet. So "Megatron" wouldn't be different enough to justify inclusion, but examples like Mégatron, Megatrón, Мегатрон and メガトロン would. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:10, 5 December 2022 (EST)

== Nonbinary Character Category ==

So, we now have another nonbinary character (who actually used their pronouns during the media no less), [[Nightshade (ES)|Nightshade]] from [[Earthspark]] (Nightshade at time of posting doesn't have a page yet)! The other fully for certain fully intentional one is [[Screwball]] from [[Beast Wars Uprising]] while [[Acid Storm (Cyberverse)|Acid Storm]] was at least an out of media by writer retcon of animation, and [[Overlord_(G1)#Ask_Vector_Prime|Overlord's]] gender is somewhat nebulous on where that fits beyond being gender expansive due to being [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#December 23, 2015|"what some would call genderfluid"]] but that at least puts us at three. Given that we have a trans category now we thought it best to at this point suggestion a nonbinary category for the sake of users (including gender expansive people) easily finding nonbinary characters on here. Obviously adding Nightshade will have to wait until they have a page but any thoughts on this yea or nay? [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 18:28, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:I forgot about Screwball. I think with three confirmed examples, even without the edge case of Overlord, that's probably enough to justify one. Care will have to be taken, however, to only include confirmed examples and not use it as a dumping ground for any character whose gender has never been explicitly identified. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 18:37, 8 December 2022 (EST)
::Authorial intent and all, but I can say that if I had the option to go back and rewrite it I would have used the term non binary for Overlord. I feel like Acid Storm is more of an edge case; it’s what one person said on their account to justify it. Whenever Acid Storm actually says something they’re animated with a female face; it’s not done at random.[[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:47, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::Acid Storm changes from masculine male to feminine female and back. Gender-fluid, sure, but definitely non-binary? As for Overlord, in the Legends manga Mega gives Overlord a female-presenting face - is there a pronoun change during that time? Would we have more candidates for inclusion in a Gender-fluid category first? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 20:17, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::::Thank for the notes folks, that does help to piece this together! Just want to note that a pronoun change is not necessary for a gender being experienced in fluidity to be the one expressed or what have you, so unless the Legends manga actually has some sort of statement about Overlord's fluidity that kind of puts us back with an umbrella term of nonbinary (which we are unsure as not having read the Legends manga if that would work for that Overlord so we can't speak to where/if Overlord falls under gender expansiveness beyond the fact that Overlord's presentation changes depending on the binary bond partner right?). Acid Storm is an edge case yes but if we do count the edge case that they are we think it is worth noting that for Acid Storm what Catt said was specifically that changing expression is just something they do, and "any pronouns" work for Acid Storm, no statement about the binary. Of course, we only see two faces which are the two different Seeker faces that were otherwise delineated by gender, but at this point we're getting into the opt-in thing of 'x person is genderfluid and thus considers themself nonbinary' or 'z person is genderfluid and only considers themself as under the multigender umbrella'. Which we don't have detail on really if Acid Storm is genderfluid as how they know themselves right? Because that's just a thing that was written in the Female Transformers page because of (no blame being given, it's understandable) the user finding that to be the term that fit best? Feel like we've ended up just pointing out an need for just a gender expansive category instead but ah well. [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 21:46, 1 January 2023 (EST)
::::::We seem to have killed this with a non-solution for the nonbinary category by pointing out that gender expansive is more certain than saying genderfluid. If we count Nightshade, Overlord, and Screwball, is that a go on nonbinary, or should we just have a gender expansive category at this point that would also be one trans characters use? For people wondering what gender expansive means you can find a definition here https://www.diversitystyleguide.com/glossary/gender-expansive/ https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/08/gender-expansive-mean/ [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 23:18, 6 February 2023 (EST)
:::::::Respectfully, I think needing to invoke a glossary suggests the term is so little-used in common parlance that it would not be useful for our needs and style. We don't have a category tag at the bottom of a bunch of BW characters saying "tetrapods" or "perissodactyls" (we ''do'' talk like that on [[Popular beast alternate modes]], maybe a grouping ''page'' would be a better approach? Just a thought...). If we are looking for a category tag I think it would be better to find the term that unambiguously covers the largest number of candidates, without a need to rely on edge cases, maintaining both accuracy and readability. I see three characters that could sensibly go in a Gender-fluid tag, one that could go in a Non-binary tag (meaning we wouldn't make the latter). We may be facing a case where there are few enough disparate examples that there isn't one single category tag that usefully unites them. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:55, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::::::::With the most recent block of EarthSpark episodes having further explored Nightshade's character and introduced a new nonbinary character in the form of Sam (this also saw the term nonbinary used in the show for the first time), we have been discussing the topic of introducing a Nonbinary characters category on the Discord. Doing some research, AVP also confirmed the Tigerhawk of Primax 496.22 Alpha (the Beast Wars cartoon continuity) to be nonbinary, so that's another character to justify that category. It's been suggested by an expert on the matter that we could introduce a "Gender expansive characters" category as an umbrella category, with Genderfluid characters, Nonbinary characters, and Transgender characters existing as subcategories as a way of future-proofing our coverage of gender expansive characters, while also ensuring we don't lump every gender expansive character together into a single broad category and hopefully making these concepts easier to navigate for casual readers. - [[User:Archforce|Archforce]] ([[User talk:Archforce|talk]]) 17:26, 4 March 2023 (EST)
:::::::::In sequence you replied to my post of Feb 7 but seem to have side-stepped the part where I questioned the usefulness of a category tag that will not be widely understood. Also, creating such a category exactly ''is'' "lumping them all together into a single broad category." So is that approach desirable or not? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 17:43, 4 March 2023 (EST)
::::::::::: They said the word nonbinary in the show. In a show full of nonbinary rep. And then nonbinary characters exists outside of that show, and it would not be a dangerous bet to expect this to continue. But people are born with an innate understanding of what an Alpha Primax 9384u743 is, or Transmetals, or Powermasters, but not what a nonbinary person is so yeah maybe we are going too far on this website for nerds who want to learn more about things related to Transformers (like nonbinary characters). We have a category called council members. Literally for any character who has served on any council. I did not understand what "council members" actually refered to before I clicked on it, assumed it was more specific than it was, but in fact it took me two seconds to figure it out. A non-binary category and/or gender-expansive category would surely be the same. And as Archforce says, make these concepts easier to navigate. Or if that was too long, what Walky said. Seriously.
You also appear to misunderstand what is meant by lumping together. Because putting all non-binary people in a non-binary category is accurate, and is something I and at least some others want, putting all non-binary people on a transgender page would be a misrepresentative "all of these are the same thing right?". Gender-expansive on the other hand comes from someone familiar with the matter, and as a non-binary person myself, as someone who has researched gender representation in media at an honours level (to flex some credentials that yeah I could be making up), I agree with what is being said on the Discord. Gender expansive as an umbrella provides the room to not lump everyone together while recognising yeah there is something shared in any act of gender that is not one of cisgender conformity. Having transgender and nonbinary characters on the same page while called out as two seperate subcategories I again think helps casual readers navigate based on this. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 18:40, 4 March 2023 (EST)
::::::::::Not using the best useful terms because they're not understood by enough people is extremely self-defeating. I reject that line of thinking. (also, like, c'mon, the first complete article for this wiki was gaddang Robot-Master, not Optimus Prime, so I think we can say the words "gender expansive" even if someone hasn't heard of them) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 17:49, 4 March 2023 (EST)

== Adding an informative table to each character page ==
I was thinking about it since it's striking.. lack.. There should be a way to tell people in which and how many episodes/issues/movies each character appears in the continuity they belong to, their debut episode/issue movie, what aliases they have had and nicknames they were given by other characters, a more centered area for the voice or live actors, a link to their gallery pages(if they have any) and one to their disambiguation pages etc. The kind of information that one would prefer to find with greater ease, especially if they aren't members. And talking about their appearances, that should prove quite useful for future page edits, since we'll know exactly where to look especially when it's about latecomers or characters that don't appear on a regular basis. I just think it'd be useful. [[User:Darthrone|Darthrone]] ([[User talk:Darthrone|talk]]) 15:44, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:This kind of infobox was discussed at the very earliest days of this wiki, and it was decided that there was just way, way too much information for it to work... and this was in 2006, BEFORE the franchise exploded. TF is such a fragmented kludge of fictions from multiple sources and creators spanning 40 years that any major character would end up with one ultra-massive thing of dubious use (can't say I see the value in a "number of appearances" tally, aside from the headache of keeping that accurate over time and arguing "what counts"), or a billion splintered ones spread across the page for the different fictions. And "nicknames" is always a minefield as those tend to turn into a massive list of "someone called them this once" which is... not helpful. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:46, 2 February 2023 (EST)
::Even if it had been a day-1 thing, I don't see how this is more informative than our current style. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 17:58, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:::I'm for infoboxes, but the information you're asking for is far too abstract and meaningless in this franchise. (We are absolutely not doing "nicknames". No.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:09, 2 February 2023 (EST)

==The (BWU) tag==
I understand the reasons why [[#Proposal re: G1 pages|my previous proposal]] regarding the proliferation of (G1) pages for random newer characters was soundly rejected. However, my main motivation for raising it was that I find the huge quantity of (BWU) pages for "repurposed" Mini-Cons and bestial Transformers to be reader-unfriendly, so I wanted to make a case for making an exception for ''[[Beast Wars: Uprising]]'' cameos. ''Uprising'' was an obscure barely-canon multi-continuity-drifting web serial which we are very unlikely to get further instalments of, and most of the relevant characters are similarly very deep pulls who will assuredly not be appearing again in future stories, and who will otherwise be stuck with tiny stub-pages forever. Most of these are Mini-Cons (here Micromasters) or bestial Transformers (here Protoformers), with a few boats or Constructicons from "[[Derailment]]". In many cases, I perceive ''Uprising'' as having tried to give these toys a hint of fiction where previously they had none at all, much like [[Ask Vector Prime]] before it. It's a very different phenomenon to most so-called "continuity transplants" we've seen in other series (such as with, say, [[Hot Shot (G1)]]), which are instead rooted in the popularity of those characters.

I think the problem here is that strictly speaking ''Uprising'' is a "Primax" continuity, sure, but it lifts dozens of characters (let alone concepts) unchanged from later stories. Slavishly hewing to that label when it's such an intertextual melting pot has resulted in this unfriendly setup. It feels like a fair decision made at the time (was [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive64#Derailment & Uprising pages|this discussion]] the one?) but in my opinion the wiki's policy kinda fails here. If we get rid of the (BWU) tag, the (G1) back-ports remaining (a minority!) will be for more significant characters, often adapted more radically. Here's the list of tiny pages we could be rid of, just like that:

*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]

There's a handful of ''Uprising'' characters that need a (G1) page anyway for non-''Uprising'' reasons; I'm totally ambivalent about where the ''Uprising'' content ends up for these: [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Override (BWU)]] (!), [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Twirl (G1)]].

Finally there's a few weird cases that would merit individual discussion but would probably just need to keep their own pages: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]].

Here is a ([https://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=500&offset=0&redirs=1&profile=all&search=%22from+the%22+%22continuity+families%22 probably non-exhaustive]) list of existing cases of multi-continuity drifting you should probably consider before weighing in:
* [[Buckethead]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 31, 2015|this Ask Vector Prime answer]])
* [[Drydock (TF 2010)]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 13, 2015|this answer]] which explicitly has him travel from one continuity to another)
* [[Drelnar Feh'd]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 17, 2015|this one]])
* [[Scorpia (G2)]], [[Autoceptor]], [[Deceptor]], and [[Kaltor]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#June 12, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Night Rescue Team]], [[Clear Skies Team]], [[Rapid Intervention Team]], [[Prehistoric Team]], [[Demolition Team]], [[Dirt Digger Team]], [[Heavy Load (Universe)]] and the [[Mobile Fortification Team]], and [[Detectas]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]]).
**However, exceptions from these Mini-Con teams are [[Nightscream (Cybertron)|Nightscream]], [[Offshoot (Cybertron)|Offshoot]], [[Strongarm (Cybertron)|Strongarm]] and [[Knockdown (Cybertron)|Knockdown]], who all have separate (Cybertron) basis on the basis of receiving separate bios after being packed in with ''Cybertron'' Primus...
**...but then [[Liftor]] is all on a single page, despite his ''Classics'' bio.
**[[Snarl (Classics)|Snarl]], [[Sledge (Classics)|Sledge]], [[Wideload (Classics)|Wideload]], [[Knockdown (Classics)|Knockdown]], and [[Steel Wind]] already have ''Uprising'' content on their pages, but that makes sense as these were originally ''Classics'' guys.
* The [[Saurian Strike Team]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Minicon 8 Pack]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 24, 2015|this one]])
* The ''Dark of the Moon'' Mini-Cons [[Dualor (DOTM)]], [[Triceradon (DOTM)]], [[Rav (DOTM)]], and [[Catilla (DOTM)]], plus [[Ironlunge]], [[Reptix]], [[Sling (AOE)]], [[Gnashteeth]], [[Wedge Shape]], [[Brimstone (Universe)]], [[Apexus]], [[Gredator]], and [[Dragoyell]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#August 13, 2015|this one]])
** Weirdly, we ''separately'' have a page for [[Rav (BWU)]], but Catilla has Unicron Trilogy, movie, and ''Uprising'' appearances covered all on the one page!
* [[Galadria]] and [[Ramak]] (because of [[Source:Transformers: Spacewarp's Log#December 5, 2015|this post]])
* Am I to understand that [[Wind Sheer (RID)]], [[Skyfire (RID)]] and the [[Dimensional Patrol]] each have just a single page because (RID) ''is'' part of the G1 continuity family sometimes...?
* And I understand that [[Primus Vanguard]] cameos just go on their original pages because that's a weird thing kinda outside of G1 anyway (at least from an in-universe perspective, if not a real-world one).
* ''Diaclone'' examples like [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]], [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]], and [[Chifumi Takahashi]] have been discussed to death.
* [[Monsterous]] was retconned to originally be from an Aligned universe (in [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#October 21, 2015|this post]], though I can't actually find any mention of Uniend? EDIT: [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#November 7, 2015|found it]]!)
* [[Primacron]] was apparently mentioned in ''[[Transformers Animated: The AllSpark Almanac II| The AllSpark Almanac II]]''.
* And [[Sentinel Supreme]] is just an Easter egg that everyone seemed to shrug about at the time.

To those who say the exception I'm proposing would be confusing, I submit these existing examples where we've apparently neglected to split something out as evidence that the only people this confuses are wiki editors like me wondering why they're not all that way. Maybe I'm just unaware of some aspect of the existing policy which accounts for all these cases? But is it really helpful to anyone to have a given toy's associated fiction squirrelled away somewhere separate you have to go into the disambiguation to find? We recently merged [[Chromhorn]] (another Sorenson job) on the basis that "There's literally no reason for these to be on different pages. They are the same thing." Can we not do the same for these Sorenson-penned cases that are basically going "look, the exact same guy shows up in multiple universes, alright?" And if the answer is no, will someone go through and split all these out? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 18:27, 6 February 2023 (EST)

:I think my response to your earlier G1-import proposal still applies here: the more exceptions we make to our system for the sake of "accessibility", the harder the overall structure becomes to grok for a new reader, and thus ironically it all becomes ''less'' accessible. Why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steel Jaw]], but ''Uprising'' Bisk be at [[Bisk (RID)]]? Or, conversely, why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steeljaw (RID)]], but LBS Steeljaw be at [[Steel Jaw|Steeljaw (IDW)]]? Neither solution is good.
:As for the current list of exceptions, I'd argue everything you list from Buckethead to the DOTM Mini-Cons should probably be split. Galadria and Ramak are characters from outside media, so we don't split them across continuity lines. Wind Sheer and Skyfire have one page for consistency with the other RID guys. The source on Monsterous being Aligned is [[Source:Ask_Vector_Prime/Facebook#November_7.2C_2015|here]], but I would argue that's just giving an origin to the GoBot and so they should share a page anyway.
:Lastly - I object to you bringing the Chromhorn thing into this, as I don't think it's a fair comparison. Chromhorn wasn't making any exception to our categorisation system; it was one page saying "Chromhorn is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT" and another saying "Chromhorn Forest Type is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT", and the former was somehow a "repurposing" of the fictionless latter. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:24, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::Totally get the Steeljaw example—although it ''is'' crazy that we're currently disambiguating G1 wolf Steeljaw simply by [[Steel Jaw]]. You should post about the disambiguation tag policy change you suggested on Discord, I think a lot of people were thinking along similar lines there. Agree with your interpretation of the current policy as to which of the examples listed should be split and which shouldn't—although the more I think about the Primus Vanguard, the more I think those should technically be split too. While I guess the [[Time Warrior (AVP)|Time Warrior]]s are multiversal travellers like Drydock. RE: Chromhorn, I understand why it's technically different; I brought it up because I think it speaks to the tenor of ''Ask Vector Prime'' answers—in spirit, I think its aim was exactly the same as with the Mini-Con examples I've given.
::What do I mean by that? To match your Steeljaw example, from the opposite angle: say I'm your typical fan scrolling [[Transformers: Dark of the Moon (toyline)]], and I click on, say, [[Dualor (DOTM)]], wondering if he's ever shown up in anything. In their current state, I get my answer immediately. With the proposed split for consistency, I instead get a page telling me that Dualor (DOTM) is a dinosaur Mini-Con from ''Dark of the Moon'', some info about the toy, ''maybe'' ending with an inscrutable note about how he was "repurposed" as an identical guy. Now, there's ''already'' an unrelated [[Dualor (Armada)]], so we'd need to make a disambiguation page. We can see this already by looking at [[Snow Cat (Universe)]], which is barren (the very scenario AVP so often tried to address!), and doesn't even admit to the existence of [[Snow Cat (BWU)]] aside from a general Snow Cat disambiguation tag. In some existing cases like [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], we've mirrored a toy writeup, which needs upkeep in parallel; in others, like Snow Cat, we're asking the user to visit the other page to read about the toy ''anyway''. To my mind, this is inarguably less accessible. I don't understand arguments made about accessibility here which are predicated on readers having learned editing policy to begin with, and I don't think this proposal would actually make it any harder to learn the system.
::I regret not listing out all the individual members of those Mini-Con teams above, to better communicate the sheer number of pages that would need to be made (and pages that would need to be renamed, in case of conflicts) to create this inconvenience in service of a rule we've already been ignoring without issue. Nobody wants to do this work, and I think it's less that no-one cares, and more that some people think it'd actually make the wiki worse, and the rest don't particularly think it'd make the wiki better.
::What about just making an exception for Mini-Cons/Micromasters? I've talked about ''Uprising'', but obviously the vast majority of cases that theoretically need splitting aren't from ''Uprising'' at all. Could probably even do a generic template like "X exists in multiple continuity families, and is a Micromaster/Maximal/Predacon in those without Mini-Cons". Thus your Steeljaws and Bisks and Overrides go unchanged, no problems or ambiguity there! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
:Once upon a time, I probably would have pushed for something like this, but where we are now: I am not a fan of any push towards treating something differently based on how "relevant" something is or not. It goes against the very spirit this wiki was founded on, because that is what was happening to the Wikipedia coverage of Transformers where they were just getting rid of things wholesale because of "relevancy." I can understand the basic point behind this, but I feel that doing so would set a bad precedent that could be exploited in the future.
:I'd be fine with splitting most of these out. I've said it before elsewhere but by and large a lot of the inconsistencies were largely the result of different contributors adding stuff or splitting stuff without a general consensus, and they haven't been cleaned up afterwards. Also, a minor note, but the Liftor thing was mainly cause no one noticed at the time until I wrote up about the profile years after the fact. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:26, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::If I gave the impression "relevancy" was the main thrust of my argument here, I didn't mean to! Like, it goes both ways—would we be merging because ''Uprising'' is so irrelevant that we shouldn't devote all these random stub pages to it, ''or'' are we merging because it's sufficiently relevant that we shouldn't be hiding that content in stub pages nobody visits? Either is true! I'm arguing for convenience and clarity. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::: This definitely feels like the strongest argument to the merge in my mind. The wiki is no stranger to niche pages, pages for nameless, fictionless, toyless nonentities. But I believe these fictionless toys and toyless fiction which are really the same thing would be a richer niche page for the merges. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 20:36, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::: I really think that once again, this overrates the number of people who would be confused by this, and underrates the number of people who would be able to figure out where to go if they wish to find the information. Like, I hate to do the whole "I was able to figure it out" thing but I was a small child with a single-digit age when I first discovered the wiki and I was able to figure out pretty quick why it was laid out the way it was. I'm not saying there's no room for improvement; I think there's a lot of cases in which the way we have things set up now is kind of ridiculous. But in this particular case, I don't really see how merging things would be any more convenient than just leaving them the way they are and splitting out the cases that we never got around to. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:52, 7 February 2023 (EST)

Just found some more pages that would need splitting under current policy: [[Crystal Widow]], [[Seawave]], [[Cradon]], [[Freefall (Kre-O)]], [[Liftoff]], and [[Epsilon Holdings]]. All due to ''Uprising'' and ''The Allspark Almanac''. Really hoping someone can propose a solution here that doesn't involve creating a billion pages and disambigs. --[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 09:24, 18 February 2023 (EST)
:We don't split businesses/locations/organizations, so Epsilon Holdings isn't one we need to consider. Kre-O doesn't really occupy a continuity family in our organization and I would just split the rest, especially Crystal Widow. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 09:28, 18 February 2023 (EST)

MediaWiki talk:Community Portal

2023-02-08T01:36:29Z

Bumblebee2000: /* The (BWU) tag */

__NEWSECTIONLINK__

This is the place for discussion of topics that affect the entire wiki. For less wide-reaching subjects, either use articles' individual talk pages or [https://discord.gg/N99Bygq our Discord server].

Some topics that would ordinarily be here have merited their own pages:

{{chapters|title=Specific Discussion Subjects|align=left|content=
<div class="list-header">'''Moving From Wikia:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving|Arriving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving|Leaving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki:Community Portal/Complaints|Complaints]]
 <div class="list-header">'''New Ad Policy:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki:Ads|Ads]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Bookworm Database-Crash:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Damage Control Central|Damage Control Central]]
* [[Project:Bookworm Crash]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving2|Leaving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Server Move:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving2|Arriving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Relicensing:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Relicensing|Relicensing]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Dealing With Vandalism:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Vandalism|Vandalism]]
 <div class="list-header">'''GoBots Sister Wiki:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/GoBots|Discussion on the place of GoBots in this wiki]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Wiki Technical Information:'''</div>
* [[Transformers_Wiki:Tech|A Not So Brief Summary of the Horrible Things That McFly and Co. Have Done To Keep This Wiki From Melting Down]]
}} 

{{:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}/Archive}}


== Site Logo revamp ==

Up until now, our rotating logo on the main page tends to have a batch of logos pointing to pages from the most recent franchises and series, plus a few from older franchises that we forgot or didn't bother to remove. I'd like to rework this system a bit to have a more even balance franchise-wise. I think we should have one character for every franchise that has had a cartoon or movie (including the JG1 shows), plus one from each of the major English-language comic runs (Marvel, Dreamwave, IDW1, and IDW2 at the bare minimum). This would be a good way to demonstrate the breadth of the franchise scope of the wiki, and help drive new readers towards legacy content. (Of course, we'd still have a few extra banners based on whatever is currently running for the "Hey, I know that guy!" factor. Would love to get some thoughts on this, and potentially character suggestions for each franchise. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 00:59, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:I think this is a great idea! Though, I'm unsure on which characters from each show would be good to use. Like, would we go most popular/memorable characters or just some really random left field obscurities like G1 Skids who appeared in only two episodes of ''The Transformers'', just to get some more eyes on character articles from franchises newer fans may not be fully aware of? Also, would Japanese-exclusive shows include ''Go!'', ''Q-Transformers'' and ''Robotmasters''? If so, maybe even an image from ''Portal'' (the Russian show) would be worthwhile too. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 02:47, 18 December 2021 (EST)
::Obscure/minor stuff risks just being the GO! Boxes again, and we already have those. For the big logo, best to go with majorish characters from majorish media. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 07:19, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:This sounds like a great idea. We could break it down like this:
G1 Seasons 1 and 2 - Optimus Prime,
TFTM/G1 Seasons 3 and 4 - Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime,
G1 Marvel - Ratchet,
Headmasters - Fort Max,
Masterforce - Minerva,
Victory - Star Saber,
Idk if we would do Zone or any of the Japanese G1 stories that came after,
Beast Wars - Megatron,
Beast Wars II - Lio Convoy,
Beast Wars Neo - Magmatron,
RID/Car Robots - Side Burn,
I've never read Dreamwave so I don't know a good character that represents it,
Unicron Trilogy - Hot Shot,
IDW could be broken into a few character reps because of how long it went on,
IDW Furman Era - IDW Bumblebee,
IDW Post Furman - IDW Galvatron,
IDW MTMTE/LL - Nautica,
IDW RID/OP - IDW Optimus Prime,
Animated - Bulkhead,
Movies - Bumblebee,
WFC Games - Bruticus,
Prime - Starscream,
RID15 - Strongarm,
Cyberverse - Windblade,
WFC Trilogy - G1 Megatron,
And then we can have a few slots open for characters from the latest shows/movies. This list would give new readers an idea on how big the franchise truly is and how diverse the characters are. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Certainly if anyone's gonna represent CR/RiD'01, it's gonna be Sky-Byte, the breakout star of the show, and not Side Burn, the Autobot womanizer. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:26, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Funilly enough I meant to put him there lol. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 20:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Dreamwave, I'd pick War Within Grimlock. Certainly Shockwave should be part of 2005 IDW since he's responsible for the whole sha-bang.--[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] ([[User talk:MistaTee|talk]]) 18:40, 5 January 2022 (EST)

== Splitting Cloud characters ==

So now we have some sorta adequate translations, I'm being increasingly convinced that merging them just on the basis of AVP was a mistake and that the Cloud characters should be split out for simplicity and ease of explanation. Notably, the central conceit is far more similar to TransTech than G1—and more different to G1 than Cyberverse, for instance. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 02:44, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I was against it then and I'm against it now. They're nothing like the TransTech; they are practically nigh identical to the G1 guys, there's a war going on in their universe, and the "central conceit" of them being multiversal guardians is more akin to Alternity than it is to TransTech, who for the majority of their fiction were at most passive observers. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I am declining to weigh in personally until I finish first pass translations but please at least pretend to look over the translated material before repeating the same arguments. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:19, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::I have looked over it. Nothing is convincing me that it's all that separate from G1 stuff. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 12:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::"War going on" describes most of Transformer fiction. What makes Cyberverse "not G1", but Cloud G1, other than convenience for us editors? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:02, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::: As far as I can tell, there is no basic divergence, aside from Grimlock's origins, from the Cloud characters to the G1 counterparts. I could point to a fair few examples on the side of Cyberverse that rank higher than that (Grimlock's presenations, the origins of the Quintessons and Sharkticons, Skywarp, Acid Storm, etc etc.) [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:23, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::We can be here all day debating over character minutiae, but the point is that Cyberverse ultimately doesn't diverge that much from G1 in its general premise as opposed to Cloud. G1 is bloated enough as it is; it doesn't hurt to take out the one thing that doesn't really fit in and make it its own thing. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::: Well that just comes right back to my question: what actually makes Cloud World's core conceit any different from G1 beyond the fact that they have technology that allows them dimensional travel? Because if it is just that, I simply do not believe that is enough to justify a split for characters who are almost all made to look like and have the same personality as the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:51, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I agree for the sake of wiki presentation. *Cloud* is more like *TransTech* than it is like *Alternity*. *Cloud* characters got to travel to both the G1 and MD worlds as equally separate destinations. TakaraTomy used the *Generations War for Cybertron* moulds as the *United* series, which is G1 and not Aligned by our classification. *Cloud* recycling unused *Generations Fall of Cybertron* toys in a non-Aligned setting strikes me as more evidence that we can allow *Cloud* to live on its own rather than as another G1 setting. And *Cloud* was chosen by e-HOBBY over the competing proposal *Prime Shattered Glass* which would also have been on separate wiki pages despite employing purely redeco mould choiceis. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:08, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I'm not convinced by the idea that them saying "G1 World" is an indicator of separateness when there is also designations for "BW Spacetime" and "MF Spacetime." Brawn is depicted as practically identical in appearance to G1 Brawn before being upgraded. As for the Prime Shattered Glass choice, I think it's pretty obvious why that would be completely separate from this particular issue. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 16:25, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::The only reason Brawn is shown as the G1 body is if you take consideration that all Cloud members are drawn according to the latest toy or model available... he got no real toy before that, the only options were either G1 Sunbow, G1 toy or the tiny Universe 2.0 Legends. Now if you remove their appearance and focus on the story, Cloud is still more akin to Transtech than Alternity, Deadlock for example even got to visit the Legends World, a Aligned world (possibly the Adventure toyline) and the Ehobby spin-off dimension (now called Precursor World) -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 17:55, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::Yes, I am aware of how Cloud repurposings work. Nothing prevents one G1 universe from visiting another. And aside from that, Japan has had barely any non-JG1 cartoon related G1 fiction; of course Cloud World, which isn't directly JG1 related, would be indicated as different; that doesn't mean that it's not able to be categorized as G1. If it were an American storyline, where we have always had multiple G1 storylines, I feel that this would not nearly be as much of a point of contention. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I'm in favor of splitting Cloud from G1. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 19:32, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I haven't read any of the Cloud fiction myself, but I know that if our translation team collectively agrees on something based on the material available, then that's more than enough convincing for me to agree with them also. In other words, I agree with a split. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:52, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I'd vastly prefer if we could get someone like McFeely to weigh in on this. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:56, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::i'm in favour of the split. The cloud people have enough characteristics to distonguist them from theur jg1 counterpatts.--[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 20:14, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::Alright, seriously, what characteristics are there actually to distinguish them from G1? Because nobody has been able to give me a concrete example so far. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 21:17, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::::dinobot, heavy usage of aligned designs, hellwarp --[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 21:36, 28 December 2021 (EST)
Looks like Escargon is the only voice against the split thus far. Still, I suggest the discussion should remain open longer than usual, out of courtesy for people not checking the wiki as regularly given the holiday season. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 21:47, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:As the translations are still ongoing, I think the most we can suggest at this time is a note regarding its a classification as a Primax setting by AVP. As more information comes to light I'm becoming increasingly convinced that it was a decision made on shaky logic. Unlike the Alternity there doesn't seem to be any evidence of these guys being derived in-universe from G1 guys. And as fiction, it's about a bunch of super advanced parallel universe monitor guys who regularly travel to other universes. If it's literally just "the cast is mostly recolours of toys with G1 fiction" then maybe we need to start talking about listing the War for Cybertron games as G1 too. [[User:Star Spangled Sam|Star Spangled Sam]] ([[User talk:Star Spangled Sam|talk]]) 01:44, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::What exactly is super-advanced about them beyond SARA, who, as far as I can tell, is a gift from some being and not even their own creation? Because otherwise, they seem to be basic Transformers. Not a single person has been able to tell me that so far, and I'd be far more willing to listen if someone would just spell out what exactly makes them so distinct that means they can't be G1. It's not about in-universe stuff, because for all intents and purposes, the characters themselves are nigh-identical to the Generation 1 characters; you look at Cloud Megatron or Cloud Rodimus and it is obvious that, irregardless of whatever the fiction might say, they are being sold as new versions of the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 04:29, 29 December 2021 (EST)
:::By the same logic, then why not put the FOC and WFC games under the G1 banner since it heavly takes inspirations from it, same settings (war on cybertron, the resources are becoming low, escaping to another world), closest designs to G1.. hell they were more marketed towards G1 than the Movies and Prime in mind (let's face it.. that's what Hasbro always does).. but the further Hasbro tied them to Aligned and they became their own thing.. Cloud is about that, maybe marketed as G1 at first but they became their own thing at the end -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 13:20, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::::The WFC games are their own case that, despite what you say, were always clearly a part of Hasbro's ideas for the Aligned continuity, which is something that I'm not going to bother going into here. Nothing about Cloud registers to me as being somehow so separate that it requires us splitting off things into their own pages. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 13:24, 29 December 2021 (EST)
Bumping for more opinions. If there's no overall opposition to it by Friday or so, I'll start splitting. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:07, 4 January 2022 (EST)
:The Cloud fiction prominently features the Cloud characters interacting with their own G1 counterparts. If nothing else, it should be split on same basis as [[Galvatron II]]. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:50, 4 January 2022 (EST)
::We've seen that with other fiction. I'm not sure why it would justify them having their whole separate pages (Galvatron II is a unique case). If that's what it takes though to not go through some inane total split, though, then fine, whatever. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:If there is to be movement on this in the immediate future I suppose I should go ahead and weigh in. As the one doing the translation I broadly agree with Riptide. While I am unmoved by philosophical discussions on what constitutes "G1-ness" or "Transtech-ness," I believe it is important to return to our guiding principle of the end user experience. Given the already convoluted nature of the material as well as the cast's consistent interaction with both various Generation 1 continuities in general and their own incarnations in specific, I believe it will be in the best interests of intelligibility for the reader to split out Cloud from Generation 1. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:25, 5 January 2022 (EST)

We are not going to pretend that these are completely separate from the Generation 1 characters. Put up a suite or a "see [X] article for more information" because it is completely ridiculous to pretend that Cloud is it's own little continuity. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:38, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I disagree. Cloud should be split off entirely. So let's have an official vote and resolve this. I say '''Split'''. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 10:28, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::The articles have already been split. You'll forgive me if I don't show confidence in the decision from people who blew me off when I pointed out their original reason for splitting was incorrect (that supposedly the Almanac had come out before Cloud was truly explained, but in fact it had come after almost all of it had been published). [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:35, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::This discussion has been open for twelve days. An unofficial tally shows at least 7-to-1 in favor of splitting. No one else has openly agreed with your position. Given that, and that Saix announced days in advance he would start splitting if there was no further discussion, it wasn't unreasonable for him to begin. But maybe there's a different split of opinions on the Discord or wherever, so it's certainly appropriate to ask for an official vote. Beyond that...the decision is just not up to you alone. The point of democracy is for all voices to be heard, not to leave every voice feeling satisfied with the outcome. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 11:08, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::I have no idea what's going on in the Discord server; I'm barred from it. I certainly hope there's not more discussion going on over there, because I was told that there would be a push to have these sorts of big discussions to be on the wiki. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:42, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::With all due respect: You need to stop putting so much emphasis on the in-universe designation, which AVP itself pointed out was ultimately arbitrary. I understand that AVP and the Almanacs are important to you, but Jim is not infallible, and while I'm sure he had good reasons for calling it "Primax" that's ultimately just ''his opinion''. Cloud being "its own thing" isn't some essential property; it's a matter of how to organise the wiki in order to make the fiction clear. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:47, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I also vote '''Split''' if only because of how better translations now has pointed out various past errors/assumptions/presumptions that needed correcting, and thus updating is needed so as to make things easier to categorize and organize here. Any wiki really worth their salt and wanting to do proper service to their respective franchises' fandoms would do the same. --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] ([[User talk:Lonegamer78|talk]]) 14:43, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::I ''still'' haven't got an answer for what makes Cloud so different that makes it ''need'' to be split. If there were a crossover between say, Marvel and Sunbow, nobody in their right mind we should completely separate, say, Huffer from Huffer. I'm willing to admit that I might just be missing something, but nothing in the stories themselves, as far as I can see, suggests it, beyond the aforementioned Cloud World classification, which for me is not enough of a justification. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:33, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::Neither Marvel nor Sunbow consists primarily of crossovers with another G1 continuity. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:20, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::If that's the main avenue of justification then frankly I don't think I'm ever going to agree with that line of reasoning, but I can clearly see I'm outvoted on this. I wish there would have been more people asked before the split was done, though, because I can see that this could very easily end up being another whole "retitling things to FSRLF" situation. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:00, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::We functionally split out Marvel and Sunbow versions for a lot of characters anyway. We're at the point where we draw lines based on how easy/hard it is for the information to be conveyed, not whether it's G1 enough or not. We think Cloud, as its own fullblown storyline/premise, falls on the side of "it's easier to read and parse it if they get their own shebang" instead of burying them in overlong G1 articles. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 21:11, 8 January 2022 (EST)

I'm not gonna argue further on this because I recognize it's a losing battle, but I think that the line of thought of "this one bit of media shouldn't be kept in an article because it won't get out there otherwise" sets a bad precedent that could easily be misused in the future. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:39, 8 January 2022 (EST)

Should the Cloud toys also be removed from the G1 character's pages? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 09:21, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:Yeah no, It vould be too convoluted, example look at the redirections [[Transformers_Cloud#Toys|there]]... where should each toy be redirected?? + the fiction regarding said toys has their own page now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 10:58, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::...What on earth are you talking about? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:16, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::Srry I misread his question.. I thought he meant "added" not "removed" from the G1 pages...
:Not entirely certain what you're asking, but the eight toys in the Cloud toyline (plus Deadlock) have already been moved to the Cloud pages in conjunction with the fiction, as they solely represent Cloud characters. The remaining Cloud characters repurpose existing toys. The writeups for those toys remain on the original pages with duplicates on the repurpose pages, as is standard practice. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:54, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::I mean, for example, [[Blaster_(G1)/toys#Generations|G1 Blaster's toy page]] has FOC Blaster on it, due to FOC Blaster being repurposed as Cloud Blaster. Should that repurposing be removed from G1 Blaster's page, since Cloud Blaster isn't considered to be G1 Blaster anymore? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 12:34, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::I believe yeah, the splitting between G1 and Cloud was recent (done last month) so there's still leftover traces on the wiki, if you can take your time to remove them why not -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 16:44, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::::Ok, good. I just wanted to check I wasn't missing anything. [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 17:13, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::::Oh! Yes those should go, good eye! -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 10:52, 18 February 2022 (EST)

==Split Movie Character Toy lists?==
Just as what happened with [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys]] and [[Megatron (G1)/toys]], I suggest we split certain Movie toy pages such as [[Bumblebee (Movie)/toys]] and [[Optimus Prime (Movie)/toys]] as both pages have become excessively bloated. I suggest we separate them by having the original Bay film toylines (07, ROFT, DOTM, AOE, TLK, and any pre SS sub lines) have their own page and starting a new one that Contains SS, BB, and the upcoming ROTB toylines, alongside any future movie toylines until the new page itself becomes heavily bloated [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Sorry for being this late but given that ROTB toys are apparently coming this spring, I suggest you split like one part contains all 5 movies while the other starts with SS and BB until now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 15:26, 22 January 2022 (EST)

== Multi-part comic stories ==

For old Marvel UK multi-part stories like [[Target: 2006]] or [[Time Wars]], we put the whole thing under a single article, but for modern-day ones like each storyline in [[Transformers (2019 comic)]] we have a separate article for each issue. Is there a good reason for the discrepancy, or are the old ones just an artefact of a time in the wiki's history that didn't follow our current standards? --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:36, 22 January 2022 (EST)
:The thing with that is that it's a result of how the UK comic was written; there'd be about 8 or so pages per issue, meaning that we'd have a lot of little articles that are easier just grouped together. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:16, 22 January 2022 (EST)
::Makes sense, although that's essentially what we have for [[The Transformers: Autocracy]] et al., which are also 8 pages per issue. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 15:38, 23 January 2022 (EST)
:::The difference with Autocracy lies mostly in that pretty much all of those issues have a beginning and end, and also have different titles. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:47, 23 January 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I always thought our headings on the Marvel UK story pages ''were'' the issue titles. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 01:21, 24 January 2022 (EST)

== Composite characters and page transclusion ==

This is something I've had the idea about for a while, but I've finally had a look at how the markup for it works and have come up with a proposal. The pages for [[Greatshot]] and [[Sixshot (G1)]] contain an entirely duplicated section set around the ''Victory'' cartoon owing to a retcon that occurred in the much later Legends manga. This is not an ideal solution because, among other reasons, any edits to Greatshot's cartoon section necessitates making the same edit to Sixshot's section.

Over in my sandbox, I've whipped up the page [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test]], containing only the events that happened to both Greatshot and the retconned Sixshot. By inserting <nowiki>{{:User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test}}</nowiki> into the relevant parts of Greatshot and Sixshot's pages (also sandboxed [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot|here]] and [[User:TheLastGherkin/Sixshot|here]]), the same information is automatically transcluded. And clicking "Edit" on, for example, the Legends manga section on Sixshot's page automatically redirects the user to editing that portion of Greatshot-test, thus updating all three pages at once.

If we go forward with this, I can see it being used for other characters in similar situations, like BWU [[Wolfang (Maximal)#Beast Wars: Uprising|Wolfang]], or Unite Warriors [[Roller (IDW)#Unite Warriors|Roller]], or putting the lion's share (pun intended) of [[Victory Leo]]'s fictional appearances back onto Victory Leo's page. With refinements, like say a <nowiki><noinclude></nowiki> explanation for what each subpage is for the layperson ("This page covers the events of the Japanese Generation 1 continuity, where Greatshot and Sixshot are the same individual...") and maybe a [[:Category:Transcluded pages]], I could see this really working, and it could probably be bent into shape for repurposed toys as well. [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 12:48, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:If we cannot avoid this sort of duplicated information entirely, this does seem like a pretty ideal solve to mitigate the constant peril of copy editing flubs maintaining multiple copies of one write-up entails. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:56, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Is there any way to get rid of the "This section is transcluded from another page. To edit it, please edit the transcluded page." notice? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:06, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:::There is! I just put that there manually while experimenting and also to make clear where the transcluded section is. In practice, since clicking "Edit" on a transcluded section takes you to the source page, a notice like that can be relegated to a commented-out note for editors who click to Edit the entire page (or a larger section). [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 16:16, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I thought it was automatic software stuff. Whoops, never mind. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:22, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Also, this works for fiction, but I see it running into issues when it comes to toys. (Thinking of Sixshot/Greatshot, Sixshot always gets toys first with Greatshot as the retool later in the same line.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:14, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:I've made some tweaks to my sandboxes, including standardising the transcluded page. Are there any objections before I start implementing this (in fiction sections)? [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 07:10, 12 February 2022 (EST)
::I sense that there could be an issue in the future where, for whatever reason, these sorts of characters diverge back into separate ones, whether it be through alternate continuities or whatever. Also, in the case of Greatshot, I feel like at the very beginning of his entry, there has to be something different to set up the Sixshot retcon, and just having the same opening text doesn't do that. 08:57, 12 February 2022 (EST)
:::His toy bio that mentions Sixshot as a separate person could go there. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 00:21, 16 February 2022 (EST)
:This could also be applied to Primus and Vector Sigma for their 3H comics sections since they are one and the same in that continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 19:26, 26 February 2022 (EST)

== What makes a franchise? Or, does "Precursor World" exist? ==

So, browsing around the wiki, as one does, and came across this: [[Precursor World (franchise)]]

Now, I'm not as well-versed in the Legends + Selects comics, so maybe this is incorrect, but to the best of my understanding, the branding "Precursor World" doesn't exist — this story was told across Generations Selects and Legends, and no toy or story was ever released branded as "Precursor World". It doesn't seem like the name even existed until pretty recently.

This...isn't a franchise, right? It's a long-running story told across various medium, but it's not a franchise, and calling it such implies something that isn't true.

Particularly, the idea that there is a "toyline" seems a bit of a stretch. There are only three listed "official" toys, but none of them were released under the "Precursor World" branding (which near as I can tell does not exist) and the list of "repurposings" seems almost entirely just "this toy/characters showed up in this story" which doesn't seem like anything's been repurposed to me. The IDW comics used a bunch of existing/prior toys, but that doesn't create a toyline of that comic series.

Am I off base here? --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:16, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:Okay there's a lot to unpack here but to begin with every single one of those toys is being repurposed as a separate object/character in a separate setting a la, for example, [[Green Tender Convoy]] and the [[Matrix Buster|Red Matrix]]. Most of the unnamed crowdfillers are minimized to footnotes on existing articles to avoid generating a bazillion stubs. The closest analogue I can give you is the [[Transformers: Shattered Glass (toyline)|toyline]] for the original ''Timelines'' iteration of Shattered Glass. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:35, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I'll grant that those indeed seem to be repurposings, but the vast majority of toys on this list merely link to the toy entry for the toy on the regular character's page. I don't think having a list of members of these groups is bad (it's good!) but I don't think this is a toyline. Again, crucially, Shattered Glass has a brand, with the official toys released under that brand, whereas precursor world does not. IDW repurposed WfC/FoC/aligned toys as G1 characters, but this didn't create a virtual toyline associated with that comic. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:46, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:::Arguably Shattered Glass toys weren't really released under their own brand either until the recent Hasbro Pulse stuff, until then the figures were all just released under the ''Timelines'' banner or whatever else Fun Pub used at the time - the idea of a singular "Shattered Glass toyline" was just as much of a constructed idea until like a year ago. I can't say "franchise" and "toyline" ''aren't'' slightly more non-literal labels than usual in this context, but I do think there's value in having the info collated like this, and I can't think of ''better'' labels that aren't something stupid like "(meta franchise)". [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 12:57, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::::To be honest, I'm inclined to agree re: Shattered Glass, and would not be opposed to restructuring the toyline page to delineate between the "Shatted Glass Collection" and "Shattered Glass toys released via Timelines" or something. Shattered Glass does, however, have a leg up on Precursor World given that every official SG toy was branded as "Shattered Glass" in some way, though perhaps not as a "franchise". The box set is called Shattered Glass, and every official toy was called "Shattered Glass". There's some nuance there, of course, as arguably those are part of the character's names ala "Prime Universe Bulkhead" is still a Legacy toy, not a Prime toy, but I'd be happy to have a debate around the best way to frame Shattered Glass stuff given those discrepancies. Allll that said, Shattered Glass is today a franchise, but there have been zero anythings released with Precursor World branding or labeling. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 13:06, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I don't think the page should be removed or even severely modified, but I do think the terminology is flawed. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 16:02, 3 March 2022 (EST)
Precursor World is definitely not a "franchise" and should not have that label. The model to look at here is the [[Beast Wars: Uprising]] article, which gives an overview of the thing, lists it's stories and toys, but does not use the "franchise" label, and doesn't ''need'' to use it. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] ([[User talk:KilMichaelMcC|talk]]) 15:07, 3 March 2022 (EST)

Yeah, no, this is not a "franchise", and the page should not be labeled as such. It is a ''setting''. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:I like the solution that AzimuthAcolyte gave on Discord: move "Precursor World (franchise)" to "Precursor World continuity" (with all uses of the word "franchise" changed to "continuity") and "Precursor World (toyline)" to "List of Precursor World toys". Simple and elegant. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:55, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Seconded.[[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:::That seems reasonable to me. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::::I'm for that. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::That's fair. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 23:59, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Works for me, somewhat obviously! If there are no major objections over the next day or two I'll get those moved over. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:48, 4 March 2022 (EST)
::Ohhh, That works -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 18:19, 4 March 2022 (EST)
Alrighty as it's been a day or so with no objections I am proceeding with the moves away from (franchise) and (toyline). --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 18:06, 5 March 2022 (EST)

== Episode Order ==
It's come to my attention that all cartoons have been listed in production order '''except''' Beast Wars, RID01, RB, and RBA. While I understand production order is not available for the latter two I suggest we change the first two for consistency's sake - Unless I'm wrong and they are ''not'' all in production order. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:48, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:We're not touching Beast Wars. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
::Beast Wars and RiD'01 not being in production order are accepted exceptions to the norm. We leave them as they are for reasons specific to each. But as for RB and RBA, we do have an idea of the production orders for each, but we instead use a weird mixture of production order and airing order that is consistent with no other series we cover. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 13:53, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:OK quick correction to myself, turns out that it's all supposed to be chronological order; That just happens to be production order for everything but those four. Sorry! [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 14:09, 16 March 2022 (EDT)

==Help with statues / figurines==
I wrote up many of the [[Transformers ULTIMATES!|ULTIMATES!]] entries, simply because no one else had. I don't actually care about that sort of merch and it ended up being me paraphrasing from press releases and copying their pics. Just today I learned there are 3 waves of TF [[Minimates]] that have no coverage here at all. It definitely seems like a lot of high-end statues are falling through the cracks as well. Is there someone who is willing to make that stuff more of a project? If not, could we perhaps put out a call for submissions on our Twitter feed? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:47, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I fear this is just... going to continue to be an Issue. The wiki is a labor of love, and the brand is at a point where there's a lot of stuff out there... well, that a lot of people probably aren't gonna love. Hasbro's moichandized the everloving HELL out of TF over the years, with more and more niche "G1" stuff that seemingly would never appeal to people for whom G1 is the big center of their fandom. I mean I just found some Micro Figures merch at a Big Lots, I've never seen these before, and I don't know offhand if they're on the wiki. They're kind of a nothing. It's hard to keep up. Same for stuff like phone games. 
:I don't know if there's an actual solution. ''Someone'' certainly needs to step up, but I kinda got my plate overflowing with my own pet (ha ha) niche chunk of TF history to exhaustively document, never mind dealing with stuff I am almost aggressively disinterested in. (Seriously what little Minimates experience I have left me with a worse impression of them than I already had from their hideous aesthetic alone.) Asking Twitter for people more well-versed in this stuff might could help for phone games, but... IS there anyone into Minimates as a whole Brand and not just in a "I get the licenses I like" sense to fill in gaps? --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 21:20, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::Once I had composed the thought "Hey, it's bad that there are a lot of Minimates out with us not covering them at all," it was too late, and I just had to burn 40 minutes on some cut-and-paste writups for the entire series. That's one "solution," I guess, but even ''my'' obsessive-compulsiveness can only go so far. Editing this site really should not feel like a job... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:18, 22 March 2022 (EDT)

==Implementing galleries==
I propose making galleries on character pages a wiki standard. The current mainpic + show screenshots format doesn't cover images like character models (Unless used as a mainpic), concept art, appearances in posters or toy murals, comic book covers, etc.
Other wikis have successfully implemented galleries, I think the Hololive Wiki galleries in particular work well as an example https://hololive.wiki/wiki/Tokino_Sora#Media.
This gallery header covers character models and has suites for concept art and even character uses in collaborative merch.[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:27, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Seconded. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:30, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I would say some version of this concept for a section has merit, if nothing else as a solve for major characters with several prominent character models, perhaps as a fairly unobtrusive method of documenting alt modes, etc etc. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:38, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::I'm for this. As a good example, the BotBots characters all look to have been radically redesigned for the show. By default the current standard is to keep the original stock art look will appear as the mainpic each page. Having a gallery option would be a good way to show both versions. [[User:ParadoxFactor|ParadoxFactor]] ([[User talk:ParadoxFactor|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Oppose. There is no reason for these to take up space on the character pages. Would not oppose separate "gallery" pages. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:57, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::If we are open to workshopping implementation I do agree a separate "gallery page" in the style we already use for more conceptual articles here and there would probably be cleaner. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 14:06, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I love the gallery idea. There's a question of how much to include, and the exact implementation details of how to portion out overflow if there's too many images. It's a shame there isn't some way to generate them automatically just by tagging images with the characters they depict. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::A separate page seems like it would be overkill for someone like [[Flamewar (G1)|Flamewar]], who would only take a few images to cover appearances not already covered by fiction section images. I assume if a small gallery was to be used on a character's page, it would be near the bottom at any rate? --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 15:22, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Yes, at the bottom would be ideal, no different from any of the galleries on our artist pages. IMO, separate gallery pages should only be used in instances where the number of images can't be comfortably fit onto one or two lines. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:33, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::I agree with Cyberlink. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 16:29, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Fair; Using gallery sections for those with few images and gallery pages for those with many images might make sense. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 15:46, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::See [[Megatron (G1)/gallery|G1 Megatron]] and [[Megatron (BW)/gallery|BW Megatron]] for examples of characters with enough images to justify separate gallery pages. [[Rhinox (BW)/gallery|BW Rhinox]], as it is now, is probably right on the line between "split it off" and "stick it at the bottom of the page". -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:58, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
I think choosing between a header at the bottom or a suite depending on image amount is a good solution instead of sticking to just one method.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 11:29, 22 March 2022 (EDT)
:Yeah, I think that would be good, as has been pointed out earlier. I do have to ask - because sometimes the artistic difference between characters in comics is slight with details only a little different in shape or kibble - would those fall under gallery stuff? Because they're effectively different per artist interpretation. I would be inclined to say yes, because effectively a different artist's rendition is shown usually of the same character without having reformatted or taken up armor or so forth. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 10:56AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I am very much on board with this idea. Having a gallery section or page depending on the character would be great, especially for characters like Flamewar who have a extremely prominent new design that we can't use as a main pic and for characters who have tons of designs, especially in the case of IDW where some characters change bodies every Tuesday. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:35 AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I think artistic liberty vs. new design would have to be on a case by case basis. Burcham's art of the BW cast wouldn't count for gallery purposes, in my opinion. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:08, 27 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I think it would be cool to have art of the same designs in different artstyles, but I agree it should probably be on case by case basis. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 6:17 PM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I currently have a sandbox to test galleries using Tigatron https://tfwiki.net/wiki/User:MrRald/sandbox/Tigatron#Gallery. I'd appreciate any feedback on things to add or change! [[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 23:44, 1 April 2022 (EDT)
::: I like what you have so far, I think we should maybe add a few more versions of Tigatron, like his different comic appearances and such. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]])

: Now that we're actually going ahead with this... I have to ask, what are the galleries actually ''for''? When we were discussing this I was under the impression that they were going to be for "behind-the-scenes" images that wouldn't otherwise have a place on the wiki, like out-of-universe character models, character concept art, or full-body renders from stuff like guidebooks. Right now, a lot of the galleries just feel redundant, given that they're just a bunch of cartoon and comic screengrabs taken from the relevant section and removed of all context... and a lot of them, like [[Blaster (G1)/gallery]] are just completely empty. The fact that every character ''can'' have a gallery does not mean that all of them ''should'', especially if most of them are just going to be redundant or mostly empty. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 18:57, 4 August 2022 (EDT)
::Agreed, I feel like this is bloating the wiki and toeing over the line of our vague remit. Despite having a LOT of images, we're not an image repository. Also, a lot of these could probably be done as a single subsection of the characters' mainpage under below "Notes" of whatever rather than as separate mostly-blank-space sub-pages full of sub-headers with like two images total in them. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 06:11, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, I didn't think they'd be separate pages. What I was expecting was whichever of the cartoon character model, Dreamwave profile art or package art weren't being used for the mainpic, plus behind-the-scenes stuff, plus maybe extra bits from artbooks, covers, or sources like that. Stuff that can't just be slotted into a fiction writeup—and I don't mean "comic crops we don't have room for because equivalent/better panels are already in the fiction section". —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:35, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
My intentions for the gallery pages were for users to actually do the work in uploading character models, renders, et al., not dumping whatever cartoon screencaps we already have in fiction sections. And separate pages would be on a case by case basis. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:46, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
I don't see the point, honestly. It seems like pretty much any significant body a significant enough character has will appear on the wiki at some point in a comic panel or a toy info image or a screenshot or something, somewhere. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs solving. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] ([[User talk:Hooper X|talk]]) 20:36, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

===G1 model images===
To branch off of this topic, how would we feel about using [https://www.allspark.com/forums/threads/the-most-accurately-coloured-g1-animation-models-online.301/ DM's coloured models] for the G1 cartoon model galleries? The last time I brought this topic up (on Discord), some people were against the idea, due to them being fan-colour works and not official, but a few newer developments have been made since I last brought it up.

To clarify, for those unaware of DM's works:

* All of the line art is original and unedited (unlike several of the models in ''The Ark'' books, which had been tweaked, altered and traced by Bill Forster to make them presentable for publishing).
* The models are the final ones used throughout the majority of the cartoon (in Toei-animated episodes at least). Note: several of the models in ''The Ark'' books we have also come to discover were unfinalized ones, due to the internet and more stuff being made public since what was originally found around 2007—not to discredit Jim and Bill's hard work in putting those books together, it's just some of what we knew then isn't entirely correct now.
* And finally, the colours (which was the big thing some people were against). Unlike the handful of fan-coloured models that were originally uploaded to the wiki in the past, which eye dropped colors straight from poor quality episode masters, DM's colours are based directly on Toei and Marvel Productions' model colour guides, colour codes, charts, colour chips found by a member of the ''Dragon Ball'' fandom (who has scanned and digitized said colour chips) and other original production materials, meaning that the colours DM has used are all coming from the ''original'' original source.

An alternative Mr. Rald had brought up on Discord is that we could possibly look at using the uncoloured model line art instead, if people feel strongly against using fan-coloured works, but I think in order to present the G1 character models fully as references, you kinda need the colours included, especially given how poor the cartoon production was, what with all the animation errors (even in Toei episodes) etc, making it hard to gather decent references for the characters, which is mostly what these galleries are for.

Also, for the record, DM has given us permission to use his colourings on the wiki.

Let me know you thoughts. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 01:39, 6 April 2022 (EDT)

: I personally think that we should use DM's coloured models, they are as official as coloured models are going to get, and it's not like DM just randomly picked and chose want colours to use as FOCS said. We could just have the model and the colour guide, but at that point, just have the model sheet coloured. I would however be in favour of the uncoloured models with colour guides and the sheets with the fully coloured models to cover all our bases. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:16 AM, 6 April 2022 (PDT)

== Making a page for the Unreal Engine? ==

War for Cybertron, Dark of the Moon (PS3/X360), Fall of Cybertron, and Rise of the Dark Spark all run on Unreal Engine, specifically Unreal Engine 3. Why isn't there a page for it. It could have good info on those wanting to mod those games.

Unrelated, but there's a server revival project being worked on for those games. Right now it's only on PC, and progress is slow, but should we include info for it in the pages for those games? It's not official btw, there's a Discord server for it and a few YouTube vids about it.[[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]]) 17:29, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not sure what information we could put on an Unreal Engine page that would be useful to modders. An Unreal Engine page would be general info on the engine and a list of games which use it. Diving into technical details isn't really something we do. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 17:52, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I think linking to {{W|Unreal Engine|Wikipedia}} should be sufficient. That's what I did when I ''unfortunately'' had to document the Funko NFTs. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:11, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I don't see what value there would be to this. Unreal warrants, at ''most'', a mention on the relevant game pages. We don't have pages for every program used to make every piece of TF media/product. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:33, 24 March 2022 (EDT)

== Category for characters with no established gender ==

So I just had this idea and decided to share it here because why not? We have categories for female characters and variable gender characters but not for characters with undetermined genders. Many BotBots for example don't have genders and I think this category could be a useful way of grouping them together. And who knows, maybe someday it could even help official creators specifically looking for genderless characters to establish a gender to them. Does anyone agree to implement this category? -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:06, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:This concept has been discussed before in the past, and generally the feeling has been that this would be a bit too much like the wiki actively trying to shape canon. Don't get me wrong, creators taking advantage of characters with no official pronouns is neat and I'm all for it, but IMO the wiki shouldn't directly serve up them. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 19:26, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
::Interestingly, I can't seem to find a prior community portal discussion about this matter, though I know it has come up on the Discord server more than once, to the conclusion Jalaguy mentioned. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 19:35, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:::Just to clarify, I thought of "official creators using it" as a quick example in favor of the category, but now I can totally see how it sounded like trying to influence canon too much. Regardless, I'd still be down for having the category if we agreed on it being useful for any other reason. -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:51, 3 April 2022 (EDT)

== Category for trans characters ==

We had a productive conversation about the no established gender thing on the wiki discord and it made me realize that there should be a transgender category for the five established trans characters that there are so far, Arcee (who has established trans characterization on two different pages), Howlback, Arcadis, Anode, and Lug. Jalaguy mentioned that this has been discussed and people thought it was a good idea but it hasn't happened, so I just thought I'd ask for go-ahead on this. I figured that transgender rather than just trans could be a good word to use for this, due to them all being people who have gender. The term trans is merely more broad and could cover different kinds of transness than that or aesthetic stuff that is similar to gender, but we have no confirmation of being there yet in canon. Thus I think transgender would be the most accurate and desirable term here, and the umbrella trans can always be tacked on later if we need to. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 5:40PM 3 April 2022 (PDT) (edited 5:48PM PDT for clarity)
:Seconded. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 5:53 PM, 3 April 2022 (PDT)
::Since there are no objections, I'll go ahead. :3 -- [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 4:19AM, 11 April 2022 (PDT)

==Streamlining disambig headers (revist)==
So I remember this conversation from last year about streamlining the disambiguation headers. I checked back on the talk page discussion (link to said discussion archive here https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal/Archive69#Streamlining_disambig_headers) to see what happened and even though there was a lot of people who liked the idea with some who did not, it did not seem like it went anywhere. I thought I'd see if anyone else would like to revisit this idea as I feel like this would streamline things more, especially for Movie and Aligned and maybe a bit of UT especially for the guys who show up in all 3 shows or those don't have other bots who are completely different sharing the same name within the trilogy. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 9:01 PM, 12 April 2022 (PDT)

== Disambig tags and suites for Masterforce paired pages ==

We need to balance out our page titles for ''Masterforce'' human + transtector character pairs. Right now we have among extant pages and tentative redlinks:

Bullhorn (G1), Cab (human), Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (human), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (robot), [something], Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (robot)

I propose either we do human gets no species tag with the robot getting a species tag as the splinter page:

Bullhorn (G1) | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

or the human does get a species tag to equally balance with the robot:

Bullhorn (G1)/human | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

This would eliminate the need to have any longer-within-parentheses tag like "Minerva (G1 robot)" which would be affected by future continuities which may not yet have happened. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:55, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
:I would prefer either the human gets the "default" continuity tag with no further disambiguation or (human)/(robot) (with needed variations for disambiguation). The slash system is ugly to me. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:59, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::I'm of the opinion that the slash option for both feels the most fair. While the human versions were the first and thus feel the most deserving of the "default" tag, the robot versions are likely to become more commonplace and relevant as newer fiction dips its toes into using more Japanese characters. On a similar note, it was decided not to give the "BW" tag to either BW Silverbolt out of fairness, so while a similar "human/robot" concept could be implemented, there is the problem with Minerva having an Animated counterpart who is also a robot, Cancer having an Animated counterpart who is also a human, there being a Kre-O Bullhorn who is also a robot, a G.I. Joe Lightfoot who is also a human, and an IDW Wilder who is also a human. "Minerva (Headmaster)" also doesn't work for the G1 robot since the human was a Headmaster too. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 16:29, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::The slash system may not be entirely visually pleasant, but I consider having "Minerva (G1 robot)" in parentheses worse. In my proposal, all transtector characters would be unified symmetrically as "(robot)". [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 17:47, 24 April 2022 (EDT)

Here are three proposals to unify the namespaces:

Possibility 1: humans get nothing and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1), Cab, Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai, Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (G1), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 2: both humans and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1)/human, Cab/human, Cancer (G1)/human, Clouder/human, Ginrai/human, Shūta Gō/human, Lightfoot (G1)/human, Minerva (G1)/human, Ranger/human, Road King/human, Wilder (G1)/human

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 3: both humans and robots get parentheses

Bullhorn (G1 human), Cab (human), Cancer (G1 human), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1 human), Minerva (G1 human), Ranger (human), Road King (human), Wilder (G1 human)

Bullhorn (G1 robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (G1 robot), Doubleclouder, Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1 robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (G1 robot)

Thoughts? [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 01:12, 12 June 2022 (EDT)
:Isn't Option 1 one basically just a slightly different version of what we're already using and what you're proposing to change in the first place? Anyway, like I said above, Option 2 is the most fair between the human and robot depictions (as Option 1 feels like we're saying "The human versions are the more important versions" when it's the robot versions that are more likely to get any representation in future comic appearances), and it reduces the amount of multiple-word parentheses tags that we usually dislike using and try to avoid as best we can (which is the exact opposite of what Option 3 is proposing). Though, drop the "/human" from Clouder and Shūta Gō since their names already differ from "Doubleclouder" and "Goshooter". No need to complicate those two. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 08:45, 12 June 2022 (EDT)

==Transformers: Armada (Trading Card Collection)==
I recently discovered that Fleer published a Trading Card collection in 2003 for Transformers Armada.
I've documented everything I could find about it - including an Energon (preview) Scorponok card I got from a local retro game store.
[[Iacon0/Sandbox]]
Is it alright if I roll this out? [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 12:52, 1 May 2022 (EDT)

== WFC/FOC Reenergized Server Project info? ==

Info: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLO5yzrWE9yVT56Rgxl9oqntVysxWr2k7e

Basically, it brings back the multiplayer servers for the Cybertron games, PC and PS3. Should this be talked about in the pages for those games? (ROTDS and ROTF aren't online at the moment, and 360 versions won't have support) [[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]])}
:It's not official, so no, it shouldn't. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:54, 27 June 2022 (EDT)

== Handling of "former GoBots" and "former Diaclone" characters on the wiki ==

So recently we've been seeing multiple characters that had previously been portrayed as dimension-hoppers from non-Transformers realities, but using Transformers designs — [[Bug Bite (GoBots)]], [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]] and [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]] — appearing as "normal" Transformers ([[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]], [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]]). There's some heavy dispute over whether we should put them on the same page or split them out (e.g. "since the GoBots Bug Bite isn't ''originally'' from a G1 universe, he shouldn't go on the G1 Bug Bite page), so I thought we should probably have a centralised place to put together a comprehensive set of standards.

My take, personally, is that GoBots and Diaclone are *not* continuity families, they're their own properties that happen to cross over with Transformers, and so shouldn't be split on that basis. I feel that Burn Out and Lift-Ticket, regardless of them being portrayed as Diaclone mecha in their initial appearance, are the same basic concept as the likes of Road Rage and Tigertrack — "Transformers versions" of existing Diaclone toys and decoes. It helps that [[Spin-Out (G1)]] inherently blurs the lines, having first appeared as a "normal" Transformer ''before'' he was portrayed as a former Diaclone mech.

For the GoBots characters, I'd frankly be tempted to go even more radical and just merge ''all'' of them — put all the [[Cy-Kill (disambiguation)|Cy-Kill]] cameos on one page, like we do for other external property characters. Even in the edge cases like [[Fracture (Movie)|Fracture]], there's the precedent of her actually being intended as just ''being'' the GoBot. It feels a lot simpler to me than the headache of having Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, and Bug Bite, the ''other'' white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, having separate pages on a technicality. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:57, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Hard disagree on GoBots. By virtue of covering the Scioli comic in full, we have a GoBots continuity family to put them in. I say keep the ones who are explicitly GoBots at (GoBots), and put the ones who are Transformers (or ambiguous) at their respective continuity families. Basically, what we're doing for Bug Bite, do for all of them. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:23, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:I don't agree on movie-Fracture in specific and the mass-merge of ''all'' GoBots-based characters in general. Fracture's a movie-universe character who premiered in a movie-based toyline and appeared in movie-timeline fiction. "The toy was originally conceived as" holds very little water there in light of all the rest of that. I'm not wild about merging characters from different continuity families (aka "major franchise umbrellas", the point of that divide was always less "fiction-detail based" and more "real-world Hasbro/Takara starting over based" as an organizational tool), as that leans heavily towards the Wikipedia style "just lump 'em all together" manner that... doesn't really work for our scope. There's SG Bug Bite and Crasher too, I don't think they should go under a giant singular page for the character concept.
: But ''in general'' I agree with keeping stuff like Lift-Ticket and Burn Out together because the distinction is really too nitpicky to be useful. If we get an EarthSpark Lift-Ticket who is a red Hoist-like bot, then they can go on a separate page because "new major franchise umbrella" gives a decent degree of separation. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:25, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: Oh, well, the SG GoBots are an obvious exception. If it's a "mirror universe" I feel like it should never share a page because the point is that it's the opposite.
:: That said, there are other nuances I admit I skimmed over — stuff like Wings Universe Cop-Tur, who's based on the original but is a secret genius and a good guy, I'm not sure he should be merged in. At the same time, though, splitting the Bug Bites feels disingenuous, and I'm not sure whether there's a good middle ground between "split 'em all" and "merge 'em all". --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:44, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I also agree there isn't really a good middle ground. But here's the thing: If GoBots wasn't a factor and it was just G1 and Cyberverse, we wouldn't be having this conversation. At the end of the day, they're from another IP, but they're also genuine Transformers characters, and thus they should remain split like other Transformers characters. And that includes treating the genuine GoBot incarnations as separate entities. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:51, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I am, honestly, not sold either way on splitting/merging re: the "very distinctly the Tonka GoBots who originated from the Tonka GoBots franchise". I feel that there are '''''definitely''''' some bots that should not be merged with the Tonkas, by virtue of being from different continuity-families/hub-franchises (bots from the live action movies and Cyberverse, for example, should really stay separate). I'm less concerned about "in-fiction origin" because that's a clusterfuck all its own since 1984 best just left alone and we already disregard that for like Nebulans and stuff anyway, though I'd also argue that like, it should be taken into consideration the diff between an homage and an iteration (I'd argue ''Timelines'' Cop-Tur is the former and probably shouldn't be merged). But even just looking at them from the real-world staggered integration of the franchises, GoBots ARE a weird edge case (whaaat, something Scioli was involved in got weird? ''nnnoooOOOOOooooo'') and it kinda feels off to not treat them as a separate thing given their ultimate origins. But like, they are, functionally, "G1" characters as far as "how they were brought to TF" goes in the real world, and I'm not convinced that splitting out WFC Bug Bite is really a good idea or terribly helpful. So like, I dunno. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 02:06, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::::And then there's the ''very'' unique case of GoBots Stretch having been given a retroactive backstory of being born in the world of Transformers Animated before he crossed dimensions and became a GoBot. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 02:23, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::::If anything, Stretch is a Transformer pretending to be a GoBot.
:::::The criteria that keep this wiki running and readable have always had some smudgy bits, and if you stare too long at any of them pretty soon all one sees is the smudge, not the dividing line or even the story itself. Cyberverse and Prime are each ''basically'' a retelling of G1, and if they didn't have a few features we've accepted as clear dividers from "real" G1, they could have gone within G1 just as much as the IDW comics have. The divisions are necessary to keep information from being a useless, unstructured, unnavigable mess; hopefully we can draw the lines in a way that comes to require the fewest exceptions later. '''My thoughts''': when there's a Bug Bite whose origin is explicitly "I'm not a Transformer, I'm hiding among them, creatures like myself find Transformers to be nauseating uncanny valley aliens," then that's a pretty extreme division, more extreme than many others we've been holding up for years without controversy, and should stay very much separate from any other Bug Bites who are just plain ol' white car Transformers. The various Cy-Kill cameos in G1 and Armada should stay separate, just because that's how we handle other hi-and-die cameos across firm storyline borders (Animated Overlord, SG Krok). I agreed at first with splitting the Burnouts/Lift-Tickets, but if it is really causing a huge dilemma I do not object to re-merging them. Each pair exists within the G1 storytelling universe. It is not essential that we build 2 different pages for G1 universe Lift-Tickets where one of them is a Diaclone mech and the other looks just like it and comes from someplace called Diaclone. We could paper that over with a "Note" explanation. The really important part is that both the Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket cases must get the same resolution. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 05:10, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:I vote for split. I regret ever pushing for merging similar concepts around the time of ''Ask Vector Prime'' because a decade ago this wouldn't have been a question, it would have been settled with "obvious they're different characters." [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:38, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Strongly in favor of putting the Diaclones back together so long as they remain essentially G1 guys. Especially since we now have ''two nigh-identical Burn-Out pages that differ only by which sliver of fiction section they possess''. Moderately in favor of putting all the dumb Cy-Kill cameos together because, like, it's only moderately funny to split out Cy-Kill (Armada) on a technicality. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 20:47, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: I'm going to stay out of the Bugbite / Fracture question. I'm too involved on the creative side. I think Walky nails it about Burn-Out & Lift-Ticket. And probably the Cy-Kill cameos too. --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 21:11, 29 July 2022 (EDT)

:I have to ask: if this is a concern, why did we split out the Cloud articles a month ago. Because they also are clearly designed to look like G1 characters, and aside from some minor changes in personality and dimension hopping stuff (which also applies to these three examples here), are near-identical in fiction to their Generation 1 counterparts. What makes them different from Bug Bite, Burn Out, and Lift-Ticket? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:29, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Lead Cloud translator here. As we discussed in-depth at the time, the Cloud characters do nothing *but* dimension hop and frequently cross over with the Japanese Generation 1 cartoon continuity and their own G1 incarnations, rendering them nigh unintelligible when buried in A-list G1 articles. The Cloud issue was one of logistics and readability, not one on the philosophy of intrinsic "G1-ness," as I believe was said at the time. I would also argue something on the scale of Cloud is a different discussion entirely from the current topic of merging two one-paragraph articles.

::On a most practical level re-merging a thoroughly deliberated and reasonably large scale split from a couple months ago just strikes me as kind of a waste of community resources.

::For those that missed it the impetus was translating the other 80-90% of the prose and the discussion can be found [[Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal#Splitting_Cloud_characters|here]]. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

Had a brainwave about a potential way to handle the GoBots characters—as a compromise between "treating them like full Transformers characters" and "treating them like external properties", use the GoBots page as a "hub" for the others. I've mocked up a couple of sandboxes for [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Cy-Kill|Cy-Kill]] and [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Bug Bite|Bug Bite]]. Any thoughts? --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:16, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:If we absolutely have to (which I still really don't agree with) I'd prefer this over full fledged merging. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:02, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:I think this is a good compromise. The important thing is that there's a clear delineation between the dimension-hopping GoBots and native Cybertronians, and I think this fits the bill. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:03, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
::I still don't like the idea of rolling in the ''Cyberverse'' Bug Bite or any other not-G1-franchise iterations on the GB character concepts (like movieverse Fracture), even in the proposed super-abridged-and-linked-to-main-article format. For the appearances within the franchise of TF-origin, sure, I think this works. Cy-Kill's multiverse of murder... ehn. I'm not really feeling strongly either way but like we got hi-then-die charcater micropages aplenty, I don't think Cy is something terribly unique to not get them. Like... we got a page for "the many deaths of Optimus Prime", I feel like "the many deaths of Cy-Kill" could probably stand to be its own thing if we REALLY wanted to hammer the point of how stupid and hack it is home. Which, come to think about it, I kinda DO. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:42, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Ah, see, Fracture was something I was specifically thinking of here — I thought it would work to accomodate both the original intent and how she's been tied back to Crasher in <s>Jim's nonsense</s> fan-targeted media while still respecting the practical reality of Fracture as her own, movieverse character. That said, I do understand your reluctance, so if the majority is against this I'm not too fussed. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:22, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, it feels like "Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee" is its own Transformers thing at this point. He may have originated as a GoBots transplant (both in real life and in fiction), but that doesn't automatically make every iteration of Bug Bite a GoBot, any more than every subsequent iteration of Lockdown or Lugnut is considered an Animated character. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 04:34, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::::I appreciate the work Riptide put into this and like the writing / presentation style employed... and I just still don't think it's necessary. Between disambigs and "You Look Familiar...", we already have ways to cope with characters who look alike across different continuities but who aren't the same character. Most of these transplanted GoBots are absolutely not the same characters as each other - most of the Cy-Kill cameos, Cyberverse Bug Bite. There is no need for us to build a new way to unite those cross-continuity characters when nothing unites them more than the "basic concepts" that we've kept separate on hundreds of other name / appearance reuses. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 08:43, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::I adore this brain blast, over and above what I proposed below (as it actually accommodates, in Cy-Kill's case, say, the ''Armada/TransTech/Animated'' cameos), and think the fact that people on both sides of this polarising issue aren't immediately opposed to it makes it strike me as a really good compromise. I still would prefer the ''Diaclone'' pages to be merged with their G1 counterparts, but whether or not it's a full merge or just the "main article" structure here, the intro phrasing proposed with Cy-Kill and Bug-Bite is perfect in my opinion. The key thing for me is that, when people look up info on Cy-Kill or Burn Out, they still find a pointer to the relevant information at the exact point they'd expect it to be, and not only that, but they can chart the entire conceptual history of the character on one page (I know the disambigs theoretically do the same, but in practise Jo's approach is much more effective). Assuming the same policy isn't applied to ''Uprising'' appearances, I still think something should be done about those—but otherwise I'd be very happy with this. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:16, 1 August 2022 (EDT)

So as I understand it, the consensus is that Diaclone characters should share a page with their G1 counterparts, and that — at least for the moment — GoBot characters should be left as-is, with White Bumblebee's G1 adventures split between the GoBot and G1 pages? Would appreciate some more input before we begin implementing this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:09, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:I still don't like the Diaclone thing but clearly I'm outvoted. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:48, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:More or less. I'm fine with rolling G1 WFC Bug Bite in with the explicitly-GoBots one in the manner test-bedded above on the same grounds as the whole "Nebulan/Cybertronian" deal with Targetmaster gun-bots we've done forever; I think the proposed format both works with the way we've handled disparate depictions between different fictions within the same franchise chunk for a very long time now while noting the important real-world issues with these transplanted characters. And it's not like the combo page would be anywhere near big enough to make a split-out necessary. But I'm willing to table that for the moment while moving ahead with rolling the Diaclones back in. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:15, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
::I agree with this completely. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:11, 3 August 2022 (EDT)
:Diaclone characters should share pages with G1 counterparts who are also canonically said to be Diaclone-y. If we ever get a "Gobots Universe Bug Bite" that would be merged too - but just "white car Bug Bite" should not. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:21, 3 August 2022 (EDT)

==Proposal re: G1 pages==
I'm not expecting anything other than a hard "no" on this from the vast majority of editors, but a few people impelled me to post it, so here goes. In particular, I think this perspective is one held by many casual readers of the wiki. As I said over on [[Talk:Burn Out (Diaclone)|Burn Out's talk page]], I think both camps feel a sense of "''obviously'' these are (not) the same character", depending on whether they're coming from a strictly in-universe perspective or not. I want to put that whole discussion into an even broader perspective. Plus, I think the list of characters below is an interesting resource in its own right.

For ages, the wiki's had it so G1 appearances of characters originating in ''Robots in Disguise''—such as [[Sky-Byte (RID)]]—just get put on those pages. My understanding is that RID was considered something of a special case, because of how it was originally conceived as an in-continuity G1 thing, and remained such in Japanese continuity. For a less-prominent example, see also ''[[Power Core Combiners]]'', which similarly lists the IDW G1 appearances of [[Smolder (PCC)]] and [[Steamhammer (PCC)]] just on those pages. Again, this was a special case, because PCC was never concretely established as being a live-action movieverse thing or a G1 thing (which makes sense, because in Hasbro's eyes at the time, that wasn't a distinction that mattered to them).

There are other areas on the wiki that take a continuity-agnostic approach; I think it's just character pages that are handled so strictly. Check out [[Noisemaze Mass Production Type Version]]—which honestly ''is'' a character page in every way that matters—for a recently-made-relevant-again example. For many bigger-picture concept pages, a similar approach is used to great effect: [[Transformation]], [[Scanning]], [[Energon]], [[Protoform]], [[Spark]], [[Living metal]], [[Mini-Con]], [[Energon mutation]], just to grab a few random examples.

To draw attention to one last point, which I predict will resonate a lot with people who already agree with me and not at all with people who don't: any and all ''Beast Wars'' or ''Beast Machines'' original characters are exempt from this issue—despite, on a real-world level, there not really being any difference between those franchises and the likes of ''Armada'' or ''Animated''. It's just the lore connection that keeps it tethered, despite the wiki treating it as its ''own'' continuity family in basically every other way that matters.

My specific proposal is this: '''for characters originating ''outside of G1'', don't keep separate G1 pages.''' Treat those characters as we do Sky-Byte, ignoring the "continuity family" divide, and put the appearances on the page where they're most relevant. Here are the salient benefits of this approach:
*Have all the information on many popular post-G1 characters in the place where most casual readers would expect to look.
*Cut the Gordian knot of the GoBots/Diaclone debate.
*Finally ditch all those (BWU) pages consisting of a single sentence and a duplicated toy entry.
*Fewer redundant toy writeups which need to be maintained in parallel.
*Far, far fewer awkward paragraphs in Notes sections talking about "continuity transplants" like those are a real thing.

Here is a list of pages which I think would be affected, sorted by continuity, just from an hour or so of searching:
*'''''Diaclone''''': [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]]
*'''''GoBots''''': [[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Crasher (G1)]], [[Cy-Kill (G1)]], [[Leader-1 (G1)]], [[Rest-Q (G1)]], [[Cop-Tur (G1)]] (!)
*'''''Armada''''': [[Hot Shot (G1)]], [[Red Alert (IDW)]], [[Demolisher (G1)]], [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Sideways (RM)]] (!), [[Treadshot (IDW)]]
*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Override (BWU)]], [[Ransack (IDW)]], [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Signal Lancer (G1)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Barricade (IDW)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Breacher (G1)]], [[Terradive (G1)]], [[Hailstorm (G1)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''Animated''''': [[Bulkhead (G1)]] (!), [[Lugnut (TF 2010)]], [[Lockdown (G1)]], [[Slipstream (G1)]] (!), [[Oil Slick (G1)]], [[Lightbright (G1)]], [[Lickety-Split (G1)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Breakdown (IDW)]], [[Airachnid (G1)]], [[Predaking (Kingdom)]], [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Rescue Bots''''': [[Medix (G1)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Scatterspike (G1)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Headlock (G1)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Transit (G1)]], [[Fracture (Cybertron)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Cyberverse''''': [[Shadow Striker (G1)]], [[Croaton (G1)]], [[Meteorfire (G1)]], [[Wildwheel (G1)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Doomwings (G1)]], [[Ursa Major (G1)]], [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': (deep breath) [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Twirl (G1)]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Sky Blast (G1)]], [[Sureshock (G1)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]
I assuredly missed some, so feel free to edit the lists above to add any other characters that would be affected by this proposal which are omitted!

Again, the vast majority of these are from ''Beast Wars Uprising'', which does have some weird lingering cases that would need further individual discussion, I think: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]]. But for the most part, I really don't see any reason why there should be all these tiny nothing pages; the only reason all those Mini-Cons were not called Mini-Cons is that in the ''Uprising'' universe, Mini-Cons are called Micromasters instead (which is the lore equivalent of "[[Barricade (G1)]] doesn't look like he's made of knives"). This is even ''less'' an irreconcilable lore detail than, for example, the organic/robotic split for Targetmasters and the like. My main goal with sharing this is to revisit the ''Uprising'' policy, because from where I'm sitting, it's resulted in exactly the same horribly inconvenient setup as the ''Diaclone'' stuff. A different, specific policy there would deal with most of the examples above, and I'd be very happy; what I've suggested is just a one-size-fits-all policy.

The weirdest victim of this stated policy, I think, is that of [[Bulkhead (G1)]], who technically originated with Animated, but whose appearances in G1 media have all drawn specifically from the ''Prime'' version. [[Slipstream (G1)]] is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: [[Slipstream (Animated)]], [[Slipstream (WFC)]] and [[Slipstream (Cyberverse)]], depending on which specific version is being depicted. That means all of the Bulkhead appearances would actually go on the ''Prime'' page. I really don't feel strongly on this detail, though. [[Cop-Tur (G1)]], as mentioned in the above discussion, is another edge case. One more strange case ''not'' listed above is that of [[Emissary (IDW)]], who homages the ''Robots in Disguise'' character but genuinely has what I'd consider to be a radically different portrayal, likely inspired as much by the ''Titans Return'' figure as anything.

To be clear, I consider G1 a special case because of how it's a catch-all label for anything that isn't Hasbro's newest ground-up reboot du jour. Like it or not, G1 usually doesn't actually mean "G1" any more, it just means ''Transformers''. I absolutely wouldn't want to start merging anything from other continuity families—that way pure madness lies. But I think this proposal has clear-cut criteria for inclusion, and would feel more consistent with other areas of existing wiki policy. To give a specific, relevant example: I don't think [[Fracture (Movie)]]'s appearances should be folded onto her merged ''GoBots'' page as some have suggested, ''but'' I do think her toy writeup should be on both without any "blah blah repurposed" hedging, and likewise for the other movieverse characters based on redecos designed by [[Joe Kyde]] contemporaneously with Classics and Universe with specific G1 characters (mostly Micromasters) in mind, some of which were even intended to be released as part of the ''Universe'' toyline. These being: [[Fracture (Movie)]], [[Big Daddy (Movie)]], [[Jolt (Movie)]], [[Grindcore (Movie)]], [[Breakaway (Movie)]], and [[Crankcase (Movie)]]. [[Mudflap (Movie)]] and [[Inferno (Movie)]] are basically the exact same but nobody ever talks about that.

Finally, I think [[Gigatron (G1)]]/[[Overlord (G1)]], [[Zaptrap]]/[[Kuwagatrer]], and [[Rotorbolt (Timelines)]]/[[Skyklik]]/[[Fumes]] should prrrooobably be revisited? In the former two cases, they exist due to niche media establishing them as separate individuals within the same continuity, but we already have precedent for dealing with that—see [[Hot Shot (G1)]]. I will concede that the Rotorbolt situation is quite funny.

I understand that the wiki is structured the way it is for good reasons, but the post-[[Evergreen]] state of the franchise is one where most writers are plucking characters from anywhere in the franchise's history without any significant changes to their depiction. The existing policy will only become more cumbersome as time goes on, in my eyes—I know for many editors, the list of pages above is a horrible scary list of Exceptions, but from where I'm sitting, they feel more like exceptions as they already stand? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 07:25, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:As someone who is basically sympathetic to your goals and not knee-jerk opposed to the idea, this:
:::"Slipstream (G1) is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: Slipstream (Animated), Slipstream (WFC) and Slipstream (Cyberverse), depending on which specific version is being depicted."
:is the worst thing I've ever read. Just, why? --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 08:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I was mostly being glib, I don't have a good answer there! Just wanted to draw attention to the fact that it ''would'' be a problem with the proposal. It's also been pointed out that all of [[Lockdown (G1)|Lockdown]]'s appearances are visually based on the ''Revenge of the Fallen'' toy! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:56, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Absolutely not. There's so much here that's based on false assumptions/incorrect information that I absolutely refuse to take any of this seriously. Concepts are on the same page because they are just that: concepts. There's so much to pick apart here but because I have important things to do, I'll just say that right now, the only reason why there was ''ever'' any confusion over Power Core Combiners is because fans took behind the scenes information from the company overly literally. You actually look at the one piece of information about the toyline (the brief history provided directly by Hasbro the club) and it makes it abundantly clear that it was always meant to be movieverse; I even argued back at the time about Smoulder and Steamhammer being put on that page, and the only reason why it's still that way is because the argument just fizzled out. And once again, I really have to ask: why the hell are we pushing forward merges based on "vibes" when we still keep the Sideways' (someone who is actually said in fiction to all be the same guy) apart based on moronic, petty reasons? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:01, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Yeah, no, sorry, I think this is ultimately unhelpful and going to cause more accessibility issues than it solves. "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in" is perhaps a little confusing to new readers, but it's ultimately fairly self-consistent and easy to navigate once you understand the basic concept; "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in, with the exception of RID01 which shares its pages with G1, and any latter-day characters imported into G1, which go on the pages of their non-G1 incarnations" is very confusing and requires you to be deep in the sauce to understand which characters are and are not exceptions to the rule. I obviously think that flexibility of the system is a good thing — the RID/G1 merge, while less than ideal, is definitely the best way to solve a very unintuitive issue — but the more holes we poke in the tower the closer it comes to collapsing, if you catch my drift.
:Ultimately I think the occasional silliness of "Shadow Striker (G1) who is identical to Shadow Striker (Cyberverse)" and such is the price we pay for having any structure whatsoever. The more we make exceptions on the basis of ultimately arbitrary "well this one's SO similar" the less consistent the wiki overall gets, and the harder it gets to navigate. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Basically, this. And I don't even think that drawing the franchise-based chunk distinction is all that confusing given I think most people grok the idea that characters will pop up across sub-fictions of major multi-media franchises with varying levels of similarity to prior incarnations that are still "oh, it's a wholly separate storyline, okay". That's just how these things ''do''. (and like "multiverse" has kinda become a ''thing'' in other franchises the last several years) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 10:00, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:"We've always put RID guys appearing in G1 as still being the RID character, look at Sky Byte" - what other examples make this an "always"? There WERE two Sky Byte pages, for years. We only stopped having a Sky-Byte (G2) when its character model in the IDW G1 comic was explicitly based off the new T30 toy sculpt which wound up with like half of these separate articles duplicating each other. It was argued on that talk page for a long while. The only other case I can think of at all is Gigatron (G1), and we ''don't'' treat him like Megatron (RID).
:"We treat BW as a continuity family like Armada, it looks like we are showing favoritism to them" - we treat it like a franchise within G1, which is what it is. And we disambig by franchise, not by continuity family. "Chase (RB)", not "Chase (Aligned)" or "Chase (Prime)". This was one of the concerns I raised last year when we turned Victory, Masterforce et al into G1 because they had no separate box branding of their own, wait it turned out they did, welp whattaya gonna do, no backsies.
:'''Last but MOST''', I'd say that, yes, "lore connections" mean a great deal here, it is a feature not a bug. This is a fiction-centric wiki as surely as it's an English-centric one. We put character writeups first, above the toys. We give the toys the character names and say "his stickers", not "its stickers" and talk about how it represents the character, not about how many micrograms of silicon it contains. Separating characters because they come from different storyline eras / offerings is entirely normal and reasonable for us. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 09:43, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I don't disagree in general, but G1/IDW Gigatron DOES share a page with RID Megatron. [[Gigatron (G1)]] is the Overlord repurpose. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:49, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Oof. Don't know why I clearly remembered them as being separate, but in any case I regret the error. Thank you.--[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
There's no way to organize something like this place without something somewhere seeming arbitrary. I think the existing structure is arbitrary in the best way that makes the most sense, and trying to "mitigate" that arbitrariness just creates different arbitrariness. A lot of this "but what if we redid all this to fix this particular thing" shuffling just relitigates why we already do the stuff we already do. so, like: no --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 09:54, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

== The Discord ==

Alright, seriously, we need to talk about this. It is beyond frustrating that a greater than 50% chunk of discussion about what big edits will happen on the wiki are happening on an app that people either aren't on or (in my case) aren't allowed on. I was told it was going to just to get voices onto things but that clearly isn't how it's working out. We need either some sort of archival dump of all these posts or something because I'm tired of getting into arguments where half the responses haven't even happened on the main site itself. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:45, 17 August 2022 (EDT)
: I think you're drastically overestimating how much discussion about big edits is happening on the Discord. No actual big decisions are getting made there, and we make it a point to repeatedly remind people that discussion for major changes needs to happen here before anything gets decided. But we also can't stop anyone from simply talking about things there the same way we couldn't stop discussion on the AllSpark thread when that was a thing, and having a public log of discussions from the editing channel is both infeasible and frankly unnecessary. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 09:09, 17 August 2022 (EDT)

==Designer bylines on toy writeups==

As those of us who have been tuning in to the [[Hasbro Pulse#Livestreams|Hasbro Pulse livestreams]] have no doubt noticed, one side effect of the unprecedented transparency of the current team on the ''Generations'' franchise is that we are now pretty consistently being blasted with a fire hose of toy designer credits. While there's been a scramble to record them on the designers' pages as best we can, this rapidly growing body of information is not doing the average reader a whole lot of good sequestered away on pages that require them to already know the designers by name. As such, I've put together a template to act as a designer byline for relevant toy write-ups, largely following the formatting of our existing voice actor template.

Documentation for the prototype template which I've named '''<nowiki>{{toydesigner}}</nowiki>''' can be found here:

*[[:Template:Toydesigner-Prototype]]

And a variety of examples of implementation can be found here:

*[[User:AzimuthAcolyte/Sandbox/Toy credits demo]]

Is this something we would be interested in implementing?

Questions, concerns, suggestions etc are welcome. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:33, 22 August 2022 (EDT)

:I support adding this template, it's valid information and helps put names and faces in a historically anonymous industry due to the lack of credits in the products themselves.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:38, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I think this is a great idea. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I really like it. The only possible negative is that unless a whole bunch of people are very dedicated to this (or one brave soul is ''extremely'' dedicated to it) we might end up seeing it only appear on a small handful of toy entries and most will never feature it. I vote for going ahead with it regardless.
:::While we are addressing the "designer credits" issue, can we also please find a better phrase to use on the designer pages than "Toys So-and-so is known to have had a hand in creating"? It's just so overwrought. I think "Design Team Credits Include:" gets the point across much more naturally.... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 13:54, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::::This is a fair point. Maybe something as blunt as "Known Design Work" mirroring the "Published Works" thing we use for writers/artists? -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Looks good to me. Hope we can scrounge together sources and lists for older design teams too. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 15:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I can't see any reason not to do this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not a toy person, but that looks really cool! --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 16:23, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
Oh wow, I'm blown away by the universally positive reception here! If there are no concerns in the next few days I guess I'll get started rolling this out. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Alrighty it's been a fair bit with no further concerns, so I have pushed the template live to [[:Template:Toydesigner]] and will begin implementing it as I have time. Any and all help is appreciated, as this will of course be a huge job. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 16:13, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Wiki Toy Photo Quality Standards ==
So we know (and had long suspected anyway) that Hasbro designers are sometimes pulling Wiki photos for reference. That's great, but we've got some toy photography on here that's a good bit off from what the figures look like in reality for one reason or another. Is there any way to flag shots that are out of whack so that they might get tweaked or replaced? This issue comes to mind since, while I've been here more or less since the Wiki started, I don't recall there being a formal set of standards for photos since it just wasn't really a big deal before now. Oversaturation is my main complaint, since one user a long while ago was going through, taking existing shots into Photoshop and oversaturating the hell out of them without regard to the actual toy, and I've noticed some updated photography like [[Prowl (Magnaboss)]] that does basically the same. It's a larger photo, but that Prowl is definitely not blazing yellow in person. Apologies in advance and please disregard if this has already been discussed elsewhere or before.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:10, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:For the record, my lighting set up is very warm, hence why Prowl's colours appear so bright. I haven't figured out the right balance in Photoshop to get the colours of figures to look spot on so figures either appear too bright or too dull in the finished product. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 17:30, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::Oh, I'm not intending to put you on the spot, that's just the first example I had on hand of a wider issue that we probably need to start being careful about since it appears to be (hilariously) affecting actual figures now, like Titans Return PMOP or Legacy Iguanus. When it was the one guy tweaking things to be inaccurate "because it looked better", I could follow him and revert stuff, but I can't when there's nothing to revert in most cases.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 18:38, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::I recommend ring lights, you can get some pretty cheap, they've good at spreading light out rather than heavy-focus, and they have adjustable brightness and warm/cool light settings: use "cool" (aka white/blue-tinted). Even before I got ring lights, I used "cool" light bulbs in the lamps. The problem is these are nowhere as common as the "normal" yellow-tinted bulbs, thus, go with the ring lights.
::As for "standards"... well, good luck with that. Every camera's a little different. Every MONITOR is a little different. Hell, I have a double-monitor setup with different models and they have small but distinct differences in brightness & etc; honestly I'm good with it since it lets me check how things may look to different people. But I think maybe a tag for photos that we are CERTAIN are too far off from final product (be they user-made or stock images) may not be a bad idea. Assuming we notice. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 22:44, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, a tag we can throw on to a photo just to make it at least visible that it's incorrect would be useful. And would probably prompt a deco designer to gather some secondary reference material, assuming the tag's obvious. I like the idea.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:29, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I've noticed that the quality of the UT stuff in the toys section flunctuates greatly-- for example, ML Starscream still uses the guidebook picture, and Superlink ver of the combining Optimus downright doesn't exist. I've started to collect UT toys since Hasbro has been updating UT stuff with more commitment and I have 0 faith in them doing it right, and most of the stuff I've gotten are the JP versions. For minor alterations like ML/ Armada Megs, is it worth uploading a completely new picture of ML Megatron onto his page? Another issue worth regarding discussing is "cartoon accuracy". Whilst Hasbro is indeed working on making more accurate figures, they obviously aren't 100% accurate, like 86 starscream using the commonly accepted G1 logo instead of the sunbow accurate one with the spike in the middle, and even from a sculpt and proportional standppint the ER mold is far from accurate compared to the sunbow model, let alone MP52. I actually cleaned up the page for TM2 Megatron because he deviates pretty heavily if you compare the CG model to the final toy, and changed the claim that Skids is "toon" accurate as he is blantently based on the original toy in deco. The same goes for Starscream, aside from the forearms and forehead hes blatently based on the T30 toy. I also had to edit that bit --[[User: Pixelmaster|Pixelmaster]] 3:31 HKT

==Reconsolidating some of our pages==
This is something I've been thinking about for a while, but I'd like to propose re-merging some of our excessively split articles back into something more manageable. It seems like that once a page is split out, a) we get a lot less editorial oversight, as the recent toy page trimming has revealed, b), stuff does not get updated nearly as often as they would be on their respective mainpages, and c) it makes information harder to find by pushing it behind a subpage that's not readily accessible.

Obviously I understand that splits are necessary for the really long pages like [[Optimus Prime (G1)]], [[Megatron (G1)]], and soforth, but when you get down to like, [[Mirage (G1)]] or [[Hound (G1)]] or [[Hot Shot (Armada)]], there's barely anything of any significance on their main pages beyond Dreamwave or the odd IDW cameo. Are, for instance, [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]]'s Marvel adventures that major that they can't fit into the main page? Are [[Hook (G1)/toys|Hook]] or [[Warpath (G1)#Toys|Warpath]] really that inundated with toys that they need their own subpage? If it's a problem of just ''length'', then a lot of the subpaged articles or mainpage stuff like the storybooks could just be trimmed down into something more manageable—as I did with G1 Cliffjumper's Marvel section earlier this year. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 17:00, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:I 100% agree with this. --[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:04, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Fully in favour. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 17:20, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Sub-pages should, on their own, be significantly sizable pages to justify making readers link-jump. A dozen toys does not strike me as remotely enough to justify a subpage split. Being ''in'' a major long-running fiction but mostly having appearances in a minority of installments that can be summed up in two sentences doesn't justify a split. New editing tools are fun and all, but just 'cuz you gotta new hammer doesn't mean you have to go hunting for anything that looks vaguely nail-like. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 18:18, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Incoming maintenance ==

Just a heads up, our host is going to be doing some maintenance in about an hour that may cause problems with the site, so if you have trouble reaching it and therefore cannot read this message, that's what it is. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 00:11, 23 November 2022 (EST)

== Foreign names ==

A dispute came up recently on the [[Megatron (ES)]] page. User:Kiké Prime has been providing Hungarian names for all the characters, but this one apparently is just "Megatron". Cyberlink420 removed it. I disputed it, pointing out that not listing it leaves the implication that we do not know the name of the character in the language. Despite having my reversion again reverted, I still find deliberately leaving blanks in our name lists odd. I am thus bringing the matter here for further discussion. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 12:16, 5 December 2022 (EST)
:My understanding has always been that we only add foreign names if they are different from the English name. Per pages like [[Megatron (G1)]], this includes examples where the name is the same, but is spelled with a diacritic or using a different alphabet. So "Megatron" wouldn't be different enough to justify inclusion, but examples like Mégatron, Megatrón, Мегатрон and メガトロン would. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:10, 5 December 2022 (EST)

== Nonbinary Character Category ==

So, we now have another nonbinary character (who actually used their pronouns during the media no less), [[Nightshade (ES)|Nightshade]] from [[Earthspark]] (Nightshade at time of posting doesn't have a page yet)! The other fully for certain fully intentional one is [[Screwball]] from [[Beast Wars Uprising]] while [[Acid Storm (Cyberverse)|Acid Storm]] was at least an out of media by writer retcon of animation, and [[Overlord_(G1)#Ask_Vector_Prime|Overlord's]] gender is somewhat nebulous on where that fits beyond being gender expansive due to being [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#December 23, 2015|"what some would call genderfluid"]] but that at least puts us at three. Given that we have a trans category now we thought it best to at this point suggestion a nonbinary category for the sake of users (including gender expansive people) easily finding nonbinary characters on here. Obviously adding Nightshade will have to wait until they have a page but any thoughts on this yea or nay? [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 18:28, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:I forgot about Screwball. I think with three confirmed examples, even without the edge case of Overlord, that's probably enough to justify one. Care will have to be taken, however, to only include confirmed examples and not use it as a dumping ground for any character whose gender has never been explicitly identified. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 18:37, 8 December 2022 (EST)
::Authorial intent and all, but I can say that if I had the option to go back and rewrite it I would have used the term non binary for Overlord. I feel like Acid Storm is more of an edge case; it’s what one person said on their account to justify it. Whenever Acid Storm actually says something they’re animated with a female face; it’s not done at random.[[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:47, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::Acid Storm changes from masculine male to feminine female and back. Gender-fluid, sure, but definitely non-binary? As for Overlord, in the Legends manga Mega gives Overlord a female-presenting face - is there a pronoun change during that time? Would we have more candidates for inclusion in a Gender-fluid category first? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 20:17, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::::Thank for the notes folks, that does help to piece this together! Just want to note that a pronoun change is not necessary for a gender being experienced in fluidity to be the one expressed or what have you, so unless the Legends manga actually has some sort of statement about Overlord's fluidity that kind of puts us back with an umbrella term of nonbinary (which we are unsure as not having read the Legends manga if that would work for that Overlord so we can't speak to where/if Overlord falls under gender expansiveness beyond the fact that Overlord's presentation changes depending on the binary bond partner right?). Acid Storm is an edge case yes but if we do count the edge case that they are we think it is worth noting that for Acid Storm what Catt said was specifically that changing expression is just something they do, and "any pronouns" work for Acid Storm, no statement about the binary. Of course, we only see two faces which are the two different Seeker faces that were otherwise delineated by gender, but at this point we're getting into the opt-in thing of 'x person is genderfluid and thus considers themself nonbinary' or 'z person is genderfluid and only considers themself as under the multigender umbrella'. Which we don't have detail on really if Acid Storm is genderfluid as how they know themselves right? Because that's just a thing that was written in the Female Transformers page because of (no blame being given, it's understandable) the user finding that to be the term that fit best? Feel like we've ended up just pointing out an need for just a gender expansive category instead but ah well. [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 21:46, 1 January 2023 (EST)
::::::We seem to have killed this with a non-solution for the nonbinary category by pointing out that gender expansive is more certain than saying genderfluid. If we count Nightshade, Overlord, and Screwball, is that a go on nonbinary, or should we just have a gender expansive category at this point that would also be one trans characters use? For people wondering what gender expansive means you can find a definition here https://www.diversitystyleguide.com/glossary/gender-expansive/ https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/08/gender-expansive-mean/ [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 23:18, 6 February 2023 (EST)
:::::::Respectfully, I think needing to invoke a glossary suggests the term is so little-used in common parlance that it would not be useful for our needs and style. We don't have a category tag at the bottom of a bunch of BW characters saying "tetrapods" or "perissodactyls" (we ''do'' talk like that on [[Popular beast alternate modes]], maybe a grouping ''page'' would be a better approach? Just a thought...). If we are looking for a category tag I think it would be better to find the term that unambiguously covers the largest number of candidates, without a need to rely on edge cases, maintaining both accuracy and readability. I see three characters that could sensibly go in a Gender-fluid tag, one that could go in a Non-binary tag (meaning we wouldn't make the latter). We may be facing a case where there are few enough disparate examples that there isn't one single category tag that usefully unites them. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:55, 7 February 2023 (EST)

== Adding an informative table to each character page ==
I was thinking about it since it's striking.. lack.. There should be a way to tell people in which and how many episodes/issues/movies each character appears in the continuity they belong to, their debut episode/issue movie, what aliases they have had and nicknames they were given by other characters, a more centered area for the voice or live actors, a link to their gallery pages(if they have any) and one to their disambiguation pages etc. The kind of information that one would prefer to find with greater ease, especially if they aren't members. And talking about their appearances, that should prove quite useful for future page edits, since we'll know exactly where to look especially when it's about latecomers or characters that don't appear on a regular basis. I just think it'd be useful. [[User:Darthrone|Darthrone]] ([[User talk:Darthrone|talk]]) 15:44, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:This kind of infobox was discussed at the very earliest days of this wiki, and it was decided that there was just way, way too much information for it to work... and this was in 2006, BEFORE the franchise exploded. TF is such a fragmented kludge of fictions from multiple sources and creators spanning 40 years that any major character would end up with one ultra-massive thing of dubious use (can't say I see the value in a "number of appearances" tally, aside from the headache of keeping that accurate over time and arguing "what counts"), or a billion splintered ones spread across the page for the different fictions. And "nicknames" is always a minefield as those tend to turn into a massive list of "someone called them this once" which is... not helpful. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:46, 2 February 2023 (EST)
::Even if it had been a day-1 thing, I don't see how this is more informative than our current style. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 17:58, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:::I'm for infoboxes, but the information you're asking for is far too abstract and meaningless in this franchise. (We are absolutely not doing "nicknames". No.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:09, 2 February 2023 (EST)

==The (BWU) tag==
I understand the reasons why [[#Proposal re: G1 pages|my previous proposal]] regarding the proliferation of (G1) pages for random newer characters was soundly rejected. However, my main motivation for raising it was that I find the huge quantity of (BWU) pages for "repurposed" Mini-Cons and bestial Transformers to be reader-unfriendly, so I wanted to make a case for making an exception for ''[[Beast Wars: Uprising]]'' cameos. ''Uprising'' was an obscure barely-canon multi-continuity-drifting web serial which we are very unlikely to get further instalments of, and most of the relevant characters are similarly very deep pulls who will assuredly not be appearing again in future stories, and who will otherwise be stuck with tiny stub-pages forever. Most of these are Mini-Cons (here Micromasters) or bestial Transformers (here Protoformers), with a few boats or Constructicons from "[[Derailment]]". In many cases, I perceive ''Uprising'' as having tried to give these toys a hint of fiction where previously they had none at all, much like [[Ask Vector Prime]] before it. It's a very different phenomenon to most so-called "continuity transplants" we've seen in other series (such as with, say, [[Hot Shot (G1)]]), which are instead rooted in the popularity of those characters.

I think the problem here is that strictly speaking ''Uprising'' is a "Primax" continuity, sure, but it lifts dozens of characters (let alone concepts) unchanged from later stories. Slavishly hewing to that label when it's such an intertextual melting pot has resulted in this unfriendly setup. It feels like a fair decision made at the time (was [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive64#Derailment & Uprising pages|this discussion]] the one?) but in my opinion the wiki's policy kinda fails here. If we get rid of the (BWU) tag, the (G1) back-ports remaining (a minority!) will be for more significant characters, often adapted more radically. Here's the list of tiny pages we could be rid of, just like that:

*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]

There's a handful of ''Uprising'' characters that need a (G1) page anyway for non-''Uprising'' reasons; I'm totally ambivalent about where the ''Uprising'' content ends up for these: [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Override (BWU)]] (!), [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Twirl (G1)]].

Finally there's a few weird cases that would merit individual discussion but would probably just need to keep their own pages: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]].

Here is a ([https://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=500&offset=0&redirs=1&profile=all&search=%22from+the%22+%22continuity+families%22 probably non-exhaustive]) list of existing cases of multi-continuity drifting you should probably consider before weighing in:
* [[Buckethead]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 31, 2015|this Ask Vector Prime answer]])
* [[Drydock (TF 2010)]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 13, 2015|this answer]] which explicitly has him travel from one continuity to another)
* [[Drelnar Feh'd]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 17, 2015|this one]])
* [[Scorpia (G2)]], [[Autoceptor]], [[Deceptor]], and [[Kaltor]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#June 12, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Night Rescue Team]], [[Clear Skies Team]], [[Rapid Intervention Team]], [[Prehistoric Team]], [[Demolition Team]], [[Dirt Digger Team]], [[Heavy Load (Universe)]] and the [[Mobile Fortification Team]], and [[Detectas]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]]).
**However, exceptions from these Mini-Con teams are [[Nightscream (Cybertron)|Nightscream]], [[Offshoot (Cybertron)|Offshoot]], [[Strongarm (Cybertron)|Strongarm]] and [[Knockdown (Cybertron)|Knockdown]], who all have separate (Cybertron) basis on the basis of receiving separate bios after being packed in with ''Cybertron'' Primus...
**...but then [[Liftor]] is all on a single page, despite his ''Classics'' bio.
**[[Snarl (Classics)|Snarl]], [[Sledge (Classics)|Sledge]], [[Wideload (Classics)|Wideload]], [[Knockdown (Classics)|Knockdown]], and [[Steel Wind]] already have ''Uprising'' content on their pages, but that makes sense as these were originally ''Classics'' guys.
* The [[Saurian Strike Team]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Minicon 8 Pack]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 24, 2015|this one]])
* The ''Dark of the Moon'' Mini-Cons [[Dualor (DOTM)]], [[Triceradon (DOTM)]], [[Rav (DOTM)]], and [[Catilla (DOTM)]], plus [[Ironlunge]], [[Reptix]], [[Sling (AOE)]], [[Gnashteeth]], [[Wedge Shape]], [[Brimstone (Universe)]], [[Apexus]], [[Gredator]], and [[Dragoyell]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#August 13, 2015|this one]])
** Weirdly, we ''separately'' have a page for [[Rav (BWU)]], but Catilla has Unicron Trilogy, movie, and ''Uprising'' appearances covered all on the one page!
* [[Galadria]] and [[Ramak]] (because of [[Source:Transformers: Spacewarp's Log#December 5, 2015|this post]])
* Am I to understand that [[Wind Sheer (RID)]], [[Skyfire (RID)]] and the [[Dimensional Patrol]] each have just a single page because (RID) ''is'' part of the G1 continuity family sometimes...?
* And I understand that [[Primus Vanguard]] cameos just go on their original pages because that's a weird thing kinda outside of G1 anyway (at least from an in-universe perspective, if not a real-world one).
* ''Diaclone'' examples like [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]], [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]], and [[Chifumi Takahashi]] have been discussed to death.
* [[Monsterous]] was retconned to originally be from an Aligned universe (in [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#October 21, 2015|this post]], though I can't actually find any mention of Uniend? EDIT: [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#November 7, 2015|found it]]!)
* [[Primacron]] was apparently mentioned in ''[[Transformers Animated: The AllSpark Almanac II| The AllSpark Almanac II]]''.
* And [[Sentinel Supreme]] is just an Easter egg that everyone seemed to shrug about at the time.

To those who say the exception I'm proposing would be confusing, I submit these existing examples where we've apparently neglected to split something out as evidence that the only people this confuses are wiki editors like me wondering why they're not all that way. Maybe I'm just unaware of some aspect of the existing policy which accounts for all these cases? But is it really helpful to anyone to have a given toy's associated fiction squirrelled away somewhere separate you have to go into the disambiguation to find? We recently merged [[Chromhorn]] (another Sorenson job) on the basis that "There's literally no reason for these to be on different pages. They are the same thing." Can we not do the same for these Sorenson-penned cases that are basically going "look, the exact same guy shows up in multiple universes, alright?" And if the answer is no, will someone go through and split all these out? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 18:27, 6 February 2023 (EST)

:I think my response to your earlier G1-import proposal still applies here: the more exceptions we make to our system for the sake of "accessibility", the harder the overall structure becomes to grok for a new reader, and thus ironically it all becomes ''less'' accessible. Why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steel Jaw]], but ''Uprising'' Bisk be at [[Bisk (RID)]]? Or, conversely, why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steeljaw (RID)]], but LBS Steeljaw be at [[Steel Jaw|Steeljaw (IDW)]]? Neither solution is good.
:As for the current list of exceptions, I'd argue everything you list from Buckethead to the DOTM Mini-Cons should probably be split. Galadria and Ramak are characters from outside media, so we don't split them across continuity lines. Wind Sheer and Skyfire have one page for consistency with the other RID guys. The source on Monsterous being Aligned is [[Source:Ask_Vector_Prime/Facebook#November_7.2C_2015|here]], but I would argue that's just giving an origin to the GoBot and so they should share a page anyway.
:Lastly - I object to you bringing the Chromhorn thing into this, as I don't think it's a fair comparison. Chromhorn wasn't making any exception to our categorisation system; it was one page saying "Chromhorn is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT" and another saying "Chromhorn Forest Type is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT", and the former was somehow a "repurposing" of the fictionless latter. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:24, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::Totally get the Steeljaw example—although it ''is'' crazy that we're currently disambiguating G1 wolf Steeljaw simply by [[Steel Jaw]]. You should post about the disambiguation tag policy change you suggested on Discord, I think a lot of people were thinking along similar lines there. Agree with your interpretation of the current policy as to which of the examples listed should be split and which shouldn't—although the more I think about the Primus Vanguard, the more I think those should technically be split too. While I guess the [[Time Warrior (AVP)|Time Warrior]]s are multiversal travellers like Drydock. RE: Chromhorn, I understand why it's technically different; I brought it up because I think it speaks to the tenor of ''Ask Vector Prime'' answers—in spirit, I think its aim was exactly the same as with the Mini-Con examples I've given.
::What do I mean by that? To match your Steeljaw example, from the opposite angle: say I'm your typical fan scrolling [[Transformers: Dark of the Moon (toyline)]], and I click on, say, [[Dualor (DOTM)]], wondering if he's ever shown up in anything. In their current state, I get my answer immediately. With the proposed split for consistency, I instead get a page telling me that Dualor (DOTM) is a dinosaur Mini-Con from ''Dark of the Moon'', some info about the toy, ''maybe'' ending with an inscrutable note about how he was "repurposed" as an identical guy. Now, there's ''already'' an unrelated [[Dualor (Armada)]], so we'd need to make a disambiguation page. We can see this already by looking at [[Snow Cat (Universe)]], which is barren (the very scenario AVP so often tried to address!), and doesn't even admit to the existence of [[Snow Cat (BWU)]] aside from a general Snow Cat disambiguation tag. In some existing cases like [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], we've mirrored a toy writeup, which needs upkeep in parallel; in others, like Snow Cat, we're asking the user to visit the other page to read about the toy ''anyway''. To my mind, this is inarguably less accessible. I don't understand arguments made about accessibility here which are predicated on readers having learned editing policy to begin with, and I don't think this proposal would actually make it any harder to learn the system.
::I regret not listing out all the individual members of those Mini-Con teams above, to better communicate the sheer number of pages that would need to be made (and pages that would need to be renamed, in case of conflicts) to create this inconvenience in service of a rule we've already been ignoring without issue. Nobody wants to do this work, and I think it's less that no-one cares, and more that some people think it'd actually make the wiki worse, and the rest don't particularly think it'd make the wiki better.
::What about just making an exception for Mini-Cons/Micromasters? I've talked about ''Uprising'', but obviously the vast majority of cases that theoretically need splitting aren't from ''Uprising'' at all. Could probably even do a generic template like "X exists in multiple continuity families, and is a Micromaster/Maximal/Predacon in those without Mini-Cons". Thus your Steeljaws and Bisks and Overrides go unchanged, no problems or ambiguity there! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
:Once upon a time, I probably would have pushed for something like this, but where we are now: I am not a fan of any push towards treating something differently based on how "relevant" something is or not. It goes against the very spirit this wiki was founded on, because that is what was happening to the Wikipedia coverage of Transformers where they were just getting rid of things wholesale because of "relevancy." I can understand the basic point behind this, but I feel that doing so would set a bad precedent that could be exploited in the future.
:I'd be fine with splitting most of these out. I've said it before elsewhere but by and large a lot of the inconsistencies were largely the result of different contributors adding stuff or splitting stuff without a general consensus, and they haven't been cleaned up afterwards. Also, a minor note, but the Liftor thing was mainly cause no one noticed at the time until I wrote up about the profile years after the fact. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:26, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::If I gave the impression "relevancy" was the main thrust of my argument here, I didn't mean to! Like, it goes both ways—would we be merging because ''Uprising'' is so irrelevant that we shouldn't devote all these random stub pages to it, ''or'' are we merging because it's sufficiently relevant that we shouldn't be hiding that content in stub pages nobody visits? Either is true! I'm arguing for convenience and clarity. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::: This definitely feels like the strongest argument to the merge in my mind. The wiki is no stranger to niche pages, pages for nameless, fictionless, toyless nonentities. But I believe these fictionless toys and toyless fiction which are really the same thing would be a richer niche page for the merges. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 20:36, 7 February 2023 (EST)

MediaWiki talk:Community Portal

2023-02-08T01:35:53Z

Bumblebee2000: /* The (BWU) tag */

__NEWSECTIONLINK__

This is the place for discussion of topics that affect the entire wiki. For less wide-reaching subjects, either use articles' individual talk pages or [https://discord.gg/N99Bygq our Discord server].

Some topics that would ordinarily be here have merited their own pages:

{{chapters|title=Specific Discussion Subjects|align=left|content=
<div class="list-header">'''Moving From Wikia:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving|Arriving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving|Leaving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki:Community Portal/Complaints|Complaints]]
 <div class="list-header">'''New Ad Policy:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki:Ads|Ads]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Bookworm Database-Crash:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Damage Control Central|Damage Control Central]]
* [[Project:Bookworm Crash]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving2|Leaving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Server Move:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving2|Arriving Take 2]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Relicensing:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Relicensing|Relicensing]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Dealing With Vandalism:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Vandalism|Vandalism]]
 <div class="list-header">'''GoBots Sister Wiki:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/GoBots|Discussion on the place of GoBots in this wiki]]
 <div class="list-header">'''Wiki Technical Information:'''</div>
* [[Transformers_Wiki:Tech|A Not So Brief Summary of the Horrible Things That McFly and Co. Have Done To Keep This Wiki From Melting Down]]
}} 

{{:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}/Archive}}


== Site Logo revamp ==

Up until now, our rotating logo on the main page tends to have a batch of logos pointing to pages from the most recent franchises and series, plus a few from older franchises that we forgot or didn't bother to remove. I'd like to rework this system a bit to have a more even balance franchise-wise. I think we should have one character for every franchise that has had a cartoon or movie (including the JG1 shows), plus one from each of the major English-language comic runs (Marvel, Dreamwave, IDW1, and IDW2 at the bare minimum). This would be a good way to demonstrate the breadth of the franchise scope of the wiki, and help drive new readers towards legacy content. (Of course, we'd still have a few extra banners based on whatever is currently running for the "Hey, I know that guy!" factor. Would love to get some thoughts on this, and potentially character suggestions for each franchise. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 00:59, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:I think this is a great idea! Though, I'm unsure on which characters from each show would be good to use. Like, would we go most popular/memorable characters or just some really random left field obscurities like G1 Skids who appeared in only two episodes of ''The Transformers'', just to get some more eyes on character articles from franchises newer fans may not be fully aware of? Also, would Japanese-exclusive shows include ''Go!'', ''Q-Transformers'' and ''Robotmasters''? If so, maybe even an image from ''Portal'' (the Russian show) would be worthwhile too. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 02:47, 18 December 2021 (EST)
::Obscure/minor stuff risks just being the GO! Boxes again, and we already have those. For the big logo, best to go with majorish characters from majorish media. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 07:19, 18 December 2021 (EST)
:This sounds like a great idea. We could break it down like this:
G1 Seasons 1 and 2 - Optimus Prime,
TFTM/G1 Seasons 3 and 4 - Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime,
G1 Marvel - Ratchet,
Headmasters - Fort Max,
Masterforce - Minerva,
Victory - Star Saber,
Idk if we would do Zone or any of the Japanese G1 stories that came after,
Beast Wars - Megatron,
Beast Wars II - Lio Convoy,
Beast Wars Neo - Magmatron,
RID/Car Robots - Side Burn,
I've never read Dreamwave so I don't know a good character that represents it,
Unicron Trilogy - Hot Shot,
IDW could be broken into a few character reps because of how long it went on,
IDW Furman Era - IDW Bumblebee,
IDW Post Furman - IDW Galvatron,
IDW MTMTE/LL - Nautica,
IDW RID/OP - IDW Optimus Prime,
Animated - Bulkhead,
Movies - Bumblebee,
WFC Games - Bruticus,
Prime - Starscream,
RID15 - Strongarm,
Cyberverse - Windblade,
WFC Trilogy - G1 Megatron,
And then we can have a few slots open for characters from the latest shows/movies. This list would give new readers an idea on how big the franchise truly is and how diverse the characters are. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Certainly if anyone's gonna represent CR/RiD'01, it's gonna be Sky-Byte, the breakout star of the show, and not Side Burn, the Autobot womanizer. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:26, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Funilly enough I meant to put him there lol. [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 20:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
::Dreamwave, I'd pick War Within Grimlock. Certainly Shockwave should be part of 2005 IDW since he's responsible for the whole sha-bang.--[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] ([[User talk:MistaTee|talk]]) 18:40, 5 January 2022 (EST)

== Splitting Cloud characters ==

So now we have some sorta adequate translations, I'm being increasingly convinced that merging them just on the basis of AVP was a mistake and that the Cloud characters should be split out for simplicity and ease of explanation. Notably, the central conceit is far more similar to TransTech than G1—and more different to G1 than Cyberverse, for instance. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 02:44, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I was against it then and I'm against it now. They're nothing like the TransTech; they are practically nigh identical to the G1 guys, there's a war going on in their universe, and the "central conceit" of them being multiversal guardians is more akin to Alternity than it is to TransTech, who for the majority of their fiction were at most passive observers. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I am declining to weigh in personally until I finish first pass translations but please at least pretend to look over the translated material before repeating the same arguments. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:19, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::I have looked over it. Nothing is convincing me that it's all that separate from G1 stuff. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 12:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::"War going on" describes most of Transformer fiction. What makes Cyberverse "not G1", but Cloud G1, other than convenience for us editors? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:02, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::: As far as I can tell, there is no basic divergence, aside from Grimlock's origins, from the Cloud characters to the G1 counterparts. I could point to a fair few examples on the side of Cyberverse that rank higher than that (Grimlock's presenations, the origins of the Quintessons and Sharkticons, Skywarp, Acid Storm, etc etc.) [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:23, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::We can be here all day debating over character minutiae, but the point is that Cyberverse ultimately doesn't diverge that much from G1 in its general premise as opposed to Cloud. G1 is bloated enough as it is; it doesn't hurt to take out the one thing that doesn't really fit in and make it its own thing. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 17:29, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::: Well that just comes right back to my question: what actually makes Cloud World's core conceit any different from G1 beyond the fact that they have technology that allows them dimensional travel? Because if it is just that, I simply do not believe that is enough to justify a split for characters who are almost all made to look like and have the same personality as the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 17:51, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I agree for the sake of wiki presentation. *Cloud* is more like *TransTech* than it is like *Alternity*. *Cloud* characters got to travel to both the G1 and MD worlds as equally separate destinations. TakaraTomy used the *Generations War for Cybertron* moulds as the *United* series, which is G1 and not Aligned by our classification. *Cloud* recycling unused *Generations Fall of Cybertron* toys in a non-Aligned setting strikes me as more evidence that we can allow *Cloud* to live on its own rather than as another G1 setting. And *Cloud* was chosen by e-HOBBY over the competing proposal *Prime Shattered Glass* which would also have been on separate wiki pages despite employing purely redeco mould choiceis. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:08, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I'm not convinced by the idea that them saying "G1 World" is an indicator of separateness when there is also designations for "BW Spacetime" and "MF Spacetime." Brawn is depicted as practically identical in appearance to G1 Brawn before being upgraded. As for the Prime Shattered Glass choice, I think it's pretty obvious why that would be completely separate from this particular issue. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 16:25, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::The only reason Brawn is shown as the G1 body is if you take consideration that all Cloud members are drawn according to the latest toy or model available... he got no real toy before that, the only options were either G1 Sunbow, G1 toy or the tiny Universe 2.0 Legends. Now if you remove their appearance and focus on the story, Cloud is still more akin to Transtech than Alternity, Deadlock for example even got to visit the Legends World, a Aligned world (possibly the Adventure toyline) and the Ehobby spin-off dimension (now called Precursor World) -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 17:55, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::Yes, I am aware of how Cloud repurposings work. Nothing prevents one G1 universe from visiting another. And aside from that, Japan has had barely any non-JG1 cartoon related G1 fiction; of course Cloud World, which isn't directly JG1 related, would be indicated as different; that doesn't mean that it's not able to be categorized as G1. If it were an American storyline, where we have always had multiple G1 storylines, I feel that this would not nearly be as much of a point of contention. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:05, 28 December 2021 (EST)
I'm in favor of splitting Cloud from G1. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 19:32, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:I haven't read any of the Cloud fiction myself, but I know that if our translation team collectively agrees on something based on the material available, then that's more than enough convincing for me to agree with them also. In other words, I agree with a split. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:52, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::I'd vastly prefer if we could get someone like McFeely to weigh in on this. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:56, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::i'm in favour of the split. The cloud people have enough characteristics to distonguist them from theur jg1 counterpatts.--[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 20:14, 28 December 2021 (EST)
::::Alright, seriously, what characteristics are there actually to distinguish them from G1? Because nobody has been able to give me a concrete example so far. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 21:17, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:::::dinobot, heavy usage of aligned designs, hellwarp --[[User:ZacAttack|ZacAttack]] ([[User talk:ZacAttack|talk]]) 21:36, 28 December 2021 (EST)
Looks like Escargon is the only voice against the split thus far. Still, I suggest the discussion should remain open longer than usual, out of courtesy for people not checking the wiki as regularly given the holiday season. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 21:47, 28 December 2021 (EST)
:As the translations are still ongoing, I think the most we can suggest at this time is a note regarding its a classification as a Primax setting by AVP. As more information comes to light I'm becoming increasingly convinced that it was a decision made on shaky logic. Unlike the Alternity there doesn't seem to be any evidence of these guys being derived in-universe from G1 guys. And as fiction, it's about a bunch of super advanced parallel universe monitor guys who regularly travel to other universes. If it's literally just "the cast is mostly recolours of toys with G1 fiction" then maybe we need to start talking about listing the War for Cybertron games as G1 too. [[User:Star Spangled Sam|Star Spangled Sam]] ([[User talk:Star Spangled Sam|talk]]) 01:44, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::What exactly is super-advanced about them beyond SARA, who, as far as I can tell, is a gift from some being and not even their own creation? Because otherwise, they seem to be basic Transformers. Not a single person has been able to tell me that so far, and I'd be far more willing to listen if someone would just spell out what exactly makes them so distinct that means they can't be G1. It's not about in-universe stuff, because for all intents and purposes, the characters themselves are nigh-identical to the Generation 1 characters; you look at Cloud Megatron or Cloud Rodimus and it is obvious that, irregardless of whatever the fiction might say, they are being sold as new versions of the G1 characters. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 04:29, 29 December 2021 (EST)
:::By the same logic, then why not put the FOC and WFC games under the G1 banner since it heavly takes inspirations from it, same settings (war on cybertron, the resources are becoming low, escaping to another world), closest designs to G1.. hell they were more marketed towards G1 than the Movies and Prime in mind (let's face it.. that's what Hasbro always does).. but the further Hasbro tied them to Aligned and they became their own thing.. Cloud is about that, maybe marketed as G1 at first but they became their own thing at the end -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 13:20, 29 December 2021 (EST)
::::The WFC games are their own case that, despite what you say, were always clearly a part of Hasbro's ideas for the Aligned continuity, which is something that I'm not going to bother going into here. Nothing about Cloud registers to me as being somehow so separate that it requires us splitting off things into their own pages. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 13:24, 29 December 2021 (EST)
Bumping for more opinions. If there's no overall opposition to it by Friday or so, I'll start splitting. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:07, 4 January 2022 (EST)
:The Cloud fiction prominently features the Cloud characters interacting with their own G1 counterparts. If nothing else, it should be split on same basis as [[Galvatron II]]. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:50, 4 January 2022 (EST)
::We've seen that with other fiction. I'm not sure why it would justify them having their whole separate pages (Galvatron II is a unique case). If that's what it takes though to not go through some inane total split, though, then fine, whatever. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:03, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:If there is to be movement on this in the immediate future I suppose I should go ahead and weigh in. As the one doing the translation I broadly agree with Riptide. While I am unmoved by philosophical discussions on what constitutes "G1-ness" or "Transtech-ness," I believe it is important to return to our guiding principle of the end user experience. Given the already convoluted nature of the material as well as the cast's consistent interaction with both various Generation 1 continuities in general and their own incarnations in specific, I believe it will be in the best interests of intelligibility for the reader to split out Cloud from Generation 1. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:25, 5 January 2022 (EST)

We are not going to pretend that these are completely separate from the Generation 1 characters. Put up a suite or a "see [X] article for more information" because it is completely ridiculous to pretend that Cloud is it's own little continuity. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:38, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I disagree. Cloud should be split off entirely. So let's have an official vote and resolve this. I say '''Split'''. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 10:28, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::The articles have already been split. You'll forgive me if I don't show confidence in the decision from people who blew me off when I pointed out their original reason for splitting was incorrect (that supposedly the Almanac had come out before Cloud was truly explained, but in fact it had come after almost all of it had been published). [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:35, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::This discussion has been open for twelve days. An unofficial tally shows at least 7-to-1 in favor of splitting. No one else has openly agreed with your position. Given that, and that Saix announced days in advance he would start splitting if there was no further discussion, it wasn't unreasonable for him to begin. But maybe there's a different split of opinions on the Discord or wherever, so it's certainly appropriate to ask for an official vote. Beyond that...the decision is just not up to you alone. The point of democracy is for all voices to be heard, not to leave every voice feeling satisfied with the outcome. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] ([[User talk:Xaaron|talk]]) 11:08, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::I have no idea what's going on in the Discord server; I'm barred from it. I certainly hope there's not more discussion going on over there, because I was told that there would be a push to have these sorts of big discussions to be on the wiki. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:42, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::With all due respect: You need to stop putting so much emphasis on the in-universe designation, which AVP itself pointed out was ultimately arbitrary. I understand that AVP and the Almanacs are important to you, but Jim is not infallible, and while I'm sure he had good reasons for calling it "Primax" that's ultimately just ''his opinion''. Cloud being "its own thing" isn't some essential property; it's a matter of how to organise the wiki in order to make the fiction clear. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:47, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:I also vote '''Split''' if only because of how better translations now has pointed out various past errors/assumptions/presumptions that needed correcting, and thus updating is needed so as to make things easier to categorize and organize here. Any wiki really worth their salt and wanting to do proper service to their respective franchises' fandoms would do the same. --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] ([[User talk:Lonegamer78|talk]]) 14:43, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::I ''still'' haven't got an answer for what makes Cloud so different that makes it ''need'' to be split. If there were a crossover between say, Marvel and Sunbow, nobody in their right mind we should completely separate, say, Huffer from Huffer. I'm willing to admit that I might just be missing something, but nothing in the stories themselves, as far as I can see, suggests it, beyond the aforementioned Cloud World classification, which for me is not enough of a justification. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:33, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::Neither Marvel nor Sunbow consists primarily of crossovers with another G1 continuity. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:20, 8 January 2022 (EST)
::::If that's the main avenue of justification then frankly I don't think I'm ever going to agree with that line of reasoning, but I can clearly see I'm outvoted on this. I wish there would have been more people asked before the split was done, though, because I can see that this could very easily end up being another whole "retitling things to FSRLF" situation. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:00, 8 January 2022 (EST)
:::We functionally split out Marvel and Sunbow versions for a lot of characters anyway. We're at the point where we draw lines based on how easy/hard it is for the information to be conveyed, not whether it's G1 enough or not. We think Cloud, as its own fullblown storyline/premise, falls on the side of "it's easier to read and parse it if they get their own shebang" instead of burying them in overlong G1 articles. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 21:11, 8 January 2022 (EST)

I'm not gonna argue further on this because I recognize it's a losing battle, but I think that the line of thought of "this one bit of media shouldn't be kept in an article because it won't get out there otherwise" sets a bad precedent that could easily be misused in the future. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 23:39, 8 January 2022 (EST)

Should the Cloud toys also be removed from the G1 character's pages? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 09:21, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:Yeah no, It vould be too convoluted, example look at the redirections [[Transformers_Cloud#Toys|there]]... where should each toy be redirected?? + the fiction regarding said toys has their own page now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 10:58, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::...What on earth are you talking about? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:16, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::Srry I misread his question.. I thought he meant "added" not "removed" from the G1 pages...
:Not entirely certain what you're asking, but the eight toys in the Cloud toyline (plus Deadlock) have already been moved to the Cloud pages in conjunction with the fiction, as they solely represent Cloud characters. The remaining Cloud characters repurpose existing toys. The writeups for those toys remain on the original pages with duplicates on the repurpose pages, as is standard practice. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:54, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::I mean, for example, [[Blaster_(G1)/toys#Generations|G1 Blaster's toy page]] has FOC Blaster on it, due to FOC Blaster being repurposed as Cloud Blaster. Should that repurposing be removed from G1 Blaster's page, since Cloud Blaster isn't considered to be G1 Blaster anymore? [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 12:34, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::I believe yeah, the splitting between G1 and Cloud was recent (done last month) so there's still leftover traces on the wiki, if you can take your time to remove them why not -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 16:44, 17 February 2022 (EST)
::::Ok, good. I just wanted to check I wasn't missing anything. [[User:Omegatron|Omegatron]] ([[User talk:Omegatron|talk]]) 17:13, 17 February 2022 (EST)
:::::Oh! Yes those should go, good eye! -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 10:52, 18 February 2022 (EST)

==Split Movie Character Toy lists?==
Just as what happened with [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys]] and [[Megatron (G1)/toys]], I suggest we split certain Movie toy pages such as [[Bumblebee (Movie)/toys]] and [[Optimus Prime (Movie)/toys]] as both pages have become excessively bloated. I suggest we separate them by having the original Bay film toylines (07, ROFT, DOTM, AOE, TLK, and any pre SS sub lines) have their own page and starting a new one that Contains SS, BB, and the upcoming ROTB toylines, alongside any future movie toylines until the new page itself becomes heavily bloated [[User:Paladin Denn|Paladin Denn]] ([[User talk:Paladin Denn|talk]]) 18:43, 5 January 2022 (EST)
:Sorry for being this late but given that ROTB toys are apparently coming this spring, I suggest you split like one part contains all 5 movies while the other starts with SS and BB until now -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 15:26, 22 January 2022 (EST)

== Multi-part comic stories ==

For old Marvel UK multi-part stories like [[Target: 2006]] or [[Time Wars]], we put the whole thing under a single article, but for modern-day ones like each storyline in [[Transformers (2019 comic)]] we have a separate article for each issue. Is there a good reason for the discrepancy, or are the old ones just an artefact of a time in the wiki's history that didn't follow our current standards? --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:36, 22 January 2022 (EST)
:The thing with that is that it's a result of how the UK comic was written; there'd be about 8 or so pages per issue, meaning that we'd have a lot of little articles that are easier just grouped together. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 10:16, 22 January 2022 (EST)
::Makes sense, although that's essentially what we have for [[The Transformers: Autocracy]] et al., which are also 8 pages per issue. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 15:38, 23 January 2022 (EST)
:::The difference with Autocracy lies mostly in that pretty much all of those issues have a beginning and end, and also have different titles. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 15:47, 23 January 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I always thought our headings on the Marvel UK story pages ''were'' the issue titles. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 01:21, 24 January 2022 (EST)

== Composite characters and page transclusion ==

This is something I've had the idea about for a while, but I've finally had a look at how the markup for it works and have come up with a proposal. The pages for [[Greatshot]] and [[Sixshot (G1)]] contain an entirely duplicated section set around the ''Victory'' cartoon owing to a retcon that occurred in the much later Legends manga. This is not an ideal solution because, among other reasons, any edits to Greatshot's cartoon section necessitates making the same edit to Sixshot's section.

Over in my sandbox, I've whipped up the page [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test]], containing only the events that happened to both Greatshot and the retconned Sixshot. By inserting <nowiki>{{:User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot-test}}</nowiki> into the relevant parts of Greatshot and Sixshot's pages (also sandboxed [[User:TheLastGherkin/Greatshot|here]] and [[User:TheLastGherkin/Sixshot|here]]), the same information is automatically transcluded. And clicking "Edit" on, for example, the Legends manga section on Sixshot's page automatically redirects the user to editing that portion of Greatshot-test, thus updating all three pages at once.

If we go forward with this, I can see it being used for other characters in similar situations, like BWU [[Wolfang (Maximal)#Beast Wars: Uprising|Wolfang]], or Unite Warriors [[Roller (IDW)#Unite Warriors|Roller]], or putting the lion's share (pun intended) of [[Victory Leo]]'s fictional appearances back onto Victory Leo's page. With refinements, like say a <nowiki><noinclude></nowiki> explanation for what each subpage is for the layperson ("This page covers the events of the Japanese Generation 1 continuity, where Greatshot and Sixshot are the same individual...") and maybe a [[:Category:Transcluded pages]], I could see this really working, and it could probably be bent into shape for repurposed toys as well. [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 12:48, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:If we cannot avoid this sort of duplicated information entirely, this does seem like a pretty ideal solve to mitigate the constant peril of copy editing flubs maintaining multiple copies of one write-up entails. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:56, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Is there any way to get rid of the "This section is transcluded from another page. To edit it, please edit the transcluded page." notice? [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:06, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:::There is! I just put that there manually while experimenting and also to make clear where the transcluded section is. In practice, since clicking "Edit" on a transcluded section takes you to the source page, a notice like that can be relegated to a commented-out note for editors who click to Edit the entire page (or a larger section). [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 16:16, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::::Oh, I thought it was automatic software stuff. Whoops, never mind. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 16:22, 10 February 2022 (EST)
::Also, this works for fiction, but I see it running into issues when it comes to toys. (Thinking of Sixshot/Greatshot, Sixshot always gets toys first with Greatshot as the retool later in the same line.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:14, 10 February 2022 (EST)
:I've made some tweaks to my sandboxes, including standardising the transcluded page. Are there any objections before I start implementing this (in fiction sections)? [[User:TheLastGherkin|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin|talk]]) 07:10, 12 February 2022 (EST)
::I sense that there could be an issue in the future where, for whatever reason, these sorts of characters diverge back into separate ones, whether it be through alternate continuities or whatever. Also, in the case of Greatshot, I feel like at the very beginning of his entry, there has to be something different to set up the Sixshot retcon, and just having the same opening text doesn't do that. 08:57, 12 February 2022 (EST)
:::His toy bio that mentions Sixshot as a separate person could go there. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 00:21, 16 February 2022 (EST)
:This could also be applied to Primus and Vector Sigma for their 3H comics sections since they are one and the same in that continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 19:26, 26 February 2022 (EST)

== What makes a franchise? Or, does "Precursor World" exist? ==

So, browsing around the wiki, as one does, and came across this: [[Precursor World (franchise)]]

Now, I'm not as well-versed in the Legends + Selects comics, so maybe this is incorrect, but to the best of my understanding, the branding "Precursor World" doesn't exist — this story was told across Generations Selects and Legends, and no toy or story was ever released branded as "Precursor World". It doesn't seem like the name even existed until pretty recently.

This...isn't a franchise, right? It's a long-running story told across various medium, but it's not a franchise, and calling it such implies something that isn't true.

Particularly, the idea that there is a "toyline" seems a bit of a stretch. There are only three listed "official" toys, but none of them were released under the "Precursor World" branding (which near as I can tell does not exist) and the list of "repurposings" seems almost entirely just "this toy/characters showed up in this story" which doesn't seem like anything's been repurposed to me. The IDW comics used a bunch of existing/prior toys, but that doesn't create a toyline of that comic series.

Am I off base here? --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:16, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:Okay there's a lot to unpack here but to begin with every single one of those toys is being repurposed as a separate object/character in a separate setting a la, for example, [[Green Tender Convoy]] and the [[Matrix Buster|Red Matrix]]. Most of the unnamed crowdfillers are minimized to footnotes on existing articles to avoid generating a bazillion stubs. The closest analogue I can give you is the [[Transformers: Shattered Glass (toyline)|toyline]] for the original ''Timelines'' iteration of Shattered Glass. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 12:35, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I'll grant that those indeed seem to be repurposings, but the vast majority of toys on this list merely link to the toy entry for the toy on the regular character's page. I don't think having a list of members of these groups is bad (it's good!) but I don't think this is a toyline. Again, crucially, Shattered Glass has a brand, with the official toys released under that brand, whereas precursor world does not. IDW repurposed WfC/FoC/aligned toys as G1 characters, but this didn't create a virtual toyline associated with that comic. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 12:46, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:::Arguably Shattered Glass toys weren't really released under their own brand either until the recent Hasbro Pulse stuff, until then the figures were all just released under the ''Timelines'' banner or whatever else Fun Pub used at the time - the idea of a singular "Shattered Glass toyline" was just as much of a constructed idea until like a year ago. I can't say "franchise" and "toyline" ''aren't'' slightly more non-literal labels than usual in this context, but I do think there's value in having the info collated like this, and I can't think of ''better'' labels that aren't something stupid like "(meta franchise)". [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 12:57, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::::To be honest, I'm inclined to agree re: Shattered Glass, and would not be opposed to restructuring the toyline page to delineate between the "Shatted Glass Collection" and "Shattered Glass toys released via Timelines" or something. Shattered Glass does, however, have a leg up on Precursor World given that every official SG toy was branded as "Shattered Glass" in some way, though perhaps not as a "franchise". The box set is called Shattered Glass, and every official toy was called "Shattered Glass". There's some nuance there, of course, as arguably those are part of the character's names ala "Prime Universe Bulkhead" is still a Legacy toy, not a Prime toy, but I'd be happy to have a debate around the best way to frame Shattered Glass stuff given those discrepancies. Allll that said, Shattered Glass is today a franchise, but there have been zero anythings released with Precursor World branding or labeling. --[[User:Spectre|Spectre]] ([[User talk:Spectre|talk]]) 13:06, 3 March 2022 (EST)

::I don't think the page should be removed or even severely modified, but I do think the terminology is flawed. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 16:02, 3 March 2022 (EST)
Precursor World is definitely not a "franchise" and should not have that label. The model to look at here is the [[Beast Wars: Uprising]] article, which gives an overview of the thing, lists it's stories and toys, but does not use the "franchise" label, and doesn't ''need'' to use it. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] ([[User talk:KilMichaelMcC|talk]]) 15:07, 3 March 2022 (EST)

Yeah, no, this is not a "franchise", and the page should not be labeled as such. It is a ''setting''. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)

:I like the solution that AzimuthAcolyte gave on Discord: move "Precursor World (franchise)" to "Precursor World continuity" (with all uses of the word "franchise" changed to "continuity") and "Precursor World (toyline)" to "List of Precursor World toys". Simple and elegant. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 18:55, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Seconded.[[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
:::That seems reasonable to me. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 19:00, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::::I'm for that. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 19:04, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::That's fair. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 23:59, 3 March 2022 (EST)
::Works for me, somewhat obviously! If there are no major objections over the next day or two I'll get those moved over. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:48, 4 March 2022 (EST)
::Ohhh, That works -[[User:MahXyme|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme|talk]]) 18:19, 4 March 2022 (EST)
Alrighty as it's been a day or so with no objections I am proceeding with the moves away from (franchise) and (toyline). --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 18:06, 5 March 2022 (EST)

== Episode Order ==
It's come to my attention that all cartoons have been listed in production order '''except''' Beast Wars, RID01, RB, and RBA. While I understand production order is not available for the latter two I suggest we change the first two for consistency's sake - Unless I'm wrong and they are ''not'' all in production order. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:48, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:We're not touching Beast Wars. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
::Beast Wars and RiD'01 not being in production order are accepted exceptions to the norm. We leave them as they are for reasons specific to each. But as for RB and RBA, we do have an idea of the production orders for each, but we instead use a weird mixture of production order and airing order that is consistent with no other series we cover. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 13:53, 16 March 2022 (EDT)
:OK quick correction to myself, turns out that it's all supposed to be chronological order; That just happens to be production order for everything but those four. Sorry! [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 14:09, 16 March 2022 (EDT)

==Help with statues / figurines==
I wrote up many of the [[Transformers ULTIMATES!|ULTIMATES!]] entries, simply because no one else had. I don't actually care about that sort of merch and it ended up being me paraphrasing from press releases and copying their pics. Just today I learned there are 3 waves of TF [[Minimates]] that have no coverage here at all. It definitely seems like a lot of high-end statues are falling through the cracks as well. Is there someone who is willing to make that stuff more of a project? If not, could we perhaps put out a call for submissions on our Twitter feed? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:47, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I fear this is just... going to continue to be an Issue. The wiki is a labor of love, and the brand is at a point where there's a lot of stuff out there... well, that a lot of people probably aren't gonna love. Hasbro's moichandized the everloving HELL out of TF over the years, with more and more niche "G1" stuff that seemingly would never appeal to people for whom G1 is the big center of their fandom. I mean I just found some Micro Figures merch at a Big Lots, I've never seen these before, and I don't know offhand if they're on the wiki. They're kind of a nothing. It's hard to keep up. Same for stuff like phone games. 
:I don't know if there's an actual solution. ''Someone'' certainly needs to step up, but I kinda got my plate overflowing with my own pet (ha ha) niche chunk of TF history to exhaustively document, never mind dealing with stuff I am almost aggressively disinterested in. (Seriously what little Minimates experience I have left me with a worse impression of them than I already had from their hideous aesthetic alone.) Asking Twitter for people more well-versed in this stuff might could help for phone games, but... IS there anyone into Minimates as a whole Brand and not just in a "I get the licenses I like" sense to fill in gaps? --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 21:20, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::Once I had composed the thought "Hey, it's bad that there are a lot of Minimates out with us not covering them at all," it was too late, and I just had to burn 40 minutes on some cut-and-paste writups for the entire series. That's one "solution," I guess, but even ''my'' obsessive-compulsiveness can only go so far. Editing this site really should not feel like a job... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:18, 22 March 2022 (EDT)

==Implementing galleries==
I propose making galleries on character pages a wiki standard. The current mainpic + show screenshots format doesn't cover images like character models (Unless used as a mainpic), concept art, appearances in posters or toy murals, comic book covers, etc.
Other wikis have successfully implemented galleries, I think the Hololive Wiki galleries in particular work well as an example https://hololive.wiki/wiki/Tokino_Sora#Media.
This gallery header covers character models and has suites for concept art and even character uses in collaborative merch.[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:27, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Seconded. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 13:30, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:I would say some version of this concept for a section has merit, if nothing else as a solve for major characters with several prominent character models, perhaps as a fairly unobtrusive method of documenting alt modes, etc etc. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:38, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::I'm for this. As a good example, the BotBots characters all look to have been radically redesigned for the show. By default the current standard is to keep the original stock art look will appear as the mainpic each page. Having a gallery option would be a good way to show both versions. [[User:ParadoxFactor|ParadoxFactor]] ([[User talk:ParadoxFactor|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:Oppose. There is no reason for these to take up space on the character pages. Would not oppose separate "gallery" pages. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:57, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::If we are open to workshopping implementation I do agree a separate "gallery page" in the style we already use for more conceptual articles here and there would probably be cleaner. --[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 14:06, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I love the gallery idea. There's a question of how much to include, and the exact implementation details of how to portion out overflow if there's too many images. It's a shame there isn't some way to generate them automatically just by tagging images with the characters they depict. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 14:24, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::A separate page seems like it would be overkill for someone like [[Flamewar (G1)|Flamewar]], who would only take a few images to cover appearances not already covered by fiction section images. I assume if a small gallery was to be used on a character's page, it would be near the bottom at any rate? --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 15:22, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Yes, at the bottom would be ideal, no different from any of the galleries on our artist pages. IMO, separate gallery pages should only be used in instances where the number of images can't be comfortably fit onto one or two lines. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:33, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::I agree with Cyberlink. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 16:29, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
:::Fair; Using gallery sections for those with few images and gallery pages for those with many images might make sense. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 15:46, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
::::See [[Megatron (G1)/gallery|G1 Megatron]] and [[Megatron (BW)/gallery|BW Megatron]] for examples of characters with enough images to justify separate gallery pages. [[Rhinox (BW)/gallery|BW Rhinox]], as it is now, is probably right on the line between "split it off" and "stick it at the bottom of the page". -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 15:58, 21 March 2022 (EDT)
I think choosing between a header at the bottom or a suite depending on image amount is a good solution instead of sticking to just one method.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 11:29, 22 March 2022 (EDT)
:Yeah, I think that would be good, as has been pointed out earlier. I do have to ask - because sometimes the artistic difference between characters in comics is slight with details only a little different in shape or kibble - would those fall under gallery stuff? Because they're effectively different per artist interpretation. I would be inclined to say yes, because effectively a different artist's rendition is shown usually of the same character without having reformatted or taken up armor or so forth. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 10:56AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I am very much on board with this idea. Having a gallery section or page depending on the character would be great, especially for characters like Flamewar who have a extremely prominent new design that we can't use as a main pic and for characters who have tons of designs, especially in the case of IDW where some characters change bodies every Tuesday. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:35 AM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I think artistic liberty vs. new design would have to be on a case by case basis. Burcham's art of the BW cast wouldn't count for gallery purposes, in my opinion. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:08, 27 March 2022 (EDT)
:::I think it would be cool to have art of the same designs in different artstyles, but I agree it should probably be on case by case basis. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 6:17 PM 27 March 2022 (PDT)
::I currently have a sandbox to test galleries using Tigatron https://tfwiki.net/wiki/User:MrRald/sandbox/Tigatron#Gallery. I'd appreciate any feedback on things to add or change! [[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 23:44, 1 April 2022 (EDT)
::: I like what you have so far, I think we should maybe add a few more versions of Tigatron, like his different comic appearances and such. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]])

: Now that we're actually going ahead with this... I have to ask, what are the galleries actually ''for''? When we were discussing this I was under the impression that they were going to be for "behind-the-scenes" images that wouldn't otherwise have a place on the wiki, like out-of-universe character models, character concept art, or full-body renders from stuff like guidebooks. Right now, a lot of the galleries just feel redundant, given that they're just a bunch of cartoon and comic screengrabs taken from the relevant section and removed of all context... and a lot of them, like [[Blaster (G1)/gallery]] are just completely empty. The fact that every character ''can'' have a gallery does not mean that all of them ''should'', especially if most of them are just going to be redundant or mostly empty. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 18:57, 4 August 2022 (EDT)
::Agreed, I feel like this is bloating the wiki and toeing over the line of our vague remit. Despite having a LOT of images, we're not an image repository. Also, a lot of these could probably be done as a single subsection of the characters' mainpage under below "Notes" of whatever rather than as separate mostly-blank-space sub-pages full of sub-headers with like two images total in them. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 06:11, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, I didn't think they'd be separate pages. What I was expecting was whichever of the cartoon character model, Dreamwave profile art or package art weren't being used for the mainpic, plus behind-the-scenes stuff, plus maybe extra bits from artbooks, covers, or sources like that. Stuff that can't just be slotted into a fiction writeup—and I don't mean "comic crops we don't have room for because equivalent/better panels are already in the fiction section". —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:35, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
My intentions for the gallery pages were for users to actually do the work in uploading character models, renders, et al., not dumping whatever cartoon screencaps we already have in fiction sections. And separate pages would be on a case by case basis. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:46, 5 August 2022 (EDT)
I don't see the point, honestly. It seems like pretty much any significant body a significant enough character has will appear on the wiki at some point in a comic panel or a toy info image or a screenshot or something, somewhere. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs solving. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] ([[User talk:Hooper X|talk]]) 20:36, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

===G1 model images===
To branch off of this topic, how would we feel about using [https://www.allspark.com/forums/threads/the-most-accurately-coloured-g1-animation-models-online.301/ DM's coloured models] for the G1 cartoon model galleries? The last time I brought this topic up (on Discord), some people were against the idea, due to them being fan-colour works and not official, but a few newer developments have been made since I last brought it up.

To clarify, for those unaware of DM's works:

* All of the line art is original and unedited (unlike several of the models in ''The Ark'' books, which had been tweaked, altered and traced by Bill Forster to make them presentable for publishing).
* The models are the final ones used throughout the majority of the cartoon (in Toei-animated episodes at least). Note: several of the models in ''The Ark'' books we have also come to discover were unfinalized ones, due to the internet and more stuff being made public since what was originally found around 2007—not to discredit Jim and Bill's hard work in putting those books together, it's just some of what we knew then isn't entirely correct now.
* And finally, the colours (which was the big thing some people were against). Unlike the handful of fan-coloured models that were originally uploaded to the wiki in the past, which eye dropped colors straight from poor quality episode masters, DM's colours are based directly on Toei and Marvel Productions' model colour guides, colour codes, charts, colour chips found by a member of the ''Dragon Ball'' fandom (who has scanned and digitized said colour chips) and other original production materials, meaning that the colours DM has used are all coming from the ''original'' original source.

An alternative Mr. Rald had brought up on Discord is that we could possibly look at using the uncoloured model line art instead, if people feel strongly against using fan-coloured works, but I think in order to present the G1 character models fully as references, you kinda need the colours included, especially given how poor the cartoon production was, what with all the animation errors (even in Toei episodes) etc, making it hard to gather decent references for the characters, which is mostly what these galleries are for.

Also, for the record, DM has given us permission to use his colourings on the wiki.

Let me know you thoughts. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 01:39, 6 April 2022 (EDT)

: I personally think that we should use DM's coloured models, they are as official as coloured models are going to get, and it's not like DM just randomly picked and chose want colours to use as FOCS said. We could just have the model and the colour guide, but at that point, just have the model sheet coloured. I would however be in favour of the uncoloured models with colour guides and the sheets with the fully coloured models to cover all our bases. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 11:16 AM, 6 April 2022 (PDT)

== Making a page for the Unreal Engine? ==

War for Cybertron, Dark of the Moon (PS3/X360), Fall of Cybertron, and Rise of the Dark Spark all run on Unreal Engine, specifically Unreal Engine 3. Why isn't there a page for it. It could have good info on those wanting to mod those games.

Unrelated, but there's a server revival project being worked on for those games. Right now it's only on PC, and progress is slow, but should we include info for it in the pages for those games? It's not official btw, there's a Discord server for it and a few YouTube vids about it.[[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]]) 17:29, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not sure what information we could put on an Unreal Engine page that would be useful to modders. An Unreal Engine page would be general info on the engine and a list of games which use it. Diving into technical details isn't really something we do. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 17:52, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I think linking to {{W|Unreal Engine|Wikipedia}} should be sufficient. That's what I did when I ''unfortunately'' had to document the Funko NFTs. [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 19:11, 24 March 2022 (EDT)
:I don't see what value there would be to this. Unreal warrants, at ''most'', a mention on the relevant game pages. We don't have pages for every program used to make every piece of TF media/product. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:33, 24 March 2022 (EDT)

== Category for characters with no established gender ==

So I just had this idea and decided to share it here because why not? We have categories for female characters and variable gender characters but not for characters with undetermined genders. Many BotBots for example don't have genders and I think this category could be a useful way of grouping them together. And who knows, maybe someday it could even help official creators specifically looking for genderless characters to establish a gender to them. Does anyone agree to implement this category? -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:06, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:This concept has been discussed before in the past, and generally the feeling has been that this would be a bit too much like the wiki actively trying to shape canon. Don't get me wrong, creators taking advantage of characters with no official pronouns is neat and I'm all for it, but IMO the wiki shouldn't directly serve up them. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 19:26, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
::Interestingly, I can't seem to find a prior community portal discussion about this matter, though I know it has come up on the Discord server more than once, to the conclusion Jalaguy mentioned. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 19:35, 3 April 2022 (EDT)
:::Just to clarify, I thought of "official creators using it" as a quick example in favor of the category, but now I can totally see how it sounded like trying to influence canon too much. Regardless, I'd still be down for having the category if we agreed on it being useful for any other reason. -- [[User:Fritz|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz|talk]]) 19:51, 3 April 2022 (EDT)

== Category for trans characters ==

We had a productive conversation about the no established gender thing on the wiki discord and it made me realize that there should be a transgender category for the five established trans characters that there are so far, Arcee (who has established trans characterization on two different pages), Howlback, Arcadis, Anode, and Lug. Jalaguy mentioned that this has been discussed and people thought it was a good idea but it hasn't happened, so I just thought I'd ask for go-ahead on this. I figured that transgender rather than just trans could be a good word to use for this, due to them all being people who have gender. The term trans is merely more broad and could cover different kinds of transness than that or aesthetic stuff that is similar to gender, but we have no confirmation of being there yet in canon. Thus I think transgender would be the most accurate and desirable term here, and the umbrella trans can always be tacked on later if we need to. --[[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 5:40PM 3 April 2022 (PDT) (edited 5:48PM PDT for clarity)
:Seconded. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 5:53 PM, 3 April 2022 (PDT)
::Since there are no objections, I'll go ahead. :3 -- [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 4:19AM, 11 April 2022 (PDT)

==Streamlining disambig headers (revist)==
So I remember this conversation from last year about streamlining the disambiguation headers. I checked back on the talk page discussion (link to said discussion archive here https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal/Archive69#Streamlining_disambig_headers) to see what happened and even though there was a lot of people who liked the idea with some who did not, it did not seem like it went anywhere. I thought I'd see if anyone else would like to revisit this idea as I feel like this would streamline things more, especially for Movie and Aligned and maybe a bit of UT especially for the guys who show up in all 3 shows or those don't have other bots who are completely different sharing the same name within the trilogy. -- [[User:ComfyBlanket|ComfyBlanket]] ([[User:ComfyBlanket|talk]]) 9:01 PM, 12 April 2022 (PDT)

== Disambig tags and suites for Masterforce paired pages ==

We need to balance out our page titles for ''Masterforce'' human + transtector character pairs. Right now we have among extant pages and tentative redlinks:

Bullhorn (G1), Cab (human), Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (human), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (robot), [something], Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (robot)

I propose either we do human gets no species tag with the robot getting a species tag as the splinter page:

Bullhorn (G1) | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

or the human does get a species tag to equally balance with the robot:

Bullhorn (G1)/human | Bullhorn (G1)/robot

This would eliminate the need to have any longer-within-parentheses tag like "Minerva (G1 robot)" which would be affected by future continuities which may not yet have happened. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 15:55, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
:I would prefer either the human gets the "default" continuity tag with no further disambiguation or (human)/(robot) (with needed variations for disambiguation). The slash system is ugly to me. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 15:59, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::I'm of the opinion that the slash option for both feels the most fair. While the human versions were the first and thus feel the most deserving of the "default" tag, the robot versions are likely to become more commonplace and relevant as newer fiction dips its toes into using more Japanese characters. On a similar note, it was decided not to give the "BW" tag to either BW Silverbolt out of fairness, so while a similar "human/robot" concept could be implemented, there is the problem with Minerva having an Animated counterpart who is also a robot, Cancer having an Animated counterpart who is also a human, there being a Kre-O Bullhorn who is also a robot, a G.I. Joe Lightfoot who is also a human, and an IDW Wilder who is also a human. "Minerva (Headmaster)" also doesn't work for the G1 robot since the human was a Headmaster too. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 16:29, 22 April 2022 (EDT)
::The slash system may not be entirely visually pleasant, but I consider having "Minerva (G1 robot)" in parentheses worse. In my proposal, all transtector characters would be unified symmetrically as "(robot)". [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 17:47, 24 April 2022 (EDT)

Here are three proposals to unify the namespaces:

Possibility 1: humans get nothing and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1), Cab, Cancer (G1), Clouder, Ginrai, Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1), Minerva (G1), Ranger, Road King, Wilder (G1)

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 2: both humans and robots get slashes

Bullhorn (G1)/human, Cab/human, Cancer (G1)/human, Clouder/human, Ginrai/human, Shūta Gō/human, Lightfoot (G1)/human, Minerva (G1)/human, Ranger/human, Road King/human, Wilder (G1)/human

Bullhorn (G1)/robot, Cab/robot, Cancer (G1)/robot, Doubleclouder, Ginrai/robot, Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1)/robot, Minerva (G1)/robot, Ranger/robot, Road King/robot, Wilder (G1)/robot

Possibility 3: both humans and robots get parentheses

Bullhorn (G1 human), Cab (human), Cancer (G1 human), Clouder, Ginrai (human), Shūta Gō, Lightfoot (G1 human), Minerva (G1 human), Ranger (human), Road King (human), Wilder (G1 human)

Bullhorn (G1 robot), Cab (robot), Cancer (G1 robot), Doubleclouder, Ginrai (robot), Goshooter, Lightfoot (G1 robot), Minerva (G1 robot), Ranger (robot), Road King (robot), Wilder (G1 robot)

Thoughts? [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 01:12, 12 June 2022 (EDT)
:Isn't Option 1 one basically just a slightly different version of what we're already using and what you're proposing to change in the first place? Anyway, like I said above, Option 2 is the most fair between the human and robot depictions (as Option 1 feels like we're saying "The human versions are the more important versions" when it's the robot versions that are more likely to get any representation in future comic appearances), and it reduces the amount of multiple-word parentheses tags that we usually dislike using and try to avoid as best we can (which is the exact opposite of what Option 3 is proposing). Though, drop the "/human" from Clouder and Shūta Gō since their names already differ from "Doubleclouder" and "Goshooter". No need to complicate those two. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 08:45, 12 June 2022 (EDT)

==Transformers: Armada (Trading Card Collection)==
I recently discovered that Fleer published a Trading Card collection in 2003 for Transformers Armada.
I've documented everything I could find about it - including an Energon (preview) Scorponok card I got from a local retro game store.
[[Iacon0/Sandbox]]
Is it alright if I roll this out? [[User:Iacon0|Iacon0]] ([[User talk:Iacon0|talk]]) 12:52, 1 May 2022 (EDT)

== WFC/FOC Reenergized Server Project info? ==

Info: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLO5yzrWE9yVT56Rgxl9oqntVysxWr2k7e

Basically, it brings back the multiplayer servers for the Cybertron games, PC and PS3. Should this be talked about in the pages for those games? (ROTDS and ROTF aren't online at the moment, and 360 versions won't have support) [[User:Trashatron|Trashatron]] ([[User talk:Trashatron|talk]])}
:It's not official, so no, it shouldn't. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:54, 27 June 2022 (EDT)

== Handling of "former GoBots" and "former Diaclone" characters on the wiki ==

So recently we've been seeing multiple characters that had previously been portrayed as dimension-hoppers from non-Transformers realities, but using Transformers designs — [[Bug Bite (GoBots)]], [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]] and [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]] — appearing as "normal" Transformers ([[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]], [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]]). There's some heavy dispute over whether we should put them on the same page or split them out (e.g. "since the GoBots Bug Bite isn't ''originally'' from a G1 universe, he shouldn't go on the G1 Bug Bite page), so I thought we should probably have a centralised place to put together a comprehensive set of standards.

My take, personally, is that GoBots and Diaclone are *not* continuity families, they're their own properties that happen to cross over with Transformers, and so shouldn't be split on that basis. I feel that Burn Out and Lift-Ticket, regardless of them being portrayed as Diaclone mecha in their initial appearance, are the same basic concept as the likes of Road Rage and Tigertrack — "Transformers versions" of existing Diaclone toys and decoes. It helps that [[Spin-Out (G1)]] inherently blurs the lines, having first appeared as a "normal" Transformer ''before'' he was portrayed as a former Diaclone mech.

For the GoBots characters, I'd frankly be tempted to go even more radical and just merge ''all'' of them — put all the [[Cy-Kill (disambiguation)|Cy-Kill]] cameos on one page, like we do for other external property characters. Even in the edge cases like [[Fracture (Movie)|Fracture]], there's the precedent of her actually being intended as just ''being'' the GoBot. It feels a lot simpler to me than the headache of having Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, and Bug Bite, the ''other'' white Bumblebee who appeared in G1 stories, having separate pages on a technicality. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:57, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Hard disagree on GoBots. By virtue of covering the Scioli comic in full, we have a GoBots continuity family to put them in. I say keep the ones who are explicitly GoBots at (GoBots), and put the ones who are Transformers (or ambiguous) at their respective continuity families. Basically, what we're doing for Bug Bite, do for all of them. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:23, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:I don't agree on movie-Fracture in specific and the mass-merge of ''all'' GoBots-based characters in general. Fracture's a movie-universe character who premiered in a movie-based toyline and appeared in movie-timeline fiction. "The toy was originally conceived as" holds very little water there in light of all the rest of that. I'm not wild about merging characters from different continuity families (aka "major franchise umbrellas", the point of that divide was always less "fiction-detail based" and more "real-world Hasbro/Takara starting over based" as an organizational tool), as that leans heavily towards the Wikipedia style "just lump 'em all together" manner that... doesn't really work for our scope. There's SG Bug Bite and Crasher too, I don't think they should go under a giant singular page for the character concept.
: But ''in general'' I agree with keeping stuff like Lift-Ticket and Burn Out together because the distinction is really too nitpicky to be useful. If we get an EarthSpark Lift-Ticket who is a red Hoist-like bot, then they can go on a separate page because "new major franchise umbrella" gives a decent degree of separation. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:25, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: Oh, well, the SG GoBots are an obvious exception. If it's a "mirror universe" I feel like it should never share a page because the point is that it's the opposite.
:: That said, there are other nuances I admit I skimmed over — stuff like Wings Universe Cop-Tur, who's based on the original but is a secret genius and a good guy, I'm not sure he should be merged in. At the same time, though, splitting the Bug Bites feels disingenuous, and I'm not sure whether there's a good middle ground between "split 'em all" and "merge 'em all". --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:44, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I also agree there isn't really a good middle ground. But here's the thing: If GoBots wasn't a factor and it was just G1 and Cyberverse, we wouldn't be having this conversation. At the end of the day, they're from another IP, but they're also genuine Transformers characters, and thus they should remain split like other Transformers characters. And that includes treating the genuine GoBot incarnations as separate entities. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:51, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:::I am, honestly, not sold either way on splitting/merging re: the "very distinctly the Tonka GoBots who originated from the Tonka GoBots franchise". I feel that there are '''''definitely''''' some bots that should not be merged with the Tonkas, by virtue of being from different continuity-families/hub-franchises (bots from the live action movies and Cyberverse, for example, should really stay separate). I'm less concerned about "in-fiction origin" because that's a clusterfuck all its own since 1984 best just left alone and we already disregard that for like Nebulans and stuff anyway, though I'd also argue that like, it should be taken into consideration the diff between an homage and an iteration (I'd argue ''Timelines'' Cop-Tur is the former and probably shouldn't be merged). But even just looking at them from the real-world staggered integration of the franchises, GoBots ARE a weird edge case (whaaat, something Scioli was involved in got weird? ''nnnoooOOOOOooooo'') and it kinda feels off to not treat them as a separate thing given their ultimate origins. But like, they are, functionally, "G1" characters as far as "how they were brought to TF" goes in the real world, and I'm not convinced that splitting out WFC Bug Bite is really a good idea or terribly helpful. So like, I dunno. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 02:06, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::::And then there's the ''very'' unique case of GoBots Stretch having been given a retroactive backstory of being born in the world of Transformers Animated before he crossed dimensions and became a GoBot. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] ([[User talk:Sabrblade|talk]]) 02:23, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::::If anything, Stretch is a Transformer pretending to be a GoBot.
:::::The criteria that keep this wiki running and readable have always had some smudgy bits, and if you stare too long at any of them pretty soon all one sees is the smudge, not the dividing line or even the story itself. Cyberverse and Prime are each ''basically'' a retelling of G1, and if they didn't have a few features we've accepted as clear dividers from "real" G1, they could have gone within G1 just as much as the IDW comics have. The divisions are necessary to keep information from being a useless, unstructured, unnavigable mess; hopefully we can draw the lines in a way that comes to require the fewest exceptions later. '''My thoughts''': when there's a Bug Bite whose origin is explicitly "I'm not a Transformer, I'm hiding among them, creatures like myself find Transformers to be nauseating uncanny valley aliens," then that's a pretty extreme division, more extreme than many others we've been holding up for years without controversy, and should stay very much separate from any other Bug Bites who are just plain ol' white car Transformers. The various Cy-Kill cameos in G1 and Armada should stay separate, just because that's how we handle other hi-and-die cameos across firm storyline borders (Animated Overlord, SG Krok). I agreed at first with splitting the Burnouts/Lift-Tickets, but if it is really causing a huge dilemma I do not object to re-merging them. Each pair exists within the G1 storytelling universe. It is not essential that we build 2 different pages for G1 universe Lift-Tickets where one of them is a Diaclone mech and the other looks just like it and comes from someplace called Diaclone. We could paper that over with a "Note" explanation. The really important part is that both the Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket cases must get the same resolution. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 05:10, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:I vote for split. I regret ever pushing for merging similar concepts around the time of ''Ask Vector Prime'' because a decade ago this wouldn't have been a question, it would have been settled with "obvious they're different characters." [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:38, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:Strongly in favor of putting the Diaclones back together so long as they remain essentially G1 guys. Especially since we now have ''two nigh-identical Burn-Out pages that differ only by which sliver of fiction section they possess''. Moderately in favor of putting all the dumb Cy-Kill cameos together because, like, it's only moderately funny to split out Cy-Kill (Armada) on a technicality. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 20:47, 29 July 2022 (EDT)
:: I'm going to stay out of the Bugbite / Fracture question. I'm too involved on the creative side. I think Walky nails it about Burn-Out & Lift-Ticket. And probably the Cy-Kill cameos too. --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 21:11, 29 July 2022 (EDT)

:I have to ask: if this is a concern, why did we split out the Cloud articles a month ago. Because they also are clearly designed to look like G1 characters, and aside from some minor changes in personality and dimension hopping stuff (which also applies to these three examples here), are near-identical in fiction to their Generation 1 counterparts. What makes them different from Bug Bite, Burn Out, and Lift-Ticket? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 11:29, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Lead Cloud translator here. As we discussed in-depth at the time, the Cloud characters do nothing *but* dimension hop and frequently cross over with the Japanese Generation 1 cartoon continuity and their own G1 incarnations, rendering them nigh unintelligible when buried in A-list G1 articles. The Cloud issue was one of logistics and readability, not one on the philosophy of intrinsic "G1-ness," as I believe was said at the time. I would also argue something on the scale of Cloud is a different discussion entirely from the current topic of merging two one-paragraph articles.

::On a most practical level re-merging a thoroughly deliberated and reasonably large scale split from a couple months ago just strikes me as kind of a waste of community resources.

::For those that missed it the impetus was translating the other 80-90% of the prose and the discussion can be found [[Transformers_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal#Splitting_Cloud_characters|here]]. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

Had a brainwave about a potential way to handle the GoBots characters—as a compromise between "treating them like full Transformers characters" and "treating them like external properties", use the GoBots page as a "hub" for the others. I've mocked up a couple of sandboxes for [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Cy-Kill|Cy-Kill]] and [[User:Riptide/Sandbox:Bug Bite|Bug Bite]]. Any thoughts? --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:16, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:If we absolutely have to (which I still really don't agree with) I'd prefer this over full fledged merging. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:02, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:I think this is a good compromise. The important thing is that there's a clear delineation between the dimension-hopping GoBots and native Cybertronians, and I think this fits the bill. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 20:03, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
::I still don't like the idea of rolling in the ''Cyberverse'' Bug Bite or any other not-G1-franchise iterations on the GB character concepts (like movieverse Fracture), even in the proposed super-abridged-and-linked-to-main-article format. For the appearances within the franchise of TF-origin, sure, I think this works. Cy-Kill's multiverse of murder... ehn. I'm not really feeling strongly either way but like we got hi-then-die charcater micropages aplenty, I don't think Cy is something terribly unique to not get them. Like... we got a page for "the many deaths of Optimus Prime", I feel like "the many deaths of Cy-Kill" could probably stand to be its own thing if we REALLY wanted to hammer the point of how stupid and hack it is home. Which, come to think about it, I kinda DO. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:42, 31 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Ah, see, Fracture was something I was specifically thinking of here — I thought it would work to accomodate both the original intent and how she's been tied back to Crasher in <s>Jim's nonsense</s> fan-targeted media while still respecting the practical reality of Fracture as her own, movieverse character. That said, I do understand your reluctance, so if the majority is against this I'm not too fussed. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:22, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, it feels like "Bug Bite, the white Bumblebee" is its own Transformers thing at this point. He may have originated as a GoBots transplant (both in real life and in fiction), but that doesn't automatically make every iteration of Bug Bite a GoBot, any more than every subsequent iteration of Lockdown or Lugnut is considered an Animated character. -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] ([[User talk:Dark T Zeratul|talk]]) 04:34, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::::I appreciate the work Riptide put into this and like the writing / presentation style employed... and I just still don't think it's necessary. Between disambigs and "You Look Familiar...", we already have ways to cope with characters who look alike across different continuities but who aren't the same character. Most of these transplanted GoBots are absolutely not the same characters as each other - most of the Cy-Kill cameos, Cyberverse Bug Bite. There is no need for us to build a new way to unite those cross-continuity characters when nothing unites them more than the "basic concepts" that we've kept separate on hundreds of other name / appearance reuses. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 08:43, 1 August 2022 (EDT)
::I adore this brain blast, over and above what I proposed below (as it actually accommodates, in Cy-Kill's case, say, the ''Armada/TransTech/Animated'' cameos), and think the fact that people on both sides of this polarising issue aren't immediately opposed to it makes it strike me as a really good compromise. I still would prefer the ''Diaclone'' pages to be merged with their G1 counterparts, but whether or not it's a full merge or just the "main article" structure here, the intro phrasing proposed with Cy-Kill and Bug-Bite is perfect in my opinion. The key thing for me is that, when people look up info on Cy-Kill or Burn Out, they still find a pointer to the relevant information at the exact point they'd expect it to be, and not only that, but they can chart the entire conceptual history of the character on one page (I know the disambigs theoretically do the same, but in practise Jo's approach is much more effective). Assuming the same policy isn't applied to ''Uprising'' appearances, I still think something should be done about those—but otherwise I'd be very happy with this. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 06:16, 1 August 2022 (EDT)

So as I understand it, the consensus is that Diaclone characters should share a page with their G1 counterparts, and that — at least for the moment — GoBot characters should be left as-is, with White Bumblebee's G1 adventures split between the GoBot and G1 pages? Would appreciate some more input before we begin implementing this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:09, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:I still don't like the Diaclone thing but clearly I'm outvoted. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 19:48, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
:More or less. I'm fine with rolling G1 WFC Bug Bite in with the explicitly-GoBots one in the manner test-bedded above on the same grounds as the whole "Nebulan/Cybertronian" deal with Targetmaster gun-bots we've done forever; I think the proposed format both works with the way we've handled disparate depictions between different fictions within the same franchise chunk for a very long time now while noting the important real-world issues with these transplanted characters. And it's not like the combo page would be anywhere near big enough to make a split-out necessary. But I'm willing to table that for the moment while moving ahead with rolling the Diaclones back in. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:15, 2 August 2022 (EDT)
::I agree with this completely. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:11, 3 August 2022 (EDT)
:Diaclone characters should share pages with G1 counterparts who are also canonically said to be Diaclone-y. If we ever get a "Gobots Universe Bug Bite" that would be merged too - but just "white car Bug Bite" should not. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:21, 3 August 2022 (EDT)

==Proposal re: G1 pages==
I'm not expecting anything other than a hard "no" on this from the vast majority of editors, but a few people impelled me to post it, so here goes. In particular, I think this perspective is one held by many casual readers of the wiki. As I said over on [[Talk:Burn Out (Diaclone)|Burn Out's talk page]], I think both camps feel a sense of "''obviously'' these are (not) the same character", depending on whether they're coming from a strictly in-universe perspective or not. I want to put that whole discussion into an even broader perspective. Plus, I think the list of characters below is an interesting resource in its own right.

For ages, the wiki's had it so G1 appearances of characters originating in ''Robots in Disguise''—such as [[Sky-Byte (RID)]]—just get put on those pages. My understanding is that RID was considered something of a special case, because of how it was originally conceived as an in-continuity G1 thing, and remained such in Japanese continuity. For a less-prominent example, see also ''[[Power Core Combiners]]'', which similarly lists the IDW G1 appearances of [[Smolder (PCC)]] and [[Steamhammer (PCC)]] just on those pages. Again, this was a special case, because PCC was never concretely established as being a live-action movieverse thing or a G1 thing (which makes sense, because in Hasbro's eyes at the time, that wasn't a distinction that mattered to them).

There are other areas on the wiki that take a continuity-agnostic approach; I think it's just character pages that are handled so strictly. Check out [[Noisemaze Mass Production Type Version]]—which honestly ''is'' a character page in every way that matters—for a recently-made-relevant-again example. For many bigger-picture concept pages, a similar approach is used to great effect: [[Transformation]], [[Scanning]], [[Energon]], [[Protoform]], [[Spark]], [[Living metal]], [[Mini-Con]], [[Energon mutation]], just to grab a few random examples.

To draw attention to one last point, which I predict will resonate a lot with people who already agree with me and not at all with people who don't: any and all ''Beast Wars'' or ''Beast Machines'' original characters are exempt from this issue—despite, on a real-world level, there not really being any difference between those franchises and the likes of ''Armada'' or ''Animated''. It's just the lore connection that keeps it tethered, despite the wiki treating it as its ''own'' continuity family in basically every other way that matters.

My specific proposal is this: '''for characters originating ''outside of G1'', don't keep separate G1 pages.''' Treat those characters as we do Sky-Byte, ignoring the "continuity family" divide, and put the appearances on the page where they're most relevant. Here are the salient benefits of this approach:
*Have all the information on many popular post-G1 characters in the place where most casual readers would expect to look.
*Cut the Gordian knot of the GoBots/Diaclone debate.
*Finally ditch all those (BWU) pages consisting of a single sentence and a duplicated toy entry.
*Fewer redundant toy writeups which need to be maintained in parallel.
*Far, far fewer awkward paragraphs in Notes sections talking about "continuity transplants" like those are a real thing.

Here is a list of pages which I think would be affected, sorted by continuity, just from an hour or so of searching:
*'''''Diaclone''''': [[Lift-Ticket (G1)]], [[Burn Out (G1)]]
*'''''GoBots''''': [[Bug Bite (G1)]], [[Crasher (G1)]], [[Cy-Kill (G1)]], [[Leader-1 (G1)]], [[Rest-Q (G1)]], [[Cop-Tur (G1)]] (!)
*'''''Armada''''': [[Hot Shot (G1)]], [[Red Alert (IDW)]], [[Demolisher (G1)]], [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Sideways (RM)]] (!), [[Treadshot (IDW)]]
*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Override (BWU)]], [[Ransack (IDW)]], [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Signal Lancer (G1)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Barricade (IDW)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Breacher (G1)]], [[Terradive (G1)]], [[Hailstorm (G1)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''Animated''''': [[Bulkhead (G1)]] (!), [[Lugnut (TF 2010)]], [[Lockdown (G1)]], [[Slipstream (G1)]] (!), [[Oil Slick (G1)]], [[Lightbright (G1)]], [[Lickety-Split (G1)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Breakdown (IDW)]], [[Airachnid (G1)]], [[Predaking (Kingdom)]], [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Rescue Bots''''': [[Medix (G1)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Scatterspike (G1)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Headlock (G1)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Transit (G1)]], [[Fracture (Cybertron)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Cyberverse''''': [[Shadow Striker (G1)]], [[Croaton (G1)]], [[Meteorfire (G1)]], [[Wildwheel (G1)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Doomwings (G1)]], [[Ursa Major (G1)]], [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': (deep breath) [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Twirl (G1)]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Sky Blast (G1)]], [[Sureshock (G1)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]
I assuredly missed some, so feel free to edit the lists above to add any other characters that would be affected by this proposal which are omitted!

Again, the vast majority of these are from ''Beast Wars Uprising'', which does have some weird lingering cases that would need further individual discussion, I think: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]]. But for the most part, I really don't see any reason why there should be all these tiny nothing pages; the only reason all those Mini-Cons were not called Mini-Cons is that in the ''Uprising'' universe, Mini-Cons are called Micromasters instead (which is the lore equivalent of "[[Barricade (G1)]] doesn't look like he's made of knives"). This is even ''less'' an irreconcilable lore detail than, for example, the organic/robotic split for Targetmasters and the like. My main goal with sharing this is to revisit the ''Uprising'' policy, because from where I'm sitting, it's resulted in exactly the same horribly inconvenient setup as the ''Diaclone'' stuff. A different, specific policy there would deal with most of the examples above, and I'd be very happy; what I've suggested is just a one-size-fits-all policy.

The weirdest victim of this stated policy, I think, is that of [[Bulkhead (G1)]], who technically originated with Animated, but whose appearances in G1 media have all drawn specifically from the ''Prime'' version. [[Slipstream (G1)]] is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: [[Slipstream (Animated)]], [[Slipstream (WFC)]] and [[Slipstream (Cyberverse)]], depending on which specific version is being depicted. That means all of the Bulkhead appearances would actually go on the ''Prime'' page. I really don't feel strongly on this detail, though. [[Cop-Tur (G1)]], as mentioned in the above discussion, is another edge case. One more strange case ''not'' listed above is that of [[Emissary (IDW)]], who homages the ''Robots in Disguise'' character but genuinely has what I'd consider to be a radically different portrayal, likely inspired as much by the ''Titans Return'' figure as anything.

To be clear, I consider G1 a special case because of how it's a catch-all label for anything that isn't Hasbro's newest ground-up reboot du jour. Like it or not, G1 usually doesn't actually mean "G1" any more, it just means ''Transformers''. I absolutely wouldn't want to start merging anything from other continuity families—that way pure madness lies. But I think this proposal has clear-cut criteria for inclusion, and would feel more consistent with other areas of existing wiki policy. To give a specific, relevant example: I don't think [[Fracture (Movie)]]'s appearances should be folded onto her merged ''GoBots'' page as some have suggested, ''but'' I do think her toy writeup should be on both without any "blah blah repurposed" hedging, and likewise for the other movieverse characters based on redecos designed by [[Joe Kyde]] contemporaneously with Classics and Universe with specific G1 characters (mostly Micromasters) in mind, some of which were even intended to be released as part of the ''Universe'' toyline. These being: [[Fracture (Movie)]], [[Big Daddy (Movie)]], [[Jolt (Movie)]], [[Grindcore (Movie)]], [[Breakaway (Movie)]], and [[Crankcase (Movie)]]. [[Mudflap (Movie)]] and [[Inferno (Movie)]] are basically the exact same but nobody ever talks about that.

Finally, I think [[Gigatron (G1)]]/[[Overlord (G1)]], [[Zaptrap]]/[[Kuwagatrer]], and [[Rotorbolt (Timelines)]]/[[Skyklik]]/[[Fumes]] should prrrooobably be revisited? In the former two cases, they exist due to niche media establishing them as separate individuals within the same continuity, but we already have precedent for dealing with that—see [[Hot Shot (G1)]]. I will concede that the Rotorbolt situation is quite funny.

I understand that the wiki is structured the way it is for good reasons, but the post-[[Evergreen]] state of the franchise is one where most writers are plucking characters from anywhere in the franchise's history without any significant changes to their depiction. The existing policy will only become more cumbersome as time goes on, in my eyes—I know for many editors, the list of pages above is a horrible scary list of Exceptions, but from where I'm sitting, they feel more like exceptions as they already stand? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 07:25, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:As someone who is basically sympathetic to your goals and not knee-jerk opposed to the idea, this:
:::"Slipstream (G1) is in a similar situation. I guess my proposal here would be to actually split the G1 content across the various pages: Slipstream (Animated), Slipstream (WFC) and Slipstream (Cyberverse), depending on which specific version is being depicted."
:is the worst thing I've ever read. Just, why? --[[User:Jimsorenson|Jimsorenson]] ([[User talk:Jimsorenson|talk]]) 08:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I was mostly being glib, I don't have a good answer there! Just wanted to draw attention to the fact that it ''would'' be a problem with the proposal. It's also been pointed out that all of [[Lockdown (G1)|Lockdown]]'s appearances are visually based on the ''Revenge of the Fallen'' toy! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 08:56, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Absolutely not. There's so much here that's based on false assumptions/incorrect information that I absolutely refuse to take any of this seriously. Concepts are on the same page because they are just that: concepts. There's so much to pick apart here but because I have important things to do, I'll just say that right now, the only reason why there was ''ever'' any confusion over Power Core Combiners is because fans took behind the scenes information from the company overly literally. You actually look at the one piece of information about the toyline (the brief history provided directly by Hasbro the club) and it makes it abundantly clear that it was always meant to be movieverse; I even argued back at the time about Smoulder and Steamhammer being put on that page, and the only reason why it's still that way is because the argument just fizzled out. And once again, I really have to ask: why the hell are we pushing forward merges based on "vibes" when we still keep the Sideways' (someone who is actually said in fiction to all be the same guy) apart based on moronic, petty reasons? [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 09:01, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:Yeah, no, sorry, I think this is ultimately unhelpful and going to cause more accessibility issues than it solves. "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in" is perhaps a little confusing to new readers, but it's ultimately fairly self-consistent and easy to navigate once you understand the basic concept; "The wiki sorts the brand into broad franchise-based chunks (G1/BW, UT, movie, etc), and characters are split up by which of those chunks they appeared in, with the exception of RID01 which shares its pages with G1, and any latter-day characters imported into G1, which go on the pages of their non-G1 incarnations" is very confusing and requires you to be deep in the sauce to understand which characters are and are not exceptions to the rule. I obviously think that flexibility of the system is a good thing — the RID/G1 merge, while less than ideal, is definitely the best way to solve a very unintuitive issue — but the more holes we poke in the tower the closer it comes to collapsing, if you catch my drift.
:Ultimately I think the occasional silliness of "Shadow Striker (G1) who is identical to Shadow Striker (Cyberverse)" and such is the price we pay for having any structure whatsoever. The more we make exceptions on the basis of ultimately arbitrary "well this one's SO similar" the less consistent the wiki overall gets, and the harder it gets to navigate. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:40, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::Basically, this. And I don't even think that drawing the franchise-based chunk distinction is all that confusing given I think most people grok the idea that characters will pop up across sub-fictions of major multi-media franchises with varying levels of similarity to prior incarnations that are still "oh, it's a wholly separate storyline, okay". That's just how these things ''do''. (and like "multiverse" has kinda become a ''thing'' in other franchises the last several years) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 10:00, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

:"We've always put RID guys appearing in G1 as still being the RID character, look at Sky Byte" - what other examples make this an "always"? There WERE two Sky Byte pages, for years. We only stopped having a Sky-Byte (G2) when its character model in the IDW G1 comic was explicitly based off the new T30 toy sculpt which wound up with like half of these separate articles duplicating each other. It was argued on that talk page for a long while. The only other case I can think of at all is Gigatron (G1), and we ''don't'' treat him like Megatron (RID).
:"We treat BW as a continuity family like Armada, it looks like we are showing favoritism to them" - we treat it like a franchise within G1, which is what it is. And we disambig by franchise, not by continuity family. "Chase (RB)", not "Chase (Aligned)" or "Chase (Prime)". This was one of the concerns I raised last year when we turned Victory, Masterforce et al into G1 because they had no separate box branding of their own, wait it turned out they did, welp whattaya gonna do, no backsies.
:'''Last but MOST''', I'd say that, yes, "lore connections" mean a great deal here, it is a feature not a bug. This is a fiction-centric wiki as surely as it's an English-centric one. We put character writeups first, above the toys. We give the toys the character names and say "his stickers", not "its stickers" and talk about how it represents the character, not about how many micrograms of silicon it contains. Separating characters because they come from different storyline eras / offerings is entirely normal and reasonable for us. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 09:43, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
::I don't disagree in general, but G1/IDW Gigatron DOES share a page with RID Megatron. [[Gigatron (G1)]] is the Overlord repurpose. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 09:49, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
:::Oof. Don't know why I clearly remembered them as being separate, but in any case I regret the error. Thank you.--[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 10:14, 30 July 2022 (EDT)
There's no way to organize something like this place without something somewhere seeming arbitrary. I think the existing structure is arbitrary in the best way that makes the most sense, and trying to "mitigate" that arbitrariness just creates different arbitrariness. A lot of this "but what if we redid all this to fix this particular thing" shuffling just relitigates why we already do the stuff we already do. so, like: no --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 09:54, 30 July 2022 (EDT)

== The Discord ==

Alright, seriously, we need to talk about this. It is beyond frustrating that a greater than 50% chunk of discussion about what big edits will happen on the wiki are happening on an app that people either aren't on or (in my case) aren't allowed on. I was told it was going to just to get voices onto things but that clearly isn't how it's working out. We need either some sort of archival dump of all these posts or something because I'm tired of getting into arguments where half the responses haven't even happened on the main site itself. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:45, 17 August 2022 (EDT)
: I think you're drastically overestimating how much discussion about big edits is happening on the Discord. No actual big decisions are getting made there, and we make it a point to repeatedly remind people that discussion for major changes needs to happen here before anything gets decided. But we also can't stop anyone from simply talking about things there the same way we couldn't stop discussion on the AllSpark thread when that was a thing, and having a public log of discussions from the editing channel is both infeasible and frankly unnecessary. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 09:09, 17 August 2022 (EDT)

==Designer bylines on toy writeups==

As those of us who have been tuning in to the [[Hasbro Pulse#Livestreams|Hasbro Pulse livestreams]] have no doubt noticed, one side effect of the unprecedented transparency of the current team on the ''Generations'' franchise is that we are now pretty consistently being blasted with a fire hose of toy designer credits. While there's been a scramble to record them on the designers' pages as best we can, this rapidly growing body of information is not doing the average reader a whole lot of good sequestered away on pages that require them to already know the designers by name. As such, I've put together a template to act as a designer byline for relevant toy write-ups, largely following the formatting of our existing voice actor template.

Documentation for the prototype template which I've named '''<nowiki>{{toydesigner}}</nowiki>''' can be found here:

*[[:Template:Toydesigner-Prototype]]

And a variety of examples of implementation can be found here:

*[[User:AzimuthAcolyte/Sandbox/Toy credits demo]]

Is this something we would be interested in implementing?

Questions, concerns, suggestions etc are welcome. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:33, 22 August 2022 (EDT)

:I support adding this template, it's valid information and helps put names and faces in a historically anonymous industry due to the lack of credits in the products themselves.
[[User:MrRald|MrRald]] ([[User talk:MrRald|talk]]) 13:38, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I think this is a great idea. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:52, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I really like it. The only possible negative is that unless a whole bunch of people are very dedicated to this (or one brave soul is ''extremely'' dedicated to it) we might end up seeing it only appear on a small handful of toy entries and most will never feature it. I vote for going ahead with it regardless.
:::While we are addressing the "designer credits" issue, can we also please find a better phrase to use on the designer pages than "Toys So-and-so is known to have had a hand in creating"? It's just so overwrought. I think "Design Team Credits Include:" gets the point across much more naturally.... --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 13:54, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::::This is a fair point. Maybe something as blunt as "Known Design Work" mirroring the "Published Works" thing we use for writers/artists? -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Looks good to me. Hope we can scrounge together sources and lists for older design teams too. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 15:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
::I can't see any reason not to do this. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 16:05, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not a toy person, but that looks really cool! --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 16:23, 22 August 2022 (EDT)
Oh wow, I'm blown away by the universally positive reception here! If there are no concerns in the next few days I guess I'll get started rolling this out. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 11:17, 25 August 2022 (EDT)
:Alrighty it's been a fair bit with no further concerns, so I have pushed the template live to [[:Template:Toydesigner]] and will begin implementing it as I have time. Any and all help is appreciated, as this will of course be a huge job. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 16:13, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Wiki Toy Photo Quality Standards ==
So we know (and had long suspected anyway) that Hasbro designers are sometimes pulling Wiki photos for reference. That's great, but we've got some toy photography on here that's a good bit off from what the figures look like in reality for one reason or another. Is there any way to flag shots that are out of whack so that they might get tweaked or replaced? This issue comes to mind since, while I've been here more or less since the Wiki started, I don't recall there being a formal set of standards for photos since it just wasn't really a big deal before now. Oversaturation is my main complaint, since one user a long while ago was going through, taking existing shots into Photoshop and oversaturating the hell out of them without regard to the actual toy, and I've noticed some updated photography like [[Prowl (Magnaboss)]] that does basically the same. It's a larger photo, but that Prowl is definitely not blazing yellow in person. Apologies in advance and please disregard if this has already been discussed elsewhere or before.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:10, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:For the record, my lighting set up is very warm, hence why Prowl's colours appear so bright. I haven't figured out the right balance in Photoshop to get the colours of figures to look spot on so figures either appear too bright or too dull in the finished product. -- [[User:Fanofcoolstuff27|Fanofcoolstuff27]] ([[User talk:Fanofcoolstuff27|talk]]) 17:30, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::Oh, I'm not intending to put you on the spot, that's just the first example I had on hand of a wider issue that we probably need to start being careful about since it appears to be (hilariously) affecting actual figures now, like Titans Return PMOP or Legacy Iguanus. When it was the one guy tweaking things to be inaccurate "because it looked better", I could follow him and revert stuff, but I can't when there's nothing to revert in most cases.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 18:38, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
::I recommend ring lights, you can get some pretty cheap, they've good at spreading light out rather than heavy-focus, and they have adjustable brightness and warm/cool light settings: use "cool" (aka white/blue-tinted). Even before I got ring lights, I used "cool" light bulbs in the lamps. The problem is these are nowhere as common as the "normal" yellow-tinted bulbs, thus, go with the ring lights.
::As for "standards"... well, good luck with that. Every camera's a little different. Every MONITOR is a little different. Hell, I have a double-monitor setup with different models and they have small but distinct differences in brightness & etc; honestly I'm good with it since it lets me check how things may look to different people. But I think maybe a tag for photos that we are CERTAIN are too far off from final product (be they user-made or stock images) may not be a bad idea. Assuming we notice. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 22:44, 24 August 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, a tag we can throw on to a photo just to make it at least visible that it's incorrect would be useful. And would probably prompt a deco designer to gather some secondary reference material, assuming the tag's obvious. I like the idea.--[[User:MCRG|MCRG]] ([[User talk:MCRG|talk]]) 16:29, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I've noticed that the quality of the UT stuff in the toys section flunctuates greatly-- for example, ML Starscream still uses the guidebook picture, and Superlink ver of the combining Optimus downright doesn't exist. I've started to collect UT toys since Hasbro has been updating UT stuff with more commitment and I have 0 faith in them doing it right, and most of the stuff I've gotten are the JP versions. For minor alterations like ML/ Armada Megs, is it worth uploading a completely new picture of ML Megatron onto his page? Another issue worth regarding discussing is "cartoon accuracy". Whilst Hasbro is indeed working on making more accurate figures, they obviously aren't 100% accurate, like 86 starscream using the commonly accepted G1 logo instead of the sunbow accurate one with the spike in the middle, and even from a sculpt and proportional standppint the ER mold is far from accurate compared to the sunbow model, let alone MP52. I actually cleaned up the page for TM2 Megatron because he deviates pretty heavily if you compare the CG model to the final toy, and changed the claim that Skids is "toon" accurate as he is blantently based on the original toy in deco. The same goes for Starscream, aside from the forearms and forehead hes blatently based on the T30 toy. I also had to edit that bit --[[User: Pixelmaster|Pixelmaster]] 3:31 HKT

==Reconsolidating some of our pages==
This is something I've been thinking about for a while, but I'd like to propose re-merging some of our excessively split articles back into something more manageable. It seems like that once a page is split out, a) we get a lot less editorial oversight, as the recent toy page trimming has revealed, b), stuff does not get updated nearly as often as they would be on their respective mainpages, and c) it makes information harder to find by pushing it behind a subpage that's not readily accessible.

Obviously I understand that splits are necessary for the really long pages like [[Optimus Prime (G1)]], [[Megatron (G1)]], and soforth, but when you get down to like, [[Mirage (G1)]] or [[Hound (G1)]] or [[Hot Shot (Armada)]], there's barely anything of any significance on their main pages beyond Dreamwave or the odd IDW cameo. Are, for instance, [[Ravage (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Ravage]]'s Marvel adventures that major that they can't fit into the main page? Are [[Hook (G1)/toys|Hook]] or [[Warpath (G1)#Toys|Warpath]] really that inundated with toys that they need their own subpage? If it's a problem of just ''length'', then a lot of the subpaged articles or mainpage stuff like the storybooks could just be trimmed down into something more manageable—as I did with G1 Cliffjumper's Marvel section earlier this year. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 17:00, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:I 100% agree with this. --[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:04, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Fully in favour. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 17:20, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Sub-pages should, on their own, be significantly sizable pages to justify making readers link-jump. A dozen toys does not strike me as remotely enough to justify a subpage split. Being ''in'' a major long-running fiction but mostly having appearances in a minority of installments that can be summed up in two sentences doesn't justify a split. New editing tools are fun and all, but just 'cuz you gotta new hammer doesn't mean you have to go hunting for anything that looks vaguely nail-like. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 18:18, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

== Incoming maintenance ==

Just a heads up, our host is going to be doing some maintenance in about an hour that may cause problems with the site, so if you have trouble reaching it and therefore cannot read this message, that's what it is. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 00:11, 23 November 2022 (EST)

== Foreign names ==

A dispute came up recently on the [[Megatron (ES)]] page. User:Kiké Prime has been providing Hungarian names for all the characters, but this one apparently is just "Megatron". Cyberlink420 removed it. I disputed it, pointing out that not listing it leaves the implication that we do not know the name of the character in the language. Despite having my reversion again reverted, I still find deliberately leaving blanks in our name lists odd. I am thus bringing the matter here for further discussion. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 12:16, 5 December 2022 (EST)
:My understanding has always been that we only add foreign names if they are different from the English name. Per pages like [[Megatron (G1)]], this includes examples where the name is the same, but is spelled with a diacritic or using a different alphabet. So "Megatron" wouldn't be different enough to justify inclusion, but examples like Mégatron, Megatrón, Мегатрон and メガトロン would. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 13:10, 5 December 2022 (EST)

== Nonbinary Character Category ==

So, we now have another nonbinary character (who actually used their pronouns during the media no less), [[Nightshade (ES)|Nightshade]] from [[Earthspark]] (Nightshade at time of posting doesn't have a page yet)! The other fully for certain fully intentional one is [[Screwball]] from [[Beast Wars Uprising]] while [[Acid Storm (Cyberverse)|Acid Storm]] was at least an out of media by writer retcon of animation, and [[Overlord_(G1)#Ask_Vector_Prime|Overlord's]] gender is somewhat nebulous on where that fits beyond being gender expansive due to being [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#December 23, 2015|"what some would call genderfluid"]] but that at least puts us at three. Given that we have a trans category now we thought it best to at this point suggestion a nonbinary category for the sake of users (including gender expansive people) easily finding nonbinary characters on here. Obviously adding Nightshade will have to wait until they have a page but any thoughts on this yea or nay? [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 18:28, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:I forgot about Screwball. I think with three confirmed examples, even without the edge case of Overlord, that's probably enough to justify one. Care will have to be taken, however, to only include confirmed examples and not use it as a dumping ground for any character whose gender has never been explicitly identified. -- [[User:Cyberlink420|Cyberlink420]] ([[User talk:Cyberlink420|talk]]) 18:37, 8 December 2022 (EST)
::Authorial intent and all, but I can say that if I had the option to go back and rewrite it I would have used the term non binary for Overlord. I feel like Acid Storm is more of an edge case; it’s what one person said on their account to justify it. Whenever Acid Storm actually says something they’re animated with a female face; it’s not done at random.[[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 18:47, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::Acid Storm changes from masculine male to feminine female and back. Gender-fluid, sure, but definitely non-binary? As for Overlord, in the Legends manga Mega gives Overlord a female-presenting face - is there a pronoun change during that time? Would we have more candidates for inclusion in a Gender-fluid category first? --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 20:17, 8 December 2022 (EST)
:::::Thank for the notes folks, that does help to piece this together! Just want to note that a pronoun change is not necessary for a gender being experienced in fluidity to be the one expressed or what have you, so unless the Legends manga actually has some sort of statement about Overlord's fluidity that kind of puts us back with an umbrella term of nonbinary (which we are unsure as not having read the Legends manga if that would work for that Overlord so we can't speak to where/if Overlord falls under gender expansiveness beyond the fact that Overlord's presentation changes depending on the binary bond partner right?). Acid Storm is an edge case yes but if we do count the edge case that they are we think it is worth noting that for Acid Storm what Catt said was specifically that changing expression is just something they do, and "any pronouns" work for Acid Storm, no statement about the binary. Of course, we only see two faces which are the two different Seeker faces that were otherwise delineated by gender, but at this point we're getting into the opt-in thing of 'x person is genderfluid and thus considers themself nonbinary' or 'z person is genderfluid and only considers themself as under the multigender umbrella'. Which we don't have detail on really if Acid Storm is genderfluid as how they know themselves right? Because that's just a thing that was written in the Female Transformers page because of (no blame being given, it's understandable) the user finding that to be the term that fit best? Feel like we've ended up just pointing out an need for just a gender expansive category instead but ah well. [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 21:46, 1 January 2023 (EST)
::::::We seem to have killed this with a non-solution for the nonbinary category by pointing out that gender expansive is more certain than saying genderfluid. If we count Nightshade, Overlord, and Screwball, is that a go on nonbinary, or should we just have a gender expansive category at this point that would also be one trans characters use? For people wondering what gender expansive means you can find a definition here https://www.diversitystyleguide.com/glossary/gender-expansive/ https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/08/gender-expansive-mean/ [[User:Causeway|Causeway]] ([[User talk:Causeway|talk]]) 23:18, 6 February 2023 (EST)
:::::::Respectfully, I think needing to invoke a glossary suggests the term is so little-used in common parlance that it would not be useful for our needs and style. We don't have a category tag at the bottom of a bunch of BW characters saying "tetrapods" or "perissodactyls" (we ''do'' talk like that on [[Popular beast alternate modes]], maybe a grouping ''page'' would be a better approach? Just a thought...). If we are looking for a category tag I think it would be better to find the term that unambiguously covers the largest number of candidates, without a need to rely on edge cases, maintaining both accuracy and readability. I see three characters that could sensibly go in a Gender-fluid tag, one that could go in a Non-binary tag (meaning we wouldn't make the latter). We may be facing a case where there are few enough disparate examples that there isn't one single category tag that usefully unites them. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 07:55, 7 February 2023 (EST)

== Adding an informative table to each character page ==
I was thinking about it since it's striking.. lack.. There should be a way to tell people in which and how many episodes/issues/movies each character appears in the continuity they belong to, their debut episode/issue movie, what aliases they have had and nicknames they were given by other characters, a more centered area for the voice or live actors, a link to their gallery pages(if they have any) and one to their disambiguation pages etc. The kind of information that one would prefer to find with greater ease, especially if they aren't members. And talking about their appearances, that should prove quite useful for future page edits, since we'll know exactly where to look especially when it's about latecomers or characters that don't appear on a regular basis. I just think it'd be useful. [[User:Darthrone|Darthrone]] ([[User talk:Darthrone|talk]]) 15:44, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:This kind of infobox was discussed at the very earliest days of this wiki, and it was decided that there was just way, way too much information for it to work... and this was in 2006, BEFORE the franchise exploded. TF is such a fragmented kludge of fictions from multiple sources and creators spanning 40 years that any major character would end up with one ultra-massive thing of dubious use (can't say I see the value in a "number of appearances" tally, aside from the headache of keeping that accurate over time and arguing "what counts"), or a billion splintered ones spread across the page for the different fictions. And "nicknames" is always a minefield as those tend to turn into a massive list of "someone called them this once" which is... not helpful. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 17:46, 2 February 2023 (EST)
::Even if it had been a day-1 thing, I don't see how this is more informative than our current style. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 17:58, 2 February 2023 (EST)
:::I'm for infoboxes, but the information you're asking for is far too abstract and meaningless in this franchise. (We are absolutely not doing "nicknames". No.) [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 18:09, 2 February 2023 (EST)

==The (BWU) tag==
I understand the reasons why [[#Proposal re: G1 pages|my previous proposal]] regarding the proliferation of (G1) pages for random newer characters was soundly rejected. However, my main motivation for raising it was that I find the huge quantity of (BWU) pages for "repurposed" Mini-Cons and bestial Transformers to be reader-unfriendly, so I wanted to make a case for making an exception for ''[[Beast Wars: Uprising]]'' cameos. ''Uprising'' was an obscure barely-canon multi-continuity-drifting web serial which we are very unlikely to get further instalments of, and most of the relevant characters are similarly very deep pulls who will assuredly not be appearing again in future stories, and who will otherwise be stuck with tiny stub-pages forever. Most of these are Mini-Cons (here Micromasters) or bestial Transformers (here Protoformers), with a few boats or Constructicons from "[[Derailment]]". In many cases, I perceive ''Uprising'' as having tried to give these toys a hint of fiction where previously they had none at all, much like [[Ask Vector Prime]] before it. It's a very different phenomenon to most so-called "continuity transplants" we've seen in other series (such as with, say, [[Hot Shot (G1)]]), which are instead rooted in the popularity of those characters.

I think the problem here is that strictly speaking ''Uprising'' is a "Primax" continuity, sure, but it lifts dozens of characters (let alone concepts) unchanged from later stories. Slavishly hewing to that label when it's such an intertextual melting pot has resulted in this unfriendly setup. It feels like a fair decision made at the time (was [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Archive64#Derailment & Uprising pages|this discussion]] the one?) but in my opinion the wiki's policy kinda fails here. If we get rid of the (BWU) tag, the (G1) back-ports remaining (a minority!) will be for more significant characters, often adapted more radically. Here's the list of tiny pages we could be rid of, just like that:

*'''''Energon''''': [[Steam Hammer]], [[Doom-Lock (BWU)]], [[Avalon (BWU)]]
*'''''Cybertron''''': [[Wing Saber (BWU)]], [[Shortround (BWU)]]
*'''Movies''': [[Reckage]], [[Hatchet (BWU)]], [[Skipjack (BWU)]], [[Sea Spray (BWU)]], [[Fearswoop (BWU)]], [[Depthcharge (BWU)]], [[Rav (BWU)]], [[Evac (BWU)]], [[Drydock (BWU)]], [[Photon (BWU)]]
*'''''TransTech''''': [[Ego (BWU)]]
*'''''War for Cybertron''''': [[Contrail (BWU)]], [[Sigil (BWU)]], [[Gauntlet (BWU)]]
*'''''Prime''''': [[Ser-Ket (BWU)]], [[Rot Gut (BWU)]], [[Twinstrike (BWU)]], [[Budora (BWU)]], [[Darksteel (BWU)]], [[Vertebreak (BWU)]], [[Grimwing (BWU)]], [[Blackbeak (BWU)]], [[Judora (BWU)]]
*'''''Robots in Disguise''''': [[Bisk (BWU)]], [[Paralon (BWU)]], [[Quillfire (BWU)]], [[Ped (BWU)]], [[Psychobat (BWU)]], [[Springload (BWU)]], [[Snitch (BWU)]], [[Razorgrille (BWU)]]
*'''''Transformers Online''''': [[Astral Knight (BWU)]], [[Psychic Shortstop (BWU)]], [[Wrath Thunder (BWU)]], [[Deep Blue (BWU)]]
*'''Mini-Cons''': [[Synapse (BWU)]], [[Black Out]], [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], [[Flat-Out (BWU)]], [[Six-Speed (BWU)]], [[Zapmaster (BWU)]], [[Crumplezone (BWU)]], [[Cannon (BWU)]], [[Bulge (BWU)]], [[Bomb (BWU)]], [[Shot (BWU)]], [[Crack (BWU)]], [[Thunderblast (BWU)]], [[Wreckage (BWU)]], [[Bonecrusher (BWU)]], [[Broadside (BWU)]], [[Tankor (BWU)]], [[Caliburn (BWU)]], [[Torque (BWU)]], [[Bilge (BWU)]], [[Search (BWU)]], [[Refute (BWU)]], [[Kingbolt (BWU)]], [[Starcatcher (BWU)]], [[Clench (BWU)]], [[Run-Over (BWU)]], [[Deepdive (BWU)]], [[Astro-Sinker (BWU)]], [[Snow Cat (BWU)]], [[Draft (BWU)]], [[Screw (BWU)]], [[Aston (BWU)]] (deep sigh)
*'''Other''': [[Terrastar (BWU)]], [[Hyperborea (BWU)]], [[Alchemor (BWU)]], [[Minion of Unicron (BWU)]]

There's a handful of ''Uprising'' characters that need a (G1) page anyway for non-''Uprising'' reasons; I'm totally ambivalent about where the ''Uprising'' content ends up for these: [[Tidal Wave (G1)]], [[Override (BWU)]] (!), [[Cannonball (G1)]], [[Black-Out]], [[Halogen (G1)]], [[Knock Out (G1)]], [[Gaidora (BWU)]], [[Strongarm (G1)]], [[Thunderhoof (BWU)]], [[Twirl (G1)]].

Finally there's a few weird cases that would merit individual discussion but would probably just need to keep their own pages: [[Clobber (BWU)]], [[Apex (BWU)]], [[Offshoot (BWU)]], [[Cybaxx (BWU)]], [[Overbite (BWU)]], and [[Terrorcon (BWU)]].

Here is a ([https://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=500&offset=0&redirs=1&profile=all&search=%22from+the%22+%22continuity+families%22 probably non-exhaustive]) list of existing cases of multi-continuity drifting you should probably consider before weighing in:
* [[Buckethead]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 31, 2015|this Ask Vector Prime answer]])
* [[Drydock (TF 2010)]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 13, 2015|this answer]] which explicitly has him travel from one continuity to another)
* [[Drelnar Feh'd]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 17, 2015|this one]])
* [[Scorpia (G2)]], [[Autoceptor]], [[Deceptor]], and [[Kaltor]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#June 12, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Night Rescue Team]], [[Clear Skies Team]], [[Rapid Intervention Team]], [[Prehistoric Team]], [[Demolition Team]], [[Dirt Digger Team]], [[Heavy Load (Universe)]] and the [[Mobile Fortification Team]], and [[Detectas]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]]).
**However, exceptions from these Mini-Con teams are [[Nightscream (Cybertron)|Nightscream]], [[Offshoot (Cybertron)|Offshoot]], [[Strongarm (Cybertron)|Strongarm]] and [[Knockdown (Cybertron)|Knockdown]], who all have separate (Cybertron) basis on the basis of receiving separate bios after being packed in with ''Cybertron'' Primus...
**...but then [[Liftor]] is all on a single page, despite his ''Classics'' bio.
**[[Snarl (Classics)|Snarl]], [[Sledge (Classics)|Sledge]], [[Wideload (Classics)|Wideload]], [[Knockdown (Classics)|Knockdown]], and [[Steel Wind]] already have ''Uprising'' content on their pages, but that makes sense as these were originally ''Classics'' guys.
* The [[Saurian Strike Team]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#September 28, 2015|this one]])
* The [[Minicon 8 Pack]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#July 24, 2015|this one]])
* The ''Dark of the Moon'' Mini-Cons [[Dualor (DOTM)]], [[Triceradon (DOTM)]], [[Rav (DOTM)]], and [[Catilla (DOTM)]], plus [[Ironlunge]], [[Reptix]], [[Sling (AOE)]], [[Gnashteeth]], [[Wedge Shape]], [[Brimstone (Universe)]], [[Apexus]], [[Gredator]], and [[Dragoyell]] (because of [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#August 13, 2015|this one]])
** Weirdly, we ''separately'' have a page for [[Rav (BWU)]], but Catilla has Unicron Trilogy, movie, and ''Uprising'' appearances covered all on the one page!
* [[Galadria]] and [[Ramak]] (because of [[Source:Transformers: Spacewarp's Log#December 5, 2015|this post]])
* Am I to understand that [[Wind Sheer (RID)]], [[Skyfire (RID)]] and the [[Dimensional Patrol]] each have just a single page because (RID) ''is'' part of the G1 continuity family sometimes...?
* And I understand that [[Primus Vanguard]] cameos just go on their original pages because that's a weird thing kinda outside of G1 anyway (at least from an in-universe perspective, if not a real-world one).
* ''Diaclone'' examples like [[Burn Out (Diaclone)]], [[Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)]], and [[Chifumi Takahashi]] have been discussed to death.
* [[Monsterous]] was retconned to originally be from an Aligned universe (in [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#October 21, 2015|this post]], though I can't actually find any mention of Uniend? EDIT: [[Source:Ask Vector Prime/Guest column#November 7, 2015|found it]]!)
* [[Primacron]] was apparently mentioned in ''[[Transformers Animated: The AllSpark Almanac II| The AllSpark Almanac II]]''.
* And [[Sentinel Supreme]] is just an Easter egg that everyone seemed to shrug about at the time.

To those who say the exception I'm proposing would be confusing, I submit these existing examples where we've apparently neglected to split something out as evidence that the only people this confuses are wiki editors like me wondering why they're not all that way. Maybe I'm just unaware of some aspect of the existing policy which accounts for all these cases? But is it really helpful to anyone to have a given toy's associated fiction squirrelled away somewhere separate you have to go into the disambiguation to find? We recently merged [[Chromhorn]] (another Sorenson job) on the basis that "There's literally no reason for these to be on different pages. They are the same thing." Can we not do the same for these Sorenson-penned cases that are basically going "look, the exact same guy shows up in multiple universes, alright?" And if the answer is no, will someone go through and split all these out? —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 18:27, 6 February 2023 (EST)

:I think my response to your earlier G1-import proposal still applies here: the more exceptions we make to our system for the sake of "accessibility", the harder the overall structure becomes to grok for a new reader, and thus ironically it all becomes ''less'' accessible. Why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steel Jaw]], but ''Uprising'' Bisk be at [[Bisk (RID)]]? Or, conversely, why should ''Uprising'' Steel Jaw be at [[Steeljaw (RID)]], but LBS Steeljaw be at [[Steel Jaw|Steeljaw (IDW)]]? Neither solution is good.
:As for the current list of exceptions, I'd argue everything you list from Buckethead to the DOTM Mini-Cons should probably be split. Galadria and Ramak are characters from outside media, so we don't split them across continuity lines. Wind Sheer and Skyfire have one page for consistency with the other RID guys. The source on Monsterous being Aligned is [[Source:Ask_Vector_Prime/Facebook#November_7.2C_2015|here]], but I would argue that's just giving an origin to the GoBot and so they should share a page anyway.
:Lastly - I object to you bringing the Chromhorn thing into this, as I don't think it's a fair comparison. Chromhorn wasn't making any exception to our categorisation system; it was one page saying "Chromhorn is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT" and another saying "Chromhorn Forest Type is a green variant of Insecticon from the UT", and the former was somehow a "repurposing" of the fictionless latter. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:24, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::Totally get the Steeljaw example—although it ''is'' crazy that we're currently disambiguating G1 wolf Steeljaw simply by [[Steel Jaw]]. You should post about the disambiguation tag policy change you suggested on Discord, I think a lot of people were thinking along similar lines there. Agree with your interpretation of the current policy as to which of the examples listed should be split and which shouldn't—although the more I think about the Primus Vanguard, the more I think those should technically be split too. While I guess the [[Time Warrior (AVP)|Time Warrior]]s are multiversal travellers like Drydock. RE: Chromhorn, I understand why it's technically different; I brought it up because I think it speaks to the tenor of ''Ask Vector Prime'' answers—in spirit, I think its aim was exactly the same as with the Mini-Con examples I've given.
::What do I mean by that? To match your Steeljaw example, from the opposite angle: say I'm your typical fan scrolling [[Transformers: Dark of the Moon (toyline)]], and I click on, say, [[Dualor (DOTM)]], wondering if he's ever shown up in anything. In their current state, I get my answer immediately. With the proposed split for consistency, I instead get a page telling me that Dualor (DOTM) is a dinosaur Mini-Con from ''Dark of the Moon'', some info about the toy, ''maybe'' ending with an inscrutable note about how he was "repurposed" as an identical guy. Now, there's ''already'' an unrelated [[Dualor (Armada)]], so we'd need to make a disambiguation page. We can see this already by looking at [[Snow Cat (Universe)]], which is barren (the very scenario AVP so often tried to address!), and doesn't even admit to the existence of [[Snow Cat (BWU)]] aside from a general Snow Cat disambiguation tag. In some existing cases like [[Steamhammer (BWU)]], we've mirrored a toy writeup, which needs upkeep in parallel; in others, like Snow Cat, we're asking the user to visit the other page to read about the toy ''anyway''. To my mind, this is inarguably less accessible. I don't understand arguments made about accessibility here which are predicated on readers having learned editing policy to begin with, and I don't think this proposal would actually make it any harder to learn the system.
::I regret not listing out all the individual members of those Mini-Con teams above, to better communicate the sheer number of pages that would need to be made (and pages that would need to be renamed, in case of conflicts) to create this inconvenience in service of a rule we've already been ignoring without issue. Nobody wants to do this work, and I think it's less that no-one cares, and more that some people think it'd actually make the wiki worse, and the rest don't particularly think it'd make the wiki better.
::What about just making an exception for Mini-Cons/Micromasters? I've talked about ''Uprising'', but obviously the vast majority of cases that theoretically need splitting aren't from ''Uprising'' at all. Could probably even do a generic template like "X exists in multiple continuity families, and is a Micromaster/Maximal/Predacon in those without Mini-Cons". Thus your Steeljaws and Bisks and Overrides go unchanged, no problems or ambiguity there! —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
:Once upon a time, I probably would have pushed for something like this, but where we are now: I am not a fan of any push towards treating something differently based on how "relevant" something is or not. It goes against the very spirit this wiki was founded on, because that is what was happening to the Wikipedia coverage of Transformers where they were just getting rid of things wholesale because of "relevancy." I can understand the basic point behind this, but I feel that doing so would set a bad precedent that could be exploited in the future.
:I'd be fine with splitting most of these out. I've said it before elsewhere but by and large a lot of the inconsistencies were largely the result of different contributors adding stuff or splitting stuff without a general consensus, and they haven't been cleaned up afterwards. Also, a minor note, but the Liftor thing was mainly cause no one noticed at the time until I wrote up about the profile years after the fact. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 20:26, 6 February 2023 (EST)
::If I gave the impression "relevancy" was the main thrust of my argument here, I didn't mean to! Like, it goes both ways—would we be merging because ''Uprising'' is so irrelevant that we shouldn't devote all these random stub pages to it, ''or'' are we merging because it's sufficiently relevant that we shouldn't be hiding that content in stub pages nobody visits? Either is true! I'm arguing for convenience and clarity. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 17:09, 7 February 2023 (EST)
::: This definitely feels like the strongest argument to the merge in my mind. The wiki is no stranger to niche pages, pages for nameless, fictionless, toyless nonentities. But I believe these fictionless toys and toyless fiction which are really the same thing would be a richer niche page for the merges.

Rik Alvarez

2022-12-15T00:35:05Z

Bumblebee2000: credits, added IDW cover

[[Image:Alvarez.jpg|right|200px|thumb|]]
'''J.E "Rik" Alvarez''' was formerly an intellectual property development manager at Hasbro and a member of the [[Transformers brand|Transformers]] [[fandom]] before crossing over into official capacities. Alvarez is ambidextrous, and frequently lightened the mood around the Hasbro, Inc. offices with feats of juggling.

Alvarez first came into prominence in [[1999]] with the publication of his [[Unofficial_guidebooks#J. E (Rikki) Alavarez books|Unofficial Guide to Transformers: 1980s Through 1990s.]] After becoming a writer and editor with [[Fun Publications]]. Among other things in his Hasbro career, he was involved in [[Erector (G1)|Erector's]] [[Transformers Hall of Fame]] entry. He was heavily involved in the [[Aligned continuity family|Aligned continuity]] and making the "[[Binder of Revelation]]", which ended up being [[Simanzi Massacre|frustrating]].<ref>Rik Alvarez panel, slide show - [http://sunnybutte.tumblr.com/post/131367083128/that-explains-a-lot-of-the-mess-that-was See fan photos]</ref><ref>Rik Alvarez panel, slide show on [[Beast Hunters]] - [http://sunnybutte.tumblr.com/post/131368170623/and-if-you-were-wondering-why-beast-hunters-was See fan photos]</ref> In among other claims about Aligned, Alvarez has said he was unhappy with ''all'' the novels and rewrote them at the eleventh hour,<ref>[http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-robots-disguise-prime-discussion/1053596-aligned-continuity-panel-tf-con-charlotte-5.html#post13037062 TF2005.com] "More tidbits from a friend of mine who took notes at the panel: ... Rik basically rewrote them himself the night before they were published." He was probably exaggerating!</ref> something which [[Alex Irvine]] denies.<ref>https://twitter.com/alexirvine/status/661371677054402561</ref> [[Andrew Hall]] says he was also invaluable in getting the [[Arms Micron]] bios done in time.<ref>[http://www.allspark.com/forums/topic/121416-everything-that-went-wrong-with-the-transformers-prime-show-panel-at-tfcon-charlotte/?p=3060514 Allspark forums:] "In his defense, Rik was of incredible help to me while I was working on the bios for the Arms Micron toys.

Many needed to be written before the characters appeared in the shows, so he gave me a lot of background info that helped me reflect the show."</ref>

After leaving Hasbro, he started a toy company called Play With This Too and served as Chief Executive Manager.<ref>[http://playwiththistoo.com/meet-the-band/ Play With This Too: Meet the Band]</ref> There've been two unsuccessful attempts to make [[Pretender|totally original]] [[IP infringement#.22Third_party.22_toys|toys]] through Kickstarter.<ref>[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/44339820/play-with-this-too-lost-protectors Lost Protectors] and [https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/44339820/boneyard-and-jetstrike-action-figures-playwiththis Boneyard & Jetstrike]</ref>

He officiated at [[Aaron Archer]]'s wedding.

==Transformers credits==
{{creatorstub}}
===Lead writer===
[[Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club (magazine)|Transformers Collectors' Club]] issues [[Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 6|#6]] to ???

===Assistant editor===
[[Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club (magazine)|Transformers Collectors' Club]] issues [[Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 6|#6]] to [[Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 12|#12]]

===Plot===
:* "[[Wings of Honor]]"

===Audio commentary===
:*''[[The Transformers: The Movie]]'' — 20th anniversary edition
::* ''The Transformers: The Movie'' fan commentary (with [[Paul Hitchens]], [[Joe Moore]], and [[Alex Weiner]])
::* "[[Scramble City: Mobilization]]" (with Alex Weiner)

===Comic Book Covers===
:*''[[The Transformers (IDW)]] [[Pax Cybertronia (issue)|The Transformers #31 (Cover A)]]

==Notes==
* Rik permanently donated figures from his collection to the [[Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum]]'s [[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (film)|Revenge of the Fallen]] display. He even helped set it up, missing the movie premier. <ref>[https://twitter.com/PlayWithThisToo/status/1563527041294942208] "These are my actual toys I had to permanently donate to the Smithsonian. I got to set up this display overnight once the museum was closed. I’ve got stories and pictures of me with airplanes I shouldn’t have! Everyone else went to the ROTF premier but me. I did this instead!"</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
*[https://twitter.com/PlayWithThisToo Rik Alvarez on Twitter]

{{DEFAULTSORT: Alvarez, Rik}}
[[Category: Convention guests]]
[[Category: Editors]]
[[Category: Fandom]]
[[Category: Fun Publications]]
[[Category: Hasbro personnel]]
[[Category: Writers]]

Minerva (G1 robot)

2022-10-29T04:06:32Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Legacy */ Tweaked the accessory section, felt wordy, added back in the Mark trivia (but not the rest of what was removed in the last edit)

{{factions|autobot|wreckersidw}}
{{disambig3|Minerva}}
{{suite|root=Minerva (G1)}}
:''Minerva is an [[Autobot]] from the [[Generation 1 continuity family|Generation 1]] [[continuity family]].''
[[File:Minerva robotmode.jpg|thumb|300px|]]

'''Minerva''' (ミネルバ ''Mineruba'') is either a former [[Transtector]] who gained life from and independently of her former owner, [[Minerva (human)|Minerva]], via the power of [[Masterforce (technology)|Masterforce]], or a normal [[Transformer|Cybertronian]]. Nevertheless, she has great skills in medicine.

==Fiction==
===Japanese Generation 1 cartoon continuity===
====''Super-God Masterforce'' cartoon====
The Transtector that would become Minerva was manufactured by the Autobots of [[Master (planet)|Master]] under [[Chromedome (G1)|Chromedome]]'s eye, to allow the [[human]]s of [[Earth]] to defend their planet against the [[Decepticon]]s if needed. When the human Minerva and her friends requested to join the battle, [[Metalhawk (G1)|Metalhawk]] granted the children their wish in the form of [[Master-Brace]]s and the [[Headmaster Junior]] Transtectors. With her Transtector, Minerva participated in the epic war against the Decepticons led by [[Devil Z]]. {{storylink|Birth! Headmaster Jrs}}

In the wake of Devil Z's destruction, the bond between the Autobot humans and their Transtectors was broken, and Minerva became a normal kid again as her now-living Transtector and those of all the other Autobots headed into space to continue the fight against the Decepticons. {{storylink|A Battle... and Then...}}

====''Legends'' comic====
The living Transtector, having taken its partner's name for its own, came to be stationed at [[G Nebula 89]]. In [[2021]], Minerva watched on as [[Grand Maximus]] unveiled the "Super Convoy Project", a new body in which a resurrected [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Optimus Prime]] would occupy. {{storylink|LG24 Shockwave & Cancer Prologue}} She was later present to defend the transtector factory when [[Overlord (G1)|Overlord]] and his forces attacked. {{storylink|Legends Comic: Bonus Edition Vol. 39|Bonus Edition Vol. 39}} She worked with [[Perceptor (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Perceptor]] to upgrade [[Godbomber]]'s armor plating, {{storylink|TF Legends Late Xmas Present Chapter|Late Xmas Present Chapter}} and came with him to the [[Legends World]] where she helped save him from [[Katsu Don]]'s clutches. {{storylink|Legends Comic: Bonus Edition Vol. 56|Bonus Edition Vol. 56}} She was defeated by Katsu Don when he returned to steal the [[Targetmaster (technology)|Targetmasters]] Perceptor was working on. {{storylink|Targetmaster Chapter Finale: Legends World in Imminent Danger! Part One|Legends World in Imminent Danger! Part One}}

====''Victory'' cartoon====
{{voiceactor|[[Tomoko Maruo]] (Japanese)}}

[[File:Minerva victory.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|left|Odds are, you only like two of these characters.]]

Several years later, when the living Transtector [[Ginrai (robot)|Ginrai]] was fatally wounded in battle with Decepticon leader [[Deathsaurus (G1)|Deathsaurus]], Minerva was summoned to Earth along with [[Perceptor (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Perceptor]] and [[Wheeljack (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Wheeljack]] for medical support. Unfortunately, it was soon determined that nothing could be done for Ginrai, save to rebuild him in an entirely new form. {{storylink|Ginrai Dies!!}} Using a design crafted by Autobot [[Supreme Commander]] [[Star Saber (G1)|Star Saber]], Minerva, Wheeljack, and Perceptor rebuilt Ginrai as Victory Leo {{storylink|Fight!! Victory Leo}} and subsequently implanted a circuit in Star Saber's head that would allow him and Victory Leo to combine. {{storylink|Awaken! Victory Leo}} Perceptor was wary of the strain on Star Saber's body when the combination was first used, but when Minerva pressed him for details, he assured her everything would turn out fine. {{storylink|The Tide Is Turned! The Ultimate Weapon, the Victory Unification}}

====Metrowars====
Following a devastating attack by [[Metrotitan (G1)|Metrotitan]], Minerva, with the help of [[Glit (KP)|Glit]], rebuilt [[Manta Ray (G2)|Manta Ray]] from his [[Master Class]] body into a new body, sans [[Energon Matrix]]. She filled Manta Ray into what was happening with [[Metroplex (G1)|Metroplex]] after Metrotitan's attack. {{Storylink|Metrowars}}

====Train Wars====
Minerva was at [[G Nebula 89]] with [[Cab (robot)|Cab]] when the [[Second Army]] came under attack by [[Darkwings]], [[Black Shadow (G1)|Black Shadow]], and [[Blue Bacchus]], who sought out the [[transtector]] factory. Minerva called out to their commander, Goshooter, to help, and he sent the [[Decepticon]]s fleeing with the power of his partner, [[Shūta Gō]]. Afterwards, though, Minerva found herself annoyed at the two's constant attempts to one-up each other. {{storylink|Train Wars: Goshooter & Shūta Gō Chapter}}

===''Super-God Masterforce'' comic===
Minerva and her friends were recruited by Metalhawk to fight [[Devil Z]]'s Decepticons. After a period of intensive training, they were given Master-Braces and Transtectors, becoming Headmaster Juniors. {{storylink|The Birth of the Junior Headmasters}}

Later, the death of Devil Z caused the bond between the humans and their Transtectors to be broken, and Minerva became a normal kid again as her now-living Transtector and those of all the other Autobots headed into space to continue the fight against the Decepticons. {{storylink|The Birth of the Super Life-Forms}}

===''Kre-O'' online comic===
[[File:KreO-webcomic-4-Minerva.jpg|100px|thumb]]

When [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]]'s new invention "[[Skeletron]]" gave [[Optimus Prime (Kre-O)|Optimus Prime]] a new see-through torso, Minerva blushed at just how embarrassing the look was. {{Storylink|Wheeljack's Bizarre Invention! Optimus Power Up!?}} She apparently treated [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]] after a roof collapsed on him. {{storylink|Dive Into the Fire! The Rescue Operation of Friendship}}
{{--}}

===2019 IDW continuity===

Minerva was chief medic for the [[Wreckers]], a covert insertion unit posing as a traveling stunt show. Because she was not a participant in their broadcasts, Minerva often served as pilot for their ship, the ''[[Stuntmaster]]''. The Wreckers were drawn to [[Velocitron]] after a terrorist cell called [[Mayhem]] interrupted one of their broadcasts to threaten the upcoming [[Speedia 500]] race. {{storylink|Tread & Circuits Part 1}} During recon before the race, Minerva monitored the [[Ascenticon]] racer [[Knock Out (G1)|Knock Out]] for Mayhem sympathies, but was only able to conclusively determine he was an arrogant twit. Their surveillance was interrupted when the Wreckers' cameraman [[Circuit (G1)|Circuit]] spotted Mayhem in the city, but was shot down before he could do more. Minerva found him in a bad state and barely managed to get Circuit stabilized back on the ''Stuntmaster''. {{storylink|Tread & Circuits Part 2}}

Mayhem attacked during the race, causing several deaths. While most of the Wreckers were on the speedway, Minerva and the medics were pulled back by [[Security Operations]] during the commotion. {{storylink|Tread & Circuits Part 3}} During the closing ceremonites at the Velocitronian Senate days later, Minerva spotted [[Submarauder (G1)|Submarauder]] of Mayhem making his way towards the balconies. She tried to intervene when he fired a harpoon gun at the new First Senator, Knock Out. Minerva tried to pursue the assassin, but Submarauder abandoned his Pretender shell and left it behind to detonate with hidden explosives. Minerva was disoriented by the blast and found by Security Operations clutching the assassin's weapon. She was arrested under suspicion of attempted murder. [[Thunder Clash]] and Minerva agreed to let Sec-Ops sort out the problem, letting the Wreckers leave Velocitron to maintain their cover. However, Minerva soon learned Mayhem and Sec-Ops had been in cahoots with the Ascenticons from the start. Knock Out's victory and rise to power had been deliberately orchestrated, and he sentenced Minerva to indefinite stasis once the Wreckers cleared out. {{storylink|Tread & Circuits Part 4}}

==Games==
===''Transformers: Earth Wars''===
{{chargamestub|{{storylink|Transformers: Earth Wars}}}}

==Toys==
===''Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers''===
{{anchor|Super-God Masterforce}}
[[File:MF-toy Minerva.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|The three vehicle-mounted weapons fire aspirin, we promise.]]
*'''Minelba''' {{sic}} (Headmaster Junior, [[1988]])
**''ID number'': '''C-303'''
**''Accessories'': Transtector, seat/helmet, left & right "Shock Blasters", "Shock Gun"
{{toydesigner|[[Ban Magami]] (concept artist)}}

:Minerva's Transtector is referred to as an ambulance, but let's be honest—it's a Porsche 959 with an emergency rescue color scheme that wouldn't likely be very useful in transporting patients around. The roof is hinged and can be opened to reveal an interior cockpit that Minerva herself can sit inside of; the prominent hinge itself is rather cleverly disguised as a lightbar, something that Minerva's American mold-partner, [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]], lacks. Her Shock Blasters plug in just above the vehicle's headlights, while her larger Shock Gun can be plugged onto the roof.

:In robot mode, Minerva's cockpit seat becomes a helmet, into which the small Shock Blasters plug as antennae. Like all Headmaster toys, Minerva has a flip-down panel on her chest which covers a spring-loaded mini-Tech-Spec-meter which gives readings for Speed, Strength and Intelligence. The tumblers are activated when Minerva (or any other Headmaster unit) is plugged into the neck socket. Minerva has her robot mode face plainly visible on her back because, as a smaller Headmaster toy, she lacks the flip down panel that covers the face featured on larger Headmasters. As another consequence of being a smaller Headmaster, Minerva's chest cavity was apparently too small for 3 individual tumblers. As a result, all Headmaster heads inserted will display her pre-molded (and painted) Speed, Strength, and Intelligence readings (7, 5, 8) on one large sliding plate.

:As noted above, Minerva shares a mold with the American Headmaster Nightbeat, but it is unclear which character came first in the design process.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/1988/Cybertron/Minerva/minerva.htm More information on Minerva at TFU.info]''

{{-}}{{anchor|Nightbeat}}
[[File:G1Nightbeat toy.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|Not-Beat.]]
*'''Minerva Night Beat''' (Headmaster Junior, 1988)
**''Accessories'': Transtector, seat/helmet, left & right Shock Blasters, Shock Gun

: Essentially just a Japanese release of [[Hasbro]]'s Nightbeat toy, this version of the Minerva toy was only available by mail order, for the price of 1800 yen and four [[Robot Point]]s. It is unknown if this version of the toy came in a simple mailer box or in [[Hasbro]] packaging.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/1988/Autobot/Nightbeat/nightbeat.htm More information on Minerva Night Beat (well, Nightbeat) at TFU.info]''
{{-}}

===''Legacy''===
[[File:TF-Legacy-Deluxe-Minerva.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|She may not be a Headmaster anymore, but at least this one won't cost you three grand.]]
*'''Autobot Minerva''' (Deluxe Class, [[2022]])
**''TakaraTomy ID number'': '''TBA'''
**''TakaraTomy release date'': TBA
**''Accessories'': Twin [[Energon]] blasters, lightbar
{{toydesigner|[[Mark Maher]] (Hasbro)}}

: ''[[Transformers: Legacy|Legacy]]'' Deluxe Class Minerva is a redeco and new head retool of Legacy Deluxe Class [[Elita One (G1)#Legacy|Elita-1]] that transforms into a Cybertronian buggy. Like Elita, her backpack kibble can be arranged in a Super God Masterforce accurate set of pauldrons, or bunched together behind her torso. As a retool of Elita, she lacks a Headmaster gimmick. Though this has been the case in some previous fiction, designer [[Mark Maher]] justified this change as "losing her headmaster ability when she came through the portal" from the "Super-God Masterforce Universe" to the Legacy toyline's ambiguous setting.<ref>[https://www.instagram.com/p/CkR9XtJM0g-/ Design notes on ''Legacy'' Minerva] from Hasbro designer [[Mark Maher]].</ref> What exactly this means for her human pilot is probably best not dwelt upon.

: Her accessories include the same blasters from Elita-1 both cast in a translucent white plastic, with the blaster based on her original weapon painted black, while the one based on Elita's remains unpainted, as well as an ambulance lightbar that can be attached to her alt mode.

: Over half a year earlier, it was previewed in [[IDW Publishing]]'s ''[[Transformers: Wreckers—Tread & Circuits|Tread & Circuits]]'' comic book. In North America, this figure was [[exclusive]]ly available at [[Walgreens]], but it was sold first by In Demand Toys in the [[United Kingdom|UK]] before any official announcement from [[Hasbro]].

{{--}}

==Merchandise==
===Super Collection Figure===
[[File:SCF MinervaRobot.jpg|thumb|300px|I will NOT make the Knee Test!]]
*'''Minerva''' (2001)
**''ACT'': '''2'''
**''Accessories'': Stand

: A PVC figurine of Minerva, based on her robot mode character model, was available in the second "act" of [[TakaraTomy|Takara]]'s ''[[Heroes of Cybertron|Super Collection Figure]]'' line. Her simple assembly gives her some limited articulation, with swivels at the neck, shoulders and forearms.

: Like all the figures in the act, she was available as both a standard full-color figure, and as a colorless clear plastic version, one of each in a case of twelve blind-packed PVCs.

{{--}}

==Notes==
[[File:Chromia Minerva toy.jpg|upright=1.1|thumb|Probably buddies with [[Arcee (Energon)|Ariel Paradron-Type]].]]
*Upon her release, Minerva was the first female Transformer toy. Many years later, though, her position would be retroactively usurped when [[Freezon]] was retconned into being female.
*Although Minerva's Transtector doesn't have room to ferry patients like a real ambulance would (which is what it's referred to being as), it would qualify as a {{w|fly-car}} due to it having a faster response time to emergencies (and saving ambulance resources if the situation is minor).
*Minerva's color scheme was used for the DVD-exclusive "White Version" [[redeco]] of ''[[Transformers: Cybertron (toyline)|Cybertron]]'' [[Thunderblast (Decepticon)#Minerva|Thunderblast]]. It made her look quite like [[Override (Cybertron)|Override]].
*Like all non-toy robot [[Kreon]]s in the ''Kre-O'' manga, Minerva is made from existing ''Kre-O'' parts. She uses the ever-popular [[Hound (G1)/toys#Kre-O|Hound]] helmet, though it's a little hard to tell just what she has attached to her arms due to the small size of the comic.

===Foreign names===
*''English:'' '''Nightbeat''' ([[Omni Productions]] dub)
*''Italian:'' '''Phantom'''
*''Russian:'' '''Vetochka''' (Веточка, "Tree Branch")
*''Spanish:'' '''Cher''' (America)

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Female Transformers]]
[[Category:Japanese-original Transformers]]
[[Category:Kre-O Autobots]]
[[Category:Kreons]]
[[Category:Legacy Autobots]]
[[Category:Legends Autobots]]
[[Category:Medics]]
[[Category:Super-God Masterforce Autobots]]
[[Category:Victory Autobots]]
[[Category:IDW (2019) Autobots]]
[[Category:Wreckers]]

Talk:Lift-Ticket (Diaclone)

2022-09-09T02:47:54Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Mainpic */

== Split proposal ==
So, I just got Selects Lift-Ticket and was wondering about its pronouns (it/it/its, apparently). I noticed there was a split proposal for this article, but there wasn't even a talk page started, let alone a discussion of it. Please note, I didn't propose this split.

So, addressing the question of splitting this article, I would say no, at least for now. This article is still quite short, and splitting it between the Diaclone and (notionally) G1 sections would give us two even shorter articles, one consisting of the brief fiction section, the other of the brief toys section. At this point, there's no real need for this split.

Furthermore, the toys may be from G1-focused lines, but one was a Bot-Con exclusive where the fiction clearly had it coming from the Diaclone part of the multiverse, while the other is from Generation'''s''' which has already featured bots from non-G1 continutities (Hot Shot, Armada Starscream, Galaxy Upgrade Optimus Prime, plus the Prime related toys announced for Legacy), so Lift-Ticket's inclusion there does not necessarily imply being a part of G1. [[User:Waverod|Waverod ✈️]] ([[User talk:Waverod|talk]]) 15:15, 1 March 2022 (EST)

Yeah, I don't think we should be against short articles if they make sense, but given the complete lack of bio and fiction we're getting for the Legacy-associated Diaclone lines, combined with how it's being more ''multiversal'' than WFC's 'G1 all the time' approach, do we actively gain anything by splitting them? [[User:AkibaSilver|AkibaSilver]] ([[User talk:AkibaSilver|talk]]) 19:19, 1 March 2022 (EST)
: I agree with Waverod and Akiba, for all the reasons given. Splitting this just gives us two worse articles instead of one better one. (Plus, like, it's not like Lift-Ticket came with any copy that said it WASN'T actually a person and not some mech-piloted thing.) ((unfortunately)) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] ([[User talk:ItsWalky|talk]]) 19:31, 1 March 2022 (EST)

== Mainpic ==

I'm in favour of the Diaclone boxart as mainpic - with Burn Out and Lift-Ticket's backstories, their original Diaclone toys are implicitly their "original designs", and the art was conveniently even published in a Transformers art book. Plus from a real-world perspective, the original Diaclone toys are invariably going to be what future creators go back to when using Lift-Ticket for fiction or toys again, versus the BotCon toys that are kind of just representative of what the current Skids and Hoist Generations moulds happened to be at the time they were brought into the franchise, y'know? [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 05:00, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:I'm not because the ''Diaclone'' art is not Lift-Ticket (it's also not ''Transformers'' art, which is a rule that should only be broken with really, ''really'', '''''really''''' good reason, like, say, with Cobra Commander's pic). Lift-Ticket has literally never had that combination of body and colors. That's the Diaclone 4WD Hi-Lux Wrecker Type. There is, in fact, a difference. "Lift-Ticket" came into existence through ''Transformers'' as the BotCon toy, and his mainpic should reflect that. And the "future creators" thing is back to the whole issue of trying to "solve" Transformers and second/third-guess every way anyone could conceivably misinterpret everything and fail to look at more than one picture per page that made the whole "citogenesis" thing such a bloated pain. (Relevant message from the Discord: https://discordapp.com/channels/656241088826441729/656248887534944265/1005647033165692979) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 07:23, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::For once I agree whole heartedly with Sipher. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:52, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::I'd say my bigger priority here is that the profile card art looks like ass and being in ''Legacy'' makes them eligible for being ''Transformers'' art. Jala's point isn't about creators referring to the main pics in a fit of "misinterpretation" or whatever, but the simple fact that they're going to refer to the Diaclone designs in all further uses of the characters, not the T30 toys. Which we're already seeing with Masterpiece Burn Out. [[User:Saix|Saix]] ([[User talk:Saix|talk]]) 07:56, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::::I don't think the bad art is a good enough excuse to go with art that isn't of their first explicitly-''Transformers'' forms. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 08:05, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::::I am also in favour of the Diaclone art. Even without it conventiently being included in a Transformers publication, well... these are Diaclone toys being included in the Transformers line and it seems more in spirit of what the first-appearance rule entails to use the Diaclone art, rather than the technical reading. Masterpiece Spin-Out and Blue Bluestreak both exist from an alternate Diaclone universe, Legacy toys are being marketed as Diaclone universe. The new Burn Out has a head based on the Diaclone art. They are so close to Transformers they sometimes made it into original Transformers art before production alterations, appearing in murals on the back of the box (if the argument for Diaclone art fails I say we use those instead, those predate FunPub by a few decades) [[User:Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 11:05, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::::::Yeah, I entirely agree with Jala and Saix here. I think that, frankly, sticking with the "first body" rule in this instance is wholly disingenuous - the BotCon design might technically have been the first way he appeared in Transformers media, but that's not the ''basis'' for the design, and pretending otherwise is just silly. The first body rule is a useful guideline, but I don't agree that it should be stuck to with such religious adherence. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 11:38, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::::::Add another vote of support for Jala's proposal. For exactly the reason Riptide gave. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 11:57, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::::::I don't think there's anything to be gained from using back-of-box mural art. I'm 100% in favour of using the package art for the reasons Jala describes. That's just what Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket look like. I'd also be in favour of using it for Delta Magnus, but I think the Masterpiece card art would be a better choice there—certainly, either would be light-years ahead of the comic crop currently used. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 11:41, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::::::I find myself convinced by Riptide's argument as well. I do think it bears remarking we are in no small part ''already'' using retroactively canonized Diaclone assets for Diaclone-derived e-HOBBY characters. Declining to do so for Diaclone-derived characters from other sources (be it BotCon, IDW, or what have you) as they rack up toys transparently based on their "Generation 1" designs feels like the kind of playing coy to the detriment of the reader we try to avoid.

:::::::That said I do also agree with Wadapan that the distinction between Diaclone and Masterpiece character models is largely splitting hairs if folks feel more comfortable going with something akin to the "most prominent body" route when possible. -[[User:AzimuthAcolyte|AzimuthAcolyte]] ([[User talk:AzimuthAcolyte|talk]]) 13:37, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

Except those artworks are NOT MEANT TO BE Lift-Ticket et al. Frankly I'm not a big fan of this tendency to finagle the rules for these BotCon-original characters that keeps happening as of late. I was in favor of it for Flamewar, but that was at least a case of art actually intended to depict Flamewar. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 12:23, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:They're not? The names may have been applied later, but those are absolutely images of the two Diaclone mechs used in that story. There's swathes of characters, many originating from FunPub, that have only been named after the fact, but those retcons don't suddenly make them into separate things, at least not in the wiki's eyes as I understand. In Flamewar's case, we did end up sticking with the original depiction, rather than the revamped body. I would argue that, in the Flamewar case, the BotCon art we stuck with is analogous not to the profile art here as you purport, but to the Diaclone depictions that are the basis for the characters—without even the complicating factor that the redesign has risen to eclipse the original in prominence. It's only through a technicality that the first bodies can be said not to count here, such that instead the one-off aberration in these characters' history (simply a product of the molds available at that time) be given priority. That's the perspective I'm coming from, as someone who prefers the current Flamewar mainpic and likes ''Timelines'' stuff generally, so it's funny to me that you're presenting it like we have some specific bias regarding FunPub stuff. —[[User:The Wadapan|The Wadapan]] ([[User talk:The Wadapan|talk]]) 14:00, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::I didn’t say we didn’t end up with the original Flamewar art? My point is more specifically about us deciding “which is more prominent” which comes up for Shattered Glass et al. In any case, I entirely disagree with the idea that these bits of Diaclone art are explicitly Burn Out and Lift Ticket, because they didn’t exist as characters until 2015. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 14:18, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
As happened the last time there was a "what to do about these Diaclone guys" discussion, I strongly vote against weakening our standards for the sake of some concept of what we think Hasbro might be likely to do next. The new Transformer toy looks the same as the old Diaclone? What a great argument for using the actual Transformer toy's art, then - they even look the same! We should have strong borders between real and not-real Transformer content and firmly respect the chronologies in cases where formerly-not-real things became real. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 14:08, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
: Right. The mechs/humans in question are not real-world ''Diaclone'' characters transplanted into ''Transformers'', they are ''Transformers'' characters created for ''Transformers'' fiction that use ''Diaclone'' as a conceptual origin but ''do not exist in actual real-world Diaclone'', plus the "Dialcone universe" they hail from is similarly made up for ''Transformers'' and dramatically different from the actual original ''Diaclone'' fiction. I think that it's important to respect that real-world origin rather than obfuscate it, even if the most full-body art we have is not good and the company responsible is... ''yeah''. The old ''Diaclone'' art is ''inspiration'' for the ''Transformers'' characters, and we should use imagery of their ''Transformers'' origin. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 18:02, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

Okay, here's an alternate argument. Lift-Ticket and Burn Out are (explicitly, in-universe) imports of the Diaclone mechs given names and expanded backstories. Their BotCon toys were released in 2015. ''[[Legacy: The Art of Transformers Packaging]]'' was released in 2014. Thus, the first published images of those mechs in Transformers media used the Diaclone boxart, and as such those ARE their first bodies from Transformers media. As such, under a strict reading of the rules, we should use the Legacy art for the mainpics. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 14:39, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

Just to loop back to Sipher's first reply quickly to clarify myself, I'm 100% not suggesting this in terms of a "trying to prevent citogenesis" mindset or whatever, but just from taking a realistic perspective about how this character is going to be handled going forward. Lift-Ticket is, ultimately, defined by being a Transformers import of the red Diaclone Wrecker toy and - regardless of what ''we'' use as a mainpic, because, to be clear, I'm not making that argument - when in future there's a Masterpiece, or another Gens toy, or whatever, it's gonna be that Diaclone toy they go back to, not the BotCon one. In my mind at least, I've always understood the logic of the "first body rule" to be that that first design is the "core" of that character, the original source from which all later designs exist in relation to. For Lift-Ticket and Burn Out, that original source ultimately ''isn't'' the BotCon toys and their reused IDW designs, it's the Diaclone toys, and, ''personally'', I think it better serves the casual reader to take a more pragmatic approach with how we define these characters, rather than treating them as if the BotCon toy designs are their visual origin point? I ultimately don't actually feel strongly enough about this to argue it much longer, but that's my take on the matter. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] ([[User talk:Jalaguy|talk]]) 15:05, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::Our readers are not stupid. They can figure out for themselves these sorts of things. I'm not convinced that a casual reader would know what Diaclone is half the time, and frankly I think putting the Diaclone art would be essentially lying to them by making them think it was an original Generation 1 toy. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 06:55, 30 August 2022 (EDT)
: Well phrased - I entirely agree. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 17:19, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:That strikes me as the same argument as using, say, the Knickerbocker "Speedar" art as Windcharger's mainpic, which I also would argue against. As noted above, trying to stick with "what Hasbro might do" is a bad idea just in general, as if Has/Tak ever revisit the characters going forward (huge "if" admittedly but still we live in an age of miracle and wonder), they're going to use whatever vaguely Hoistlike/Skidslike molds they have available regardless of said molds' fidelity to the granular details of prior iterations/inspirations. I mean, Legacy Burn has the entirely wrong head for either the prior BC ''or'' Diaclone iteration, for crying out loud. And on top of the issues of preserving the actual real-world character history (again, they're not actually ''Diaclone'' characters and we shouldn't pretend they are or present them in a way that makes them appear to be), frankly I'm not keen on encouraging the snake to keep eating its own tail. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]])
::Sincere question - what exactly is the point of the "first body rule" if not preserving character design lineage, as Jalaguy described? I want to understand properly where you're coming from.
::(Also, and I recognise that this kind of contradicts me asking you for clarification - as a guy who directly worked on Burn Out and Lift-Ticket's BotCon incarnations, aren't you maybe a bit too close to the issue to get directly involved on the wiki?) --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 18:50, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::You're vastly misinterpreting/nitpicking the "first body" guideline; by that logic, we should default to nothing but Diaclone/Microman/Knickerbocker/Beetras/etc concept imagery because that was the "character design lineage" origin point. We've always operated using the characters' real-world ''Transformers'' premiere as the mainpic basis, and we don't go changing that to chase whatever the character happens to look like in the franchise's immediate ''now''. And just to make the overall point of the guideline clearer, we've ''always'' had wiggle room allowing for the effectively-simultaneous release of toys with often-significantly-different-looking media designs to reflect that semicomplicated character origin. As for ''these'' characters, their real-world premiere is the ''Transformers'' BotCon toy set, the simultaneous release of the media depicts them with those designs, and that was their only depiction for over half a decade. The mainpic should reflect that, not non-''Transformers'' art for non-''Transformers'' toys from a non-''Transformers'' line from three decades prior that served as their ''inspiration'' (a word that's become super-overused as of late but sometimes it is, in fact, accurate).
:::As for "worked on", I had nothing to do with the toys' creation, that was decided and done and sent to the factories long before I had any involvement with the project. I co-wrote a comic script involving them that was largely ignored. And I would argue the same for anything I was 100% unconnected to (and ''have'': Flamewar). --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] ([[User talk:M Sipher|talk]]) 20:23, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::::Right, I understand there's always been flexibility, but that's more of a "how" than a "why". From what you're saying, I guess the reasoning for the first body guideline is... so we don't have to update mainpics, I guess? I don't think I'm quite understanding.
::::As for the "well why don't we use the pre-transformer designs for everyone then"... we kind of do? Like, for instance, Optimus's mainpic is (an interpretation of) the Diaclone design. He's just appeared enough that we have options outside of the Battle Convoy art. I don't think that argument holds much water.
::::(And, as I've mentioned - the Diaclone art and BotCon toy both represent the red towtruck Diaclone mecha, and the Diaclone art was published in ''Legacy'' - a piece of official, licensed Transformers media - nine months before the BotCon toy was released. What makes one depiction valid and the other not?) --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:59, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::::I think claiming that the Legacy page is intending to represent anything when Legacy is an out-of-universe guidebook showcasing real-world things is a bit willfully ignorant when it comes to this very much based in fiction issue. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 21:32, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::::::I don't really see why? It's no more out-of-universe than the boxart itself. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 22:54, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::::::The cardart is on a tech specs. That puts it in the realm of fiction. The Legacy book is a non-fiction book. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 06:55, 30 August 2022 (EDT)
:The "Legacy" art is unnamed - it's a full-page spread of multiple art samples all just labeled "Diaclone", in a section titled "Pre-Transformer Oddities." The characters of BO and LT are not named because, of course, they didn't exist yet. "This is something alive that exists in the TF universe" came from after that. The source we would be citing for TF art says it isn't TF art. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 19:25, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::But Burn Out and Lift-Ticket are, explicitly, both in- and out-of-universe, the Diaclone mechs given names. We have one piece of art in officially-published Transformers media of the red Diaclone tow-truck mech, and another piece of art in officially-published Transformers media of the red Diaclone tow-truck mech, and it seems absurd to me to say that they're not representative of the same "character". --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 19:49, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
:::For the record, Riptide, I think the "Legacy" argument is strong - but it's a strong self-contradictory argument for us doing something that is self-contradictory. We are being asked to say the "This is not a pipe" painting is a pipe, because we can point at it with an Impossible Trident. This is a case that is epistemologically difficult for our organizational systems (or at least, it is for me). --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] ([[User talk:Thylacine 2000|talk]]) 19:54, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
::::Yeah, I can understand that - it is an inherently nebulous situation. I will admit that the "Legacy is technically first" argument is at least a little tongue in cheek; "I don't think we should be so strict about the first body rule, but if we ARE going to be strict about it, ''technically'' we should be using the Legacy art anyway". Personally, I wouldn't be arguing so strongly in favour of it if not for the fact that it acts as the origin point of the design lineage AND represents the same in-universe Diaclone mech AND was published in TF source; it's the combination of factors that makes it feel silly to avoid using it, to me. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 20:03, 29 August 2022 (EDT)
So here's the thing - the whole "this BotCon toy was so totally meant to reference the Diaclone toy" - a toy, a concept that only becomes part of the Transformers franchise proper at the moment LT/BO are released. In the lore, yes, the Diaclone Red Wrecker has always been called LT. But not in the real world and also not in the actual Transformers franchise which this wiki purports to document. We don't do this for Loudpedal or Road Rage, we use the MP bio card art. Those are IMO roughly comparable conceptually, and in that case, we're using the "first body." The TF fiction created the character where the toy used to be. Prior to that, it was a blank canvas for you to project your own theories onto... much like the DK-series toys still are today, I guess, and we use photos of the toys for those two... so in each case, we're talking about two or three pages tops. Just stick to "first appearance in TF fiction body" for the Diaclone crew. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] ([[User talk:Hooper X|talk]]) 20:28, 29 August 2022 (EDT)

I'm going to bring up this: [https://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?title=Nemesis_Prime_(G1)&oldid=801378].
This is what using these mainpics feels like to me. Yes, it is certainly similar to what Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket look like (and admittedly they are closer in terms of real-world conception than this revision to Nemesis Prime), but it's not what either the original Diaclone artists, nor Jim or Bill when they complied the book, had in mind when they created/complied this artwork. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 06:59, 30 August 2022 (EDT)
:See this is what using the Bot-Con art comes off as to me. Sure, Optimus Prime was a car one time and got repainted into Nemesis before a truck did. But it is obtuse to use the first appearance over the Diaclone box-art/Legacy book/Legacy toyline appearances. As Jalaguy said above about not being obtuse to casual readers and representing the core of the character, rather than going with the technically correct answer. I think, while the Legacy book people weren't sitting there waiting for it to be put on the main-page of the wiki article. Absolutely the intent of Lift-Ticket, Burn-Out and every other Diaclone import into Transformers is funnily enough, the Diaclones they are importing. The Diaclone artists never intended that guy to be Optimus Prime but that does not change that the Transformers people did. [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 22:47, 8 September 2022 (EDT)

Also now that I think of it, aren't at least some of the the original Diaclone robots meant to be mass-produced? So Burn-Out and Lift-Ticket would only be one individual robot in a series of identical ones. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 07:02, 30 August 2022 (EDT)
:How does this affect anything at all? [[User:Bumblebee2000|Bumblebee2000]] ([[User talk:Bumblebee2000|talk]]) 22:47, 8 September 2022 (EDT)

Does anyone else want to chip in on this? By my count the vote is currently 7:4 in favour of using the ''Legacy'' art, ''and'' there's the fact that the Legacy art was published first and thus ''arguably'' is the true "first body", which indicates to me that we're currently leaning towards a switch back to the ''Legacy'' mainpics. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 17:41, 8 September 2022 (EDT)
:Unless a former Fun Publications staffer can provide clean versions of the BotCon 2015 artworks, I also vote in favour of the ''Diaclone'' packaging art as reprinted in ''Legacy''. [[User:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47]] ([[User talk:S.H.I.E.L.D. Agent 47|talk]]) 17:53, 8 September 2022 (EDT)
::ALso in favor of using the Legacy art as the mainpic for the reasons stated above. - [[User:Archforce|Archforce]] ([[User talk:Archforce|talk]]) 19:33, 8 September 2022 (EDT)
:It's absolutely not "arguably" the true first body. Pretending that the Diaclone art published in Legacy in any way represents two characters who hadn't been created yet just because they are technically based on the toys those artworks represent is an act of willful ignorance of the first body rule. This isn't us "bending" the rules, this is us breaking them, and it's insane to pretend otherwise. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon|talk]]) 21:30, 8 September 2022 (EDT)
::Mm, no, see, it IS arguable, because we're arguing it. Burn Out and Lift-Ticket are identities assigned to the Diaclone mecha, and we have pictures of the Diaclone mecha that predate the BotCon toys that were based on them. From both an in-universe and out-of-universe perspective, these are the same character/concept, from my perspective. --[[User:Riptide|Riptide]] ([[User talk:Riptide|talk]]) 21:53, 8 September 2022 (EDT)
:I agree with changing the mainpic. [[User:McBaggins|McBaggins]] ([[User talk:McBaggins|talk]]) 21:42, 8 September 2022 (EDT)

Cog (G1)

2022-09-05T15:57:12Z

Bumblebee2000: /* War for Cybertron: Siege */ Added Legacy Redeco. Not sure if this is the ideal way to incorporate into the existing list of virtual redecos but it is at least present now

{{featured}}
{{factions|autobot}}
{{disambigm|Cog (disambiguation)|Gasket (disambiguation)}}
:''Cog is an [[Autobot]] from the [[Generation 1 continuity family]].''
[[File:TV Magazine Cog.jpg|upright=1.67|thumb|Clockwise from top: Cog, Gasket, and Grommet. Not pictured: Widget, Doodad, and Thingamajigger.]]

'''Cog''' is the combined robotic form of [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]]'s vehicular drones, '''Gasket''' and '''Grommet'''. Cog has no independent will of his (its?) own and is completely under Maximus's control. Functioning as both mechanic and warrior, he allows Fortress Maximus to be at other places while in city mode, as well as to interact with more normally-sized beings.<ref>Fortress Maximus's bios in the [[The Transformers Universe|Marvel ''Transformers Universe'']] and [[Transformers: More than Meets the Eye|Dreamwave ''More than Meets the Eye'']]. Remarkably, the two bios entirely agree with each other's presentation of Cog, as his drone status had already been established in Fortress Maximus's on-package bio.</ref>

When Cog is feeling at his most sentient, he's quick to express skepticism in his leaders' actions, even directly to [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]]. Someone's got to be the wet blanket, because sometimes the wet blanket's correct.

==Fiction==
===Marvel ''The Transformers'' comics===
[[File:Marvelhm01 Cog speaks.jpg|left|thumb|Dammit, Max, stop doing your ventriloquist act and ''fight!'']]
[[File:Marvelhm01 gasketandgourmet.jpg|165px|thumb|Dammit, Max, stop repainting your drones and ''fight!'']]

Cog was among [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]]'s troops that ambushed a prisoner-of-war death march led by [[Scorponok (G1)|Scorponok]]. He stood at Fortress Maximus's side as he held the troops, waiting for the perfect moment to strike, then split into his component vehicles Gasket and Grommet for the attack. Cog returned to [[robot mode]] by the time the Decepticons' battle line broke, and he counseled Fortress Maximus to finish off the fleeing Decepticons. Maximus refused, instead calling for a mutual retreat. Both Cog's [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]]s were seen returning to the [[Manganese Mountains]] with the rescued prisoners.

Much later, after a disastrous military confrontation with the natives on planet [[Nebulos]], [[:File:Marveluk133 cog sedition.jpg|Cog]] was one of the Autobots that gathered around [[Kup (G1)|Kup]] to talk smack about Fortress Maximus's pacifist-aggressive leadership style. {{storylink|Ring of Hate!}}
{{-}}

===''The Transformers'' cartoon===
[[File:Gasket-Grommet Rebirth3.jpg|thumb|upright=0.6]]
Gasket and Grommet acted as turrets for [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]]'s third mode during the giant Autobot's barrage on [[Scorponok (G1)|Scorponok]] and the [[Decepticon]]s. {{storylink|The Rebirth, Part 3}}
{{-}}

===''Beast Wars: Uprising''===
Cog, Gasket, and Grommet were identified as some of the names or aspects of [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]] in the Builders' era when [[Survive]] led a unit to eliminate the robot/base. {{storylink|Head Games}}

===''Legends'' comic===
In [[2038]], Cog became a butler and attendant to Fortress of [[Master (planet)|Master]]. In the past, Fortress had risked his health whenever he combined with his Battleship Maximus [[Transtector|transtector]] to become the massive and powerful Fortress Maximus. Cog helped circumvent Fortress's problems by combining with the battleship too, serving as Fortress's life support system. Together, they formed "Weaponizer Fortress Maximus" and joined many Autobot Supreme Commanders in defending Cybertron from [[Dark Nova|Unicron Neo]]. {{storylink|The Road to Legends' Revival Chapter 4: LG-EX Big Powered Prologue Part One|Big Powered Prologue, Part 1}}

===''War for Cybertron Trilogy'' continuity===
====''War for Cybertron Trilogy'' marketing material====
[[File:Siege-Cog-art.jpg|thumb|upright=0.6|Cry “havoc!” and let slip the Cogs of ''War for Cybertron''!]]
On Cybertron, Cog was a [[Cybertronian military insignia|Ground Command Artillery Sergeant]], whose function was a mechanic. {{storylink|War for Cybertron: Siege|''Siege'' webpage}}<ref name=Siege>[https://transformers.hasbro.com/en-us/brands/siege ''Siege'' website]</ref> During the war for Cybertron, Cog was deployed to the [[Manganese Mountains]], whose rough terrain provided cover for him and other Autobots. This advantage protected them from detection as [[Seeker (body-type)|Seekers]] made patrols in the area. {{storylink|Source:Teletraan-1 Data Files|''Siege'' Teletraan-1 Data Files}}<ref name=Siege/>

Cog arrived on a flame-wreathed battlefield to give [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] a firepower boost against [[Flywheels|Skytread]]. After Cog combined with Sideswipe, they gained the upper hand until [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] arrived on the scene. He hit Sideswipe so hard that Cog was reduced to a pile of his own parts lying on the ground. {{storylink|Source:Teletraan-1 Data Files#Autobots vs. Decepticons stop motion|Autobots vs. Decepticons stop motion}}

====''War for Cybertron Trilogy'' cartoon====
{{voiceactor| [[Brian Robert Burns]] (English), [[Yūki Shin]] (Japanese)|[[Yann Sundberg]] (French), [[Johann Fohl]] (German), [[Alan Bravo]] (Latin-American Spanish)}}

[[File:SiegeEpisode2-Cog.jpg|left|thumb|300px|I'm here to finally show up in a cartoon and support Optimus Prime, and I'm all out of supporting Optimus Prime!]]

When [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] reported to the Autobots camped within the ''[[Ark (G1)|Ark]]'' that [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]] had surrendered to [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]], Cog warned that them Ultra Magnus knew the location of their base and all their secrets. Therefore, his actions had put them all in danger. After Optimus explained to everyone that Ultra Magnus had sent a message claiming Megatron was hunting for the [[AllSpark]], Cog countered that A) the AllSpark was a myth and B) any action the Autobots could take to counter this plan could be a trap. Cog was among the Autobots who checked out the coordinates in Ultra Magnus' message before being surrounded by hostile Decepticons, as he had predicted. Cog was shot through his midsection by [[Impactor (G1)|Impactor]] and had to be dragged off the battlefield. Once back at the ''Ark'', Cog was repaired by [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]]. {{storylink|Siege episode 2}}

[[File:SiegeEpisode5-WeaponizedCog.jpg|thumb|300px|I make other people awesome!]]

After Cog returned to duty, Optimus used the [[Alpha Trion Protocols]] to locate the AllSpark within the [[Rust Sea|Sea of Rust]]. Cog warned Optimus that no Autobot who entered the region had ever returned. While Optimus led a team into the Sea of Rust despite his warnings, Cog joined [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] and [[Arcee (G1)|Arcee]] in grifting [[Energon]] from the elusive [[Mercenary]] [[Soundblaster (G1)|Soundblaster]]. Thanks to [[Buzzsaw (G1)|Buzzsaw]], however, Soundblaster found the trio out. Cog transformed and weaponized Arcee to aid in their escape. {{storylink|Siege episode 5}} Returning to the ''Ark'' with enough Energon to power its launch, Cog helped defense the ship from a Decepticon siege as it flew towards a [[space bridge]]. Ultimately, Cog and the rest of the ''Ark'' crew disappeared through the space bridge to a location unknown. {{storylink|Siege episode 6}}

[[File:WFC-Earthrise-Ep6-Cog-dying-in-Fortune.jpg|thumb|left|300px|I'm no longer going to make people awesome...]]
Cog was on the bridge of the ''Ark'' as it mistakingly journeyed through the [[Dead Universe]]. {{Storylink|Earthrise episode 5}} After exiting the Dead Universe, the ''Ark'', ''[[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]]'', and ''[[Fool's Fortune]]'' locked in a dogfight over [[Earth]]. Coming upon Optimus locked in battle with Megatron, Cog arrived just in time to see Optimus violently threaten Megatron's life. When the ''Fool's Fortune'' fired on the ''Ark'', Cog was sucked into space through a hole in the ship. Infiltrating the Mercenary ship, Cog knocked both [[Bug Bite (G1)|Bug Bite]] and [[Exhaust]] overboard, before making his way to the ship's bridge. Finding that Deseeus was controlling the ship in an attempt to destroy the Autobots and Decepticons, Cog pulled a gun on the Quintesson and shot off one of his tentacles. After being knocked into Doubledealer's chair by a blast from the ''Nemesis'', Cog was stabbed by Deseeus as he made his escape. The mortally wounded Cog sent a message to both the ''Ark'' and the ''Nemesis'' that he had taken the ''Fool's Fortune'' and asked them to stop firing. Unfortunately, the ''Fool's Fortune'' exploded, killing Cog and sending the other ships crashing down to Earth in the process. {{storylink|Earthrise episode 6}}

While the Autobots and [[Maximal]]s searched for the Allspark in a forest on Earth, the object produced an illusion of Cog to Arcee, as part of its defense mechanism. Arcee admitted that Cog couldn't be real. {{storylink|Kingdom episode 3}} After the Allspark was returned to Cybertron, revitalizing it, the Autobots, Maximals, Decepticons, and Predacons resolved their ongoing war and built a statue depicting an Autobot Cog-model soldier and a Decepticon [[Reflector (G1)|Refraktor]]-model soldier standing together, back-to-back. {{storylink|Kingdom episode 6}}
{{--}}

==Toys==
===''The Transformers''===
[[File:Cogtoy.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|"Sit on my face and tell me that you love me."]]
* '''Fortress Maximus''' (Headmaster Base, 1987)
**''Accessories'': "Laser" rifle

: Cog was only available as part of the [[Fortress Maximus (G1)/toys#Toys|Fortress Maximus]] set. He is formed by combining the two armored cars, Gasket and Grommet; the process involves little more than removing Gasket's arms and re-pegging them on his sides and then pegging the two vehicles together. The top of Gasket's [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]] is sculpted to securely fit [[Spike Witwicky (G1)#Toys|Spike]] (pictured) or any other large Headmaster figure.

:Cog, Gasket, and Grommet were redecoed into [[Grand Maximus#Toys|Grand Maximus]]'s [[Cog (Masterforce)#Toys|Cog, Onomisu, and Koka]], and [[Fortress Maximus (RID)#Toys|Cybertron City]]'s [[Gadep#Toys|Gadep, Guardia, and Protect]].

::* ''[http://www.tfu.info/1987/Autobot/Cog/cog.htm More information on Cog at TFU.info]''

===''Encore''===
*'''Fortress Maximus''' (Headmaster Base, 2013)

:The first re-release of Fortress Maximus in ''[[Transformers Encore|Encore]]'' comes with Cog once again. There are no significant differences between the re-release Cog and the original.
{{-}}

===''War for Cybertron: Siege''===
{{anchor|Generations}}
[[File:War-for-Cybertron-Siege-Deluxe-Cog.jpg|thumb|300px|He's back, in Cog form!]]
*'''Cog''' (Deluxe Weaponizer, [[2019]])
**''Hasbro ID number'': '''WFC-S8'''
**''TakaraTomy ID number'': '''SG-05'''
**''TakaraTomy release date'': [[February 23]], [[2019]]
**''Hidden message code'': '''FORTRESSMAXIMUS'''
**''Accessories'': 2 "RT-5 Circuit Welder" pistols

:Part of the first wave of ''[[War for Cybertron: Siege|Siege]]'' Deluxe Class figures, Cog transforms from robot into armored vehicle and back. Cog also retains his ability to split into Gasket and Grommet, a trait proudly demonstrated by the packaging artwork. His official alternate mode is a combined half-track vehicle consisting of the two individual vehicles plugged together. However, the flat rectangular tab that holds them together doesn't have a particularly tight fit and has a tendency to come undone during handling. With multiple [[5 mm post|5 mm ports]] and 3 mm posts, he can also accommodate "Fire Blast" effect pieces from the [[Battle Master]]s assortment to simulate blaster fire, or ''taking'' blaster fire. His forearms also have minor hints of battle damage. Cog's transformation is also the most simple of the ''Siege'' "Weaponizer" molds, as it only requires the detachment of three parts.

:As a Weaponizer, he can also be disassembled into an arsenal of weapons, armor, and other upgrades compatible with various other ''Siege'' figures as part of the interchangeable/connectable-weapon [[C.O.M.B.A.T. System]]... or, really, ''any'' figures with [[5 mm post]] attachment points. He splits into a "C-40 Neutron Synthesis Shield" (torso), "C-LR Thermal Booster" (hips and waist), two "C-HV Electro-Scramblers" (arms), and two "C-M3 HF Spectrum Disruptors" (legs), with a pair of "RT-5 Circuit Welders" (his handguns) left over. His instructions show two suggested combinations with ''Siege'' Deluxe Class [[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#War for Cybertron: Siege|Sideswipe]]: the "Defensive Loadout" turns Cog into a shield, pair of platform shoes, and an anti-aircraft backpack, while the "Offensive Loadout" uses nearly all his parts to make a huge artillery-laden backpack with marginally bigger cannons. "[[The Road to Legends' Revival Chapter 4: LG-EX Big Powered Prologue Part One]]" of the ''[[Transformers Legends (comic)|Legends]]'' comic includes a configuration with ''[[Transformers Legends (franchise)|Legends]]'' [[Fortress Maximus (G1)/toys#Legends|Fortress Maximus]] (and of course, any of his redecoes), which turns Cog into four pieces of weaponry to attach to the Titan.

:Cog's "G1" toy and character model both have his front portion as a six-wheeled vehicle, with the middle pair of wheels being coloured gray (as they're molded into the torso). The ''Siege'' toy reinterprets this central pair as simply being circular detail for the shoulder joints. Meanwhile, the treads of the back portion of the vehicle have been flipped upside-down, perhaps to better hide the wheels the toy rolls on. The treads are actually removable, each tightly attached with three small pegs, and can be swapped, but sculpting on the inside stops them from sitting flush in anything other than the default position.

:The 5 mm pegs on his guns are trimmed on the side, and consequently don't fit securely into his hands or the 5 mm ports on other figures. Additionally, most of the pegholes featured on Cog's body are in fact hexagonal as opposed to circular, which combined with the trimmed circles leaves them unable to stay positioned properly. A [[Variant#Running changes|running change]] solved this problem by slightly altering the shape of the handles to make them rounder; this change was retained in later versions of the mold.

:Though designated for release in the first quarter of 2019, Cog's wave reached U.S. store shelves in late 2018.

:This mold serves as the basis for the [[Comms Officer]], [[Security Officer (G1)|Security Officer]], and other assorted [[generic]] Autobots from the [[Transformers: War for Cybertron Trilogy (cartoon)|Netflix cartoon]] and was [[retool]]ed with a new head to make ''Siege'' [[Aragon#Generations|Aragon]]. A redeco of Cog (with additional accessories) was later released, based on the Netflix [[Security Officer (G1)#Legacy|Security Officer]]
::*''[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60kQRdKs6u8 Official conversion video at the TRANSFORMERS OFFICIAL YouTube channel]''
{{--}}

==Games==
===''Transformers Trading Card Game''===
[[File:W3SergeantCog.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|Having a new toy does wonders for an old obscure bot's exposure.]]
*'''Sergeant Cog, Artillery-Mechanic/Heavy Force Defensebreaker Cannon''' (2019)
**'''Wave 3: War for Cybertron: Siege I'''
**''Rarity: '''''SRT'''
**''Card Number: '''''T42/T48'''
**''Stars: ''10
:Sergeant Cog, Artillery-Mechanic is one of forty-eight double-sided character cards available in Wave 3 of the ''[[Transformers Trading Card Game]]'', War for Cybertron: Siege I. As a [[C.O.M.B.A.T. System|Weaponizer]], Sergeant Cog, Artillery-Mechanic begins the game in Bot Mode. Instead of being sent to the KO Area once his Health drops to zero, the card is flipped to the Upgrade side, becoming the Heavy Force Defensebreaker Cannon, and equipped in the Weapons slot of another character on the player's side of the battlefield.
{{--}}

==Notes==
[[File:Marveluk130 cog dewback.jpg|110px|thumb|You're ''not helping,'' England.]]
* Cog and his components were variously miscolored in almost every appearance in the ''[[The Transformers: Headmasters|Headmasters]]'' book. Such art errors were common in the miniseries. [[:File:Marvelhm01 gromet decepticon.jpg|The one time]] any of his components was colored ''right'' was when Grommet was shown fighting alongside the [[Decepticon]]s.
* Cog's appearance in the ''Headmasters'' comic is a possible art error: he's colored like [[Hardhead (G1)|Hardhead]], and his advice to Fortress Maximus suits Hardhead's aggressive nature. So a possible explanation is that Hardhead was incorrectly drawn as Cog, and [[Nelson Yomtov|the colorist]] was actually using the correct color scheme from the scripted character. This is supported by the fact that Fortress Maximus is also colored correctly—but is drawn like Hardhead!
* In the UK printing, someone noticed the errors and decided that the colors and script were wrong, not the line-art. So the dialogue was changed to have Cog addressing Hardhead, not Fortress Maximus. Unfortunately, not only does this negate the possibility that what appears to be Cog is actually Hardhead himself, but it also attributes the followup line ("There's been enough destruction!") to Hardhead, which does not suit his personality at all.
*Cog's comic book appearance uses Cerebros's cartoon head design. In turn, ''Siege'' Cog homages Cerebros's distinct mouthplate as opposed to the traditional mouthplate on his original toy.
*Gasket and Grommet's "appearance" in "The Rebirth" is due to their toys having the gimmick of being able to be stored in Fortress Maximus's feet. This was likely the case in photos of the toy given to the animation studio, which led to the character model for Fortress Maximus's third mode including the cannons in the feet.

===Foreign names===
*''Japanese:'' '''Cog''' (コグ ''Kogu''), '''Gasket''' (ガスケット ''Gasuketto''), '''Gromme''' (グロメ ''Gurome'')
*''Hungarian:'' '''Tengely''' ("Axis")

==References==
<references />

[[Category:Beast Wars: Uprising Autobots]]
[[Category:Combined forms]]
[[Category:Generation 1 Autobots]]
[[Category:Generation 1 drones]]
[[Category:Generation 1 cartoon Autobots]]
[[Category:Legends Autobots]]
[[Category:Mechanics]]
[[Category:Multi-component Transformers]]
[[Category:War for Cybertron: Earthrise Autobots]]
[[Category:War for Cybertron: Siege Autobots]]
[[Category:Weaponizers]]

The Transformers: Lost Light

2022-09-04T10:08:30Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Overview */ link fixes, sorry

{{disambig2|the comic series|the titular starship|Lost Light}}
[[File:LL1_regcvr.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|[[The Dying of the Light: (1) How Bright Their Frail Deeds|His light died]], so Rodimus decided to get this [[Black Rodimus Convoy|cool bad guy deco]].]]
'''''The Transformers: Lost Light''''' is a finished comic series, a rebranded version of and sequel to ''[[The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye]]''. Debuting in [[Calendar|December]] [[2016]], it ran alongside sister titles ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' and ''[[The Transformers: Till All Are One|Till All Are One]]''. The story is basically 'Season 3' of ''More Than Meets The Eye'' and leads up to "the grand finale" over two years. <ref>[https://boroughcon.com/2017/04/revealing-greatness-with-james-roberts/ Interview with Boroughcon]</ref> ''Lost Light'' concluded with issue #25 in November [[2018]] as part of the ending of the IDW Universe.

{{chapters|title=''The Transformers: Lost Light'' issues|align=center|prev=The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye|content=
*[[Dissolution Part 1: Some Other Cybertron|#1]]
*[[Dissolution Part 2: Anomie|#2]]
*[[Dissolution Part 3: A World Misplaced|#3]]
*[[Dissolution Part 4: Bad Moon Rising|#4]]
*[[Dissolution Part 5: Modes of Production|#5]]
*[[Dissolution Part 6: This Machine Kills Fascists|#6]]
*[[After Megatron (A Dissolution Epilogue)|#7]]
*[[An Axe to Break the Ice|#8]]
*[[Chasing the Infinite|#9]]
*[[The Plotters' Club (Part 1): Full Circle|#10]]
*[[The Plotters' Club (Part 2): Filling in the Blanks|#11]]
*[[The Plotters' Club (Part 3): Journey's End|#12]]
*[[Sardines|#13]]
*[[The Ties That Bind (issue)|#14]]
*[[Kill All 'Cons|#15]]
*[[The Everlasting Voices (1): Metastasis|#16]]
*[[The Everlasting Voices (2): The God War|#17]]
*[[The Everlasting Voices (3): You Are Here|#18]]
*[[Crucible (Part 1): A Dance Before Dying|#19]]
*[[Crucible (Part 2): Lūstrāre|#20]]
*[[Crucible (Part 3): Farsickness|#21]]
*[[Crucible (Part 4): The Return of the King|#22]]
*[[Crucible (Part 5): The Unremembering|#23]]
*[[Crucible (Part 6): A Spark Among Embers|#24]]
*[[How To Say Goodbye And Mean It: Part 2|#25]]
}}

==Overview==
In the wake of the confrontation with the [[Decepticon Justice Division]] on [[Necroworld]], the marooned [[Team Rodimus (G1)|Team Rodimus]] attempts to return to the ''[[Lost Light]]'' with the help of the "[[Disappeared]]"—the various [[time travel]]ling Transformers plucked from across time and space. Among them are runaway [[blacksmith]]-turned adventurer [[Anode]] and her partner [[Lug (IDW)|Lug]], who struggle to adjust to the present day as they deal with demons from their past.

Before Team Rodimus can get offworld, a rogue [[geobomb]], courtesy of the [[Galactic Council]] shunts the planet into an entirely different universe. When Rodimus and a small crew of Autobots attempt to return to Cybertron, they find themselves in the middle of [[Functionist Universe|an alternate Cybertron]], where [[Megatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Megatron]] was never born and [[Functionism]] reigns supreme. The ''Lost Light'' crew find themselves embroiled in the Council's plot to consolidate their power by crushing the heroic [[Anti-Vocationist League]] and their supporters. With the help of the native universe's [[Rung (G1)|Rung]] — his true function finally revealed — the Autobots manage to foil their plan and return home... but accidentally leave Megatron behind. Taking command of the AVL, Megatron and his old friend [[Terminus (G1)|Terminus]] start their revolution anew.

The crew of the ''Lost Light'' finally get offworld in a mass displaced [[Skip|Decepticon]], but Tailgate, his mutating [[Outlier (group)|outlier]] powers growing increasingly destructive and erratic, volunteers to stay behind in the hopes that a cure can be found for his condition. [[Fangry (G1)|Fangry]], his pride wounded by an earlier encounter with the super-powered Autobot, takes advantage of the situation to bury him alive for another six million years.

With Team Rdoimus back to their search, Nautica leads a small group in an excursion to [[Troja Major]] under the pretense of investigating a map to Cyberutopia she believes a [[Agonizer|Decepticon contact]] of hers might have. Nautica's true motive however is a Resus piece of Knight's technology she believed to be in the markets, with the aim of using it to ressurect [[Skids (G1)#IDW|Skids]], whose [[brain module]] she has kept hidden behind her eyepatch. Meanwhile, Lug and Anode find a [[Infinite|strange Transformer]] who is quickly killed by the [[Black Block Consortia]], before running into a Blacksmith friend, [[Wipe-Out]]. Right behind them are soldiers of the Grand Architect, here to kill their former blacksmith associates. The blacksmiths and Lug escape as the troops deem them less important than reobtaining the Consortia's victim as well as confront its [[Mengel|creator]], another associate of the architect and the very merchant The price for Skid's life is high, and Nautica sells her emotions towards Skids to pay the cost, almost losing her emotions towards best friend [[Velocity (G1)|Lotty]] too, before finally hearing her upset friend's words and accepting that Skids had chosen to give his life to save them. This decision narrowly saves both of their lives as they escape the Architect's troops here to forcefully claim the device, returning it to the Grand Architect, [[Scorponok (G1)#2005 IDW continuity|Scorponok!]]. Returning to the ship, disaster strikes the team as the mass-displaced Skip starts reverting to smaller size, Ratchet starts disappearing and [[Ten]] starts speaking! About the fate of the universe depending on the imminently-dead crew doing what he says, too!

Back on the Lost Light, Getaway finds the deceptive foundations of his new captaincy fragile, and so makes a deal with some devils, Froid and [[Sunder (G1)|Sunder]], using their skills to keep things in control in exchange for feeding members of the crew to the latter. The Protectobots [[Combiner Wars (comic)|return]] to a suspicious welcome, and just as quickly leave with the addition of a rescued [[Thunder Clash|Thunderclash]] and [[Rook (CW)|some]] [[Mirage (G1)#2005 IDW continuity|casualties]] thanks to [[Star Saber (G1)#2005 IDW continuity|another deadly ally]] of Getaway's. Despite the carnage, Getaway is happy; thanks to spacetime portals known as [[Warren|The Warren]], he has lead the quest to victory, Cyberutopia awaits...

Somewhere else, [[Scavenger (group)|The Scavengers]] make a new friend who is not happy to be there but unable to reach [[Deathsaurus (G1)| her commander]] on her communicator. They all get captured by Scorponok, reuniting Grimlock with his [[The Transformers: Maximum Dinobots|old foe]]. They discover Scorponok has created an [[Firstborn|organic Decepticon]] complete with spark, the goal to exploit organic procreation of this genetically-engineered species and harvest the sparks for mechanical bodies to restore the dwindling number of Decepticons. The Scavengers get the upper-hand however, rescuing the Firstborn and obtaining The Magnificence from him before fighting their way off the ship. However, they learn from the Magnificence that the transmat would kill the Firstborn, so Grimlock takes her and forces his friends into the Transmat. Grimlock is left singlehandedly fighting off Scorponok's troops, while the Scavengers are surprised to find themselves in the abandoned prison cell of Grimlock within the abandoned Garrus-9 facility with no way out, trapped forever...

Team Rodimus wake up, unsure of how they survived their predicament. The first answer they find, they are all dead and this is the [[Transformer afterlife|Afterspark]]. The last thing any of them can remember is Ten attempting to direct the ship to Mederi to save them before the mass-displacement completely gave out, leaving the crew to desperately bail out into space. Some believe and make peace, while others remain skeptical. Rodimus, of course, demands to speak to the people in charge, the [[Guiding Hand]].
{{issuestub|remainder of series}}

==Creative team==
[[File:James Roberts and Jack Lawrence.jpg|thumb|300px|Series writer [[James Roberts]] (left) and artist [[Jack Lawrence]] (right)]]
[[James Roberts]] returns as the writer. Due to IDW editorial wanting a fresh artistic start, UK artist [[Jack Lawrence]] replaces previous MTMTE mainstay [[Alex Milne]], with Milne providing alternate covers for issues.<ref>[http://www.forcesofgeek.com/2016/07/sdcc-idw-announces-post-revolution-debuts.html SDCC – IDW Announces Post-Revolution Debuts!]</ref> Milne later provided art for issue #13 of the series. [[Joana Lafuente]] continues to provide colours for most issues, continuing from MTMTE #29.

[[Priscilla Tramontano]] provided art for #8-#9, while [[Andrew Griffith]] covered the four page interlude of issue #12. The 'Scavengers' arc from #14-15 had its art duties shared by [[Sara Pitre-Durocher]] and [[Brendan Cahill]]. [[E. J. Su]] returned to the Transformers series for the beginning of the series final arc, issue #19. Scheduled for bi-monthly release until its end, Cahill will return for #22 and #24, with [[Casey Coller]] working on #20.<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1014524949179109378, James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/07/04]</ref>

==Soundtrack==
Continuing the tradition started in ''MTMTE'', Roberts posted songs on his Twitter as an unofficial soundtrack for each issue leading up to their release. As its predecessor's third "season", it gets its own theme song. Additionally, in October of 2018, leading up to the release of issue #25, Roberts built up a playlist for the series including a mixture of new and old songs; the new ones are listed here.
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxHRXFFigZ0 Graycoated Morning]" by {{w|David & the Citizens}}<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/778020170325454848 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2016/09/20] — "Oh, alright then. Here's your first musical taste of Transformers: Lost Light. Play loud. No, no - louder."</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7mRYLJLB2w Still Fighting it]" by {{w|Ben Folds}} — theme song for Rung<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1037473125217255425 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/09/05] — "And while we’re sharing songs - and given what happened in issues 22 and 23 - now seems like a good time to finally unveil Rung’s theme"</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQmca0NLuq8 Small World]" by {{w|Roddy Frame}}<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1046851766887829505 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/10/01]</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXHd4E-YBx0 Wild Roses]" by {{w|Bill Ryder-Jones}}<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1048190630277664768 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/10/05]</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWWwKDttHnM "Nobody Does it Better]" by {{w|Carly Simon}} — theme song for Skids<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1182796694259404800 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2019/10/11]</ref>

==Collections==
*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 1 TPB ([[October 25]], [[2017]]) ISBN 1631409921 / ISBN 978-1631409929
:Contains issues #1 to #6.
:Bonus material includes a cover gallery.

*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 2 TPB ([[February 14]], [[2018]]) ISBN 1684051487 / ISBN 978-1684051489
:Contains issues #7 to #12.
:Bonus material includes a cover gallery.

*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 3 TPB ([[August 15]], 2018) ISBN 1684053315 / ISBN 978-1684053315
:Contains issues #13 to #18.
:Bonus material includes a cover gallery.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 79: Primeless''''' ([[November 14]], 2018)
:Contains issues #9 to #12, along with ''Optimus Prime'' #9 to #12.
:Bonus material includes a one-page editorial by [[Simon Furman]] that mentions the IDW universe's impending end, a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 4 TPB ([[January 30]], [[2019]]) ISBN 1684054109 / ISBN 978-1684054107
:Contains issues #19 to #25.
:Bonus material CURRENTLY UNKNOWN.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 77: Dissolution''''' ([[September 4]], 2019)
:Contains issues #1 to #8.
:Bonus material includes a sketch gallery by [[Jack Lawrence]], a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

<gallery>
File:LLvol1 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 1'''; cover art by [[Jack Lawrence]] and [[Joana Lafuente]]
File:LLvol2 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 2'''; cover art by [[Alex Milne]] and [[Josh Perez]]
File:LLvol3 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 3'''; cover art by Jack Lawrence and Joana Lafuente
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v79.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 79: Primeless'''''; cover art by [[Don Figueroa]] and [[Livio Ramondelli]]
File:LLvol4 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 4'''; cover art by [[Nick Roche]] and [[Josh Burcham]]
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v77.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 77: Dissolution'''''; cover art by [[Dreamwave Productions]] and Jack Lawrence
</gallery>

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 86: The Everlasting Voices''''' ([[July 1]], [[2020]])
:Contains issues #13 to #18.
:Bonus material includes the first half of ''[[Transformers: Historia]]'' (up to ''[[The Transformers: Last Stand of the Wreckers|Last Stand of the Wreckers]]''), including the [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] profile, a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 87: Crucible''''' ([[July 29]], 2020)
:Contains issues #19 to #24.
:Bonus material includes the second half of ''Transformers: Historia'', including the [[Optimus Prime (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Optimus Prime]] profile, a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 88: Unicron''''' ([[August 26]], 2020)
:*Contains ''[[Transformers: Unicron]]'' issues [[Our Darkest|#0]] to [[Ceremony|#6]], as well as ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' [[Post|#25]] and ''Lost Light'' #25.
:*Bonus material includes a cover gallery, the Hasbroverse backup comics and creator interviews, and an intro by [[Simon Furman]].

* '''''[[The Transformers: The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 2|The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 2]]''''' ([[April 6]], [[2022]]) ISBN 1684058775 / ISBN 978-1684058778
:* Contains ''[[The Transformers: Till All Are One|Till All Are One]]'' [[Heavy|#9]]–[[Your First Mistake|12]], ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' [[New Cybertron Part 1: To Walk Among the Chosen|#1]]–[[New Cybertron End: Feel Safe Without Regrets|6]] and ''Lost Light'' [[Dissolution Part 1: Some Other Cybertron|#1]]–[[After Megatron (A Dissolution Epilogue)|7]].

*'''''[[Transformers: Best of Hot Rod]]''''' ([[May 4]], [[2022]])
**Collects ''[[The Transformers: Autocracy]]'' #10: "[[Rise]]", ''[[The Transformers: Spotlight|Spotlight]]'': "[[Spotlight: Hot Rod|Hot Rod]]", [[Marvel Comics]]' [[The Transformers (Marvel comic)#Marvel UK|''The Transformers'' (UK)]] #254: "[[White Fire]]", ''Lost Light'' #20, ''[[The Transformers: Regeneration One|Regeneration One]]'' #100: "[[The War to End All Wars, Part 5]]", and Marvel Comics' [[Transformers Annual 1989]]: "[[Peace]]".

* '''''[[The Transformers: The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 3|The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 3]]''''' ([[September 27]], 2022 ''*scheduled*'') ISBN 1684059070 / ISBN 978-1684059072
:* Contains ''[[Revolutionaries]]'' [[Strange Visitors|#5]]–[[Ghost in the Machine (IDW)|8]], ''Lost Light'' [[An Axe to Break the Ice|#8]]–[[The Plotters' Club (Part 3): Journey's End|12]], ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' [[The Next Day, and the Next|#7]]–[[Origin_Myths|10]], [[Ghost Stories|''Transformers'' Annual 2017]] and ''[[The Transformers: Salvation]]''.

<gallery>
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v86.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 86: The Everlasting Voices'''''; cover art by Dreamwave Productions and Jack Lawrence
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v87.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 87: Crucible'''''; cover art by Dreamwave Productions, [[Casey Coller]] and [[Tom B. Long]]
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v88.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 88: Unicron'''''; cover art by [[Dreamwave Productions|Dreamwave]] and [[Alex Milne]]
File:IDWCollectionP3V2.jpg|'''''The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 2'''''; cover art by [[Sara Pitre-Durocher]]
File:BestOfHotRod cvr.jpg|'''''Transformers: Best of Hot Rod'''''; cover art by [[James Biggie]]
File:IDWCollectionP3V3.jpg|'''''The IDW Collection, Phase Three, Volume 3'''''; cover art by Sara Pitre-Durocher
</gallery>

==Notes==
*Roberts had always planned the series would end with them running into the Knights in some way and facing a vague threat, such as Unicron or Quintessons, linked to them, but it's around the time of ''Lost Light'' he'd decided on that final threat being the Functionists.<ref>[https://www.mixcloud.com/GuernseyGeekOnPodcast/guernsey-geekon-james-roberts-interview-in-full/ Guernsey GeekOut interview with James Roberts, 1:22:30 to 1:27:00]</ref>
*As with the previous series, bear in mind that James Roberts writes the series with the characters in general all having his English accent.<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1024666474500313089 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/08/01]</ref>

==References==
{{Reflist}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Lost Light}}
[[Category:IDW (2005) comic series]]
[[Category:Lost Light issues| ]]

The Transformers: Lost Light

2022-09-04T09:55:50Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Overview */ Not finished but... Placed Sardines slightly out of publication order, which might be up to debate. But I think it is cleaner for a brief summary to put it after the Troja Major arc, then have both the interludes, and then the finale.

{{disambig2|the comic series|the titular starship|Lost Light}}
[[File:LL1_regcvr.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|[[The Dying of the Light: (1) How Bright Their Frail Deeds|His light died]], so Rodimus decided to get this [[Black Rodimus Convoy|cool bad guy deco]].]]
'''''The Transformers: Lost Light''''' is a finished comic series, a rebranded version of and sequel to ''[[The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye]]''. Debuting in [[Calendar|December]] [[2016]], it ran alongside sister titles ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' and ''[[The Transformers: Till All Are One|Till All Are One]]''. The story is basically 'Season 3' of ''More Than Meets The Eye'' and leads up to "the grand finale" over two years. <ref>[https://boroughcon.com/2017/04/revealing-greatness-with-james-roberts/ Interview with Boroughcon]</ref> ''Lost Light'' concluded with issue #25 in November [[2018]] as part of the ending of the IDW Universe.

{{chapters|title=''The Transformers: Lost Light'' issues|align=center|prev=The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye|content=
*[[Dissolution Part 1: Some Other Cybertron|#1]]
*[[Dissolution Part 2: Anomie|#2]]
*[[Dissolution Part 3: A World Misplaced|#3]]
*[[Dissolution Part 4: Bad Moon Rising|#4]]
*[[Dissolution Part 5: Modes of Production|#5]]
*[[Dissolution Part 6: This Machine Kills Fascists|#6]]
*[[After Megatron (A Dissolution Epilogue)|#7]]
*[[An Axe to Break the Ice|#8]]
*[[Chasing the Infinite|#9]]
*[[The Plotters' Club (Part 1): Full Circle|#10]]
*[[The Plotters' Club (Part 2): Filling in the Blanks|#11]]
*[[The Plotters' Club (Part 3): Journey's End|#12]]
*[[Sardines|#13]]
*[[The Ties That Bind (issue)|#14]]
*[[Kill All 'Cons|#15]]
*[[The Everlasting Voices (1): Metastasis|#16]]
*[[The Everlasting Voices (2): The God War|#17]]
*[[The Everlasting Voices (3): You Are Here|#18]]
*[[Crucible (Part 1): A Dance Before Dying|#19]]
*[[Crucible (Part 2): Lūstrāre|#20]]
*[[Crucible (Part 3): Farsickness|#21]]
*[[Crucible (Part 4): The Return of the King|#22]]
*[[Crucible (Part 5): The Unremembering|#23]]
*[[Crucible (Part 6): A Spark Among Embers|#24]]
*[[How To Say Goodbye And Mean It: Part 2|#25]]
}}

==Overview==
In the wake of the confrontation with the [[Decepticon Justice Division]] on [[Necroworld]], the marooned [[Team Rodimus]] attempts to return to the ''[[Lost Light]]'' with the help of the "[[Disappeared]]"—the various [[time travel]]ling Transformers plucked from across time and space. Among them are runaway [[blacksmith]]-turned adventurer [[Anode]] and her partner [[Lug (IDW)|Lug]], who struggle to adjust to the present day as they deal with demons from their past.

Before Team Rodimus can get offworld, a rogue [[geobomb]], courtesy of the [[Galactic Council]] shunts the planet into an entirely different universe. When Rodimus and a small crew of Autobots attempt to return to Cybertron, they find themselves in the middle of [[Functionist Universe|an alternate Cybertron]], where [[Megatron (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Megatron]] was never born and [[Functionism]] reigns supreme. The ''Lost Light'' crew find themselves embroiled in the Council's plot to consolidate their power by crushing the heroic [[Anti-Vocationist League]] and their supporters. With the help of the native universe's [[Rung (G1)|Rung]] — his true function finally revealed — the Autobots manage to foil their plan and return home... but accidentally leave Megatron behind. Taking command of the AVL, Megatron and his old friend [[Terminus (G1)|Terminus]] start their revolution anew.

The crew of the ''Lost Light'' finally get offworld in a mass displaced [[Skip|Decepticon]], but Tailgate, his mutating [[Outlier (group)|outlier]] powers growing increasingly destructive and erratic, volunteers to stay behind in the hopes that a cure can be found for his condition. [[Fangry (G1)|Fangry]], his pride wounded by an earlier encounter with the super-powered Autobot, takes advantage of the situation to bury him alive for another six million years.

With Team Rdoimus back to their search, Nautica leads a small group in an excursion to [[Troja Major]] under the pretense of investigating a map to Cyberutopia she believes a [[Agonizer|Decepticon contact]] of hers might have. Nautica's true motive however is a Resus piece of Knight's technology she believed to be in the markets, with the aim of using it to ressurect [[Skids (G1)#IDW|Skids]], whose [[brain module]] she has kept hidden behind her eyepatch. Meanwhile, Lug and Anode find a [[Infinite|strange Transformer]] who is quickly killed by the [[Black Box Consortia]], before running into a Blacksmith friend, [[Wipe-Out]]. Right behind them are soldiers of the Grand Architect, here to kill their former blacksmith associates. The blacksmiths and Lug escape as the troops deem them less important than reobtaining the Consortia's victim as well as confront its [[Mengel}creator]], another associate of the architect and the very merchant The price for Skid's life is high, and Nautica sells her emotions towards Skids to pay the cost, almost losing her emotions towards best friend [[Velocity (G1|Lotty]] too, before finally hearing her upset friend's words and accepting that Skids had chosen to give his life to save them. This decision narrowly saves both of their lives as they escape the Architect's troops here to forcefully claim the device, returning it to the Grand Architect, [[Scorponok!]]. Returning to the ship, disaster strikes the team as the mass-displaced Skip starts reverting to smaller size, Ratchet starts disappearing and [[Ten]] starts speaking! About the fate of the universe depending on the imminently-dead crew doing what he says, too!

Back on the Lost Light, Getaway finds the deceptive foundations of his new captaincy fragile, and so makes a deal with some devils, Froid and [[Sunder (G1)|Sunder]], using their skills to keep things in control in exchange for feeding members of the crew to the latter. The Protectobots [[Combiner Wars (comic)|return]] to a suspicious welcome, and just as quickly leave with the addition of a rescued [[Thunder Clash|Thunderclash]] and [[Rook (CW)|some]] [[Mirage (G1)#2005 IDW continuity|casualties]] thanks to [[Star Saber (G1)#2005 IDW continuity|another deadly ally]] of Getaway's. Despite the carnage, Getaway is happy; thanks to spacetime portals known as [[The Warren]], he has lead the quest to victory, Cyberutopia awaits...

Somewhere else, [[The Scavengers]] make a new friend who is not happy to be there but unable to reach [[Deathsaurus (G1)| her commander]] on her communicator. They all get captured by Scorponok, reuniting Grimlock with his [[Maximum Dinobots|old foe]]. They discover Scorponok has created an [[Firstborn|organic Decepticon]] complete with spark, the goal to exploit organic procreation of this genetically-engineered species and harvest the sparks for mechanical bodies to restore the dwindling number of Decepticons. The Scavengers get the upper-hand however, rescuing the Firstborn and obtaining The Magnificence from him before fighting their way off the ship. However, they learn from the Magnificence that the transmat would kill the Firstborn, so Grimlock takes her and forces his friends into the Transmat. Grimlock is left singlehandedly fighting off Scorponok's troops, while the Scavengers are surprised to find themselves in the abandoned prison cell of Grimlock within the abandoned Garrus-9 facility with no way out, trapped forever...

Team Rodimus wake up, unsure of how they survived their predicament. The first answer they find, they are all dead and this is the [[Afterspark]]. The last thing any of them can remember is Ten attempting to direct the ship to Mederi to save them before the mass-displacement completely gave out, leaving the crew to desperately bail out into space. Some believe and make peace, while others remain skeptical. Rodimus, of course, demands to speak to the people in charge, the [[Guiding Hand]].
{{issuestub|remainder of series}}

==Creative team==
[[File:James Roberts and Jack Lawrence.jpg|thumb|300px|Series writer [[James Roberts]] (left) and artist [[Jack Lawrence]] (right)]]
[[James Roberts]] returns as the writer. Due to IDW editorial wanting a fresh artistic start, UK artist [[Jack Lawrence]] replaces previous MTMTE mainstay [[Alex Milne]], with Milne providing alternate covers for issues.<ref>[http://www.forcesofgeek.com/2016/07/sdcc-idw-announces-post-revolution-debuts.html SDCC – IDW Announces Post-Revolution Debuts!]</ref> Milne later provided art for issue #13 of the series. [[Joana Lafuente]] continues to provide colours for most issues, continuing from MTMTE #29.

[[Priscilla Tramontano]] provided art for #8-#9, while [[Andrew Griffith]] covered the four page interlude of issue #12. The 'Scavengers' arc from #14-15 had its art duties shared by [[Sara Pitre-Durocher]] and [[Brendan Cahill]]. [[E. J. Su]] returned to the Transformers series for the beginning of the series final arc, issue #19. Scheduled for bi-monthly release until its end, Cahill will return for #22 and #24, with [[Casey Coller]] working on #20.<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1014524949179109378, James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/07/04]</ref>

==Soundtrack==
Continuing the tradition started in ''MTMTE'', Roberts posted songs on his Twitter as an unofficial soundtrack for each issue leading up to their release. As its predecessor's third "season", it gets its own theme song. Additionally, in October of 2018, leading up to the release of issue #25, Roberts built up a playlist for the series including a mixture of new and old songs; the new ones are listed here.
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxHRXFFigZ0 Graycoated Morning]" by {{w|David & the Citizens}}<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/778020170325454848 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2016/09/20] — "Oh, alright then. Here's your first musical taste of Transformers: Lost Light. Play loud. No, no - louder."</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7mRYLJLB2w Still Fighting it]" by {{w|Ben Folds}} — theme song for Rung<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1037473125217255425 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/09/05] — "And while we’re sharing songs - and given what happened in issues 22 and 23 - now seems like a good time to finally unveil Rung’s theme"</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQmca0NLuq8 Small World]" by {{w|Roddy Frame}}<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1046851766887829505 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/10/01]</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXHd4E-YBx0 Wild Roses]" by {{w|Bill Ryder-Jones}}<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1048190630277664768 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/10/05]</ref>
*"[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWWwKDttHnM "Nobody Does it Better]" by {{w|Carly Simon}} — theme song for Skids<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1182796694259404800 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2019/10/11]</ref>

==Collections==
*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 1 TPB ([[October 25]], [[2017]]) ISBN 1631409921 / ISBN 978-1631409929
:Contains issues #1 to #6.
:Bonus material includes a cover gallery.

*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 2 TPB ([[February 14]], [[2018]]) ISBN 1684051487 / ISBN 978-1684051489
:Contains issues #7 to #12.
:Bonus material includes a cover gallery.

*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 3 TPB ([[August 15]], 2018) ISBN 1684053315 / ISBN 978-1684053315
:Contains issues #13 to #18.
:Bonus material includes a cover gallery.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 79: Primeless''''' ([[November 14]], 2018)
:Contains issues #9 to #12, along with ''Optimus Prime'' #9 to #12.
:Bonus material includes a one-page editorial by [[Simon Furman]] that mentions the IDW universe's impending end, a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

*'''''Transformers: Lost Light''''' Vol. 4 TPB ([[January 30]], [[2019]]) ISBN 1684054109 / ISBN 978-1684054107
:Contains issues #19 to #25.
:Bonus material CURRENTLY UNKNOWN.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 77: Dissolution''''' ([[September 4]], 2019)
:Contains issues #1 to #8.
:Bonus material includes a sketch gallery by [[Jack Lawrence]], a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

<gallery>
File:LLvol1 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 1'''; cover art by [[Jack Lawrence]] and [[Joana Lafuente]]
File:LLvol2 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 2'''; cover art by [[Alex Milne]] and [[Josh Perez]]
File:LLvol3 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 3'''; cover art by Jack Lawrence and Joana Lafuente
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v79.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 79: Primeless'''''; cover art by [[Don Figueroa]] and [[Livio Ramondelli]]
File:LLvol4 TPBcvr.jpg|'''Vol. 4'''; cover art by [[Nick Roche]] and [[Josh Burcham]]
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v77.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 77: Dissolution'''''; cover art by [[Dreamwave Productions]] and Jack Lawrence
</gallery>

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 86: The Everlasting Voices''''' ([[July 1]], [[2020]])
:Contains issues #13 to #18.
:Bonus material includes the first half of ''[[Transformers: Historia]]'' (up to ''[[The Transformers: Last Stand of the Wreckers|Last Stand of the Wreckers]]''), including the [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] profile, a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 87: Crucible''''' ([[July 29]], 2020)
:Contains issues #19 to #24.
:Bonus material includes the second half of ''Transformers: Historia'', including the [[Optimus Prime (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|Optimus Prime]] profile, a cover gallery and an intro by Simon Furman.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 88: Unicron''''' ([[August 26]], 2020)
:*Contains ''[[Transformers: Unicron]]'' issues [[Our Darkest|#0]] to [[Ceremony|#6]], as well as ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' [[Post|#25]] and ''Lost Light'' #25.
:*Bonus material includes a cover gallery, the Hasbroverse backup comics and creator interviews, and an intro by [[Simon Furman]].

* '''''[[The Transformers: The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 2|The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 2]]''''' ([[April 6]], [[2022]]) ISBN 1684058775 / ISBN 978-1684058778
:* Contains ''[[The Transformers: Till All Are One|Till All Are One]]'' [[Heavy|#9]]–[[Your First Mistake|12]], ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' [[New Cybertron Part 1: To Walk Among the Chosen|#1]]–[[New Cybertron End: Feel Safe Without Regrets|6]] and ''Lost Light'' [[Dissolution Part 1: Some Other Cybertron|#1]]–[[After Megatron (A Dissolution Epilogue)|7]].

*'''''[[Transformers: Best of Hot Rod]]''''' ([[May 4]], [[2022]])
**Collects ''[[The Transformers: Autocracy]]'' #10: "[[Rise]]", ''[[The Transformers: Spotlight|Spotlight]]'': "[[Spotlight: Hot Rod|Hot Rod]]", [[Marvel Comics]]' [[The Transformers (Marvel comic)#Marvel UK|''The Transformers'' (UK)]] #254: "[[White Fire]]", ''Lost Light'' #20, ''[[The Transformers: Regeneration One|Regeneration One]]'' #100: "[[The War to End All Wars, Part 5]]", and Marvel Comics' [[Transformers Annual 1989]]: "[[Peace]]".

* '''''[[The Transformers: The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 3|The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 3]]''''' ([[September 27]], 2022 ''*scheduled*'') ISBN 1684059070 / ISBN 978-1684059072
:* Contains ''[[Revolutionaries]]'' [[Strange Visitors|#5]]–[[Ghost in the Machine (IDW)|8]], ''Lost Light'' [[An Axe to Break the Ice|#8]]–[[The Plotters' Club (Part 3): Journey's End|12]], ''[[Optimus Prime (comic)|Optimus Prime]]'' [[The Next Day, and the Next|#7]]–[[Origin_Myths|10]], [[Ghost Stories|''Transformers'' Annual 2017]] and ''[[The Transformers: Salvation]]''.

<gallery>
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v86.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 86: The Everlasting Voices'''''; cover art by Dreamwave Productions and Jack Lawrence
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v87.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 87: Crucible'''''; cover art by Dreamwave Productions, [[Casey Coller]] and [[Tom B. Long]]
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v88.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 88: Unicron'''''; cover art by [[Dreamwave Productions|Dreamwave]] and [[Alex Milne]]
File:IDWCollectionP3V2.jpg|'''''The IDW Collection Phase Three: Volume 2'''''; cover art by [[Sara Pitre-Durocher]]
File:BestOfHotRod cvr.jpg|'''''Transformers: Best of Hot Rod'''''; cover art by [[James Biggie]]
File:IDWCollectionP3V3.jpg|'''''The IDW Collection, Phase Three, Volume 3'''''; cover art by Sara Pitre-Durocher
</gallery>

==Notes==
*Roberts had always planned the series would end with them running into the Knights in some way and facing a vague threat, such as Unicron or Quintessons, linked to them, but it's around the time of ''Lost Light'' he'd decided on that final threat being the Functionists.<ref>[https://www.mixcloud.com/GuernseyGeekOnPodcast/guernsey-geekon-james-roberts-interview-in-full/ Guernsey GeekOut interview with James Roberts, 1:22:30 to 1:27:00]</ref>
*As with the previous series, bear in mind that James Roberts writes the series with the characters in general all having his English accent.<ref>[https://twitter.com/jroberts332/status/1024666474500313089 James Roberts (@jroberts332) on Twitter, 2018/08/01]</ref>

==References==
{{Reflist}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Lost Light}}
[[Category:IDW (2005) comic series]]
[[Category:Lost Light issues| ]]

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Arcee (WFC)

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{{factions|autobot|hofsilver}}
{{disambig3|Arcee}}

:''Arcee is an [[Autobot]] from the [[Aligned continuity family]].''
[[File:Arcee-Prime-stock-render-alternate.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|''Transformers: '''Prime'''''? Pft! You know who the ''real'' star is.]]

A former scout on [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] before the [[Great Exodus]], '''Arcee''' is the least physically-imposing of [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]'s crew, but she's also Optimus's most reliable soldier, his go-to [[Female Transformer|gal]] when he needs someone he can count on.<ref>[http://www.hubworld.com/transformers/shows/prime/cast-gallery/arcee The Hub's profile page for Arcee]</ref> Whatever she lacks in physical form she more than makes up for it in force of personality. She is tough as nails at all times, always ready with a snarky quip even in the face of deactivation, not afraid to bend the rules every now and then, and seemingly never, ever scared.

And while that is largely true, and makes her an incredibly dangerous opponent (especially in melee combat, her specialty), that force of will ''is'' also a bit of a front. The loss of [[Tailgate (Prime)|a partner]] back on Cybertron rattled her, leading her towards a path of going it alone. And when she finally started opening up to [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|another partner]] on [[Earth]], losing ''him'' shook her to her core. To then be immediately saddled with the task of being the "guardian" for [[Jack Darby]], one of the locals accidentally caught up in the struggle on Earth, well, let's just say she was less than thrilled about that.

Okay, she was openly verbally hostile to Jack over the whole thing, but her loyalty to Optimus kept her from refusing the task. Like it or not, she's his guardian, and she's going to protect that boy's life... with her own, if she has to.

Slowly, but surely, Arcee is coming around again and facing her past demons. Jack's bravery and ingenuity even when in mortal peril is growing on her. Who knows. He might make a good partner.

{{quote|It is the external wounds which heal the quickest.|[[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]|"[[Partners (Prime)|Partners]]"}}

==Fiction==
===Ask Vector Prime===
In [[Uniend 610.23 Zeta]], {{storylink|Ask Vector Prime}} Arcee was among to Autobots that participated in the Battle at [[Tyger Pax]], and joined [[Ironhide (WFC)|Ironhide]], [[Jazz (WFC)|Jazz]] and [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]] in their plan to launch the [[AllSpark]] into space to keep it from [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]].

With Ironhide and Jazz on lookout up at the [[Well of All Sparks]]'s rim, it fell upon Arcee to launch the AllSpark into space under Optimus's instructions, since Primes were forbidden to interfere with the AllSpark as a failsafe. {{storylink|Bumblebee at Tyger Pax}}

===Cartoon continuity===
====IDW ''Prime'' comic====
[[File:PrimeComicArcee.jpg|left|thumb|upright=1.1|"Well I can tell ''''arth'''' is 'Earth' but ''''age'''' is really throwing me."]]
Before the war, Arcee had been spying in [[Kaon (polity)|Kaon]], and sometime during it she had been rescued by [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|Cliffjumper]]. When Optimus ordered the Autobots to [[Earth]], her ship had been destroyed, and she was willing to wait as she detected the Decepticons had returned to Cybertron and they were planning something ''big''. There, she entered a base and annihilated the [[Vehicon (Prime)|Vehicons]] there, inadvertently returning Cliffjumper's favor. She hacked into the Decepticons's communications signal there, and found their weapons lab in Kaon. Arcee found Cliffjumper a brash soldier inappropriate for her stealthy mission, but he convinced her Kaon was too dangerous and that she could use his ship to go to Earth.

[[File:Arceeprimecomictransform.jpg|thumb|upright=0.85|Arcee, transform and—geeeaaaheeeewwww!!]]

The duo entered the city through the maintenance tunnels Arcee had once explored, and she found a secret staircase by activating an Autobot symbol on the wall. There they discovered [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]] had rebuilt a [[space bridge]] to travel to Earth. Concerned by the repercussions of the Decepticons's discovery of how to build space bridges, Arcee wanted to destroy it, but Cliffjumper convinced her it was their way off Cybertron. Distracting Starscream with a ruse, Arcee activated the space bridge and overloaded its systems, jumping through it with him before it blew up.

Landing on Earth, the duo scanned their alternate modes and traveled to find a population center where they could build a scanner and find Optimus. Starscream attacked, having also jumped through the space bridge, blasting Arcee's arm off. Cliffjumper fought him and tried to get Arcee to safety, but she refused, telling him to leave her and find Optimus. Thankfully, Optimus and [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]] came to them instead, and fended off both Starscream and [[Breakdown (WFC)|Breakdown]]. Optimus carried Arcee through a [[GroundBridge]] to base, where [[Ratchet (WFC)|Ratchet]] reattached her arm. {{storylink|Transformers: Prime (graphic novel)|Transformers: Prime}}

{{-}}

====''Prime'' cartoon====
{{voiceactor|[[Sumalee Montano]] (English), [[Markie Post]] ([[BotCon 2011]]), [[Shizuka Itō]] (Japanese)|[[Fan Churong]] (Chinese), [[Rosa Campillo]] (Spain-Spanish), [[Seon Lee]] (Korean), [[Sonia Mazza]] (Italian), [[Martina Treger]] (German), [[Rosalba Sotelo]] (Latin American Spanish), [[Márcia Regina]] (Brazilian Portuguese), [[Anneli Heed]] (Swedish), [[Susa Saukko]] (Finnish), [[Célia Torrens]] (French)}}
[[File:Predatory-Airachnidscratch.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|right|Pull my finger.]]
During the Great War, Arcee was partnered with [[Tailgate (Prime)|Tailgate]]. After one mission, she was talking to Tailgate over the comm when she was captured by [[Airachnid (Prime)|Airachnid]] and taken for interrogation. She refused to talk, but when Airachnid revealed she had also captured Tailgate, she revealed she knew nothing, and Tailgate was killed by the Decepticon. Arcee was subsequently rescued by Bumblebee and Cliffjumper, though Airachnid herself escaped. {{Storylink|Predatory}}

[[File:OutofthePast-CliffArcee.jpg|left|thumb|upright=1.67|"Did it have anything to do with those sirens around noon?" "I said I ''don't'' want to talk about it!"]]
Following the exodus from Cybertron, Arcee was investigating talk of a Decepticon operation on the deserted planet. Both she and Cliffjumper were captured by [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]] who needed them to decode a transmission. The pair were taken to [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]], who used a [[cortical psychic patch]] on Arcee, revealing the transmission was [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]'s call to bring other Autobots to Earth. Learning that Shockwave had developed a [[space bridge]] that the 'Cons intended to use to invade Earth, Arcee and Cliffjumper teamed up to sabotage it, using it to land up on Earth just before it exploded. {{storylink|Out of the Past}} Soon after she arrived on Earth, Bulkhead accidentally stepped into some power lines. Arcee was impressed with the dance he did as a consequence. {{storylink|Scrapheap (episode)|Scrapheap}}

[[File:DarknessRising1-thisisjasper.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|He's gonna ride her like a Harley on a bad stretch of road.]]
Arcee was engaged in casual banter with Cliffjumper when her friend was ambushed by Decepticons: by the time Arcee and the others got there, his body was missing and his lifesigns had ceased. While Optimus Prime said they should not dwell on negative emotions, Arcee claimed she'd go back on duty protecting humans; but when targeted by a [[Vehicon (Prime)|Vehicon]] duo and forced to rescue [[Jack Darby|human youth Jack Darby]], she showed an irritable, seething nature, attacking the Vehicons with angry cries of vengeance for Cliffjumper.

She ignored most of Jack's questions, initially threatened him to forget what he'd seen, and wasn't that concerned with humans witnessing the battle afterwards. To her annoyance, Optimus then ordered her to bring in Jack and the other human witnesses to [[Autobot Outpost Omega One]], so the Decepticons couldn't target them. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 1}}

[[File:DarknessRising2-girltrouble.jpg|left|thumb|upright=1.4|She transforms into the world's largest motorcycle.]]
When the Autobots headed to the Decepticon Energon mines to locate Cliffjumper, Arcee found the broken and [[Dark Energon| Dark Energon-corrupted]] body of Cliffjumper moving, and tried to save him. She grabbed his hand, but was horrified when the body turned out to be a [[zombie|mutated ''thing'']] bent on attacking, and dropped him. When [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]] arrived to drop a bomb into the area to destroy the mines, the Autobots were forced to retreat without Cliffjumper through the [[GroundBridge]]. Once inside their base, Arcee began to feel dizzy, much to the surprise of Jack, [[Miko Nakadai|Miko]] and Raf. It was due to contact with a miniscule amount of the Dark Energon that had corrupted Cliffjumper.

Arcee, despite her "illness", was given the task of taking Jack Darby home, and angrily snapped at him when he said he was sorry for her loss, demanding to know what he'd know about such losses; the argument was interrupted when [[June Darby|Jack's mother]] arrived and promptly began questioning him about the mysterious blue bike. The next morning, Arcee snappily woke Jack up and dragged him to Central Command... but demanded he write a note so his mother wouldn't worry. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 2}}

On the way back, Arcee showed off some motorcycling tricks. They reached the base, only for Optimus to leave her in charge and go off on a mission with [[Ratchet (WFC)|Ratchet]]. Arcee was disgruntled and, leaving [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] in charge, immediately went out on patrol with Bumblebee. The pair patrolled the nearby Nevada desert until they got a call from Bulkhead to say Fowler had been kidnapped, and he'd gone to the Decepticon ship to mount a rescue. Arcee tried to contact base to get bridged back, but no one was there, and she and Bumblebee had to put "the metal to the pedal". {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 3}}

[[File:DarknessRising4-Arceestandoff.jpg|upright=1.2|thumb|"No, ''I'm'' ****ing Blue Death from above."]]
They arrived at the Decepticon ship to find Bulkhead had already dealt with the guards. Within, they rescued Jack and Raf from a pair of Decepticons, and quickly caught up with Bulkhead and Miko. The three kids being a liability in a fight, the Autobots cleared out a room for them to shelter in. A short time later, they found the brig. Arcee slipped in through a shaft in the ceiling to get the drop on Starscream, but he threatened to shoot the prisoner. Fowler caused a distraction and the Autobots opened fire. Starscream inconsiderately blasted Arcee with his jet exhaust as he fled. With Fowler rescued, the Autobots picked up the kids and returned back to base, where they faced some pointed questions from Optimus. Jack, however, was sick of the constant danger and decided he wanted no more to do with the Autobot/Decepticon conflict. Arcee reminded him to keep the conflict secret, and as he left by GroundBridge, she was sad to see him go. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 4}}

She later paid Jack a visit and managed to talk him into returning to the Autobot base. When they did so, it was to find that Ratchet had discovered the location of the space bridge, and Arcee and the other Autobots headed up into orbit to try and prevent Megatron from sending the Dark Energon through. They reached the space bridge terminal, but came under attack from flying Decepticons. Ultimately they were unable to prevent Megatron's plan from going ahead, and the only way to prevent the zombies coming through from Cybertron was to destroy the space bridge itself. Arcee, Bulkhead and Bumblebee followed Ratchet's instructions, feeding the space bridge's power back on itself, but were attacked by Megatron just as they completed the job. Arcee was hit and knocked off into space. Luckily Bumblebee had the presence of mind to grab her as the Autobots retreated through the GroundBridge just before everything exploded. Back at base, Arcee seemed in a bad way, but after some concern from Jack, she was able to stand up again. She, Bulkhead and Bumblebee could later be seen hanging out with the three kids. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 5}}

Arcee attempted to help Jack with his science project, a motorcycle engine, despite not knowing anything about Earth auto-mechanics. Her role was usurped by Ratchet anyway. {{storylink|Masters & Students}}

[[File:Scrapheap-huddleforwarmth.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|left|"I wish we'd chosen the sauna."]]
After Bulkhead and Bumblebee found a pod in the [[Arctic]] and brought it back to base, Optimus and Arcee went back to the Arctic to check for clues as to the pod's origin. After some time searching, the temperature sensors Ratchet had given them went off, but they were unable to raise base so they could GroundBridge back. The pair sought shelter, but as their temperatures slowly dropped, things looked grim. Arcee decided to keep warm by blaming Bulkhead for their predicament. Just as they were losing hope, the GroundBridge opened and ejected Bulkhead and the swarm of [[Scraplet]]s that had been causing havoc at base. The Scraplets froze in the cold air and the three Autobots were subsequently able to return home. {{storylink|Scrapheap (episode)|Scrapheap}}

Arcee was amused by Bulkhead's exuberant job when they were contacted by [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]], one of Bulkhead's old friends, though she was initially worried the signal could be a 'Con trap. She, Bulkhead and Bumblebee GroundBridged out to Wheeljack's landing site in time to see him take out a bunch of Vehicons. They returned to base where the Autobots celebrated, though Arcee mainly sat on the sidelines with Jack. When Bulkhead began to grow suspicious that Wheeljack wasn't all he seemed, Arcee tried to allay his fears, and when he directly confronted Wheeljack, Arcee urged him to keep calm. He turned out to be right. After everything was resolved, Arcee again took part in the partying, mostly by standing around watching the others dance. She also turned out to see the real Wheeljack off when he returned to space. {{storylink|Con Job}}

[[File:Convoy-kablooie.jpg|thumb|upright|upright=1.4|"My bad" won't cut it with Optimus this time.]]
When Fowler asked for help transporting the [[Dynamic Nuclear Generation System]], Arcee took part in the Autobot convoy, concealed in Prime's trailer along with the D.N.G.S. When [[MECH]] goons broke the back of the trailer open, she zoomed out in her cycle mode and blew up one of the MECH cars. She helped pass the D.N.G.S. over to a train, but a short time later the Autobots were attacked by Vehicons, and she, Bumblebee and Bulkhead spent the rest of the whole affair fighting them. {{storylink|Convoy (episode)|Convoy}}

When an [[Energon Harvester]] was located in a museum, the Autobots surrounded the building while the kids went in to steal it. [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]] and [[Breakdown (WFC)|Breakdown]] appeared at the front of the museum to attack Optimus, and as Breakdown charged at the museum, Bumblebee and Arcee attempted to stop him. A missile from Breakdown sent Arcee skidding into Bumblebee. After the Decepticons obtained the Harvester, Arcee made a token effort to chase them. She, Bumblebee and Prime later attempted to track down the Decepticons before the Harvester could be used, but they ended up coming to Bulkhead's rescue after he found and stopped the Decepticons himself. {{storylink|Deus ex Machina}}

[[File:ArceeThey'reRacing.jpg|upright=1.4|left|thumb|Well, I hope Jack wasn't too attached to his legs.]]
As Arcee and Jack were leaving school, they encountered Sierra, who asked if she could take Jack up on his offer of a ride. They were interrupted by [[Vince]], who challenged Jack to a race. Arcee reminded her companion of the rules, however when Vince made disparaging remarks about her motorcycle mode, she decided that he needed to be taught a lesson. Arcee and Jack completely smoked Vince at racing, though she made Jack swear not to tell any of the other Autobots. When Jack agreed to another race, Arcee flatly refused to take part, and later found out he'd talked Bumblebee into helping him instead. Furious, she dragged Bulkhead out to help her find Jack and Bumblebee, only to reach them just as Knock Out was abducting Vince. The three Autobots tracked the Decepticons to a storage facility, where Arcee attempted unsuccessfully to retrieve Vince from Knock Out, and ended up chasing the 'Con. She was unable to catch him, but Optimus turned up to lend a hand and rescue the human, and he demanded an explanation from his ashamed soldiers. Afterward, Arcee was willing to allow Jack to give Sierra a ride, but just once. {{storylink|Speed Metal}}

[[File:AirachnidUpsideDown.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|"So... Is this the part where we [[Spider-Man|kiss?]]"]]
On a routine energon scouting mission, Arcee and Jack stumbled on a crashed spaceship in the wilderness. Arcee recognized it as belonging to [[Airachnid (Prime)|Airachnid]] and found she was unable to contact base. After dropping Jack a safe distance away, she hunted Airachnid, interrupting her foe's attack on a lone camper. They fought, but Jack's reappearance distracted Arcee long enough for Airachnid to get the upper hand and stick the Autobot to a nearby rock with webbing. Airachnid played on how Arcee had a habit of losing partners before starting to chase Jack. Haunted by her previous meeting with Airachnid, Arcee eventually managed to break free using her motorcycle mode, and caught up with Jack in time to save him by delivering a brutal pounding to Airachnid, who managed to flee underground. Arcee was left with a new respect for how Jack had handled the situation, and was happy to call him her partner. {{Storylink|Predatory}}

[[File:Arceeandherblaster.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|left|That'll cost extra]]
After Optimus was infected by [[Cybonic plague]], Arcee and Bumblebee GroundBridged aboard the ''[[Trypticon (WFC)|Nemesis]]''. They found Megatron's body in stasis lock, and Arcee formed a [[cortical psychic patch]] so Bumblebee could find the cure in the Decepticon leader's mind. She hid with Bumblebee's unconscious body in a vent, but time began to run out when [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]], [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]] and [[Soundwave (WFC)|Soundwave]] entered the room and discussed pulling the plug on their commander. Soundwave noticed the cortical link and Starscream began following it to the vent, but Bumblebee had located the cure and the two GroundBridged off the ship. Arcee sent a parting gift by shooting at Megatron, and the Decepticons found Megatron's mind was blank... {{storylink|Sick Mind}}

Arcee was unsure if she'd successfully offlined Megatron. She was unenthusiastic when it turned out they had to return to the Arctic after the Decepticons stole a telescope lens. There, she and Bulkhead fought Breakdown as a diversion while Optimus snuck on board the Decepticon ship to destroy the heat ray they'd built the lens into. Her success in fighting breakdown was limited, but they kept him busy for long enough, and were knocked flying by the shockwave from the heat ray exploding. They were surprised when Megatron subsequently turned up alive and well to stop Starscream from finishing off Optimus. {{Storylink|Out of His Head}}

[[File:ArceeFailstonoticekidsenteringSpacebridge.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|Arcee's such a great babysitter.]]
When a Dark Energon signature was detected, Arcee was left at base on GroundBridge duty because Optimus wanted Ratchet's Dark Energon knowledge handy. She failed to notice the three kids sneaking after Optimus's team, and only later spotted that they were gone. She attempted to GroundBridge them back, but interference resulted in an explosion and the kids vanished en route. After Bulkhead's attempt to phone Miko failed, Arcee tried to ring Jack, but there was too much interference for them to talk. They eventually discovered the kids were trapped in an alternate dimension, and when Ratchet used the GroundBridge to rescue them, Optimus, Arcee and Bulkhead went to make sure they were safe from Starscream. {{storylink|Shadowzone (episode)|Shadowzone}}

When Breakdown was captured by MECH, Arcee and the others were surprised when Optimus insisted that they rescue the Decepticon, though it turned out he was concerned that Cybertronian technology would fall into MECH hands. The team arrived in [[Kamchatka Peninsula]] and followed an energon signal Ratchet had detected. The trace led them to find Breakdown's eye and a MECH bomb. After they avoided being blown up by the bomb, the team tracked down Bulkhead in time to chase off Starscream and some Vehicons. {{storylink|Operation: Breakdown}}

[[File:Crisscross-callmeArcee.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.1|It's the equivalent of a guy introducing his mom to his girlfriend.]]
Jack's alter-school activities resulted in his mom forbidding him from using his motorcycle. Jack pointed out to Arcee that this would mean she would have to stay in the garage for several weeks, but she instead promised that she would try to be back before Jack's mom got home at night. The next day Arcee and Bumblebee were fighting some Vehicons when Jack called her to warn her that mom was on her way home early. Arcee failed to get back in time, and had to sneak in via GroundBridge. Later on that evening, she managed to get back before June Darby did, but it turned out that was because mom had been abducted by MECH. Arcee and Jack followed Silas's instructions, proceeding to a deserted factory, and were shocked to find that Airachnid was involved. Arcee was webbed and rendered unconscious, but while MECH was preparing her for "surgery", she recovered and escaped. She managed to catch up with Airachnid before the 'Con could do anything to Jack or his mother, and the pair fought at length around the building. She eventually succeeded in knocking Airachnid into a container and pouring concrete on top, but as she was moving to rescue June, was webbed to the ground by the still active Decepticon. Relief came in the form of Agent Fowler and three helicopters, which forced Airachnid to retreat. Arcee and Jack subsequently took June to the Autobot base to meet the team. {{storylink|Crisscross}}

[[File:TFP ep18 tag team.jpg‎|thumb|upright=1.67|"We'll do fine as long as you don't need the bathroom anytime soon." "Um Arcee..."]]
Arcee was scheduled to do some routine maintenance with Jack, but June's well-meaning questions drove Arcee batty, and she instead opted to accompany Bulkhead on a mission to find a magnetic anomaly. Miko managed to sneak along on the mission, and Arcee again found herself as the third wheel, but when they reached the source of the magnetic disturbance, it turned out to be Airachnid and Breakdown fighting over a magnetic weapon. During the ensuing fight, Breakdown used the weapon, a [[polarity gauntlet]], to magnetize the two Autobots, and Arcee became stuck to Bulkhead's back. With the only choice to retrieve the gauntlet, Arcee ordered Miko to return to base, and she and Bulkhead tracked the 'Cons to an old gas station. After some more fighting, Arcee managed to become unstuck from Bulkhead, and briefly used the gauntlet to polarize everyone. In the end, the Autobots triumphed and returned to base with the gauntlet, where Arcee received an apology from June for the earlier questioning. {{storylink|Metal Attraction}}

Bulkhead and Arcee were assigned to check out an [[Stripped energon mine|old energon mine]]. When Miko ran into the mine, Jack persuaded Arcee to let him take a look inside too. She and Jack stumbled on Megatron and Starscream, and during the firefight that ensued, she shot Megatron's arm, causing him to blast the ceiling and causing a cave in. After the floor fell away, she lost track of the others, but eventually found the kids, and was able to rescue Bulkhead from Starscream. The two Autobots and the kids escaped the mine and briefly considered ending the Decepticons then and there before deciding it wasn't what Optimus would have done. Though Arcee still looked tempted. {{storylink|Rock Bottom}}

[[File:Partners2 Arcee talk to rock.jpg‎|upright=1.4|thumb|left|I can't believe we actually had to bury a horn.]]
Standing at Cliffjumper's graveside, Arcee pledged she would find the 'Con who killed him. When the Autobots were on their next mission to check out a signal from a buried Decepticon wreck, they ran into Airachnid, and Arcee attempted to take the opportunity to settle the score for Tailgate, only for Airachnid to get the better of her. After coming to her rescue, Optimus reminded her that revenge was never profitable. When their captive, Starscream, claimed to want to switch sides, Arcee spoke out to say they should take him with them. Arcee was left guarding the prisoner, however when he inadvertently revealed that it was he who had killed Cliffjumper, she became enraged and attacked him. Though she eventually got the upper hand and was about to finish him off, she realized that Bumblebee was watching the fight, and reluctantly let Starscream limp away. Later at base, her injuries were healed, but she blamed herself for ruining their chance to gain access to Starscream's knowledge. {{storylink|Partners (Prime)|Partners}}

Arcee accompanied Prime and Bumblebee as they tried to retrieve a [[Cybertronian data cylinder]] before the Decepticons did. During the fight she was tackled by Knock Out. Ultimately the Decepticons made off with the cylinder, and later Arcee listened as Ratchet told them the cylinder's contents had ended up in Bulkhead's brain, and wondered aloud what the formula Bulkhead was writing was—the Autobots were excited to find it was a set of equations for synthetic energon. Arcee found it weird when Bulkhead was in "brainiac mode", and as it turned out the data was eating Bulkhead's mind. Bumblebee and Arcee accompanied Optimus on an unsuccessful attempt to get the cylinder back from Megatron, and they ended up fighting a bunch of Vehicons. Later they came to Miko and Bulkhead's aid to save the pair from Knock Out and Breakdown, and Arcee was present when Miko managed to rouse the comatose Bulkhead. {{storylink|T.M.I.}}

[[File:StrongerFaster-surrounded.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|The Steves are gonna have a field day with this.]]
During a mission to intercept Knock Out and Breakdown, Arcee sped over a roadblock caused by Vehicons, separating herself from the other Autobots despite Prime's orders. She soon found herself surrounded by Vehicons, but was surprised when Ratchet came through the GroundBridge and single-handedly bashed the lot of them. Ratchet later revealed that he had injected himself with the synthetic energon he'd been working on, and Arcee was keen for them all to try it, however, Ratchet began exhibiting personality changes that disturbed her. During their next mission, Ratchet accused Optimus of not being pro-active enough, bringing up Cliffjumper's death which angered Arcee to the point of threatening violence. When Ratchet took off to tackle Megatron on his own, Arcee and the other Autobots were forced to come to his aid. {{storylink|Stronger, Faster}}

When an ancient prophecy looked like it was imminent, Arcee and Bulkhead wonder how seriously they should take it. They accompanied Optimus to a military base to stop the Decepticons attacking it, but when they were faced with Raf being gravely injured, Optimus ordered Arcee to accompany him and Bumblebee back to base. While Ratchet fought to save the boy's life, Arcee had to keep Bumblebee calm. {{storylink|One Shall Fall}}

Arcee accompanied Bulkhead and Ratchet on a mission to rescue Prime from an area rich in Dark Energon, though at one point she appeared to become mesmerized by the sight of a volcano spewing Dark Energon. Once they got Optimus back to base, they set about investigating the cause of the natural disasters that had begun plaguing the planet, and realized that [[Unicron]] lay at the center of the Earth. Arcee and the other Autobots began checking out the sites of the tremors. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 1}}

Though Optimus ordered the other Autobots to remain at base, Arcee, Bulkhead and Bumblebee joined him anyway. They fought increasingly larger stone Unicrons, until they encountered a colossal one that knocked Bulkhead and Bumblebee aside, then sent Arcee likewise tumbling along the ground. As it moved to crush Optimus underfoot, help came in the unlikely form of Megatron, who offered to help them fight Unicron. After they returned to base, Optimus gave the trio the choice of whether to accompany him and Megatron to [[Earth's core]], and Arcee opted to go for Jack's sake. She, Bumblebee and Bulkhead greeted Megatron to the Autobot base by aiming their guns at him, and when they were ready to GroundBridge to their new destination, she insisted Megatron go first. Before long, they were standing within Earth's core. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 2}}

As the Autobots battled [[Unicron's antibodies|anti-bots]], Arcee was briefly separated from the others, and had to ride one of the anti-bots to catch up with them again. She, Bulkhead and Bumblebee remained outside Unicron's spark chamber to fight off the anti-bots. After Unicron's defeat, they entered the chamber only to discover that Optimus had lost his memory and was leaving with Megatron. They subsequently had to GroundBridge back to base minus their leader and explain what had happened to the others. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 3}}

The Autobots tried fruitlessly to find a way to get Optimus back. Arcee even managed to get on board the ''Nemesis'' by slipping through the Decepticon GroundBridge after Knock Out and Breakdown. She searched through the ship, fighting Vehicons, only to be expelled from the ''Nemesis'' by Soundwave. It didn't help matters that she didn't even manage to determine if Optimus was on board, let alone where the ship was. {{storylink|Orion Pax, Part 1}} Arcee and the others scoured the globe fruitlessly for the space bridge until they got information on its whereabouts from an undisclosed source which Arcee immediately figured out was Starscream. The Autobots stormed the energon mine housing the bridge before sending Jack and Arcee through to Cybertron, where they began using Jack's [[Key to Vector Sigma|key]] to search for [[Vector Sigma]]. {{Storylink|Orion Pax, Part 2}} On their arrival at [[Kaon (polity)|Kaon]], they were attacked by an [[Insecticon (WFC)|Insecticon]] which Arcee attempted to keep busy while Jack headed onwards. She was rendered unconscious for a time, but came around and retrieved Jack from the Vector Sigma chamber. On their return to Earth, she was forced to fight Megatron to distract him while Jack uploaded the Matrix information into Optimus. Mission successful, they returned to base for the big reunion. {{storylink|Orion Pax, Part 3}}

Arcee was impressed by Bumblebee's retrieval of the [[spark extractor|Spark Extractor]], and when his [[transformation cog|T-cog]] was later stolen, knew immediately it was MECH. Unfortunately her racing around in vehicle mode didn't do much to make Bumblebee feel better about his lack of a cog. {{storylink|Operation Bumblebee, Part 1}} She was unhappy about being asked to do the transplant between Ratchet and Bumblebee, but luckily didn't get the chance, as she had to rush off with Optimus and Bulkhead to try and secure an artifact. She and Prime proved unable to penetrate Knock Out's force field, and as a result, Megatron got away with the [[Forge of Solus Prime]]. {{storylink|Operation Bumblebee, Part 2}}

[[File:Crossfire Airachnid captures Arcee.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.4|One day, she'll learn not to run off after Airachnid on her own. This is not that day.]]
Arcee and the others came to Wheeljack's aid when he returned to Earth to battle [[Dreadwing (Prime)|Dreadwing]]. {{storylink|Loose Cannons}} Arcee was part of an Optimus-led mission to an abandoned energon mine in [[South America]], where they found Megatron fighting an Insecticon. Arcee was more interested in the fight's observer, Airachnid, and immediately attacked her old foe. After chasing her through tunnels, Arcee stumbled into a web trap and ended up dangling cocooned from a tree. Her life was only saved by Starscream, who chased Airachnid off and cut Arcee down, though she still had to ask the other Autobots for help. {{storylink|Crossfire (Prime)|Crossfire}}

When Fowler was attacked by a truck resembling Optimus, Arcee chased the interloper and was run down by him. She recovered at base, and they discovered that the truck was a MECH-built clone of Optimus. The Autobots located the MECH base, but as they explored it, [[Nemesis Prime (Prime)|Nemesis Prime]] took them out one by one. After Optimus prevailed, the Autobots returned to base for repairs. {{storylink|Nemesis Prime (episode)|Nemesis Prime}} Optimus, Bumblebee and Arcee responded to strange activity and found Airachnid in the process of unleashing a swarm of Insecticons. Leaving the others to fight the Insecticons, Arcee chased Airachnid, eventually reaching the Insecticon hive. Though she was tempted to finish off Airachnid, Arcee tricked her foe into stepping onto one of the Insecticon pods, resulting in Airachnid being put in stasis lock so she could be safely taken back to base. {{storylink|Armada (episode)|Armada}}

[[File:TunnelVisionArceeRelic.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.1|Stay away from the cookie jar.]]
After the ''Nemesis'' crashed, Arcee took part in an attack on it with the spark extractor, only to be put into stasis by its weapons. She recovered back at base when the kids disabled the ship. {{storylink|Flying Mind}} Arcee was sent with Bumblebee, Jack and Miko to retrieve a relic located in the [[New York City|Manhattan]] subways. {{storylink|Toxicity}} {{storylink|Tunnel Vision}} The two Autobots found Knock Out with the artifact, but as Arcee tried to seize it, the Decepticon stunned her with his prod. After the party was interrupted by a sweeper train carrying Miko and Jack, Arcee pursued the train while being chased by Knock Out's Insecticon. She managed to both save the train from crashing and get rid of the Insecticon by getting it to touch a third rail. After Bumblebee got hold of the relic, he and Arcee were introduced to [[Vogel]], who'd helped Jack and Miko. {{storylink|Tunnel Vision}}

They returned to base to find Bulkhead critically injured after his mission, and Arcee and Bumblebee helped get the Wrecker to the medical bay. {{storylink|Hurt}} Attempting to comfort Miko, who was upset by the slowness of Bulkhead's recovery, Arcee told her about the time she and Cliffjumper were interrogated by Shockwave and arrived on Earth. {{storylink|Out of the Past}} When new Autobot [[Smokescreen (Prime)|Smokescreen]] appeared while the Autobots were investigating a crashed escape pod, Arcee was initially suspicious of him, recalling Makeshift. She was eventually convinced of the veracity of his story and after he helped during a mission to recover [[Red Energon]], she joined the others in welcoming him to the team. {{storylink|New Recruit}}

When Fowler notified them that a [[Project Damocles]] satellite had been stolen by Breakdown and Silas, Optimus took a team including Arcee to a military base in the hope of securing the satellite control codes before the Decepticons could get them. Instead they found themselves facing both Decepticon troopers and the orbital death ray itself, controlled by Soundwave. {{storylink|The Human Factor}} Arcee was unconvinced that it would be a good thing when Jack was assigned to help Smokescreen adapt to life on Earth, and the fact that the pair pulled a prank on Vince during their first mission did nothing to help. While Arcee was on a mission to find an Iacon relic, Smokescreen endangered Jack by taking him into combat, and though Arcee and the rest of the team rescued the boy, she was not pleased with either of them. {{storylink|Legacy (episode)|Legacy}}

With the news they might soon be able to restore Cybertron, Arcee, Bulkhead and Bumblebee were unsure whether they wanted to leave Earth and their friends. She volunteered to accompany Smokescreen to [[Egypt]] to find the first [[Omega Key]] but, though they found the key, Smokescreen was apparently destroyed by Megatron. Arcee returned to base despondent at losing another partner, but it later turned out Smokescreen was still alive. {{storylink|Alpha/Omega}} Smokescreen's exuberance got on her nerves. After she and Bumblebee failed to secure a key, Smokescreen and Bulkhead likewise failed in their mission, and Arcee ended up lecturing the rookie on being a team player, causing him to leave the Autobot base upset. When Smokescreen later turned out to be the final relic they were after, the Autobots located him too late to prevent him being captured by Soundwave. {{storylink|Hard Knocks}}

After Smokescreen escaped the ''Nemesis'' with two of the keys, the Autobots received a message from Starscream offering a trade for the final key. Arcee operated the GroundBridge and guarded the base with Smokescreen and Bumblebee, but Starscream was able to steal their three keys anyway, thanks to his Red Energon. {{storylink|Inside Job}} As the Autobots equipped themselves to go to Cybertron, Arcee availed herself of the [[Apex Armor (Prime)|Apex Armor]], which proved very useful during their battle against the Decepticons. Having obtained the Omega Keys, the Autobots found the [[Omega Lock]], only for the Decepticons to unveil their trump card in the form of the three kids as hostages. {{storylink|Regeneration (Prime)|Regeneration}} Arcee was forced to hand over her key in exchange for Jack. After Optimus destroyed the Omega Lock to prevent Megatron destroying Earth, Arcee returned with the others to base, only to find that the Decepticons were attacking it. The Autobots were forced to abandon base, and Arcee and Jack bridged to a point somewhere in the US. {{storylink|Darkest Hour (episode)|Darkest Hour}}

Arcee and Jack paused in their travels so Arcee could scout out a helicopter, which turned out to be civilian. In the meantime, Jack came under attack by Decepticons but he and Arcee managed to blow them up with a gas station. {{storylink|Darkmount, NV}} After they took a rest stop at an abandoned farm house, the pair were cruising down a road when [[Ultra Magnus (WFC)|Ultra Magnus's]] spacecraft set down in front of them. {{storylink|Scattered}}
Introductions were made, and the pair accompanied Ultra Magnus as he collected up the rest of Team Prime, finally arriving at the ''[[Harbinger]]''. {{storylink|Prey (episode)|Prey}} Bumblebee and Arcee joined the attack on [[Darkmount (Earth)|Darkmount]], acting as a "stealth team" and infiltrating the citadel under cover of a diversion. Unfortunately they ran into heavy resistance and were taken captive, but when Optimus Prime arrived to join the assault, they renewed their attack on the Decepticons. Following the destruction of Darkmount, the Autobots assembled at a human military base. {{storylink|Rebellion (Prime)|Rebellion}}

[[File:PlusOneArceeAwesomePose.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.4|Such a basic hero pose. But it ''just works for her.'']]
Arcee reflected that without Smokescreen's inability to follow orders, they might not still have Optimus Prime. The Autobots soon discovered that the Predacons were working on cloning more Predacons. {{storylink|Project Predacon}} When Decepticon activity was detected in [[New Mexico]], Arcee talked Wheeljack into going with her and the pair immediately ran into trouble in the form of a squad of Vehicons. After dispatching the Decepticons, Arcee and Wheeljack proceeded to retrieve the bone they'd been after, and Arcee managed to talk her companion into not abandoning his place in the Autobot team. While they were still hauling the bone away, news came that Fowler and June had gotten into trouble, and the two Autobots had to go and rescue the pair from Knock Out. They succeeded, though Knock Out got away with another Predacon fossil. {{storylink|Plus One (Prime)|Plus One}}

[[File:PrimePersuasionArceeShocked.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|Arcee read her "test results."]]
Arcee and the others took time out from hunting for Predacon fossils to secure some energon supplies, unaware it was part of a Decepticon plan to deceive the newly-intelligent [[Predaking (Prime)|Predaking]]. {{storylink|Evolution}} When the Decepticons began stealing technology to repair the Omega Lock, Arcee and the other Autobots attempted to stop them. They traveled to the [[Solaris particle collider]] in Antarctica, where they found the Decepticons already in the process of raiding the place. {{storylink|Minus One}} Though they fought their way through the Decepticons, they were ultimately unable to stop the Decepticons stealing the needed technology, and on top of this, when they returned to base it was to find Ratchet had been abducted by Soundwave. {{storylink|Persuasion}}

They launched the probe and monitored it and Optimus's progress from the base. Though the probe was destroyed, Ratchet was able to send them the coordinates to the Decepticon warship, and Arcee and the others geared up in preparation to assault the ''Nemesis''. {{storylink|Synthesis}} Arcee attempted to lead her team to join Ratchet, only for Smokescreen to abandon them along the way, and for them to be confronted by Starscream. They managed to fight their way through to the Omega Lock control room, where Arcee watched Bumblebee kill Megatron with the Star Saber. With the ''Nemesis'' secured, the Autobots were able to take the ship to Cybertron, where they used the Omega Lock to restore their home world. Arcee told Jack to stay in touch, before she and the other Autobots returned home. {{storylink|Deadlock (episode)|Deadlock}}

In the aftermath of Cybertron's rebirth, Arcee patrolled in an attempt to find Starscream and Shockwave. With the discovery that there were two new Predacons on the loose, she and the other Autobots attempted to persuade Predaking to help them, but were unsuccessful. After encountering Unicron, in possession of Megatron's rebuilt form, the Autobots realized that the dark god intended to destroy their world. After foiling an attempt by Starscream to retake the warship, the Autobots attempted to defend the Well of All Sparks from Unicron's onslaught. It was only when Optimus returned that Unicron was defeated, and Arcee was later present when Optimus sacrificed himself to restore the AllSpark to Cybertron. {{storylink|Predacons Rising (Prime)|Predacons Rising}}

====Titan ''Prime'' comic====
[[File:Titan4.3 Arcee is melodramatic.jpg|thumb|left|upright=1.67|And what happened, then? Well, in Whoville they say - that Arcee shot Christmas in the face.]]
Arcee took part in the testing of Ratchet's newly-developed [[Safe]] training room, though she was amused by the medic's interest in making things explode. After Bulkhead broke through a wall, Arcee alerted the others to the rather large nuclear missile he'd accidentally uncovered and activated. A Vehicon scouting party showed up looking for the source of the energy signature the bomb was giving off, so Optimus, Arcee and Bumblebee went out to trash them. The trio returned to base a short time later to find Fowler had arrived to deal with the bomb. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.1|The Safe and the Failsafe}}

During some downtime, Optimus took the other Autobots, including Arcee, on a trip to [[Valley of Fire State Park]]. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.2|War Story}}

During the holidays, Arcee roundly mocked Bulkhead as he attempted to decorate a [[Christmas]] tree. Unfortunately for her, after Fowler reported that the Decepticons had taken over a [[Yamal|nuclear-powered ship]], she found herself left at base with Bulkhead. The kids suggested she and Bulkhead try to find something they both liked, but progress was slow until they discovered their mutual love of ice skating. They subsequently turned the base into an ice rink and skated around it until the other Autobots came back. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.3|Ice Breaker}}

[[File:Titan4.5 Arcee threatens MECH.jpg|thumb|upright=1.5|Our coverage of "Convoy" says different, Arcee!]]
She and Jack scouted out [[Franklin High School]] when schools in the region began unexpectedly exploding. It paid off when [[MECH]] turned up, however while Arcee was on the comm to Optimus, Jack sneaked inside the school. Arcee crashed inside to rescue him from MECH, though he insisted on following the baddies up to the roof. Silas got away anyway, and Arcee had to get Jack off the burning building. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.5|School Is... Out!}} After the [[President of the United States]] was kidnapped, the Autobots traced the culprit, Starscream, to the [[Grand Canyon]]. Bumblebee and Arcee teamed up to take out the cannons manned by Vehicons that Starscream had brought along. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.6|All the President's 'Bots!}}

Arcee and Bulkhead headed to [[Zhejiang Province]], [[China]] after the Autobots lost contact with Optimus Prime. They found [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]] and a bunch of Vehicons feeding Optimus's body into a crusher but were overcome by the Decepticons before they could rescue him. Luckily Optimus came to his senses in time. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.8|The Mind Trap!}} After Miko was kidnapped by [[MECH]] agent [[Novo]], Arcee joined the hunt to find her. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.9|The Novo Incident}}

Arcee was bemused by Jack's demonstration of bobbing for apples. She was on the team which visited the [[Deep Driller]] oil platform and encountered [[Rufus Madison|General Madison]] and his men. After ending up underneath Bulkhead, she managed to trick two of the soldiers in [[robotic battle suit]]s into shooting each other. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.10|Mad Dogs & Autobots}} When Bulkhead went missing, Arcee searched in vain until Miko managed to work out he was on the Decepticon ship. Arcee was subsequently part of the mission to rescue their friend. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.11|The Battle for Bulkhead}} Arcee took part in a battle against the Decepticons in [[The Wave]]. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.12|The Evil Shred}}

Following a TV studio takeover by Knock Out and [[Breakdown (WFC)|Breakdown]], Arcee came along on the mission as backup. She took to the shadows, and once Optimus had rescued the other hostages, Arcee rescued [[Chuck Chuckles]] and took down the two Decepticons herself. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.14|It's a Knock-Out}}
{{charstubfiction|{{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.17|Collider Scope}} {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.18|Power Outage}}}}

====Mega-Mouth====
Arcee occasionally takes time out from defending the universe and protecting the planet Earth in disguise to... answer fan mail? {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.1|Mega-Mouth}}

====Eaglemoss ''Prime'' comic====
{{charstubfiction|{{storylink|On Thin Ice}} {{storylink|Sand Trap}} {{storylink|Horrible TV}} {{storylink|Cell}} {{storylink|Cleanup}}}}

====''Beast Hunters'' comic====
Following Optimus's sacrifice, Arcee, Bumblebee, and Bulkhead encountered [[Sludge (FOC)|Sludge]] in a tunnel. {{storylink|Beast Hunters issue 7|Beast Hunters #7}} They emerged on the surface in time to help [[Grimlock (WFC)|Grimlock]] and the other Dinobots fight a squad of [[Forged]]. Arcee was shocked to hear they'd been created by Shockwave. After dealing with that threat, Arcee starting filling the Dinobots in on recent events, only for them to be promptly attacked by a new Predacon. The Autobots split into groups to head to [[Kaon (polity)|Kaon]], with Arcee and Swoop taking one group of survivors. [[Swoop (WFC)|Swoop]] drew off the Predacon when it attacked, allowing Arcee and the other to reach Kaon while the Predacon was dealt with. There, Arcee explained that the Dinobots would always be welcome in the Autobot ranks. Grimlock, however, said the Dinobots would be unable to help with the reconstruction of Kaon, since they'd be building a new home for the survivors. {{storylink|Beast Hunters issue 8|Beast Hunters #8}}

====''Transformers Legends'' comic====
[[File:Legends Prime Arcee.jpg|thumb|100px]]
Arcee was among the heroic female Transformers who appeared in one of [[Tigatron]]'s dreams, in which she spotted the approaching evil female Transformers seeking to kidnap Tigatron. She may have subsequently engaged [[Nightbird (G1)|Nightbird]] in battle, or might have just been in the latter's line of sight. {{storylink|Legends Comic: Bonus Edition Vol. 11|Bonus Edition Vol. 11}}

{{-}}

====IDW ''Robots in Disguise'' comic====
Arcee, Ultra Magnus, and Bulkhead spied on Bumblebee's team from their spaceship. {{storylink|Fire, When Ready!}} While struggling to get his team to work together, Bumblebee recalled happier times when he was part of Team Prime with Arcee. She and Bulkhead were sent by Magnus to question [[Spinhead]], but arrived after the Decepticon had been captured. They returned to the ship, unaware that Bumblebee had spotted them. {{storylink|Robots in Disguise issue 1|Robots in Disguise #1}}

The trio visited Bumblebee so they could question some of the ''[[Alchemor (RID)|Alchemor]]'' prisoners over the whereabouts of [[Clipshade]], and Arcee discovered she had a fan in [[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]]. Arcee took part in the capture of the Decepticon, though she was prevented from speaking further with Bumblebee when Magnus ordered them back to the ship with Clipshade. {{storylink|Robots in Disguise issue 2|Robots in Disguise #2}}

Arcee accompanied Ultra Magnus and Bulkhead on another visit to Team Bee following an operation that ended with [[Overhead]] escaping. {{storylink|Robots in Disguise issue 3|Robots in Disguise #3}} After Ultra Magnus filled the other Autobot team in on the fact that Clipshade was an Autobot spy, Arcee and the rest of the team launched an operation to arrest the leader of the [[Cybercomrade Sect]], [[Overhead]]. Arcee and Strongarm got to tagteam Overhead, though when the Sect leader turned the space bridge she was working on into a black hole, Grimlock saved Arcee from being sucked in. In the aftermath of the fight, Overhead and her hench-[[Croctobot]]s were taken into custody, and Ultra Magnus, Arcee and Bulkhead returned to Cybertron with them. {{storylink|Robots in Disguise issue 4|Robots in Disguise #4}}

====2015 ''Robots in Disguise'' cartoon====
[[File:EnemyOfMyEnemy-Arcee.jpg|right|thumb|150px|This High Council don't want none unless your helmet's got buns, hon.]]
Following the restoration of Cybertron from the [[Great War (Prime)|Great War]], Arcee adopted a new body with a blue and pink color scheme. However, when a new [[Autobot High Council|High Council]] came into power, Arcee was blacklisted for being a supporter of Optimus Prime. {{Storylink|Enemy of My Enemy (RID)|Enemy of My Enemy}}
{{-}}

===''Tales of the Beast Hunters'' comic===
Arcee tracked [[Ripclaw]] to the [[Canadian Rockies]]. Rather than attack directly, she leaked the coordinates to the Decepticons in the hope they would deal with the problem. {{storylink|Tales of the Beast Hunters Chapter 19}}

===''Kre-O'' bios===
Arcee was once webbed to the ground by Airachnid and tickled mercilessly by [[Insecticon (WFC)|Insecticon]]. {{storylink|Airachnid (Prime)|Airachnid's bio}}

===''Kre-O'' online comic===
[[File:KreO Arcee.jpg|thumb|]]
Arcee was one of the [[Autobot]]s who left [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] in the ''[[Ark (Kre-O)|Ark]]'' in search for energy blocks to alleviate their hunger. Thanks to the boarding of the ''Ark'' by [[Decepticon]]s, the ''Ark'' crashed and the [[Transformer]]s fell into a four million year-long sleep. They woke up to a world filled with blocks. {{storylink|Kreon Story}}
{{-}}

===''Transformers: The Ultimate Pop-Up Universe''===
Arcee was deployed on Earth alongside [[Sideswipe (WFC)|Sideswipe]] and [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]]. {{storylink|Transformers: The Ultimate Pop-Up Universe|The Ultimate Pop-Up Universe}}

==Commercial appearances==
Arcee was weirded out by [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]], [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]], [[My Little Pony|ponies]], and an {{w|Strawberry Shortcake|underage baker}} singing Christmas carols. {{storylink|Commercial/Prime#Carolers1|The Hub Carolers}}

==Games==
===''Transformers Prime: Terrorcon Defense''===
Arcee fought off Starscream as he led Vehicon troops to the town of [[Jasper]] to collect Dark Energon from a nearby mine. She then teamed up with Bumblebee to stop Soundwave and more Vehicons from reaching an abandonned military base. She then helped Optimus Prime destroy whatever Vehicons managed to infiltrate the outpost on their way out. Upon Megatron's arrival to the battlefield, she aided Optimus Prime defend Autobot headquarters.

Arcee could deploy "Cannon Turrets", "Anti Air Turrets", and "Sniper Turrets" through the Ground Bridge to aid her in destroying Vehicons. {{storylink|Transformers Prime: Terrorcon Defense}}
{{-}}

===''Transformers: War for Cybertron'' (Xbox 360/PS3/PC)===
[[File:WFCArcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.95|Four wheels good, two wheels ''better!'' Four wheels good, two wheels ''better!'']]
{{voiceactor|[[Kari Wahlgren]] (English)|[[Alina Kamińska]] (Polish)}}
{{Note|Arcee is not a playable character in the storyline campaign. However, she can be unlocked for Escalation mode and for customization in online multiplayer as an Autobot scout. Her chassis type is listed as "Sprinter".}}

Arcee was one of the many Autobots who were captured and placed in [[Kaon (polity)|Kaon]]'s prisons complex. She was freed from her imprisonment when [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]], [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]] and [[Sideswipe (WFC)|Sideswipe]] allowed themselves to be captured in order to rescue [[Sentinel Zeta Prime|Zeta Prime]]. During their rescue attempt, they opened all of the Kaon cells, allowing the prisoners, Arcee included, to escape. The freed prisoners were all led to transport ships, overseen by [[Air Raid (WFC)|Air Raid]], in which they used to escape the complex. Arcee herself helped direct her fellow prisoners to the ships, whilst Optimus's team kept the Decepticons busy.
{{storylink|Transformers: War for Cybertron (360/PS3/PC)|Transformers: War for Cybertron}}
{{-}}

===''Transformers: Fall of Cybertron'' (Xbox 360/PS3/PC)===
[[File:Arcee-foc-pinup-Crop.jpg|upright=0.85|thumb|left|link=File:Arcee-foc-pinup.jpg|Click for full version]]
Deep in the [[Rust Sea|Sea of Rust]], a Decepticon facility housed a room containing not only a number of weapons but also a [[:File:arcee-foc-pinup.jpg|pin-up poster]] of Arcee. Sketchy. {{storylink|Transformers: Fall of Cybertron}}
{{Note|Arcee is one of three characters (with [[Barricade (WFC)|Barricade]] and [[Slipstream (WFC)|Slipstream]]) from ''War for Cybertron'' whose parts are not available in the multiplayer character designer, ostensibly because the designers couldn't make female parts work with the system.<ref>[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7dBQA-OJR0 Comic-Con: Transformers: Fall of Cybertron panel at YouTube (50:00 mark)]</ref>}}
{{-}}

=== ''Transformers: Prime - The Game'' ===
[[File:Transformers prime the game arcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.2|Say goodnight, Jak! (3DS version pictured)]]
{{voiceactor|[[Sumalee Montano]] (English)|[[Rosa Campillo]] (Castilian Spanish)}}

The Autobots detected a massive asteroid of Dark Energon headed toward Earth, and intercepted the ''Nemesis'' crew attempting to retrieve the asteroid when bridging to the location. At the climax of the battle, the asteroid began to split apart and exploded. Team Prime fell to Earth and scattered across the country.

Arcee landed back in Jasper, and was met by a horde of Insecticons upon waking up. Arcee proceeded to defeat them and was alarmed when Jack, who had come to her aid when her life signal was detected on Earth, contacted her and opened up a ground bridge for her. However, Arcee was met by Airachnid, and the latter ended up kidnapping Jack. Arcee pursued her and managed to release Jack from her possession.

Arcee & Bumblebee went to investigate a part of the asteroid that landed on Earth, though Bumblebee scouted ahead. She assisted Bumblebee in grounding Dreadwing, but that was about it. Later, Arcee joined Bumblebee in bridging to the Nemesis to save Ratchet and the children, who had been captured by the Decepticons over this period of time. She was met yet again by Airachnid, though this time coming rather close to defeating her. Unfortunately, Airachnid had escaped. The team regrouped, though missing Optimus, and Ratchet dispatched Bulkhead, Bumblebee, and Arcee to chase Thunderwing in order to give him time to create a device to corrupt his Dark Energon core. Arcee was knocked into stasis by Megatron, just in time for Optimus to arrive. Arcee was taken by Bulkhead for medical care. Arcee then assisted Jack, after much hesitation from her and Optimus, in planting Ratchet's disruption device inside of Thunderwing's core. The dynamic duo were successful in carrying out the task.

Arcee later joined the rest of the team in watching the sun set after a day's hard work. {{storylink|Transformers: Prime - The Game}}

===''Transformers Prime: Relic Hunter''===
Arcee was once sent to [[Antarctica]] to find and retrieve an Ionian{{sic}} relic. She fell in a lot of Dark Energon pits along the way. {{storylink|Transformers Prime: Relic Hunter|Relic Hunter}}
{{--}}

===Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark (3DS)===
{{voiceactor| ?}}
Arcee with [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|Cliffjumper]] and [[Hound (Prime)|Hound]] were assigned a mission to capture the [[Dark Spark]], but were confronted by [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]], [[Soundwave (WFC)|Soundwave]] and [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]]. After fighting them, the Autobots continued on their way. At the railway station, they joined the waiting Optimus, Bumblebee and Jazz. Together, the Autobots dealt with a group of Insecticons, and then loaded on a train. When the train was blown up by the Decepticons, Arcee was at the head of a detachment of the Autobots, who tried to prevent the escape of the Decepticons with the Dark spark. This attempt was unsuccessful. Then the female followed the enemies to Kaon, where she headed one of the groups that attacked Bruticus and also confronted numerous Decepticon drones. Bruticus returned, leading Arcee and the others to attack him, forcing him to retreat due to his injuries. The Autobots eventually caught up with him and caused him to fall apart.{{storylink|Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark (3DS)|Rise of the Dark Spark}}

===''Transformers Prime: Pulsar Defense''===
When the Decepticons constructed an [[Energon Drain]] in an asteroid field, Arcee and the Autobots countered it by building a [[Pulsar Dish]] from debris. While the dish was under construction, Arcee and Jack could help out by scanning the nearby debris for the necessary components. {{storylink|Transformers Prime: Pulsar Defense}}
{{-}}

===''Transformers Universe''===
[[File:Tom-stockwell-arcee-small.jpg|thumb|upright=1.2|right]]
{{Note|Arcee is seen for a brief moment in the 2014 trailer, furthermore her portrait can be found in the game files. She was intended to be the mentor for the training room, however the game was shut down before the training section was produced.}}
{{Storylink|Transformers Universe}}

{{-}}

==Toys==
===''Prime''===
====''First Edition''====
{{anchor|NewYork}}
[[File:Primetoy-ArceeNYCC.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|Arcee went back in time and had a little one with herself.]]
*'''Bumblebee and Arcee, Includes Raf Esquivel and Jack Darby''' (NYCC 2011 exclusive)
**''Accessories:'' Two arm blades/motorcycle panels

:Arcee is a [[redeco]] of Deluxe Class Arcee (see below) in pink and white [[Arcee (G1)|Generation 1 Arcee colors]] and comes with a New York taxicab [[Bumblebee (WFC)/toys#First Edition|Bumblebee]] and NY-themed [[Jack Darby#Prime|Jack Darby]] and [[Raf Esquivel#Prime|Raf Esquivel]] figurines. They were sold exclusively at [[New York Comic Con]] 2011.

::*''[http://tfu.info/2011/Autobot/NYCCArcee/arcee.htm More information on NYCC Arcee at TFU.info]''

{{-}}{{anchor|FirstEdition}}
[[File:Primetoy-ArceeDeluxe.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|Gimmicks include: plug-in arm blades, conservation of mass between modes.]]
*'''Arcee''' ("First Edition" Deluxe Class, 2011)
**''Number:'' '''002'''
**''Takara release date:'' [[December 28]], [[2011]]
**''Accessories:'' Two arm blades/motorcycle panels, stand

: Part of the first wave of ''First Edition'' Deluxe Class toys, Arcee transforms from a blue motorcycle to a robot and back. Arm blades stow in vehicle mode and can be plugged under Arcee's forearms in [[robot mode]]. Like all "First Edition" toys, a cardboard display stand comes assembled within the packaging.

: After exceptionally spotty distribution in the original release, Arcee and many of the other ''First Edition'' toys were re-released as part of a big batch of [[Toys"R"Us]] exclusives in late 2012. They later made their way to closeout chains like Ross and Marshall's.

: The TakaraTomy release of this toy uses a brighter shade of blue plastic, as well as slightly brighter paint applications.

: This mold was also used to make ''[[Transformers Timelines (toyline)|Timelines]]'' [[Transmutate (BW)#Timelines|Trans-Mutate]].

::*''[http://tfu.info/2011/Autobot/PrimeArcee/arcee.htm More information on First Edition Arcee at TFU.info]''

{{-}}{{anchor|FEPlated}}
[[File:TFP-FE-Arcee-Blue-Plated-Version.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb]]
*'''Arcee ~Blue Plated Ver~''' ("First Edition" Deluxe Class, 2013)
**''Accessories:'' Two arm blades/motorcycle panels, stand

:A chrome redeco of the First Edition Arcee figure is released as a lucky draw prize, by spending 3,000 yen or more on Transformers products at Edion or Bic Camera while the entry for the draw is obtained. The figure was limited to 40 pieces.

:As the paintable parts are chromed, ''caution is advised'' if you want to peg the pieces in place while converting.

{{-}}

====''Cyberverse''====
[[File:Cyberverse legion arcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67]]
*'''Arcee''' (Cyberverse Legion, 2012)
**''Series/Number:'' '''2 / 003'''
**''Takara release date:'' [[April 28]], 2012
**''Takara Number:'' '''EZ-09'''
**''Accessories:'' Blaster

: Part of the first wave of ''[[Transformers: Prime (toyline)|Prime]]'' [[Cyberverse (toyline)#Series 2|Series 2 Cyberverse]] Legion Class toys, this smaller-scale Arcee comes with a rubbery translucent-pink blaster which has numerous [[C joint|3mm peg]]s and a single peg-hole, allowing it to be held or mount onto any of her numerous ports. She has permanently-deployed battle blades on her arms in robot mode, and is largely [[scale]]-accurate with the Deluxe and Voyager toys in vehicle mode.

: This sculpt was also used to make [[Flamewar (Prime)|Flamewar]] and [[Transformers (2014 toyline)|''Transformers'' (2014)]] [[Groove (G1)#Transformers (2014)|Protectobot Groove]]. Her blaster, in various colors, was also used by ''Cyberverse'' [[Bumblebee (WFC)/toys#Cyberverse|Bumblebee]], [[Evac (Ride)#Cyberverse|Evac]], [[Wheeljack (Prime)#Hyperspeed|Hyperspeed Wheeljack]], [[Tailgate (Prime)|Autobot Tailgate]], the [[Bumblebee (WFC)/toys#CyberverseBattlesuit|redeco]] of Bumblebee that comes with the [[Bumblebee Battle Suit]], and the ''Transformers'' (2014) Groove figure, which he comes with ''2'' of them.

::*''[http://tfu.info/2012/Autobot/LegArcee/arcee.htm More information on Cyberverse Legion Arcee at TFU.info]''

{{-}}{{anchor|EZ6pack}}
[[File:TFP-EZ-SP1-Autobot-Set-Arcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67]]
*'''Autobot Set''' (EZ Collection 6-pack, [[November 24]], 2012)
**''ID number'': '''EZ-SP1'''
**''Accessories'': Blaster

:Available for this set, this version of Arcee replaces her blue plastic with a darker shade of blue. She was released as a six-pack along with [[Bumblebee (WFC)/toys#EZ6pack|Bumblebee]], [[Bulkhead (Prime)#EZ6pack|Bulkhead]], [[Optimus Prime (WFC)/toys#EZ6pack|Optimus Prime]], [[Ratchet (WFC)#EZ6pack|Ratchet]], and [[Wheeljack (Prime)#EZ6pack|Wheeljack]].

{{-}}

====''Robots in Disguise''====
{{anchor|Deluxe}}
[[File:PrimeRID-ArceeDeluxe.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67]]
[[File:Prime-toy ArceeTakTomDx.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|The PRID version is the more show accurate one?!?!]]
*'''Arcee''' (Deluxe Class, 2012)
**''Series/Number:'' '''1 / 005'''
**''Takara release date:'' [[May 28]], 2012
**''Takara Number:'' '''AM-11'''
**''Accessories:'' Blaster & blade (Hasbro only), "Arc" Arms Micron (Takara only)

: Part of the second wave of ''[[Transformers: Prime (toyline)#Robots in Disguise (2012)|Prime: Robots in Disguise]]'' Deluxe Class toys, this smaller, new-mold Deluxe Class Arcee figure features a transformation that relies slightly more on fake kibble than the earlier Deluxe toy. The entire front of the bike now stores on her back, though the rest of the toy transforms very similarly (but not identically). She comes with a large blaster and one of her arm blades, both of which can mount onto her hands, forearms, and front wheel via [[5 mm post|5mm post]], as well as combine with each other. Additionally, the blades from the "First Edition" figure can mount onto thin pegs on either side of her vehicle mode.

: The Japanese release has new 5mm post attachments added to her wings, to go along with the [[Arms Micron]] system. As such, she loses the blaster and blade combo, and instead has her own Arms Micron, [[Arc]], who transforms into a weapon somewhat resembling her arm-blade. Most of her [[paint operation]]s also have been removed, replaced with customer-applied foil [[sticker]]s.

: This mold was also used for [[BotCon 2014]] [[Flareup (G1)#BotCon2014|Flareup]] and was heavily retooled into ''[[Transformers: Generations (toyline)|Generations]]'' [[Chromia (G1)#Generations|Chromia]].

::*''[http://tfu.info/2012/Autobot/Arcee/arcee.htm More information on ''Robots in Disguise'' Arcee at TFU.info]''
::*''[http://higekumatoytoy.blog60.fc2.com/blog-entry-1541.html Arms Micron Arcee at Alfes's toy blog]''
{{PrimeRIDArceeMold}}
{{-}}

====''Beast Hunters''====
{{anchor|BHDeluxe}}
[[File:Beast hunters arcee deluxe.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|Batgiiirl! Batgiiiirl! Where do you come from? Where do you go?]]
*'''Arcee''' (Deluxe Class, 2013)
**''Series/Number:'' '''2 / 012'''
**''Accessories:'' Echohawk Bow, two [[missile]]s

: Part of the fourth wave of ''[[Transformers: Prime (toyline)#BH|Prime: Beast Hunters]]'' Deluxe Class toys, Arcee is a redeco and extensive [[retool]] of ''Prime: Robots in Disguise'' Arcee, and comes with the massive spring-loaded "[[Echohawk Bow]]", which can fire its two missiles. It can be held via its two jointed 5mm handles, as well as attach to her front wheel in vehicle mode.

:Her instructions include the [[Tales of the Beast Hunters Chapter 19|nineteenth chapter]] of the ''[[Tales of the Beast Hunters]]'' series.

: This version of the mold was also used for [[BotCon 2014]] [[Flamewar (G1)#BotCon2014|Flamewar]].

::*''[http://tfu.info/2013/Autobot/Arcee/arcee.htm More information on ''Beast Hunters'' Arcee at TFU.info]''
{{PrimeRIDArceeMold}}

{{-}}
===''Kre-O''===
[[File:Kre-O-Autobot-Command-Center.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb]]
*'''Autobot Command Center''' (Playset, 2013)
**''Set number'': '''A5412'''
**''Pieces'': '''461'''
**''Kreons'': Arcee, Bumblebee, Optimus Prime, Ratchet, Shockwave

: The Command Center playset includes a Kreon of Arcee based on her ''[[Transformers: Prime (franchise)|Prime]]'' incarnation. She uses the [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]] style helmet. There's also a blue [[Wheeljack (G1)/toys#Kre-O|Wheeljack]] backpack-wing in the set that is not technically hers, but can be added to her to make her just that little bit more like the show model.

: The set also comes with ''Prime''-style Kreons of [[Bumblebee (Kre-O)#CommandCenter|Bumblebee]], [[Ratchet (Kre-O)#CommandCenter|Ratchet]], [[Shockwave (Kre-O)#CommandCenter|Shockwave]], and [[Knock Out (Prime)#CommandCenter|Knock Out]], and a brick-built [[Rippersnapper (Prime)#CommandCenter|Rippersnapper]] beast and [[Optimus Prime (Kre-O)#CommandCenter|Optimus Prime]] truck.

{{-}}
===''Go!''===
[[File:Gotoy-HunterArcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|"... ''Bullseye.''"]]
*'''Hunter Arcee''' ([[October 26]], [[2013]])
**''ID number:'' '''G22'''
**''Accessories:'' Arc Bowgun, two missiles

:Part of the sixth wave of [[TakaraTomy]] ''[[Triple Combination: Transformers Go! (toyline)|Go!]]'' toys, Hunter Arcee is a [[redeco]] of the ''Beast Hunters'' Deluxe Class Arcee toy, and features a predominantly blue and black color scheme with silver and pink highlights, similar to her ''Prime'' cartoon appearance.
{{PrimeRIDArceeMold}}

{{-}}

===''Legacy''===
[[File:TF-Legacy-Deluxe-Class-Arcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.67|Arcee’s been bulking since ''Prime'' ended in case they make a ''Legacy'' toy of Airachnid for her to go at it with.]]
*'''Prime Universe Arcee''' (Deluxe Class, [[2022]])
**''TakaraTomy ID number'': '''TL-05'''
**''TakaraTomy release date'': [[August 27]], [[2022]]
**''Accessories:'' 2x [[Energon]] blades, front tire/Energon blaster

: Part of the first wave of ''[[Transformers: Legacy|Legacy]]'' Deluxe Class toys, "Prime Universe Arcee" is a ''Generations''-styled version of the character that transforms into a '90s-style sportbike motorcycle, much like a {{w|Kawasaki Ninja ZX-7R}}. Her accessories include two [[Energon]] blades, which can mount to her motorcycle mode, as well as form a shield in robot mode. Her front tire can be detached and split open to reveal an Energon blaster. In a feature intended more for her mold mate Road Rocket (see below) but nevertheless highlighted in Arcee's instructions, this Energon blaster can also plug into a 5mm port in Arcee's back.

: Not documented in the instructions, the waist of the figure can clip the ball joint to the abs in robot mode, for a more stable figure, but the joint comes apart and detaches the legs from the torso easily when trying to convert back to motorcycle. Another undocumented feature is that the energy blades can attach to ''Legacy'' [[Skids (G1)#Legacy|Skids's]] Axe, leading many to believe that combining weapons might be a theme across many size classes of ''Legacy'' figures, and not just the Core Class figures in the promotional/box art.

: This figure was retooled into ''[[Transformers: Legacy|Velocitron Speedia 500 Collection]]'' [[Road Rocket (G2)#Legacy|Road Rocket]] and redecoed into ''[[Transformers: Generations (toyline)#Shattered Glass Collection|Shattered Glass Collection]]'' [[Flamewar (SG)|Decepticon Flamewar]].
{{--}}

==Merchandise==
===Kinder Surprise===
*'''Transformers: Prime''' (2014)
:Only available inside a blindpacked chocolate egg as part of Kinder's ''Transformers: Prime'' series, this buildable Arcee mini-figure consists of a generic "cog" onto which her limbs and armor can be clipped to construct her. She has articulation on her shoulders and upper legs.
{{-}}

===Eaglemoss cards===
{{Charstubtoys}}

{{-}}
===''R.E.D. [Robot Enhanced Design]''===
[[File:TF-R.E.D.-Arcee.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|So you're saying there's a ''21st century'' we can tap for nostalgia?]]
*'''Arcee''' (March 2021)
**''Accessories'': 2 Ion Blasters, 2 alternate hands, 2 Forearm Blades with [[Fire Blast effect|slash effects]], [[Dark Energon]] Crystal

:Released as part of the second wave of ''[[Transformers R.E.D.]]'' toys, Arcee is a non-transforming 6-inch action figure akin to the ones from the ''[[Marvel Comics|Marvel]] Legends'' and ''[[Star Wars (franchise)|Star Wars]] The Black Series'' lines. She features 26 points of articulation and extensive paint operations in an attempt at [[show-accuracy]].

:Arcee's chest plate can be removed to reveal details meant to represent her "inner workings". She includes two pairs of hands: two closed fists, and two open hands to hold (non-included) weapons or accessories; her hands can also be completely removed and replaced with her Ion Blaster accessories. Also included are a pair of blade accessories that can plug into her forearms, along with two blast effects that can slide onto the blades' edges to represent a slash attack. Finally, she also comes with a translucent, purple, cube-shaped chunk of unrefined Dark Energon ore. Arcee's stock CG renders show her slash effects variously in the same colors as the Dark Energon crystal or her blue paint applications; the toy as released features them in unpainted grey.

:As with all ''R.E.D.'' toys, Arcee was a Walmart exclusive in Canada and the United States, and was later made available on [[Hasbro Pulse]] in limited quantities.
{{-}}

==Notes==
[[File:DarknessRising3-Arceesizechange.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|The motorcycle transforms into her leg and then the rest of her robot mode hops over and attaches to it.]]
[[File:VectorSigmaBotBuilderArcee.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1|Basically destined to be [[Pinkie Pie]] at some point.]]
*In the ''Prime'' cartoon, Arcee's [[hologram|holographic]] driver is named "[[Sadie]]".<ref>[[Darkness Rising, Part 1]]
</ref>
* All of the Autobots in ''Prime'' [[size changing|change size]] between [[alternate mode]]s, but it's way more noticeable with Arcee's transformation from a vehicle roughly the size of Jack to a robot just a little shorter than Bumblebee. Her tires do not change size when she transforms. One can see a little regular-sized tire in her back, and small half-tires on her calves.
*Arcee's chest panels [[:File:PrimeArcee PinkParts.jpg|fluctuate]] in color from episode to episode. Sometimes, they're pink; other times, they're clear. They seem to be clear more often than pink, though.
*Arcee's blue color scheme is due to the writers not wanting to make Jack look silly by putting him on a pink motorcycle.<ref>[http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/transformers-prime-39/nycc-2011-transformers-prime-panel-tony-todd-is-dreadwing-nathan-fillion-to-voice-a-transformer-173567/ NYCC 2011 Transformers: Prime Panel at TFW2005]</ref>
*Arcee's show model is the basis for the non-toy character [[Akiba Prime]].
*In the Japanese dub of ''Transformers: Prime'', Arcee's catchphrase of "scrap" was rendered "saiaku" (最悪), a phrase that literally translates to "the worst". It is often used by young women as an expression of frustration or irritation.
*Arcee's body parts are available to use in the Hub website's [[Vector Sigma Bot Builder]] online game. Normally, you cannot configure a generic 'bot using all Arcee parts, but you can see what one would look like at right through the magic of Photoshop.
*In the [[Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark (3DS)|3DS version of ''Rise of the Dark Spark'']], there are obvious hints at a relationship between Cliffjumper and Arcee. Cliffjumper refers to Arcee as, "Darling", and Hound flat out says to Arcee, "I see why Cliffjumper likes you, boss."
*Arcee is the only one of the original Autobots in ''Prime'' (excluding the deceased Cliffjumper) not to appear in ''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2015 cartoon)|Robots in Disguise]]'' with a speaking role.
**During her easter egg appearance on the show, she is depicted in an updated version of her ''Prime'' body with elements of her Generation 1 [[Arcee (G1)|counterpart]], what with the divided backpack and Princess Leia-inspired "buns" on her helmet.
*A proposed [[Fun Publications]] [[BotCon]] [[exclusive]] was a redeco of [[#Robots in Disguise|''Prime: Robots in Disguise'' Deluxe Class Arcee]] into a "Femme Fatale" version of [[Cy-Kill (GoBots)|''GoBots'' Cy-Kill]].<ref>[http://www.toycollectors.com.au/bc14/bc14br.html BotCon 2014 attendee report]</ref>
===Arms Up Modes===
In the Japanese ''Prime'' toyline, Arcee has named powered-up modes when given various [[Arms Micron]]s in certain configurations:
*'''Slasher Mode''' (スラッシャーモード ''Surasshā Mōdo'')
**''Arms Microns'': Arc, B.2, B.H., C.L., O.P., R.A.
: Seen on her box-back photo, in this mode Arcee uses the [[Slash Cannon α]] on her right arm, [[Slash Cannon β]] on the other, with [[C.L.]] on her right wing and [[B.H.]] on her left.
*'''Crushgize Nebula Scythe''' (クラッシュジアイズネビュラーサイズ ''Kurasshujiaizu Nebyurā Saizu'')
**''Arms Microns'': Arc, B.H., Baro, Gora, O.P., R.A., Zori
: This rather overblown mode, revealed in the ''[[From the Cybertron Satellite, Transformers Division|Cybertron Satellite]]'' portion of "[[Scrapheap (episode)|Freezing Transformation!? Terror of the Minicons]]", starts with Arcee holding the [[Nebula Scythe]] Combo Weapon. Add [[Gora]] to her right wing, [[R.A.]] to her left, [[Zori]] to her back and [[Baro]] in drill mode to the end of Zori's tail, and boom! The "gize" part of the name seems to be from the word "energize".
===Foreign names===
*''Japanese:'' '''Arcee''' (アーシー ''Āshī'')

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Fall of Cybertron Autobots]]
[[Category:Female Transformers]]
[[Category:Hall of Fame characters]]
[[Category:Kre-O Autobots]]
[[Category:Kreons]]
[[Category:Legends Autobots]]
[[Category:Letters page answerers]]
[[Category:Prime Autobots]]
[[Category:Robots in Disguise (2015) Autobots]]
[[Category:Spies]]
[[Category:Transformers Universe game Autobots]]
[[Category:War for Cybertron Autobots]]
[[Category:Convention exclusives]]
[[Category:Cyberverse]]
[[Category:Go! Autobots]]
[[Category:Legacy Autobots]]

Argus Base

2022-08-24T15:03:21Z

Bumblebee2000:

{{picsneeded}}
'''Argus Base''' is an old military fortification that a small group of humans led by [[G.B. Blackrock]] reside in, forming a small resistance against [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron's]] tyranny.

==Fiction==
===''Regeneration One''===
After Megatron reactivated the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]] and conquered Earth with an army of deceased Autobots and Decepticons, a small group of humans led by G.B. Blackrock took refuge in Argus Base. It was there that the comatose [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike Witwicky]] was revived as Circuit Smasher. When the [[Wreckers]] arrived on Earth, and stumbled across Spike Witwicky and some other humans, Spike took them back to Argus Base, where they met with Blackrock and formed a plan to shut down the Ark and taking down Megatron. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 3}}

==Notes==
Blackrock tells the Wreckers that the former owners of Argus Base were an "ultra-secret" covert team who "went up against your lot [Transformers] way back when". While not explicitly named, this and the large eagle-head sigil on the conference desk seems to implicitly identify the team as [[G.I. Joe]], who gained a similar avian symbol with 2009's Rise of Cobra series and did indeed fight the Transformers during Marvel's run.

[[Category:Bases]]
[[Category:Regeneration One locations]]

Argus Base

2022-08-24T15:02:58Z

Bumblebee2000: Copied the note about ARGUS Base on the "Loose Ends part three" page over to here as I was surprised to see it absent. I do mean copied, credit and thanks to the user who originally wrote that

{{picsneeded}}
'''Argus Base''' is an old military fortification that a small group of humans led by [[G.B. Blackrock]] reside in, forming a small resistance against [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron's]] tyranny.

==Fiction==
===''Regeneration One''===
After Megatron reactivated the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]] and conquered Earth with an army of deceased Autobots and Decepticons, a small group of humans led by G.B. Blackrock took refuge in Argus Base. It was there that the comatose [[Spike Witwicky (G1)|Spike Witwicky]] was revived as Circuit Smasher. When the [[Wreckers]] arrived on Earth, and stumbled across Spike Witwicky and some other humans, Spike took them back to Argus Base, where they met with Blackrock and formed a plan to shut down the Ark and taking down Megatron. {{storylink|Loose Ends, Part 3}}

==Notes==
Blackrock tells the AWreckers that the former owners of Argus Base were an "ultra-secret" covert team who "went up against your lot [Transformers] way back when". While not explicitly named, this and the large eagle-head sigil on the conference desk seems to implicitly identify the team as [[G.I. Joe]], who gained a similar avian symbol with 2009's Rise of Cobra series and did indeed fight the Transformers during Marvel's run.

[[Category:Bases]]
[[Category:Regeneration One locations]]

DC Comics

2022-08-18T05:34:31Z

Bumblebee2000: reference link 404s, replaced with wayback

'''DC Comics''' is a comic book company.

==Fiction==
===Ask Vector Prime===
In the universe [[Quadwal 1215.15 Epsilon]], DC put out a much beloved ''[[GoBots]]'' comic that ran alongside the ''{{gb|Challenge of the GoBots}}'' cartoon. Online [[Fandom|fans]] on alt.toys.gobots in the 90s would spend countless hours debating which of the two was superior. {{storylink|Source:Ask Vector Prime/Facebook#December 21, 2015|Ask Vector Prime, December 21, 2015}}

==Notes==
* In the late 2000s, [[Phil Jimenez]], in collaboration with [[IDW Publishing]] editor-in-chef [[Chris Ryall]], pitched a comic book crossover between the Transformers and DC Comics' {{w|Justice League}}. Sadly, the pitch never came to fruition,<ref name="jla">[https://web.archive.org/web/20121001130724/http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2012/08/phil-jimenezs-jlatransformers-crossover-pitch-was-undeniably-epic/ Phil Jimenez’s JLA/Transformers crossover pitch was undeniably ‘epic’] at Comic Book Resources</ref> likely in part due to the massive {{w|The New 52}} reboot project of [[2011]].
* Artist [[Jim Lee]] currently serves as both Publisher and Chief Creative Officer of the company, with the latter position previously held by [[Dan DiDio]] until early [[2020]].

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
*[https://www.dccomics.com/ Official site]
*{{w|DC Comics}} at Wikipedia

[[Category:Companies]]
[[Category:Comics]]
[[Category:Warner Bros. properties]]

Phil Jimenez

2022-08-18T05:33:59Z

Bumblebee2000: reference link 404s, replaced with wayback

[[File:PhilJimenez creator.jpg‎|right|thumb|150x|Okay... but with ''what?'']]
'''Phil Jimenez''' (born [[July 12]], [[1970]]) is an American comic book artist and writer, well known for his work on ''Wonder Woman'', ''Infinite Crisis'', ''New [[X-Men]]'', ''The Invisibles'', and ''Amazing [[Spider-Man]]''. Jimenez makes no secret out of his professional admiration of famous comic book artist {{w|George Pérez}}, whom he considers his primary influence, to the point where the two artists' art styles are nearly indistinguishable.

==Cover art==
* ''[[Transformers: Rage in Heaven]]'' (hardcover)
* ''[[The Transformers: Robots in Disguise]]'' issues [[Shockwaves|17]] & [[Second Exodus|18]] (retailer incentive covers)

==Package art==
* [[Hasbro Toy Shop]]/[[San Diego Comic-Con]] 2013 [[exclusive]] [[Metroplex (G1)#Generations|Metroplex]]

==Comic art==
* [[2005 IDW continuity|The Transformers]]: [[Dark Cybertron (IDW)|Dark Cybertron]] Chapters: [[Dark Dawn: Dark Cybertron Chapter 1|1]] and [[...And the Damage Done: Dark Cybertron Finale|12]] (layouts)

==Notes==
* In the late 2000s, Jimenez, in collaboration with [[IDW Publishing]] editor-in-chef [[Chris Ryall]], pitched a comic book crossover between the Transformers and [[DC Comics]]' {{w|Justice League}}. Sadly, the pitch never came to fruition.<ref name="jla">[https://web.archive.org/web/20121001130724/http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2012/08/phil-jimenezs-jlatransformers-crossover-pitch-was-undeniably-epic/ Phil Jimenez’s JLA/Transformers crossover pitch was undeniably ‘epic’] at Comic Book Resources (archived)</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
* {{w|Phil Jimenez}} at Wikipedia

{{DEFAULTSORT:Jimenez, Phil}}
[[Category:Illustrators]]

Ultra Magnus (G1)/toys

2022-08-15T07:56:27Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Alternity */ fix Fort Max and Star Saber links which I assume is from before they got a dedicated toy page

{{suite}}

[[File:MP Magnus book cover art.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.2|He can't deal with the obligatory joke now!]]
Sometimes [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]] looks a lot like [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]]. There are a lot of [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys|Optimus Prime toys]], and they need to be [[redeco]]ed into SOMETHING. Ergo...

==Toys==
===''The Transformers''===
{{anchor|Generation 1}}[[File:Ultramagnusg1toy.jpg|right|upright=1.67|thumb|Honkimus Prime]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (1986, 1987)
**''Takara ID number:'' '''C-69'''
**''Accessories:'' Large robot head, rifle, chest plate, 2 trailer connectors/waist plates, 2 small robot fists (left & right), 2 large robot fists (left & right), 2 missile launchers, 4 missiles

: ''[[The Transformers (toyline)|The Transformers]]'' Ultra Magnus is a [[redeco]] of the ''[[Diaclone]]'' "Powered Convoy" figure, itself a redeco and slight retool of "Battle Convoy", the toy that became the original [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys|Optimus Prime]] figure, sporting a new trailer. One of the last few ''Diaclone'' toys to be released in the ''Transformers'' toyline, Magnus was recolored from the original toy's dark blue, red and black color scheme into a more patriotic red, white and blue. His chestplate, which was rendered white in his package art, was molded in the same blue as his shoulders. He transforms into a White Freightliner WFT-8664T cabover semi-trailer truck, towing a car-carrier trailer capable of transporting up to four normal-sized Autobot cars. As with Optimus Prime, his cab transforms into a small robot, which can then combine with the trailer to form a "super robot", although all original Generation 1 fiction prior to the 21st century ignored this and simply rendered the super robot as Magnus's default robot form. To facilitate this combination, Magnus sports a slightly longer front axle than Prime, thereby creating tabs on either side of the cab that slide into grooves in the trailer to help lock the small robot into place. He is armed with a rifle sporting two handles that allow either of his [[robot mode]]s to hold it, and two shoulder-mounted missile launchers, whose spring-loaded firing mechanism was removed for the Hasbro release of the figure.

:Despite having extensive arm articulation on the same level as his inner Prime mold, Magnus's completed robot mode's arms are somewhat hindered by protrusions along the sides of his body. While this does not particularly impede his arms from moving, positioning them at certain levels will cause said protrusions to force them outwards. The helmet also features empty eye-sockets, which show nothing but his inner Prime's upper brow behind them as opposed to actual eyes.

:The ''Diaclone'' Powered Convoy figure had several additional features and modes which were mostly excised or left unmentioned for the ''Transformers'' release of Ultra Magnus. Principally, Powered Convoy came packaged with "Powered Buggy", who was left out of Magnus's release (see [[#Notes|notes below]] for further details). Omitted from Magnus's instructions is the ability of his chestplate and super robot head to combine to form a small vehicle; the Powered Convoy version of the figure included small rolling wheels on the underside of the chestplate which were removed for Ultra Magnus. Three additional modes were included in the ''Diaclone'' instructions that Hasbro left out: a "preparation base" mode and an "Autobot base" mode were excluded entirely, while the third, a "catapult launcher" mode originally intended and proportioned to accommodate the ''Diaclone'' Jet Robo figure that became [[Starscream (G1)/toys|Starscream]], was shown only on the front of his packaging, interacting with [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]]. The Japanese release of Ultra Magnus—released as part of the ''[[Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers (toyline)#Toys 2|Scramble City]]'' sub-line—''did'' include instructions for the preparation base and catapult launcher modes, but replaced the original Autobot base mode with a new configuration.

:The original Ultra Magnus figure has been reissued and redecoed several times down the years, and this article strives to list each edition of the figure under its own heading. The first alteration to Magnus, however, was a [[variant|running change]] made while he was still on shelves: Originally, his tires were made of [[rubber tires|rubber]] and he sported paint on both his small and large robot heads, but this version was replaced with one featuring plastic tires and no paint on either head. In addition, the clear yellow plastic that formed his windows was removed from the cab, leaving just holes instead; and his thighs and fuel tanks were left white, as opposed to the vacuum metalized chrome ones of the original release.

:The small robot component, as well as being part of Optimus Prime, was also released with a different trailer as [[Pepsi Convoy]]. The white Optimus Prime redeco was also repurposed to be [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys|Optimus Prime]] himself in the ''[[Transformers vs. G.I. Joe]]'' [[The War Never Ends|#11]].

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/1986/Autobot/UltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{G1OptimusPrimeMold}}

{{-}}{{anchor|2000reissue}}
[[File:Reissue ultra magnus.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.67]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (December 2000)
**''ID number:'' '''C-69'''
**''Accessories:'' Large robot head, rifle, chest plate, 2 trailer connectors/waist plates, 2 small robot fists (left & right), 2 large robot fists (left & right), 2 missile launchers, 4 missiles

:Ultra Magnus was first reissued in Japan in December of 2000, featuring no discernible changes from the original Japanese edition of the figure. His packaging sported a metallic golden sticker commemorating the fifteenth anniversary of the ''Transformers'' franchise in Japan.

:This reissue of Magnus was accompanied by two exclusive redecos, noted below.

{{-}}{{anchor|MatrixGlow}}
[[File:Ultra-magnus Matrix Glow.JPG|right|upright=1.67|thumb|Till All Go Number One!]]
*'''Shining Magnus''' ([[December 26]], 2000)
**''ID number:'' '''C-69'''
**''Accessories:'' Large robot head, rifle, chest plate, trailer connector/waist plate, 2 small robot fists (left & right), 2 missile launchers, 4 missiles

: With a yellow cab and an entirely translucent yellow trailer, Shining Magnus is intended to recall the moment in the ''[[The Transformers: The Movie]]'', just before Optimus Prime dies, when the Matrix is passed to Ultra Magnus and he is bathed in its light. Of course, the Matrix's light was, er, ''blue,'' so it's a weird fit. The Marvel Comics adaptation of the film did colour the light yellow, but it seems rather unlikely that's where Takara were taking their inspiration from.

:Shining Magnus was one of two exclusive redecos released in the wake of the 2000 reissue of the original Ultra Magnus toy. Limited to only 800 pieces, it was available only at the 20th Century Toy Museum toy show, held on [[December 26]], 2000 at the Mitsukoshi Department Store in Yokohama, Japan. The toy is sometimes known as "Matrix Glow Magnus" amongst collectors, or less favorably, "Urine Magnus".

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2001/Autobot/UltraMagnusMatrixGlow/ultramagnus.htm More information on Matrix Glow Magnus at TFU.info]''

{{-}}{{anchor|MoviePreview}}
[[File:G1 UltraMagnusPreviewVersion toy.jpg|right|upright=1.67|thumb|Blue Honkimus Prime]]
*'''Ultra Magnus Yokokuhen Version''' ([[February 26]], 2001)
**''ID number:'' '''C-69'''
**''Accessories:'' Large robot head, rifle, chest plate, trailer connector/waist plate, 2 small robot fists (left & right), 2 missile launchers, 4 missiles

: In the early stages of the development of ''The Transformers: The Movie'', [[The Transformers: The Movie promo|promotional footage]] for the movie was released that depicted Ultra Magnus in the black, red, and dark blue color scheme of the original ''Diaclone'' Powered Convoy toy. As the second of two exclusive redecos released in the wake of the 2000 reissue of the original Ultra Magnus toy, the "Movie Preview Version" (予告編バージョン ''Yokokuhen Bājon'') of Ultra Magnus paid homage to this early appearance. He ''is'' just a redeco of the Magnus figure, however, and so despite his resemblance to the ''Diaclone'' figure, he still lacks that toy's exclusive features, like Powered Buggy, wheels in his chestplate, and a Diaclone pilot.

: Movie Preview Version Ultra Magnus was available exclusively at Toy Festival 2001, held on [[February 26]], 2001 in Tokyo, Japan, limited to 1,500 pieces.

: This toy doubles as the separate characters [[Delta Magnus]] and [[Magna Convoy]]

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2001/Autobot/UltraMagnusPre-Movie/ultramagnus.htm More information on Ultra Magnus Movie Preview Version at TFU.info]''
{{--}}

====''Transform Jr''====
[[File:Ultramagnus jr.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.67|And thus a trend is foreshadowed]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Gokin, 1985)
**''ID number:'' '''C-69'''
**''Accessories:'' Laser Blaster, two fists (left and right), head, cardboard trailer

:As one of the first ''[[Transform Jr]]'' toys, this version of Ultra Magnus was released under the early name for the series, ''Transform Gōkin''. Naturally, the figure is a redeco of the [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Transform Jr|''Transform Jr'' Optimus Prime toy]], a smaller, simplified version of the original Generation 1 cab robot figure intended as a low-cost alternative for younger children. Magnus features a similar transformation to his larger toy, with a removable head in addition to fists, but lacks rubber tires and translucent windows. As with most other ''Transform Jr'' figures, he lacked most of his major accessories, coming only with a rifle (a white redeco of [[Ion blaster|Prime's gun]], rather than Magnus's own unique weapon) and a cardboard replacement for his trailer that had to be assembled by the buyer, and which unsurprisingly, could not form armor.

::*''[http://www.angelfire.com/ny5/reminator4/HTML/g1auto/magnusjr.htm More information on Transform Jr Ultra Magnus at an Ultra Magnus fan site]''
{{-}}

[[File:Tfjr magnus galvatron.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.67]]
*'''Ultra Magnus vs Galvatron''' (multi-pack, 1987)
**''Accessories:'' Laser Blaster, two fists (left and right), head, cardboard trailer

:Later, by the time the line had been rebranded with the more familiar ''Jr'' title, the Magnus figure was re-released in a two-pack with a [[Galvatron (G1)/toys#Seven|vinyl figurine of]] [[Galvatron (G1)/toys|Galvatron]], which also came with a die-cast figurine of [[Metroplex (G1)|Metroplex]].
{{--}}

===''Commemorative Series''===
[[File:G1toy commemorative magnus.jpg|right|upright=1.67|thumb|So the reissue was later reissued....''All right, give me the bomb''.]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (2002/2012)
**''Accessories:'' Large robot head, rifle, chest plate, 2 trailer connectors/waist plates, 2 small robot fists (left & right), 2 large robot fists (left & right), 2 missile launchers, 4 missiles

:Part of their ''[[The Transformers: Generation One Commemorative Series|Commemorative Series]]'' of Generation 1 reissues, Ultra Magnus was released in the first series (Series I) and has proper functional missile launches for the first time in the Western Hemisphere, but this meant that, like all the other ''Commemorative Series'' toys with renewed firing projectiles, his formerly short missiles were infamously lengthened to absurdity [[for safety reasons]]. Additionally, like the ''Commemorative'' Optimus Prime toy, his smokestacks were shortened to prevent breakage.

:The figure was given a surprise re-release in late 2012, Though the "''Commemorative Series''" label was not printed anywhere on the packaging, the included instructions retained the name. The figure is largely similar to its previous ''Commemorative'' release. Despite early product listings by online stores depicting the figure with long smokestacks,<ref name="longstacks">[http://tformers.com/article.php?sid=19045 Premature announcement of long smokestacks for the 2012 Asia reissue of Commemorative Series Ultra Magnus] at TFormers</ref> the stacks are actually still short like on the previous release.<ref name="shortstacks">[http://vxt.ca/2013/01/05/transformers-reviews-commemorative-series-ultra-magnus-missile-modification-tutorial/ Review of the 2012 Asia reissue of Commemorative Series Ultra Magnus] at VTX (the long stacks seen in the photos are explicitly stated to be a custom job)</ref> The cab also has the modified hitch that the Optimus Prime cab received for the [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#G1MoviePrime|2011 ''Chronicle'' DOTM two pack]]. In any case, [[Mold#Deterioration|mold deterioration]] is beginning to catch up to the tooling.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2002/Autobot/CSUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on ''Commemorative Series'' Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{--}}

===''Masterpiece''===
[[File:Masterpiece UltraMagnus toy.jpg|right|upright=2.2|thumb|I looked like this in a comic [[Revelation (War and Peace)|once]]. ONCE!]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (2005/2008)
**''ID number:'' '''MP-2'''
**''Accessories:'' Rifle, Megatron gun with removable silencer, scope and stock, Matrix of Leadership, energon axe

: ''[[The Transformers: Masterpiece|Masterpiece]]'' Ultra Magnus is a white redeco of ''Masterpiece'' Convoy (Optimus Prime) with all the same accessories, though some have been redecoed. Additionally, his box can be refolded into his classic trailer configuration, but doesn't hold up since it's, well, cardboard. He retains the Matrix, which he can indeed open. Dammit, open.

: As a [[TakaraTomy|Takara]] product, ''Masterpiece'' Ultra Magnus was never released in the US, but was eventually released by Hasbro Australia in 2005 for their market as a Target exclusive, retaining his Japanese packaging, with simple stickers stating a recommended age of 8+, as well as presenting Hasbro Australia's details and explaining what the product was.

: Additionally, [[TakaraTomy]] reissued Masterpiece Ultra Magnus in 2008 sporting their logo in the top right-hand corner of the box to replace the Takara logo in the bottom right featured on the original release in 2005. This reissue has been met with some [[quality control]] issues much like that of [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#mp4|Convoy Perfect Edition]], such as bad paint applications and chipping, misaligned doors, and even [[Misassembly|mis-assembled]] headlights which have been installed upside down.

: Like all the Japanese versions of this mold, Ultra Magnus features different images on his communicators than all other releases. In his case he features [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys|Optimus Prime]] and a digital readout.

: This mold was also used to make ''Masterpiece'' "[[Eldedroid#Masterpiece|Convoy Black Version]]".

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2005/Cybertron/UltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Masterpiece Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{MP1Mold}}

{{-}}{{anchor|MP22}}
[[File:MP22-UltraMagnus.jpg|right|upright=2.2|thumb|You know what? He can deal with this n...hold on, WHY THE HELL DOES HIS CAB HAVE A RED BUMPER-- ''*looks at screencaps*'' oh huh]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' ([[2014]]-[[December 27|12-27]]/[[2018]]-[[January 27|01-27]])
**''ID number:'' '''MP-22'''
**''Accessories:'' Super Blaster Gun, 2 missiles, [[Spike Witwicky (G1)#MP22|Spike figure]], [[Daniel Witwicky (G1)#MP22|Daniel figure]], left & right Matrix hands, neutral face, screaming face

: The second release of ''Masterpiece'' Ultra Magnus is an all new, much more show-accurate mold, transforming into a car carrier with a functioning gate/ramp. He can carry 4 smaller ''Masterpiece'' Autobots in the top and bottom of his trailer, which features small indents to stop them from rolling off. While the cab in his [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]] is heavily modeled on the MP-10 Optimus Prime mold, it doesn't transform into a separate white Optimus Prime figure, but rather folds inside-out to form his upper torso. The cab is much lighter than the MP-10 cab (due to it being hollow), and neither can carry the other's trailer due to differences in the height of the back section and a different attachment process.

:He is designed to interact with the Matrix of Leadership of [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#MP10|MP-10 Optimus Prime]] in many ways: His chest opens to reveal a Matrix compartment, and he comes with an extra pair of hands specifically molded to hold the Matrix. To complement this, his regular, "neutral" face can be replaced with an alternative "screaming" face. Both faces can store on a panel in his back, and removing his face reveals a white face-plated design underneath the helmet, as a reference to the "White Optimus in armor" design of the original toy.

:For his other accessories and features, he comes with his gun, and his two non-firing shoulder missile launchers. The gun stores in the trailer in vehicle mode, while the launchers have removable missiles, and are no longer detachable, instead being connected to poseable armatures. Finally, he also comes with articulated figurines of Spike and Daniel, who can ride in his cab in vehicle mode.

[[File:MP-22 Ultra Magnus stock.jpg|right|1px]]
:The artwork on the spec card and instruction booklet are in a different style to other TakaraTomy ''Masterpiece'' releases. Also, early [[Stock photography|stock photo]]s depicted him [[:File:MP-22 Ultra Magnus stock.jpg|with red inner legs and a gray gun.]]

:If bought in Asian markets outside Japan, Ultra Magnus comes with a [[collector coin]]. The coin comes in a package designed after Ultra Magnus's chest, although the white "belt" is upside-down compared to the ''Masterpiece'' figure.

:In Australia, Ultra Magnus was a [[Toys"R"Us]] [[exclusive]], being limited to 400 pieces. This release has a different box design (the same artwork as the instruction manual on the regular release) and instructions in English.

:This figure was reissued on [[January 27]], [[2018]].

:''Masterpiece'' Ultra Magnus was later redecoed as [[Delta Magnus#Masterpiece|Delta Magnus]].
{{MPMagnusMold}}

{{-}}{{anchor|MP35}}
{{picsneeded|Die-Cast figure}}
* '''Ultra Magnus''' Mini Die-Cast figure (2017)
**''ID number:'' '''2'''

:The Hasbro Asia release of ''Masterpiece'' [[Grapple (G1)#Masterpiece|Grapple]] comes with a mini Ultra Magnus figure, the second in a range of non transformable collectables made from <s>lost art</s> Die-Cast metal and based on the corresponding ''Masterpiece'' figure (MP-22).
{{--}}

===''G-2''===
{{anchor|G2}}
[[File:G2toy-LaserUltraMagnus.jpg|right|upright=1.67|thumb|Probably the only Magnus repaint of Prime we'll ever get who isn't just white.]]
*'''Laser Ultra Magnus''' (2006)
**''ID number:'' ''' TRF-13-S'''
**''Accessories:'' Gun, sword, 5 discs, ripple missile launcher, 10 missiles, 1 foam missile, foam missile launcher air bellows

: An [[e-HOBBY]] exclusive, ''G-2'' Laser Ultra Magnus is a redeco of Laser Optimus Prime, transforming into a mid-1990s Western Star 4964EX extended-hood truck pulling a blue and white tanker trailer. He was packaged in the reissue Laser Optimus Prime's box, along with Prime's instructions, bio card, and sticker sheet. Yes, the stickers that have "Optimus Prime" written on them.

:In [[robot mode]], the bottom of the truck becomes a windowed chest based upon the original Optimus Prime toy (and the original Ultra Magnus's cab). His main gimmick is light-up LED headlights and a [[Light-piping|lightpipe]] in the bottom of his right fist, illuminated by an LED in his right forearm, that illuminates his clear sword or his double-barreled rifle if they are placed in that hand. All three LEDs are activated simultaneously by pressing the sunroof-like depression on the roof of the truck.

:The trailer unfolds to form a battle station bristling with many firing weapons. Primarily, these are an air-powered missile launcher, a ripple rocket launcher with 5 missiles that can be launched individually (This turret can also be mounted in Laser Magnus's hand) and a "disc launcher" that fires several white plastic discs. This disc launcher is the only weapon that can be used in [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]].

:This release uses the toolings that were modified for the ''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2001 toyline)|Robots in Disguise]]'' [[Scourge (RID)#Robots in Disguise (2001)|Scourge]] toy, and thus has smooth discs and a less pointy sword. This mold was also planned to be used for the canceled ''[[Transformers: Universe (2003 toyline)|Universe]]'' [[Toxitron (Universe)#Universe (2003)|Toxitron]] toy.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2006/Cybertron/UltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Laser Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{G2LaserOptimusPrimeMold}}
{{--}}

===''Classics''===
[[File:Transformers-classics-BfAC-Ultra-Magnus.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|Arctic Camo Prime!]]
*'''Ultra Magnus vs Skywarp: Battle For Autobot City''' (Multi-pack, 2007)
**''Accessories:'' Smokestack/laser cannons, Wind vane/blaster

: A [[Target]]-[[exclusive]] [[redeco]] of ''[[Transformers: Classics|Classics]]'' Voyager Class [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Classics (2006)|Optimus Prime]], Ultra Magnus transforms into a modern cab-over style truck of made up model, dominated by a large wind vane on his roof. In robot mode, his wind vane transforms into a large ion blaster, and his smokestacks transform into a smaller laser cannon. Additionally, both weapons can combine together to form a double-barreled over-shoulder weapon. As with most ''Classics'' toys, he features a heat-sensitive [[rubsign]].

: He was released with [[Skywarp (G1)/toys#Classics (2006)|Skywarp]] as part of the "Battle for Autobot City" set. He was also available in Woolworth stores throughout the United Kingdom.

: The final production toy has several major paint application differences compared to [[:File:ClassicsUltraMagnus toy.jpg|the toy depicted on the packaging]], including the loss of all light blue paint (including his faceplate and crest, both replaced with silver) and darker blue on his thighs. Also, his red eyes are replaced with blue light-piped eyes, and it seems the smokestacks/double-barreled gun were originally going to be cast or painted white instead of the final version's unpainted black.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2006/Autobot/ClassicsUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Classics Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{ClassicsOptimusPrimeMold}}

{{-}}{{anchor|PrimeMagnus2Pack}}
*'''Optimus Prime and Ultra Magnus''' (Multi-pack, 2007)
**''Accessories:'' Smokestack/laser cannons, Wind vane/blaster

:In Asian markets, such as Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia, and the Philippines, Ultra Magnus was also made available as part of a special two-pack with Voyager Class Optimus Prime in late 2007. Aside from the unique packaging, the toys are identical to their single releases.
{{--}}

===''Titanium Series''===
[[File:TitaniumHero UltraMagnus.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.66|Oh, that's right, this Ultra Magnus guy had a trailer or something, didn't he?]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (6-inch Cybertron Heroes, 2007)
**''Accessories:'' Laser rifle, display stand, 2 rocket launchers

: ''Titanium Cybertron Heroes'' Ultra Magnus is an all-new sculpt constructed mostly of die-cast metal. For the first time, Ultra Magnus's cab and trailer are one piece, rather than a [[partformer]] like the Generation 1 toy version, although the cab is only held on by a peg and can be detached, resulting in a small, super-deformed cab. The toy's wheels can all spin. He transforms very similarly to the original toy, but the aforementioned truck cab now folds down into his back rather than detaching and reconnecting, with his head flipping out of the back of the cab.

: Ultra Magnus is armed with a gray laser rifle and two shoulder-mounted, non-firing rocket launchers which, due to some mistake, face top-down when attached in [[robot mode]]. It is unknown whether the launchers were somehow mirror-flipped in manufacture or if his shoulder assemblies [[Misassembly|were switched]]. The latter is perhaps supported by the orientation of molding detail shown in the [[instructions]] and on the Generation 1 toy, although the [[tampograph]]s could argue against this. One can easily "correct" this by unscrewing his blue forearms and swapping out the shoulders, allowing the launchers to face top-up.

: Unfortunately, due to the robot mode-oriented design of this figure, as well as size limitations, the rear ramp is now solely part of his legs as detail and cannot fold down, nor is there clearance space for any other vehicles to be transported. For some reason, on the side of each of Magnus's legs/ the back of his [[alternate mode|vehicle mode]] trailer there are white flip-out wing shaped panels. The paint on these panels flakes off easily, so it's best never to touch them. Like most, if not all, 6-inch Titaniums, his joints are very floppy. His left shoulder on some copies is one of the loosest (if not ''the loosest'') ball joints on a Transformers figure ever. In another possible mis-assembly issue, the figure's knees bend far more ''forwards'' than backwards. Strangely, the molded detail on the tops of the thighs contradicts this being a mis-assembly. The vehicle mode also has a hard time staying as it should as very few pieces actually tab together.

:His chest panel can flip up to reveal a shallow recess for the Autobot Matrix of Leadership, though no Matrix accessory to date is actually flat enough to fit inside.

:He comes with the generic display stand shared by all of the 6" "Cybertron Heroes", with a unique, removable nameplate.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2007/Autobot/TitUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Titanium Series Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''

{{-}}{{anchor|TiWarWithin}}
[[File:Titanium WarWithin ultramagnus.JPG|right|upright=1.67|thumb|A toy to remember that time Ultra Magnus never looked like this in ''The War Within''.]]
*'''(War Within) Ultra Magnus''' (6-inch Cybertron Heroes, 2007)
**''Accessories:'' Laser rifle, display stand

: A [[redeco]] of the 6-inch War Within Optimus Prime, transforming into a Cybertronian truck mode used by Prime (but not Magnus) in "[[Transformers: The War Within|The War Within]]" comics. The original Prime figure was personally designed by comic artist [[Don Figueroa]], who created the original comic design in the first place, and his signature is left on the figure in the most literal way: The word "DON" can be seen sculpted into the barrel of his gun.

: As a ''[[Titanium Series]]'' figure, Magnus is made in large part from [[die-cast]] metal, but like so many of the other toys in the ''Titanium'' line, his plastic joints have trouble supporting his heavy metal weight. He again comes with the generic display stand and nameplate.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2007/Autobot/TitTWWUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on War Within Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{--}}

===''Alternity''===
[[File:Alternity Ultra Magnus.jpg|right|upright=1.67|thumb|Because a car carrier isn't a car.]]
*'''Ultla Magnus {{sic}} [Brilliant White Pearl]''' (2010)
**''ID number:'' '''A-01U'''

:An [[e-HOBBY]]-exclusive redeco of ''[[Transformers: Alternity|Alternity]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Alternity|Convoy]], Ultra Magnus transforms into a white 1:32 scale Nissan GT-R, featuring die-cast metal parts, an opening hood, trunk and doors, as well as an interior, complete with his feet and thighs being sculpted to form the back seats. This complex figure stands at 6.5" tall and is armed with a pair of blasters on each arm.

:The e-HOBBY version came packed with an [[Nissan GT-R / Ultra Magnus (Brilliant Pearl White)|exclusive comic book]]. A version available via Hasbro Asia is identical to the e-HOBBY version except it does not include the pack-in comic (like most e-HOBBY exclusives released outside of Japan).

:The mold suffers from a [[Design flaw|minor design oversight]], wherein the rear Nissan badge collides with his left leg strut when the left foot is hinged over and pegged into a clear plastic socket during transformation, with the results being that the connection is slightly crooked, isn't very secure, and sometimes pops off, and that the crooked pegging often causes the socket to crack.

:This mold was also used to make [[Nemesis Prime (Universe)#Alternity 2|Convoy Super Black]] and ''Alternity'' [[Dai Atlas (G1)#Alternity|Dai Atlas]], and retooled to make [[Star Saber (G1)/toys#GT|GT-R Saber]], [[Megatron (G1)/toys#GT|GT-R Megatron]], and [[Fortress Maximus (G1)/toys#GT|GT-R Maximus]].
{{--}}

===''United''===
[[File:Unitedtoy-UltraMagnus.jpg|right|upright=1.67|thumb|If you can't afford the [[#Masterpiece|''Masterpiece'' Ultra Magnus]], you can still get yourself a<s>n Albino Optimus Prime</s> Cabnus.]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' ([[September 29]], 2012)
**''Accessories:'' Smokestack/laser cannons, Wind vane/blaster

: ''[[Transformers United|United]]'' Ultra Magnus is a redeco of [[#Classics|his ''Classics'' toy]], replacing his opaque blue plastic with white, omitting his blue and black [[paint operation]]s, painting his hands and shin-vents white, adding silver paint to his kneepads, thighs, pelvis, and smokestack cannons, painting his [[mouthplate]] and crest blue, replacing his bronze-painted wheel rims with silver, and [[vacuum metallizing]] his vehicle grill and fenders. He was exclusively released in Hasbro Asia's markets.

:While unconfirmed, it seems likely that this release was conceived to satisfy then-high collector demand for the original ''Classics'' Ultra Magnus, a result of the unofficial City Commander upgrade kit released for the figure by "[[IP theft|third party]]" company FansProject. Of course, as an unlicensed product, the kit was not acknowledged in any official marketing material for the re-released toy.
{{ClassicsOptimusPrimeMold}}
{{--}}

===''Timelines''===
[[File:TCCSS1-UltraMammoth.jpg|right|thumb|upright=1.67|If I'm a mammoth I'm a very manly mammoth.]]
*'''Ultra Mammoth''' (Ultra Class, 2012)
**''TFSS1 number'': '''6'''
**''Accessories:'' [[Blue Bolts]] cannon, two Energy Bolts, two Thunderstrike missiles, [[Reconfiguration Matrix]]

: Representing the new body [[Ultra Magnus (G1)#Classics|Ultra Magnus]] used in ''[[Beast Wars Shattered Glass]]'', the Ultra Mammoth toy is a light blue and white redeco of ''[[Transformers: Beast Wars (Japanese toyline)#1999 (Beast Wars Neo)|Beast Wars Neo]]'' [[Big Convoy]]. Like Big Convoy, Ultra Mammoth is a [[shellformer]], as practically all of his [[beast mode]] components are shells that fit around the compressed robot to form this mode. He technically has a beast "[[attack mode]]", in which his large cannon is folded out. His main body has a similar color scheme to Ultra Magnus's "Super Mode" (though with more white), and his head has the color scheme of regular Magnus.

: In [[robot mode]], Ultra Mammoth is absolutely chock-full of weapons and gimmicks. First and foremost, the spring-loaded Blue Bolts cannon, formed out of the beast's head, back, and tail, can fire two missiles from two barrels in succession with a rotating dial. It is held in his hands via [[5 mm post]] and can be stored on his back, though doing so may cause some stability problems owing to its weight. Second, his shoulders can be swung up to reveal sculpted, non-firing missile pods. Third, he has flip-out {{w|tonfa}} melee weapons in his forearms. Fourth, the two beast panels on the sides of his legs feature two spring-loaded missile launchers that fire his anchor-shaped projectiles, which can be loosely held in his hands. Last, but certainly not least, his chest panel flips down, revealing a removable Matrix toy accessory in vacuum-metalized sliver with a transparent blue center. This accessory can be held by any figure with standard 5mm fist holes.

: The anchor-shaped Thunderstrike missiles have been retooled since the previous two uses of this mold, presumably for safety reasons, and as a result can no longer be kept loaded in beast mode. The instructions refer to the space in his chest as a "[[Dead Matrix]] annex", but the Matrix within is referred to as the [[Reconfiguration Matrix]] in packaging and was ultimately depicted by [[Beast Wars Shattered Glass|tie-in fiction]] as the [[Origin Matrix]].

: Ultra Mammoth is one of the first six [[Transformers Collectors' Club]] [[exclusive]] figures to be offered via the [[Transformers Figure Subscription Service|Figure Subscription Service]] in 2013.

:The Ultra Mammoth figure was also repurposed as a different guy also called [[Ultra Mammoth]].

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2013/Maximal/TFCCUltraMammoth/ultramammoth.htm More information on Ultra Mammoth at TFU.info]''
{{BWBigConvoyMold}}
{{--}}

===''Bot Shots''===
[[File:BStoy-3packUltraMagnus.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|[[Hasbro|They]] didn't even bother painting me white this time.]]
*'''Red Alert / Ultra Magnus / Mirage''' (Multi-pack, 2013)
**''Series'': '''2'''
**''Number'': '''BP010'''
***''Fist strength'': '''840'''
***''Blaster strength'': '''248'''
***''Sword strength'': '''532'''

:Part of the third wave of ''[[Bot Shots (toyline)|Bot Shots]]'' Series 2 three-packs, Ultra Magnus is a [[redeco]] of [[Optimus Prime (Armada)/toys#BotShotJumpShot|Jump Shot Optimus Prime]], and turns into a heavily-armed futuristic firetruck heavily based on ''[[Transformers: Cybertron (franchise)|Cybertron]]'' [[Optimus Prime (Armada)|Optimus Prime]]. As a Jump Shot toy, an impact to his front bumper will cause him to spring up and [[Autotransformation|autotransform]] into robot mode. He also has an "spinner" in his chest that shows his three attack types and power levels. He comes in a three-pack with [[Red Alert (G1)/toys|Jump Shot Red Alert]] and [[Mirage (G1)#3pack|Super Bot Mirage]].
{{--}}

===Ultra Magnus Pen===
[[File:UltraMagnusPen.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66]]
*'''Transformers Ultra Magnus Pen''' (2014)
**''Accessories:'' Blaster

: A white redeco of [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Optimus Prime Pen|Optimus Prime Pen]] produced by [[Sentinel (company)|Sentinel]] as part of the 30th anniversary of ''Transformers'', Ultra Magnus Pen is a well-articulated robot that folds into the shape of a rather chunky, but functional ballpoint pen. The tip of the pen is formed from his blaster, with the barrel acting as a cap. Ultra Magnus Pen was sold exclusively through [http://www.hlj.com/ HobbyLink Japan].

: This mold was also used to make [[Nemesis Prime (G1)#Black Convoy Pen|Black Convoy Pen]].
{{--}}

===''Hero Mashers''===
[[File:HM-toy Optimus.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|Magnus: The Hand of Fate.]]
*'''Optimus Prime''' (Battle Upgrade, 2014)
**''Pieces'': '''18'''
**''Accessories'': Missile-launching rifle, missile, energy axe, cannon, left & right rocket pods, "Ultra Magnus" right forearm & fist

: Part of the first wave of "Battle Upgrade" ''[[Hero Mashers]]'' toys, Ultra Magnus is represented as a spare forearm that is included with Optimus Prime, but does not appear in the line as a complete figure. The arm is a retooling of [[Bulkhead (Prime)#Hero Mashers|Bulkhead]]'s, removing the spring-loaded missile-launcher gimmick.
{{--}}

===''Kre-O''===
{{anchor|SDCC2014}}
[[File:KreO-Toy UltraMagnusC84.jpg|thumb|upright=1.66|right]]
*'''Kreon Class of 1984''' (Kreon figure set, [[2014]])
**''Set number'': '''B0090'''
**''Voted'': Teacher's Pet
**''Accessories'': Optimus rifle

:[[Kreon]] Ultra Magnus is based on the inner "white Optimus" robot of the original toy, with extensive toy-based details, including red eyes.

:He was only available in a [[San Diego Comic-Con]] 2014 [[exclusive]] pack of 30 Kreons dubbed the "[[Kreon Class of 1984]]". Remaining stock was to be sold at [[Hasbro Toy Shop]] online, only there ''was'' no remaining stock after the show.

:And yes, his inclusion in this 1984-themed set is confusing, as Magnus did not appear in ''Transformers'' in any capacity until 1986.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2014/Autobot/SDCCKre-OUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]''
{{--}}

===''Transformers'' (2014)===
{{anchor|2014legion}}
[[File:Transformers-2014-legion-ultra-magnus-toy.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb|My other pants are in the cleaners.]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Legion Class, 2015)

:Legion Class Ultra Magnus is a redeco of [[Transformers (2010 toyline)|''Transformers'' (2010)]] ''[[Reveal the Shield]]'' [[Legends Class (2005)|Legends Class]] [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#2010Legend|Optimus Prime]], with the retooled hands and head/vehicle mode roof originally created for [[Transformers: Generations#Asian market exclusives ("GDO")|''Generations'' GDO]] Legends Class [[Motormaster (G1)#Generations|Motorbreath]]. While the deco partially follows previous redecos of Optimus Prime figures as Ultra Magnus's "inner robot", with a teal/blue [[mouthplate]], a teal/blue forehead crest [[paint operation]], red eyes and blue/teal windows, it also features several rather ''odd'' deco choices, namely extremely dark charcoal gray legs (to the point of nearly looking ''black'') and ''white'' wheels (though coincidentally resembles his Transform Jr. toy).

:Ultra Magnus comes in packaging that is based on the packaging design for the concurrently released ''Combiner Wars''-era ''Generations'' figures, but replaces the name ''Generations'' with "Authentic Transformers". Since Ultra Magnus and his [[wave]]-mates ship with three figures previously released under what we consider a generic [[Transformers (2014 toyline)|''Transformers'' (2014) toy line]], all of them now in the new packaging style, we consider Ultra Magnus to be part of that line as well. The [[package art]] used for Ultra Magnus is hilariously inaccurate, as it is recolored from artwork originally created for the [[Transformers Legends (mobile game)|''Legends'' mobile game]], depicting Ultra Magnus's armored form ''colored as his inner robot''.

:The wave that contains Ultra Magnus has thus far been found at Fred's, Gordmans, Dollar General, and Family Dollar stores in the United States, but was available at general retail in Hong Kong and from Australian Target stores.

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2015/Autobot/FDUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]
{{2010LegendsOptimusPrimeMold}}
{{--}}

===''Combiner Wars''===
{{anchor|Leader}}
[[File:CombinerWarsUltraMagnus.jpg|upright=2|thumb|"You may take Albino Prime from me, but you can never leave my chest empty!"]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Leader Class, 2015)
**''Accessories:'' Two guns, [[Minimus Ambus]] figure

:''[[Combiner Wars (toyline)|Combiner Wars]]'' Ultra Magnus is an all-new Leader Class mold, with a [[robot mode]] based on [[Nick Roche]]'s design for the character in [[IDW Publishing]]'s ''[[The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye|More than Meets the Eye]]'' and transforming into a truck and trailer. Although the truck and trailer cannot be separated, they are connected by a pivot joint that still allows one to move independent of the other. He includes a small [[Minimus Ambus]], based on [[Alex Milne]]'s design for the character, that can be stored inside his chest in robot mode. In vehicle mode, the trailer-bed has a set of 3 notches that seemingly correspond with tabs on Minimus, however, it is a loose fit, and Minimus will detach with a little shaking. Artist [[Andrew Griffith]] also worked with Hasbro on Minimus's toy design and "cockpit" within Magnus.<ref>[https://twitter.com/glovestudios/status/566697537730408449 Andrew Griffith on Twitter, 14 February 2015] Awesome that they finally showed the Leader Ultra Magnus. Have they shown Ambus' cockpit yet? That's the part I got to work on. Oh yeah I forgot I worked on the design of Minimus too lol. (In plastic form.)</ref> Minimus is not necessary for transformation and Ultra Magnus can be completed without seating him in the cockpit.

:Ultra Magnus includes two [[5 mm post|5 mm]] guns, which can be combined with his shoulder-mounted missile launchers to form a large hammer weapon, in homage to the character's [[Ultra Magnus (Animated)|''Animated'']] and [[Ultra Magnus (WFC)|''Prime'' incarnations]]. Note that in robot form, Ultra Magnus lacks 5mm holes in his hands for his guns; instead, his fingers open and close like the hands of Combiner class Combiner War toys. This means that he isn't able to strongly hold his guns, making them prone to falling out. The door sculpted into Ultra Magnus's cab suggests that it is intended to represent a positively ''gargantuan'' vehicle, with the trailer being perhaps seven stories tall if [[scale]]d to a human. Hasbro representatives at [[Toy Fair 2015]] said that his ladder sculpts were intended to match in scale similar ladder sculpts on ''Combiner Wars'' [[Devastator (G1)#Generations|Devastator]].

:Ultra Magnus comes with a character card based on his packaging art, which was drawn by [[Marcelo Matere]].

:The mold was also heavily retooled into ''[[Titans Return (toyline)|Titans Return]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#Titans Return|Powermaster Optimus Prime]].
::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2015/Autobot/CWUltraMagnus/ultramagnus.htm More information on Ultra Magnus at TFU.info]
{{CWUltraMagnusMold}}
{{--}}

===''Legends''===
{{anchor|TransformersLegends}}
[[File:Takaratomy-lg-14-ultra-magnus-and-alpha-trion.jpg|upright=2|thumb|Of course he comes with Alpha Trion! Why wouldn't he? Those two hang out all the time!]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' ([[September 19]], [[2015]])
**''ID number:'' '''LG-14'''
**''Accessories:'' two guns, Alpha Trion figure

:''[[Transformers Legends (franchise)|Legends]]'' Ultra Magnus is a redeco of the [[#Combiner Wars|''Combiner Wars'' Leader Class Ultra Magnus]] toy. Compared to the Hasbro release, ''Legends'' Ultra Magnus features whiter plastic, and a deco closer to his original toy (including his rifles) and his appearances in [[The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye|IDW's ''More Than Meets The Eye'']] comics (down to the red thighs and unpainted eyes). The figure includes a small [[Alpha Trion (G1)#Legends|Alpha Trion]] figure, which is redecoed from Minimus Ambus. His profile names his buildable hammer the [[Magnus Hammer]].

:Unlike most ''Legends'' releases which feature Takara-original art, Ultra Magnus features the ''Combiner Wars'' toy's [[Marcelo Matere]]-drawn packaging art on his box, only recolored to match the toy's new paint job (and slightly modified to accommodate Trion's longer beard).

:Ultra Magnus also comes with [[Legends Comic: Bonus Edition Vol. 14|Bonus Edition Vol. 14]] of the [[Transformers Legends (comic)|''Legends'' manga]].
{{CWUltraMagnusMold}}
{{--}}

===''Q-Transformers''===
[[File:QTransformers UltraMagnus.jpg|thumb|right|upright=1.66|A totally realism-minded superdeformed Ultra-Munchkin vehicle, just like all the others!]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' ([[January 30]], [[2016]])
**''ID number:'' '''QTF-05'''

:''[[Q-Transformers]]'' Ultra Magnus is a retool of [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Q-Transformers|QT-19 Convoy]] with a new head and arms/trailer, transforming from a [[super deformed]] car carrier with integrated trailer to a cute little robot. This toy was first available for sale at a special ''Q-Transformers'' event on [[January 16]]th, two weeks before it was released in stores.

:The original version of this mold was also used to make [[Nemesis Prime (G1)#Q-Transformers|Black Convoy]].
{{--}}

===''Platinum Edition''===
{{anchor|AutobotHeroes}}
[[File:TF-Platinum-Edition-Autobot-Heroes-Ultra-Magnus.jpg|upright=2|thumb|"Beware, my retool is nearby.."]]
*'''Autobot Heroes''' (5-pack, 2016)
**''Accessories'': Springer's weapons (dual missile launcher, two missiles, rotor blades/sword), Arcee's weapons (2 swords), Kup's "laser musket" rifle/exhaust pipe, Ultra Magnus' 2 guns, Blurr's weapons (Sniper rifle, left & right pistols), Minimus Ambus figure

:Part of Hasbro's ''[[Transformers: Platinum Edition|Platinum Edition]]'' offerings for 2016 intended to commemorate the 30th anniversary of ''[[The Transformers: The Movie]]'', Ultra Magnus is a redeco of his ''Combiner Wars'' Leader Class toy, featuring some plastic color changes: The white plastic parts are now truly ''white'', compared to the more creamy color of the original version; also, several parts previously cast in blue plastic have been changed to white and vice versa, with some of them being (at least partially) painted over to restore the original color. The metallic blue color for the chest section and the forearm panels is not only visibly rather conspicuous compared to his unpainted blue parts, but also makes tabbing his arms together in truck mode considerably more difficult, due to the paintjob resulting in a thicker tab and smaller slot. Additional painted details include painted rims and a blue striping on his cab. He also retains his [[Minimus Ambus#Platinum Edition|Minimus Ambus]] figure, who is cast in the same white plastic as Ultra Magnus's white parts and features more light and dark green paint operations on his torso than the original release, both of which are considerably darker and more saturated than the original's lighter, "pearly" green paint operations.

:Ultra Magnus was released as part of 5-pack with [[Arcee (G1)/toys#AutobotHeroes|Arcee]], [[Springer (G1)/toys#Platinum Edition|Autobot Springer]], [[Kup (G1)/toys#AutobotHeroes|Sergeant Kup]], and [[Blurr (G1)/toys#AutobotHeroes|Blurr]]. The set also included a recreation of the theatrical poster for the 1986 movie. In the United States, this set was officially a [[Target]] exclusive, but was only available via the company's website, never sold in stores. It was also released in Singapore, although it's currently unknown whether it was exclusive to any particular stores there or not. In Canada, it was available via the Canadian [[Walmart]] website but never found in stores, whereas in the United Kingdom, it was available via [[Toys"R"Us]] stores and the website. In Spain, it was available via the Spanish subsidiaries of both [[Amazon (website)|Amazon]] and Carrefour, as well as the department store chain El Corte Inglés, supposedly also only available online. In Germany, it was available via retailer Real and specialty store Rappelkiste Ahlen, also only available online.
{{CWUltraMagnusMold}}
{{--}}

===''Alt-Modes''===
[[File:Alt-Modes UltraMagnus.jpg|upright=1.66|thumb]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Alt-Modes, 2016)
**''Series'': '''1'''
**''Collection'': '''1'''

:A retool of ''[[Alt-Modes]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#Alt-Modes|Optimus Prime]] with a new head and chest, Ultra Magnus is a super deformed toy whose body transforms into a truck when the Autobot faction symbol on his head is flipped. He was [[Blindpacking|blind-boxed]] and available in the first collection of the toyline.

:The original version of the mold was also used to make [[Nemesis Prime (G1)#Alt-Modes|Nemesis Prime]].
{{--}}

===''Titans Return''===
{{anchor|HasCon}}
[[File:TitansReturntoy-UltraMagnus.jpg|thumb|The smallest Soldier who ever lived!]]
*'''Leinad & Arcee''' / '''Ultra Magnus''' (Special Edition, 2017)
**''Accessories:'' [[Daniel Witwicky (G1)#Generations|Leinad]] Titan Master, Ultra Magnus Titan Master, guns

:''[[Titans Return (toyline)|Titans Return]]'' Ultra Magnus is a redeco/retool of ''Titans Return'' Titan Master [[Fangry (G1)#Generations|Fangry]] with a new Titan Master head, and he is a solo [[Titan Master]] included with [[Arcee (G1)/toys#Titans Return|Arcee]], a redeco/retool of [[Blurr (G1)/toys#Titans Return|Blurr]]. The Titan Master in robot mode is themed after the original toy's inner robot figure, while his head mode face is based on the armored Magnus head. The set debuted at [[HasCon 2017]] before a later release at [[New York Comic Con]] 2017 and a standard release<ref>[http://io9.gizmodo.com/hasbros-own-convention-will-sell-you-a-giant-transforme-1797331311 Hasbro's Own Convention Will Sell You a Giant Transformer That Actually Charges Your Phone]</ref> at [[Toys"R"Us]]. Like [[Hot Rod (G1)/toys#TRCOV|Rodimus Prime]], [[Thunderwing (G1)#Titans Return|Thunderwing]], and [[Scorponok (G1)/toys#Generations|Scorponok]], Ultra Magnus also features a die-cast Titan Master torso and head mode face.
{{TRFangryMold}}
{{--}}

===''War for Cybertron: Siege''===
[[File:War-for-Cybertron-Siege-Leader-Ultra-Magnus.jpg|thumb|upright=2.2|It comes with a white Magnus cab that ''isn't an Optimus redeco?'' Time to channel ''Unsolved Mysteries'', with [[Robert Stack]]!]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Leader Class, [[2019]])
**''Hasbro ID number'': '''WFC-S13'''
**''TakaraTomy ID number'': '''SG-07'''
**''TakaraTomy release date'': '''[[February 23]], 2019'''
**''Hidden message code'': '''FORGEOFSOLUS'''
**''Accessories'': "RT-15 Stethoscopic Detector", 2 "C-30 Magnetic Inducer Launchers", 2 "W-HV-1000 Simulacrum Blasters", 7 [[Magnus Armor]] pieces

:Part of the first wave of ''[[War for Cybertron: Siege|Siege]]'' Leader Class figures, Ultra Magnus transforms from robot to a car carrier truck inspired by his ''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2001 franchise)|Robots in Disguise]]'' [[Ultra Magnus (RID)|incarnation]] and back! The most notable feature of this toy is that the trailer transforms into the Magnus Armor and combines with the Voyager-sized inner robot to form the super robot mode, making this the first official mainline representation of the armor since Magnus's original toy back in 1986. Ultra Magnus also features "battle damage" paint applications on several parts of his body, as well as multiple hardpoints all over himself and his weapons to accommodate "Fire Blasts" from the [[Battle Master]]s assortment, which can be used to simulate blaster fire or explosions. He includes five weapons compatible with the [[C.O.M.B.A.T. System]]. His "RT-15 Stethoscopic Detector" is silver in painted samples at [[San Diego Comic-Con#2018|SDCC 2018]], Hasbro's stock renders, and [[stock photography]], while [[TakaraTomy]] stock photography (to the right) shows it in red with silver highlights. The final blaster is molded in red and painted silver, except for the grip which is left as bare red plastic. Though his two black blasters continue the ''Robots in Disguise'' Ultra Magnus homage, mirroring the detailing placed just behind that Magnus's cab, their hexagonal tips resemble that of ''[[Transformers: Cybertron (toyline)|Cybertron]]'' [[Optimus Prime (Armada)/toys#Cybertron|Optimus Prime]]'s Super Mode leg cannons, a comparison strengthened by the stock photos using the black blasters as leg mounted cannons.

:Although both the inner robot and Magnus armor have sideways ankle joints, the feet of the Magnus armor are molded to set the feet permanently at an angle, forcing Ultra Magnus' legs into an A-stance. While this doesn't hinder the robot mode to any great degree, it creates visibly slanted protrusions while in truck mode. Additionally, be sure the truck cab's upper half is moved as far forward as possible when transforming to truck mode, otherwise the connection between the truck cab and trailer will be placed under a great deal of strain once connected.

:The inner robot, while still resembling Optimus Prime in general appearance, is actually a different mold from ''Siege'' Voyager Class [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#War for Cybertron: Siege|Optimus Prime]].

:Though designated for release in the first quarter of 2019, Magnus's wave reached U.S. store shelves in late 2018.

{{WFCSiegeUltraMagnusMold}}
{{--}}

===''War for Cybertron Trilogy''===
[[File:Netflix-WFC-Ultra-Magnus-Rung-Spoiler-Pack.jpg|thumb|upright=2.2|[[Play-Doh|Fun to play with, not to eat.]]]]
*'''Spoiler Pack''' (Leader Unboxing, [[2020]])
**''TakaraTomy ID number:'' '''WFC-08'''
**''TakaraTomy release date:'' [[December 19]], 2020
**''Accessories:'' "RT-15 Stethoscopic Detector", 2 "C-30 Magnetic Inducer Launchers", 2 "W-HV-1000 Simulacrum Blasters", 7 [[Magnus Armor]] pieces, [[Rung (G1)#War for Cybertron Trilogy|Battlefield Rung]] [[Battle Master]], 2 "Fire Blasts", 3 [[energon cube]]s, [[Play-Doh|compound]]

:Promoting the ''Siege'' season of the [[Netflix]] [[Transformers: War for Cybertron Trilogy (cartoon)|''War for Cybertron Trilogy'' cartoon]], this ''[[War for Cybertron Trilogy (toyline)|War for Cybertron Trilogy]]'' Leader Unboxing set contains a slathered redeco of ''Siege'' Leader Ultra Magnus, plus some extras that beef up the price (including the translucent pink "[[Rung (G1)#War for Cybertron Trilogy|Battlefield Rung]]" and a compound in which a buyer can dig to reveal energon cubes).

:The Cybertronian text on the package reads "BATTLEFIELD RUNG", while the 'spoiler' text inside features a Decepticon-themed quote: "I ULTRA MAGNUS / IN GOOD FAITH / HEREBY SURRENDER / TO YOU" and an Autobot-themed one: "THIS CAN ONLY / MEAN ONE THING / [[Ultra Magnus Dies!!|ULTRA MAGNUS IS DEAD]]". These are direct quotes that refer to Ultra Magnus's decision and its consequences in the [[Siege episode 2|second]] and [[Siege episode 4|fourth]] episode of the ''Siege'' chapter, respectively. It is noteworthy that the black gradients are meant to represent his final moments in the ''Siege'' cartoon. The included Rung also has a striking resemblance to the [[Alpha Trion Protocols]]. While the set does not include the cloak Magnus sported in the second episode, the cloak from ''[[Studio Series]]'' ''Dark of the Moon'' [[Megatron (Movie)/toys#SS34|Megatron]] can be used as a decently accurate stand-in if one wishes.

:This set is a shared exclusive between online retailers and [[Walmart]] in Canada and the USA, and in Japan as a [[TakaraTomy]] Mall exclusive. The Japanese release is packaged in a standard windowed box. The set also found its way into numerous discount retailers, often at a steep deduction to its price tag.
{{WFCSiegeUltraMagnusMold}}
{{-}}

{{anchor|Behold}}
[[File:Behold Galvatron Ultra Magnus.JPG|thumb|200px]]
* '''Behold, Galvatron! Unicron Companion Pack''' (Leader Class, 2022)
:Ultra Magnus was also released as a non-transforming and immobile minifigure, barely 10mm tall, scaled to interact with the immense [[Unicron/toys#HasLab|HasLab Unicron]] figure and its clear display base. This was one of a set of 14 minifigures in the "Unicron Companion Pack" that was included with the [[Galvatron (G1)/toys#War for Cybertron Trilogy|"reformatting" version of Galvatron]]. The set was [[exclusive]] to [[Hasbro Pulse]].
{{--}}

===''War for Cybertron: Kingdom''===
[[File:WFC-Kingdom Leader Ultra Magnus.jpg|upright=2.2|thumb|ER Prime forgot to bleach his colors before the photoshoot, so they had to get a new guy for the pictures.]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Leader Class, February [[2021]])
**''Hasbro ID number'': '''WFC-K20'''
**''TakaraTomy ID number'': '''KD-11'''
**''TakaraTomy release date'': [[July 31]], 2021
**''Accessories'': "RT-15 Stethoscopic Detector", 2 missile launchers, 7 [[Magnus Armor]] pieces

:Part of the second wave of ''[[War for Cybertron: Kingdom|Kingdom]]'' Leader Class toys, Ultra Magnus is a retool of the above ''Siege'' toy, transforming from robot to car carrier truck. Like the ''Siege'' version, the figure is composed of the truck cab, which transforms into the inner robot, and the trailer, which transforms into the armor for the main robot. The wheels, Magnus Armor head, two chest pieces, shoulders, side car-carrier panels, and crotch, core-body chest, back, and rear-end have been changed to more closely resemble Ultra Magnus's original "Generation 1" cartoon appearance in both modes. As such, his cab and trailer are more separate, lengthening the truck mode, although the two halves cannot swivel independently from one another. Due to the retooling, the armor's shoulders no longer attach to the trailer itself in vehicle mode, and the robot mode hands of the truck cab are visible. The cab retooling also limits the backward hip movement in his core-body and the waist in his main body (though the latter can be worked around with the back's sliding rail). Additionally, exercise caution when using the forward hip movement, especially during transformation, as the upper edge of Ultra Magnus’ thighs can scrape off the white paint on the Magnus Armor side of his crotchplate.

:The front end of Ultra Magnus's trailer also features small molded details shaped like the Autobot [[insignia]] to be placed to better replicate his [[Sunbow Productions|Sunbow]] model and his [[#Generation 1|original toy]], although there is no Autobot symbol present. Ultra Magnus has a similarly blank spot on his right shoulder for an Autobot sigil, but no sigil exists.

:His "RT-15 Stethoscopic Detector" remains the same, though his missile launchers are differently molded, and he lacks the leg-mounted "C-30 Magnetic Inducer Launchers". While the armor parts are still compatible with the original ''Siege'' inner robot, the front torso armor cannot clip into place due to the distance of both the tabs and holes.

:Much like most of the toyline, Ultra Magnus comes with one of four possible holographic [[Golden Disk (Voyager)|Golden Disk]] cards for his wave, which reveals a [[Source:Golden Disk destinies|possible destiny]] of a key character.

:Hasbro stock photography (right) is mistransformed; the inner Magnus robot has the truck mode's front bumper left slid down and the torso slid forward, while the armored robot form has the waist plate left in the configuration used for his standard robot form. Both truck modes have the torso piece of the cab slid back instead of all the way forward. The CGI renders on the back of the box do not have these mistakes, though his armored robot chest is missing red.

{{WFCSiegeUltraMagnusMold}}
{{--}}

===''Premium Finish''===
[[File:Premium-finish-siege-Ultra-Magnus.jpg|thumb|350px|Dude, are you sure you are Ultra Magnus? You look more like a poorly tanned [[Nemesis Prime (G1)#War for Cybertron: Siege|Nemesis Prime]]...]]
*'''Ultra Magnus''' (Leader Class, [[December 29]], [[2021]])
**''TakaraTomy ID number'': '''PF WFC-03 / PFGR 03'''
**''Hasbro ID number'': '''GE-03'''
**''Accessories'':"RT-15 Stethoscopic Detector", 2 "C-30 Magnetic Inducer Launchers", 2 "W-HV-1000 Simulacrum Blasters", 7 [[Magnus Armor]] pieces

:As part of the third wave of TakaraTomy's ''[[Transformers Premium Finish|''Premium Finish'']]'' subline, Ultra Magnus is a detailed redeco of the [[#WFC-S13|Siege]] mold, featuring more paint applications that represent his appearance in [[War for Cybertron: Siege|''Transformers: War For Cybertron: Siege'']] and with the same weapons as the aforementioned mold. Alongside sporting a dark grey paint scheme instead of white (or white & grey), his Shoulder Pylons are now cracked. He may have stiff limbs, and his legs may not connect when transforming him into truck mode.
{{WFCSiegeUltraMagnusMold}}
{{--}}

==Notes==
[[File:TrasformerSuperBuggy.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|The child custody battle was a long and painful process.]]
*The ''[[Diaclone]]'' toy that would become Magnus—called "Powered Convoy"—came in a couple different varieties. Aside from the version that was eventually turned into "Movie Preview" Magnus, there was a "chrome" version that used a lighter gray outer plastic and chromed the central body/lower ramps of the trailer unit. This version was also available in a multi-pack with a red version of the toy which would become [[Mirage (G1)/toys#Toys|Mirage]], and the black version of the toy which would become [[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Toys|Sideswipe]]. (Decades later, the red and blue Magnus would inspire the character [[Delta Magnus]] while the black Sideswipe would be used as [[Deep Cover#Toys|Deep Cover]]).

*All versions of the ''Diaclone'' Powered Convoy toy came with a red "Powered Buggy" (パワードバギー) partner-robot that transformed from futuristic buggy (with a space for a Diaclone pilot) to robot and could also use the large rifle in either mode. Why this was excised from the ''Transformers'' incarnation is unknown. The Italian ''[[Trasformer]]'' line by [[GiG]], however, ''did'' release the vehicle as the "Super Buggy" on its own.

*White redecos of Optimus Prime toys that ''look'' like Ultra Magnus, but which surprisingly aren't, include ''[[Smallest Transforming Transformers]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#STTWhite|Convoy (White)]], ''[[Transformers Sports Label|Sport Label]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#marine|Convoy featuring Nike Free 7.0 Marine Version]], and ''[[Transformers Music Label|Music Label]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Music Label|Convoy —playing iPod speaker—]] (though it was actually made from the Ultra Magnus version of the mold), ''[[Bot Shots (toyline)|Bot Shots]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#BotShotPolarAssaultTeam|Polar Assault Team Optimus Prime]], ''[[Bot Shots (toyline)#TakaraTomy BeCool line|BeCool]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#GarbageTruck|Garbage Truck (Clean Optimus)]], ''[[The Transformers: Masterpiece|Masterpiece]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#MP711|Convoy (7-Eleven ver.)]], and ''au x Transformers'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#InfobarANNIN|INFOBAR Optimus Prime (ANNIN)]] .
{{--}}

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
*[http://www.diaclone.net/orid/dia057/index.html Diaclone Powered Convoy at Diaclone.net (Japanese-language site)]

[[Category:Alternity Autobots]]
[[Category:Beast Wars Maximals]]
[[Category:Bot Shots Autobots]]
[[Category:Classics Autobots]]
[[Category:Combiner Wars Autobots]]
[[Category:E-Hobby]]
[[Category:Generation 1 toy Autobots]]
[[Category:Generation 2 Autobots]]
[[Category:Kre-O Autobots]]
[[Category:Kreons]]
[[Category:Legends Autobots]]
[[Category:Masterpiece]]
[[Category:Q-Transformers characters]]
[[Category:Platinum Edition]]
[[Category:Repurposed toys]]
[[Category:Target exclusives]]
[[Category:Timelines characters]]
[[Category:Titanium Series]]
[[Category:Titan Masters]]
[[Category:Titans Return Autobots]]
[[Category:Transformers with three modes]]
[[Category:United Autobots]]
[[Category:Universe Autobots]]
[[Category:War for Cybertron: Kingdom Autobots]]
[[Category:War for Cybertron: Siege Autobots]]

Action Man (comic)

2022-08-10T02:56:25Z

Bumblebee2000: fixed Revolutionaries link, changed Brogan, Noble and Action Man toyline pages as the only page actually on the wiki is Action Man the title, covering both Brogan and Noble. Added Hasbroverse wiki link to Brogan

[[Image:ActionMan TPB.jpg|thumb|right|250px|''I never done good things (I never done good things)'' ''I never done bad things (I never done bad things)'']]

'''''Action Man''''' was a [[2016]] comic miniseries published by [[IDW Publishing]], based on the Action Man toy, the [[United Kingdom]]'s equivalent of the original [[G.I. Joe (franchise)|G.I. Joe]] action figure. Written by [[John Barber]] and drawn by [[Paolo Villanelli]], it centers on the eponymous [[Action Man]], a young man named Ian Noble who's been thrust into the role of Britain's top secret agent after the death of {{i|Mike Brogan|his predecessor}}.

The series takes place immediately before the ''[[Revolution]]'' event in which it takes part. The series was planned as a four-issue miniseries, along with a [[The Modern World|''Revolution'']] tie-in. But fret not! Action Man's adventures continue, along with several ''Transformers'' characters, in ''[[Revolutionaries]]''.

{{chapters|title=''Action Man'' issues:|style=3|content=
*[[To the Victors the Spoils|Prologue]]
*[[Absolute Beginners|#1]]
*[[England, Half English|#2]]
*[[Out of the Way|#3]]
*[[Mr Love and Justice|#4]]
*[[The Modern World|Revolution]]
}}

==Overview==
{{issuestub}}
{{storylink|To the Victors the Spoils}} {{storylink|Absolute Beginners}} {{storylink|England, Half English}} {{storylink|Out of the Way}} {{storylink|Mr Love and Justice}}

==Collections==
*'''''Action Man Volume 1''''' ([[January 18]], [[2017]]) ISBN 1631408097 / ISBN 978-1631408090 
:*Contains issues #1-4 and the ''Revolution'' one-shot.

[[Category:IDW (2005) comic series]]
[[Category:Action Man issues| ]]

Transformers: Generation 2 (toyline)

2022-08-07T07:11:07Z

Bumblebee2000: added Legacy Leadfoot

{{nav-G2}}
Two years after the [[The Transformers (toyline)|original ''Transformers'' toy line]] petered out in the US, [[Hasbro]] revamped the series with late-1992's '''''Transformers: Generation 2''''', the first "reboot" of the franchise. With a mix of classic popular characters, vintage toys, all-new [[gimmick]]-laden molds, and bodacious 90s color schemes, Hasbro hoped to recapture some of the financial success that had been lost with age and competition.

''Generation 2'' saw more-or-less simultaneous release in the US and European markets, but Japan would not start the line (or even have any ''Transformers'' product at all on shelves, for that matter) until 1995.

Unfortunately, the revamping failed to give the franchise the jumpstart it needed, despite having created several benchmarks that ''Transformers'' lines still follow to this day. In a desperate bid to save ''Transformers'' from ending for good, Hasbro chose to end the line in its third year, and [[Beast Wars: Transformers (franchise)|go in a completely new direction]]...

{{TOCclear}}

==Overview==
[[File:G2Prime toy.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6|Optimus Prime's first G2 toy, essentially a re-release of the original toy but with a new [[soundbox]] and weapons.]]
Initially, the line heavily featured re-releases of several [[The Transformers (toyline)|"Generation 1" toys]] (as the pre-''Generation 2'' series quickly became known to the [[fandom]]), with tweaked decos and new accessories, alongside several molds that had been recently released as part of the European-market line. But after that initial year, all-new product quickly outnumbered reworked old product, and the line pushed its design and engineering to levels far beyond the original series; most notably, it was during the latter half of ''Generation 2'' that the toys began to feature the kind of advanced [[articulation]] in robot mode that made the toys much more "action figures" than ever before (and far more posable than many "regular" action figure lines!), which has been a staple of the brand ever since.

''Generation 2'' also sought to follow changing trends in the toy market in a broader sense. It put a much larger focus on keeping "main" characters (particularly [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] and [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]]) readily available on shelves with a variety of toys at different price points, as most of the successful competing toy lines of the '90s were focused on a core cast of characters, rather than the massive ever-changing casts of the '80s.

Unfortunately, the series debuted to lackluster sales, despite featuring many fan-favorite toys that hadn't been available for years. Some fans blamed [[Neon|color selections]], but it seems ''far'' more likely that it was simply a case of bad timing combined with too much product "your older brother has in the attic". Even the later new molds didn't help much, nor the little changes made as the line went on, such as removing [[insignia|faction symbols]] from the toys (supposedly kids didn't quite "get" them at the time, possibly due to the mix of symbols in the early line), or packaging frippery like the "[[Real Action Pop-Ups 3-D Transformer Trading Card]]"s that came with larger later toys.

[[File:G2toy laser optimus prime.jpg|left|thumb|upright=1.5|Laser Rod Optimus Prime, the last Optimus toy of the line, all-new with a literal truckload of gimmicks.]]

Kids simply weren't into robots that turned into "real" vehicles at the time, it seems, and the "older nostalgic" market (which can rarely sustain a [[G.I. Joe (franchise)|major toy brand]] at nationwide retail even today) was downright microscopic at the time. Being up against the then-new ''[[Saban Entertainment|Mighty Morphin Power Rangers]]'', the still-popular ''Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles'' (whose overall garish color schemes give lie to the idea that colors are what sank ''Generation 2''), and the ever-growing popularity of home video game consoles that sucked kids away from ''all'' toys added to the line's woes. The lack of a proper, network-backed "advertainment" cartoon was also a factor, as the [[Transformers: Generation 2 (cartoon)|repackaged '80s-series episodes branded as "''Generation 2"]] didn't advertise the majority of the actual toyline, and was stuck in syndication hell to boot where ''Power Rangers'' and ''Ninja Turtles'' got steady network play. Ironic, given a strong advertising cartoon was a major contributor to the success of the original ''Transformers'' series over its [[GoBots|biggest competitor]].

''Generation 2'' was ended after about two and a half years, with several new products trapped in development limbo. A handful saw release in Europe, Australia, and New Zealand (namely the [[Power Master]]s), but most of those canceled toys stayed unreleased. (A few of the slated new molds got released in later lines with new decos, however.)

As Hasbro had recently acquired former competitor [[Kenner]], and the ''Transformers'' franchise was facing extinction, the decision was made to shift the boys'-toy production to Kenner and take ''Transformers'' in a wildly different direction to hopefully revitalize the seemingly-tired concept... ''[[Beast Wars: Transformers (franchise)|Beast Wars]]''.
{{--}}

==Hasbro US line==
===1992===
{{anchor|USA}}
The line started off in late 1992 fairly modest, at least by production standards, with classic products in new decos (sometimes with new accessories). An unusual promotional tie-in<ref>https://twitter.com/tfwiki/status/1435291530391138304</ref> saw theatrical ads for the toyline run in front of holiday movies starting at the end of November; attendees were given a [[Sweepstakes Offer!|promotional pamphlet]] with a coupon for $2 off Optimus Prime that expired on December 31st, 1992.

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Bonecrusher (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Bonecrusher]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Hook (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Hook]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Long Haul (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Long Haul]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Mixmaster (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Mixmaster]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Scavenger (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Scavenger]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Scrapper (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Scrapper]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Autobot Cars|Cars]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Inferno (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Inferno]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Jazz (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Jazz]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Sideswipe]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Grimlock (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Grimlock]] (silver)}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Slag (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Slag]] (silver)}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Snarl (G1)#Generation 2|Snarl]] (silver)}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Decepticon Planes|Jets]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Ramjet (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Ramjet]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Starscream (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Starscream]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Leader'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Optimus Prime Collector's Edition]]}}
</ul>
|}

===1993===
This year saw all-new new molds that had been developed for release the same year as part of the European "Generation 1" line (which had not actually ended yet), with a large, completely new mold in the form of a huge tank Megatron. This series started using [[light-piping]] for the robot eyes, a minor gimmick that would become a standard in ''Transformers'' toys for a good two decades following.

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Mini Vehicle|Mini Autobots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Beachcomber (G1)#Generation 2|Beachcomber]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Bumblebee (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Bumblebee]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Hubcap (G1)#Generation 2|Hubcap]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Seaspray (G1)#Generation 2|Seaspray]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Axelerator|Small Cars]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Rapido#Toys|Rapido]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Skram (G2)#Toys|Skram]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Turbofire#Toys|Turbofire]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Windbreaker#Toys|Windbreaker]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Skyscorcher|Small Jets]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Afterburner (G2)#Toys|Afterburner]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Eagle Eye (G2)#Toys|Eagle Eye]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Terradive (G2)#Toys|Terradive]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Windrazor (G2)#Toys|Windrazor]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Color Changer]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Deluge (G2)#Toys|Deluge]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Drench (G2)#Toys|Drench]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Gobots#Toys|Gobots]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Jetstorm (G2)#Toys|Jetstorm]]}}
</ul>
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=3|[[File:G2 Gobots toy.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|Color Changer Gobots]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Grimlock (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Grimlock]] (blue/turquoise)}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Slag (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Slag]] (red/green)}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Snarl (G1)#Generation 2|Snarl]] (green/red)}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Leader'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Watches'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Autobot (G2)#Toys|Autobot]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Galvatron (G1)/toys#Merchandise|Galvatron]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Scorpia (G2)#Toys|Scorpia]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Superion (G1)#Merchandise|Superion]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Ultra Magnus (G1)/merchandise#Watch|Ultra Magnus]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{--}}

===1994===
Come the line's second (full) year, designs were getting more ambitious. While redecoes of "Scramble City" style combiners filled out the lower price-point ranks, completely new molds were being worked on with extensive [[gimmick]]s.

Two nigh-line-wide changes to how the toys were being produced were made this year, both of which would become standards in ''Transformers'' from here on out: enhanced robot mode [[articulation]], and the move away from customer-applied [[sticker]]s in favor of factory-applied [[tampograph]]s. Even the re-used "Generation 1" molds for this year lost their customer-applied sticker sheets.

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Air Raid (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Air Raid]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Fireflight (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Fireflight]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Silverbolt (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Silverbolt]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Skydive (G1 Aerialbot)/toys#Generation 2|Skydive]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Slingshot (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Slingshot]]}}
</ul class="iconlist">
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticons]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Blast Off (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Blast Off]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Brawl (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Brawl]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Onslaught (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Onslaught]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Swindle (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Swindle]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Vortex (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Vortex]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Rotor Force]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Leadfoot (G2)#Toys|Leadfoot]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Manta Ray (G2)#Toys|Manta Ray]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Powerdive#Toys|Powerdive]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Ransack (G2)#Toys|Ransack]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Laser Rod]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Electro#Toys|Electro]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Jolt (G2)#Toys|Jolt]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Sizzle (G2)#Toys|Sizzle]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Volt#Toys|Volt]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=3|[[File:G2 Jolt toy.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|Laser Rod Jolt]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Hero (G2)|Heroes]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#Hero|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#HeroOptimusPrime|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Others'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Dreadwing (G2)#Toys|Dreadwing]] with [[Smokescreen (G2)#Toys|Smokescreen]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 1994]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Breakdown (G1)#Generation 2|Breakdown]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]]''' (''canceled'')
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Dead End (G1)#Generation 2|Dead End]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Drag Strip (G1)#Generation 2|Drag Strip]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Motormaster (G1)#Generation 2|Motormaster]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Wildrider (G1)#Generation 2|Wildrider]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Protectobot (G1)|Protectobots]]''' (''canceled'')
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Blades (G1)#Generation 2|Blades]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[First Aid (G1)#Generation 2|First Aid]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Groove (G1)#Generation 2|Groove]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Hot Spot (G1)#Generation 2|Hot Spot]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Streetwise (G1)#Generation 2|Streetwise]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{--}}

===1995===
For the 1995 releases, Hasbro introduced redesigned packaging that quietly dropped the ''Generation 2'' moniker. Gone were '80s-toy redecoes, everything this year was a brand-new sculpt... or a ''redeco'' of a brand-new sculpt introduced this year. In fact, 1995 was the first year that ''Transformers'' really got into extensive same-line redecos as a budgetary procedure, as well as using "major" character names on toys of dubious resemblance to their namesakes in order to retain the [[trademark]]s on them. The enhanced articulation of the prior year's Laser Rods got refined further with the Cyberjets' extensive use of [[ball joint]]s, which would become ''the'' standard for ''Transformers'' toys up to the present day.

Unfortunately, this was also the final year of ''Generation 2'', and a great many items advertised in toy catalogs ended up unreleased. Some in-package samples have made it out. Despite most of this unreleased product being redecoes of existing molds, their scarcity means that all of them still demand big bucks on the secondary market, ''especially'' the few new molds.

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Go-Bot (G2)|Go-Bots]] wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Blowout#Toys|Blowout]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Double Clutch (G2)#Toys|Double Clutch]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Firecracker#Toys|Firecracker]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Gearhead#Toys|Gearhead]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[High Beam#Toys|High Beam]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Motormouth#Toys|Motormouth]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Go-Bots wave 2'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#Go-Bot|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#GobotOptimusPrime|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Go-Bots wave 3'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Frenzy (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Frenzy]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Bumblebee (G1)/toys#Go-Bot|Bumblebee]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Ironhide (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Ironhide]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Mirage (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Mirage]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Go-Bot|Sideswipe]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Soundwave (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Soundwave]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Go-Bots wave 4''' (''canceled'')
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Hound (G1)/toys#G2Gobot|Hound]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Rumble (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Rumble]]}}
*"[[4X]]"
*"[[911]]"
*"[[Black Viper Go-Bot|Black Viper]]"
*"[[Purple Mercedes Go-Bot|Purple Mercedes]]"
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=4|[[File:HooliganG2-toy.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|Cyberjet Hooligan]][[File:G2toy ATB megs and screamer.jpg|thumb|upright=1.5|ATB Megatron and Starscream]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Cyberjet]]s wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Hooligan (G2)#Toys|Hooligan]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Skyjack (G2)#Toys|Skyjack]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Space Case (G2)#Toys|Space Case]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Cyberjets wave 2'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Air Raid (G1)/toys#Cyberjet|Air Raid]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Jetfire (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Jetfire]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Strafe (G1)#Generation 2|Strafe]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Laser Cycle]]s wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Road Pig (G2)#Toys|Road Pig]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Road Rocket (G2)#Toys|Road Rocket]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Laser Cycles wave 2''' (''canceled'')
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Jazz (G1)/toys#LaserCycle|Jazz]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Soundwave (G1)/toys#LaserCycle|Soundwave]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Auto Roller (G2)|Auto Rollers]] wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Dirtbag#Toys|Dirtbag]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Roadblock (G2)#Toys|Roadblock]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Auto Rollers wave 2''' (''canceled'')
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#G2General|General Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Hound (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Sgt. Hound]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Auto Rollers wave 3''' (''canceled'')
*"[[APC Auto Roller]]"
*"[[Jet Auto Roller]]"
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Leaders'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#ATB|Megatron]] with [[Starscream (G1)/toys#ATB|Starscream]] (limited release)<ref group="A" name="atb">ATB Megatron with Starscream '''was''' released at retail, but only to test markets in Ohio in '''very''' limited quantities. The toy was never available as a wide release, so it's effectively as rare as the unreleased stuff.</ref>}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#LaserOptimusPrime|Laser Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 1995]] exclusives'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Nightracer (G2)#Toys|Nightracer]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Watches'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Blast Off (G1)/toys#Generation 2 2|Blast Off]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/merchandise#Generation 2|Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Power Master]]s''' (''Australia and New Zealand only'')
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Bulletbike (G2)#Toys|Bulletbike]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Ironhide (G1)/toys#PowerMaster|Ironhide]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Meanstreak#Toys|Meanstreak]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Staxx#Toys|Staxx]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Hero (G2)|Heroes]]''' (''canceled'' redecos)
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#CombatHero|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#CombatHeroOptimusPrime|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Other canceled stuff'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Greasepit (G2)#Toys|Greasepit]] and the [[Go-Bots Racing Rig]]}}
</ul>
|}
<big>'''Notes'''</big>
<references group="A" />
{{--}}

==Hasbro European line==
{{anchor|Europe}}
The whole European ''Generation 2'' situation is a little weird.

[[The Transformers (European toyline)|''Transformers'']] didn't end in most European markets when the US line did, with roughly two years of product released after the franchise (temporarily) closed shop in the US. The normal, un-sublined ''Transformers'' series continued in 1993, but shared many new molds with the 1993 US ''Generation 2'' line (albeit in different colors, sometimes as different characters), as well as the new "G2" Autobot and Decepticon faction symbols. ''Technically'', these releases are still "Generation 1".

In 1994, Hasbro UK and Hasbro International followed Hasbro US's lead and changed the branding to the new ''Generation 2'' name, and re-released much of the 1993 product as well as "new" items from the US line. This, mixed with the slow spread of information online at the time, has led many fans to overall consider ''all'' of the new-sigil 1993 product to be "Generation 2".

Which is fair enough, but this list will ''only'' contain the product released under the actual ''Generation 2'' banner.

Most toys were available in two different [[multilingual packaging]] [[variant]]s: English/Spanish/Portuguese and French/Dutch/German. In addition, [[GiG]] distributed figures in Italian-only packaging.

===1994===
The overwhelming bulk of this year's product was made up of repackaged re-releases of 1993 product from both the European and American toylines, the latter being "new" to most European markets, and newly-developed toys released concurrently with the American market.

This year's releases started the trend of the European toys having extremely condensed on-package [[bio]]s, as some specs only had the figure's name, function, and motto. Many quotes were changed from their previous releases as well.

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Sparkabot]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Fizzle#Generation 2|Blaze]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Flamefeather (G1)#Generation 2|Flamefeather]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sizzle (G1)#Generation 2|Sizzle]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Sparkstalker#Generation 2|Sparkstalker]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Axelerator]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Turbofire#Toys|Hotrider]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Rapido#Toys|Rapido]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Skram (G2)#Toys|Skram]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Windbreaker#Toys|Zap]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Skyscorcher]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Eagle Eye (G2)#Toys|Hawk]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Afterburner (G2)#Toys|Snipe]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Terradive (G2)#Toys|Terradive]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Windrazor (G2)#Toys|Tornado]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Rotor Force|Rotorbots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Powerdive#Toys|Blade]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Ransack (G2)#Toys|Blitz]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Leadfoot (G2)#Toys|Hot Foot]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Manta Ray (G2)#Toys|Piranha]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=2|[[File:Blaze-toy.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|Sparkabot Blaze]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Aquaspeeder]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Aquafend#Toys|Aquafend]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Deluge (G1)#Toys|Deluge]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Jetstorm (G1)#Toys|Jetstorm]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Speedstream#Toys|Speedstream]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Stormtrooper (G1)|Stormtroopers]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Aquablast#Toys|Aquablast]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Drench (G1)#Toys|Drench]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Hydradread#Toys|Hydradread]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Rage (G1)#Toys|Rage]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Lightformer]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Deftwing#Toys|Deftwing]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Ironfist (G1)#Toys|Ironfist]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Trakkon]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Calcar#Toys|Calcar]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Fearswoop (G1)#Toys|Fearswoop]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Laser Rod|Illuminators]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Electro#Toys|Electro]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Sizzle (G2)#Toys|Fireball]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Jolt (G2)#Toys|Hotrod]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Volt#Toys|Volt]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Autobot Cars|Heroics]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Jazz (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Jazz]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Inferno (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Inferno]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Sideswipe]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Decepticon Planes|Skyraiders]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Ramjet (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Ramjet]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Starscream (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Starscream]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Dinobot (G1)|Dinobots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Grimlock (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Grimlock]] (blue deco only)}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Slag (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Slag]] (green deco only)}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Snarl (G1)#Generation 2|Snarl]] (red deco only)}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=2|[[File:G2-toy Hydradread.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|Stormtrooper Hydradread]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Hero (G2)|Heroes]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Archforce#Toys|Archforce]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sureshot (G2)#Toys|Sureshot]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Obliterator]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Clench (G1)#Toys|Colossus]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Pyro (G1)#Toys|Spark]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Leaders'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Dreadwing (G2)#Toys|Stealth Assault]] with "[[Smokescreen (G2)#Toys|robot/jet fighter]]"}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|
|}
{{-}}

===1995===
Come the line's second year, it fell pretty much into line with the US series, with only a single "exclusive" sub-group, the Powermasters. However, they wey were not ''truly'' exclusive to Europe, as they were ''also'' available in Australia and New Zealand in the same English-only packaging that would have been used in the United States had the line not been canceled, lacking the "Generation 2" moniker and rendering "Power Masters" as two words instead of one like in Europe.

The packaging for the European 1995 releases was ''differently'' redesigned compared to the North American packaging, featuring very different color layouts, retaining the ''Generation 2'' title and, for whatever reason, now relegating all the individual character names for toys that shipped as assortments to the ''back'' of the packaging, thereby putting the emphasis of the marketing entirely on the price points.

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Go-Bot (G2)|Gobots]] Wave 1'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Blowout#Toys|Blowout]]<ref group="B" name="eurogbcj">Apparently, the decision to market the wave 2 Go-Bot and Cyberjet redecos as separate characters was a last-minute change of plans that was only put into use in America and Japan; in Europe, Hasbro supposedly stuck to the original idea for those assortments (here named "Gobots" and "Mini-Jets", respectively), with the redecos being sold as [[variant#Running changes|running change color variants]] of their wave 1 mold-mates instead, in unchanged packaging featuring [[package art]] in the original deco and the original character's name: Megatron and Optimus Prime, slight color variants of Blowout and Firecracker with solid instead of clear plastic parts, were still marketed as "Blowout" and "Firecracker"; "Hooligan" was also available in Jetfire's colors, "Skyjack" in Air Raid's, and "Space Case" in Strafe's. This practice is only confirmed for the versions available in [[multilingual packaging|multilingual]] French/Dutch/German packaging; thus far, no specimens in English/Spanish/Portuguese packaging or in Italian [[GiG]] packaging have surfaced. The subsequent, completely redecoed Go-Bots wave was marketed as the same characters as their United States counterparts, however.</ref>}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Double Clutch (G2)#Toys|Double Clutch]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Firecracker#Toys|Firecracker]]<ref group="B" name="eurogbcj"/>}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Gearhead#Toys|Gearhead]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[High Beam#Toys|High Beam]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Motormouth#Toys|Motormouth]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Gobots Wave 2'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Frenzy (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Frenzy]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Bumblebee (G1)/toys#Go-Bot|Bumblebee]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Ironhide (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Ironhide]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Mirage (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Mirage]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Go-Bot|Sideswipe]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Soundwave (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Soundwave]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Cyberjet|Mini-Jets]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Hooligan (G2)#Toys|Hooligan]]<ref group="B" name="eurogbcj"/>}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Skyjack (G2)#Toys|Skyjack]]<ref group="B" name="eurogbcj"/>}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Space Case (G2)#Toys|Space Case]]<ref group="B" name="eurogbcj"/>}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Power Master|Powermasters]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Bulletbike (G2)#Toys|Bulletbike]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Ironhide (G1)/toys#PowerMaster|Ironhide]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Meanstreak#Toys|Meanstreak]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Staxx#Toys|Staxx]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=2|[[File:G2-toy Meanstreak.jpg|thumb|upright=1.5|Powermaster Meanstreak]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Laser Cycle|Lasercycles]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Road Pig (G2)#Toys|Road Pig]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Road Rocket (G2)#Toys|Road Rocket]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Auto Roller (G2)|Autorollers]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Dirtbag#Toys|Dirtbag]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Roadblock (G2)#Toys|Roadblock]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Leader'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#LaserOptimusPrime|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{--}}
<big>'''Notes'''</big>
<references group="B" />

==Takara ''G-2'' line==
{{anchor|Japan}}
{{nav-JG2}}
'''''Transformers: G-2''''' was [[TakaraTomy|Takara]]'s first foray back into Transformers after ending the original line in [[1992]] with ''[[Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers: Operation Combination (franchise)|Operation Combination]]''. Available for only the latter half of [[1995]], ''G-2'' did not include any of the Generation 1 molds (including the later European ones) which were in the American and European lines, only the more poseable toys newly created for the line. Each release came with a [[Transformers: G-2 (pack-in manga)|pack-in comic]].

Virtually none of the toys in ''G-2'' have significant differences from the Hasbro releases outside of packaging. Only the [[Go-Bot (G2)|Go-Bot]]s have deco changes. The [[Cyberjet]]s each came with an extra [[sticker]] sheet to customize the toys, but are otherwise identical. While prototypes for "enhanced" Cyberjets with add-on armor have since surfaced, they never made it beyond prototype.

''G-2'' was not a major financial success for Takara. As a result, the planned spin-off ''[[Block Town]]'' was canceled, and there was another short ''Transformers'' drought in Japan until the introduction of ''[[Beast Wars: Super Lifeform Transformers|Beast Wars]]'' in [[1997]].
{{-}}

{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Go-Bot (G2)|Go-Bots]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#Go-Bot|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Soundwave (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Soundwave]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#GobotOptimusPrime|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Cyberjet]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|TRF-07 [[Skyjack (G2)#Toys|Skyjack]]}}
{{Bp-d2|TRF-08 [[Space Case (G2)#Toys|Space Case]]}}
{{Bp-d2|TRF-09 [[Hooligan (G2)#Toys|Hooligan]]}}
{{Bp-a2|TRF-14 [[Aero Raid#Toys|Aero Raid]]}}
{{Bp-a2|TRF-15 [[Strafe (G2)#Toys|Strafe]]}}
{{Bp-a2|TRF-16 [[Jetfire (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Jetfire]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Laser Cycle|Laser Bike]]s'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|TRF-11 [[Road Rocket (G2)#Toys|Road Rocket]]}}
{{Bp-d2|TRF-12 [[Road Pig (G2)#Toys|Road Big]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Laser Rod|Lazer Rod]]s''' {{sic}}
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|TRF-03 [[Electro#Toys|Effectro]]}}
{{Bp-a2|TRF-04 [[Volt#Toys|Autovolt]]}}
{{Bp-d2|TRF-05 [[Jolt (G2)#Toys|Hot Row]]}}
{{Bp-d2|TRF-06 [[Sizzle (G2)#Toys|Firebot]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=2|[[File:AeroRaid-stickers.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|Aero Raid's extra stickers]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Hero (G2)|Heroes]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|TRF-01 [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#HeroOptimusPrime|Convoy]]}}
{{Bp-d2|TRF-02 [[Megatron (G1)/toys#Hero|Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Aerial Bombing Officer'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|TRF-10 [[Dreadwing (G2)#Toys|Dreadwing]] (w/ [[Smokescreen (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Smokescreen]])}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''Supreme Commander'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|TRF-13 [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#LaserOptimusPrime|Battle Convoy]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{--}}

==Massive amounts of concept stuff==
[[File:G2SludgeBoxart.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|I got my spine, I got my Orange Sludge.]]
[[File:UnmadeVideoCameraMegatron.jpg|thumb|upright=1.4|Camcorder Megatron?]]

In the years since ''Generation 2'' ended, numerous [[Unreleased toy#Generation 2|ultimately-unused concepts]] have come to light, showing what might have been were more molds available, were budgets bigger, ''et cetera''. These range from redecoes of old toys to all-new mold prototypes, and a few real oddities.

;Redecoes
*Orange [[:File:G2SludgeBoxart.jpg|Sludge]], bright green [[:File:G2SwoopArtwork.jpg|Swoop]], and a delightfully tiger-striped version of [[:File:G2GrimlockArtwork.jpg|Grimlock]].
*"[[Sandstorm (G2)#Toys|Sandstorm]]", a desert-themed redeco of Ramjet.
*"[[Blackout (G2)#Toys|Blackout]]", a black redeco of Starscream.
*Hand-painted samples of a jungle-themed [[:File:G2SSJungleprotojet.jpg|Starscream]] and a blue sky-themed [[:File:WhizBangNavyRamjetRedeco.jpg|Ramjet]], both of whom could be new characters for all we know.
*A green and purple [[:File:G2MirageVaultArt.jpg|Mirage]], a yellow and turquoise [[:File:UnmadeG2SideswipeMockup.jpg|Sideswipe]], and a bright orange [[:File:G2JazzLegacyArt.jpg|Jazz]].
*Recolored card art of [[Power Master]] [[Ironhide (G1)/toys#PowerMaster|Ironhide]], in yellow and blue, attached to packaging mock-ups bearing the names "Belzone", "Light Speed", and "[[Pothole]]".

;New-mold prototypes
*A resin prototype of a [[Unproduced G.I. Joe Transformer|transforming six-wheeled APC]] capable of carrying a [[G.I. Joe (franchise)|G.I. Joe]] figure.
*A [[customizing|kitbashed/hand-painted]] mock-up of the large [[Megatron (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Megatron tank mold]] as a video camcorder.
*Takara had prototypes of the Cyberjet molds with add-on armor pieces on display at a toy convention, but those clearly never happened.
*Two more [[Auto Roller (G2)|Auto Roller]]s: an [[APC Auto Roller|APC]] and a [[Jet Auto Roller|jet]]. Those eventually ended up being used by Takara for the Japanese version of the ''[[Transformers: Beast Wars (Japanese toyline)|Beast Wars]]'' line (as [[Autolauncher#Toys|Autolauncher]] and [[Autojetter#Toys|Autojetter]], respectively).
*Six additional [[Go-Bot (G2)|Go-Bot]]s: [[Rumble (G1)/toys#Generation 2|Rumble]], "[[Crash Test (G2)#Toys|4X]]", "[[911#Toys|911]]", a [[Black Viper Go-Bot|black Dodge Viper]], [[Hound (G1)/toys#G2Gobot|Hound]], and a [[Purple Mercedes Go-Bot|purple Mercedes-Benz SL500 sport coupé]]. Four of them were later used by Hasbro for the ''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2001 toyline)|Robots in Disguise]]'' line, as the [[Spy Changer]]s [[Side Swipe (RID)#Toys|Side Swipe]] (Rumble), [[Daytonus#Toys|Daytonus]] (4X), [[Prowl 2#Toys|Prowl 2]] (911) and [[Side Burn (RID)#Spychanger|Side Burn]] (Viper), while the Hound and Mercedes-benz sculpts remain unreleased.
*Two jets, a race car and a tow truck were designed for price points that never came to fruition. The two jets, which would have been released under an assortment named "Solar Jets", were later used by Hasbro for the ''[[Machine Wars: Transformers|Machine Wars]]'' line (as [[Megatron (G1)/toys#Machine Wars|Megatron]]/[[Megaplex#Toys|Megaplex]] and [[Thundercracker (G1)/toys#Machine Wars|Thundercracker]]/[[Skywarp (G1)/toys#Machine Wars|Skywarp]]), as were the race car (as [[Prowl (G1)/toys#Machine Wars|Prowl]]/[[Mirage (G1)/toys#Machine Wars|Mirage]]) and the tow truck (as [[Hoist (G1)/toys#Machine Wars|Hoist]]/[[Hubcap (MW)#Toys|Hubcap]]).
*The [[Solarbot#Toys|Solarbot]], an item mentioned on some late-series card samples but otherwise we know literally nothing about what it was supposed to be. Possibly the race car and tow truck?
{{--}}

==Post-''Generation 2'' releases==
As time has passed and fandom attitudes have changed, the once-often-poo-pooed ''Generation 2'' line has become a go-to source for a more quirky nostalgia-grab, particularly as a source for [[redeco]] color schemes for modern toys, though some do end up as new-character [[homage]]s.

;Hasbro
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Transformers: Universe (2003 toyline)|''Universe'' (2003)]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Space Case (G2)#Universe (2003)|Space Case]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Transformers: Universe (2008 toyline)|''Universe'' (2008)]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|"Aerial Rivals" ([[Air Raid (G1)/toys#Universe (2008)|Air Raid]], [[Skydive (G1 Aerialbot)/toys#Universe (2008)|Skydive]])}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Inferno (G1)/toys#Universe (2008)|Inferno]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#Universe (2008)|Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Skyjack (G2)#Universe (2008)|Skyfall]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Transformers (2010 toyline)|''Transformers'' (2010)]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#RTSDeluxe|Optimus Prime]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Transformers: Generations (toyline)|Generations]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Dreadwing (G2)#Generations|Dreadwing]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Powerdive#Generations|Powerdive]]}}
{{Bp-a2|"Ultimate Gift Set" ([[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#UltimateGiftSet|Combat Hero Optimus Prime]], [[Jazz (G1)/toys#UltimateGiftSet|Autobot Jazz]])}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=3|[[File:Generations-Combiner-Wars-Generation-2-Superion.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|''Combiner Wars'' shared-exclusive Superion.]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Amazon (website)|Amazon]] / [[BigBadToyStore]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Bruticus (G1)#G2FOC|Bruticus]] ([[Blast Off (G1)/toys#G2FOC|Blast Off]], [[Brawl (G1)/toys#G2FOC|Brawl]], [[Onslaught (G1)/toys#G2FOC|Onslaught]], [[Swindle (G1)/toys#G2FOC|Swindle]], [[Vortex (G1)/toys#G2FOC|Vortex]])}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Kre-O]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|Autobot Assault [[Devastator (G1)/toys#YellowDevastator|Devastator]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Devastator (G1)/toys#OrangeDevastator|Constructicon Devastator]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Combiner Wars (toyline)|Combiner Wars]]''''' (exclusives)
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Bruticus (G1)#CWG2|Bruticus]] ([[Blast Off (G1)/toys#CWG2|Blast Off]], [[Brawl (G1)/toys#CWG2|Brawl]], [[Onslaught (G1)/toys#CWG2|Onslaught]], [[Shockwave (G1)/toys#CWG2|Shockwave]], [[Swindle (G1)/toys#CWG2|Swindle]], [[Vortex (G1)/toys#CWG2|Vortex]])}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Menasor (G1)#CWG2|Menasor]] ([[Blackjack (G1)#CWG2|Blackjack]], [[Wildrider (G1)#CWG2|Brake-Neck]], [[Breakdown (G1)#CWG2|Breakdown]], [[Dead End (G1)#CWG2|Dead End]], [[Drag Strip (G1)#CWG2|Dragstrip]], [[Motormaster (G1)#CWG2|Motormaster]])}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"| 
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Superion (G1)#CWG2|Superion]] ([[Air Raid (G1)/toys#CWG2|Air Raid]], [[Fireflight (G1)/toys#CWG2|Firefly]], [[Powerglide (G1)/toys#CWG2|Powerglide]], [[Slingshot (G1)/toys#CWG2|Quickslinger]], [[Silverbolt (G1)/toys#CWG2|Silverbolt]], [[Skydive (G1 Aerialbot)/toys#CWG2|Skydive]])}}
</ul>
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Titans Return (toyline)|Titans Return]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Diac#Toys|Diac]] & [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#TRVoyager|Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-a2|"Chaos on Velocitron" ([[Refractor#Toys|Refractor]] & [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#TRCOV|Laser Prime]])}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[War for Cybertron: Siege|Siege]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|"Autobot Alphastrike Counterforce" ([[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#S26|Covert Clone Sideswipe]])}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Generations Selects (toyline)|Generations Selects]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/Generations toys#GS01|Combat Megatron]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/Generations toys#GS14|Megatron (G2)]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Sandstorm (G2)#Generations Selects|Sandstorm]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Ramjet (G1)/toys#Generations Selects|Ramjet]]}}
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Transformers: Legacy|Legacy]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#Legacy|Laser Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Jhiaxus (G2)#Legacy|G2 Universe Jhiaxus]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/Generations toys#Legacy|G2 Universe Megatron (Core Class)]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Road Rocket (G2)#Legacy|G2 Universe Road Rocket]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Leadfoot (G2)#Legacy|G2 Universe Leadfoot]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{-}}
{{comingsoontoy|''Legacy'' G2 Universe Megatron and Road Rocket}}

;Hasbro via [[Fun Publications]]
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 2010]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2d2|"Generation 2: Redux" ([[Breakdown (G1)#Timelines|Breakdown]], [[Clench (G1)#Timelines|Clench]], [[Pyro (G1)#Timelines|Autobot Spark]], [[Streetwise (G1)#Timelines|Streetstar]])}}
{{Bp-a2d2|[[Rapido#Timelines|Rapido]] & [[Cindersaur (G1)#Timelines|Cindersaur]] 2-pack}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Timelines|Sideswipe]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 2011]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Sideswipe (Animated)#Toys|Sideswipe]]}}
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Transformers Collectors' Club]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|"Club Crossover Exclusive" ([[Megatron (G1)/toys#ClubCrossover|Megatron]])}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Fisitron (Timelines)#Toys|Fisitron]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Nightracer (G2)#Timelines|Nightracer]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"| 
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Ramjet (G1)/toys#Timelines|Ramjet]]}}
*[[Solarbot#Shattered Glass 2|Solarbot]]
{{Bp-d2|[[Starscream (G1)/toys#Timelines|Starscream]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=3|[[File:TL-toy Rapido.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|BotCon 2010 Rapido]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 2013]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Electro#Timelines|Autobot Electrons]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 2014]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Kreon]] [[Breakdown (G1)#BotCon2014|Breakdown]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 2015]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Timelines|General Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Hound (G1)/toys#Timelines|Sgt. Hound]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[BotCon 2016]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Ratchet (G1)/toys#Combiner Wars|Autobot Ratchet]]}}
</ul>
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Transformers Figure Subscription Service|Transformers Figure Subscription Service 5.0]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a1|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/Generations toys#TFSS|Double Pretender Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-d1|[[Megatron (G1)/Generations toys#TFSS|Double Pretender Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{-}}

;TakaraTomy
{| style="margin-left:1em;" width="100%"
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[e-HOBBY]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Ultra Magnus (G1)/toys#G-2|Laser Ultra Magnus]]}}
*[[Solarbot#Shattered Glass 2|Solarbot]]
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Hybrid Style]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#THS02B|Convoy Black Version]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''[[Transformers (2010 toyline)|''Transformers'' (2010)]]'''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Dreadwing (G2)#Transformers (2010)|Dreadwing]] & [[Smokescreen (G2)#Transformers (2010)|Smokescreen]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Transformers United]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#UnitedG2|Laser Optimus Prime]]}}
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#UnitedTank|Tank Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top" rowspan=2|[[File:Masterpiece-MP12G-G2Lambor.jpg|upright=1.5|thumb|''Masterpiece'' G2 Lambor]]
|-
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Transformers Chronicle (toyline)|Chronicle]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#ChronicleEZHero|Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Transformers United|United EX]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Roadblock (G2)#United EX 2|Dozermaster]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Manta Ray (G2)#United EX 2|Marinemaster]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Rapido#United EX 2|Racemaster]] Prime Mode}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[The Transformers: Masterpiece|Masterpiece]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-a2|[[Bumblebee (G1)/toys#MP21G|Bumble G-2 Ver.]]}}
{{Bp-a2|[[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#MP12G|Lambor G-2 Ver.]]}}
</ul>
|
|width="20%" valign="top"|'''''[[Transformers Legends (franchise)|Legends]]'''''
<ul class="iconlist">
{{Bp-d2|[[Megatron (G1)/toys#LG63|G2 Megatron]]}}
</ul>
|}
{{--}}

==Notes==
*A ''Generation 2'' exists within the fictional [[Unicron Trilogy continuity family|Unicron Trilogy]] universe, as a ''toyline''! According to the online [[Cyber Key Codes|Cyber Key Code]] bio for the [[Transformers: Cybertron (franchise)|Cybertron]] Decepticon, [[Shortround (Cybertron)|Shortround]], he is an avid toy collector whose prize pieces are [[Generation 2 Defensor and Menasor]]. However, it is not specified whether or not these items are actually ''Transformers'' toys like their real world counterparts.

==References==
{{reflist}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Generation 2 (toyline)}}
[[Category:Earth culture]]
[[Category:Generation 2| Generation 2 (toyline)]]
[[Category:Toylines]]

Dead End (Animated)

2022-07-18T10:47:07Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{faction|decepticon|decepticong2|teamstunticon}}
{{disambig3|Dead End}}
:''Dead End is a [[Decepticon]] from the [[Transformers Animated (franchise)|Animated]] [[continuity family]] (via [[Transformers Timelines (franchise)|Timelines]]).''

[[Image:DeadEndAnimated.jpg|right|thumb|200px|''I run around in sandals, I never, ever shave. ''
''And that's the way I wanna be when someone digs my grave.'']]
'''Dead End''' has [[facial hair]] that is fabulous. The other [[Team Stunticon|Stunticon]]s are probably jealous. Their attentions would be wasted on Dead End, because he's too busy being a depressing beat poet.<ref>{{twitter|Everyone needs a depressingly dour beat poet in their life.|https://twitter.com/DerrickJWyatt/status/30788614854017024|Derrick J Wyatt|2011|01|27}}</ref>
{{TOCclear}}
==Fiction==
===''Animated''===
{{voiceactor|[[David Kaye]] (English)}}
[[Image:StuntiConJob-nowheretorun.jpg|left|thumb|300px|"Nowhere to hide, from my poetry. Ahem..."]]
Dead End was sent, along with the other Stunticons and [[Toxitron (Animated)|Toxitron]], on a mission to break [[Megatron (Animated)|Megatron]] and other Decepticons out of [[Trypticon Prison]]. In the guise of entertainers, they planned to rig the former [[Decepticon Gladiatorial Arena]] in [[Kaon (polity)|Kaon]] with explosives, blasting the prison walls open and killing the audience in the process.

All was going well until the Stunticons were abruptly assaulted in mid-rehearsal by [[Cheetor (Animated)|Cheetor]], who opened fire on the disguised Decepticons. Once the Autobot cop settled down, the rehearsal continued.

On the night of the plan's execution, Sideswipe and Cheetor returned in the middle of the show, having worked out the Stunticons' plan. The Stunticons fought back, with Dead End and [[Drag Strip (Animated)|Drag Strip]] cornering Cheetor. But when Toxitron turned out to actually be a disguised [[Optimus Prime (Animated)|Optimus Prime]], their plan was exposed to everyone watching. Dead End was incarcerated in Trypticon Prison, alongside the very Decepticons he and his teammates had sought to free. {{storylink|The Stunti-Con Job}}

[[File:G2DeadEndAnimated-CAA.jpg|thumb|upright=0.65|If anything, these colours might make him more depressed.]]
At some point, Dead End '''[REDACTED BY THE OFFICE OF [[Sentinel Prime (Animated)|SENTINEL MAGNUS]]]''' [[forestonite]], leaving him with a garish color scheme. {{storylink|Transformers Animated: The Complete AllSpark Almanac|The Complete AllSpark Almanac}}
{{--}}

==Toys==
===''Timelines''===
[[Image:Animated Dead End Toy.JPG|right|thumb|300px|Because there wasn't an ''Animated'' Sunstreaker toy to redeco.]]
*'''The Stunti-Con-Job''' (BotCon 2011 box set)
**''Accessories'': 2 tailpipe/"mini-bazookas"

: Dead End is a [[redeco]] of Deluxe Class [[Transformers Animated (toyline)|''Animated'']] [[Jazz (Animated)#Toys|Jazz]], transforming into a street racer very dimly resembling a tricked-out Porsche. His side-pipes detach to form a pair of "mini-bazookas". He is only available as part of the [[BotCon 2011]] box set, which also includes [[The Motor Master]], [[Wildrider (Animated)|Wildrider]], [[Drag Strip (Animated)|Drag Strip]], and [[Breakdown (Animated)|Breakdown]].

: This mold was later [[retool]]ed into ''Animated'' [[Jackpot (Animated)|Jackpot]], which was released through the [[Transformers Figure Subscription Service]] in [[2013]].

::*''[http://www.tfu.info/2011/Decepticon/BCDeadEnd/deadend.htm More information on Dead End at TFU.info]''

{{--}}

==Notes==
* Dead End was the first toy to be revealed for the BotCon 2011 set, on [[January 27]], 2011. The toy was put up on the convention website, followed shortly by his [[character model]] on BotCon's Twitter feed.
* Dead End being a Jazz redeco may have its roots in the Generation 1 episode "[[Masquerade]]", wherein [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] was disguised as [[Dead End (G1)|Dead End]] with camouflage paint. Of course, this isn't the first [[Dead End (ROTF)|Dead End]] redeco of a [[Jazz (Movie)|Jazz]].
* One of the early ideas for Dead End's deco was to paint his face up to resemble a skull.<ref>[http://www.tfradio.net/podcast/2011/3/6/derrick-j-wyatt-interview.html "Radio Free Cybertron" interview with Derrick J. Wyatt]</ref>

==References==
<references/>

[[Category:Animated Decepticons]]
[[Category:BotCon exclusives]]
[[Category:Convention-original characters]]
[[Category:Poets]]
[[Category:Stunticons]]
[[Category:Timelines characters]]

Bumblebee (film)

2022-07-18T10:44:34Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter templates

{{disambig3.5|the feature film|the Autobot it features|Bumblebee (Movie)|Bumblebee}}
{{Nav-Bumblebee}}
{{movie|
|seriess=[[Live-action film series]]
|prev=Transformers: The Last Knight (film)
|next=Transformers: Rise of the Beasts
|title=''Bumblebee''
|image=BumblebeeMovieNewPoster.jpeg
|caption=According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly. Its wings are too small to get its fat little body off the ground. The bee, of course, flies anyway, because bees don't care what humans think is impossible.
|production companies=[[Allspark Pictures]] [[Lorenzo di Bonaventura|di Bonaventura Pictures]] [[Tencent Pictures]] [[Michael Bay|Bay Films]]
|distributor=[[Paramount Pictures]]
|executive producer=[[Steven Spielberg]]
|associate producer=[[Lorenzo di Bonaventura]] [[Tom DeSanto]] [[Don Murphy]] [[Michael Bay]] [[Mark Vahradian]]
|written by=[[Christina Hodson]]
|directed by=[[Travis Knight]]
|cinematography by=[[Enrique Chediak]]
|edited by=[[Paul Rubell]]
|music by=[[Dario Marianelli]]
|release date=[[December 21]], [[2018]]
|continuity=[[Live-action film series]]
|runtime=114 minutes
|budget=$102–135 million
|box office=$468 million
}}
'''''Bumblebee''''' is the sixth movie in the [[live-action film series]]. A "reset" of the film series as a whole,<ref name="reboot">[http://news.tfw2005.com/2018/02/16/transformers-cinematic-universe-current-movie-series-rebooted-358641 Transformers Cinematic Universe Is Over: Current Movie Series To Be Rebooted] at TFW2005</ref> ''Bumblebee'' acts as a prequel to the previous five movies, albeit [[retcon|taking some liberties]] with continuity. The film is directed by [[Travis Knight]] rather than [[Michael Bay]] (who still pitches in as producer), written by newcomer [[Christina Hodson]], and produced on a far lower budget of around $100-137 million.<ref>[https://screenrant.com/bumblebee-movie-budget-cost/ "The film's budget is reportedly in the range of $100-137 million..." -Screenrant article on the film's budget and profit]</ref> The film was released in the U.S. on [[December 21]], [[2018]].

When [[Bumblebee (Movie)|Bumblebee]] is sent to [[Earth]] to establish a base for the [[Autobot]]s, he finds himself hunted by both [[Sector Seven]] and the [[Decepticon]]s. With his memory and voice lost in battle, he is found by [[Charlie Watson]], a young woman in search of a direction in life. The pair work together to try to discover who Bumblebee is and why he's on Earth, but ultimately they'll find themselves with the fate of the planet in their hands...

{{quote|Thank you...so much...for giving me...my voice.|[[Bumblebee (Movie)|Bumblebee]]}}

==Synopsis==
[[File:BBfilm-Optimus-Bumblebee-Earth.jpg|thumb|left|300px|"In tennis, you attack at the point of weakness!"]]
War rages on [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]], and things look bad for the [[Autobot]]s. The [[Decepticon]]s have broken through the front lines, contact has been lost with the capital, and [[Ratchet (Movie)|Ratchet]], [[Brawn (ROTF)|Brawn]], [[Arcee (Movie)|Arcee]], [[Cliffjumper (Movie)|Cliffjumper]], [[Wheeljack (Movie)|Wheeljack]], [[Ironhide (Movie)|Ironhide]], and several other survivors are pinned down under Decepticon assault until [[Optimus Prime (Movie)|Optimus Prime]] arrives to momentarily repel their foes. Prime looks for scout [[Bumblebee (Movie)|B-127]], who appears only a moment after. The arrival of [[Soundwave (ROTF)|Soundwave]], [[Starscream (Movie)|Starscream]] and [[Shockwave (Movie)|Shockwave]] on the battlefield, as well as the surge in Decepticon forces, prompts Prime to order the Autobots to fall back to a launchpad. He instructs the Autobots to board escape pods and flee from the planet. He also gives B-127 a secret mission: go to [[Earth]], a well-hidden planet Prime has identified, and establish a base for the Autobots to regroup and strike back. As the [[Seeker (Movie)|Seeker]]s under Shockwave's command begin attacking the launchpad directly, Prime leaps into the horde of Decepticons to buy B-127's pod some time to escape.

[[File:BBfilm-Burns-meets-bee.jpg|thumb|300px|"This isn't a goodfella. This is a ''bad''fella!"]]
The year is [[1987]], and Agent [[Jack Burns]]' team of [[Sector Seven]] agents emerge victorious from a mock battle after leading [[Danny Bell]] and his team into an ambush. As Burns good-naturedly chides his unlucky opponent, however, an unknown projectile appears overhead and plows into their midst, injuring many agents. Burns, believing his team to be under projectile assault after confirming that no other military practices using live ammo are occurring nearby, immediately calls for backup... upon which he comes face to face with B-127 rising from the crater. He immediately orders his forces to give chase, and the Autobot flees after [[scanning]] and [[transformation|transforming]] into a nearby military jeep.

Even though the military attempts to capture him with [[harpoon]]s and [[machine gun]]s, B-127 evades them and emerges into a clearing leading to an empty mineshaft. Burns gives the order to cut it off from escaping into the mine, which one of his soldiers executes by blindsiding B-127 with his jeep. However, B-127 begins talking to the humans in [[United States of America|English]], assuring them of his peaceful intentions and that he is not here to hurt anyone. Burns orders the soldiers to stand down, only for a jet to appear overhead. Burns is baffled that the Air Force was alerted this early, but the robot corrects him—the plane is, in fact, the Decepticon [[Blitzwing (BB)|Blitzwing]], who bombards the clearing with missiles and swoops in to attack the yellow Autobot!

[[File:Bumblebee-BeeVsBlitz.jpg|300px|thumb|left|"I have been felled by a winged beast of destruction!"]]
B-127 puts up a valiant effort against Blitzwing and even manages to damage his opponent's flight systems, but is soon subdued and dangled over a cliff. Blitzwing interrogates the scout about Optimus Prime and the Autobots' whereabouts; the scout valiantly refuses and asserts that he will "never talk," a move that prompts Blitzwing to "make it official" by ripping out his voice synthesizer. Badly injured, he is thrown off the cliff and prepared for execution. But B-127 uses a moment of quick thinking to rip a missile from the Decepticon's arm and shove it into his chest. B-127 takes advantage of the Decepticon's momentary confusion to kick himself away before opening fire on the missile, detonating it, and killing Blitzwing. As he limps away, Burns watches him leave trapped under a destroyed jeep. The Autobot crawls to a riverbank before collapsing from his injuries, with his memory cells critically damaged. His systems scan a nearby [[Volkswagen]] Beetle before he finally fades away to unconsciousness...

[[File:BBfilm-Charlie-finds-bee.jpg|thumb|300px|"What about you?" "He really is dead."]]
In [[Brighton Falls]], [[Charlie Watson]], a 17-year old girl one day away from turning 18, awakens from her slumber. Since Charlie isn't over [[Charlie's dad|her father's]] death yet, she brushes off her annoying younger brother [[Otis Watson|Otis]], and her mother [[Sally Watson|Sally]]'s infatuation with her new boyfriend [[Ron (BB)|Ron]]. Charlie bikes to her job at the [[Brighton Falls Boardwalk|boardwalk]], where she is utterly humiliated in an encounter with [[Tina Lark]] and her posse. She visits [[Hank's Marine Repair and Parts]] after hours to look for car parts, discovering an old V.W. Beetle under a tarmac after accidentally knocking over some motorboats. She finds the key in the ignition and attempts to start it, but is surprised when the car emits an unintelligible signal...

On one of [[Saturn]]'s moons, Decepticon hunters [[Shatter]] and [[Dropkick (Movie)|Dropkick]] interrogate Cliffjumper about Optimus Prime's whereabouts. The Autobot remains resolute, which angers his interrogators, until B-127's signal, activated on Earth by Charlie, reaches the three [[Transformer]]s. The two Decepticons agree to go to Earth and hunt down B-127 instead, and Dropkick vertically bisects Cliffjumper, killing the Autobot.

In a [[Texas]] trailer park, the dysfunctional couple, [[Roy (BB)|Roy]] and [[Amber]], argue about Roy spending the down payment for their house on a tricked-out new car, among other things. Their spiel is interrupted when a meteor crashes mere feet from them, missing Roy's new car, much to his relief. However, he's not so lucky when a second one falls as it obliterates both his prized car and their house. Headlights shining from inside the inferno give the irresponsible man some hope until Shatter and Dropkick reveal themselves and transform before them. As Roy attempts to greet the newcomers, Dropkick kills the unlucky man and leaves Amber before the Decepticons drive off to the West Coast following B-127's signal.

Failing to make progress on repairing her late father's Corvette and feeling left out by her family, Charlie wakes up to the worst 18th birthday imaginable. The disappointing presents from Sally and Ron (a pink bicycle helmet and a book about smiling more, respectively) only worsen the feeling. She fumes in her bedroom before storming over to the auto repair and asking [[Uncle Hank|Hank]] for the Beetle. She even offers to work at the shop for a year in exchange for the car, but Hank refuses since he isn't hiring employees, and Charlie can take the car for free if she can get it to start. Charlie gets to work and soon triumphantly drives her new car home.

[[File:BBfilm-Charlie-Bumblebee-garage.jpg|thumb|300px|left|"You like jazz?"]]
Charlie parks her new Beetle in the garage but is surprised when a part falls out from its undercarriage. She's even more surprised when an inspection of the vehicle reveals what appears to be a ''face'' under the car... moments before B-127 transforms and reveals himself to her. However, Charlie's only momentarily terrified as her fear turns to compassion upon seeing that the Autobot is about as afraid of her as she is of him. She manages to soothe the scared scout and emotionally connect with him, giving him the name "Bumblebee" after the warbled beeps and buzzes he makes.

[[Seymour Simmons|Agent Simmons]] relays the news of the Decepticons' landfall to Burns, who immediately prepares a team to travel to Texas and intercept them.

[[File:BBfilm-Bumblebee-pat-pat.jpg|thumb|300px|"You're flying outside the hive, talking to humans that attack our homes with power washers and M-80s!"]]
Charlie awakens the next day and goes straight to the garage, but discovers to her horror that Bumblebee has vanished without a trace. A quick interrogation of Otis reveals Sally has appropriated Charlie's car to take their dog [[Conan]] to the vet, as Ron needed to use the family station wagon. Charlie frantically chases her mother on her moped and manages to pull her over, despite Bumblebee almost blowing his cover by extending an arm out from his trunk and waving at her. She later takes the Autobot to a secluded beach, where she teaches him that he should always assume [[Alternate mode|vehicle mode]] unless the two of them are alone.

[[File:ShatterDropkickhologram.jpg|thumb|300px|left|"Mr. Bee, I'm going to ask what I think the entire court here would like to know... what exactly is your relationship to that woman?"]]
Burns' team and [[Dr. Powell]] intercept the two Decepticons in Texas and ask them to state their business. Dropkick wants to eliminate the humans, but Shatter comes up with a better idea; lying to the humans that they are a "peacekeeping Decepticon patrol." She asks Sector Seven's aid in tracking down the "dangerous escaped criminal" B-127. While Burns is doubtful, Powell, enthusiastic at the prospect of first contact with an [[alien]] species, eagerly agrees to talk to his superiors about the matter.

Bumblebee and Charlie bond in a secluded forest, but when Bee's chest starts sparking from the damage he took during his fight with Sector Seven, Charlie attempts to fix it, only to activate a holographic message sent by Optimus Prime accidentally. While the message is garbled and incomplete, hearing it jolts a memory in Bumblebee...

''Leaping from the collapsing launchpad and latching onto a Seeker to make his way down, Optimus fights his way through several Seekers before Soundwave deploys [[Ravage (ROTF)|Ravage]] to attack him. Prime manages to fight off the feline minion with some effort, but his distraction has allowed dozens of Decepticons, including Soundwave, Shockwave, and Starscream, to surround him. The Decepticons move in to attack the Autobot leader even as B-127 watches, unable to help, from his departing escape pod...''

[[File:BBfilm-Charlie-Bumblebee-hugs.jpg|thumb|300px]]
Charlie realizes that Bumblebee is on the run from something serious. When he attempts to use his broken radio, she decides she can at least fix that, and they return to her garage, where she sets about extracting the radio from the Corvette. Bumblebee starts playing a video, which turns out to be footage of her last dive meet made by her father shortly before his death. She installs the radio in Bumblebee, though he forcefully ejects the music tapes she inserts into him. While she's looking through her tapes, he starts thumbing through her father's L.P.s, and she scolds him. However, after she notices a specific record, her mood changes, and she starts playing it, recalling how she and her father used to listen to it while working on the Corvette. She tells Bee how her father died of a heart attack, and she's continued working on the car in his memory.

At Sector Seven, [[General Whalen]] leads a discussion over whether to allow the Decepticons access to their equipment. Burns believes they can't trust the Decepticons, but Whalen promises to turn them over to him once they track down B-127. Shatter and Dropkick are duly introduced to Sector Seven's array of computers, though they're more interested in the telephone network.

[[File:BBfilm-Charlie-Memo-ride-in-Bumblebee.jpg|thumb|300px|left]]
As Bumblebee plays with his new radio, Charlie's neighbor [[Memo]] stumbles into the garage, intending to ask Charlie on a date, and is shocked at the sight of the giant robot. Charlie swears him to secrecy, and the pair go for a drive in Bumblebee. Charlie borrows Memo's shirt so she can show off by "driving" blindfolded, and they hang out of Bumblebee's sunroof.

Dr. Powell marvels over the radio at the massive worldwide interconnected web the Decepticons are constructing using the computers and telephone network to track [[energon]] signatures. Burns still has his misgivings, but Whalen believes they can turn the technology on the Decepticons.

Still driving in Bumblebee, Charlie and Memo realize that the reason the Autobot has been playing with his radio is to teach himself to speak with it. They arrive at a cliff by the seaside, where [[Tripp Summers]] challenges Charlie to dive off the cliff. When she's unable, despite urging from Bumblebee, she's cruelly mocked by Tina. Though Charlie claims not to be bothered, Memo and Bumblebee both want revenge. That night, they head to Tina's house and attempt to educate Bumblebee on the art of throwing toilet paper and eggs; this doesn't go well, culminating in Bumblebee enthusiastically jumping on Tina's car and the trio making a quick getaway before she emerges to find the damage. Their frantic driving is spotted by [[Sheriff Lock]], who gives chase in his cruiser. Bumblebee is easily able to outmaneuver Lock's vehicle, which ends up totaled as a result. The three fugitives return to Charlie's home, where they say their goodnights.

[[File:Bumblebee vs sofa.jpg|thumb|300px|"I told you, stop flying in the house!"]]
The next morning, Charlie tells Bumblebee he needs to stay in the garage as the authorities will be looking for him, and leaves for her job. Bumblebee instead ends up following Conan into the house, and his curious exploration ends up demolishing just about everything in the living room and kitchen. Finally, he ends up plugging himself into a wall socket, causing an energon-infused power surge that travels down nearby power lines. The equipment at Sector Seven detects the surge, and the Decepticons roll out, closely followed by Burns and his men. Memo also notices the commotion, so he calls Charlie, who returns home where the pair survey the devastation. Memo manages to get Bumblebee back into the garage, but Charlie realizes she's screwed. Meanwhile, the Decepticons have reached Brighton Falls.

Sally returns home with Otis to find the destruction. An argument ensues between her and Charlie, who ends up storming out. Charlie and Memo go driving to cool off, but they run into a roadblock set up by Sector Seven. Charlie tries to keep Bumblebee calm, but when the Sector Seven soldiers seize her, Bumblebee transforms and carries her off. Unfortunately, they immediately run into Shatter and Dropkick, who attempt to interrogate Bumblebee but are perplexed when the Autobot doesn't try to fight back. Burns and his men arrive and start zapping Bee with electrical guns, and Charlie gets knocked out when she attempts to help him.

[[File:BBfilm-interrogation.jpg|thumb|300px|left|"Remember what Van said, why is your life more valuable than mine?" "Funny, I just can't seem to recall that!"]]
Charlie wakes up in her bed and emerges from her room to find Agent Burns telling her parents that she had stolen valuable government equipment. Despite her protests, her mom banishes her back to her room. She promptly slips out through her window, and Otis catches her trying to get Memo's attention by throwing rocks at his window. She manages to stop him from alerting her mother. Joining Memo in his house, they watch a news report about Sector Seven setting up shop at [[McKinnon Air Base]], and Charlie reasons that's where they're holding Bumblebee. Otis is assigned to keep the plan secret while Charlie and Memo head to the base.

At the airbase, Powell watches the two Decepticons interrogate Bumblebee. Charlie and Memo sneak into the base in time to watch as the Decepticons inadvertently trigger Optimus Prime's recording, revealing that the Autobots are coming to Earth. As the Decepticons discuss the presented opportunity, Powell realizes their mistake in cooperating with the giant evil robots and tries to radio a warning to Burns before Dropkick kills him.

Sally and Ron pick over the debris in their house, and Otis is entirely unsuccessful at convincing them that Charlie is still in her room.

[[File:BBFilm-Charlie-Bee-touch-hands.jpg|thumb|300px]]
Shatter locates a nearby communications tower they can use to call in the Decepticon army. Once Dropkick blasts Bumblebee, the pair depart, and Charlie and Memo run to the lifeless Autobot's side. Charlie believes they can still revive him using the electrical guns, and though at first, it seems as though she's unsuccessful, Bumblebee sits up, and his memories start to restore. Agent Burns and his men arrive outside and blow up the exterior door before advancing inside. Charlie tells Bumblebee to run as the troops attempt to take her and Memo away, but the soldiers harpoon Bee. It's not until Burns throws Charlie to the ground that Bumblebee finds the strength to get up and start blasting, unfazed by anything the humans throw at him. Sector Seven retreats, but Charlie has to talk Bumblebee down. Charlie tries to persuade him that they need to hide, but Bumblebee is set on stopping the Decepticons. While Charlie leaves in Bee, Memo tries unsuccessfully to slow down the pursuing Sector Seven vehicles.

As Bumblebee and Charlie race through Brighton Falls, pursued by Sector Seven, they're joined by Sally and Ron in the station-wagon. Though Ron manages to obstruct Burns's vehicle successfully, he ends up spinning out as they approach a set of traffic lights, and there's an almost-pileup as multiple vehicles skid to a halt just inches from hitting each other. Shatter and Dropkick blend their technology into the communications tower at the port in preparation to send their message. Bumblebee arrives and has Charlie hide in a garbage bin for protection before he begins shooting the tower, prompting Dropkick to descend and engage the Autobot in a fierce fight. An errant missile throws Charlie from her hiding place, and, seeing Bumblebee occupied, she heads for the tower. Narrowly avoiding Bumblebee and Dropkick's fight, she starts ascending a nearby crane. Burns also arrives in a helicopter, ordering the pilot to open fire on the communications tower. The battle below moves into a dry dock, with Dropkick transforming to helicopter mode to fire at Bumblebee. Bumblebee throws a chain that hits the Decepticon's rotors, wrapping around Dropkick as he changes to robot mode and allowing Bumblebee to terminate him.

Charlie reaches the top of the crane and jumps across to the tower. Above her, Shatter shoots down the Sector Seven helicopter, sending it plunging towards the ground. Bumblebee manages to grab it before it can crash, saving Burns's life. Charlie moves to disconnect the Cybertronian power source, and when Shatter transforms into jet mode to stop her, Bumblebee shoots down the Decepticon. During the ensuing fight on the ground, Charlie successfully disconnects the tower's power source.

[[File:BBfilm-Charlie-Bee-underwater.jpg|thumb|300px|left|"You snap out of it!" "''You'' snap out of it!"]]
An enraged Shatter pounds on Bumblebee, who shoots the wall of the dry dock. Shatter mocks him for missing until the wall gives way, and Shatter gets crushed between a ship and the side of the dock. As Bumblebee sinks to the bottom of the flooded dock, Charlie overcomes her fear and dives in, finding Bumblebee at the bottom and helping him to get back to the surface. Finally seeing Bumblebee's true nature, Burns tells the pair they need to make their escape before the rest of Sector Seven arrives, and as they leave, Memo turns up just slightly too late to save the world.

[[File:BB-GoldenGateBridge.jpg|thumb|300px|"Beautiful day to fly." "Sure is."]]
Bumblebee and Charlie end up on a hill overlooking the [[Golden Gate Bridge]], where Charlie tells the Autobot that she can't interfere with his greater purpose, and they have to go their separate ways. After a tearful farewell, Bumblebee scans a passing Camaro as his new alternate mode and drives off to rendezvous with Optimus Prime on the bridge, leaving to continue his mission. Charlie returns home and reunites with her family and Memo.

That night in a nearby forest, Optimus commends Bumblebee on keeping Earth safe, as the two watch more Autobot refugees appear in the sky over Earth. Not far away, Charlie successfully gets the Corvette running and takes it for a first drive.
{{-}}

==Cast==
{{featuredcharacters|
h1=[[Autobot]]s|c1=
*[[Bumblebee (Movie)|Bumblebee]] ([[Dylan O'Brien]])
*[[Optimus Prime (Movie)|Optimus Prime]] ([[Peter Cullen]])
*[[Cliffjumper (Movie)|Cliffjumper]] ([[Andrew Morgado]])
*[[Ratchet (Movie)|Ratchet]] ([[Dennis Singletary]])
*[[Arcee (Movie)|Arcee]] ([[Grey Griffin]])
*[[Wheeljack (Movie)|Wheeljack]] ([[Steve Blum]])
*[[Brawn (ROTF)|Brawn]] ([[Kirk Baily]])
*[[Ironhide (Movie)|Ironhide]]
*Autobot soldiers

|h2=[[Decepticon]]s|c2=
*[[Shatter]] ([[Angela Bassett]])
*[[Dropkick (Movie)|Dropkick]] ([[Justin Theroux]])
*[[Blitzwing (BB)|Blitzwing]] ([[David Sobolov]])
*[[Soundwave (ROTF)|Soundwave]] ([[Jon Bailey]])
**[[Ravage (ROTF)|Ravage]]
*[[Shockwave (Movie)|Shockwave]] (Jon Bailey)
*[[Starscream (Movie)|Starscream]]
*[[Thundercracker (Movie)|Thundercracker]]†
*[[Thrust (Movie)|Thrust]]†
*[[Seeker (Movie)|Seekers]] (Kirk Baily; [[#Transformers references|see below]])

|h3=[[Human]]s|c3=
*[[Charlie Watson]] ([[Hailee Steinfeld]])
*[[Memo]] ([[Jorge Lendeborg Jr.]])
*[[Sally Watson]] ([[Pamela Adlon]])
*[[Otis Watson]] ([[Jason Drucker]])
*[[Ron (BB)|Ron]] ([[Stephen Schneider]])
*[[Uncle Hank]] ([[Len Cariou]])
*[[Craig (BB)|Craig]] ([[Kollin Holtz]])
*[[Tina Lark]] ([[Gracie Dzienny]])
*[[Tina's girlfriends]] ([[Isabelle Ellingson]], [[Mika Kubo]])
*[[Tripp Summers]] ([[Ricardo Hoyos]])
*[[Sheriff Lock]] ([[Fred Dryer]])
*[[Roy (BB)|Roy]] ([[Lenny Jacobson]])
*[[Amber]] ([[Megyn Price]])
*[[Charlie's dad]] ([[Tim Martin Gleason]])
*[[Bill (BB)|Bill]] ([[Antonio D. Charity]])
'''[[Sector Seven]]'''
*[[Jack Burns]] ([[John Cena]])
*[[Dr. Powell]] ([[John Ortiz]])
*[[General Whalen]] ([[Glynn Turman]])
*[[Seymour Simmons]] ([[Nick Pilla]])
*[[Danny Bell]] ([[Edwin Hodge]])

|h4=Others|c4=
*[[Conan]] ([[Sterling (dog)|Sterling]])
|nonumbering=true
}}

† The individual Seekers are identified as such in packaging bios for ''Studio Series'' toys of characters featured in the film.

==Quotes==
"I'll never talk." 
"Is that right? Then let's make it official."
:—'''Bumblebee''' and '''Blitzwing''', right before the latter destroys the former's voice box.

"If ''you'' won't tell us where Prime is, perhaps your young friend will." 
"''Never''." 
"You're a brave warrior. You deserve a better death...then again..."
:—'''Shatter''' and '''Cliffjumper''', right before Dropkick executes the latter.

"I like the way they ''pop.''" 
"''Focus,'' comrade."
:—'''Dropkick''' and '''Shatter''', after the former kills a human bystander.

"I say this with all due respect...have you lost your damn mind?!" 
"''That'' was with all due respect?"
:—'''Agent Burns''' and '''Dr. Powell''' debate.

"They literally call themselves Decepticons. That doesn't set off any red flags?"
:—'''Agent Burns''' doesn't trust the giant alien robots.

"Look, I know what you saw is a little crazy. I can explain. ... Yeah, I can't explain, but here's the deal: If you tell anyone what you just saw, I'm going to have to run you over with my car." 
"...Jeez!" 
"...I don't mean that in a mean way, okay?"
:—'''Charlie''' and '''Memo'''

"Ron! We have a kid in the car!" 
"I was trying to save the other kid! What was I...It was a lose-lose!"
:—'''Sally''' and '''Ron'''

"You think these little chains can hold-"
:—'''Dropkick''' before being sliced to pieces by said little chains.

"Thank you...so much...for giving me...my voice." 
"Thank you for...for making me feel like me again."
:—'''Bumblebee''' and '''Charlie''' say their goodbyes.

"No way. You kidding me? You're telling me you could've been a Camaro this whole time?"
:—'''Charlie''' sees Bumblebee has one last trick up his sleeve.

"Old friend, you kept this planet safe. Because of you, we have a future, B-127." 
"My name... is... Bumblebee."
:—'''Optimus Prime''' thanks the newly-rechristened '''Bumblebee'''.

==Continuity notes==
As a prequel to the rest of the live-action film series, ''Bumblebee'' includes set-up elements for several of them:

* Ancillary media dating back to [[2007]] has primarily credited [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]] with inflicting the injuries that caused Bumblebee to lose his voice (with both the [[Aligned continuity family]] and the [[Transformers: Cyberverse (cartoon)|''Cyberverse'' cartoon]] adapting the idea for their continuities), but internal to the films themselves, no specifics were ever provided, with "damage in battle" being the only reason given for the little Autobot's muteness. ''Bumblebee'' tells the on-screen version of the story, revealing that Blitzwing was the culprit.
* Meanwhile, Megatron himself is notably absent from the film's Cybertron-set prelude since, per the first movie's events, he is frozen on Earth at the time.
* The first film introduced Sector 7 and their [[Hoover Dam]] headquarters. A young [[Seymour Simmons]] (played by [[John Turturro]] in the present-day films) appears among the organization's ranks.
* Thanks to Charlie fitting him with a working radio, Bumblebee learns how to "speak" by using snippets of music to express himself, which is, of course, how he communicates in all the other films.
* Burns warns Whalen of the potential for Decepticon attacks on Earth, citing [[Washington, D.C.]], [[New York City]] and [[Chicago]] as possible targets. All three of these cities experienced Decepticon activity in other ''Transformers'' films: New York in ''[[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (film)|Revenge of the Fallen]]'', and D.C. and Chicago in ''[[Transformers: Dark of the Moon (film)|Dark of the Moon]]''.
* At the end of the movie, Bumblebee scans the [[1977]] Camaro mode that he had at the start of the original ''Transformers'' film.

Despite its notional "prequel" status, the film underwent significant reshoots ([[#Changes before, during and after production|see below]]) that resulted in the deletion, alteration, and addition of scenes that create disjointedness between ''Bumblebee'' and the rest of the film series; even by the film series' usual ''laissez-faire'' approach to continuity. The breaks in continuity lead many fans to consider it a "stealth reboot" similar to ''{{w|X-Men: First Class}}''.

* The ''big'' principal continuity-breaker is that the film completely throws out ''[[Transformers: The Last Knight (film)|The Last Knight]]'''s premise that Bumblebee and the Autobots were active on Earth during significant periods throughout history, such as the {{w|American Revolutionary War}}, the {{w|Napoleonic Wars}}, [[World War I]], [[World War II]] and so on, and instead shows Bumblebee to have first come to Earth in [[1987]]. By extension, this also throws the film's [[Transformers: Bumblebee Movie Prequel|prequel comic]], which also operated on ''The Last Knight''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s premise, out the window.
* More circumstantially, the film's aesthetics are notably different, hewing much closer to Generation 1. Cybertron itself closely resembles its Generation 1 design instead of the "honeycomb" design seen in ''Dark of the Moon'' and ''The Last Knight''. Bumblebee's '77 Camaro robot-mode body, seen in the film's mid-credits sequence, is entirely different from his 2007 film appearance, instead depicted as a variation of the body used through the rest of this film.
* Sector 7 refers to their meeting with Shatter and Dropkick as "first contact," which feels a little off since, according to the first film, they've kept the AllSpark and the frozen Megatron in their Hoover Dam base since the early 20th century. Neither Megatron nor the AllSpark are mentioned in the movie's final cut, with Dropkick and Shatter showing no awareness of them despite being allowed into the base where Sector 7 keeps them—but these aren't really true inter-movie continuity-breaking discrepancies, as the same thing happened in the ''original'' cut of the film, where Megatron ''did'' appear in Sector Seven's possession in a mid-credits scene (again [[#Changes before, during, and after production|see below]]).
* In-keeping with the AllSpark going unmentioned, the Autobots leave Cybertron because they are on the losing end of the war, with Bumblebee going to Earth to establish a fallback position for his comrades, rather than to search for the cube. This isn't particularly incompatible with the information provided in the first film; however, the fact that the Autobots are seen arriving on Earth at the end in 1987 when the first film showed them coming in 2007 is more incongruous. There's nothing to say they won't leave again over the following 20 years to search other planets and systems for the AllSpark, as mentioned in the first film's prologue, only to return when Bumblebee discovers it was on Earth all along—but as we said, this movie doesn't mention that. Notably, having Bumblebee lose his voice ''after'' coming to Earth actually ''necessitates'' a meeting between 'Bee and the other Autobots before the first movie. Ratchet noted in that film that he'd been trying to fix Bumblebee's voice for a while, meaning his arrival in 2007 couldn't be the first time he'd seen Bumblebee since he lost his voice.

==Transformers references==

[[File:BBfilm-Optimus-Prime-leaps-into-battle.jpg|thumb|300px|"All right, scramble, jocks! It's time to fly."]]
*During the opening battle on Cybertron, the Autobots' weapons fire orange laser blasts, while the Decepticons' fire blue ones, replicating the color-coded blaster fire of the [[The Transformers (cartoon)|Generation 1 cartoon]] (though there, the Decepticons' weapons fire ''purple'' blasts).
*Optimus Prime's entrance into the battle on Cybertron is a direct reference to his famous leap into action from ''[[The Transformers: The Movie]]''.
*In another seeming ''The Movie'' homage, Brawn is downed by a shot to the shoulder during his cameo. This time, however, he survives and is seen among the Autobots getting into the escape pods.
*The well-known Autobots are accompanied by [[generic]] recolors of Ironhide with one of two new heads.<ref name="ILM">[https://www.ilm.com/visual_development/bumblebee-developing-an-epic-set-piece BUMBLEBEE: DEVELOPING AN EPIC SET PIECE] at ILM</ref>
*The Seekers' Cybertronian alternate modes are loosely inspired by their "tetrajet" modes from the [[More than Meets the Eye, Part 1|first Generation 1 episode]].
*Starscream is the only "unique" Seeker to appear during the film's Cybertron sequences. The rest of their forces are made up of countless robots that recycle five generic designs: blue-and-white (based on [[Thundercracker (G1)|Generation 1 Thundercracker]]), [[:File:BB-Skywarp-concept.jpg|purple-and-grey]] (based on [[Skywarp (G1)|Generation 1 Skywarp]]), [[:File:BB-Thrust-concept.jpg|green-and-grey]] (based on [[Thrust (Armada)|''Armada'' Thrust]]),<ref name="ILM" /> teal-and-white, and grey-and-red. The "Thrust" model has a triangular protrusion position behind its head, loosely replicating the character's "[[Conehead]]" appearance without actually giving him a genuine conehead.
**While it is hard to determine which (if any!) of these generic robots are the ''actual'' movie universe incarnations of [[Thundercracker (Movie)|Thundercracker]], [[Skywarp (Movie)|Skywarp]], and [[Thrust (Movie)|Thrust]], ''Studio Series'' toy bios help clear matters up: the ''real'' Thrust is stated to be the one who joins Starscream in "blast[ing] the Autobot[s'] launchpad with missile fire to stop their escape from Cybertron".
**Of course, the [[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (Xbox 360/PS3/PC)|console version of the ''Revenge of the Fallen'' game]] features [[Seeker Warrior]]s colored like Thundercracker, [[Seeker Sniper]]s colored like Skywarp, and [[Seeker Scout]]s colored like Thrust. Coincidence?
*As Optimus calls retreat, Arcee and Cliffjumper wield pistols that are a direct design match to the "generic" pistol design used for Autobots in season 2 of the Generation 1 cartoon.
*The Cybertron tower containing the launchpad is based on the [[Great Dome]].<ref name="ILM" />
*[[Shockwave (Movie)|Shockwave's]] eye flickers very subtly during his brief line of dialogue like his [[Shockwave (G1)|Generation 1 counterpart]].
*[[Shatter]], according to Travis Knight, is based on [[Nightbird (G1)|Nightbird]].
*The concept of Cybertron falling into Decepticon hands and the Autobots initiating a mass exodus originates from the Aligned continuity family, although in this case, the Autobots depart in individual escape pods instead of [[Ark (disambiguation)|a single gargantuan starship]].
*[[Teletraan-I]] can be sighted in the background as the Autobots enter their escape pods.
*Blitzwing drops a well-known [[Furmanism]] as he fights B-127, stating that the Autobot will "[[Furmanism#DIE SCREAMING|die screaming]]... like [B-127's] friends!"
[[File:BBFilm-Optimus-as-Freightliner.jpg|thumb|300px]]
*Memo is reading a copy of [[GoBots|''GoBots Magazine'']], which he tosses aside when he sees Charlie. Though ''GoBots Magazine'' was a real publication, the issue Memo reads isn't one of the five real-life issues that exist; however, it faithfully emulates their cover style, down to the "Collector Poster Inside" cover tag. In a deleted scene, Memo even theorizes that Bumblebee is a GoBot.
*A snippet of "[[The Touch]]" plays when Bumblebee is "encouraging" Charlie to dive from the cliff.
*The fight between Bumblebee and Dropkick includes a sequence where Dropkick picks up Bumblebee and throws him. Then the Autobot lands in car mode, veers around, and jumps to punch him in the face—which harkens back to the fight choreography between [[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]] and [[Jazz (G1)|Jazz]] from the G1 cartoon's season 1 opening credits.
*Optimus' vehicle mode at the end of the film is a Freightliner cab-over truck ''very'' similar to his G1 counterpart. He's even pulling the classic trailer, which has the signature 'stripe' on its side!

==Real-life references==
*One of the vehicles Bumblebee rejects scanning is the Urban Assault Vehicle from ''{{w|Stripes (film)|Stripes}}''.
*Charlie has a poster for the rock band {{w|The Pretenders}}, which coincidentally is the name of a Transformers [[Pretender|sub group]] involving the robots disguising themselves as human.
*Throughout the film, Charlie wears band shirts for {{w|Elvis Costello and the Attractions}}, {{w|Motörhead}}, {{w|The Damned (band)|The Damned}}, {{w|The Rolling Stones}}, and {{w|The Smiths}}.
*Charlie eats {{w|Mr. T Cereal}}.
*The Watson family dog, Conan, is named after {{w|Conan the Barbarian}}.
*Uncle Hank and Charlie's family watch ''[[ALF]]'', a sitcom from the '80s about an alien taking refuge in a human home. Fitting. However, see Errors.
*The station wagon Charlie's family drives is based on the one in ''{{w|National Lampoon's Vacation}}''.
*Cliffjumper repeats his name and rank while being interrogated by Shatter and Dropkick, which references a real-life rule in the {{w|Geneva Convention}} that states these are the only things soldiers have to divulge under interrogation. More specifically, this references a typical exaggeration in film and TV in which soldiers ''only recite these'' in response to their captors.
*The transmission that Cliffjumper and the Decepticons pick up from B-127 is the theme song to ''[[Cheers]]''.
*Dropkick and Shatter's arrival on Earth almost mirrors the appearance of the Bug in ''{{w|Men in Black (1997 film)|Men in Black}}''.
*Bumblebee watches ''{{w|The Breakfast Club}}'', leading to him emulating [[Judd Nelson]]'s iconic fist pump several times throughout the rest of the film.
*After repairing Bumblebee's radio, Charlie inserts a cassette of The Smiths' album ''{{w|Strangeways, Here We Come}}'' and "{{w|Girlfriend in a Coma (song)|Girlfriend in a Coma}}" briefly plays before Bee ejects the tape.
*Charlie also tries inserting a cassette of the [[Rick Astley]] album ''{{w|Whenever You Need Somebody}}'', causing it to play a snippet from "{{w|Never Gonna Give You Up}}".
[[File:BBfilm-cassette-drawer.jpg|thumb|300px]]
*Other musicians featured in Charlie's drawer of cassettes include {{w|Joan Jett}}, {{w|Adam and the Ants}}, {{w|Guns N' Roses}}, {{w|Talking Heads}}, {{w|INXS}}, {{w|Pink Floyd}}, {{w|Oingo Boingo}}, {{w|Huey Lewis and the News}}, and {{w|Prism (band)|PRiSM}}. She also mentions {{w|Stevie Nicks}} and The Rolling Stones while searching for tapes.
*The record Charlie takes from her father's collection is {{w|Sam Cooke}}'s 1961 album ''Sam's Songs'', and when she puts it on, Sam Cooke's version of "{{w|Unchained Melody}}" plays. However, see Errors. Also seen in the collection of records is {{w|Roxy Music}}'s ''{{w|For Your Pleasure}}''.
*Shatter asks Powell to "take [the Decepticons] to your leader," referencing the ages-old trope from early alien-related science fiction.
*The letters 'BFG' are written on Charlie's jean jacket, a reference to ''{{w|The BFG}}'', a children's book about a young girl befriending a big, friendly giant and defeating a group of evil giants together. Also quite fitting.
*Sector Seven uses a variant of the WOPR supercomputer from ''{{w|WarGames}}''.
*While looking around the Watsons' house, Bumblebee is briefly intrigued by a can of {{w|Tab (drink)|Tab}} soda and a game of ''{{w|Pong}}'' running on an [[Atari, Inc.|Atari 2600]]. However, see Errors.
*Otis wears a {{w|Bruce Lee}} T-shirt during the third act.
*Memo's room has posters for ''{{w|The Thing (1982 film)|The Thing}}'', ''[[Indiana Jones|Raiders of the Lost Ark]]'', Tom Baker-era ''[[Doctor Who]]'', and a {{w|Heather Thomas}} pin-up.
*Bumblebee's rampage is a direct nod to the 1999 [[Warner Bros.]] animated film ''{{w|The Iron Giant}}'', in which the titular robot protagonist assaults the U.S. military with glowing red optics in retaliation for them harming his human best friend.
*Ron claims he learned his driving skills from ''{{w|Miami Vice}}''.

==Errors==
*The episode of ''ALF'' that Charlie's family watch is episode 20 of season 2, "You Ain't Nothin' But a Hound Dog". The episode originally aired on February 29, 1988, a year after the movie is meant to occur.
*Charlie starts playing the first track on Sam Cooke's album ''Sam's Songs'', which ought to have been "Little Things You Do" rather than "Unchained Melody". The latter song doesn't even appear on the album, being the last track on side A of Cooke's earlier release ''Hits of the 50's''.
*Powell remarks that the Decepticon modifications to the S7 computers have created an "interconnected web of information," implying that the Internet's technology originated from the Decepticons. However, the idea of an interconnected network of computers for communications and data transfer was developing for decades before the film's setting in the late 1980s. The term "Internet" first appeared in the mid-1970s.
*Bumblebee watches a game of ''Pong'' running on the Atari 2600 plugged into the Watsons' television. However, ''Pong'' was never released as a standalone game for the 2600, only appearing as part of the ''{{w|Video Olympics}}'' game compilation, which featured a colorized remake that looked entirely different from the classic black-and-white version shown on the screen. The paddles are also seen moving on their own, despite no one touching the controllers and the game lacking an attract mode.
*Simmons identifies Brighton Falls as a "coastal town."However, both the {{w|Richmond–San Rafael Bridge}} and {{w|Marin Islands|East Marin Island}} can be seen in the background of the Watsons' house establishing shots, which would place Brighton Falls within the San Francisco Bay, not quite on the coast. Furthermore, this causes problems with the [[Brighton Falls Boardwalk]], which faces the ocean… maybe Brighton Falls is just a ''very'' large town?

==Tie-in material==
*''[[Transformers: Bumblebee Movie Prequel]]''
During the lead-up to the release of the movie [[IDW Publishing]] released a four-issue limited series detailing an adventure set in the 60s, during which Bumblebee works with British intelligence to foil the plans of a group of Decepticons, including Blitzwing. It seems likely that author [[John Barber]] was working off an earlier draft of the film, which simply began with Bumblebee already on Earth in the time frame between ''The Last Knight'' and ''Bumblebee''.

*"[[Sector 7 Adventures: The Battle at Half Dome]]"
A one-shot promotional comic, that was released as [[pack-in material]] with the home video release and as a motion comic among the film's special features. The comic follows [[Seymour Simmons]] two years after the film's events, and serves to help bridge the gap between ''Bumblebee'' and the 2007 film.

==Music==
Two albums were released for the film:
*''[[Bumblebee (Motion Picture Score)]]'' - showcasing composer [[Dario Marianelli]]'s score for the film.
*''[[Bumblebee (Motion Picture Soundtrack)]]'' - featuring the film's diegetic music as well as Hailee Steinfeld's end credits song, "Back to Life."

==Home video releases==
{{main|Bumblebee (film)/home video}}
''Bumblebee'' was released on digital platforms on [[March 19]]; and on DVD, Blu-ray, and 4K on [[April 2]]. A limited edition VHS copy was sent out as a promotional item, but was not available at retail.<ref>[https://news.tfw2005.com/2019/04/01/transformers-bumblebee-movie-out-now-on-vhs-real-vhs-promo-copy-with-pics-386407 TFW2005 VHS coverage]</ref>

==Theatrical posters==
<center><gallery>
File:BumblebeeCharlieSilhouettePoster.jpg|Yellow-black,
File:BumblebeeCrouchingPoster.jpg|yellow-black,
File:BumblebeeUSMoviePoster.jpeg|yellow-black,
File:BumblebeeMovieNewPoster.jpeg|yellow-black...
File:BumblebeePosingPoster.jpg|Ooh, black and yellow!
File:BumblebeeBurnsDecepticons.jpg|Yeah, let's shake it up a little.
</gallery></center>

==Reception==
{{quote|Mankind has split the atom, sent a man to the moon, and now, in arguably its most unlikely achievement, it has produced a watchable ''Transformers'' movie.|Scott Tobias|[http://www.npr.org/2018/12/20/677501424/flight-of-the-bumblebee-transformers-flick-soars-over-low-franchise-expectations NPR review]}}

Coming off the notoriously poor reception to ''The Last Knight,'' ''Bumblebee'' had a ways to go in terms of redeeming the ''Transformers'' film franchise for both Paramount and the general movie-going public. However, the film was positively received by critics, who generally praised Travis Knight's restrained directorial approach, Hailee Steinfeld's acting, the [[The Transformers (cartoon)|Generation 1]]-styled robot designs, and Charlie and Bumblebee's dynamic, comparing the film to its spiritual predecessors, ''{{w| E.T. the Extraterrestrial|E.T.}}'' and ''{{w|The Iron Giant}}''. The film currently holds a 92% and a "Certified Fresh" rating on Rotten Tomatoes. <ref> [https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/bumblebee/ ''Bumblebee'' review on Rotten Tomatoes] </ref>

After making $500,000 at 325 theaters from its December 8 preview screenings, <ref> [https://deadline.com/2018/12/aquaman-sneak-preview-box-office-amazon-prime-1202521144/ ‘Aquaman’ Amazon Prime Previews Hook Near $3M Besting ‘Jumanji 2’] </ref> ''Bumblebee'' made its domestic opening alongside ''{{w|Aquaman (film)|Aquaman}}'', ''{{w|Welcome to Marwen}}'', and ''{{w|Second Act (film)|Second Act}}'', and proceeded to gross $21 million over its first weekend, finishing third behind ''Aquaman'' and ''{{w|Mary Poppins Returns}}''. <ref> [https://deadline.com/2018/12/aquaman-bumblebee-christmas-thursday-night-previews-weekend-box-office-1202524462/ 'Aquaman’ Unwraps $22M+ On Christmas For $105M+ Cume; ‘Holmes & Watson’ Opens To $6M+; ‘Vice’ $4M+] </ref> In its second weekend, ''Bumblebee'' grossed another $20.5 million, remaining in third place. <ref>[https://deadline.com/2018/12/aquaman-mary-poppins-returns-bumblebee-new-years-weekend-box-office-1202526812/ 'Aquaman’ Sailing To $52M+ 2nd Weekend; $189M+ Cume Pacing Ahead Of ‘Doctor Strange’ & ‘Guardians Of The Galaxy’]</ref> ''Bumblebee'' ended its domestic box office run on March 7, 2019, with a total domestic gross of $127.2 million, and earned an additional $340.8 million overseas (including $170.8 million from China) for a worldwide total gross of $468 million. <ref>[https://www.boxofficemojo.com/title/tt4701182/?ref_=bo_se_r_1 Bumblebee - Box Office Mojo]</ref> While that total makes it the lowest-grossing entry in the live-action film series to date, Viacom CEO Bob Bakish stated in January 2019 that ''Bumblebee'' was "solidly profitable," praising the film's performance as a turnaround for Paramount following the money-losing ''The Last Knight'',<ref>[https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/viacom-ceo-says-hes-mulling-small-acquisition-targets-1175029 Viacom CEO Says He's Mulling Small Acquisition Targets]</ref> which ''did'' make more money but not enough to recoup its monstrous budget.

In 2019, ''Bumblebee'' became the first ''Transformers'' film since the 2007 film not to be nominated for any {{w|Golden Raspberry Award}}s. Indeed, the film was one of those selected as a candidate for a {{w|The Razzie Redeemer Award|Razzie Redeemer Award}}, with the website praising the film's more "innocent and endearing" approach to the franchise. <ref>[https://razzies.com/razz-newz.html Razz Newz]</ref>

==Production staff==
{{stub}}

==Development details==
*March 27, 2015 — [[Paramount Pictures]] negotiates with [[Akiva Goldsman]], hiring him to create a "writer's room" with the intention of building a cinematic universe.<ref name="goldsman">[http://deadline.com/2015/03/transformers-akiva-goldsman-paramount-sequels-spinoffs-1201400027/ Paramount Enlisting Akiva Goldsman To Ramp Up 'Transformers' Output] on deadline.com</ref> Goldsman goes on to hire a number of writers over the next few months: [[Steven DeKnight]] (''Daredevil''),<ref>[http://www.denofgeek.com/movies/transformers-cinematic-universe/35696/transformers-cinematic-details-more-writers-over-10-films Transformers cinematic details]</ref> [[Robert Kirkman]] (''The Walking Dead''),<ref name="deadlinewritersroom">[http://deadline.com/2015/05/transformers-writers-robert-kirkman-zak-penn-art-marcum-matt-holloway-jeff-pinkner-1201430601/ 'Transformers' Spinoff & Sequel Scribes Set] on Deadline.com</ref> [[Art Marcum]] and [[Matt Holloway]] (''Iron Man''),<ref name="deadlinewritersroom" /> Christina Hodson (''Shut In'', ''The Fugitive''),<ref name="hodsonbeer">[http://www.comingsoon.net/movies/news/446175-christina-hodson-and-lindsey-beer-join-transformers-writing-team Christina Hodson and Lindsey Beer Join the Transformers Writing Team]</ref> [[Lindsey Beer]] (''Dig''),<ref name="hodsonbeer" /> [[Zak Penn]] (''Pacific Rim 2''),<ref name="deadlinewritersroom" /> [[Jeff Pinkner]] (''The Amazing Spider-Man 2'', ''Lost''),<ref name="deadlinewritersroom" /> [[Andrew Barrer]] and [[Gabriel Ferrari]] (''Ant-Man''),<ref name="barrerferrari">[http://deadline.com/2015/05/transformers-ant-man-andrew-barrer-gabriel-ferrari-cybertron-1201433402/ 'Ant-Man' Scribes Andrew Barrer & Gabriel Ferrari Join 'Transformers' Writers Room] on Deadline</ref> [[Ken Nolan]] (''Black Hawk Down''), and [[Geneva Robertson-Dworet]].<ref name="nolandworet">[http://www.slashfilm.com/transformers-writers-room/ Akiva Goldsman Teases 'Transformers' Franchise Plans]</ref> Involved in the pitching process are [[Steven Spielberg]], [[Michael Bay]], [[Brian Goldner]], [[Lorenzo di Bonaventura]], [[Mark Vahradian]], and [[Don Murphy]].<ref name="deadlinereveal">[http://deadline.com/2015/09/transformers-writers-room-akiva-goldsman-transformers-5-1201531918/ 'Transformers' Writers Room Wraps] on Deadline</ref>
*October 3, 2015 — During his keynote speech at the MIP Junior Conference, [[Allspark (company)|Allspark]]'s [[Stephen J. Davis]] notes that the writing team has come up with film concepts for Transformers 5, 6, 7, and 8.<ref name="stephendaviskeynote">[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_P2fw_DlS4?t=812 Stephen Davis's keynote speech] at MIPJunior.</ref>[[File:TransformersUniverseBumblebeePoster.jpg|thumb|right|200px|"My sweater is Ralph Lauren, and I have no pants."]]
*February 12, 2016 — At ToyFair, Hasbro reveals the projected release date of Transformers 6, along with those of its predecessor and [[Transformers: Rise of the Beasts|Transformers 7]], as well as the fact that Transformers 6 will focus on Bumblebee.<ref name="toyfairreveal">[http://news.tfw2005.com/2016/02/12/transformers-5-transformers-6-bumblebee-spin-off-movie-revealed-309503 Transformers 5, Transformers 6 And Bumblebee Spin-Off Movie Revealed] ToyFair news at TFW2005</ref>
*December 29, 2016 — Lorenzo di Bonaventura names Christina Hodson as the screenwriter in an interview.<ref name="hodson">[http://collider.com/transformers-5-plot-characters-dinobots-details/ 'The Last Knight' Producer Lorenzo di Bonaventura Reveals How a 'Transformers' Movie Is Made] on Collider</ref>
*March 3, 2017 — [[Travis Knight]] is appointed director.<ref name="deadlinedirector">[https://deadline.com/2017/03/bumblebee-movie-travis-knight-director-kubo-and-the-two-strings-1202034882/ Travis Knight To Direct ‘Transformers’ Spinoff ‘Bumblebee’ At Paramount]</ref>
*May 26, 2017 — A poster at Licensing Expo 2017 gives the name of the film as ''Transformers Universe: Bumblebee''.<ref name="expoposter">[https://www.cinemablend.com/news/1724400/the-bumblebee-movie-just-got-a-new-title-and-a-cool-80s-logo "The Bumblebee Movie Just Got A New Title And A Cool 80s Logo"]</ref>
*June 10, 2017 — [[Hailee Steinfeld]] reveals in an interview that she's been cast in the film.<ref>[http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/music/pitch-perfect-pop-star-hailee-steinfeld-hits-charts-with-most-girls-single-and-lands-transformers-role/news-story/47a238f0e75bf06a0ffc34a18e9906e4 Pitch Perfect pop star Hailee Steinfeld hits charts with Most Girls single and lands Transformers role]</ref>
*July 11, 2017 — [[Jorge Lendeborg Jr.]] is reported by The Hollywood Reporter to have been cast as the male lead.<ref>[http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/transformers-spinoff-bumblebee-casts-jorge-lendeborg-jr-as-male-lead-1017547 'Transformers' Spinoff 'Bumblebee' Casts Jorge Lendeborg Jr. as Male Lead (Exclusive)] on Hollywood Reporter</ref>
*July 13, 2017 — More actors including [[Jason Drucker]], [[Abby Quinn]], [[Rachel Crow]], [[Ricardo Hoyos]], and [[Gracie Dzienny]] join the cast.<ref>[http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/transformers-spinoff-bumblebee-rounds-cast-1019823 'Transformers' Spinoff 'Bumblebee' Rounds Out Cast (Exclusive)]</ref>
*July 23, 2017 — [[Pamela Adlon]] joins the cast.<ref>[http://deadline.com/2017/07/pamela-adlon-bumblebee-movie-transformers-casting-1202133812/ Pamela Adlon Joins Cast Of 'Transformers' Spinoff 'Bumblebee']</ref>
*July 31, 2017 — [[John Cena]] is announced as a cast member. Also, Bumblebee is a Volkswagen this time. The film is pushed back to December of 2018. Production begins,<ref name="cenareveal">[http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/john-cena-joins-transformers-spinoff-bumblebee-1025411 John Cena Joins 'Transformers' Spinoff 'Bumblebee' (Exclusive)] on Hollywood Reporter</ref> with the filming going under the codename "Brighton Falls".<ref>[https://screenrant.com/transformers-bumblebee-working-title-filming-start/ Bumblebee Spinoff Working Title & Filming Start Date Revealed] on Screenrant</ref>
*August 6, 2017 — Hailee Steinfeld reveals on Twitter that her character's name is [[Charlie Watson]].<ref>{{twitter|Meet Charlie Watson.
#BumblebeeTheMovie|https://twitter.com/haileesteinfeld/status/894296888643432448|Hailee Steinfeld|2017|08|06}}</ref>
*September 9, 2017 — At [[HasCon 2017]], di Bonaventura discusses some hints on the film, including that the movie is set in [[1986]].<ref>[http://news.tfw2005.com/2017/09/09/hascon-2017-bumblebee-movie-tidbits-348630 Hascon 2017: The Bumblebee Movie Tidbits] on TFW2005</ref>[[File:BumblebeeMovie firstlook.jpg|thumb|350px|"There's a bee in the car!"]]
*September 12, 2017 — Actor and stuntman [[Rory Markham]] reveals on Instagram that he is playing a [[Sector Seven]] agent named [[Agent Adams|Adams]]. <ref>[http://news.tfw2005.com/2017/09/12/sector-7-returns-transformers-universe-bumblebee-movie-348886 Sector 7 Returns in Transformers Universe: Bumblebee Movie] on TFW2005</ref>
*September 20, 2017 — Travis Knight reveals the first Decepticon vehicle mode in the form of a 1971 Plymouth GTX.<ref>{{twitter|LAIKA Pres & CEO Travis Knight on the set of his live-action film BUMBLEBEE. Travis will have more news on this & the next LAIKA film soon!|https://twitter.com/LAIKAStudios/status/910549230602788864|Laika Studios|2017|09|20}}</ref>
*October 2, 2017 — [[Peter Cullen]] has a role in the movie.<ref>[http://news.tfw2005.com/2017/10/02/peter-cullen-confirmed-bumblebee-movie-351131 Peter Cullen Confirmed In The Bumblebee Movie] on TFW2005</ref>
*October 26, 2017 — [[John Ortiz]] is revealed to be a cast member.<ref>[http://deadline.com/2017/10/john-ortiz-paramount-bumblebee-spinoff-peppermint-stxfilms-1202195412/ John Ortiz Cast In 'Bumblebee' Spinoff & 'Peppermint'] on Deadline.com</ref>
*November 12, 2017 — A wrap party for the movie reveals the movie's title as ''Bumblebee: The Movie''.<ref>[https://www.cinemablend.com/news/1724400/the-bumblebee-movie-just-got-a-new-title-and-a-cool-80s-logo The Bumblebee Movie Just Got A New Title And A Cool 80s Logo] on Cinema Blend</ref>
*December 11, 2017 — {{w|Martin Short}} is revealed to be doing some voice work for the film.<ref>[http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/attheshore/headliners/steve-martin-and-martin-short-head-to-borgata-for-an/article_7d516048-de98-11e7-9fa4-c7175ccf2b9d.html Steve Martin and Martin Short head to Borgata for an unforgettable evening] on pressofatlanticcity.com</ref>
*December 29, 2017 — A "first look" photo is released showing Hailee Steinfeld and Bumblebee's Volkswagen alternate mode.<ref>{{twitter|First Look at "Bumblebee" from @ParamountPics
with Hailee Steinfeld! #Bumblebee hits theaters on Dec. 21, 2018!|https://twitter.com/AwardsCircuit/status/946794788988293121|Clayton Davis|2017|12|29}}</ref>
*January 28, 2018 — During an interview at the Grammys, Hailee Steinfeld suggests Bumblebee may sing during the movie.<ref>[https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/lifestyle/8096803/hailee-steinfeld-hair-waves-2018-grammys-how-to Interview on Billboard.com]</ref>
*February 16, 2018 — At [[Toy Fair 2018]], Hasbro states that the film series will be reset after ''Bumblebee: The Movie''.<ref name="reboot" />
*April 24, 2018 — Footage of the film is shown at Cinemacon.<ref>[http://comicbook.com/movies/2018/04/26/first-bumblebee-footage-transformers-cinemacon/ First 'Bumblebee' Footage Previews the 'Transformers' Spinoff at CinemaCon] at comicbook.com</ref>
[[File:BumblebeeMovieShatter&Dropkick.jpeg|thumb|300px|"Thanks for the coffee. Sorry, I couldn't finish it. If I did, I'd be up the rest of my life."]]
*June 5, 2018 — The [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAIX12F6958 official teaser trailer] is posted by Paramount Pictures, also revealing the film's title has been shortened to just ''Bumblebee''.
*June 6, 2018 — [[Charlie Adler]] reveals he is not in ''Bumblebee''.<ref>{{twitter|Sadly no . But I’m sure whoever is doing it is wonderful ! It’s been a wonderful franchise for me for a long time and now some else’s turn !! Break a leg !|https://twitter.com/charlie_adler/status/1004401979597025280?s=19|Charlie Adler|2018|06|06}}</ref>
*June 8, 2018 — [[Starscream (Movie)|Starscream]] is initially stated to be in the film in a blog post on Paramount's parent company before his name is later scrubbed from the post afterward.<ref>[http://blog.viacom.com/2018/06/bumblebee-transforms-hailee-steinfelds-life-in-first-trailer/ Original text: "But things get hectic. The military lurks. So does dreaded Decepticon Starscream." Revised text: "But things get hectic. The military lurks. So does a dreaded Decepticon."]</ref>
*July 13, 2018 — Entertainment Weekly reveals [[Angela Bassett]] and [[Justin Theroux]] will voice new Decepticons [[Shatter]] and [[Dropkick (Movie)|Dropkick]] respectively.<ref>[http://ew.com/movies/2018/07/13/bumblebee-decepticon-trackers-first-look/ First Look: Bumblebee unveils two new Decepticon muscle cars]</ref>
*July 20, 2018 — A ''Bumblebee'' panel at the [[San Diego Comic-Con]] 2018 reveals more information on the film, such as details regarding the characters.<ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/transformers-bumblebee-movie-panel-in-hall-h-at-sdcc2018-jointhebuzz/41645/ Seibertron's coverage on the SDCC'18 Bumblebee panel.]</ref> Also, John Cena dressed as Bumblebee.<ref>{{twitter|I asked the fine folks @IGN
to help me find the true meaning of robot existence at #SDCC. But did I, as John Cena, find the answers to living as a Bumblebee? Let’s find out. @bumblebeemovie I asked the fine folks @IGN
to help me find the true meaning of robot existence at #SDCC. But did I, as John Cena, find the answers to living as a Bumblebee? Let’s find out. @bumblebeemovie
|https://twitter.com/JohnCena/status/1020800460125605890|John Cena|2018|07|20}}</ref>
*August 26-30, 2018 — [[David Sobolov]] confirms he is part of the cast of ''Bumblebee'' as the voice of [[Blitzwing (BB)|Blitzwing]].<ref>{{twitter|#Transformers fans... @ParamountPics
has given me the ok to reveal I’m playing a role in the upcoming epic @bumblebeemovie
! As of now I’m not authorized to tell you my character’s name. More news about that soon! Who do you think it is? @transformers
@tfw2005
@seibertroncom|https://twitter.com/volobos/status/1033867788824309760|David Sobolov|2018|08|26}}</ref><ref>{{twitter|#Transformers fans... It's time to reveal I'm the voice of Blitzwing in @bumblebeemovie ! Thank you TravisKnight and @ParamountPics for this exciting chance to work on another epic @transformers adventure.|https://twitter.com/volobos/status/1035346211392368640|David Sobolov|2018|08|30}}</ref> 
*September 22-23, 2018 — Three teasers were released on various platforms with many different languages, revealing [[Soundwave (ROTF)|Soundwave]] and [[Ravage (ROTF)|Ravage]]'s appearance in the movie. Additionally, shots were revealed of Optimus Prime's design, the three major Decepticons in the movie, and [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]. <ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/soundwave-and-optimus-prime-featured-in-teaser-for-next-bumblebee-movie-trailer/42075/ Seibertron's article including the two of the teasers released] and [https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/new-bumblebee-movie-teaser-with-blitzwing-and-barricade/42078/ an article with one of the teasers.]</ref>
*September 24, 2018 — The official trailer is uploaded by Paramount Pictures' YouTube channel, revealing (among other things) [[Shockwave (Movie)|Shockwave]] and the [[Seeker (Movie)|Seeker]]s' appearances in the movie. A second international trailer is released, showcasing some more scenes. An interview with Travis Knight on the new trailer is also published, revealing Starscream (''now'' it's legitimate) and [[Wheeljack (Movie)|Wheeljack]]'s appearance in ''Bumblebee''.<ref>[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcwmDAYt22k Bumblebee (2018) - New Official Trailer] and [https://www.cbr.com/bumblebee-international-trailer-optimus-prime-cybertron/ an article showcasing the international trailer.] [https://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/bumblebee-trailer-breakdown-travis-knight/ Interview with Knight.]</ref>
*September 27, 2018 - Before a special showing of [[The Transformers: The Movie|the animated movie]], another interview with Travis Knight and Hailee Steinfeld was seen AND a brief scene of Charlie and Bee's first interaction.
*November 13, 2018 - ''Bumblebee'' is rated PG-13 for sci-fi violence.<ref>[http://news.tfw2005.com/2018/11/13/transformers-bumblebee-movie-rated-pg-13-376496]</ref>
*November 23, 2018 - A new trailer is released showcasing some new scenes, namely, Bumblebee's Cybertronian robot mode. Another trailer is released animated with...[[Play-Doh]].<ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/bumblebees-cybertronian-mode-shown-in-a-new-movie-trailer-playdoh-trailer/42450/ Seibertron's article on the 2 new trailers]</ref>
*November 27, 2018 - A new featurette demonstrates the more G1-inspired designs of the Transformers, including a proper look at Optimus's model and brief shots of [[Arcee (Movie)|Arcee]], [[Ratchet (Movie)|Ratchet]], [[Ironhide (Movie)|Ironhide]], Wheeljack and [[Cliffjumper (Movie)|Cliffjumper]].<ref>[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRFv6JVFApk Bumblebee - First Generation Design - Paramount Pictures UK]</ref>
*December 2, 2018 - Lorenzo di Bonaventura confirms [[Dylan O'Brien]] as the voice of Bumblebee.<ref>https://www.ign.com/articles/2018/12/03/transformers-bumblebee-movie-voice-actor-dylan-obrien</ref>
*December 4, 2018 - New footage of the movie drops, showing Soundwave's voice, as well as many new shots of Cybertron and the battle between Bumblebee and Blitzwing.<ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/soundwave-speaks-more-footage-china-release-date-and-sponsor-and-more-bumblebee-news-roundup/42538/ Seibertron's coverage of the new trailer, as well as a general roundup of new footage.]</ref>
*December 8, 2018 - Special early screenings of the film take place in specific areas. Fans who attend are given free [[Tiny Turbo Changers]] toys, and short behind-the-scenes featurettes are shown before and after the film. <ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/early-reactions-and-impressions-for-2018-live-action-transformers-bumblebee-film/42550/ Seibertron's roundup of people's thoughts on the early screening.]</ref>
{{--}}

===Changes before, during, and after production===
Initially, ''Bumblebee'' would have served as a more direct prequel to the 2007 movie, bridging the gap between Bumblebee's [[World War II]] adventures in ''The Last Knight'' and setting up some plot points from the original ''Transformers'' film. Many of these elements were subsequently dropped during reshoots following test screenings in 2018; this may have been a result of feedback from the test screenings, Paramount's concerns over the negative commercial and critical reception to ''The Last Knight'', or a desire to take the franchise in a new direction. Some of these dropped scenes and plot points include:<ref>[http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/pre-screener-differences-warning-spoilers-ahead.1166457/ Differences between the final cut and the pre-screening, documented by a TFW2005 user]</ref>
[[File:ANewCarForCharlie-deletedscene.jpg|thumb|300px|"TiVo. You can just freeze live TV? That's insane!"]]
*The film's original cut didn't include any scenes set on Cybertron, opening instead with a scene of Bumblebee already on Earth, fleeing from Sector Seven in his Jeep mode, thereby preserving continuity with ''The Last Knight.'' In this original opening, Bumblebee laments that the humans are now hunting him despite his being sent to protect them, and comes to the embittered conclusion that mankind isn't worth fighting for. This sets up the character arc Bumblebee is intended to undergo in the film, learning through his friendship with Charlie that not all humans are alike, and that there is good in them after all, culminating in his decision to fight Shatter and Dropkick in order to save the Earth from a Decepticon invasion after he regains his memories in the film's final act. This arc becomes diluted in the finished film, even though this climactic scene remains, since Bumblebee does not experience this loss of faith in the first place. This original opening is included among the deleted scenes on the home release.
**For the final cut of the film, the scene was reshot to have Bumblebee's escape pod crash-land near Burns's Sector Seven squad—who are in the woods because of a training exercise—by pure coincidence. Unfortunately, this creates some new discrepancies: Sector Seven is ''already'' driving SUVs equipped with anti-Transformer harpoon weaponry; a mid-1980s special forces unit keeps a World War II-era Willys Jeep around for some reason; and Bumblebee can speak English not more than a few minutes after landing on Earth.
*Burns was originally going to have a markedly different personality. In the test cut, he was depicted as a far grimmer character who had lost someone close to him in a prior Transformer attack. In the final version of the film, he became more eccentric, though remnants of his original personality still appear at times.
*Otis appeared more frequently in the original cut of the film, particularly in the first act. Deleted scenes include: Charlie "dropping him off" at karate practice by having him ride a skateboard while clinging to the back of her bike [[Marty McFly]]-style; Charlie leaving to buy Bumblebee while she is meant to be watching Otis, warning him that she will kill him if he dies while she is away; Charlie coercing Otis into helping her clean the new Beetle when she returns; and Bumblebee breaking down on the road while the two are taking it for a test drive, leading Otis to abandon Charlie and walk off while a passing Tina taunts her. All of these scenes are among the deleted scenes included in the home release.
*Originally, Charlie was to have two friends named [[Liz]] and [[Brenda]] "Bren" (played by [[Rachel Crow]] and [[Abby Quinn]] respectively), who worked with her at Hot Dog on a Stick. The two originally appeared in the first Boardwalk scene where they tell Charlie they "aren't a match anymore," following her personality change after her father's death, upsetting her. They later reappear at the cliffside party, having bribed their way into Tina's friendship by giving her free corn dogs and abandoning Charlie for their new "cool" status. Both scenes are present as extras on the home release, and the characters still appear in the [[Transformers: Bumblebee: The Junior Novel|Junior Novel adaptation]].
*In the test cut, Cliffjumper was not part of the scene in which Shatter and Dropkick detect Bumblebee on Earth. Cliffjumper's inclusion was made because his similarities to Bumblebee would set the stakes of the story: "You have to understand that if Shatter and Dropkick encounter Bumblebee, things are not going to end well."<ref>[https://uproxx.com/hitfix/travis-knight-interview-bumblebee/ Travis Knight ''UPROXX'' interview]</ref>
*The scene where Bumblebee explores Charlie's house originally had the Autobot inadvertently bring the house's electronics to life with his [[energon radiation]], necessitating a slapstick fight sequence in which Bumblebee, Charlie, and Memo had to unplug the hostile Transformers to deactivate them. {{w|Martin Short}} would have featured in the scene, presumably as the voice of at least one of the mutations. This scene was cut ''very'' late in production, enough so that a version of it would find its way into both the junior novel and [[A New Car for Charlie|Junior Reader adaptations]]. As a result, the movie's corresponding scene features an unusually high number of rapid-fire jump cuts to mask the missing footage, including a strange, swaying "POV" shot that originally belonged to the mutant washing machine as it watched Charlie and Memo enter the house. Eagle-eyed viewers will realize that the house's television is gone from its usual spot. At the same time, the washing machine is, for no apparent reason, sitting in the middle of the family carpet, the "real" reason being that these appliances had been brought to life and summarily dispatched in the original cut of the movie. Another remnant of the sequence surfaces when Sally asks why the television's cord was cut—something of a ''non sequitur'' in this version. The complete sequence is included as one of the deleted scenes on the home release, though it does not feature Short's voice.
*The test cut of the film featured a post-credit scene with Burns, Simmons, and Whalen discussing that the Autobots can never learn of "N.B.E.-01:" [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]], frozen in ice as per the 2007 movie, albeit redesigned to have a more [[Megatron (G1)|Generation 1-styled appearance]]. This scene was replaced in the final cut by entirely new scenes of Optimus Prime and Bumblebee watching more Transformers arrive on Earth and Charlie finishing her and her father's car repair project.
**The scene where Bumblebee joins Optimus Prime on the Golden Gate Bridge was, however, the same in both versions and would've been the last on-screen appearance of Bee in the original cut. With that cut being more closely aligned with the live-action continuity at large, it seems likely that the scene was intended to be a bit more ambiguous - the audience at large would've been able to read it as "Bumblebee goes off to join Optimus Prime", while the filmmakers would've retained some plausible deniability in the form of "it's just a truck that ''looks'' like Optimus Prime" - thus better allowing for the arrival of the Autobots to occur as seen in the 2007 movie.
*A scene of Bumblebee being on the run in Vietnam in his World War II body made it to concept art stage.<ref>[http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/the-big-bumblebee-concept-art-thread.1167241/#post-16487632 Vietnam fields concept art]</ref>
{{-}}

[[File:TF-BB-Movie-Murderbee-Trailer-vs-Final-Cut.jpg|250px|thumb|"You see? You can't treat them
like equals! They're striped savages! Stinging's the only thing they know! ''It's their way!''"]]
Additional changes, some of which took place ''after'' the introduction of the film's Cybertron scenes, include:
*The first trailer to include Cybertron scenes featured Blitzwing among Shockwave's Seekers. In later trailers and the final film, he was replaced with Starscream, sporting his traditional color scheme and seemingly a new head lacking the 'flight mask' design motif.
*In a statement for Seibertron.com, Jon Bailey noted that he auditioned for [[Ironhide (Movie)|Ironhide]], suggesting the character was originally intended to have dialogue.<ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/bumblebee-movie-voice-actor-jon-bailey-talks-about-his-experience/42553/ Seibertron article on Bailey's experience]</ref> This was confirmed in a Seibertron.com podcast, in which he also said [[Starscream (Movie)|Starscream]] was supposed to yell "Die Autobots!", in a slightly reworked version of his appearance. [[Soundwave (ROTF)|Soundwave]] was also supposed to say "Operation: Destruction" and/or "Operation: Annihilation" after ejecting [[Ravage (ROTF)|Ravage]] as a direct reference to the original cartoon.<ref>[https://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/twincast-podcast-episode-214-bumblebee/42674/ Seibertron.com Twincast Podcast Episode #214 "Bumblebee"]</ref>
*The Cybertron tower was supposed to look more [[Great Dome]]-like before opening up to display the launchpad, with concept art to boot, though it was cut for time.<ref name="ILM" />
*Optimus Prime was to have an extended role in the opening scene, having a Cybertronian vehicle mode, though it was cut for time. Concept art for a more Cybertronian robot mode and vehicle mode was created by [[Alex Jaeger]], though the film ultimately uses a model closer to his Earthen robot form.<ref name="ILM" />
*An additional render and a deleted scene depict Shatter and Dropkick inside Sector 7 with their car-only robot forms, indicating they may have been supposed to scan their aerial modes later in the film.<ref name="ILM" />
*Travis Knight initially wanted to feature Megatron during the Cybertron scenes. However, the Decepticon leader was ultimately omitted, specifically because continuity dictated he was still frozen on Earth at the time,<ref>[https://comicbook.com/movies/2018/12/19/bumblebee-deleted-megatron-decepticon-scene/ 'Bumblebee' Deleted A Megatron Scene] on comicbook.com</ref> despite the removal of the scene mentioned earlier showing this.
*When Bumblebee's memories are restored and he fights against Sector 7, his eye color is red, as opposed to the blue in the trailer (right).
*Very early stock art for the film depicted Bumblebee with his now-traditional "wings" formed from his car's doors alternate mode. This was changed late in production to give his final C.G. model a more humanoid appearance, but not early enough to change his [[Bumblebee (Movie)/toys|concurrently-released toys]], which almost unanimously depict Bumblebee with said door-wings.
*Shatter went under the working name '''[[Fracture (disambiguation)|Fracture]]'''.<ref name="ILM" />
{{-}}

==Notes==
*During production, the film was referred to in presentational material under a variety of names, including "Transformers 6", "Bumblebee: The Movie," "The Bumblebee Movie," and "Transformers Universe: Bumblebee."
*[[Hasbro Pulse]] occasionally refers to the movie as "Transformers: Bumblebee" or "Bumblebee Movie".<ref>[https://hasbropulse.com/products/transformers-studio-series-65-voyager-bumblebee-movie-blitzwing]
</ref>

===Foreign names===
*''Japanese:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (バンブルビー ''Banburubī'')
*''Arabic:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (بامبلبي ''Bamblibi'')
*''Cantonese:'' '''''Daai Wong Fung''''' (大黃蜂, "Bumblebee")
*''Greek:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (Μπάμπλμπι ''Bámplmpi'')
*''Hindi:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (बुमबलेबी ''Bumabalebee'')
*''Hungarian:'' '''''ŰrDongó''''' ("Space Bumblebee")
*''Korean:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (범블비 ''Beombeulbi'')
*''Mandarin:'' '''''Dàhuángfēng''''' (大黃蜂, 大黄蜂, "Bumblebee")
*''Russian:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (Бамблби ''Bamblbi'')
*''Tamil:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (பம்பல்பீ ''Pampalpī'')
*''Telugu:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (బంబుల్బీ ''Bambulbī'')
*''Ukrainian:'' '''''Bumblebee''''' (Бамблбі ''Bamblbi'')

==References==
{{reflist|2}}

==External links==
*{{w|Bumblebee (film)|Bumblebee}} on Wikipedia
*[[IMDB:tt4701182|Bumblebee]] on IMDB

[[Category:Bumblebee| ]]
[[Category:Bumblebee media| ]]
[[Category:Real world films]]

Rise of the Decepticons: All Fall Down

2022-07-18T10:20:39Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{disambig3|All Fall Down}}
{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Transformers (2019 comic)|Transformers]]'' #19
|prev=Arcee/Greenlight: Run
|next=Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's
|caption=
|image=TF2019 19 cvrA.jpg
|title="Rise of the Decepticons: All Fall Down"
|publisher=[[IDW Publishing]]
|date=[[March 18]], 2020
|coverdate=March 2020
|written by=[[Brian Ruckley]]
|art by=[[Anna Malkova]]
|colors by=[[Joana Lafuente]]
|letters by=[[Jake M. Wood]]
|editor=[[David Mariotte]], [[Tom Waltz]] and [[Riley Farmer]]
|continuity=[[2019 IDW continuity]]
|chronology=
}}

'''The Ascenticons step up to help with relief efforts—but as Megatron tightens his grip on the Ascenticon Guard, Bumblebee begins to suspect that something is amiss.'''

==Synopsis==
After a long convalescence at [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]]'s medical center, [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] cheerfully reports to [[Ratchet (G1)|Ratchet]] that she's finally been cleared for active duty, but stops dead when confronted by the sight of a grim-faced Ratchet tending to the greviously wounded [[Javelin]], and the comatose [[Ruckus (G1)|Ruckus]] and [[Kaskade]]. Ratchet warns her that this grisly sight is the least of his worries; in her absence, the [[Tether]] has fallen, levelling vast swathes of Iacon with it. Horrified, Windblade takes in the sight from above while [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] and his innermost [[Decepticon|Ascenticon]]s regard the devastation from a nearby balcony. The Ascenticon leader bitterly muses that he ''never'' wanted things to turn out this way, but the drastic actions of his followers have left him no choice but to continue down this road. Ignoring [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]]'s protests, Megatron orders his followers into action: Jhiaxus will rally his followers in [[Tarn (polity)|Tarn]], [[Ratbat (G1)|Ratbat]] will contact the [[Decepticon Mini-Cassette|Infiltration Trooper]]s under his command, and [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] will be placed under the protection of the [[Ascenticon Guard]]. Indeed, Megatron has already enlisted some new Guard recruits directly from [[The Rise]], but this extra muscle comes at a cost: the Ascenticon leader decrees that [[Elita One (G1)|Elita-1]] has outlived her purpose as the Guard's honest, idealistic figurehead... and makes it clear that [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] must meet with an "accident" on his next mission.

Elita is indeed confused and outraged when Soundwave goes over her head to bring in these new recruits, and warns Soundwave that the presence of dangerous 'bots like [[Ion Storm]] and [[Nova Storm (G1)|Nova Storm]] will undermine the goodwill she's worked to cultivate with the people of Cybertron. Soundwave doesn't care: Elita is relieved of command, confined to quarters, and [[Flywheels|Skytread]] is installed as the new leader of the Ascenticon Guard.
Predictably, Bumblebee isn't much pleased by the shakeup, and says as much during his next deployment as part of a search-and-rescue mission to help victims of the recent disaster. With no need to conceal his thinly veiled hatred of Bumblebee, Skytread orders him to check out a nearby storage building, smirking at the prospect of finally getting even with his rival. The moment Bumblebee's out of earshot, however, he puts in a call to [[Chromia (G1)|Chromia]] to try and tell her what's happened, only to find that she's apparently busy with her own problems. In the meantime, Bumblebee gets to work; spying a hand amidst the debris, he frantically tries to dig out the stranded Cybertronian—but discovers that it belongs to a 'bot who's already dead. The sight brings back terrible memories for Bumblebee as he collapses onto a nearby rock... unaware of the glowing eyes watching his every move.

Elsewhere, [[Sentinel Prime (G1)|Sentinel Prime]] and [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Orion Pax]] watch as [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] escorts the [[Voin]] asserter through the streets while [[Nautica (G1)|Nautica]] does her best to try and talk down the alien. Orion tries to keep Sentinel abreast of the crisis, but his news is not heartening: [[Vigilem]] has disappeared, [[Lodestar (Titan)|Lodestar]] is gravely injured, the other [[Titan (group)|Titan]]s remain offline, and the [[Winged Moon]] has spun into an unstable orbit. But while the bullish Sentinel wants to arrest Soundwave and break The Rise as hard and fast as possible, Orion advocates restraint: better to focus on rebuilding what they already have while leaving the Ascenticons to a general capable of handling a surgical strike. However, there's only one [[Great General]] available; on hearing [[Pyra Magna]]'s name, Sentinel immediately shuts down his deputy and storms off, shouting that he'll pass the [[Matrix of Leadership]] to [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]], ''not'' Orion, and that he'll expose the Ascenticons as the traitors and liars he knows they are.

In the ruins, Bumblebee tries to fend off [[Catgut]], and although he's able to shake off the Ascenticon long enough to transform and speed off, a barrage of laser fire from above rains down upon him, courtesy of Catgut's partner [[Treadshot (G1)|Treadshot]], intent on finishing the job!

Meanwhile, Windblade and a team of other security veterans—[[Sureshot (G1)|Sureshot]], [[Blades (G1)|Blades]], [[Springer (G1)|Springer]], and [[Smokescreen (G1)|Smokescreen]]—assemble under the auspices of [[Firestar (G1)|Novastar]], who's sought them out to join a security team modelled after Novastar's [[Colonial Security]] division. This new recon and rapid response team will operate in conjunction with [[Hound (G1)|Hound]]'s heavies; security, Novastar explains, will no longer just ''react'' to trouble... for the first time, they'll be getting proactive, organizing counterstrikes, and fighting back against those which would seek to bring down the planet from within.

Bumblebee doesn't go down easy, holding off Catgut long enough to leap to safety through a crack in the ceiling... but Catgut bounds after him, latches onto his leg, and drags him back down to the ground in time for Treadshot to charge his chest cannon and unleash a blast so powerful that it blows Bumblebee straight through the nearest wall. Treadshot moves in for the kill, but is taken aback by another high-powered blaster volley and backs off. The blaster belongs to Chromia, and as she helps Bumblebee up she gives him everything they know: Catgut and Treadshot are confirmed members of [[The Rise]], and Bumblebee realizes that someone wanted him out of the picture. Chromia tries to console him by telling him that he did everything he could, but it's no use to Bumblebee: nothing on Cybertron has improved and [[Rubble]] is still dead.

At Rise headquarters, a furious [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] interrogates [[Skystalker (G1)|Skystalker]], demanding to know what's happened to Vigilem. Skystalker, still traumatized, can't answer, but the session is cut short when an irate [[Sixshot (G1)|Sixshot]] barges in, demanding an explanation. Not only have dozens of Risers left to join the Ascenticon Guard, [[Mindwipe (G1)|Mindwipe]], [[Whisper (G1)|Visper]] and [[Storm Cloud (G1)|Storm Cloud]] have left on a secret mission following Mindwipe's complaints about not having enough energon to continue his "research"—and ''this'' news prompts a horrified Shockwave to rise from his refueling chair...

==Featured characters==
{{featuredcharacters
|c1=
* [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Orion Pax]] (28)
* [[Sentinel Prime (G1)|Sentinel Prime]] (29)

|h2=[[Decepticon|Ascenticon]]s|c2=
{{{!}}border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" style="background:transparent"
{{!}}-
{{!}}style="background:transparent;border:0px" valign="top"{{!}}
* [[Kaskade]] (3)
* [[Ruckus (G1)|Ruckus]] (4)
* [[Ratbat (G1)|Ratbat]] (6)
* [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] (7)
* [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] (8)
* [[Strika (BM)|Strika]] (9)
* [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (10)
* [[Flywheels|Skytread]] (11)
* [[Elita One (G1)|Elita-1]] (12)
* [[Swift (G1)|Swift]] (13)
* [[Roadtrap (POTP)|Roadtrap]] (14)
* [[Battleslash]] (15)
* [[Crasher (G1)|Crasher]] (16)
{{!}}style="background:transparent;border:0px" valign="top"{{!}}
* [[Runamuck (G1)|Runamuck]] (17)
* [[Runabout (G1)|Runabout]] (18)
* [[Ion Storm]] (19)
* [[Nova Storm (G1)|Nova Storm]] (20)
* [[Acid Storm (G1)|Acid Storm]] (21)
* [[Reflector (G1)|Refraktor]] (22)
* [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] (23)
* [[Catgut]] (25)
* [[Treadshot (G1)|Treadshot]] (37)
* [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] (38)
* [[Flatline (G1)|Flatline]] (39)
* [[Skystalker (G1)|Skystalker]] (40)
* [[Sixshot (G1)|Sixshot]] (41)

{{!}}}

|h4=Cybertronians|c4=
{{{!}}border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" style="background:transparent"
* [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] (1)
* [[Javelin]] (2)
* [[Ratchet (G1)|Ratchet]] (5)
* [[Chromia (G1)|Chromia]] (24)
* [[Nautica (G1)|Nautica]] (26)
* [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] (30)
* [[Ironhide (G1)|Ironhide]] (31)
* [[Sureshot (G1)|Sureshot]] (32)
* [[Blades (G1)|Blades]] (33)
* [[Firestar (G1)|Novastar]] (34)
* [[Springer (G1)|Springer]] (35)
* [[Smokescreen (G1)|Smokescreen]] (36)
{{!}}style="background:transparent;border:0px" valign="top"{{!}}

{{!}}}

|h5=Others|c5=
* [[Voin]] asserter (27)
}}

==Quotes==
"Cybertron is becoming such a dangerous place, even for those trying to do the right thing."
:—'''Megatron'''

"You have '''got''' to be kidding." 
"Joke's on you. I run the Guard now. I can run '''you''' into the ground if I feel like it."
:—'''Bumblebee''' and '''Skytread'''

"I say the Ascenticons are '''traitors''' and '''liars''', and we '''will''' tell that truth! We '''will''' name them what they are!"
:—'''Sentinel Prime'''

"Windblade and Blades are air recon." 
"This'll be good. Singular versus plural to see who's best, right?"
:—'''Novastar''' and '''Blades'''

"You've done '''all''' you possibly can." 
"I guess. But it's not enough, is it? It hasn't changed anything. He's still dead."
:—'''Chromia''' and '''Bumblebee'''

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] was injured back in [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Three|issue #9]] during a raid on a Rise bunker and subsequently confined to a stasis tube for the next ten issues.
* Ratchet's other patients include [[Javelin]], [[Kaskade]], and [[Ruckus (G1)|Ruckus]], who were all injured in [[The Change In Your Nature Part Two|issue #14]]: Javelin was shot in the head by Ruckus's team, while Ruckus and Kaskade were themselves badly wounded when Soundwave detonated the abandoned [[Titan (group)|Titan]] they were using as a temporary base.
* The [[Voin]] asserter arrived on Cybertron in [[The Change In Your Nature Part Four|issue #16]], seeking retribution for the Voin scavenger that [[Quake (G1)|Quake]] killed in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Five|issue #5]].
* [[Pyra Magna]] had been referenced several times before as some kind of political prisoner, and this issue reveals that she was previously one of the [[Great General]]s of Cybertron alongside [[Dai Atlas (G1)|Dai Atlas]], [[Strika (BM)|Strika]], and [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]]—presumably, as per Megatron's flashback in [[The Change In Your Nature Part Three|issue #15]], they served in the [[War of the Threefold Spark]]. Orion specifically notes that Ultra Magnus is "absent" from Cybertron, in what's presumably foreshadowing for his upcoming ''[[Transformers: Galaxies|Galaxies]]'' story arc.
* Skytread has disliked Bumblebee since [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part One|issue #7]], where Bumblebee took down both him and [[Reflector (G1)|Refraktor]] in a sparring match; their rivalry continued into [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Five|#11]], where Skytread knocked Bumblebee unconscious, but 'Bee got his own back in [[The Change In Your Nature Part One|#13]] when he beat the tar out of Skytread.
* Following her uncertain fate in [[The Change In Your Nature Part Five|issue #17]], this issue clarifies that [[Lodestar (Titan)|Lodestar]] survived her encounter with [[Vigilem]], but is badly injured and unable to fly.
* Sentinel Prime deputized Novastar and Hound to lead a special operations unit back in [[The Change In Your Nature Part Three|issue #15]]. Here, Novastar is shown assembling her forces at the same [[alternate mode|alt-mode]] testing track that appeared in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Three|issue #3]].
* Chromia mentions that Treadshot is a confirmed member of [[The Rise]]; his name appeared among the list of Rise members Windblade and Chromia recovered from the Rise bunker in [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Three|issue #9]].

===Transformers references===
* In addition to the toyetic [[Battleslash]], [[Roadtrap (POTP)|Roadtrap]], and [[Acid Storm (G1)|Acid Storm]]'s [[Rainmaker]] compatriots [[Ion Storm]] and [[Nova Storm (G1)|Nova Storm]], [[Swift (G1)|Swift]] joins the Ascenticon Guard, having previously appeared in the [[2005 IDW continuity]] as a post-war [[Decepticon]] recruit during a 2015 ''[[The Transformers: Robots in Disguise|The Transformers]]'' storyline...
* ...but the ''really'' unexpected cameo this time round is friggin' ''[[Crasher (G1)|Crasher]]'', who last showed up in 2007's ''[[The Transformers: Megatron Origin|Megatron Origin]]'' miniseries as a jokey reference to the ''[[GoBots]]'' [[Crasher (GoBots)|character of the same name]] (Brian Ruckley, man). Perhaps for trademark reasons, she's drawn with the visored face that she sported in her first IDW appearance, itself based on Crasher's original toy, rather than her more humanoid cartoon visage.
* Orion namedrops Dai Atlas as one of Cybertron's Great Generals, noting that he's since gone immersant in what seems to be a reference to the character's depiction in the [[2005 IDW continuity]] as an ancient Cybertronian from [[Nova Prime]]'s era.
* Treadshot and Catgut are mentioned to have survived the wreck of the ''[[Iron Hope (Cybertron)|Iron Hope]]'', a starship from the ''[[Transformers Timelines (fiction)|Timelines]]'' story "[[Force of Habit]]," and Chromia notes that subsisting on [[Nucleon (substance)|nucleon]] while stranded left the remaining crew permanently mode-locked. In the original [[The Transformers (Marvel comic)|Marvel ''Transformers'' comics]] and toy bios, nucleon was the substance responsible for changing ordinary Transformers into non-transforming [[Action Master]]s; presumably, [[Gutcruncher (G1)|Gutcruncher]] in [[Arcee/Greenlight: Run|the previous issue]] is also one of the "''Iron Hope'' Hundred."
* In contrast to the many ''[[Combiner Wars (toyline)|Combiner Wars]]''-styled characters in this continuity, [[Blades (G1)|Blades]] has been given an original body by line artist Anna Malkova based on his [[Blades (G1)#Universe (2008)|''Universe'' toy]], a redeco of [[Evac (Cybertron)#Toys|''Cybertron'' Evac]].<ref>{{twitter|ok, look, Blades has a tough life! Based him on a Tf Universe toy, because of his riff with Windblade i thought it'd be fun if their looks were somewhat similar, but Joana colored him more to the tune of CW one and at this point, just, wait till he comes back, we'll sort it out!|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1405586233246552070|Anna Malkova|2021|06|18}}</ref>

===Errors===
* Ratchet's head chevron is mistakenly colored red, instead of the black that matches his ''[[War for Cybertron: Siege|Siege]]'' design and previous appearances in this book.

===Other notes===
* Originally solicited for March 11, this comic arrives just one week late. Coming out merely a week after the previous issue, however, brings the series back on schedule...or it would have, had the {{w|COVID-19 pandemic}} not pushed the next issue all the way back to June.

===Covers (3)===
* '''Cover A''': Bumblebee in the crosshairs, by [[Thomas Deer]]
* '''Cover B''': Chromia's friends and foes, by [[Priscilla Tramontano]]
* '''Retailer incentive cover''': Elita-1 imprisoned, by [[Freddie E. Williams II]] and [[Jeremy Colwell]]

<gallery>
File:TF2019 19 cvrA.jpg
File:TF2019 19 cvrB.jpg
File:TF2019 19 cvrRI.jpg
</gallery>

===Advertisements===
* ''[[The Transformers: The IDW Collection]]'' [[The Transformers: The IDW Collection Phase Two: Volume 11|#11]]
* ''[[Transformers vs. The Terminator]]''
* ''Locke & Key''

===Reprints===
*'''''Transformers Volume 3: All Fall Down''''' ([[February 24]], [[2021]]) ISBN 1684057396 / ISBN 978-1684057399
**Hardcover.
**Collects ''Transformers'' issues #19–24 and ''Galaxies'' issues #7–12.
**Bonus material currently unknown, most likely alternate covers.

<gallery>
image:TF-IDW-2019v3.jpg|'''''Volume 3: All Fall Down'''''; cover art by [[Cryssy Cheung]]
</gallery>

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
*[https://graphicpolicy.com/2020/03/17/preview-transformers-19/ Preview]

[[Category:Transformers (2019) issues]]

Green

2022-07-18T10:16:39Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{disambig3|Green}}
:''Green is a [[flyt]] from the [[2019 IDW continuity|2019 IDW portion]] of the [[Generation 1 continuity family]].''
[[File:TheWorldInYourEyesPart5 ProwlAndGreen.jpg|thumb|upright=1.6|right|She probably doesn't turn into an axe.]]

'''Green''' is [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]]'s pet [[flyt]].

==Fiction==
===2019 IDW continuity===
The flyt flock that followed [[Leviathan (G1)|Leviathan]] around glued their egg strands to her hull every kilocycle. One fell off the massive [[Transformer]] soon after she hatched, and a [[Voin]] scavenger scooped her up and sold her to Prowl.{{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's|Swindle's}} Prowl named her "Green", fed her bits of [[skitter]], and used her as a sounding board as he investigated crimes. {{storylink|The World In Your Eyes Part Five}}

Before a raid on [[Swindle's]], [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]] met Green and questioned her unimaginative name. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's|Swindle's}}

After Optimus Prime and his supporters were forced to abandon Iacon, Prowl brought Green with him. {{storylink|War World: We Are Not Meant To Be Darkness|We Are Not Meant To Be Darkness}}

==Notes==
*Like the rest of her kind, Green is very loosely inspired by [[Pteraxadon]] from the ''[[War for Cybertron: Siege]]'' toyline.<ref>{{twitter|I think it's best to ask Mr. Ruckley since i drew it as a creature of a species briefly shown in previous issues|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1125840794991116288|Anna Malkova|2019|05|07}}</ref><ref>{{Twitter|Not really ... but then again, vaguely sort of. One of the secondary reasons for having organic life around is (perhaps, one day) as a pointer to how some TFs might end up with animalish alt-modes ...|https://twitter.com/Brian_Ruckley/status/1166726077902991365|Brian Ruckley|2019|08|28}}</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Comic-only characters]]
[[Category:IDW (2019) aliens]]

The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Five

2022-07-18T10:14:27Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Transformers (2019 comic)|Transformers]]'' #11
|prev=The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Four
|next=Nautica: Home
|caption=
|image=TF2019 11 cvrB.jpg
|title="The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Five"
|publisher=[[IDW Publishing]]
|date=[[August 28]], 2019
|coverdate=August 2019
|written by=[[Brian Ruckley]]
|art by=[[Angel Hernandez]] (pg. 8-17), [[Anna Malkova]] (pages 1-7, 18-20)
|colors by=[[Joana Lafuente]] and [[Josh Burcham]]
|letters by=[[Tom B. Long]]
|editor=[[David Mariotte]] and [[Tom Waltz]]
|continuity=[[2019 IDW continuity]]
|chronology=
}}

'''Bumblebee finds his loyalties tested when Barricade becomes the prize in a struggle between The Rise and Security Operations.'''

==Synopsis==
In the halls of the Cybertronian [[Senate]], First Senator [[Sentinel Prime (G1)|Sentinel Prime]] and [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Orion Pax]] gravely listen to [[Chromia (G1)|Chromia]]'s report on the current crisis unfolding at [[Decepticon Headquarters (G1 Cybertron)|Ascenticon Headquarters]]: rogue [[Security Operations]] officer [[Barricade (IDW)|Barricade]] has sought refuge with the Ascenticons... and [[Ascenticon Guard]] member [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] has denied the 'bots of Security Operations access to the building. Straightforward as ever, Sentinel orders Chromia to break down the doors and bring in their target by force, but Orion advocates a more restrained approach. Perhaps, he suggests, he should speak to [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] first... the recent destruction of the [[Memorial Crater]] has further divided [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]'s already polarized society, and those who hold Ascenticon sympathies are already blaming the security operatives who carried out the raid. Sentinel grumbles that Orion has until sunset to get what he wants... and if he ''doesn't'', then he'll order Chromia to get proactive about the situation.

Ignoring Head of Intelligence [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]]'s snide remarks, Chromia passes an object to Orion: the salvaged contents of the data-jack that she and her team uncovered at the Rise base in the crater. Forty names are on the list of every 'bot who used the facility's [[energon stations]]–including, she reasons, the Risers responsible for killing [[Brainstorm (G1)|Brainstorm]] and [[Rubble]].

Elsewhere, Megatron himself is furious with Soundwave's handling of the recent crisis–under Soundwave's authorization, Barricade passed information directly to [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] regarding the location of the [[Voin]] witness... and Shockwave sought to tie up that loose end by sending the notoriously unstable [[Quake (G1)|Quake]] to finish the job. With security cordons at their doorstep and a suspected Riser taking shelter in their headquarters, the political legitimacy of the Ascenticons is crumbling, and fast. As he vents his fury, the Ascenticon leader smashes one piece of furniture after the next, until an attendant timidly pokes her head around the door to inform Megatron that Orion wishes to speak to him. With his carefully-prepared plan collapsing around him, the Ascenticon leader sighs, and agrees that Security Operations ''cannot'' be allowed to speak to Barricade now. Instead, Megatron puts through a call to [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] on one of Soundwave's secure drones, informing his co-conspirator that someone needs to come get Barricade... and that the extraction effort needs to look good.

Unaware of Megatron's scheme, [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] has just finished paying [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]]'s [[stasis lock]]ed body a visit–but that's not why he's at the medical center today, as he's arrived to have a tête-à-tête with Orion Pax. Orion is the one who put him up to joining the Ascenticon Guard, a way of keeping an eye on the organization after the suspiciously incompetent attack on Megatron's Ascenticon rally–but now, with Ascenticon headquarters in turmoil, Orion asks Bumblebee not to return. The yellow Ascenticon refuses: Rubble died because nobody was there to protect him. Bumblebee was in debt to Orion already, but now he's even ''deeper'' in debt to Rubble's memory... and he won't stop until that debt is paid, and Cybertron protected.

Some time later, back at Ascenticon headquarters, the members of the [[Ascenticon Guard]] prepare for the inevitable confrontation with [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] and his men. One by one, the various Ascenticons head off to their posts, intent on maintaining a united front in the face of Security... but Bumblebee lags behind, and wonders aloud just ''what'' Barricade did to get on their radar. Soundwave is quick to order Bumblebee to his station, but–the moment Soundwave's back turns–Bumblebee slips off after Barricade as the ex-cop heads down a side hallway, and bumps into [[Flywheels|Skytread]] on the way, who firmly encourages his fellow guardsman to find somewhere else to be busy.

Up above, [[Sixshot (G1)|Sixshot]] and his compatriots [[Whisper (G1)|Visper]] and [[Storm Cloud (G1)|Storm Cloud]] scope out the situation below. As per Shockwave's orders, they've been sent to retrieve Barricade, and make it look convincing... and their "attack" begins with a blast that announces their presence. While the two smaller Transformers grab Barricade, Skytread is seemingly dropped with a staged jolt from an electric stun baton, Bumblebee goes up against Visper before Sixshot intervenes and momentarily stuns the yellow 'bot. As they turn to leave, however, the [[Six Changer]] finds himself blindsided when Bumblebee recovers and fights back, wielding a chunk of debris as an improvised weapon! Though 'Bee fights hard, the fight is as short-lived as it is lopsided: Sixshot contemptuously snatches Bumblebee's weapon from his hands... and Bumblebee himself is electrocuted by none other than Skytread! The deed done, the Risers scatter... and Barricade goes with them.

That night, Megatron surveys the ruins of the damaged Ascenticon building; with Soundwave in tow, the Ascenticon leader broadcasts a new speech. Cybertron is but a shadow of its former glory, Megatron opines, and the rise of violence across the planet–a violence exemplified by The Rise, and abetted by the incompetence of Security Operations–are but symptoms of the underlying cause: and that cause is the the reign of the Autobots, and their slavish adherence to the [[Nominus Edict]].

On cue, Megatron's fellow Ascenticons step forward–senators, members of the Ascenticon Guard alike, and even Bumblebee. Though they are beset by chaos and disorder on all sides, Megatron announces that progress ''must'' be made, their ascension aided by determination, purpose, and, if need be, anger... and, as he hoists the tattered Ascenticon flag, the first step on this new path begins with a new insignia for the Ascenticons. Using a blowtorch, Megatron burns a new pattern over the old symbol, turns it upside down, and reveals his handiwork to the people of Cybertron...

...[[Decepticon|the sign of the future.]]

==Featured characters==
{{featuredcharacters
|c1=
* [[Sentinel Prime (G1)|Sentinel Prime]] (1)
* [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Orion Pax]] (4)

|h2=[[Decepticon|Ascenticon]]s|c2=
{{{!}}border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" style="background:transparent"
{{!}}-
{{!}}style="background:transparent;border:0px" valign="top"{{!}}
* [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] (5)
* [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (6)
* [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] (9)
* [[Reflector (G1)|Refraktor]] (10)
* [[Elita One (G1)|Elita-1]] (11)
* [[Flywheels|Skytread]] (13)
* [[Acid Storm (G1)|Acid Storm]] (17)
* [[Strika (BM)|Strika]] (18)
{{!}}style="background:transparent;border:0px" valign="top"{{!}}
* [[Ratbat (G1)|Ratbat]] (19)
* [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] (20)
'''[[The Rise]]'''
* [[Barricade (IDW)|Barricade]] (12)
* [[Storm Cloud (G1)|Storm Cloud]] (14)
* [[Sixshot (G1)|Sixshot]] (15)
* [[Whisper (G1)|Visper]] (16)

{{!}}}

|c4=
* [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] (2)
* [[Chromia (G1)|Chromia]] (3)
* [[Nautica (G1)|Nautica]] (7)
* [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] (8)

}}

==Quotes==
"I stay until I've cleared my debts and made anyone else that needs to '''pay theirs'''. Because if I don't, I will '''break.''' I will break."
:—'''Bumblebee'''

"We'll do the elevated approach anyway. Shockwave wanted something dramatic. Some damage. He also said not to '''kill''' anyone if possible, so I suppose we try that."
:—'''Sixshot'''

"We must not ascend slowly now, on the '''soft''' current of reason and debate, but on a '''surging tide''' of purpose and determination! And yes, '''anger too''' if that is what it takes to sweep away the obstacles and delays and distractions the Autobots set in our path. '''This''' is the new face of Ascenticons. And it is the '''face''' of the '''future'''."
:—'''Megatron''' ends on a CLIFFHANGER, dun dun DUNNNNNN

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* [[Barricade (IDW)|Barricade]] officially joined the Ascenticon Guard during [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Three|issue #9]], and sought shelter in their HQ in [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Four|the previous issue]]; it wasn't entirely laid out in the comic beforehand, but we correctly theorized that Barricade was the 'bot responsible for passing on information regarding the [[Voin]] scavenger to [[The Rise]], beforehand, and that Quake was deliberately sent to silence it.
* Chromia and her team salvaged data on The Rise in [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Three|issue #9]] and inadvertently ran into Sixshot and his skeleton crew while there. The ensuing conflict saw the [[Memorial Crater]] destroyed, as mentioned by Orion in this issue, and the fallout from the battle has further inflamed tensions in Cybertronian society.
* Windblade was wounded in [[The Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part Three|issue #9]] and subsequently taken to the medical center in issue #10, though her condition was left unclear. This issue reveals that she will recover.
* Bumblebee is revealed to be a deep-cover operative for Orion Pax; this explains the ''real'' reason why he expressed an interest in joining the Ascenticon Guard in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Five|issue #5]]; and may also clarify his semi-regular disappearances in issues [[The World In Your Eyes Part Three|#3]] and [[The World In Your Eyes Part Four|#4]].
* Additionally, Bumblebee notes that he's been in Orion's debt for a "long time;" ''presumably'', this has something to do with Bumblebee's still-mysterious expulsion from Security Operations, as revealed in issue #5, though the precise circumstances behind this incident have yet to be revealed.
* Orion mentions the botched attack on Megatron's rally, which took place in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Two|issue #2]]; several characters since then have occasionally touched on the suspiciously incompetent nature of the attack.
* Sixshot retains the battle damage he sustained at the hands of Windblade in issue #9, and warns Visper and Storm Cloud not to end up on the same list he's placed [[Flamewar (G1)|Flamewar]] and [[Shadow Striker (G1)|Shadow Striker]] on, referencing his rather poor treatment of the duo in the same issue.

===Transformers references===
* Stained glass windows on the walls of the Senate depict [[Alpha Trion (G1)|Alpha Trion]], [[Solus Prime]], [[Nexus Prime]], [[Solomus]], and [[Quintus Prime]]. These were not a script mandate, and were added by artist [[Anna Malkova]]; according to her, they are meant to represent various branches of the government: legislative, judicial, executive, social services, and education.<ref>{{twitter|Hehe, windows from front to back: Alpha Trion, Solus, Nexus, Solomus and Quintus. I was going for a sort of governmental symbolism there with figures who could symbolize various branches of the state - Legislative, Judical, Executive, as well as Social services and education :)|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1169233149664124929|Anna Malkova|2019|09|04}}</ref> Other statues in the hall are based off a stylized version of Sentinel Prime's [[Sentinel Prime (ROTF)|live-action film series counterpart.]] <ref>{{twitter|As for the statues by the doors - well, those are a tongue-in-cheek stylized Movie Sentinel look alikes :)|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1169233913732128768|Anna Malkova|2019|09|04}}</ref>
* Chromia name-drops [[Glyph (Universe)|Glyph]] as the 'bot responsible for unscrambling the garbled data recovered from the Rise base, referencing the character’s history as an accomplished linguist.
* Characters mentioned on the datapad include some well-known future Decepticons—[[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]] and [[Rumble (G1)|Rumble]]—and some more obscure characters, including [[Treadshot (G1)|Treadshot]] and [[Blackjack (G1)|Blackjack]].
* The critically wounded Windblade is interred within a clear tank of liquid, kept on life support via a series of tubes wired into her body; a similar fate befell [[Sideswipe (G1)/2005 IDW continuity|the original IDW incarnation of Sideswipe]], though in ''that'' case he didn’t recover and was, ultimately, euthanized.
* Sixshot swears by the [[Void]].
* The final group shot of the Ascenticons features most of the Ascenticons who've appeared in the series, with some new faces thrown in: [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] appears, using the orange-and-grey jet form based on his [[Jhiaxus (G2)#Generations|2014 ''Generations'' toy]]; behind him is [[Strika (BM)|Strika]], sporting a body that's close to her appearance in ''[[The Transformers: Till All Are One|Till All Are One]]'', and [[Ratbat (G1)|Ratbat]] in characteristic purple bat mode.

===Errors===
* After last issue’s gaffe, Soundwave is back to using his distinctive speech bubbles... however, in this issue, they're coloured ''yellow'', rather than blue.

===Covers (3)===
* '''Cover A''': Elita-1, by [[James Raiz]] and [[Josh Burcham]]
* '''Cover B''': Security Operations, by [[George Caltsoudas]]
* '''Retailer incentive cover''': Quake's on the loose, by [[Guido Guidi]]
<gallery>
File:TF2019 11 cvrA.jpg
File:TF2019 11 cvrB.jpg
File:TF2019 11 cvrRI.jpg
</gallery>

===Advertisements===
* ''[[Transformers: Galaxies]]'' series
* [[Transformers '84 issue 0|''Transformers '84'' #0]] one-shot
* New ''[[G.I. Joe (franchise)|G.I. Joe]]'' series
* ''[[Transformers (2019 comic)|Transformers]]'' (back cover)

===Reprints===
*'''''Transformers Volume 1: The World In Your Eyes''''' ([[January 22]], [[2020]]) ISBN 1684055318 / ISBN 978-1684055319
**Hardcover.
**Collects issues #1–12.
**Bonus material includes alternate covers.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 99: The Cracks Beneath Your Feet''''' ([[October 21]], 2020)
:*Contains ''Transformers'' issues #8–14.
:*Bonus material includes a cover gallery and an intro by [[Simon Furman]].

<gallery>
TF-IDW-2019v1.jpg|'''''Volume 1: The World In Your Eyes'''''; cover art by [[Cryssy Cheung]]
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v99.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 99: The Cracks Beneath Your Feet''''' cover by [[Dreamwave Productions|Dreamwave]] (Cyclonus) and [[Angel Hernandez]]
</gallery>

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
*[https://graphicpolicy.com/2019/08/27/preview-transformers-11/]

{{DEFAULTSORT:Cracks Beneath Your Feet Part 5}}
[[Category:Transformers (2019) issues]]

Flyt

2022-07-18T10:08:39Z

Bumblebee2000: missed that there was a second twitter reference here, added

[[File:Tremors Flyts.jpg|thumb|upright=1.0|right|UHH DINOSAURS!]]
'''Flyts''' are pterosaur-like alien creatures that have made [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] their home. They're docile enough to be kept as pets.

==Fiction==
===2019 IDW continuity===
[[File:TheWorldInYourEyesPart5 ProwlAndGreen.jpg|thumb|upright=1.2|left|But I don't want to cure cancer. I want to turn people into dinosaurs.]]
Flocks of flyts could be seen circling [[Leviathan (G1)|Leviathan]] as she went about her harvesting duties. {{storylink|The World In Your Eyes Part Three}} The creatures would often glue their eggs to Leviathan's hull, and after [[Green|one of them]] fell off and hatched, it was collected by a [[Voin]] scavenger and sold to [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]]. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's|Swindle's}}

Naming her "Green", [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] kept her in his quarters as a pet, feeding her bits of [[skitter]]. {{storylink|The World In Your Eyes Part Five}} When [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]] visited Prowl, he remarked on the unimaginative nature of Green's name. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's|Swindle's}}

After Leviathan had fallen into a fissure, the flyt flock buzzed around above the crack. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Tremors|Tremors}}
{{--}}

==Notes==
*The flyt are very loosely inspired by [[Pteraxadon]] from the ''[[War for Cybertron: Siege]]'' toyline.<ref>{{twitter|I think it's best to ask Mr. Ruckley since i drew it as a creature of a species briefly shown in previous issues|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1125840794991116288|Anna Malkova|2019|05|07}}</ref> <ref>{{Twitter|Not really ... but then again, vaguely sort of. One of the secondary reasons for having organic life around is (perhaps, one day) as a pointer to how some TFs might end up with animalish alt-modes ...|https://twitter.com/Brian_Ruckley/status/1166726077902991365|Brian Ruckley|2019|08|28}}</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Alien species]]
[[Category:IDW (2019) species]]

Flyt

2022-07-18T10:05:41Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

[[File:Tremors Flyts.jpg|thumb|upright=1.0|right|UHH DINOSAURS!]]
'''Flyts''' are pterosaur-like alien creatures that have made [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] their home. They're docile enough to be kept as pets.

==Fiction==
===2019 IDW continuity===
[[File:TheWorldInYourEyesPart5 ProwlAndGreen.jpg|thumb|upright=1.2|left|But I don't want to cure cancer. I want to turn people into dinosaurs.]]
Flocks of flyts could be seen circling [[Leviathan (G1)|Leviathan]] as she went about her harvesting duties. {{storylink|The World In Your Eyes Part Three}} The creatures would often glue their eggs to Leviathan's hull, and after [[Green|one of them]] fell off and hatched, it was collected by a [[Voin]] scavenger and sold to [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]]. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's|Swindle's}}

Naming her "Green", [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] kept her in his quarters as a pet, feeding her bits of [[skitter]]. {{storylink|The World In Your Eyes Part Five}} When [[Nightbeat (G1)|Nightbeat]] visited Prowl, he remarked on the unimaginative nature of Green's name. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Swindle's|Swindle's}}

After Leviathan had fallen into a fissure, the flyt flock buzzed around above the crack. {{storylink|Rise of the Decepticons: Tremors|Tremors}}
{{--}}

==Notes==
*The flyt are very loosely inspired by [[Pteraxadon]] from the ''[[War for Cybertron: Siege]]'' toyline.<ref>{{twitter|I think it's best to ask Mr. Ruckley since i drew it as a creature of a species briefly shown in previous issues|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1125840794991116288|Anna Malkova|2019|05|07}}</ref> </ref><ref>[https://twitter.com/Brian_Ruckley/status/1166726077902991365 @Brian_Ruckley on Twitter, 28 August 2019]</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Alien species]]
[[Category:IDW (2019) species]]

The World In Your Eyes Part Five

2022-07-18T09:58:11Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{Comicstory
|seriesissue=''[[Transformers (2019 comic)|Transformers]]'' #5
|prev=The World In Your Eyes Part Four
|next=Orion Pax: Free Fall
|caption=
|image=TF2019 05-cvrB.jpg
|title="The World In Your Eyes Part Five"
|publisher=[[IDW Publishing]]
|date=[[May 15]], 2019
|coverdate=May 2019
|written by=[[Brian Ruckley]]
|art by=[[Anna Malkova]] (pg. 1-4), [[Angel Hernandez]] (pg. 4-6, 8-9, 12-13, 16-20), [[Sara Pitre-Durocher]] (pg. 7, 10-11, 14-15)
|colors by=[[Joana Lafuente]] and [[Josh Burcham]]
|letters by=[[Tom B. Long]]
|editor=[[David Mariotte]] and [[Tom Waltz]]
|continuity=[[2019 IDW continuity]]
|chronology=
}}

'''Chromia uncovers an alarming conspiracy, a conflicted Bumblebee finds himself at a crossroads, and an overeager Rubble's curiosity lands him in over his head.'''

==Synopsis==
[[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] records the latest in a series of political broadcasts that will be played across [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]: the Ascenticon leader rails against the [[Nominus Edict]] that has, in his view, stymied the expansion of the Cybertronian race. [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] observes that this latest message will reach thousands, and his words are indeed borne out when the message is broadcast, with a crowd gathering around a screen in the streets of [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]] to watch. But [[Chromia (G1)|Chromia]], who's passing by one such broadcast, has more pressing concerns; a call with [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] regarding [[energon]] distribution records confirms her suspicions that a dozen members of [[The Rise]] have indeed stopped withdrawing their regular fuel allotments and gone into hiding...but she's blindsided when Sideswipe reveals that more than ''two hundred'' Cybertronians have abruptly gone off the grid in the days since [[Brainstorm (G1)|Brainstorm]]'s murder.

Elsewhere, [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] reflects on the recent investigations from the privacy of his office as he tends to [[Green|his pet]]. Prowl muses aloud that Cybertron's unbroken peace and prosperity has dulled his old predatory instincts, and the loss of this old edge is why it's taken him this long to figure out how to best root out an unlicensed [[Voin]] scavenger: rather than operating within the Voin community, he needs to find its clients and scare ''them'' into cooperating with his inquiries.

At the [[Tether]], [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] bids [[Rubble]] goodnight at the end of another training shift. Rubble waits for [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] to pick him up so that they can take the space elevator up to the [[Winged Moon]] itself, but Bumblebee calls in on Rubble's communicator with bad news: they'll need to postpone their trip, as his mentor has another one of his pressing secret appointments. Bumblebee promises the crestfallen Rubble that he'll take him there as soon as he can. Wheeljack comforts Rubble by assuring him that Bumblebee has a good reason for doing so, and so the little 'bot heads back to his quarters alone… and, not far away, Bumblebee transforms and speeds off through a run-down part of town, down into an abandoned mineshaft.

Rubble's trip home takes him through Iacon's [[energon storage field]]s, where he stops to marvel at the city's vast stockpiles of fuel, past the [[A'ovan habitat]], a vast arcology constructed to house Cybertron's population of [[A'ovan]] refugees, and into the tangled streets of the city's bustling [[Xeno-Quarter]]. Fascinated by the diversity of the planet's organic immigrants, Rubble's attention wanders until a gaggle of Voin pass by, with one of them offhandedly recognizing Rubble as the "small Cybertronian." Realizing that this Voin ''must'' be the same unlicensed scavenger he encountered on the night of the murder, Rubble, eager to help Prowl and the other members of [[Security Operations]] in their investigation, impulsively gives chase.

In the depths of the mine, meanwhile, Bumblebee meets up with his mysterious contact. Although he was expecting [[Elita One (G1)|Elita-1]], he's instead confronted by none other than Senator Soundwave, who brushes off his concerns and abruptly plants a metal pole into the ground before he permits their conversation to continue.

Rubble's chase takes him deeper and deeper into the Xeno-Quarter, passing one alien after the next, but he's unable to locate the mystery Voin. Rubble instead tries to use his communicator to contact Bumblebee, but is unable to remember how to turn on the device... and that's when a crunching noise catches his attention, followed by one of the Voin's slaved organics bolting past, shrieking in terror...

Bumblebee's meeting with Soundwave starts off rough and doesn't get much better: Elita-1 might command the new [[Ascenticon Guard]], but it's Soundwave who's in charge of recruiting new members, and neither of them are particularly inclined to trust a former member of Security Operations. Bumblebee tries to point out that he's far from the only member of the force to join the Guard, and besides, he was ''expelled'' from the organization, but Soundwave retorts by pointing out that he's also a known Autobot associate. Exasperated, Bumblebee finally confesses the real reason why he's met up with Soundwave: recent events have caused Bumblebee to realize that their peaceful, carefully curated world is beginning to break down, and the Autobots have proven themselves unable to handle the burgeoning crisis. Moreover, as a new mentor, Bumblebee is willing to do whatever it takes to ensure that Rubble can have a future, though he trails off, noting that something is making it hard to think. The Senator explains that he took the precaution of planting his [[electromagnetic suppressor]], which blocks ''all'' incoming and outgoing transmissions to ensure the privacy of their conversation.

Elsewhere, Rubble has discovered the Voin as he peers around the corner... but he's not the ''only'' one to have done so: [[Quake (G1)|Quake]] has found it first, having smashed its glass tank and crushed the helpless Voin in his metal fist! Confusion turns to horror when Quake spies the young 'bot at the end of the alleyway and turns to pursue him. Rubble flees back the way he came, desperately trying to raise Bumblebee on his communicator—unaware that Bumblebee can't hear him, thanks to Soundwave—and unexpectedly reaches Prowl's private channel instead. Rubble blurts out that the Voin's been killed, but Prowl doesn't have time to process this before an explosive round from Quake's turret blows a hole in the wall and knocks Rubble off his feet.

A desperate Prowl attempts to get Rubble to tell him what's going on, but all he can hear are Rubble's own shouted pleas for mercy as Quake closes in. The very last thing Rubble sees is Quake's fist coming down on him...before his vision fades to static, and then nothing...

==Featured characters==
{{featuredcharacters
|c1=
|h2=[[Decepticon|Ascenticon]]s|c2=
* [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] (1)
* [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (2)
* [[Quake (G1)|Quake]] (13)
|h4=Cybertronians|c4=
* [[Prowl (G1)|Prowl]] (3)
* [[Chromia (G1)|Chromia]] (5)
* [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] (voice, 6)
* [[Gears (G1)|Gears]] (7)
* [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] (8)
* [[Rubble]] (9)
* [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] (10)
* [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (11)
|h5=Others|c5=
* [[Green]] (4)
* [[Voin]] scavenger (12)
}}

==Quotes==
"Weapons were destroyed or sealed away. Hundreds were exiled. Can you see the '''links''' in the chain? '''No more''' colonies. '''No more''' expansion. We must not antagonize other lifeforms. '''Hoard''' energon. We must never ever risk shortages again. Links in the chain. Forgings must become rare. Limits must be set on our energon rations—the fuel of our very '''lives'''. Can you see the '''chain'''?"
:—'''Megatron'''

"Another successful session maintaining the world's order and function, Rubble. Well done." "Thanks. It's fun." "Fun? This isn't about '''fun'''. It's about the endless, selfless struggle against entropy! Don't worry. I'm joking. Of '''course''' it's fun, at least some of the time."
:'''—Wheeljack''' and '''Rubble'''

"I've never even spoken to Megatron, but this world's going '''crazy''' if someone's trying to kill Senators. I'm a mentor now. I don't '''want''' a crazy world. I want the world I '''thought''' we had. Safe."
:—'''Bumblebee'''

"There is violence out in the void and on colony planets. But not on Cybertron. Not now. It does not happen here, he told me. My mentor does not know everything. Bumblebee can be wrong..."
:—'''Rubble'''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s final monologue

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
* Oh, damn! [[Cyclonus (G1)|Cyclonus]] mentioned that he'd seen a "blue bot" on the night of Brainstorm's death in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Four|the previous issue]]; even if he's not the culprit, it seems like Quake definitely has ''some'' connection to the murder, as his going after the Voin sure reads like an attempt to silence a potential witness...
* Megatron mentions Cybertronians being "exiled," presumably as part of the terms of the [[Nominus Edict]]; if you've been reading along, then there's a good chance your mind'll immediately jump to Cyclonus, who appeared in the previous issue and is suggested to be a veteran of a prior war against the [[Threefold Spark]]. Certainly, this issue suggests that the circumstances behind Cyclonus's new life in the wilderness may not have been entirely voluntary.
* Prowl feeds his pet a diet of [[skitter]]s; they were previously established to be an introduced species to Cybertron back in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Two|issue #2]].
* Confirming what was implied back in issue 2, this issue confirms that Cybertron's population of [[A'ovan]] were displaced from their homeworld by the [[Thraal]], again hearkening back to the history of the two races as first related in [[Transformers Comic issue 3|issue #3]] of [[Transformers (Titan Magazine)|Titan's ''Transformers'']] magazine.
* Bumblebee had been cagey about the reason why he abruptly left Security Operations in [[The World In Your Eyes Part One|issue #1]]; here, he reveals that he was expelled, though ''why'' remains a mystery. Additionally, he refers to the attack on Megatron's last Ascenticon rally as his primary motivation behind joining the Ascenticon Guard, which occurred in issue #2.
* Rubble first had difficulties using his built-in communicator in [[The World In Your Eyes Part Three|issue #3]]. That issue also had Chromia wire his communicator to hers, which, evidently, also linked his system to Prowl's.
* Rubble's last thoughts are a condensed version of his opening monologue from the beginning of issue #2.

===Transformers references===
* Prowl's organic, pterosaur-like pet is very loosely based on the [[Battle Master]] [[Pteraxadon]] from the ''Siege'' toyline,<ref>{{Twitter|oh heck! The pages I drew are up on preview! Dont miss this issue y'all it's a big one!|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1125798518411669504|Anna Malkova|2019|05|07}}</ref> <ref>{{twitter|I think it's best to ask Mr. Ruckley since i drew it as a creature of a species briefly shown in previous issues|https://twitter.com/Anna__Malkova/status/1125840794991116288|Anna Malkova|2019|05|08}}</ref> which featured in stock photography with Prowl's ''War for Cybertron'' toy.
* Rubble's muddled recollection of Cybertron's many organic immigrants include a race that he misremembers as either the "Akluthan" or the "Aklutheen;" assuming that he's referring to one of the many pre-existing alien races in ''Transformers'' lore, it seems a safe bet that he's talking about the [[Akalouthan]], who previously appeared in the ''[[Transformers: Universe (comic)|Universe]]'' comic.
* It might seem a little odd to have Bumblebee flag up Soundwave as a Senator, but it's not an entirely unprecedented development: backstory for the [[Aligned continuity family]] established that [[Soundwave (WFC)|that version of Soundwave]] was also a Senator, though it was never really touched upon outside of a brief reference in ''[[Transformers: The Covenant of Primus|The Covenant of Primus]]''.

===Errors===
* On page 14, Bumblebee's dialogue is missing a comma between "guard" and "I'd've."

===Other notes===
*[[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]] and [[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]] appear in vehicle mode on this issue's A cover. Skywarp would not debut in this continuity until [[The Change In Your Nature Part Three|issue #15]] while Thundercracker would have to wait until all the way in [[Radical Time|issue #42]]

===Covers (6)===
* '''Cover A:''' [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Orion Pax]], Bumblebee, Megatron, Chromia, and [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]], by [[Andrew Griffith]] and [[Thomas Deer]]
* '''Cover B:''' The spectre of Soundwave looms large over Bumblebee, by [[Cachét Whitman]]
* '''Retailer incentive cover A:''' A Marvel-styled clash between Optimus Prime and Megatron, by [[Guido Guidi]], to celebrate the franchise's 35th anniversary
* '''Retailer incentive cover B:''' A Optimus Prime and Megatron face off in the style of [[The Transformers (cartoon)|the original cartoon]], by [[Adam Riches]]
* '''The Fellowship exclusive cover A:''' [[Grimlock (G1)|Grimlock]] and [[Swoop (G1)|Swoop]], by [[John Gallagher]]
* '''The Fellowship exclusive cover B:''': Grimlock and Swoop in their dino modes, by John Gallagher
<gallery>
File:TF2019 05-cvrA.jpg|
File:TF2019 05-cvrB.jpg|
File:TF2019 05-cvr RIA.jpg|
File:TF2019 05-cvrRIB.jpg|
File:TF2019 05-cvrREA.jpg|
File:TF2019 05-cvrREB.jpg|
</gallery>

===Advertisements===
* ''[[Star Trek vs. Transformers]]'' TPB
* ''[[Go-Bots (comic)|Go-Bots]]'' TPB
* ''Canto'' comic
* ''Clue:Candlestick'' comic (back cover)

===Reprints===
*'''''Transformers Volume 1: The World In Your Eyes''''' ([[January 22]], [[2020]]) ISBN 1684055318 / ISBN 978-1684055319
**Hardcover.
**Collects issues #1–12.
**Bonus material includes alternate covers.

*'''''[[Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection]] Volume 98: The World In Your Eyes''''' ([[October 7]], 2020)
:*Contains ''Transformers'' issues #1–7.
:*Bonus material includes a cover gallery, a Q&A with series writer [[Brian Ruckley]], and an intro by [[Simon Furman]].

<gallery>
TF-IDW-2019v1.jpg|'''''Volume 1: The World In Your Eyes'''''; cover art by [[Cryssy Cheung]]
File:DefinitiveG1Collection v98.jpg|'''''The Definitive G1 Collection Volume 98: The World In Your Eyes''''' cover by [[Dreamwave Productions|Dreamwave]] (Quake) and [[Cachét Whitman]]
</gallery>

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
* [https://graphicpolicy.com/2019/05/14/preview-transformers-5/ Preview]

{{DEFAULTSORT:World In Your Eyes Part 5}}
[[Category:Transformers (2019) issues]]

Drift (SG)

2022-07-18T08:26:31Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Notes */ Twitter template

{{faction|sgAutobot}}
{{disambig3.5|the evil Autobot|his heroic counterpart|Drift (G1)|Drift}}
:''Drift is an evil [[Autobot]] from the [[Transformers: Shattered Glass (franchise)|Shattered Glass]] [[continuity family]].''

[[Image:DriftSG-art.jpg|right|thumb|250px|Wait, does this mean [[Drift (G1)|normal Drift]] is [[Patrick Seitz|Deathstroke the Terminator]]?]]
The irreverent '''Drift''' is a Dimensional Fragment Eliminator, which means he's always taunting and combating those invaders who dare poke through the walls of his universe. The "Bot of Banter" is considered one of the most vile Autobots ever, and the chatty mercenary loves to dream up more creative ways to slay his targets. [[Optimus Prime (SG)|Optimus Prime]] has given Drift no boundaries, creating an immoral, money-driven monster.

The relentless and cruel Drift has only one real weakness: an irrational fear of [[petro-rabbit]]s.

{{TOCclear}}

==Fiction==
===Fun Publications ''Shattered Glass'' continuity===
Drift was an especially brutal Autobot serving as a bounty hunter and mercenary. [[Optimus Prime (SG)|Optimus Prime]] liked his style, allowing Drift to carry out his hunts however he saw fit. His irreverent attitude and impudent mouth may one day test the Prime's patience, though. {{storylink|Drift (SG)#Toys|2012 Drift profile card}} After Drift tracked down Optimus Prime in his private sanctuary, Optimus confided in Drift about his reasons for starting the Autobots. He had new concerns and a new job for Drift as well. {{storylink|Coalescence}}

Drift was partnered up with [[Stepper (SG)|Stepper]] to hunt intruders from other [[universal stream]]s. {{storylink|Stepper (SG)#Toys|BotCon 2015 Stepper profile card}}

During their time on Earth, Drift became a student of the mysterious Gigatron. Residing in Kita Kyushu, Drift trained vigorously to became a Samurai Gunman and underwent a dramatic change in temperament as he adopted his master's teachings. He was now an honorable, if egotistical, assassin.

When Stepper was captured by the Autobots and then vanishing following an encounter with interdimensional [[GoBots]], Drift hunted them down to balance the scales. He shot their transport out of the sky and held them at gunpoint after they crashed to Earth. To demonstrate his prowess, Drift fired off a warning shot in the air, then a blind second shot to destroy [[BuggyMan|Buggyman]]'s [[R-Navi]] drone. He accepted security officer [[Treds]] as his opponent when Treds took responsibility for Stepper's loss. Fortunately for Treds, his ally [[Solarbot]] used his energies to catch Drift's first shot and guide it back down to Earth. As a result, the Samurai Gunman technically ended up shooting himself and the GoBots managed to escape. {{storylink|Last Sunset}}

Drift was part of the Autobot assault on [[Decepticon City (SG)|Decepticon City]] on their universe's native [[Earth]]. When [[Megatron (SG)|Galvatron]] arrived in the ''[[Annex]]'' to fight back, Drift initially engaged him. [[Rodimus (SG)|Rodimus]] called him and the other Autobots off, though, to let [[Optimus Prime (SG)|Optimus Prime]] fight the Decepticon leader. {{storylink|Memory's Splinter}}

After Galvatron defeated Prime, Drift and the others fled aboard [[Sky Lynx (SG)|Sky Lynx]] back to Cybertron. {{storylink|Restoration}} When their ride announced they'd have to lighten their load, [[Rodimus (SG)|Rodimus]] promptly dumped [[Optimus Prime (SG)|Optimus Prime]] out the nearest hatch. Drift had no objections to Rodimus declaring himself the new leader. {{storylink|Familiar Reflections}}

When Optimus Prime returned as Nova Prime, Drift fought against his [[Knights of Unicron (SG)|Knights of Unicron]] until Rodimus was overthrown. {{storylink|Out of the One, Many}} He was taken into custody by the [[Autotrooper (SG Knights of Unicron)|Autotrooper]]s in the aftermath of the battle, but apparently took advantage of the dark [[Primus/Shattered Glass|Primus]]'s manifestation to flee Cybertron aboard the ships. {{storylink|The Future Buried...}}

==Toys==
===''Timelines''===
[[Image:SGtoy-Drift.jpg|right|thumb|300px|Now if they want to get really meta, [[Fun Publications]] should also [[redeco]] this guy as Green Lantern.]]
*'''Shattered Glass Drift''' (Deluxe, 2012)
**''Accessories'': Two "dual swords", one large sword, left & right pistols
:''[[Transformers Timelines (toyline)|Timelines]]'' Drift is a [[redeco]] of ''[[Transformers: Generations (toyline)|Generations]]'' [[Drift (G1)#Generations|Drift]], in red with white highlights. In addition to the three swords that came with the original Drift toy, he comes with the two small guns that came with ''Generations'' [[Blurr (G1)/toys#Generations|Blurr]]; however, because these were not intended to come with this version of the mold, factory carelessness resulted in a large number of units coming with two of the same gun, when they should feature tabs on opposite sides. As the tabs on the guns only serve to attach them to the large rifle included with ''Generations'' Blurr, and as the doors of the Drift version of the mold cannot be used to holster the small guns, the effect this has on the figure is, at best, negligible, although this has not prevented the [[Ruined FOREVER|usual reaction]]. The hood of his vehicle mode sports the character [http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E5%AE%9A 定] ("decided").

: Drift is one of two [[2012]] [[Transformers Collectors' Club]] [[exclusive]] figures (the other being ''Timelines'' [[Runabout (G1)#Timelines|Over-Run]]).

: This mold was [[retool]]ed into ''Generations'' [[Blurr (G1)/toys#Generations|Blurr]].

: Drift sold out within 48 hours of being available (taking into account problems with the store's ordering process).

::*''[http://tfu.info/2012/Autobot/TFCCSGDrift/drift.htm More information on Drift at TFU.info]''
{{GenerationsDriftMold}}

== Merchandise ==
=== Flame Toys ===
==== Kuro Kara Kuri====
[[File:FlameToysSGDrift.jpg|thumb|200px|The merc mech with the merch.]]
*'''Shattered Glass Drift''' (March 2019)
**''Number:'' '''01-A'''
:Part of [[Flame Toys]]' ''Kuro Kara Kuri'' line of high-end non-transforming poseable figures, Shattered Glass Drift is a redeco of the [[Drift (G1)#Flame Toys|Drift]] figure. Like his normal counterpart, Shattered Glass Drift features [[die-cast]] parts and LEDs in his head.
:Shattered Glass Drift lacks the fabric cloak included with the G1 version, but instead includes two pistols, accompanying holsters (that can be swapped out for the sword sheaths at his waist), and accompanying hands meant to hold said pistols.
:Customers who preordered Shattered Glass Drift on D4Toys also received a special extra "Helmet Armor" that could be swapped out with Shattered Glass Drift's normal front helmet piece. This extra piece partly covers his face similar to a samurai helmet.
{{--}}

==== Furai Model ====
*'''Shattered Glass Drift''' (May 2021)
**''Number:'' '''19'''
{{charstubtoys}}

==Notes==
* Drift was first described by FP as the "Mech with a Mouth." The phrase "Merc with a Mouth" is used to describe the [[Marvel Comics]] character, [[Wikia:marvel:Deadpool (Wade Wilson)|Deadpool]]. With ''Generation 1'' Drift being a silent, sullen, moody, dark anti-hero ninja, it may be fitting that his ''Shattered Glass'' opposite is a manic, fourth-wall breaking anti-villain with a thing for Bea Arthur.
* Fun Publications has explained that they wanted the character on Drift's hood to mean "a doom" because Drift "brings A DOOM to any enemy he meets". They were limited to only one character, however, and could not find a singular character that embodied what they wanted to convey. This resulted in the use of the character [http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E5%AE%9A 定] ("decided", as in "your fate is decided"?), which is "a stretch".<ref>[https://archive.is/DPciC @Botcon explains the character used on Shattered Glass Drift's hood.]</ref>
** If you are curious as to how Japanese speakers would execute such symbolism, obvious candidates include [https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%AD%BB#Japanese 死] ("death"), [https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%AE%BA#Japanese 殺] ("kill"), and [https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E7%8B%A9#Japanese 狩] ("hunt").<ref>{{twitter|If the Japanese chose it, it would have been around "death," "killing," or "hunting." (translated)|https://twitter.com/taaboustoybox/status/1160032685995151360|2019|08|10}}</ref> Commentary from Japanese Twitter users, 9 August 2019]</ref>
* In his final published appearance in ''[[Last Sunset]]'', Drift's personality has changed from that of Deadpool to a stereotypical samurai warrior. This was done as a reversal on the evolution of Drift in the 2005 IDW Continuity, from a moody and serious samurai under [[Shane McCarthy]] to an upbeat, spiritual crewmate on [[The Transformers: More than Meets the Eye]], as written by [[James Roberts]].

==References==
{{Reflist}}

==External links==
* [http://www.transformersclub.com/drift12.cfm ''SG'' Drift's page] @ TransformersClub.com

[[Category:Convention-original characters]]
[[Category:Ninjas]]
[[Category:Shattered Glass Autobots]]
[[Category:Timelines characters]]

Transformers: Devastation

2022-07-18T08:22:23Z

Bumblebee2000: /* Trivia */

{{disambig3|Devastation}}
{{videogame
|title=''Transformers: Devastation''
|image=Transformers Devastation cover.jpg
|caption=Like I said, kids are cruel, Jack. And I'm very in touch with my inner child.
|developer=[[PlatinumGames]]
|publisher=[[Activision]]
|writer=[[Andy Schmidt]]<ref>[http://news.tfw2005.com/2015/06/19/andy-schmidt-confirmed-as-the-storyteller-for-transformers-devastation-293507 Andy Schmidt Confirmed As The Storyteller For Transformers: Devastation - TFW2005]</ref>
|additionalwriting=
|date=NA: [[October 6]], [[2015]] EU/AU: [[October 9]], [[2015]]
|platform=[[PlayStation]] 3, PlayStation 4, [[Xbox 360]], Xbox One, PC
|ratings=ESRB: T PEGI: 7+ CB: M
|credits=Transformers: Devastation/credits
}}

'''''Transformers: Devastation''''' is a video game by [[PlatinumGames]], announced at E3 2015 and released in October of the same year. Billed as a tie-in to ''[[Combiner Wars (franchise)|Combiner Wars]]'',<ref>[http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/transformers-forming-epic-storyline-toys-830399 'Transformers' Forming Epic Storyline with Toys, Comics and Video Games (Exclusive) - The Hollywood Reporter]</ref> ''Devastation'' is based in the [[Generation 1 continuity family]] and tells an original story, in which the [[Autobot]]s unite to prevent the [[Decepticon]]s from turning the [[Earth]] to metal. The game primarily draws inspiration from [[The Transformers (cartoon)|the original cartoon]], the [[2005 IDW continuity|IDW comics]], and the ''[[Combiner Wars (toyline)|Combiner Wars]]'' toyline, among other sources, and features the return of some of the surviving voice actors from the original cartoon. The game was directed by [[Kenji Saito]], and the soundtrack was composed by [[Satoshi Igarashi]], [[Tetsuya Shibata]], and [[Jun Okubo]], with contributions by [[Vince DiCola]] and [[Kenny Meriedeth]].<ref>[http://news.tfw2005.com/2015/06/16/watch-the-first-transformers-devastation-gameplay-live-183026 Watch the first Transformers Devastation gameplay! - TFW2005]</ref>

''Devastation'' was the final ''Transformers'' game published by [[Activision]]; following the expiration of their licensing agreement with [[Hasbro]], the game and its downloadable content were delisted from multiple digital storefronts on [[December 21]], [[2017]].<ref>[https://www.polygon.com/2017/12/22/16810202/platinum-games-transformers-devastation-legend-of-korra-steam-xbox-live-playstation-store Platinum’s Transformers and Korra games disappear from digital stores - Polygon]</ref>

{{TOCclear}}

==Plot==
===Chapter 1: City of Steel===
[[File:Devastation-Arrival.jpg|thumb|250px|right|[[Avengers]], Assemble!]]
In [[New York City]], a large explosion heralds the appearance of several giant mechanical claws emerging from the ground, causing mass destruction. [[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] and his Decepticons land downtown and observe the swarm of [[Insecticon (G1)|Insecticons]] that has filled the air, with [[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] also detecting traces of [[plasma energy]]. [[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] is hesitant, as no one has been able to control plasma energy since the [[Golden Age]], but Megatron rebukes him, intent on using the gift that they have been given. With the humans successfully evacuated from the city, [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] and his team of Autobots arrive to assess the threat and stop the Decepticons. After a brief run-in with [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]], Optimus and [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] come face to face with Megatron himself. Optimus demands Megatron cease his attack on the city, but Megatron only laughs, saying that Optimus doesn't even realize the truth of who is really behind the attack, and declaring he only wants to make "improvements" to the city. Optimus and Bumblebee defeat Megatron, but he slips away as the two are distracted by the sudden appearance of a giant Steel Tower.

[[File:Devastation-SecretMessage.jpg|thumb|250px|left|Yes, it's coming to me..."Be sure to drink your Ovaltine?!"]]
The Autobots pursue Megatron to the tower, where he deduces that it is somehow directing the Insecticons before receiving a stream of data encoded in [[Cybertronian language#The Transformers cartoon|Ancient Autobot]] from the tower. He rides away on [[Long Haul (G1)|Long Haul]], with the Autobots giving chase, and after [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] briefly battles Megatron, a hatch emerges from the ground leading below. Megatron enters, activating the security system to ensure the Autobots cannot follow. [[Teletraan I|Teletraan-1]] reveals that the hatch leads to the interior of an unknown ship buried below the city, requiring the shutdown of three sub-generators and a primary generator to gain access. With no other choice, the Autobots reach the sub-generators, each guarded by two of the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]], and shut them down. They return to the primary generator, but the Constructicons have beaten them there and reform Devastator. The team defeat the [[Combiner]], but a hologram of Megatron appears to reveal his plan: he now controls the Cybertronian ship known as the ''[[Proudstar]]'', and is using it to control the Insecticons, allowing him to [[cyberforming|cyberform]] the [[Earth]] into a new [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]] within mere days at the cost of all native life.
{{-}}
===Chapter 2: The Proudstar===
[[File:Devastation-ProudstarComponents.jpg|thumb|250px|right|[SELECT YOUR WEAPON]]]
After chasing down a [[Sentry-Bot]] containing the key-code to enter, the Autobots enter the ''Proudstar''. Optimus explains that the ship is of Autobot origin, and was once captained by [[Nova Prime]] as part of the Mission of Cybertronian [[Expansion]]. Its goal was to make uninhabited planets suitable for Cybertronian life and preserve a record of their race's culture via the [[Colonnade of Cybertron]] placed aboard the ship's supercomputer, the [[Ferrotaxis]], which controls both the [[Plasma Core]] and the Insecticons. With so much of Cybertron's culture having been lost over the course of the [[Great War (G1)|Great War]], the Autobots make it their mission to retrieve the Ferrotaxis intact and shut down the Plasma Core, stopping the cyberforming. As they split up to explore, Optimus notes a feeling of darkness permeating the ship. The group briefly gets locked into a battle with Soundwave, but he is called away by Megatron for other matters, leaving them to be swarmed by Insecticons bursting from the many [[stasis pod]]s housed within the ship. The Autobots battle through the swarms, including several giant-sized Ancient Insecticons, as the voice of [[Teletraan Alpha]] cryptically hints at the [[The Transformers: The Movie|dark future events]] each Autobot will face, including prophesying that the Great War will come to an end without Optimus Prime there to see it. They reach the Plasma Core, but due to plasma energy's unpredictability, [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] predicts blowing up the Core will cause an explosion that will take half the Earth with it. Defeating the Insecticon guards, they break the shielding protecting the Core, but the security system envelops the core in a protective casing and fires it away from the ship.
{{-}}
===Chapter 3: The Core===
[[File:Devastation-CoreDamage.jpg|thumb|250px|right|That electrical storm is dangerous. Everyone grab your [[yellow boots]]!]]
With the ship and Insecticons rendered inactive due to the loss of their power source, the Autobots seek to retrieve the Plasma Core before Megatron, as well as shut it down due to the potentially dangerous leak sprung in the previous encounter. Knowing Megatron will need someone to retrieve the core, they encounter and defeat [[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]], who believes plasma energy is too dangerous to be controlled by anyone and tells them the Core's location on the promise that they get rid of it. Making their way to the island where the Core landed, the Autobots encounter Decepticon defenses at [[Liberty Bridge]], stalling for time so that the leak may be patched before they move it. The team uses an explosive cube of [[Red Energon]] to clear the forces at the bridge's entrance, but Starscream arrives to replace them. The Autobots defeat him and begin to cross the bridge, only to come under fire by [[Blitzwing (G1)|Blitzwing]] as they do so. They manage to hold him off until reaching the other side of the bridge, where they defeat him. Optimus approaches the badly-damaged Plasma Core container, but Starscream appears and carries it away before they have a chance to shut it down.
{{-}}
===Chapter 4: Possession===
[[File:Devastation-Menasor.jpg|thumb|250px|right|Great... AETHER!]]
Back at the tower, Soundwave reveals to Megatron that they were unable to patch the leak before Starscream took the Plasma Core, meaning its detonation is imminent. Only able to be repaired at a [[Plasma Energy Interface]] on Cybertron, Megatron orders Starscream to bring the unstable Core to the tower. The Autobots pursue him across the bridge, but the onset of a storm makes it difficult for Starscream to fly, causing him to lose his grip on the Core and drop it into the city. Optimus tracks Starscream's landing location, but Megatron sends [[Motormaster (G1)|Motormaster]] to the coordinates as well. The team race him to the crash site, barely beating him there, and fight him off. The Autobots follow the trail to the Plasma Core, and Wheeljack prepares to patch the leak while the others cover him. Just as he gets the case open, Motormaster and the rest of the [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] arrive and form [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]]. The Autobots defeat the Combiner and, in a fit of rage, he throws the Plasma Core case all the way to the tower. Megatron activates the [[space bridge]] to Cybertron and takes the Core and his troops through, ordering Starscream to hold off the Autobots.
{{-}}
===Chapter 5: To Cybertron===
[[File:Devastation-PlasmaEnergyInterface.jpg|thumb|250px|right|Well, there's your problem: you put the batteries in backwards!]]Optimus and his team follow the Decepticons through the space bridge, battling Starscream while in transit. They emerge on Cybertron just as Megatron leaves with the Plasma Core and Blitzwing appears for a rematch. The group defeat him and approach the Plasma Energy Interface, but before they can stop it, they are ambushed by [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]]. While ultimately defeated, Shockwave manages to hold the Autobots off long enough for [[Scrapper (G1)|Scrapper]] to finish repairing the Plasma Core and escape with Megatron. Bumblebee points out the insanity of their plan, but Shockwave argues that Nova Prime was the one who saw the need to cyberform populated planets, though Optimus refuses to believe it. Now back at the tower, Megatron orders the Plasma Core and the Ferrotaxis brought online, declaring the cyberforming process will be complete in less than one Earth day.
{{-}}
===Chapter 6: Ferrotaxis===
[[File:Devastation-Nova-Madness.jpg|thumb|250px|right|He took the cancellation of ''Animated''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s fourth season pretty hard.]]
Now patched and restored to the ''Proudstar'', the Plasma Core is put into overdrive, causing the Insecticons to restart the cyberforming process at a rapid rate, and the Autobots return to stop it. However, due to the poor repair job by the Constructicons, the Core ruptures and produces a gravitational anomaly that begins sucking the Autobots in. Retreating to a safe distance, Wheeljack deduces that if the core goes critical, it will lead to planetary extinction. Optimus decides that the only way to shut down both the Plasma Core and the Insecticons is by using the Ferrotaxis, which [[Grimlock (G1)|Grimlock]] points out is in Megatron's possession. However, Soundwave takes control of the ship's security systems, sabotaging their escape route. Barely evading his traps, the Autobots once again become aware of the darkness permeating the ''Proudstar''. Prime posits that while Nova Prime's mission may have initially been noble, cyberforming uninhabited planets to bring life to the galaxy, he and his crew were corrupted by some [[Unicron/Generation 1|unknown entity]] along the way, seeding darkness within his spark and driving him to insanity. The entity sought the destruction of Cybertron and its people, and still searches for the planet to this day, destroying all it encounters along the way. The Autobots head to the control room, but are blocked by Soundwave. Defeating him, the team prepares to storm the control room and take Megatron down once and for all.
{{-}}
===Chapter 7: Legacy===
[[File:Devastation-FinalBattle.jpg|thumb|250px|right|"You only want the Ferrotaxis because I'm using it." "Oh, yeah? Prove it." "Here." "Hey, man, I don't want your stupid Ferrotaxis."]]
As they approach the ''Proudstar''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s control room, the Autobots are beset by a legion of Decepticons seeking to defend it, including Motormaster, Thundercracker and [[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]]. The Autobots enter the control room, where Megatron mocks them before leaving with the Ferrotaxis, ordering the Constructicons to finish them off. After battling all six individually, the Constructicons merge into Devastator, prompting another battle. However, it isn't long before Menasor shows up as well, forcing them to fight both Combiners at once. Eventually, both are knocked off the platform to their destruction, and the Autobots head for the surface. Emerging from below, the Autobots find Megatron watching in delight as the planet is ripped apart by the cyberforming, declaring their home will live once more and noting how much he and Optimus could have accomplished together as allies. Optimus demands that Megatron hand over the Ferrotaxis so that their culture might continue to be preserved and shared, but Megatron throws it away, declaring that they will have to defeat him to get it. The Autobots engage in battle in battle with Megatron and emerge victorious, with Optimus once again demanding the Ferrotaxis. Megatron declares that if he can't have it, no one can, launching it high into the sky with his fusion cannon. A swarm of Insecticons follows the Ferrotaxis into the air, and Optimus grabs hold of one of them to catch up, with Megatron in hot pursuit.

[[File:Devastation-Space.jpg|thumb|250px|left|Space...the final <s>boss battle</s> frontier...]]
Now in Earth's orbit as the Insecticons surround the Ferrotaxis, Optimus prepares to fire at the computer, only to be knocked from his perch by Megatron, forcing the two into a zero-gravity final battle. Megatron argues that he fights to restore Cybertron, the home that Optimus abandoned, and that life comes from servos, gyros, and fuel, not flesh. Optimus rejects this, however, believing that destroying other worlds to keep Cybertron on life-support can't be the only way. With one final blow, Optimus manages to knock Megatron out long enough to retrieve the Ferrotaxis, but cannot shut down the Insecticons due to a failsafe activated by Megatron. Megatron declares the only way to stop the Ferrotaxis is to destroy it at the cost of Cybertron's culture and history, and that Cybertron's fate is now in Optimus's hands. Optimus replies that he has the courage to make the right decision and fires upon the Ferrotaxis, destroying it. As a result, the Plasma Core shuts down and the Insecticons all fall lifelessly back to Earth. Megatron is mortified, but Prime is resolute in his decision, believing humanity should decide its own fate. As he falls back to Earth, he tells the other Autobots that while they have lived on Earth for years, they have never truly accepted it as their home, holding out hope of returning to a re-forged Cybertron. While that may someday occur, Prime declares that as of that day, the Earth is their true home, and they are to protect it no matter the cost.

[[File:Devastation-Nova-Awakens.jpg|thumb|250px|right|Oy! Ten thousand years will give you such a crick in the neck.]]
Later, back at the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]], a recovered Optimus discusses with Wheeljack if he has found a way to strengthen their forces, with Wheeljack deeming the process risky. As he reflects on what Teletraan Alpha told him aboard the ''Proudstar'', Teletraan-1 receives a transmission from [[Defensor (G1)|Defensor]] and [[Superion (G1)|Superion]], who throw their full support behind Optimus's plan. Deciding that this is the price he must pay to rid the world of the Decepticons, Optimus and Wheeljack examine schematics for the [[Optimus Maximus (G1)|project]]. Unbeknownst to them, one of the pods on the'' Proudstar'' has broken open. Nova Prime awakens...
{{--}}

==Featured Characters==
{{Featuredcharacters
|c1=
*[[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] ([[Peter Cullen]])
**[[Nemesis Prime (G1)|Nemesis Prime]]*
*[[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]] ([[Dan Gilvezan]])
**Goldfire*
*[[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]] ([[Michael Bell]])
**[[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]]*
*[[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] ([[Christopher Swindle]])
*[[Grimlock (G1)|Grimlock]] ([[Gregg Berger]])
*[[Defensor (G1)|Defensor]] ([[Steve Blum]])
*[[Superion (G1)|Superion]] ([[Jamieson Price]])
|c2=
*[[Megatron (G1)|Megatron]] ([[Frank Welker]])
*[[Starscream (G1)|Starscream]] ([[Scott Whyte]])
*[[Soundwave (G1)|Soundwave]] (Frank Welker)
*[[Blitzwing (G1)|Blitzwing]] ([[Dave Boat]])
*[[Thundercracker (G1)|Thundercracker]] ([[André Sogliuzzo]])
*[[Skywarp (G1)|Skywarp]] (Scott Whyte)
*[[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] ([[Darryl Kurylo]])
*[[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]] (Christopher Swindle)
*[[Rumble (G1)|Rumble]] (Scott Whyte)
*[[Laserbeak (G1)|Laserbeak]]
*[[Buzzsaw (G1)|Buzzsaw]]
*[[Ravage (G1)|Ravage]]
*[[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] (Dave Boat)
**[[Scrapper (G1)|Scrapper]] (Michael Bell)
**[[Scavenger (G1)|Scavenger]] (André Sogliuzzo)
**[[Mixmaster (G1)|Mixmaster]] (Jamieson Price)
**[[Long Haul (G1)|Long Haul]] (Gregg Berger)
**[[Bonecrusher (G1)|Bonecrusher]] (Steve Blum)
**[[Hook (G1)|Hook]] (Jamieson Price)
*[[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]] ([[James Arnold Taylor]])
**[[Motormaster (G1)|Motormaster]] ([[Liam O'Brien]])
**[[Breakdown (G1)|Breakdown]]**
**[[Offroad (CW)|Offroad]]**
**[[Dead End (G1)|Dead End]]**
**[[Drag Strip (G1)|Drag Strip]]**
*[[Battlecharger|Ground Soldiers]] (Steve Blum, Darryl Kurylo, [[Jim Ward]])
*[[Seeker (body-type)|Seekers]] (James Arnold Taylor, André Sogliuzzo, Liam O'Brien)
*[[Insecticon (G1)|Insecticons]] (Darryl Kurylo, Christopher Swindle, Dave Boat)
**[[Kickback (G1)|Kickback]]
**[[Shrapnel (G1)|Skrapnel]]
**[[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]]
|c4=
*[[Teletraan I|Teletraan-1]] (Jim Ward)
*[[Teletraan Alpha]] (Jim Ward)
*[[Nova Prime]]
*[[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]]†
*[[Kranix (G1)|Kranix]]†
*[[Kremzeek]]
|nonumbering=true
}}

:''*Indicates character available only as downloadable content skin.''
:''**Indicates character who only appears in vehicle mode.''
:''† Indicates character who only appears in text-based log entries.''

==Quotes==
"But...but PLASMA energy is unstable! No one has been able to tame it since...since...the GOLDEN AGE!" 
"Then stand back Starscream, and watch me tame it, as I have tamed you."
:— '''Megatron''' made '''Starscream''' his patsy.

"Optimus... come to save the day, I presume?"
:— Just like old times for '''Megatron''' and Optimus Prime.

"Less talk, Autobot. More dying."
:— '''Megatron''' plays for keeps.

"They call me 'Goldfire'! ...Ridiculous, I know."
:— '''Bumblebee''' is less than impressed by his DLC costume.

"Scanning... Identified. Cybertronian Bumblebee. Beware the coming tide of chaos... You will evolve known by another name. In time, your spirit will be that of legend. Your monikers will be many: The World's Bridge. Goldbug. Race-Welder. And finally... Goldfire." 
"Well, that makes me feel special..."
:— '''Teletraan Alpha''' foresees '''Bumblebee''''s future.

"My loyalty only goes so far. Tampering with Plasma Energy? That's madness." 
"Wow, that took, like, no convincing at all. No wonder they call you ThunderCRACKER." 
"Very funny, pipsqueak."
:— Much to '''Thundercracker''''s dismay, '''Bumblebee''' learns the true meaning of his name.

"Last one there's the corroded diode, Autobots!"
:— '''Motormaster''' tells the Autobots to eat his dust.

"We should have been allies, you know. Imagine what we could have accomplished... But you never had the manifolds to do what needed to be done." 
"I have the manifolds to stand up for those who cannot stand for themselves."
:— '''Megatron''' and '''Optimus Prime''' talk motivation.

"Why must you always interfere?" 
"You would place Cybertron at the center of the universe." 
"Cybertron is the center of my universe. How is it not at the heart of yours?" 
"Cybertron is about all life. Destruction to keep Cybertron on life support--there must be another way." 
"Flesh isn't life. Servos, gyros and fuel--this is where life comes from! You're defending--''bi-product''--at best! I will restore Cybertron and retake the galaxy!" 
"That ambition will be your end."
:— '''Megatron''' and '''Optimus''' wax poetic as they battle in space.

"Behold, Optimus. A new Cybertron is being born..." 
"No, you are only destroying the Earth, not creating." 
"You don't really believe that, do you?" 
"It is the only thing I am sure I believe. You must be stopped." 
"You're welcome to try." 
"It will be my pleasure." 
"I'm not done yet!!"
:— The final battle between '''Megatron''' and '''Optimus''' comes to a head.

"Autobots. We have lived on Earth for decades. But I see now that we have not truly accepted Earth as our home, holding out some distant hope that we would return to a newly re-forged Cybertron. And maybe one day, that will happen, but we cannot continue to live in between worlds. From this day forward, we are no longer Cybertronians who are stranded on another world. Now we are a part of Earth. And we must treat Earth as though we were forged here. And we must protect our home...no matter the cost."
:— '''Optimus''' monologues as he falls back to Earth.

==Gameplay==
''Devastation'' is a fast-paced hack-and-slash brawler, similar to many of Platinum's other titles like ''Bayonetta'' and ''[[Solid Snake|Metal Gear]] Rising: Revengeance''. Players choose from five Autobots ([[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]], [[Bumblebee (G1)|Bumblebee]], [[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe]], [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]], and [[Grimlock (G1)|Grimlock]]) and battle Decepticons using a combination of light and heavy physical attacks, with players generally having to defeat an entire wave of enemies in order to proceed. Players can chain these attacks into a combo, as well as extend their combos and utilize new moves by strategically transforming back and forth between vehicle and robot modes during strings of attacks. Each of the Autobots is also equipped with a projectile-based weapon, allowing them to attack enemies they cannot normally reach, such as airborne [[Seeker (body-type)|Seekers]]. Players have multiple defensive options, being able to block, dodge, parry, and counterattack against enemy blows; similar to the "Witch Time" mechanic from ''Bayonetta'', dodging at just the right moment will induce "Focus" and cause time to slow down for the surrounding environment, giving players a chance to move in close and counterattack. Certain gameplay segments will encourage the use of vehicle mode over robot mode, such as chasing down escaping Decepticons on a highway or transforming back to robot mode at maximum speed to break an enemy shield.

Each of the five Autobots has a different set of moves and properties; Optimus is the most equally-balanced, Bumblebee focuses on quickness over attack strength, Sideswipe uses a hit-and-run attack style, Wheeljack is largely based around ranged combat and defense, and Grimlock deals in slow but powerful close-range strikes. Each character also possesses a unique ability that they can trigger in battle, such as Wheeljack's shield or Grimlock's grapple; this depletes energy from their Ability Gauge, which automatically refills over time. Attacking enemies will also fill the Ultimate Gauge; when full, this will allow players to use their character-specific Ultimate Attack, doing heavy damage to multiple foes.

The game also includes a player-customization system. Several different weapon types can be potentially dropped by enemies or found in weapons caches and vaults. Each type of weapon, such as axes, swords, or hammers, can only be used by certain characters, and new weapons can be synthesized by using the old ones as materials, allowing players to create stronger weapons of different types. Players can also spend in-game [[Galactic Credits|credits]] to develop [[T.E.C.H.]] that grants passive boosts to their characters, giving them bonuses such as auto-recovery or an increased credit drop rate; the strength of the T.E.C.H. developed varies depending on the amount of credits spent, as well as the player's success at a quicktime event during the synthesis process. Characters' individual stats can also be improved either through combat or by purchasing upgrades with credits. The Lab acts as the in-game store, allowing players to purchase additional weapons, temporary power-ups, and new moves for all five Autobots. Players can access all of these options by returning to the [[Ark (G1)|Ark]], either between story chapters or by using one of several Teletraan uplinks in each stage, which also function as checkpoints.

The game features seven Story chapters. At the beginning, three difficulty levels are accessible ("Scout", "Warrior", and "Commander"), while two higher difficulties ("[[Magnus (rank)|Magnus]]" and "[[Prime (rank)|Prime]]") are unlocked after completing the lower ones. Players who go off the beaten path in the story chapters may find side missions and [[Transpacial Converters]] scattered about; completing these will reward players with additional weapons. In addition to the primary Story Mode, the game also includes a Challenge Mode with 50 stand-alone missions.

A Gallery mode allows players to view assorted art pieces, such as stage concept art and [[Transformers: Generations (toyline)|Generations]] [[package art|character art]]. New art can be unlocked by finding bouncing [[Kremzeek]]s and Mystery Objects in each stage, or shooting down Decepticon Flags and Spy Ops hovering in the sky. Collectible [[Source:Devastation info logs|info logs]] explaining various concepts and backstory elements can be found throughout the game as well. Completing the game will add the credits sequence to the gallery, viewable with or without the credits themselves, as well as a model viewer that allows players to view all of the 3D character models, accompanied by their respective themes. The model viewer includes a "Transform" command that lets you view both of their modes, and a "Try Me" button that plays some of their voice samples.

Players who pre-ordered the game received a downloadable content bundle that included character skins for Optimus Prime, Bumblebee, and Sideswipe based on [[Nemesis Prime (G1)|Nemesis Prime]], Goldfire, and [[Red Alert (G1)|Red Alert]] respectively, as well as three new weapons: the [[Dark Star Saber]], the Photon Disruptor, and the twin Golden Hunters. This bundle was later made available for general purchase roughly a month following the game's release.

==Trophy/Achievement list==
When completing various goals and tasks during the game, the player will be rewarded as part of their console of choice's meta-goal system. Players can earn up to 31 Trophies on PlayStation 3 and PlayStation 4, and 30 Achievements on the Xbox 360 and Xbox One. The PlayStation versions' trophies come in four types: Bronze, which represent easier tasks and are worth the least experience; Silver, which are awarded for challenges of mid-level difficulty; Gold, which are given for harder tasks and worth more experience; and Platinum, the highest-level trophy unlocked only after earning all of a game's other trophies. On the Xbox versions, each achievement has a Gamerscore value that adds to the player's total Gamerscore across all games played; up to 1000 Gamerscore can be earned in ''Devastation''. These achievements can also be earned in the PC version as part of the Steam interface, but lack the individual values and weights from the console versions.

{| border=1 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=5
! Icon
! Achievement/Trophy name
! Achievement/Trophy description
! Gamerscore
! PS Trophy
|-
| [[File:Devastation Till All Are One.jpg|60px]]
| [['Til all are one|Till All Are One]]
| Complete all chapters on any difficulty.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Supreme Commander.jpg|60px]]
| [[Supreme Commander]]
| Complete all chapters on any difficulty using Optimus Prime.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Sting Like A Bee.jpg|60px]]
| Sting Like a Bee
| Complete all chapters on any difficulty using Bumblebee.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation The Wizard Of Iacon.jpg|60px]]
| The Wizard of [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]]
| Complete all chapters on any difficulty using Wheeljack.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Raging Bull.jpg|60px]]
| Raging Bull
| Complete all chapters on any difficulty using Sideswipe.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation The King.jpg|60px]]
| The King
| Complete all chapters on any difficulty using Grimlock.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation All Clear.jpg|60px]]
| All Clear
| Complete all Challenge Mode missions on any difficulty.
| 85 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Gold}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Halfway There.jpg|60px]]
| Halfway There
| Complete half of all Challenge Mode missions on any difficulty.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation No Stone Unturned.jpg|60px]]
| No Stone Unturned
| Collect all collectible items.
| 90 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Gold}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Avid Collector.jpg|60px]]
| Avid Collector
| Complete half of all collectible items.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Synthesis 101.jpg|60px]]
| Synthesis 101
| Synthesize 10 weapons.
| 15 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Bronze}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Full Throttle.jpg|60px]]
| Full Throttle
| Defeat 100 enemies with Vehicle/Dino Attacks.
| 15 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Bronze}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Dont Hit The Brakes.jpg|60px]]
| (Don't) Hit the Brakes!
| Defeat 100 enemies with Rush Attacks.
| 15 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Bronze}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Platinum.jpg|60px]]
| Platinum
| Complete all chapters, earning the highest rank, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater.
| 90 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Gold}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Catch This.jpg|60px]]
| Catch this!
| Use parrying to catch the following from an enemy: a boulder, a missile, and both drill types.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Pedal To The Metal.jpg|60px]]
| Pedal to the Metal
| Use Focus 100 times.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Quick Reflexes.jpg|60px]]
| Quick Reflexes
| After dodging, quickly counter with a melee attack 100 times.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Bullet Storm.jpg|60px]]
| Bullet Storm
| After dodging, quickly counter with a ranged attack 100 times.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Hawkeyed.jpg|60px]]
| Hawkeyed
| Perform 100 successful head shots.
| 15 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Bronze}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Flyswatter.jpg|60px]]
| Flyswatter
| Finish the lift battle in Chapter 2 without taking damage from Insecticons.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Urban Landscaping.jpg|60px]]
| Urban Landscaping
| In chapter 1, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, knock Devastator into a building 3 times.
| 15 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Bronze}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Roadblock.jpg|60px]]
| Roadblock
| In chapter 4, defeat Motormaster while racing him.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Surround Sound.jpg|60px]]
| Surround Sound
| In chapter 6, on diff. COMMANDER or greater, defeat Soundwave without defeating any cassettes.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Wrecking Crew.jpg|60px]]
| Wrecking Crew
| In chapter 1, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, defeat Devastator without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Hard-Core.jpg|60px]]
| HARD-Core
| In chapter 2, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, destroy the shielding without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Triple Changer.jpg|60px]]
| [[Triple Changer]]
| In chapter 3, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, defeat Blitzwing without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Destruction Derby.jpg|60px]]
| Destruction Derby
| In chapter 4, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, defeat Menasor without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Dont Look Him In The Eye.jpg|60px]]
| Don't Look Him in the Eye
| In chapter 5, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, defeat Shockwave without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Broken Radio.jpg|60px]]
| Broken Radio
| In chapter 6, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, defeat Soundwave without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation Emperor of Destruction.jpg|60px]]
| [[Emperor of Destruction]]
| In chapter 7, on difficulty COMMANDER or greater, defeat Megatron without taking damage.
| 30 {{gamerscore}}
| {{PS Silver}}
|-
| [[File:Devastation All Trophies.jpg|60px]]
| All Trophies
| Earned all other trophies.
|
| {{PS Platinum}}
|-
|}

==Notes==
===Errors===
*At the beginning of the game, Soundwave is not shown flying in the sky despite landing alongside Starscream, Blitzwing, and Megatron a moment later.
*In that same cutscene, the Decepticon flying next to Blitzwing is not Starscream, but one of the Warrior Seekers.
*In Chapter 1, Teletraan 1 pronounces "[[Kaon (polity)|Kaon]]" as "Kai-on" when it should be "Kay-on".
*In Chapter 1, when the Constructicons form Devastator, you can see straight through Devastator's shoulder joint in the brief moment before Bonecrusher attaches. This is due to the model's arm joint not being capped off at the end as it is usually obscured by Devastator's arm, thus allowing the camera to see within the model where the polygon backfaces are not rendered.
*In Chapter 1, when Megatron enters the hatch leading underground, Optimus mispronounces Teletraan-1 as "Teltraan-1", omitting the second syllable.
*In Chapter 3, when Optimus throws the Red Energon cube, it is inexplicably colored pink.
*In Chapter 4, after Starscream crashes in the Decepticon hangar, the faction symbols on all the other Decepticons suddenly pulse as one.

===Transformers references===
*All of the unlockable weapons are derived from those used in past ''Transformers'' series:
**Some of the weapons originate from ''[[Transformers: Prime (cartoon)|Transformers Prime]]'', such as the [[Star Saber (Prima)|Star Saber]], the [[Dark Star Saber]], and the [[Forge of Solus Prime]].
**Optimus carries both his standard [[energon-axe]] and [[ion blaster]].
**[[Sideswipe (G1)|Sideswipe's]] primary melee weapons are silver swords identical to the one included with his [[Sideswipe (G1)/toys#Masterpiece|G2 ''Masterpiece'' toy]]. His standard [[flare gun]] and [[Transformers: Generation 2 (Marvel)|G2 comic]] GZS-3 and MA685 blasters are also unlockable throughout the game.
**Bumblebee's blasters are based on the weapon included with his [[Bumblebee (G1)/toys#Masterpiece|Masterpiece toy]].
**Wheeljack's wrenches are based on the accessories included with his [[Wheeljack (G1)/toys#Generations|2010 ''Generations'' toy]].
**Grimlock wields his [[galaxial rocket launcher]] packaged with his [[Grimlock (G1)/toys#Generation 1|original toy]], though it is physically modeled after his Twin Stunner Laser. He can also unlock his [[energo weapon|Energo-sword]].
**The Piercing Rifle is based on [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]]'s blaster.
**The Small Blasters are based on those wielded by [[Rumble (G1)|Rumble]] and [[Frenzy (G1)|Frenzy]].
**The MOD Fusion Cannon and Battle Blade are based on [[live-action film series|live action]] [[Megatron (Movie)|Megatron]] and [[Optimus Prime (Movie)|Optimus Prime]]'s weapons, respectively.
**The basic hammer weapons bear a striking resemblance to the [[Magnus Hammer]].
**Heavy hammers, such as the Energon and Shock Hammer, are based on ''Age of Extinction'' [[Grimlock (AOE)|Grimlock]]'s mace.
**The Wrecking Ball resembles [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]]'s melee weapon.
**The Basic Blasters are based on the [[:File:MegatronsMasterPlan generic autobot pistol.jpg|generic Autobot pistols]] first introduced in "[[Megatron's Master Plan, Part 1]]".
**The Heavy Blaster is based on the animation model for [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]]'s photon missile launcher.
**The basic swords are slightly scaled-down versions of [[Razorclaw (G1)|Razorclaw]]'s [[Sonic sword]].
**The Battle Cutters are dead ringers for the saw weapon [[Hot Rod (G1)|Hot Rod]] briefly used in ''[[The Transformers: The Movie]]'' (later immortalized in plastic for his [[Hot Rod (G1)/toys#Masterpiece|first Masterpiece figure]]).
**The Photon Eliminator, Rodimus Prime's classic weapon, can be acquired after Magnus mode is unlocked.
**The Battle Swords resemble [[Optimus Primal (BW)|Optimus Primal]]'s swords. They are often dual-wielded in the game by Elite Seekers in Primal's original colors.
**The four "knuckle" weapons resemble the "Combat Claw" that came with the ''[[Transformers: Prime (toyline)|Prime]]'' [[Megatron (WFC)/toys#Prime|Voyager Megatron]] toy.
**The Loudspeaker is based on ''[[Transformers (2010 toyline)|Transformers]] [[Transformers (2010 toyline)#Hasbro Reveal the Shield subline|Reveal the Shield]]'' Deluxe Class [[Jazz (G1)/toys#Transformers (2010)|Special Ops Jazz]]'s weapon (itself based on [[Classic Pretender]] [[Jazz (G1)/toys#Pretender|Jazz]]'s weapon) in its combined form with the figure's loudspeaker accessories attached.
**The Magna Shot blaster is a signature weapon of [[Dai Atlas (G1)|Dai Atlas]].
**The Shockwave Blaster strongly resembles Shockwave's original toy in blaster mode.
**The Solar Beam Rifle is based on [[Devastator (G1)/toys#Generation 1|''Generation 1'' Devastator's]] weapon (called a "magna laser" in his and Mixmaster's [[instructions]] but a "solar energy beam rifle" in his [[bio]]).
**The drills Bonecrusher and Devastator use (both melee and ranged) can be unlocked after they are defeated. Both versions are based on the spring-loaded drills that came with their G1 toys.
**Motormaster/Menasor's classic Ionizer Sword and Cyclone Rifle can be unlocked after they are defeated.
**The Basic Spreadshot is based on the animation model of [[Hound (G1)|Hound]]'s hologram gun.
**The Heavy Spreadshot series of weapons are (appropriately) based on [[Getaway]]'s [[plasma-shell shotgun]].
**The four basic Machineguns {{sic}} are based on [[Kickback (G1)|Kickback]]'s "Electrothermic Blast Tube" (AKA the gun his G1 figure came with). Fittingly, the Kickback fought in Chapter 2 wields one of these.
**The Assault Rifles are modeled after the large rifle that came with [[Blurr (G1)|Blurr's]] [[Blurr (G1)/toys#Generations|2010 ''Generations'' toy]].
**The basic sniper rifles are based on [[Kup (G1)|Kup]]'s [[musket laser]] included with his [[Kup (G1)/toys#Generations|2011 ''Generations'' figure]].
**The heavy sniper rifles are modeled after [[Blaster (G1)|Blaster]]'s [[Electro-scrambler]].
**The grenade launchers, four basic missile launchers, and Grappling Hook are all based on the missile launchers in [[Ironhide (G1)|Ironhide]] & [[Ratchet (G1)|Ratchet]]'s [[Onebox component]]s.
**The Adhesive and Slow Gel Guns, as well as the Rust, Confuse & Weakening Spreadshots, all resemble the missile launcher that came with [[Sludge (G1)#Toys|Sludge]] (specifically, how it appeared in the [[The Transformers (cartoon)|Generation 1 cartoon]]).
**All of the "middle-weight" launchers (Delay Launcher, 6 Shot Missiles, etc.) are based on ''[[Transformers: Generation 2 (franchise)|Generation 2]]'' [[Dreadwing (G2)|Dreadwing's]] shoulder-mounted gatling gun.
*The eight upgradeable stats for each Autobot (Strength, Courage, Speed, Fireblast, Skill, Endurance, Intelligence, and Rank) are based directly on those featured on the original G1 toy boxes for each character.
*Wheeljack's Ultimate attack involves building an [[Wheeljack Instant Immobilizer|Immobilizer]] from "[[The Immobilizer]]".
*The Repair Kits bear a fair resemblance to [[Diagnostic Drone]]s.
*The weapon crates scattered throughout each level bear a resemblance to the [[AllSpark]]'s container from ''[[Transformers Animated (cartoon)|Transformers Animated]]''.
*The attempted [[cyberforming]] of Earth by the Decepticons has been used as a plot point in several past ''Transformers'' stories.
*The hurricane wind generators may be a reference to the [[Devastator Winds]] that have inspired Devastator's name in a few continuities.
*Concept art in the game shows that the cyberforming claws found throughout New York City and the ''Proudstar'' are based on [[Scorponok (G1)|Scorponok]]'s claws/hands, though the final design has ''slightly'' different details.
*Sideswipe declares he's ready to [[The Transformers: The Movie#Quotes|bust some Deceptichops]].
*Megatron's appearance mixes his general G1 design with his ''Combiner Wars'' [[Megatron (G1)/toys#Combiner Wars|figure]] (tank tread shins, pointed shoulders, tank alt. mode).
*Megatron generates an energy-based shield from his fusion cannon arm, an ability he previously exhibited in "[[More than Meets the Eye, Part 3]]".
*Several billboards advertise [[S. Witwicky Auto Repairs & Tow Service|S. Witwicky's Auto Shop]] and [[Prim Cola]]. Also visible is the "Creamy Cream" billboard from "[[Prime Target (episode)|Prime Target]]", renamed to the less-snigger-inducing "Bluebird Lotion". An IDW-inspired billboard easter egg is a sign advertising, "[[Maccadam's Old Oil House|Maccadam's Motor Oil]]."
*Shops found around the city include [[Becky's Coffee Shop]] from "[[I, Robot-Master!]]"; Lander's Beverages, named in homage to [[Lander]]'s love of wines; and a jewelry store named Bahoudin's, referencing the [[Pearl of Bahoudin]] from "[[Trans-Europe Express]]". [[Burger House]] was also planned to appear, but PlatinumGames had to change the sign for legal reasons, instead advertising a "Mega Burger Combo".<ref>[https://www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2015/12/20/the-abundant-easter-eggs-of-transformers-devastation.aspx The Abundant Easter Eggs Of Transformers Devastation - Game Informer]</ref>
*The message Megatron receives from the tower uses "[[Cybertronian language#The Transformers cartoon|Ancient Autobot]]" characters, first seen in "[[Cosmic Rust (episode)|Cosmic Rust]]".
*Bumblebee comments on the unlikely odds that another Cybertronian ship besides the Ark and the [[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]] would have crash-landed on Earth millions of years ago...unaware that the [[Axalon (BW)|Axalon]] and [[Darksyde (BW)|Darksyde]] did exactly that in ''[[Beast Wars: Transformers (cartoon)|Beast Wars]]''.
*The Insecticons are treated as a swarm similar to the clones from the G1 cartoon and the Infestation from the IDW comics, with infologs stating that these Insecticons were bred specifically for use on the ''Proudstar'' without the faction alignment, speech or distinct personalities of the primary Insecticons.
*Like his IDW self, [[Nova Prime]] traveled through the [[Benzuli Expanse]].
*One of Kranix's logs makes mention of [[Ore-13]].
*Teletraan Alpha alludes to Wheeljack and Optimus's unfortunate demises in ''[[The Transformers: The Movie]]''.
*Teletraan Alpha also tells Bumblebee that he will eventually be known as "The World's Bridge", "[[The Return of Optimus Prime, Part 2|Goldbug]]", "Race-Welder", and "Goldfire".
*Sideswipe asks Teletraan Alpha if he's been talking to [[Sunstreaker (G1)|his brother]].
*Teletraan Alpha cannot read Grimlock's aura due to the Dinobot [[S.O.S. Dinobots|not being completely Cybertronian]].
*[[Red Energon]] appears, only here it's a volatile explosive, not a speed enhancer.
*[[Blitzwing (G1)|Blitzwing]] uses ice in his jet mode and fire in his tank mode, in the vein of his [[Blitzwing (Animated)|''Animated'' counterpart]].
*The [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] appear in their ''Combiner Wars'' [[Stunticon (G1)#Generations|designs]], with Offroad replacing [[Wildrider (G1)|Wildrider]], while Menasor's appearance is a combination of his G1 and CW designs. Notably, [[Blackjack (G1)|Blackjack]] forms on Menasor's chest, though he does not appear among the separated Stunticons. Also, the Stunticons actually fuse with Motormaster's limbs like in the [[The Transformers (cartoon)|original cartoon]].
*Shockwave has the ability to generate duplicates of himself, in an ''insanely'' specific reference to a power mentioned in the original animated series [[production bible]], which was never used in the cartoon itself ([[Desertion of the Dinobots, Part 1#Continuity notes|except maybe once]]). The duplicates have the grey color scheme of the original "Astro Magnum" toy Shockwave was based on.
*Megatron states that he thought Optimus was [[The Transformers: The Movie#Quotes|made of sterner stuff]].
*Optimus defeats Megatron with the same haymaker he used in their final battle in the [[Battle of Autobot City]].
*Defensor and Superion's appearances at the end of the game are taken directly from their ''Combiner Wars'' designs, although their limb configurations do not match their standard setups.
*The end credits theme, "Face the Devastation", features a sequence of chords borrowed from [[The Transformers: The Movie - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack|''The Transformers: The Movie''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s musical score]], also composed by Vince DiCola.

===Real-world references===
* Devastator's first appearance as he looks over the building is an identical shot to the Colossal Titan's first appearance in ''{{w|Attack on Titan}}''.

===Trivia===
[[File:Devastation-Ratbat.jpg|thumb|250px|right|Who dares disturb my beauty sleep? Have you not heard? This movie's already over! Captain Blue is defeated, and we are victorious!]]
*[[FIRRIB|Frenzy is blue, Rumble is red]].
*[[Ratbat (G1)|Ratbat]] was planned to appear as part of the boss fights with Soundwave, but was removed during development. However, his unused character model and textures can still be found within the game's files.
*Although Frank Welker reprised his roles as both Megatron and Soundwave from the original cartoon, he did not voice Superion, Mixmaster, Skywarp, Rumble, or Frenzy, despite having originated all of those roles. The same can be said of Michael Bell, who did not voice Bombshell and Bonecrusher as in the original cartoon (albeit, the latter was for only one episode). Additionally, of the other characters in the game whose voice actors were still alive, [[Corey Burton]], [[Arthur Burghardt]], [[Neil Ross]], [[Clive Revill]], and [[Hal Rayle]] did not return to voice Shockwave, Devastator, Hook, Bonecrusher, Kickback, or Skrapnel.
*During the final battle in space, the player always fights as Optimus Prime even if another playable character was in use, but Prime will fight using the previous character's gear. For example, if Wheeljack was using his wrenches to fight Megatron on the ground, Prime will ''somehow'' have those wrenches with him in space. This also applies to the "Nemesis Prime" DLC skin, which will revert to the standard Optimus, despite being the same character.
* An extremely limited number of ''Devastation'' faceplates for PlayStation 4 were produced in Japan, which is a bit odd considering the game was never released there.<ref>{{Twitter|Transformers Devastation PS4. Note the face plate is officially licensed with the reflective PS logo. (Pardon the dust.)|https://twitter.com/synaesthesiajp/status/1444381270516060163|JP Kellams|2021|10|03}}</ref>
{{-}}

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
* [https://open.spotify.com/album/1WhigvyyE6rQyFlFV5wmwP ''Transformers: Devastation'' soundtrack selection on Spotify]]

{{DEFAULTSORT:Devastation}}
[[Category:Generation 1 video games]]
[[Category:Combiner Wars]]

PlayStation

2022-07-18T08:21:31Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

[[Image:PlayStation 1 logo.jpg|thumb|Do not underestimate the power of PlayStation.]]

'''PlayStation''' is a series of game consoles made by [[Sony]] that have had many ''Transformers'' [[video games]] released on them over the years. The first model was made available in [[1994]], the '''PlayStation 2''' was released in [[2000]], the '''PlayStation 3''' in [[2006]], the '''PlayStation 4''' in [[2013]], and the '''PlayStation 5''' in [[2020]]. Two portable systems, the '''PlayStation Portable''' and the '''PlayStation Vita''', were released in [[2005]] and [[2012]] respectively.

An [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Optimus Prime featuring Original PlayStation|Optimus Prime toy]] inspired by the original PlayStation was released in 2015.
==Games==
'''PlayStation''':
*[[Beast Wars: Transformers (video game)|''Beast Wars: Transformers'']] (1997)
*[[Transformers: Beast Wars Transmetals (PS)|''Transformers: Beast Wars Transmetals'']] (1999)

'''PlayStation 2''':
[[Image:PlayStation 2 logo.jpg|thumb|Live in your world. Play in ours.]]
*[[The Transformers (PS2)|''The Transformers: Call of the Future'']] (2003)
*''[[DreamMix TV World Fighters]]'' (2003)
*[[Transformers (PS2)|''Transformers'']] (2004)
*[[Transformers The Game (console)|''Transformers The Game'']] (2007)
*[[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (Wii/PS2)|''Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen'']] (2009)

'''PlayStation Portable''':
[[Image:PlayStation Portable logo.jpg|thumb|It's like a nut you can play with outside.]]
*''[[Transformers The Game (PSP)|Transformers The Game]]'' (2007)
*''[[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (PSP)|Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen]]'' (2009)

'''PlayStation 3''':
[[Image:PlayStation 3 logos.jpg|thumb|It only does everything.]]
*[[Transformers The Game (console)|''Transformers The Game'']] (2007)
*[[Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen (Xbox 360/PS3/PC)|''Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen'']] (2009)
*[[Transformers: War for Cybertron (360/PS3/PC)|''Transformers: War for Cybertron'']] (2010)
*[[Transformers: Dark of the Moon (Xbox 360/PS3)|''Transformers Dark Of The Moon'']] (2011)
*''[[Transformers: Fall of Cybertron]]'' (2012)
*''[[Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark (console)|Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark]]'' (2014)
*''[[Transformers: Devastation]]'' (2015)

'''PlayStation 4''':
[[Image:PlayStation 4 logo.jpg|thumb|Greatness awaits.]]
*''[[Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark (console)|Transformers: Rise of the Dark Spark]]'' (2014)
*''[[Transformers: Devastation]]'' (2015)
*''[[Transformers: Battlegrounds]]'' (2020)
[[Category:Video game consoles]]

==Notes==
* An extremely limited number of ''Transformers: Devastation'' faceplates for PlayStation 4 were produced in Japan to tie in with the game's release.<ref>{{Twitter|Transformers Devastation PS4. Note the face plate is officially licensed with the reflective PS logo. (Pardon the dust.)|https://twitter.com/synaesthesiajp/status/1444381270516060163|JP Kellams|2021|10|03}}</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

Aoi YÅ«ki

2022-07-18T08:17:33Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

'''Aoi Yūki''' (悠木碧 ''Yūki Aoi'', born [[March 27]], [[1992]]), is a Japanese actress, voice actress and singer who was born as '''Aoi Yabusaki''' (八武崎碧 Yabusaki Aoi). She is best known for her roles as the eponymous heroine, Madoka Kaname in ''Puella Magi Madoka Magica'', Koto Yumeno in ''Onegai My Melody'', Tsuyu Asui/Froppy in ''My Hero Academia'', Tornado of Terror in ''One Punch Man'', Iris and Eevee in ''Pokémon'', Platinum the Trinity in ''BlazBlue'', Clementine in ''Overlord'', Diane in ''The Seven Deadly Sins'', Menat in ''[[Street Fighter II × Transformers|Street Fighter]] V'', Yuuki Konno in ''Sword Art Online'', Futaba Sakura in ''Persona 5'', and Gwen Stacy/Spider-Gwen in ''[[Spider-Man]]: Into the Spider-Verse''.

==Roles==
===''[[Bumblebee (film)|Bumblebee]]''===
*[[Shatter]]

===''[[Transformers: Cyberverse (cartoon)|Transformers: Cyberverse]]''===
*[[Windblade (Cyberverse)|Windblade]]

==Notes==
*Yuki is a self-proclaimed ''Transformers'' fan, with Bumblebee being a personal favorite. As a result, [[TakaraTomy]] sent her several Bumblebee figures for her birthday in 2019. <ref>{{Twitter|なななんと！タカラトミーさん(@takaratomytoys
)さんから、お誕生日プレゼントが事務所に！！！すごーい！！ビーに囲まれて眠れるー！！天国！！超嬉しいです！大事に育てなきゃー💕💕🐝これでメタコレビーちゃんが、外出時用、家用、保存用にできる！ありがとうございました✨|https://twitter.com/staff_aoi/status/981037676806651904|Aoi Yuki|2018|04|03}}</ref>

==References==
{{reflist}}

==External links==
* [https://lineblog.me/aoi_yuki/ Aoi Yuki's Website] (In Japanese)
* [https://twitter.com/staff_aoi Aoi Yuki's Twitter]

{{DEFAULTSORT: Yuki, Aoi}}
[[Category: Japanese voice actors]]

Sick as a Bot

2022-07-18T08:08:55Z

Bumblebee2000: I am going to make all my errors on this one page and keep getting it perfect with all the ones before and after

{{episode|
|otherseries=''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2015 cartoon)|Transformers: Robots in Disguise]]'' (2015) ep 68
|image=TRID S3 E23 SAAB MSS.jpg
|caption="It ain't easy being green."
|prev=Something He Ate
|next=Five Fugitives
|title="Sick as a Bot"
|airdate=[[October 21]], [[2017]]
|production company=[[Allspark (company)|Hasbro Studios]]
|writer=[[Will Friedle]]
|animation studio=[[Polygon Pictures]], [[drop]] (2D)
|director=[[Todd Waterman]]
}}
'''After the Energon seeking Wingcode infects the Autobots with a virus, Bulkhead joins Grimlock in his hunt for the Decepticon.'''
==Synopsis==
[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|"Here's something interesting. It's a possible gamma sickness."]]
A gargoyle-shaped [[Decepticon]] climbs a peak near the scrapyard and, spotting the pile of [[Energon]] there, takes flight. The [[Autobot]]s and their [[human]] friends are still cleaning up after the recent Decepticon attack. [[Denny Clay|Denny]] is overjoyed to find some intact pond decorations, and [[Russell Clay|Russell]] is just carrying them away when the Decepticon swoops down at him. As the [[Bee Team (RID)|Bee Team]] starts fighting back, [[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] admits that the defense system is offline for diagnostics. The Decepticon releases a noxious-looking green gas, covering [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]], [[Sideswipe (RID)|Sideswipe]] and [[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]], who start to malfunction. The Decepticon manages to grab some of the Energon but [[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] holds her at bay long enough for Fixit to get the defenses back online and she's forced to flee. The Autobots are just about to assess their damage when a [[space bridge]] portal opens and [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] steps out, having been summoned there to meet [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]. Grimlock and Fixit appear to not be affected by the nanovirus the Decepticon released, but Fixit believes it's likely to be fatal unless treated. The Mini-Con checks [[Wingcode]]'s history for clues, before deciding the way forward is to try to synthesize an antidote.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 2.jpg|thumb|right|250px|"Well, if Banner knows what it is, I'm gonna track him down, I'm gonna put my foot on his throat, and I'm gonna..." "That was Banner. IT was Banner."]]
After some work, Fixit determines that neither his nor Grimlock's nano-cells are compatible. The virus starts affecting him too, and Grimlock decides he needs to go capture Wingcode so they can try to use her to make a cure. The Dinobot rushes off blindly and Bulkhead follows, trying to tell Grimlock that they need a proper plan. Grimlock refuses to listen and when Bulkhead tries to force him to go back to the scrapyard, the resulting tussle ends up with them landing in front of a bunch of humans. Bulkhead comes up with a story on the fly to cover up their appearances and carries Grimlock back. Bumblebee claims to be feeling better, but as Denny notes, he and the other afflicted Autobots are burning up. Denny and Russell try to attend to the ailing Fixit, and while they're doing so, Strongarm drives off in a delirious state. The two humans drive off to find her just as Bulkhead returns with an unconscious Grimlock. Grimlock comes around and is horrified at how much worse everyone looks, realizing he should have stayed put. Bulkhead stops him from panicking more and suggests he do something that relaxes him.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 3.jpg|thumb|left|250px|"I want more. You've seen what he becomes, right?" "I have. And it's beautiful. Godlike."]]
Wingcode devours the energon she stole, and goes looking for more. Elsewhere, Strongarm reprimands an ice cream truck for noise pollution and when it fails to respond, starts threatening it. Denny and Russell arrive to act out their cover story that Strongarm is an automated police drone, and Strongarm is distracted by another passing car.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 4.jpg|thumb|right|250px|"You should know that there's a flip side to this, too. If we miss on the low side, if we induce me and it fails, this will be very dangerous for you." "I've always been more curious than cautious, and that's served me pretty well."]]
Back at the scrapyard, Grimlock relaxes by smashing cars. He and Bulkhead are about to start thinking of a plan to capture Wingcode when they're called on to bring every cooling device they can find to the command center as Bee and Sideswipe's core processors are overheating. Something Bee says gives Grimlock an idea for a plan. He loads the energon onto a trailer, and despite Bulkhead's objections, they haul it off. Wingcode spots them leaving the scrapyard and heads in pursuit. She attacks them as they argue on a mountainside, causing the trailer and most of the energon to fall into a river below. Grimlock throws the remaining energon into a nearby cave. Wingcode follows him into the cave and is amused by his poor attempt at claiming he doesn't know where the energon is, until the Dinobot points out that he was smart enough to lure her into the cave where she can't fly. Wingcode turns to escape, only to find the way out blocked by Bulkhead. The two Autobots charge and render Wingcode out cold.

Denny takes a sample of Wingcode's nano-cells and injects them into Bumblebee. Though there's a few tense moments, Bee's condition returns to normal. The other Autobots are likewise quickly cured. Bulkhead reveals he intends to stick around until Optimus turns up, and Grimlock leads him off to the nearby quarry so they can punch granite.

==Featured characters==
{{featuredcharacters
|c1=
*[[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] (2)
*[[Sideswipe (RID)|Sideswipe]] (3)
*[[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]] (4)
*[[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]] (5)
*[[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] (8)
*[[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] (9)
|c2=
* [[Wingcode]] (1)
|c3=
*[[Russell Clay]] (6)
*[[Denny Clay]] (7)
*Campers (10-14)
*Ice cream man (15)
}}

==Quotes==
"Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Stay calm. Calm helps, crazy doesn't."
:—'''Bulkhead'''

"Hey! No amusing antenna toppers! Pull over!"
:—'''Strongarm''' lays down some Cybertronian law.

"A fist denting in a Sharkticon's snout with one punch."
:—'''Bulkhead''' calms down Grimlock

"I think part of the problem is we're not really thinkers." 
"Yeah, not so much."
:—'''Grimlock''' and '''Bulkhead'''

"Hey, don't talk smack about my tail. It ''will'' smack you back."
:—'''Grimlock'''

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
*He's back, baby! [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] was last seen on-screen in ''[[Predacons Rising (Prime)|Predacons Rising]]''; he ''had'' also appeared in ''Robots in Disguise''<nowiki>'s</nowiki> [[Fire, When Ready!|tie-in comic]], but the episode establishes that they are in a separate continuity from the cartoon, as Bulkhead has to be introduced to the Bee Team.
*[[Nightstrike]] is referred to multiple times.
*Grimlock uses the fake energon cubes that were meant to trick [[Ped (RID)|Ped]] in "[[Can You Dig It?]]".

===Prisoner manifest===
* ''In stasis'': [[Clampdown (RID)|Clampdown]], [[Quillfire (RID)|Quillfire]], [[Underbite]], [[Thunderhoof (RID)|Thunderhoof]], [[Wingcode]]
* ''Known at Large'': [[Steeljaw (RID)|Steeljaw]].
**The Autobots have run out of stasis pods at this point in the series. This has plot implications as Fixit says otherwise he would put the three stricken Autobots in stasis to slow the progress of the virus.

===Transformers references===
*Bulkhead jokingly calls Grimlock "Dinobutt," which was an affectionate insult [[Rattrap (BW)|Rattrap]] frequently lobbed at [[Dinobot (BW)|Dinobot]] in the ''[[Beast Wars: Transformers (cartoon)|Beast Wars]]'' cartoon.
*Bulkhead's design seems to share a lot of similarities with his [[Bulkhead_(Prime)/toys#Robots_in_Disguise|RID Prime toy]], from the headlights on his hips instead of his chest, his flat hood on his stomach, and his clearly visible chest windscreen.

===Real-world references===

===Errors===

===Trivia===
*The episode's name comes from the common expression "[http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sick_as_a_dog sick as a dog]".
*By this point in the series, all the original members of [[Team Prime]] from the [[Transformers: Prime (cartoon)|Prime]] cartoon have made an appearance: Bumblebee, Optimus Prime, Ratchet, and finally, Bulkhead. They will finally be seen all together for the episode [[Enemy of My Enemy (RID)|Enemy of My Enemy]], along with cameos from [[Arcee (WFC)|Arcee]], [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|Cliffjumper]], [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]], [[Ultra Magnus (WFC)|Ultra Magnus]], [[Smokescreen (Prime)|Smokescreen]], and [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]].
*Early in the episode, Fixit observes that the Autobots have run out of stasis pods. Following the capture of Wingcode, it was <ref>{{Twitter|They put her in a makeshift pod they built from parts found in the Scrapyard and froze her with Freon modified by Fixit.|https://twitter.com/sonnova/status/926287533339705344|Adam Beechen|2017|11|03}}</ref> by showrunner [[Adam Beechen]] that she was placed in a makeshift pod as a result.

===Foreign localization===
'''French'''
:*''Title:'' '''Un antidote pour BOT''' ("An Antidote for BOT")
:*''Original airdate:'' [[November 18]], 2017

'''Hungarian'''
:*''Title:'' '''Bacibot''' ("Germ-Bot")
:*''Original airdate:'' [[January 6]], 2018

==Home video releases==
{{homevidnote}}
;DVD
[[File:Flag of Australia.png|20px|Australia]] 2018 — ''Transformers Robots in Disguise: Combiner Force'' — Freedom Fighters ([[Beyond Home Entertainment]]) 

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Robots in Disguise (2015) episodes]]

Sick as a Bot

2022-07-18T08:07:50Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template fix

{{episode|
|otherseries=''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2015 cartoon)|Transformers: Robots in Disguise]]'' (2015) ep 68
|image=TRID S3 E23 SAAB MSS.jpg
|caption="It ain't easy being green."
|prev=Something He Ate
|next=Five Fugitives
|title="Sick as a Bot"
|airdate=[[October 21]], [[2017]]
|production company=[[Allspark (company)|Hasbro Studios]]
|writer=[[Will Friedle]]
|animation studio=[[Polygon Pictures]], [[drop]] (2D)
|director=[[Todd Waterman]]
}}
'''After the Energon seeking Wingcode infects the Autobots with a virus, Bulkhead joins Grimlock in his hunt for the Decepticon.'''
==Synopsis==
[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|"Here's something interesting. It's a possible gamma sickness."]]
A gargoyle-shaped [[Decepticon]] climbs a peak near the scrapyard and, spotting the pile of [[Energon]] there, takes flight. The [[Autobot]]s and their [[human]] friends are still cleaning up after the recent Decepticon attack. [[Denny Clay|Denny]] is overjoyed to find some intact pond decorations, and [[Russell Clay|Russell]] is just carrying them away when the Decepticon swoops down at him. As the [[Bee Team (RID)|Bee Team]] starts fighting back, [[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] admits that the defense system is offline for diagnostics. The Decepticon releases a noxious-looking green gas, covering [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]], [[Sideswipe (RID)|Sideswipe]] and [[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]], who start to malfunction. The Decepticon manages to grab some of the Energon but [[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] holds her at bay long enough for Fixit to get the defenses back online and she's forced to flee. The Autobots are just about to assess their damage when a [[space bridge]] portal opens and [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] steps out, having been summoned there to meet [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]. Grimlock and Fixit appear to not be affected by the nanovirus the Decepticon released, but Fixit believes it's likely to be fatal unless treated. The Mini-Con checks [[Wingcode]]'s history for clues, before deciding the way forward is to try to synthesize an antidote.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 2.jpg|thumb|right|250px|"Well, if Banner knows what it is, I'm gonna track him down, I'm gonna put my foot on his throat, and I'm gonna..." "That was Banner. IT was Banner."]]
After some work, Fixit determines that neither his nor Grimlock's nano-cells are compatible. The virus starts affecting him too, and Grimlock decides he needs to go capture Wingcode so they can try to use her to make a cure. The Dinobot rushes off blindly and Bulkhead follows, trying to tell Grimlock that they need a proper plan. Grimlock refuses to listen and when Bulkhead tries to force him to go back to the scrapyard, the resulting tussle ends up with them landing in front of a bunch of humans. Bulkhead comes up with a story on the fly to cover up their appearances and carries Grimlock back. Bumblebee claims to be feeling better, but as Denny notes, he and the other afflicted Autobots are burning up. Denny and Russell try to attend to the ailing Fixit, and while they're doing so, Strongarm drives off in a delirious state. The two humans drive off to find her just as Bulkhead returns with an unconscious Grimlock. Grimlock comes around and is horrified at how much worse everyone looks, realizing he should have stayed put. Bulkhead stops him from panicking more and suggests he do something that relaxes him.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 3.jpg|thumb|left|250px|"I want more. You've seen what he becomes, right?" "I have. And it's beautiful. Godlike."]]
Wingcode devours the energon she stole, and goes looking for more. Elsewhere, Strongarm reprimands an ice cream truck for noise pollution and when it fails to respond, starts threatening it. Denny and Russell arrive to act out their cover story that Strongarm is an automated police drone, and Strongarm is distracted by another passing car.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 4.jpg|thumb|right|250px|"You should know that there's a flip side to this, too. If we miss on the low side, if we induce me and it fails, this will be very dangerous for you." "I've always been more curious than cautious, and that's served me pretty well."]]
Back at the scrapyard, Grimlock relaxes by smashing cars. He and Bulkhead are about to start thinking of a plan to capture Wingcode when they're called on to bring every cooling device they can find to the command center as Bee and Sideswipe's core processors are overheating. Something Bee says gives Grimlock an idea for a plan. He loads the energon onto a trailer, and despite Bulkhead's objections, they haul it off. Wingcode spots them leaving the scrapyard and heads in pursuit. She attacks them as they argue on a mountainside, causing the trailer and most of the energon to fall into a river below. Grimlock throws the remaining energon into a nearby cave. Wingcode follows him into the cave and is amused by his poor attempt at claiming he doesn't know where the energon is, until the Dinobot points out that he was smart enough to lure her into the cave where she can't fly. Wingcode turns to escape, only to find the way out blocked by Bulkhead. The two Autobots charge and render Wingcode out cold.

Denny takes a sample of Wingcode's nano-cells and injects them into Bumblebee. Though there's a few tense moments, Bee's condition returns to normal. The other Autobots are likewise quickly cured. Bulkhead reveals he intends to stick around until Optimus turns up, and Grimlock leads him off to the nearby quarry so they can punch granite.

==Featured characters==
{{featuredcharacters
|c1=
*[[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] (2)
*[[Sideswipe (RID)|Sideswipe]] (3)
*[[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]] (4)
*[[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]] (5)
*[[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] (8)
*[[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] (9)
|c2=
* [[Wingcode]] (1)
|c3=
*[[Russell Clay]] (6)
*[[Denny Clay]] (7)
*Campers (10-14)
*Ice cream man (15)
}}

==Quotes==
"Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Stay calm. Calm helps, crazy doesn't."
:—'''Bulkhead'''

"Hey! No amusing antenna toppers! Pull over!"
:—'''Strongarm''' lays down some Cybertronian law.

"A fist denting in a Sharkticon's snout with one punch."
:—'''Bulkhead''' calms down Grimlock

"I think part of the problem is we're not really thinkers." 
"Yeah, not so much."
:—'''Grimlock''' and '''Bulkhead'''

"Hey, don't talk smack about my tail. It ''will'' smack you back."
:—'''Grimlock'''

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
*He's back, baby! [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] was last seen on-screen in ''[[Predacons Rising (Prime)|Predacons Rising]]''; he ''had'' also appeared in ''Robots in Disguise''<nowiki>'s</nowiki> [[Fire, When Ready!|tie-in comic]], but the episode establishes that they are in a separate continuity from the cartoon, as Bulkhead has to be introduced to the Bee Team.
*[[Nightstrike]] is referred to multiple times.
*Grimlock uses the fake energon cubes that were meant to trick [[Ped (RID)|Ped]] in "[[Can You Dig It?]]".

===Prisoner manifest===
* ''In stasis'': [[Clampdown (RID)|Clampdown]], [[Quillfire (RID)|Quillfire]], [[Underbite]], [[Thunderhoof (RID)|Thunderhoof]], [[Wingcode]]
* ''Known at Large'': [[Steeljaw (RID)|Steeljaw]].
**The Autobots have run out of stasis pods at this point in the series. This has plot implications as Fixit says otherwise he would put the three stricken Autobots in stasis to slow the progress of the virus.

===Transformers references===
*Bulkhead jokingly calls Grimlock "Dinobutt," which was an affectionate insult [[Rattrap (BW)|Rattrap]] frequently lobbed at [[Dinobot (BW)|Dinobot]] in the ''[[Beast Wars: Transformers (cartoon)|Beast Wars]]'' cartoon.
*Bulkhead's design seems to share a lot of similarities with his [[Bulkhead_(Prime)/toys#Robots_in_Disguise|RID Prime toy]], from the headlights on his hips instead of his chest, his flat hood on his stomach, and his clearly visible chest windscreen.

===Real-world references===

===Errors===

===Trivia===
*The episode's name comes from the common expression "[http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sick_as_a_dog sick as a dog]".
*By this point in the series, all the original members of [[Team Prime]] from the [[Transformers: Prime (cartoon)|Prime]] cartoon have made an appearance: Bumblebee, Optimus Prime, Ratchet, and finally, Bulkhead. They will finally be seen all together for the episode [[Enemy of My Enemy (RID)|Enemy of My Enemy]], along with cameos from [[Arcee (WFC)|Arcee]], [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|Cliffjumper]], [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]], [[Ultra Magnus (WFC)|Ultra Magnus]], [[Smokescreen (Prime)|Smokescreen]], and [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]].
*Early in the episode, Fixit observes that the Autobots have run out of stasis pods. Following the capture of Wingcode, it was <ref>{{Twitter|They put her in a makeshift pod they built from parts found in the Scrapyard and froze her with Freon modified by Fixit.|https://twitter.com/sonnova/status/926287533339705344|Adam Beechen|2017|11|03}}</ref> by showrunner [[Adam Beechen]] that she was placed in a makeshift pod as a result.

===Foreign localization===
'''French'''
:*''Title:'' '''Un antidote pour BOT''' ("An Antidote for BOT")
:*''Original airdate:'' [[November 18]], 2017

'''Hungarian'''
:*''Title:'' '''Bacibot''' ("Germ-Bot")
:*''Original airdate:'' [[January 6]], 2018

==Home video releases==
{{homevidnote}}
;DVD
[[File:Flag of Australia.png|20px|Australia]] 2018 — ''Transformers Robots in Disguise: Combiner Force'' — Freedom Fighters ([[Beyond Home Entertainment]]) 

==References==
{{reflink}}

[[Category:Robots in Disguise (2015) episodes]]

Wingcode

2022-07-18T08:06:12Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{faction|decepticon}}
:''Wingcode is a [[Decepticon]] from the [[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2015 franchise)|Robots in Disguise]] portion of the [[Aligned continuity family]].''
[[File:TRID E 68 Wingcode BM.jpg|thumb|350px|Rainbow, tacos, [[Doctor Who]], Homestuck!]]

Much like her fellow energon vampire, [[Nightstrike]], '''Wingcode''' needs to constantly feed on energon. But Wingcode has a unique way of immobilizing her prey, releasing a cloud of particles that infects Cybertronians with a potentially deadly malware.

==Fiction==
===2015 ''Robots in Disguise'' cartoon===
{{voiceactor|[[Constance Zimmer]] (English)|[[Anja Nestler]] (German)}}
During the Great War, Wingcode was an airborne spy, however after she stole a nanotech virus and absorbed it into her system, she was arrested and placed in a quarantine [[stasis pod]] aboard the ''[[Alchemor (RID)|Alchemor]]''. She was eventually freed when the ship crashed on [[Earth]] and released its cargo. According to [[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]], it's likely she went into hibernation to conserve energon but woke when her reserves became critical.

Starving for energon, Wingcode spotted the supply piled up in the [[Vintage Salvage Depot for the Discriminating Nostalgist|scrapyard]] and headed in to take some. When she was met by resistance from the Autobots, she doused the area with nano-particles before managing to grab a few cubes. She was about to try and secure more when she was interrupted by [[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] and the reactivated security system, forcing her to fly off. She soon consumed what little she'd stolen and went searching for more, spotting Grimlock and [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] with a trailer of [[energon cube]]s. Wingcode attacked, knocking the pair around and sending most of the cubes tumbling into the river, however Grimlock threw the rest into a nearby cave. She followed him in, only to find she'd fallen into his trap—unable to fly in the cramped cave, she was soon rendered unconscious by Grimlock and Bulkhead. She was taken back to the scrapyard where Fixit used a nano-cell sample from her to cure the Autobots. {{storylink|Sick as a Bot}}

==Notes==
*Wingcode uses an altered version of [[Nightstrike]]'s character model. Unlike previous instances of model reusing, this similarity is actually acknowledged in-story as both characters are energon vampires.
*Like Nightstrike, Wingcode is never seen transforming into any alternate form and its never made clear in her episode what form shes currently in. Nightstrike would later receive a ''Tiny Titans'' figure revealing he actually has a more humanoid robot form, with his "bat-form" being his beast mode. As Wingcode's model removes some of the bat-like features and gives her a (somewhat) more humanoid head, its likely that this is her robot-mode.
*When asked of Wingcode's fate, [[Adam Beechen]]'s explanation was that she was placed in a makeshift stasis cell, as the Autobots had run out of real ones.<ref>{{Twitter|They put her in a makeshift pod they built from parts found in the Scrapyard and froze her with Freon modified by Fixit.|https://twitter.com/sonnova/status/926287533339705344|Adam Beechen|2017|11|03}}</ref> by showrunner [[Adam Beechen]] that she was placed in a makeshift pod as a result. She was later returned to Cybertron with the other Decepticons after the events of "[[Freedom Fighters]]", as Beechen stated in a since-deleted blog post.

==References==
{{reflist}}

[[Category:Cartoon-only Transformers]]
[[Category:Robots in Disguise (2015) Decepticons]]
[[Category:Vampires]]
[[Category:Female Transformers]]

Sick as a Bot

2022-07-18T07:59:02Z

Bumblebee2000: Twitter template

{{episode|
|otherseries=''[[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2015 cartoon)|Transformers: Robots in Disguise]]'' (2015) ep 68
|image=TRID S3 E23 SAAB MSS.jpg
|caption="It ain't easy being green."
|prev=Something He Ate
|next=Five Fugitives
|title="Sick as a Bot"
|airdate=[[October 21]], [[2017]]
|production company=[[Allspark (company)|Hasbro Studios]]
|writer=[[Will Friedle]]
|animation studio=[[Polygon Pictures]], [[drop]] (2D)
|director=[[Todd Waterman]]
}}
'''After the Energon seeking Wingcode infects the Autobots with a virus, Bulkhead joins Grimlock in his hunt for the Decepticon.'''
==Synopsis==
[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 1.jpg|thumb|left|250px|"Here's something interesting. It's a possible gamma sickness."]]
A gargoyle-shaped [[Decepticon]] climbs a peak near the scrapyard and, spotting the pile of [[Energon]] there, takes flight. The [[Autobot]]s and their [[human]] friends are still cleaning up after the recent Decepticon attack. [[Denny Clay|Denny]] is overjoyed to find some intact pond decorations, and [[Russell Clay|Russell]] is just carrying them away when the Decepticon swoops down at him. As the [[Bee Team (RID)|Bee Team]] starts fighting back, [[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] admits that the defense system is offline for diagnostics. The Decepticon releases a noxious-looking green gas, covering [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]], [[Sideswipe (RID)|Sideswipe]] and [[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]], who start to malfunction. The Decepticon manages to grab some of the Energon but [[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] holds her at bay long enough for Fixit to get the defenses back online and she's forced to flee. The Autobots are just about to assess their damage when a [[space bridge]] portal opens and [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] steps out, having been summoned there to meet [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]. Grimlock and Fixit appear to not be affected by the nanovirus the Decepticon released, but Fixit believes it's likely to be fatal unless treated. The Mini-Con checks [[Wingcode]]'s history for clues, before deciding the way forward is to try to synthesize an antidote.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 2.jpg|thumb|right|250px|"Well, if Banner knows what it is, I'm gonna track him down, I'm gonna put my foot on his throat, and I'm gonna..." "That was Banner. IT was Banner."]]
After some work, Fixit determines that neither his nor Grimlock's nano-cells are compatible. The virus starts affecting him too, and Grimlock decides he needs to go capture Wingcode so they can try to use her to make a cure. The Dinobot rushes off blindly and Bulkhead follows, trying to tell Grimlock that they need a proper plan. Grimlock refuses to listen and when Bulkhead tries to force him to go back to the scrapyard, the resulting tussle ends up with them landing in front of a bunch of humans. Bulkhead comes up with a story on the fly to cover up their appearances and carries Grimlock back. Bumblebee claims to be feeling better, but as Denny notes, he and the other afflicted Autobots are burning up. Denny and Russell try to attend to the ailing Fixit, and while they're doing so, Strongarm drives off in a delirious state. The two humans drive off to find her just as Bulkhead returns with an unconscious Grimlock. Grimlock comes around and is horrified at how much worse everyone looks, realizing he should have stayed put. Bulkhead stops him from panicking more and suggests he do something that relaxes him.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 3.jpg|thumb|left|250px|"I want more. You've seen what he becomes, right?" "I have. And it's beautiful. Godlike."]]
Wingcode devours the energon she stole, and goes looking for more. Elsewhere, Strongarm reprimands an ice cream truck for noise pollution and when it fails to respond, starts threatening it. Denny and Russell arrive to act out their cover story that Strongarm is an automated police drone, and Strongarm is distracted by another passing car.

[[File:TRID S3 E23 SAAB SC 4.jpg|thumb|right|250px|"You should know that there's a flip side to this, too. If we miss on the low side, if we induce me and it fails, this will be very dangerous for you." "I've always been more curious than cautious, and that's served me pretty well."]]
Back at the scrapyard, Grimlock relaxes by smashing cars. He and Bulkhead are about to start thinking of a plan to capture Wingcode when they're called on to bring every cooling device they can find to the command center as Bee and Sideswipe's core processors are overheating. Something Bee says gives Grimlock an idea for a plan. He loads the energon onto a trailer, and despite Bulkhead's objections, they haul it off. Wingcode spots them leaving the scrapyard and heads in pursuit. She attacks them as they argue on a mountainside, causing the trailer and most of the energon to fall into a river below. Grimlock throws the remaining energon into a nearby cave. Wingcode follows him into the cave and is amused by his poor attempt at claiming he doesn't know where the energon is, until the Dinobot points out that he was smart enough to lure her into the cave where she can't fly. Wingcode turns to escape, only to find the way out blocked by Bulkhead. The two Autobots charge and render Wingcode out cold.

Denny takes a sample of Wingcode's nano-cells and injects them into Bumblebee. Though there's a few tense moments, Bee's condition returns to normal. The other Autobots are likewise quickly cured. Bulkhead reveals he intends to stick around until Optimus turns up, and Grimlock leads him off to the nearby quarry so they can punch granite.

==Featured characters==
{{featuredcharacters
|c1=
*[[Grimlock (RID 2015)|Grimlock]] (2)
*[[Sideswipe (RID)|Sideswipe]] (3)
*[[Strongarm (RID)|Strongarm]] (4)
*[[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]] (5)
*[[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] (8)
*[[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] (9)
|c2=
* [[Wingcode]] (1)
|c3=
*[[Russell Clay]] (6)
*[[Denny Clay]] (7)
*Campers (10-14)
*Ice cream man (15)
}}

==Quotes==
"Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Stay calm. Calm helps, crazy doesn't."
:—'''Bulkhead'''

"Hey! No amusing antenna toppers! Pull over!"
:—'''Strongarm''' lays down some Cybertronian law.

"A fist denting in a Sharkticon's snout with one punch."
:—'''Bulkhead''' calms down Grimlock

"I think part of the problem is we're not really thinkers." 
"Yeah, not so much."
:—'''Grimlock''' and '''Bulkhead'''

"Hey, don't talk smack about my tail. It ''will'' smack you back."
:—'''Grimlock'''

==Notes==
===Continuity notes===
*He's back, baby! [[Bulkhead (Prime)|Bulkhead]] was last seen on-screen in ''[[Predacons Rising (Prime)|Predacons Rising]]''; he ''had'' also appeared in ''Robots in Disguise''<nowiki>'s</nowiki> [[Fire, When Ready!|tie-in comic]], but the episode establishes that they are in a separate continuity from the cartoon, as Bulkhead has to be introduced to the Bee Team.
*[[Nightstrike]] is referred to multiple times.
*Grimlock uses the fake energon cubes that were meant to trick [[Ped (RID)|Ped]] in "[[Can You Dig It?]]".

===Prisoner manifest===
* ''In stasis'': [[Clampdown (RID)|Clampdown]], [[Quillfire (RID)|Quillfire]], [[Underbite]], [[Thunderhoof (RID)|Thunderhoof]], [[Wingcode]]
* ''Known at Large'': [[Steeljaw (RID)|Steeljaw]].
**The Autobots have run out of stasis pods at this point in the series. This has plot implications as Fixit says otherwise he would put the three stricken Autobots in stasis to slow the progress of the virus.

===Transformers references===
*Bulkhead jokingly calls Grimlock "Dinobutt," which was an affectionate insult [[Rattrap (BW)|Rattrap]] frequently lobbed at [[Dinobot (BW)|Dinobot]] in the ''[[Beast Wars: Transformers (cartoon)|Beast Wars]]'' cartoon.
*Bulkhead's design seems to share a lot of similarities with his [[Bulkhead_(Prime)/toys#Robots_in_Disguise|RID Prime toy]], from the headlights on his hips instead of his chest, his flat hood on his stomach, and his clearly visible chest windscreen.

===Real-world references===

===Errors===

===Trivia===
*The episode's name comes from the common expression "[http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/sick_as_a_dog sick as a dog]".
*By this point in the series, all the original members of [[Team Prime]] from the [[Transformers: Prime (cartoon)|Prime]] cartoon have made an appearance: Bumblebee, Optimus Prime, Ratchet, and finally, Bulkhead. They will finally be seen all together for the episode [[Enemy of My Enemy (RID)|Enemy of My Enemy]], along with cameos from [[Arcee (WFC)|Arcee]], [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|Cliffjumper]], [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]], [[Ultra Magnus (WFC)|Ultra Magnus]], [[Smokescreen (Prime)|Smokescreen]], and [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]].
*Early in the episode, Fixit observes that the Autobots have run out of stasis pods. Following the capture of Wingcode, it was <ref>{{Twitter|They put her in a makeshift pod they built from parts found in the Scrapyard and froze her with Freon modified by Fixit.|https://twitter.com/sonnova/status/926287533339705344|Adam Beechen|2017|11|03}}<ref> by showrunner [[Adam Beechen]] that she was placed in a makeshift pod as a result.

===Foreign localization===
'''French'''
:*''Title:'' '''Un antidote pour BOT''' ("An Antidote for BOT")
:*''Original airdate:'' [[November 18]], 2017

'''Hungarian'''
:*''Title:'' '''Bacibot''' ("Germ-Bot")
:*''Original airdate:'' [[January 6]], 2018

==Home video releases==
{{homevidnote}}
;DVD
[[File:Flag of Australia.png|20px|Australia]] 2018 — ''Transformers Robots in Disguise: Combiner Force'' — Freedom Fighters ([[Beyond Home Entertainment]]) 

==References==
{{reflink}}

[[Category:Robots in Disguise (2015) episodes]]