MediaWiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:B.O.T. (episode)

2013-11-05T05:01:17Z

Bumblejumper:

Having watched this episode and agreeing with the "Worst episode ever" part, while also noting that we don't subscribe to the concept of "NPOV"...are we maybe being a little too hard on the episode? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 06:30, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
:Not particularly. Destroying the Moon with a cannon that can apparently only be operated by Bruticus to just flood a canyon is a plan that deserves all the ire it gets. [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 06:35, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
::Is it really that much worse than the [[Giant Purple Griffin|fortress]]? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 06:54, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Yes. And that's not even taking into account the sheer hateability of the two human leads. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 06:58, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
:I suppose you have a point, there...okay, just thought I'd bring it up. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 07:01, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
::You know, it's like Wile E. Coyote, the resources they spend on Crazy Schemes would be better spent on just building a power plant that they can get energy from, without all the 'destruction' that forces the Autobots to intervene. Hell, given they wouldn't be bothering anybody, chances are Prime would just leave them alone. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 12:23, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
:::I dunno... Megatron seems incapable of even simple energy-gathering schemes unless they involve the destruction of something. On at least one occasion, a normally benign manner of generating energy was used by Megatron in a fashion that threatened to destroy the Earth. (ex: [[Fire in the Sky]]). -- [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 14:29, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
::::We're right. The Giant Purple Griffin was the best he ever did. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 14:39, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

:Hmmm...This episode is ridiculous, but I don't think it's the "worst ever," because it's at least entertaining in an unintentionally-comic way. There are way duller episodes out there (like "Face of the Ninjika"--and I think Blurr's lava orgasm is way more creepy than anything else in the series--well maybe not Prime's "Ahh" while coma raping Elita One (to save her life!)). "Canrnage in C-Minor" is another popular choice for "worst ever," and it's hard to argue with that one on multiple levels. We've also got a pair of Season 3 episodes that involve magic, Dark Ages castles and dragons, and a butler Grimlock (can you tell I abhor Season 3?). Then there's just all-around bad ideas like "Sea Change," spotlighting one of the characters who I'd hate to listen to for 22 minutes, then making him a lovesick Merman that STILL talks like that. --Skywarp, 8/14/13 12:31PM EDT.
:Clearly, you haven't had to watch this episode 5,000 frikkin times. . Also, this ain't a discusion board [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 12:49, 14 August 2013 (EDT)
::I'm just saying that there are a ton of serious contenders for "Worst Episode Ever" at "B.O.T."'s level or worse. Perhaps too many to wrap that particular title around this episode's waist in the Wiki's intro, snarky intent or no. -- Skywarp 8/14/13, 17:01PM EDT.
:::I think if you list magic and dragons in a season 3 episode as being bad, and forgot it was in season 2 also, it's not that bad. And again, not a disscussion thread. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 17:06, 14 August 2013 (EDT)
I think Roland and Martin are a reference to Rowan and Martin's Laugh-In. [[User:MegaBee|MegaBee]] 21:30, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Aren't we kind of taking it too far with all the "worst episode" stuff? I mean, almost everyone agrees it's silly, but all the episodes cheat and have animation errors, and the plot really isn't any worse than any other cheesy 1980s cartoon. Sometimes a joke is actually funnier if it isn't used as much, maybe we should cut back in the "worst episode" stuff? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 00:01, 5 November 2013 (EST)

== Receiving, decrypting... ==

* The speech synthesizer is "rewired" so that instead of "synthesizing and transmitting," it "receives and decrypts." And this somehow lets the kids listen in on a conversation being held in the Decepticon base. '''''WHAT?!'''''
Especially given the context... does anybody else find this part, at least, not to be mind-blowingly confusing? It's hideously contrived, to be sure, but I'd posit that "receiving and decrypting" isn't too far off from "listening" - close enough, at least, not to warrant that huge exclamation of disbelief at the end. Thoughts? [[User:Caswin|Caswin]] 18:44, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
:Since there weren't any objections, I changed it to something a little less over-the-top. At which point it was reverted. What? [[User:Caswin|Caswin]] 18:50, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:Sorry, I just saw a red-link user messing with the funny, which is usually a revert-on-sight thing. Still, the plot point above ''is'' indefensibly absurd. "Receives and decrytps" WHAT exactly? Are the 'cons broadcasting their private conversations now?? It's a huge, bizarre stretch (I even thought so when I was 12), and WHAT?? sums it up very succinctly. -- [[User:Repowers|Repowers]] 19:36, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
::Well, yes... but you could say about as much for half of the episode. Bear in mind that, as the summary says, it's not the Decepticons broadcasting their conversations to be "received and decrypted" - it's going by what Brawl hears, which makes at least a ''little'' more sense. The more I think about it, the less an all-capitals bold-and-italics statement like that seems right - not any more, at least, than it would be for all the other myriad problems listed with the episode. [[User:Caswin|Caswin]] 17:38, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

== Navigation boxes ==
Rather than have two nav boxes on one page, if we're integrating the Japanese cartoon run into the American run (which makes sense), could we get a two-series nav box for the cartoons, much like we have for [[Second Generation!|the comics]]?
:I don't really know if that's possible. While the insertion of new Japanese episodes intp the US run is comparable to the insertion of new UK material into the US comics run, this isn't the only consideration. The Japanese series actually puts the US episodes in a ''different order''. Like... in American continuity, "Fire in the Sky" comes after "Divide and Conquer," and is followed by "SOS Dinobots," but in Japan, it comes after "Masquerade," and is followed by "Fire on the Mountain." How can you show that without having two nav boxes? - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 22:56, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
::Oh, wait. Snap. You mean [[Child's Play (issue)|like this]]. Well... bugger, that's an evening wasted! - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 22:58, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
:::Yep, sorry, didn't mean to make that link so hard to find. And yeah, the UK book is all kinds of messy, but the two-series system makes short work of it. Don't despair; it's pretty easy to convert the two boxes into one, once the template is set up. We just need one of the code-knowledgeable folks to set the thing up. -- [[User:Repowers|Repowers]] 23:08, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

== Caption issue ==
Okay, that caption on the image of the gagged Elise? I think that's got to go. Aside from just being potentially offensive, it doesn't even make sense given that neither the characters depicted in the image nor the episode's writers are Japanese. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 17:23, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
:Yeah, I have to agree. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 17:38, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
::I'll go along with that. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 17:54, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
:::Only question is: what do we change it to? --[[User:Professor Icepick|Professor Icepick]] 17:56, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
::::Not when Japan is responsible for [[Transformers: Kiss Players (franchise)|this]].--[[User:Dynamus Prime|Dynamus Prime]] 17:57, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
::::Proposed captions:
::::"Putting leaked spoilers on Teletraan I can have dire consequences."
::::"The mods block yet another anonymous caption bastard."
::::"And next we'll get that Kicker punk!"
::::[[User:JW|JW]] 18:05, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
:::::I kinda had in mind something like "This is the light-hearted, end-of-episode comedy beat. No, seriously." --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 18:09, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
::::::Hmm, yours is better. [[User:JW|JW]] 18:15, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
::::::I agree. --[[User:Professor Icepick|Professor Icepick]] 18:21, 9 May 2008 (UTC)
:::::::How about... [[Starscream (Animated)|Starscream]] knows where you've been, girl.--[[User:Dynamus Prime|Dynamus Prime]] 21:59, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

== How's it the worst episode ever? ==
Tell me why. Please? --[[User:Kaon Prisoner|Kaon Prisoner]] 16:30, 22 May 2011 (EDT)
:It's all on the page. Why should anyone tell you? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 16:31, 22 May 2011 (EDT)

Huh... sorry 'bout that. --[[User:Kaon Prisoner|Kaon Prisoner]] 16:41, 22 May 2011 (EDT)

== Animation by Toei? ==

I find the episode animated by Toei hard to believe. Y'know the BIG ROAD in the ep? VERY un-Toei-like. --[[Special:Contributions/66.82.9.82|66.82.9.82]] 20:31, 12 August 2011 (EDT)

== Any Practical Reason? ==

[[User:Sky`sLimit|Sky]] 08:50, 6 November 2011 (EST)Can someone explain WHY they would make an episode like this anyway?
:Have you watched a lot of old '80s cartoons? Episodes this bad were common in a lot of series, it's just that the TF fandom is super-organized and has examined things in depth that makes B.O.T. stand out. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 11:15, 6 November 2011 (EST)

[[User:Sky`sLimit|Sky]] 18:13, 7 November 2011 (EST)....... Is it bad to admit that I just started watching Transformers?

[[User:Sky`sLimit|Sky]] 20:45, 14 November 2011 (EST)I haven't been able to watch any Transformers episodes because of the time it is on.
:There's no shame in it, no, but please keep your discussion related to the page itself in the future. That said, to answer your original question, it probably to do with the staff being on a schedule, having to come up with something to fill up a 49-episode season, and this being what they turned in at the deadline. They tried, man. - [[User:Caswin|Caswin]] 20:13, 15 December 2011 (EST)

:Late response, but also on a note, the end of the season tends to be where "filler crap they couldn't squeeze anywhere else" got dumped before shows started using multi-parters or cliffhanger episodes to book-end their series'. I remember reading that bit from a Flint Dille excerpt for '''Visionaries''' (probably a DVD extra). He was wondering why on Earth the last episode of that series was so unrelated to.. well, anything. Apparently season/series enders that aren't cliffhangers can't be winners. And I need to remember to sign my posts so I don't respond to myself six months down the road. [[User:Pakopako|Pakopako]] 17:29, <span style="text-decoration:line-through;">11 March</span> 11 October 2012 (EDT)

== Split ==

This episode has so many errors, they should have their own page. On purpose, we should spilt the error section into an article called [[B.O.T. (episode)/Errors]]. You know, just to show how many errors there are. Sound good?[[Special:Contributions/71.255.175.43|71.255.175.43]] 23:30, 12 July 2012 (EDT)
:No. I think splitting pages unnecessarily is a bad idea. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 23:45, 12 July 2012 (EDT)
::Also, you don't even get a page length warning. This page doesn't need to be broken down at all. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 23:47, 12 July 2012 (EDT)
:::I think he's proposing to do it for "comedic effect". --[[User:Abates|abates]] 23:53, 12 July 2012 (EDT)
::::Bingo! Yes, that's exactly why![[Special:Contributions/71.255.175.43|71.255.175.43]] 15:56, 13 July 2012 (EDT)
:::::That's a stupid reason to split a page. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 16:45, 13 July 2012 (EDT)
:I thought it was a bad idea too. It just seemed funny, I didn't know what you would think. The reason was not to split it because it was too long, just because there's a shit load of errors on this page. I still had a feeling you'd say no anyway.[[Special:Contributions/71.255.175.43|71.255.175.43]] 22:10, 13 July 2012 (EDT)
::It doesn't mean it's a bad idea, it just might be bad on the Wiki. Might make a good MST3K skit. '''And this episode is why Optimus died in the Movie.'''[[User:Pakopako|Pakopako]] 20:05, 11 October 2012 (EDT)

User talk:ItsWalky

2013-11-05T04:45:41Z

Bumblejumper:

{{preview bastard}}

--I'm deeply sorry

[[User talk:ItsWalky/2006|2006 Archives]]

[[User talk:ItsWalky/2007|2007 Archives]]

[[User talk:ItsWalky/2008|2008 Archives]]

[[User talk:ItsWalky/2009|2009 Archives]]

So are you this wiki's owner? Hi I'm new. -[[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 23:45, 4 November 2013 (EST)

==Things to say to you==
[[Image:Ttoc.GIF|right|thumb|We approve this message.]]

Just some thing I've been wanting to say to David...

First off, you're a monumental asshole. You have an ego the size of a small planet and it's irritating watching you act like an important SOB when you're basically just a nobody.

Second, your webcomics aren't funny. They're boring tripe that makes Penny Arcade look good(and believe me, Penny Arcade is garbage). Cyanide and Happiness is a funny webcomic, yours is not. Your "jokes" are painful, about like watching Michael Richards yell the n-word as a routine. You don't draw a comic, you draw an opinionated blog. I'm not sure which name suits your crap better, "ShitPacked" or "ShortDicked".

Your liberalism and your love of Indiana get on my nerves. You jab at Mallard Filmore? Yeah, one shitty comic making fun of another shitty comic. Or are you just pissed that his gets in newspapers while you're JUST a webcomic? As to Indiana, I live here, and if it were up to me, the state would be walled off and none of the freaks living there allowed to interact with the rest of the planet. The state is about 3 decades behind the times. But something tells me even you know this otherwise you'd still live here. I sure as hell do not live here by choice and as soon as I can, I'm moving far away from this joke of a state.

And your brand loyalty is typical fandom crap. You have Aaron Archer's rod so far down your throat it's unreal. And Aryan fucktard Michael Bay's rod has apparently joined it. I'd say soemthing abotu Don Murphy but he was born without one. Actually, I can say something- he's Kevin "unfunny asshole" Smith with more body fat. Hasbro didn't give the film to a competent director, just a cheap one. And neither Speilberg or ILM have done anything useful in years. Give WETA, or even Tom Savini a chance and we wouldn't be getting Bionicle bots. You're afraid to not like a Hasbro product. No wonder they don't have to go out of the way to please the "fans"- you'll accept it no matter what. But hey, you personally have been sucking off incompetent British bonehead Simon Furman and his shitty stories for years. There are no gods in Transformers. Unicron was built by a monkey, little man. Furman is dog shit.

And go figure this TF wiki is a joke full of misinformation, insults or outright lies- you're a mod here. You're never right. You're more of an incorrect pompous jerkoff than Defunct is. Right, ban me from editing, as if it would somehow matter, any info you don't agree with is pulled. You only have friends because people feel sorry for you. Me, I have no need. People are a commodity to be used and their wants only get in the way of what I'm out for. Use them and drop them.

Who am I? Go look who added a note about you on Encyclopedia Dramatica's Allspark page if you're not too lazy. As well as past AS, Kalidor, FIRRIB and Hooks entries(the hooks entry especially true). Oh, and just info on white people in general and that idiotic Nintendo Wii. I'm not making it that easy for you.
: Is it my birthday? This stuff ''feeds'' me. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:19, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
: Duuuuude. Walky may be a dick, but I still ''like'' him for some inexplicable reason. You, on the other hand, are just one sore drama queen.--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 17:14, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

: This is some of the most funny stuff I've seen in a while. Comedy PLATINUM. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 02:30, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

: Bwa ha ha ha ha. Priceless. I think someone needs to get off the internets for a few minutes. [[User:Chip|Chip]] 02:49, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

: Wait, you mean I didn't get drunk and write this? [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 05:47, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

: I wish lame puns happened to me. [[User:Interrobang|Interrobang]] 20:08, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Why do I get the feeling that guy has been permanently banned?[[User:Florky Man|Mr. Florky]] 15:55, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Wow, an Encyclopedia Dramatica troll. No need to be so harsh on Walky. I, too, like the Baybots, and, I happen to like Bionicle. Also, his Webcomic is one of my favorites. So, if you have nothing nice to say, never ever EVER come back here.--[[User:Dynamus Prime|Dynamus Prime]] 16:22, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

==BANNED==

What the hell did I do to warrant a ban, exactly? As far as I'm aware, I don't even think I broke any rules, and if I did, an official warning would be appropriate. I received no such warning. I was not here for trolling and you know that - you use that bullshit excuse to get people to ignore arguments you can't handle. But you, personally, who made this decision, know I'm not a troll.

This is fucking low. I had little enough respect for you down to your ranting against the fanbase, Willis, but this is a whole new level of buggery. If you're going to use your comic to rant against and discredit people you don't like, the least you can do is suck it up when people rant at you back, and not act like a control-freak child.

I really don't think you're aware of your own actions anymore.
*Do the words [[Wikipedia:WP:NPA|no personal attacks]] mean anything to you? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 00:18, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
:: Do the words "warning before ban" mean anything to you? Rulemongering doesn't justify a decision anyway, since Walky is one of the people making the rules. There were plenty of personal attacks leveled at me, but I did not report them officially.

::I really find it hard to believe that you think it's completely on a rational level of discourse to claim that the comic strip I draw is about child pornography. If I'm not mistaken about your identity, you've been banned from almost every single Transformers web board you've had an acquaintance with, and I'm only doing this place a favor by getting rid of you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:22, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

::: That's not an excuse. I will openly admit I HAVE been banned from several forums, but only because I repeatedly opposed the staff on each and every one of them; and with good cause, they all have roughly the same problem. People bully others either into liking the movie or to agree with the kind of views you promote - and since nobody can directly attack or discredit anyone, these people(and you are) are left to their methods.
::: For your current decision to be validated, the admins of those boards, boards which are influenced in turn by your anti-fan attitude, would have to be near 100% correct in their decisions, and those decisions would have to occur within a context that would map exactly onto here. Any rational moderator does not base their decisions so much off performance on other boards, especially when it's not even a messageboard they're operating. Two different media. I have openly said I despise all active Transformers boards for their level of authoritarianism, yet level of tolerance towards the pushing of certain viewpoints.

::: Not to mention that you're still operating under the fallacy of Appeal to Majority - that alone means I shouldn't really even have to counter you.

::: And don't even use the "CHILD PORNOGRAPHY" thing as an excuse. Again, any rational moderator would warn several times before a ban, I personally reversed that edit even though it was obviously intended to be a joke as anyone reading this knows what pile'o'bile already is. You have no justification for what you did, but your ego is too big to realise you can actually do wrong with your power. You'll never admit it, but I wouldn't be surprised if some part of you is pissed that I defeated some of your ramblings, whether they were directly written by you or encouraged by you, it's still the kind of guff you normally blew, and I managed to defeat it. You, and the mods of the big sites will always have your ban buttons - but you will NEVER be able to justify your actions to me. That's how I know that I'm in the right, at least in situations like this - solidly backed justification is almost always absent.
:::: Personal attacks + deleting comments in response to you = banno --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:36, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
:::: P.S. Sign your posts. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:36, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

::::: I have never intentionally deleted comments in response to me. I just moved one recently as it was in the middle of a paragraph of text. Not to mention that happened after you banned my original IP. Personal attacks alone are not grounds enough for a ban, especially when you're doing an awful, awful lot to be mercilessly torn into.
Need I point out that once again, you are unable to defend yourself properly? When does the "You're insane?" come? Ganging up of all your little friends since a majority always means you're right?
Do you even realise what a fascist shithead you sound like? Just because you're an admin of a place doesn't give you a free pass to be a dick with it. There's a difference between what you can do and what you should do that you don't seem to have learned yet. [[User:67.159.44.88|67.159.44.88]]

: YOU BAN PEOPLE BECAUSE ****YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE

TRUTH****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111twelve FUCKING FASCIST PIGCOP NAZI WIKIPEDO '''ASSHOLE''' [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 00:32, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

:: My gosh, now that I have seen someone mock the notion, it MUST be untrue. Please, where can I learn these 1337 debating skills?

:::Dude, I've been banned from twice as many forums as you, guaranfuckingteed, but they still let me post here because I'm not as goddamn retarded as you are. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 00:34, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

:::: And can you demonstrate exactly how I'm more retarded than you? Or are you just, Walky style, dropping weighted terms to discredit someone's point of view without even trying?

:::::1. Hoop doesn't delete other people's comments on talk pages. 2. He actually signs his posts, which you've been asked to do many times, but haven't caught on. --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 00:40, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

:::::: I didn't delete anything. If I did, it was an accident because someone posted right in the middle of text it wasn't meant to be in the middle of. Not signing my posts doesn't make me retarded since it's blatant when I'm saying something. --[[User:67.159.44.88]]

Actually - come to think of it, you make fun of the idea that anyone running a site can be Nazi, yet you still mention you got banned from many forums. Does that perhaps mean that you genuinely got banned for being an asshole and not opposing the staff/local clique like I did?

:''any rational moderator would warn several times before a ban''
:Not true, some things are auto-ban. I don't think you ''did'' any of them, but I'm just saying.
:Dude- you got an expedited ban because you showed no signs of contrition, argued every point, used personal insults, refused to sign your posts even when '''repeatedly asked to''' (I had to go back into history and dig out which incoherent chunks of text where yours, because the posts weren't hierarchied properly so the debate was really hard to follow. This is why signin posts is important dumbfuck.)
:And ultimately you got banned because you were making a major nuisance of yourself in ''without'' any correlating '''contribution''' to justify keeping you around. You're a negative. You edited 3 articles- Fandom, Shortpacking and Ruined Forever- and ''all' of those edits got reverted because they either flames or crappy jokes that make the articles ''worse''. Even if I were to (generously) believe you didn't intend to start a fight, you picked the 3 flamebaitiest articles you could find and masturbated across them. ''Allah forfend'' you should write an ''episode summary'' or something.
:Unrelated- Walky can Talk:Fandom be semi-protected instead of full? Loserbot isn't registered. -[[User:Derik|Derik]]01:06, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

==On an unrelated note: Thank you.==
I know this is an odd place to say it, but I figured if I only said it once, it wouldn't be a bother so here goes: Thank You. Shortpacked is hilarious, and when not laughing, I'm agreeing with alot of the statements the main character makes. (and feeling like I was the only one who noticed some of them, like the one about General Discussions.) I also noticed your a Hot Shot fan, which is also awesome. I also noticed its due to the efforts of you and other people here that the move was made from Wikia to Tfwiki, which was a good idea so I also want to say a long overdue thank you for doing that as well, and finally: thanks for doing what you can for this site, because without this site, I'd be out of the loops on Club Exclusive things, and other Misc. Transformers related content. I go here frequently for information (or lolz) and I'm quite sure not only me but many others are grateful to you and all others who help contribute to this place.--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]
:Thanks, and we do our best! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:08, 4 January 2010 (EST)
I love it too. Ive been going through the archives and im up to the part where amber gets a bit of a makeover and ive loved every second of it --[[User:Mrgalvaprime|Mrgalvaprime]] 17:25, 14 January 2012 (EST)
only webcomic I read daily.--
[[User:Mojotron|Mojotron]]

==Tulsa, Oklahoma==
Sorry to bother you (I tried to avoid saying something again sense I already did the 'Thank you' earlier, but I HAD to ask about this). Had nothing better to do so I've been reading shortpacked's full archive beginning to end today. (Well I'm currently on July 6 2009 to be fair) and I noticed something that I just HAD to ask about. I've noticed once you mentioned Oklahoma. I ignored it the first time but then later you said "Tulsa". Now you got me curious, because I live in Tulsa and thus wondered what made you decide to choose to mention here of all places, sense basically nothing ever happens here. (Aside from the occasional Convention and the recent BOK center. Granted I may be moving to Florida in a few years..I really hope so. Been here my whole life and its boring) Just thought I'd ask, before curiosity drove me nuts. Keep up the good work on the comic, peace.--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]

EDIT: haha on second thought..maybe I should've said this at Walkypedia..or do you even go there? (I'd assume you do.) Oh well, my mistake I guess. Hope you'll still answer my question regardless. lol--[[User:Chipmonk328|Chipmonk328]]

== WfC Starscream ==

You said: "We revert that back to Starscream every time you change it for a reason."
:Well that's just great since that is my first contribution to that page. And the picture itself says Skywarp so I was just making both consistent. I'll change the pic to Starscream as well.--[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] 11:22, 14 January 2010 (EST)
:: Ah, sorry. Got you confused with Blackout, who was also changing it to Skywarp. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:28, 14 January 2010 (EST)
::: No prob. Just re-uploaded the image with starscream in the name rather than skywarp. The old one now has the delete tag. Thanks. --[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] 11:33, 14 January 2010 (EST)

== Quick Report ==

More vandalism, on Nekomimi A/B, section animated..I think? caption didn't seem right..
I heard you're supposed to report to an Admin, right?
-[[User:SlamBolt|Danny LeFox]] 23:37, 20 January 2010 (EST)
: The caption is okay. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:10, 21 January 2010 (EST)

== Independent Wikis ==
Hello Walky. This is Archaic, webmaster of Pokémon fansite Bulbagarden, and its associated wiki Bulbapedia. I sent you an email about 2 weeks ago (to the address linked on both your webcomics) regarding an idea I've recently been playing around with of a co-operative of independent wikis. I understand that you've been rather busy recently, so I just wanted to check if you had received that email or not, and if you might be interested in contributing your thoughts to the matter? --[[User:Archaic|Archaic]] 20:24, 25 January 2010 (EST)
: I did receive it! I'm sorry for not answering swiftly. Our answer depends on how much interaction you are looking for. Part of the appeal of leaving Wikia was breaking free of the mandatory link chain to "related wikis" that they put at the bottom of our frontpage. Our frontpage is now our own. That's not something I think we're interested in. We are, though, all in favor of people starting up their own wikis instead of depending on those lying Wikia assmongers. (to coin a phrase) But, I can't speak for the people here who help maintain this wiki and how much they would be willing to lend a hand. So, uh, the answer to your question at the moment is: "I don't know?" Um. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:47, 25 January 2010 (EST)
::Heh, no worries. We're all fairly busy at this time of year. For now, we're going full steam ahead with a limited version of this idea, focusing specifically on wikis linked to Nintendo franchises, which we're likely to launch within a couple of weeks. Perhaps it might be easiest if I'm able to show you what we're doing there? While we're doing quite a bit of integration between the partner wikis for this limited network, I'd imagine that any more general grouping of independent wikis would have to be a lot less so, if only for logistical reasons. As I mentioned in the email, it's all fairly up in the air right now. A lot of brainstorming, but not a lot of actual action at this point. --[[User:Archaic|Archaic]] 15:15, 26 January 2010 (EST)
:::If I may weigh in... basically, while I wager most (if not all) of us are individually supportive of any wikis that break free of Wikia, when it comes to linking on this wiki we generally only stick to links that add information to our articles, such as TFU.info, Marvel Universe TF profiles, Wookieepedia and GI Joe sites for Star Wars and GI Joe crossovers, etc. So unless there's some crossover connection between Pokemon and TF that we missed, I don't see that we can help, because we don't have anything that would need a link to your wiki. --[[User:Jeysie|Jeysie]] 15:35, 26 January 2010 (EST)
::::What, not even with that page you have on Pokéformers? ;) Seriously though, I think you might have misunderstood what I was suggesting. I'm not looking at a 2-way affiliation or link here. Instead, what I've been investigating is much closer to what Walky has in Blank Label Comics for his webcomics. An alliance of wikis united by a common purpose. Exactly how far one would take that is the real question. I certainly wouldn't expect a link to every wiki in such a network on the front page of any wiki in it. As you've rightly pointed out, you value the independence you've regained after breaking from Wikia, and any such network would have to be very careful to maintain that for all sites while still offering something meaningful. *shrugs* Like I said, all very much pie-in-the-sky kind of vague ideas right now, just exploring possibilities. --[[User:Archaic|Archaic]] 20:47, 26 January 2010 (EST)

:::::I don't know if you've heard, but wikia has decided to make a change (mandatorily!) that is 100 times worse than what drove you guys to a new server. I am interested in finding info on how you guys actually performed your move, and what would need to be done before, during, and after to make it work. If you could give me even a link (so that I can show others), that would be hugely helpful.
:::::If you could message me on my wikia talk page (yes, I know), that would be most appreciated. Thanks![[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 10:18, 28 September 2010 (EDT)

==Yeaaaaaaaah==
:: ''Hey, were you the [http://tfwiki.net/w2/index.php?title=Tales_of_the_Fallen_issue_5&diff=414380&oldid=413827 guy who called a dude a schmuck for no real reason], and so then he [http://shortpacked.livejournal.com/593224.html?thread=14980936#t14980936 quit this wiki] because he was treated like shit? You don't get a vote. Especially since you think Florida and Cuba are separated by a friggin' river. (Anyway, I vote against rhyming in the Headmasters section.) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:07, 8 February 2010 (EST)''
Yes because he was considering the entry was as bare and snarky as possible (You're hardly the soul of discretion all the time yourself sir) . And remarkably, being from a good distance across the planet, I don't know where everything is situated on that side of the world so the assumption of he ran into a river instead of the atlantic ocean, while my own fault I'll admit, is fairly understandable. But if I'm not aloud to voice my opinion cause a guy you don't know told you something about another guy you don't know, then tell me now please, save me trying to vote on something again. (I'm being completely serious by the way, if that's the case, I want to know). All the best. [[User:Eire]] 01.33 Feb 09 2010 (UTC)
::: When your opinion is "the guy who created this page is a schmuck," then you're probably going to get some flak for said opinion. It's not like the page was horribly put together. It was just abbreviated and snarky. It wasn't called for. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 21:52, 8 February 2010 (EST)

== Guess who's back..... ==

[[User:Masterman666]]
--[[User:-Blackout-|-Blackout-]] 12:45, 11 February 2010 (EST)
: Remind me who he is, again? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 12:54, 11 February 2010 (EST)
::[[User:Masterman555]]. Banned for flaming and using a sockpuppet. --[[User:-Blackout-|-Blackout-]] 13:01, 11 February 2010 (EST)
:::Then bye-bye, then! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:15, 11 February 2010 (EST)

== Breakaway image caption ==

Isn't Topspin the one with no personality? (Or was it a ref to Breakaway being Mister Likes-Everyone-Nice-Guy?) --[[User:Jeysie|Jeysie]] 13:13, 11 February 2010 (EST)
: Topspin doesn't like being used, and ripped Kickback's spark out of him in angry fury. That's more than Breakaway ever emoted. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:16, 11 February 2010 (EST)
::Plus, his utter devotion to Alpha Trion was also more characterization than Breakaway got. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 13:19, 11 February 2010 (EST)
:::Fair enough... it's just that since Topspin was always the one with the "No personality" cracks in his page (and the one who's profile specifically says he's had his personality and will crushed out) it seemed potentially out of place, so I figured I'd ask.
:::(Personally I admit I wouldn't claim Breakaway (who did a fair bit of pep-talking everyone) has no personality any more than Heatwave, who's equally easy-going, friendly, and optimistic, can be said to not have one, but I was more checking for possible mistakes than taste...) --[[User:Jeysie|Jeysie]] 13:47, 11 February 2010 (EST)

== RE: Divebomb ==
Hup, my bad. Thanks for catching that! [[User:Ayellowbirds|Ayellowbirds]] 11:06, 22 February 2010 (EST)

== Red Alert image ==
Thanks for color correcting it, looks much better. My desktop bit the dust last week, and my netbook chokes on photoshop. [[User:Kookaburra|Kookaburra]] 01:22, 30 March 2010 (EDT)

==Mainpage logos==
I'm shocked you haven't put up BC Breakdown yet. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:34, 8 April 2010 (EDT)
:I just put up *a* Breakdown. Really, I'd prefer to stick to art rather than toy images. Spark was an adrenaline rush exception. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:34, 8 April 2010 (EDT)

== I can't think of a suitable title to put here right now..... ==

[[Special:Log/block&page=User:Jeysie|This seems rather uncalled for.]]

Thank you for your attention. --[[User:-Blackout-|-Blackout-]] 13:38, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
: Maybe you should have brought it up during the twenty-four hours in which she was banned, and not like a few minutes before it expired. And it was certainly called for, considering the disrespect she was showing other users. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:15, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
::You called her a bitch. Was that not disrespectful as well? - [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 16:43, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
:::I think that was just me making an obvious point about her having talk page conversations ''entirely about other posters''. As usual, I make my points through sarcasm. Jeysie wasn't being sarcastic or trying to illustrate a greater point when she told me to stop "mouthing off." --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:21, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
:::I'm not upset about being banned. What I am upset about is that the reason it's so irritating trying to have a conversation with you is that you are constantly responding to people trying to make reasonable points with mocking rude responses, often ones that illustrate that the point was missed. So, I don't like ''your'' disrespectful attitude any more than you like mine.
:::Considering you actually make good points on the few occasions you turn off the mocking attitude and take the time to understand the points being made, it'd make dealing with you a whole lot less frustrating if you'd keep the attitude turned off all the time. --[[User:Jeysie|Jeysie]] 16:57, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
::::Ahahaha Jeysie is telling me to stop having a mocking attitude! I will mark that on my Jeysie-is-condescending calendar OH WAIT THERE IS NO ROOM --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:21, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
:::::Can we stop this? Both of you? You're both highly devoted editors to this wiki and we don't need a long lasting feud. Pretty Please? --[[User:Bluestreak7|Bluestreak7]] 17:28, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
::::::The kids don't like it when mommy and daddy fight.... --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 17:36, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
::::::Seconded. This is time and energy better spent on working on articles, and I've seen enough from both of you to know that it would benefit the wiki greatly if you did that. -- [[User:Ayellowbirds|Ayellowbirds]] 17:40, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
:::::::If Walky drops the attitude problem, there won't ''be'' a feud, because I'll have nothing to comment on to him, which will make me very happy.
:::::::The only reason I say anything at all is because I'm tired of his attitude always making trying to discuss something on the wiki a stressful chore instead of something productive. --[[User:Jeysie|Jeysie]] 17:44, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
::::::::This is silly. --[[User:NCZ|NCZ]] 17:48, 9 April 2010 (EDT)
:::::::::Response to Walky: Maybe you're not aware, but I am on a different continent than you are. Different continent = different time zone = inability to respond at the same time as you Americans. And don't even TRY to shift the blame. --[[User:-Blackout-|-Blackout-]] 05:07, 10 April 2010 (EDT)

==New bot==
Can I get a bot tag for [[User:DNAVI]] please? abates said you were the man for the job. - [[User:Magnus Maximus|Magnus Maximus]] 02:25, 15 April 2010 (EDT)

== Regarding TG Studios and the guy you banned ==

[[Talk:TG Studios|You may want to check this out.]] --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 14:33, 29 April 2010 (EDT)

Can you make Timelines sharkticon on wirte and put on a image ?

== Squiggles! ==

If by "squiggles", you mean "Japanese", toss me a copy of that translation, eh, my fine fellow? For the annotations, don'tcha know! :) - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 10:30, 5 July 2010 (EDT)
: In the filecard for Primal Major and Alpha Supreme, Maggie translated the two non-English characters at the end of it, which mean "Shanghai." That's all she's done (per my specific request), so I don't have anything else to tell you. :) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:35, 5 July 2010 (EDT)
::Ahh, that's still cool! I wouldn't have figured it out on my own! I have spotted at least one or two other bits of Japanese in there and was going to pester Spengler about them anyway. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 10:40, 5 July 2010 (EDT)

== King Starscream's bounty ==

So, do I get it if I turn myself in? - [[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 12:55, 2 August 2010 (EDT)

== Look! ==

You suck! Along with most of the other administartors on this wiki. I can't believe you treat people the way you do. I've been watching for a while, and I will tell you, that you're just an asshole! Why don't you grow up, and quit being a dick to everyone! Banning people for ridiculous reasons! Telling people their work is shit! In fact, I created this account just to confront you! GROW UP AND QUIT BEING A DICK! YOU"RE AN ASSHOLE! {{unsigned|Generations123|17:32, 11 August 2010 (EDT)}}
:The irony is staggering. --[[User:NCZ|NCZ]] 17:40, 11 August 2010 (EDT)
:: I think this guy deserves a Shortpacked! comic in his honor.--[[Special:Contributions/65.11.250.113|65.11.250.113]] 19:26, 29 August 2010 (EDT)

== My sandboxes ==

Hiya David, I was wondering if you will take a look at my improved Primes sandbox (not that I'm suggesting to retitle the article or anything, it's just the whim of my user space). I hadn't realized Marvel never uses the number 13, as it's been years since I read "Legacy of Unicron" or "Primal Scream", one takes these things for granted now. Also, regarding Alpha Trion, I finally have a response again to yesterday's chat, I feel we can compromise on this: the only thing bugging people about him being a multiversal singularity is SG. As you suggested, we should wait: we should wait to see if Forest or Hasbro explain his actions in that continuity or if multiversal singularities don't apply to mirrorverses like SG and that Alpha is truely unique from the original Prime who's more likely than not the one from G1/RID/UT/TA/ROTF/WFC. [[User:Alientraveller|Alientraveller]] 14:08, 12 August 2010 (EDT)

== Scan request ==

Since I can't find my copy of it at the minute, and since I know you had it out recent to scan that image of Rodimus Prime that's on the main page at the moment, might I trouble you to scan the panel from the third issue of the Marvel movie adaptation that features Hot Rod with a handful of energon sticks? On Junkion, when he's trying the universal greeting. Thanks! - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 04:59, 30 September 2010 (EDT)

== Ultra Magnus ==

I think we need to rewrite the Dreamwave section. It's kind of old TFwiki there with the super-condensed summary and lack of links to individual issues. --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 16:04, 30 September 2010 (EDT)

== Daleks ==

Listen, if you want behind the scenes proof, When the Daleks first appeared in Doctor Who, they were called Daleks, Davros calling the casing Mark 3 Travel Machine never happed until the time of the Forth Doctor. The information on the page is WRONG.
[[User:LordDalek|LordDalek]] 16:19, 16 October 2010 (EDT)

Oh, and by the way, Davros if a Doctor Who character. Detour is giving us information from fiction too. The comment is wrong.[[User:LordDalek|LordDalek]] 16:22, 16 October 2010 (EDT)

== Something that might be of interest to the TFWiki... ==

I think you'll find [http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/original-g1-scripts-designs-other-items-on-heritage-auction/20162/ this] to be rather interesting, as it may contain certain materials that would be decent additions to this Wiki. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 19:39, 8 November 2010 (EST)
: Thanks. I took some screencaps where I could. We should tell [[Jim Sorenson]] these exist and maybe he has a million dollars. (Or maybe just a hundred. Not many bids on these, and who the hell even knows this auction site exists?) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:33, 8 November 2010 (EST)
::That site had some of the live-action movie props being auctioned either last year or earlier this year, IIRC. --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] 22:45, 8 November 2010 (EST)
:Should I/we let him know in his [[User talk:Jimsorenson|User Talk page]] about this? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 14:09, 9 November 2010 (EST)

==Question & request==
How come we should keep "Junkion trader"? I wouldn't know of a source that makes it a canon designation and before the article even had the noname-nickname template. So, why keep a made-up name that's no longer needed?
: Also, if you have ''The Complet Ark'', could you add an image of adult Chip Chase to his article? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 13:15, 14 November 2010 (EST)
:: Isn't "Junkion trader" from a magazine or something? I don't think we made it up. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:43, 14 November 2010 (EST)
:::I can't say anything about magazines (though I'd wonder which magazine would bother to mention such an obscure "character"), but mostly, Derik, who made the article, had it marked as "nickname" from the start and left a reason for naming Junkion 1 "Junkion trader" on the Omniverse talk page. Altogether, I think it's not canon in any capacity. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 13:49, 14 November 2010 (EST)
::::*clenches fist* ''Derik''!! --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:50, 14 November 2010 (EST)

==Another request (Junkion related)==
I figure that before I completely lose my sight looking for Junkion models in a sea of red & random, I should ensure someone will move the Junkion articles (currently 3) I've been writing to their proper location. Would you be so kind? If the articles aren't clear enough on which model/character is described, there's a small extra description in the mainpic temapltes (that I just figured out don't show up on the actual page). Pretty please? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 12:40, 17 November 2010 (EST)
: I don't own the Complete Ark, so it will have to wait for someone to divulge that information. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 15:49, 17 November 2010 (EST)
:: :( Well, I guess I could try pestering Sorenson about it. Sorry for bothering you. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 15:55, 17 November 2010 (EST)
::: I have the Complete Ark, but I'm finding your descriptions a little vague. I think I'd need screen shots or comic panels or whatever to work out who you're talking about. - [[User:Cattleprod|Cattleprod]] 17:06, 17 November 2010 (EST)
::::As I said, the mainpic template contains a "screenshot description" that should make it possible to track who is who. Otherwise, [[:Image:TFTM Junkions.JPG|the three most in front in order are: kisser, double-eye and mouthplate]]. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 17:09, 17 November 2010 (EST)

== Talk:Bulkhead (Prime) ==

But every other kind of comment is allowed including swearing. The whole point of discussion pages is to discuss despite whether you think it's a waste. If it was in the wrong place then you should have said. -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 09:46, 29 November 2010 (EST)
: "He looks kind of purple when he's under certain lighting" is not something that's worth discussing. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:43, 29 November 2010 (EST)

== This might silence those who question the WFC/Exodus/Prime continuity ==

We finally have [http://www.unicron.com/news_item/2462/ official word] straight from the mouth of Hasbro itself that War for Cybertron, Exodus, and Prime are indeed in the same aligned continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 16:16, 8 December 2010 (EST)
:So... exactly what we had BEFORE. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:24, 8 December 2010 (EST)
::Yeah, but, now we can point nonbelievers to the words directly, instead of them having to just take our word for it. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 16:33, 8 December 2010 (EST)
:::So... exactly what we had BEFORE. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:39, 8 December 2010 (EST)
:::On this very wiki: [[Hasbro_Q%26A/September_2010:_Answers]] --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:06, 8 December 2010 (EST)

== I Am Sorry ==

Hey look, I am here to apologize for the crap I have been saying. I was acting like a jerk for a while to you and It has really been haunting me recently. I know I need to work on my grammer, and I actually shouldn't posting anything since I am only in my second year in High School, and to be honest, I have only been a fan of TF for 9 years. I have really been a jerk recently and I just want to have a clean start now. I hope you understand. I am sorry, in other words, for all the crap I put you and this sight through.[[User:LordDalek|LordDalek]] 14:02, 22 December 2010 (EST)

== Walky..... ==
Care to tell me why you have blocked my IP? --[[User:-Blackout-|-Blackout-]] 06:11, 23 January 2011 (EST)
:ItsWalky blocked your IP because of that Goldbug (IDW) toy deal of a few days ago. He may not have realized you were a regular contributor, but regardless, you should've started a third/fourth debate rather than declare the first two void because their results don't strike with your view on "reality". [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 06:20, 23 January 2011 (EST)
:: I blocked the anonymous IP who got into the edit war over removing Goldbug's toy info, which was just fucking obnoxious. If that was you, then whoops. Don't be a dickwad. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 09:16, 23 January 2011 (EST)

== You have Lugnut? ==

I've heard about you reviewing him, did you obtain him at a Brick & Mortar store like Walmart or Target? If so, which one (so the hunt may go on). Or was it through eBay/"specialty" store, or overseas? Moreso I'm wondering if the "not yet released" tag should still be applied to the Hasbro version on [[Lugnut (TF 2010)|his page]]. [[User:Karhukjnsi|Karhukjnsi]] 23:28, 11 February 2011 (EST)
: I got him from Big Bad Toy Store. He has been seen in stores, but like many other toys these days, he's having trouble hitting saturation. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 07:45, 12 February 2011 (EST)

==Aw look==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/David_Willis_(cartoonist)_(2nd_nomination) Your Wikipedia page is up for deletion].

-Blackout-
:Yeah, a nomination you started. Big effing whup. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 04:04, 9 March 2011 (EST)
::Which is why it got a SpeedyKeep and the deletion tag is already gone. Nice try. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:52, 9 March 2011 (EST)

== Generations Scourge ==

Ohhh, yes, I see now. I didn't realise that his head could extend so far up. I thought it was just the normal extension for his robot mode. Bit of a pain to push back down, though...

Anyway, I apologise.

[[Special:Contributions/24.143.42.51|24.143.42.51]] 16:40, 26 March 2011 (EDT)

== Thanks! ==

Thank you for backing me up on the bolded-comma issue. I knew all those things people said about you couldn't be true! [[User:JW|JW]] 16:24, 21 April 2011 (EDT)

==A week?==
Don't you think that's a bit long for a regular editor to be banned? Far as I can tell, he didn't even get a warning. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 12:58, 29 April 2011 (EDT)
: It's not his first week-long ban. And he's been warned (and banned) about this behavior before. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:07, 29 April 2011 (EDT)
::Don't you think that's a bit short since that's about the only thing he does? --[[User:FortMax|FortMax]] 13:11, 29 April 2011 (EDT)

==Iacon Archives==
Looking through the history of "Laserbeak (Cybertron)" and "Revelations Part 3", I see you were the one who called the archives the 'Iacon Archives'. Where did you get this name from, as it is not in the comics? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 17:45, 20 May 2011 (EDT)
: The archives appeared to be in Iacon. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:17, 20 May 2011 (EDT)
:: Could you elaborate on "appeared"? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 03:02, 21 May 2011 (EDT)
::: Everything in the story happened in Iacon. Or under Iacon. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:43, 21 May 2011 (EDT)
:::: Not really, since Vector Prime and co. first hang out at Kalis and Kaon also gets namedropped at some point. So... I guess that means the Archives' location can't be pinpointend any better than "somewhere on Cybertron". Thanks for helping me! [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 16:14, 21 May 2011 (EDT)

==New User==
There I did everything you said also I don't know how to use user pages so I hope i'm doing this right.[[User:Chubzhac|Chubzhac]] 23:35, 20 May 2011 (EDT)

==External Links==
Is it ok to use external links for titles such as ''Star Trek: Leonard McCoy, Frontier Doctor''? -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 00:15, 31 May 2011 (EDT)
: In what context? I'd really rather prefer most external links remain in the External links section. I kinda hate when I click on a link in the body of an article, thinking there'll be something relevant on this site, only to be taken elsewhere. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 00:16, 31 May 2011 (EDT)
::That's a little contradictory since there are external links all over this site that isn't in the External Links section. So what specifically don't you like about it? Being misled into thinking you're going onto Lindsey Lohan's Wikipedia article, but instead go to Mandy Moore's? (or something like that) What I meant exactly was that in almost every issue's page there's an Advertisment section showing what else is from the same publisher (that's why I used ''Star Trek'' as an example). So could some of those advertisments have an external link to another wiki site that would specialise (or have more insight) in that particular title. I hope that was a little more straight foward and maybe a little easier to understand. -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 13:16, 1 July 2011 (EDT)

== Probation appeal ==

So, the incident that led to my probation was proposing that [[Dead End (Animated)]] move to "Dead End (Timelines)" on the basis that that was his franchise-of-origin. I brought the issue up on the Allspark's "Major Wiki work" thread because I had no idea why it was reverted and I couldn't talk about it here (because of the probation thing). [http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=51208&view=findpost&p=1825571 The conclusion seemed to be] that I was ''technically'' correct, but the Wiki just didn't want to do it that way.
{{quote|The idea of moving the BotCon-exclusive Animated characters to a "Timelines" disambig is just one of those occasional instances where the instruction to "[[Help:Ignore all standards|ignore all standards]]" comes into play. Sometimes, it's just easier, more aesthetically pleasing, or just feels RIGHT to do things a certain way that may not be the way everything else is done.|[[Chris McFeely]]}}
I went about everything the right way, as far as I know. I put one move proposal tag on one page so it could be talked about. I gave a technically correct reason, "Franchise of origin. Like [[Cop-Tur (Timelines)]]". I do my best to remember to not do what I have been hollered at for doing in the past, but seriously, I had no way of knowing I was stepping into an instance of "ignore all standards". All you really had to do was revert my one move proposal with a big "We are ignoring all standards you moron!" in the change log. You would have felt better for hollering at me and I would have been clued in on what was going on and that would have been the end of it. So, can I please have my probation lifted? - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 18:59, 12 June 2011 (EDT)

==When the past comes to haunt you==
[[Vector Sigma Chamber]] - I have no clue how it could be written so that it's significantly different from the Vector Sigma page. You've stated you believe it could be an article with its own worth. If you have time, would you please give the page its long needed update?<br>
Meanwhile, I have never been able to track down the source that the ''[[Nemesis (G1)|Nemesis]]'' is Shockwave's underwater base in the Marvel comics. You and Derik talked about the source being one of the letters pages, but would you have any idea which issue's letters page?<br>
As an aside, [[TFWiki.net 2011 Transformers Hall of Fame Auditions/Entries|this page]] is locked, which would be all fine and stuff if not for the handful of article links that can not be fixed anymore. Could you please remove all of them? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 02:32, 15 June 2011 (EDT)

== New and ticked off ==

I'm new here. I have taken your suggestions into account, but there is one thing that still bothers me: no one else wants to help me. Can you lend a hand? --[[User:Ibreakthingz|The Breaker]] 19:24, 15 June 2011 (EDT)
:Nope - Random IP number
::What do you need help with? --[[User:FFN|FFN]] 12:54, 20 June 2011 (EDT)
Let me tell you, I am SUPER excited to help the guy who starts off by telling me he's ticked off. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:03, 20 June 2011 (EDT)

== Oh man, sorry ==
I don't see any comments, only some guy asking about how the info and description of Cybertron should be. Sorry about the confusion. I actually don't think that I ever reverted it back O.o I don't remember that, I must have clicked on some wrong place or something. Again, sorry fellow Transformer-fan :) [[User:Luka1184|Luka1184]] 11:15, 29 June 2011 (EDT)

== Dark of the Moon: Ship? ==

What exactly did they use to explore the moon then? Just wondering, thanks. [[User:Autow1ngz|Autow1ngz]] 02:22, 5 July 2011 (EDT)
: The novelization calls the ship Ratchet and Optimus Prime take to the moon the "Atlax X," a human-built craft. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:45, 5 July 2011 (EDT)
:Whoops, what I meant to say was what did Optimus and Ratchet use to recover the comatose (boy I love that word after seeing it on Tfwiki) body of Sentinel? [[User:Autow1ngz|Autow1ngz]] 03:00, 5 July 2011 (EDT)
::No, in the finished film, they ''do'' use the Xantium to go to the moon. Prime announces in a voiceover at the beginning of the scene, "Xantium approaching Tranquility base". - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 05:42, 5 July 2011 (EDT)
:::It feels weird, then, that they only really introduce the ship much later in the movie.--[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:34, 5 July 2011 (EDT)
::::Quite agreed. Seems fairly obvious that it was originally going to be a human-built endeavour (it's the "Ares V" in the comic), but then someone said "Why do they need a human rocket if our script already features a pre-existing Autobot spaceship as a plot point?", and it got shoved in earlier without any real reworking of the later intro scene. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 11:38, 5 July 2011 (EDT)

== Evac (Prime) ==

At SDCC announced two new figures for a character called Evac, from the Prime franchise, should we wait until he makes an appearance in the show to create his own article? --[[User:Metroplex|Metroplex]] 20:58, 23 July 2011 (EDT)
:Remember, one doesn't have to appear in the show to get a toy. -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 21:03, 23 July 2011 (EDT)
::I could have sworn that Evac was supposed to be a character for the new Transformers ride...[[Special:Contributions/98.209.73.178|98.209.73.178]] 21:28, 23 July 2011 (EDT)
:::He's not from Prime, correct. He's a new character created for the movie-based Transformers ride at Universal. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:23, 23 July 2011 (EDT)

== I need to tell you something. ==

Hi. There's something that I've been feeling a bit guilty about for a long time. You see, on a different account (which I will reveal the name of after you respond to make sure there are no hard feelings) I was quite rude. I was irrational, confused and upset. Afterwards, I left this site in guilt, and ashamed because I wasn't thinking rationally a few times while on my account. Do you think you can maybe accept my apology for my actions, because I feel like a horrible person for the silly things I brought up and got into. Would you please accept my apology? If you can't, well, that's okay too. If you don't get this, well, I just wanted to say I'm sorry for being such a horrible person on such a good website. :(
[[Special:Contributions/74.82.64.16|74.82.64.16]] 15:27, 28 July 2011 (EDT)

== Guilt ==

Sorry, I was thinking about my previous heading "I need to tell you something" and I reliezed that although I ment it in a kind way, I thought it's possible that you could believe that to mean that I had some cruel things to say, which I did not. The message is still the same though! If it means anything, I would like to say you can be sure nothing like that could happen again with me.
[[Special:Contributions/74.82.64.17|74.82.64.17]] 16:05, 28 July 2011 (EDT)
: I don't know who you are, but I guess we're all right. It's hard to refuse an apology from an anonymous dude. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:12, 29 July 2011 (EDT)

== Harrison Ford ==

Was it rude? Horrifying even? Why did you undo my edit? An external reference isn't to much to ask for. Is it? -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 19:39, 13 October 2011 (EDT)
: I addressed this on the talk page. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 19:55, 13 October 2011 (EDT)

== Files on user pages ==

I removed the images from my user page because of fair use, but nobody had removed them in the meantime because of this. So did I do right by taking them off or can I put them back? -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 19:46, 23 October 2011 (EDT)
: I don't really understand what you're asking. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 23:35, 23 October 2011 (EDT)
::Let's try this again. On another wiki I added a pic to [http://youngjustice.wikia.com/index.php?title=User:Anythingspossibleforapossible&oldid=39022 my user page] and it was [http://youngjustice.wikia.com/index.php?title=User:Anythingspossibleforapossible&action=history removed]. [http://youngjustice.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Thailog#Using files on your own user page This is the reply I got when I inquired further]. If you still don't understand I'll just put them back. -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 18:11, 24 October 2011 (EDT)
:::Over here, you're allowed to upload one pic specifically for your userpage. On top of that, from what I gather, you can add other pics that already exist for article, but obviously don't go overboard. Hope that helps! --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 18:10, 24 October 2011 (EDT)
:::::Thank you. -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 18:11, 24 October 2011 (EDT)

== I noticed the BotCon Europe 2002 talk page ==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Selective_deletion]

Just being helpful. :) --[[User:Krafty|K-K-Krafty!]] 10:22, 11 November 2011 (EST)

== About the caption bastard template... ==

I do not understand why you added that (mean-spirited) template. It's only two captions, and if you looked at my contributions, you would have noticed that I added a lot of information. I thought captions were supposed to be a reward for all that work. Adding a twist on an overused joke is at least an attempt to make it fresh, rather than stating some variation of "this joke sucks now", which is ''just'' as overused as plainly using an overused joke. [[User:Inkblot|Inkblot]] 19:41, 6 January 2012 (EST)
: I apologize for using the template. I was going to write a more personal note, but remembered we had the template, forgetting how sharply worded it was. You have not been a bad editor. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:42, 6 January 2012 (EST)

==A massive favour to ask==
Ive just started getting into your webcomics (im up to date on shortpacked and it wasnt until this morning i realised about you're earlier ones) but i have a huge favour to ask of you. I am currntly stuck with this stupid school laptop for a home computer which includes a school blocking system. While Shortpacked and Joyce and Walky sites are unaffected when i try to open dumbing of age it comes up with
[[Image:Examplepagetoshowwalky.jpg|left|500px|thumb|]]
Is there anyway you could perhaps email me copies of the files for each update + all the ones so far. I can understand if you say no but i though there was no harm in asking--[[User:Mrgalvaprime|Mrgalvaprime]] 06:15, 17 January 2012 (EST)
: I'm sorry, but I cannot email you all my comics. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:12, 1 March 2012 (EST)
Oh well, it was a long shot anyway--[[User:Mrgalvaprime|Mrgalvaprime]] 03:47, 30 May 2012 (EDT)
{{-}}

== Prime toys ==

You wouldn't happen to know when exactly the ''Transformers: Prime'' toys are scheduled to be released, would you?[[Special:Contributions/71.255.172.244|71.255.172.244]] 19:59, 1 March 2012 (EST)
: Transformers toys that aren't the first wave of product for a blockbuster movie don't tend to have release dates. Stores will receive them and put them out at some point after that. So I have no date for you. However, I've seen them out at some stores here for weeks, so the answer is "some time in the past, perhaps now, perhaps not until the future." --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:10, 1 March 2012 (EST)
I haven't seen any toys in the stores, but thanks anyway.[[Special:Contributions/71.255.172.244|71.255.172.244]] 21:44, 1 March 2012 (EST)

The other convention-exclusive pink Arcee figure, they are availible on the web. How would I be able to get it without getting lead into a scam. I was hoping you or someone on this wiki would know how I would be able to get that toy. I didn't go to the convention.[[Special:Contributions/71.162.106.122|71.162.106.122]] 19:24, 4 March 2012 (EST)
: http://www.hasbrotoyshop.com/transformers-prime-bumblebee-and-arcee-set?BR=496&ID=29273 --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:58, 5 March 2012 (EST)
::Wow! Only $29.99. Thanks.
:::On Ebay, it costs $80.00.

== what you said to me ==

i will make sure i learn more english when i go to school today
: Mostly I hope they teach you about capital letters and punctuation. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:02, 19 March 2012 (EDT)

It's kind of hard to do that all when you're using a wii like I am [[User:Jacktransformerdude|Jacktransformerdude]] 02:08, 19 March 2012 (EDT)
: If you're editing the wiki with something that makes it nigh-impossible to edit the wiki, you probably shouldn't edit the wiki. I've tried it on my cellphone before, and it's extremely difficult to get all of the various coding right, but if I can't edit the wiki correctly, I just don't edit the wiki. Leaving a bunch of stuff that has to be deleted or completely overhauled is worse than not contributing at all. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:54, 19 March 2012 (EDT)

== The Fallen/Megatronus Prime artwork ==

I wanted to have someone verify this before I uploaded it, but is [http://t4ak.roblox.com/daaf9f4eb9b33f115661eb4a7c849007 this] the concept art for the ''Aligned'' pre-Fallen version of Megatronus Prime, and if so is is usable? --[[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 15:23, 10 April 2012 (EDT)
: That's not exactly what we saw at Hasbro's panels. It's not in the same style. (It'd look more like the Aligned Prima art, which is way more painterly.) This looks like an artist's recreation from memory to me. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:07, 10 April 2012 (EDT)
::Thanks, just what I needed to know. Off to search again. --[[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 16:53, 11 April 2012 (EDT)
:::Pictures were not allowed of those guys. If you somehow manage to find one, we wouldn't be able to use it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 21:15, 11 April 2012 (EDT)
::::Gotcha. Thanks anyway. --[[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 21:37, 17 April 2012 (EDT)

== Prime Hot Shot toy image ==

Not really sure why you replaced the photos that I already took for the toy with your own, (which are kind of faded, especially with the red) but whatever. Just kind of wondering why, though. <small>Well, there go my efforts... :/</small> [[User:Inkblot|Inkblot]] 23:19, 7 May 2012 (EDT)
: M Sipher overwrote my Kick-Over photos. It happens. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 23:33, 7 May 2012 (EDT)

== Reno Wilson ==

If I sound impatient, I'm sorry, but I've explained the reasoning behind my edit to the Mudflap controversy several times over, and nobody has disagreed with me. A couple users explained what it's supposed to mean, but it turns out that it's based on an incorrect assumption to begin with. Both times that I've I changed it, though, the edit has been reverted without an explanation. If this is about my spate of edits to my own comments, then I'm sorry, but I'm just editing a minor note to be more factually accurate and less obtusely "snarky". How can I get it to stick? - [[User:Caswin|Caswin]] 17:00, 13 May 2012 (EDT)
: "Nobody has disagreed with me" is a pretty bold complaint, considering everyone on that talk page disagrees with you. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:08, 13 May 2012 (EDT)
::In my defense, that's a recent development. Nobody ''had'' disagreed with me when I wrote that. If anyone can prove me wrong or show that this is a special case, I'll shut up right now. However, while I understand if it became personal at some point, I have to admit I don't see the point in defending the wording of one note so closely to begin with, at least not unless it's funnier than I thought. - [[User:Caswin|Caswin]] 18:12, 13 May 2012 (EDT)
:::"Prove me wrong" is a red herring. The entire discussion is a "Yeah-huh"/"Nuh-uh" dynamic. You didn't understand the joke. Everyone else did. There's nothing left to prove or discuss. Please, please, please move on to something else. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:31, 13 May 2012 (EDT)

==IDW==
Ok. Fine but can you edit Ratchet then if I do my edits too long because I've been on it for quite awhile. Ed

===IDW Whirl==
Hi there, I'm not sure how else to get in touch with you.
Please don't include speculative conclusions to the Wiki. All that was written in MTMTE #6 regarding Whirl is that he was at one point an instructor, and that he changed his names a few times. Until it has been confirmed that Whirl IS or is not Jetstream, please don't state as such. (apple pie)
: I don't think you grasp the difference between speculative conclusions and the Whirl/Jetstream deal. Don't mess with those pages again. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:03, 27 June 2012 (EDT)

===Nightracer Changes===
I got a note from you and am not sure the proper method for messaging or response to you, so I'll just say it here? You needn't have so drastically changed both entries for Nightracer. I deliberately created a new page for the cloned Nightracer so once more was known about both, they could both be altered accordingly. You seemed to edit both pages until they were to YOUR liking, rather than letting them evolve as needs be. Really, you created a lot of work for yourself, so please don't get upset and send me condescending messages when you could have simply fixed the new entry, and let me know how they work. It's not exactly easy to find instructions on how to "discuss" things, so assuming you know EXACTLY how everything should work and then talking down to a newer user doesn't really make you look very good.
: YOU needn't have so drastically changed Nightracer's entries. That is my problem. I am trying to revert. As a new user, when you make many many changes to a page, to the point of moving the page itself, without asking about it first, I don't think you have a lot of room to get mad at someone else changing it a whole bunch to put it mostly back the way it was. Next time, ask. Certainly, at least, until you have a better grasp of how the wiki organizes information. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:08, 7 September 2012 (EDT)

===Reverting All My Edits==
Okay, so maybe I should quit adding captions. But why do you keep undoing my major edits to character bio pages too? Okay, it shouldn't be an essay. But this is a Wikipedia, and it's the Transformers Wikipedia to boot; people come here for specific information. On Transformers.
[[User:Harley Quinn hyenaholic|Harley Quinn hyenaholic]] 10:49, 21 September 2012 (EDT)
: You are not adding specific information. You are saying in fifteen paragraphs what the page is already saying in three paragraphs. It is not only unnecessary, but makes the page worse. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:52, 21 September 2012 (EDT)

==Secretary joke==
:I have no problem with acknowledging Arcee's less intense role in HM (note: I have yet to see about half of HM, so as for HM context I hardly have anything to say), but I question what is the joke's target: The Headmasters's writing... or secretaries and Japanese people? It's not just that joke, it's that this wiki has a small web of jokes and remarks relating to Arcee's job change that go beyond fair critique and into, well, bigotry. I'm trying to imagine how the way the wiki trashes on Arcee's job change must read to someone who is a secretary. As the child of a (once) secretary, I do see it as an attack on the job itself. You can't really deny that - just look at the image description I've changed that felt the need to specify the job warrior with "brave" as if being a secretary means you can't be brave (if this is HM context, it fails to specify that). Airazor's page used to have the same problem in her writeup about her gender in Japan. This also makes the joke gendered, given the usual associations of who does which job contrasted with the idea which job deserves more appreciation. For the other element of the joke that bugs me, I invite a look at BW Blackarachnia's note section. There's one at best humorous, at worst neutral treatment of an absolutely disgusting post on Blackarachnia's design process. The next note about Blackarachnia in Japan is written with much more condemnation while failing to convince me I'm reading about something worse than the previous note. And then there's that eternal remark about Arcee in HM again that again fails to offer a proper and coherent story rather than inside-crowd cover-aggression. I could also talk about the 'joke' showing up on TFA Arcee's page, which is kinda bull considering TFA had a bad-to-horrendous treatment of most of its female cast, Arcee included, but that's not commented on. No, what is commented on is a lesser worse treatment of G1 Arcee decennia ago in that awful country known as Japan.
:That's why I want the joke changed. Not because the wiki shouldn't talk about the job change and sexist/gender stereotypical script motivations, but because I don't think a small cover-aggressive caption will be enough to do that without being sexist itself. And in the context of the entire wiki, because I feel critique on Japanese writing is handled considerably bolder than critique on American writing.
:All that said, I'm taking a step aside from the above to thank you for the Arcee captions you've added. They're a great addition to her article. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 07:09, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
::I've yet to be convinced that you can tell the difference between making fun of bigotry and bigotry itself. You seem to constantly believe one is the other, and suggest that just dealing with the subject directly is embracing it. To that I say bullshit, and that's stupid. You're not going to win that argument. Making fun of stupid Transformers crap is what this wiki does, and "historically bad treatment of female characters" is not magically exempt from that.
:: The way to fix this is not to dial back on the criticism of stupid crap. If there are things you think we should lampshade but we are not, by all means, fix that. Animated Arcee already has a caption on her page talking about how she's just a prop. I added one to G1 Arcee's page last night about her less-than-stellar introduction into IDW continuity. (Both those are English fictions, btw.)
:: The "In Japan, I'm a secretary!" is a caption that is as old as her page, and originally belonged to a screencap from her then-only appearance in which her leg had gotten blown off in the line of duty. I don't think it's appropriate for the stock image for which it has substituted and could stand to be changed to match the image better. But if you're going to level the pretty incendiary charge of "bigotry," I think you could at least meet that serious charge with the footwork to determine the source and context of the content you're leveling the claim at. Again, this is part of my concern that you assume the worst of others' intentions without first attempting to understand them. Is a caption "bigotry" when it merely survived an earlier version of the page from a time when Animated Arcee didn't have the history she does now? Or do you just like throwing that damn word around because it's easy? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:34, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
:::You know what I don't get? That I can't simply say "this caption makes me uncomfortable" and that that is enough reason to change it (I could also add to that "these captions have ''always'' made me uncomfortable but I've been too scared and confused to do something about most of them earlier"). Also I don't get why you keep making this as if I am attacking individuals. The only reason I contacted you and M Sipher is because you both returned something that makes me uncomfortable and rather than start an edit war with an admin or two because I'd like to get a few things done before ever getting banned, I'm trying to talk this over. Yes, I'm using words as "bigotry" and "sexism", because I don't think they're big words that should be reserved for the most extreme, clearly visible of cases. The moment it plays into a system (that makes the extreme cases possible), it qualifies. But I don't call ''anyone'' any of those words, because I don't believe these jokes/critiques are bad on their own, but bad in a system, and I don't hold anyone of this wiki responsible for that system. Why I don't look up histories of page jokes/remarks - I'm not interested in who put it there and the reasons for it aren't really important either. All I'm concerned about is what is there now and how it connects with other such comments all over the wiki. Individual excuses are just going to cloud the systematic problem's presence.
:::And believe me, it's ''not'' easy using those words, because they're words that are likely to cause unwarranted defensiveness that blocks out the entire function of those words of pointing out systematic problems. If I'd go for easy, I'd be ass-kissing my way into your good graces right now.
:::I hope you'll excuse me that I'll give a specific reply to "I've yet to be convinced that you can tell the difference between making fun of bigotry and bigotry itself. You seem to constantly believe one is the other, and suggest that just dealing with the subject directly is embracing it." (only). There's two things I know of that are important in this, and those are all needed: that ironic sexism ís a form of sexism and that femmephobia is a terrible way of 'battling' sexism. That indeed puts a number of jokes and remarks around here in the same vein of bad as what they try to criticize. Call it a 'belief' if you want to, I'll keep calling it 'What is Sexism 101'. And lastly, it's nonsense that a caption can 'deal with a subject directly'. Nearly all captions rely on background knowledge, but do not provide it themselves. That's why a number of them criticizing content fail. Notes and elaborate sections tend to provide better 'deal with a subject directly'-stuff, but they're rare.
:::The thing is that I'd love to rewrite/write about some of the problematic content and 'deal with the subject directly' but I sincerely doubt that it would be appreciated. There was, for example, the matter of Override Prime's Primehood about a year ago that did not go down well. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 17:36, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
::::The problem is that you have a definition of "femmephobia" that others do not share, and so your claims of it aren't getting any traction. I still can't comprehend how pointing out that Arcee's function in America is "Warrior" but her function in Japan is "Go-fer" is in any way being hateful of ladies. Hear me out: I in no way want to diminish your feelings on a topic that you have a inside take on. As a female, you will always have a better understanding of the experience, and as dudes the best we can do is listen and understand. However, the problem is ''you are just one female.'' You don't represent all of them. I've been doing webcomics about ladies and gay folks for forever, and if there's anything I've learned over and over again it's that nobody agrees on what's offensive or sexist or bigoted. I've gotten yelled for jokes being construed as insensitive by a minority, while simultaneously a bunch of other folks from that same minority saying that other guy or gal is wrong and it was fine. If commentary could be vetoed by one person who didn't like it, there wouldn't be any commentary ever. And so while your word carries more weight on this topic due to circumstance of birth, your word will not always be Final. It can't work that way.
::::You can make a plea for why that caption is dumb, and if others agree we can certainly yank it out, but other people can outvote you. This wiki is a collaborative project and no one person can veto the decisions of the community, lest I remind you that we don't have an all-encompassing Sideways page. Your best course of action is to find others who agree with you and get them involved here. I bet you that on this topic the wiki would be willing to listen to a vocal minority (that is, consisting of more than one person). --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 19:37, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
::::At any rate, I've asked around: http://itswalky.tumblr.com/post/32361010306/a-question-to-the-ladies-who-follow-me-so (I want to emphasize through this exercise that while I may not agree with your take, I do take it seriously.) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:17, 26 September 2012 (EDT)
:::::Oh, I am familiar with your work and the controversies it causes. If I recall correctly, it was one of your comics that introduced me to the term "ableism". Came in handy when the D-drama in the MLP: Friendship is Magic fandom started.
:::::I am also well-aware I am not the chosen representative of all of womanhood, nor did I present myself as such. I very much appreciate you asking others for their opinions, even though I didn't have to look to know what the general attitude would be. It's commendable you took the time to do this for me. Thank you.
:::::That said, you unintentionally brought up another possible 'both be happy'-solution for this matter that doesn't require too much change I think. I don't know much about Arcee's role in HM, as said already, but if her role is so small that her job can be described as "gofer", then all I request is that word to be used on the wiki instead of "secretary" for me to be, well, a lot more okay with the situation, and definitely the caption. Would that be possible (I accept 'no')? [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 14:05, 27 September 2012 (EDT)
::::::"Go-fer" is fine. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:43, 27 September 2012 (EDT)

== Question ==
Alright, I probably seem like a little kid for asking this, but how do you think I did on the ''[[Transformers: Prime - The Game|Prime - The Game]]'' page? -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 08:19, 31 October 2012 (EDT)

== "Home in" ==

I don't understand how the merriam link disagrees with jalaguy; it specifically gives "a missile honing in on its target — Bob Greene" as an example.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:01, 27 November 2012 (EST)
: Yes, it gives examples of usage, but then spends a whole paragraph belaboring how it shouldn't be used. The page defines it, but then tells you not to use it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:34, 27 November 2012 (EST)
:: I hadn't expected to start a mini-edit war with that note. Thanks for the support! [[User:JW|JW]] 10:35, 28 November 2012 (EST)

== Predacon bird ==

I Looked it up and can't find anything on the Predacon bird from Car Robots. Can you please tell me where I can find the picture of the Predacon bird?[[User:Transfan 1992|Transfan 1992]] 19:50, 9 December 2012 (EST)
: I seriously have no idea what the hell you are talking about. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 20:25, 10 December 2012 (EST)
::He seems to be talking about some random shot cut from an [[The Decepticons|RID episode]]... [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 20:29, 10 December 2012 (EST)
:::Then I am of no help. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:21, 11 December 2012 (EST)

== NOOOOO.jpg ==

: [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] has had [tfwiki.net/wiki/File:NOOOOO.jpg this] marked to be moved since May. No one's done so, so I'd like to see if I you'd approve of the move?--[[User:Spin-Out|Spin-Out]] 18:29, 27 July 2013 (EDT)

== Question. ==

EDIT-Thank you.[[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 17:06, 19 August 2013 (EDT)

== Apologies ==

Hey ItsWalky,

Just saw your message. Just got rid of the link. Sorry about that.

I didn't mean to break any rules, I just wanted to know what to do with the info.

--[[User:Dean3|Dean3]] 01:00, 17 September 2013 (EDT)

Wait until it airs? Which is why the Predacons Rising page is LOCKED? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:02, 17 September 2013 (EDT)

Will do. Thanks again for the info. Also, as a side note, that's an ''awesome'' profile image you've got on your page. Plus your art is awesome too; just checked your blog page. --[[User:Dean3|Dean3]] 02:48, 17 September 2013 (EDT)

== Possible Second Alt Mode.... ==

Does perceptor in fall of cybertron transform into a microscope?
[[User:Hyruk]]
: I dunno, maybe read [[Perceptor (Prime)|Perceptor]]'s page to find out. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:40, 1 November 2013 (EDT)

Talk:Predaking (Prime)

2013-11-05T04:30:58Z

Bumblejumper:

So, hey, is Beast Hunters a new franchise? Do we need to move Predaking's page to a new disambig? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 16:43, 11 October 2012 (EDT)
:Well, the branding seems to be ''Transformers Prime: Beast Hunters'', so I suppose it's more of a subline-imprint than a whole new franchise... [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 17:17, 11 October 2012 (EDT)
::Does that mean it gets its own page? If it does, I'll be happy to create it. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 19:06, 11 October 2012 (EDT)

Does anyone know what kind of accent this guy has, it sounds awesome! - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 23:30, 4 November 2013 (EST)

== Observation ==

Just an observation, it feels like this guy is made to replace Dreadwing, as he follows Megatron with blind devotion, cares deeply for his brethren and Megatron is keeping seecrets about there demise from him.

== Voyager toy observances. ==

So, being polite (I didn't want to directly edit the page and add stuff without, you know, putting it here first) and having the toy in hand...

*He has a LOT of rubbery plastic that likes to deform (Some in the box, the beastmode head on mine is warped and I have no idea how it's supposed to look 'normally'). Presumably the Takara release will have hard plastic?
*His rocket launchers have a gear-mesh system that allows you to plug them together and fire them at the same time... But this function doesn't work in beastmode, the plugs on his shoulders are too wide to allow the gears to mesh. Which is somewhat perplexing as this presumably would be the entire point of the gear-mesh system?
*Finally, his tail-sword is a neat idea, but doesn't really work, his hands (Being rubbery plastic) don't have enough friction or room for the tabs to hold the sword functionally like in the promo pictures. It tends to just flop out of his hand if you place it there.

On that note, the Promo-picture is miss transformed in robot mode, he should have a black spike erected on either shoulder.

On a more childish/awesome note, with his rocket launchers on his arms, he looks like he has dragon-headed fists, complete with fireball punches.

--[[User:Slift|Slift]] 21:53, 3 April 2013 (EDT)

: It seems that, like many figures that use soft plastic, HOW soft the plastic is varies by case and even parts. My Predaking has fairly solid but flexible plastic on his head, and almost Play-Doh for hands. It takes a clear packaging band to hold it in place properly. QC got a little lax on this one. --[[User:King Starscream|King Starscream]] 16:08, 19 April 2013 (EDT)

== Beast Fire ==

Is the Beast Fire Predaking definitely part of Beast Hunters, and not Predacons Rising? Or is there two releases of the same figure?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 12:38, 10 July 2013 (EDT)

== Titles ==

*G12: プレダコン悪鬼大帝 (Predacon Demon Emperor)
*G23: 究極悪鬼大帝 (Ultimate Demon Emperor)

Applies for Dragotron and Guren Dragotron, if the split happens.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 18:48, 18 September 2013 (EDT)
:The former's been written on here as "Evil Oni Emperor", so I guess the latter would be "Ultimate Evil Oni Emperor", then. Good to know, thanks. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 19:54, 18 September 2013 (EDT)
::Akki's already one word, though, it's not two. The "-ki" is probably meant to tie into the Four Oni, but unlike those four its box doesn't actually call it an Oni (whereas the Four Oni's profiles say they transform from 'Dragon Mode' to 'Oni' [http://www.eptoy.com/images/product/2530_2.jpg]). If you want to differentiate it from Akuma, "Fiend" is also an acceptable translation.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 20:57, 18 September 2013 (EDT)

== Main Pic==

Could we change the main pic to a robot screenshot? [[User:SoundWave|SoundWave]] 18:52, 7 October 2013 (EDT)

MediaWiki talk:Community Portal

2013-11-05T04:27:45Z

Bumblejumper: /* New Theme */

__NEWSECTIONLINK__

This is the place for discussion of topics that affect the entire wiki. Some topics that would ordinarily be here have merited their own pages:

{{chapters|title=Specific Discussion Subjects|align=left|content=
<div class="list-header">'''Moving From Wikia:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving|Arriving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving|Leaving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki:Community Portal/Complaints|Complaints]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''New Ad Policy:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki:Ads|Ads]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Bookworm Database-Crash:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Damage Control Central|Damage Control Central]]
* [[Project:Bookworm Crash]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving2|Leaving Take 2]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Server Move:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving2|Arriving Take 2]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Relicensing:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Relicensing|Relicensing]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Dealing With Vandalism:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Vandalism|Vandalism]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''GoBots Sister Wiki:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/GoBots|Discussion on the place of GoBots in this wiki]]
<br/> <div class="list-header">'''Wiki Technical Information:'''</div>
* [[Transformers_Wiki:Tech|A Not So Brief Summary of the Horrible Things That McFly and Co. Have Done To Keep This Wiki From Melting Down]]
}}<br/>

{{:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}/Archive}}


==Batchtaster?==

Really? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 18:19, 1 January 2013 (EST)

== Captions ==

I have often found myself simply reading this website for entertainment because it just appeals to my sense of humor that much. I have often found myself wanting to somehow upvote or like a caption because it was just that good. Is there a way to do this? If not, can there be? [[User:Tourny|Tourny]] 20:59, 5 January 2013 (EST)
:I don't think that'd ever happen, because at the end of the day, this a Transformers wiki, not a 'post your Transformers jokes here' website. The jokes aren't and never should be the main focus, they're just a fun side effect. If anything, such a system would kind of legitimise the people who show up and do just want to use this place as a place to post their 'hilarious' Transformers jokes without contributing anything useful, and god knows we don't want that... [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 04:52, 6 January 2013 (EST)
::A most welcome way of doing it would be to point out the captions you like by posting to your facebook or twitter or what have you, especially with a link to the TFWiki page in question. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:18, 6 January 2013 (EST)

== Aligned character page main images ==

Since we've finally beun to treat the Aligned characters like we do characters of other continuities by disambiguating them by franchise, does anyone else feel that a bunch of characters with (WFC) disambigs having their Prime designs as their main image feels a little off? I mean, [[Thundercracker (Armada)]] uses his Armada design as his main image despite his Cybertron depiction being his most prominent one. Wouldn't it make more sense to have the WFC designs be the main images for those characters who bear the (WFC) disambig and such? Especially since our policy says, "the main image [of a character's page] should be their original 'real world' form". --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:34, 7 January 2013 (EST)
:Not sure why it's there for Thundercracker, but characters like [[Sideways (RID)]] and [[The Fallen]] use their later body designs for their mainpics. It's the most prominent way they've appeared, same as Sideways and Fallen. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 00:40, 7 January 2013 (EST)
::The only reason Sideways has his Armada body at the top of the page is that there is no art of the RID body. His packaging image was a photo of his toy and he hasn't appeared in that body anywhere in fiction. The Fallen has his movie body because, well, it was our most popular page for a year or two, because of the movies, and so he was a special case. Regardless, a part of me is pretty okay with the Aligned guys having their Prime bodies at the top, ignoring all standards. That feels a lot different to me than the disambiguation parenthetical, which is there for organization, not for looks or presentation like the main image is. But my feelings are not super strong. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:31, 7 January 2013 (EST)
:::I think we should stick with the Prime images. I'm basically okay with the disambig change at this point after not being on board at first, but I think keeping their Prime main images will help mitigate the potential confusion or blurring of the lines that Aligned seems to always foster. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 05:09, 7 January 2013 (EST)
::::I think for the time being, Prime images make the most sense. ''Going into the future'', I think additional different-looking cartoons in the Aligned continuity would be a decent argument for returning to WFC bodies, because at that point they're simply one of many looks, instead of the less prominent of two. -[[User:LV|LV]] 11:49, 7 January 2013 (EST)

==Continuing spam==
With the spam continuing, even with captchas and email activation turned on, are we to assume that it's some actual poor bastards sitting there copypasting nonsense about handbags into pages? Would a possible solution be trivia-style verification questions? Something most TF fans would know, or could otherwise find out easily, but that a bored spammer would lack the initiative to find out? Like 'who is the Combaticon leader?' or 'what faction does Hound belong to?' and so on. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 14:57, 8 January 2013 (EST)
:''Are'' Captchas and email activation turned on? I'm not sure how they could be. These are obviously bots, and last I heard we'd only turned on the requirement to register before you can edit.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 15:05, 8 January 2013 (EST)
::Yeah, log out and check the account creation page, there's a reCAPTCHA thingmabob on there now. Sipher mentioned activation emails being turned on in the spam discusson further up the page, but looking at the sign-up page again, email isn't required, so I guess it can't be... [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 15:14, 8 January 2013 (EST)

::There are [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Anti-spam_features several simple steps] that would improve matters immediately and immensely - [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:TitleBlacklist TitleBlacklist] to block the likes of <nowiki>[[Talk:Something/]] and [[Talk:/Something]]</nowiki>, preventing users from creating User: pages with their first edit by requiring the Autoconfirmed permission to do so, adding a [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgSpamRegex $wgSpamRegex] to LocalSettings.php to prevent pages from being saved if they contain obvious trigger words like "viagra", "cialis", "online casino", "ugg boots" and so forth. They just aren't being used. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 19:20, 8 January 2013 (EST)

::reCaptcha is a piece of poop, security-wise. I'm also reluctant to add more extensions at the moment, due to performance issues, BUT. Find something simple and lightweight to REPLACE reCaptcha, and we can talk. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 05:38, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::$wgSpamRegex isn't an extension, it's a line of code you can add various banned words to (i.e., if "viagra" is in the list and someone tries to save a page that includes it, the page wouldn't save and they'd get a error message telling them why it wouldn't save. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:29, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::You know what WASN'T on? wgEmailConfirmToEdit. That may make a LOT more sense, as I'd wager that spambots aren't actually including legit emails. Email authentication is NOT the same thing. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 16:50, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

:I still don't think reCaptcha is helping, as noticed, and it doesn't have anything like, say, a lockout policy, so I've bit the bullet and added a modified version of the SpamBlacklist extension, adding in RBL support and some basic language filters in one go. It's reasonably light on DB traffic, too. Will it slow the flood? That remains to be seen, but they're still getting around it right now. I also think I've resolved the IP blocking issue, so we might (might!) be okay now. Turns out that adding a load balancer in front of the Squid caches hurts Mediawiki's IP detection logic. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 20:21, 16 January 2013 (EST)
::Alternate suggestion: could the system be modded to block an editor from creating an article until one of their edits is marked as patrolled (and thus approved as legitimate)?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 00:53, 24 March 2013 (EDT)

== We are moving very very soon. ==

That means at some point within the next few hours to few days the wiki will go to Read Only mode while McFly moves stuff around. Then we won't be hemorrhaging cash and things will run smoothly and we'll all have boners, even the ladies. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:12, 9 January 2013 (EST)
:I've got one right now! - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 17:23, 9 January 2013 (EST)

Okay, so, uh, what the hell happened? -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 00:43, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:We have moved. Some things are still being tweaked. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:46, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::Well, I knew we moved, just I thought nothing would look different. Oh, well. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 00:52, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::New Mediawiki software version. Some things got a little mixed up in the move, and newer versions decided to put the hammer down on bad practices. Other things are just... being refactored from a distinct lack of notes. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 01:43, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::Most of what's left is going to be us rejiggering some templates to more efficient code, and documenting the snot out of things so McFly doesn't name his first ulcer after us.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 02:02, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::: http://science.education.nih.gov/home2.nsf/Educational+ResourcesResource+FormatsOnline+Resources+High+School/928BAB9A176A71B585256CCD00634489 :p - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:25, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::::: Pedantry aside, I CAN name my migraines after you. Stress exacerbates THOSE. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 20:05, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::::: Which migraine's stronger then? Madness or little Sanity? :p - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 10:36, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

===Stuffs what have gone wrong(er)===
User CSS files aren't being called post-move. Basically, the stuff [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Configuration_settings#CSS.2FJs here] was previously all set true, now it's set false. [Is [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] even working?] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:25, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
: Compared old LocalSettings.php to new, wgUseSiteJs/wgUseSiteCss were NOT set over there. If you're not just making blanket assumptions, please point my not-MediaWiki-understanding ass to the right place. Remember, I built the house, but others (Scout? Derik?) actually laid out the rooms and installed the appliances. My understanding of Mediawiki extends out to "Ooh, shiny mediawiki package in apt repositories..." Anything else is a '''Wild. Ass. Guess.''' --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 20:05, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::I'm not an expert ('''And I can't see the Wiki's LocalSettings.php myself to be sure!'''), but I have played around with MediaWiki a fair bit, so I'm beyond the "oh, shiny" stage and I know where to look at in http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Contents .
::For instance, I don't know what $wgAutoConfirmAge and $wgAutoConfirmCount are currrently set to. If the createpage and upload ''have'' been set, but those two variables are ''not'' set, a fairly minimal barrier would be two days & four edits before you can create pages and upload files - certainly, very few spambots will hang around for two whole days before editing!

<pre>
$wgAutoConfirmAge = 86400 * 2; # Two days times 86400 seconds/day
$wgAutoConfirmCount = 4;
</pre>

::If they HAVEN'T been set, you can add them with:
<pre>
# Only users with accounts in autoconfirmed group
# (registered accounts at least as old as $wgAutoConfirmAge and having at least as many edits as $wgAutoConfirmCount)
# can create pages:
$wgGroupPermissions['*' ]['createpage'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['user' ]['createpage'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['autoconfirmed']['createpage'] = true;

# Only users with accounts in autoconfirmed group
# (registered accounts at least as old as $wgAutoConfirmAge and having at least as many edits as $wgAutoConfirmCount)
# can upload files:
$wgGroupPermissions['*' ]['upload'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['user' ]['upload'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['autoconfirmed']['upload'] = true;
</pre>
::-[[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 10:36, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

===Broken templates===
{{tl|cal-date}} is broken, but I'm not template savvy enough to fix it. Anyone want to have a go? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 07:17, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
:Ja, I will fix it. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:15, 17 January 2013 (EST)
::$%^&* I'm getting ''closer'' to fixing it. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 15:02, 17 January 2013 (EST)
:::''*cries piteously*'' -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 15:43, 17 January 2013 (EST)
::::I've just had a go and I think that's sorted it! Not sure if there are any other broken templates lurking out there... --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:58, 20 January 2013 (EST)
===Storylink===
Are the storylinks looking odd for anyone else? They appear as full size text without the surrounding box from before for me. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 12:29, 20 January 2013 (EST)
:Yeah, storylinks, note boxes, disambig boxes, organisation templates (eg. listing comics issues) and episode/issue/etc. infoboxes are all not displaying correctly. I assume that the folks who know what they're doing with this kind of stuff are working on getting them fixed.. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 12:42, 20 January 2013 (EST)
::I think that's done it - or at least it's displaying normally for me now. Well done to all involved, much appreciated. --[[User:Emvee|Emvee]] 17:04, 22 January 2013 (EST)

== Still Confused About All This ==

I just got registered so that I can always find this site.

When I search for Transformers Wiki, all I get is Teletraan 1 and I don't like that site as well. Heck, their information on BotShots is woefully unsatisfactory.

Did this site used to be that site or the other way around? Much of the information in articles looks copied from one site or the other.

Apologies if this is the wrong place to ask these questions. I was looking for an e-mail address or something and couldn't find it. {{unsigned|Haven13}}
:No worries! We were originally at Wikia, but split with them in September 2008 and went independent. Wikia are still operating the old version, but it doesn't get updated in a lot of areas.
:Where is it you're searching for Transformers Wiki? We come up first on Google when I search on there. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:16, 23 January 2013 (EST)
::Ooh! Ooh! Let me guess! BING. (Who are blocked for '''hammering''' our wee servers.) --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 23:52, 23 January 2013 (EST)
:::Well, I just searched for "transformers wiki" on bing.com and we were the first result. Followed by the wikia site, wikipedia's main Transformers page, and wikipedia's Transformers (film) page. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 07:01, 24 January 2013 (EST)

== Key things missing from toy sections on character pages ==

There are a couple of things most toy sections don't have that would probably be useful:
* a link to the page about the toyline - some articles have it, but they don't seem to be the majority.
* for characters who've been more than one faction in fiction, knowing what faction their toy was sold as would be useful, especially if the toyline's page isn't split into Autobots and Decepticons.
Just a couple of ideas. --[[User:Flicky1991|Flicky1991]] 16:45, 2 February 2013 (EST)
:More than once I have thought a link to the toyline would be handy. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 21:31, 2 February 2013 (EST)

== New Theme ==

So, according to Hasbro, basically the entire new theme of the Transformers brand is now Beast Hunters. So why not change the wiki theme from Animated to Beast Hunters? Just a suggestion,if people don't like it, whatever. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 12:15, 10 February 2013 (EST)
:That's a good idea. Even if not Beast Hunters specifically, a Prime-related theme would make more sense than Animated now, considering it's been a couple of years. --[[User:Flicky1991|Flicky1991]] 12:43, 10 February 2013 (EST)
:Yeah, sounds awesome! I'm in favor of a TFP theme, when do we change? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:42, 4 November 2013 (EST)
::Why would we change to TFP after it just ended rather conclusively?--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 23:23, 4 November 2013 (EST)
:::Yeah, you've got a point, maybe TF4, when it comes out? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 23:27, 4 November 2013 (EST)

== Trivia/notes sections ==

While I have nothing against a "trivia" or "notes" section (we are not Wikipedia, after all), it is my opinion that such a section should really only contain general notes about the article's subject that are either really trivial, or too general to fit into any specific paragraph. In particular, a noteworthy two-line bit regarding a specific toy in an article about a character with multiple toys might better fit into the specific toy's entry. For example, if the toy had a prototype that was very different from the final toy, the toy's entry isn't very long and the info about the prototype doesn't fill the page either, it could better be added to the toy's entry (since it's actual information about the toy, and its design process), rather than treating it as marginal trivia that is ostracized from the main portion of the article. Likewise, informative notes about fictional appearances of a character and after-the-fact retcons that affect the general perception of said character are better added as notes to the specific fiction writeup, rather than shoving it into the "notes" ghetto. So simply put: Short notes that are directly related to a specific part of the article might better be placed in that very part, rather than in an inflated catch-all "notes" section. Thoughts?--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 15:45, 16 February 2013 (EST)

== Proposal to rename an article. ==

Hi, I'm proposing that the article "Brick Springhorn" be renamed to "Brick Springstern". Because of an error in the original comic, the character was given both names at various points during the story. A radio announcer called him "Springstern" and an editorial caption said he was "Springhorn". Usually, I'd agree with calling him "Springhorn". We can rationalise the mistake by saying the announcer was mistaken or drunk or something, and of course "Springhorn" is just a damn funny name. Except...

In the recent IDW reprint (which I was re-reading today), they have corrected the error, and he's now called "Springstern" throughout the comic. (Similar to how the IDW reprints corrected the Sherman Dam / Boulder Dam mistake).

Given that "Springstern" is now his name throughout the most recent printing, I'd suggest that most readers trying to look up the character will type "Springstern" into the search box. I know the redirect is in place, but I feel that maybe it should now be the other way round, with 'Horn' redirecing to a main article located at 'Stern'.

Advice and opinion welcome! --[[User:Ryan Frost|Ryan Frost]] 17:55, 14 March 2013 (EDT)
:This is terrible news, because you're probably right, and I hate it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:01, 14 March 2013 (EDT)

== Database dump ==

Hello! In my region I have a bit of an internet connection issue so I'm using WikiTaxi for offline wikia browsing. Since tfwiki is based on wikimedia system I was wondering if a database dump of current pages could possibly be generated for download? I see that it currently doesn't exist on your special: statistics page. I'd rather avoid any mirroring software as it would no doubt cause issues with the site so I hope someone can help with this.

Thank you in advance,

[[User:NocteDraconis|NocteDraconis]]
:I can't help personally, but it might be worth also posting this over in the [http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=83287 TFWiki discussion thread] on the Allspark board, it's frequented by several of the sysops/technical-know-how guys from here. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 09:05, 27 March 2013 (EDT)

:Thank you for pointing me in the right direction :)Though, I do hope someone will take notice of the question here as well. [[User:NocteDraconis|NocteDraconis]] 15:12, 27 March 2013 (EDIT)

== Proposing New Continuity Term for Multipath Books ==

Hi, I've been working on the first six Find Your Fate Junior books since I joined about a month ago, and just finished a summary for [[Dinobots Strike Back]]. While I'm still revising it, I just began editing relevant info into character pages, and starting with Starscream's, I found I needed a new term to explain how paths within the same book relate to each other without using the word "book". I didn't see anything that applies to this in the Continuities page, so I began referring to each individual book as its own "micro-continuity nexus". I think this is necessary to clarify that each book has its own tangle of paths which don't carry over to other books in the series, even though the books in that particular series are numbered by Ballantine.

For example, when moving from that first book onto Starscream's actions in [[Battle Drive]], I'd begin the first paragraph with: "In the next adjacent micro-continuity nexus, Starscream and Blitzwing were on a strafing-run to torch farmland, when..." since "later" isn't true with no possible book-to-book continuity, but I need to indicate that the summaries are moving on to the next book beyond just the storylinks in that section of the character page.

Please let me know if there's a better, established term I should be using for this phenomenon. Perhaps some term applied to video games with alternate endings? I don't know jack about TFVGs, and haven't studied those pages yet. I intend to add all relevant content from Dinobots Strike Back to the character pages soon, while it's still fresh in my mind, so please let me know if I'm at risk of muddying them up with a nonsensical term. [[User:Bumblevivisector|Bumblevivisector]] 23:49, 4 May 2013 (EDT)
: A couple years ago [[User:Hooper_X/SANDBALLS/Example_character_article/Games|I was trying to figure out how to describe video games with multiple playable characters, different endings, etc.]] and was leaning towards considering each individual path a [[splinter timeline]]. But that's just me and nobody else ever looked at what I came up with. So. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 12:51, 14 May 2013 (EDT)
::Yeah, I've gotten the impression that no one will say anything about others' sandboxes, but might once something's actually implemented and becomes a potential problem. I agree that "splinter" is as good a term as "path", and I see now that even the splinter page could use some work; seems like [[Earthforce]] should be mentioned as the first ''possible'' splinter, setting the precedent for the other Marvel examples listed, but that was likely a touchy subject for tending to veer into endless speculation.

::Your example looked like a workable outline, but I don't know enough about different TF games to visualize in detail how it'd apply. Have there been any two TF games with continuity that retroactively makes one possible outcome the "real" ending? (non-TF ex: Mortal Kombat II stating Johnny Cage beat Goro) "Nexus" just seems like the best word for a clump of splinters that all have equal weight, continuity-wise (one game, one book).[[User:Bumblevivisector|Bumblevivisector]] 19:11, 14 May 2013 (EDT)
:::How much of the [[splinter timeline]] article is from sources? Is that term actually used? If so, I think it would be best to keep with it. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 20:22, 14 May 2013 (EDT)
::::Oh, I just meant that the article looked like it could use a few more examples of splinters, assuming the word was most relevant as a descriptive fan term. If it's only documenting uses of "splinter" from official sources, then forget it. As long as no one's objecting to terms I'm using in FYF books and character page subsections, I'll just keep using them until I'm done documenting the first 6 books and worry about the wiki's broader terminology later.

::::Since they're classified as "multipath adventures", I'll usually just say "path" or "outcome" to indicate that they're all viable options with the same canonical weight, since "splinter" ''could'' imply either a timeline-shifting cataclysm, or that the splinter is inferior to a "main" timeline that far more fans are familiar with, a principle which would just inject fan-judgement into these particular books. [[User:Bumblevivisector|Bumblevivisector]] 21:16, 14 May 2013 (EDT)

== Holy grails and Want list need to be more visible. ==

Judging by just how long Jake/Stingray has been on the want list, these two things need to be more visible. Many people visiting the wiki probably don't even visit the home page let alone scroll down far enough to read those two little boxes.
Would it be possible to do something like the Go! boxes for them? [[User:RavenG|RavenG]] 02:40, 14 May 2013 (EDT)

So nobody else thinks something like this would be good?[[User:RavenG|RavenG]] 08:58, 2 June 2013 (EDT)
:I think the problem is more likely that no one has the items in question than that they need to be more visible. Most of those things are very obscure. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:37, 2 June 2013 (EDT)
:: All the more reason it should be more visible. The more people that know to look for this stuff, the more chances there are of actually finding it.[[User:RavenG|RavenG]] 01:51, 5 June 2013 (EDT)
::: It's second from the top, just below the Featured Article. It's more visible than 90% of the rest of the frontpage. And finding Holy Grails is NOT more important than showcasing our good content that we actually have. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:04, 5 June 2013 (EDT)

== Seen this? ==
[http://lmb3.net/2013/04/18/3633/ More info than you ever thought you'd need about the Ziploc TFTM iron-on promotion.] This all should be wiki'd up by someone. Possibly me. 09:51, 17 May 2013 (EDT) (look at that 100 million dollar growth in the first year - that's like ''Angry Birds'' levels of success.)

== Left-hand menu ==

FOC and Prime - the Game have been and gone by now, so we can probably take them off there. It's probably a bit early to put Transformers 4 on. Maybe we could put links to the MTMTE and RID comics? Is Transformers: Legends high-profile enough that a link on the menu would be useful? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 22:31, 21 May 2013 (EDT)
:Anyone else have an opinion? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 21:34, 27 May 2013 (EDT)
::I'd be down with MTMTE and RID on the sidebar, considering the level of popularity IDW's stuff is currently enjoying in the fandom. Legends is probably high-profile enough, but our article for it ''is'' still sporting a stub template, and I'd reckon that most people looking for information on the game will end up at the specialised Wikia rather than here. Once we get closer to 2014, I'd suggest we might subsequently want Thrilling 30 (once we have a page up) and Transformers 4 on there. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 04:54, 28 May 2013 (EDT)

== Spam filter acting up ==

Japanese Wikipedia is being blocked by our spam filter. Can it be whitelisted? [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 20:42, 3 June 2013 (EDT)
:The spam filter is blocking all external links at the moment. I've given it a poke, but because of the caching we do, it may take a few hours before it comes right. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 21:15, 3 June 2013 (EDT)

== New Category ==

Have we considered adding a category for characters that debuted in fiction before receiving a toy? As in, no toy was in production at the time they first appeared, but it was eventually made. I've noticed the number of examples growing lately, with [[Straxus (G1)|Straxus]], [[Grindcore (G1)|Grindcore]], [[Drift (G1)|Drift]], [[Nightstalker]], [[Wipe-Out]], the Female Autobots, [[Dion]], [[Hauler]], [[Devcon]]...

Can't think of a way to phrase it, though. "Fiction First characters"? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 10:31, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
:[http://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?ns14=1&search=Original&title=Special%3ASearch&fulltext=Advanced+search&fulltext=Advanced+search Precedent] suggests Cat:Fiction-original characters, with Comic-original and Cartoon-original subcategories. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 11:52, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
::But there's already a Fiction-Only characters category (with Comic- and Cartoon-only subcategories). So Fiction-original would therefore encompass Comic-original and Cartoon-original sub-categories, plus a Fiction-Only subcategory with Comic- and Cartoon-only as sub-subcategories? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 21:53, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
:::Sure. That would make, e.g., [[:Category:Comic-only characters]] a (direct) subcategory of both Cat:Fiction-only and Cat:Comic-original. (NB: There are, of course, more possibilities than comic- and cartoon-. I just picked them up as the most frequent) - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 23:00, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
::::I'm curious, would you include such characters as G1 Shockwave, G1 Reflector, and the casts of ''Animated'' and ''Prime''? Why or why not? - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 13:54, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
:::::In Shockwave and Reflector's cases, the toy was made first despite the character actually appearing first, so it's hard to judge, but I'd be inclined not to put them in the category, although I see why others would disagree. I don't know about the ''Animated'' situation, but the ''Prime'' show was made well before any toys were, so they certainly belong there. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:01, 11 June 2013 (EDT)

Yeah, I think this gets pretty hinky when you consider that to be technically correct we'd have to apply it in ''every'' instance where the fiction debuted before the toys did, regardless of whether toys were planned all along and it was just a quirk of release order.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 14:21, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
: Shouldn't it be a case of who developed it first? Dion was developed for fiction and then later turned into a toy (much later). Where a toy is designed and developed and then turns up in fiction (even if this is aired/ released before the toy is released) it was originally developed as toy. The Shockwave et al issue is easy to resolve if you forget about whether they were a transformer toy or not and focus on whether they were a toy or not. Here the character model for fiction is based on a toy, it is an artistic representation of something filtered through the necessities of the medium in which appears along with aesthetic considerations. Where a character is developped for fiction first the starting point is the characterization, personality, needs of the story etc. It is a different creative process. You have to consider if we have toy designers going for show accuracy or illustrators going for toy accuracy (or in some cases not worrying about accuracy at all). I do think the category tells us something about the creative process that has gone into each character/ toy especially where the dates on release as toy/ fiction are similar. I agree though that it could be a potential minefield and we will need source/ link information to back up which category each character would go in..... [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 14:48, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
The above is why I wanted to be clear on the wording. I'm thinking ONLY about characters who were first introduced in fiction at a time when there were no official plans to produce a toy of them...not characters whose first appearance in fiction just happened to beat their toy to release. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 15:56, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
:Because if you split hairs that fine, it becomes an increasingly meaningless distinction relative to our existing categories. A category ought to be relatively simple to apply. Ideally it should be obvious without even needing to go to the category's page to read the description.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 19:02, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
::It seems fairly simple to me - toys don't pop up out of nowhere, there are catalogue solicitations, ToyFairs, adverts and so forth that happen months before toys are/were released. To be "Fiction-original", the point would be to demonstrate that they weren't planned as a toy at any point around the release of the comic/etc (and we know it takes yoinks to develop a toy - diverging from actual original characters for the sake of examples - IDW Stealth Bomber Megatron and IDW muscle car Bumblebee were both fiction-original designs, and the not-quite-accurate toys took so long to develop and schedule that both announced after the IDW characters had *stopped* using those bodies! Whereas "Goldfire Bumblebee" may not have been officially announced before RiDW #18 came out, but is anyone in any doubt that the design was toy-first?) If in doubt, leave it out. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 15:01, 19 June 2013 (EDT)

== Gallery space ==

I know that the majority of this would already be covered on the fiction articles, and we want the wiki to have an organic and fun read to it, rather than being tables and lists, but would it be acceptable to add a gallery space for stuff like depicting the various designs and robot/alt mode pairs? For example, when reading about G1 Bumblebee in IDW having umpteen different designs, I kind of want to be able to see an exhaustive list pointing out each design and saying where it's from. Since this would be a separate namespace, it wouldn't clutter up the fiction articles, and might actually relieve some pressure to add a screenshot to the fiction articles just because it depicts a design or mode that no interesting screenshots had depicted.

This could also be expanded into interesting screenshots themselves, or for the Japanese series, animated gifs depicting named attacks. Something similar to [http://digimon.wikia.com/wiki/Gallery:Greymon this] or [http://digimon.wikia.com/wiki/Gallery:Ravemon this].

Suggestions and objections welcome, and if you guys aren't interested in this but know of a fansite that already does it, please bring it up as well, as this kind of obsessive categorizing is what I live for.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 14:55, 14 June 2013 (EDT)

== tales of the beast hunters chapter 22 sharkticon megatron ==

chapter 21 vertebreak

Chapter 22 (Sharkticon Megatron)

chapter 23 night shadow bumblebee

someone add this to tales of the beast hunters thanks {{unsigned|Jazz-meister}}
:This is copyvio, right? Don't we need to delete this?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 20:04, 14 June 2013 (EDT)
::It's not really a good place for it, no... --[[User:Abates|abates]] 21:18, 14 June 2013 (EDT)

== Romanizations of purely Japanese names ==

It has come to my attention that the way this Wiki romanizes Transformer names that are purely Japanese in origin (such as for [[Shouki|Shōki]], each member of the [[Dinoforce]], the recent [[Gan'ō]], etc.) feels a bit at odds with how we also handle official name spellings. Generally speaking, we tend to go with the names that are official, and seem to only really diverge from this if there's something inherently wrong with the official spellings, right? Well, for the aforementioned examples, each of them has an official spelling of their names written in English, yet this Wiki seems to forgo those official spellings for some reason and instead opts for a different spelling of each. My question is, if we have an official spelling of a purely Japanese name, and there seems to be little-to-nothing wrong with said official spelling, then why don't we always use it?, For Shōki, for instance, we've gone with spelling his name as such despite official packaging material with his toy spelling his name as "Shouki" in English. Similar cases also apply for the Dinoforce members and Gan'ō, as well. The only exception to this I can think of that we do use is "Ginrai", whose name would be more straightforwardly Romanized as "Jinrai", but we went with "Ginrai" due to official sources spelling his name with a G. So what makes Ginrai special enough for him to use the official spelling over the straight Romanization spelling?<br>
Now, I'm not suggesting that we switch every single romanized purely Japanese name out of the Hepburn style that we use. On the contrary, I think we should at least continue to utilize the current Hepburn style for names that have no official spelling in English whatsoever, or at least for those who haven't had theirs revealed yet. But for those who have (Shouki, the Dinoforce, Ganoh, etc.), I ponder as to why we don't just use what is official if what's official is indeed a decently acceptable alternative to what ths Wiki uses. I mean, there is precedence in us using the official spellings since we use "Ginrai" over "Jinrai". Why, we even use "Dinoforce" when the box and fiction both clearly say "Kyoryu Sentai" (Dinosaur Squadron/Taskforce) in Japanese. So what's been stopping us from using the official names for the non-Ginrai Japanese word TF names? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 01:08, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
:Part of the problem I feel here is evokes the "Spell My Name With An S" trope, and part trying to keep the spirit of the name's original meaning. For example, "Dinoforce" from "Kyoryu Sentai" feels more... real in English, I suppose, as contrast to someone actually writing out "Dinosaur Squadron/Taskforce". "Dinoforce" has that sense of quirkiness but it still carries the meaning without loosing too much. Sometimes, the official spelling that Takara uses just seems odd ([[Mirage (G1)|Ligier]]/[[Engrish#Deliberate Engrish|Rijie]] or [[Rartorata]], anyone?), and other times the name only makes sense if you have a passable grasp of the language. <sub>(The arguments I could bring up from subbing toku. Then of course, someone else could argue about "sentai" that used in the Super Sentai series...)</sub> --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] 01:52, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
::I'm fine with us using "Dinoforce". I was just pointing it out as an example of us using an official spelling over a more literal one. Same with "Ginrai" vs. "Jinrai". But, what I'm really getting at is why we use spellings like "Shōki", "Gōryū", "Gan'ō", etc. when there are official TakaraTomy spellings of these as "[http://tftechspecs.com/pics2/12668.jpg Shouki]", "[http://tftechspecs.com/pics2/12710.jpg Goryu]", [https://twitter.com/tagoal/status/345702332438302720/photo/1 Ganoh]", etc. that feel just as valid as alternatives to what we currently use. (Not to mention easier to type.) This inquiry mostly stems from the discussion on [[Talk:Gan'ō|Gan'ō's talk page]], and raises the question as to why we don't use the official spellings in cases like these when there doesn't seem to be that much, if anything at all, inherently wrong with those spellings. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 09:53, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
:::Look, there's pretty much one reason we do it this way - Interrobang's unconquerable boner for the Japanese language. He pushed for it, and the reason it wound up happening is the same reason that right now nobody is taking on this argument against it. Because '''''nobody caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaares.''''' And nobody wants to have to go through changing everything again. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 15:12, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
::::In other words, "Sabrblade, have at it." - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 17:27, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
:::::Basically. I should point out I pretty much NEVER see Japanese use of English letters actually involving macrons and blardeeblar. And if we can get rid of a lot of that shit on the wiki, I'll be... well, I dunno about ''happy'', but less aggravated. I am 100% in favor of using the given romanization when it's obviously not incorrect. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 13:49, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
::At least going forward, I personally support the "use the romanization given" initiative, unless it gets as bad as Minelba.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:13, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
::::I'm all for consistency with the Japanese packaging when it's basically the same pronunciation. -[[User:LV|LV]] 18:51, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
Very well, then. Interrobang, huh? Figures. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:25, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
:Erg, just hit a speedbump. Tried to move Shōki's page to "Shouki", but it won't let me. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 11:17, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
::It's because there's already a page, redirecting to Shōki. An admin will have to delete the Shouki page. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 11:47, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
Can an admin delete the Dinoforce redirects? All of them have history, so I can't move them over. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 10:51, 20 June 2013 (EDT)
:There's still [[Būpink]], [[Pīpō]], and [[Kōmoribreast]], but I can't find any official romanizations, so I guess they stay where they are? [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 13:22, 20 June 2013 (EDT)
::Yeah, I'd say we can stick with the Hepburn style Romanizations for names/terms that haven't official been spelled in English yet (or unless there is something genuinely and inherently wrong with its English spelling).
::Also, thanks a bunch for helping out with this. I started to, but I got stuck when the redirects needed to be deleted first, and then came the TF: The Ride grand opening in Orlando that I was in attendance of, which took a lot of my time away from the Internet. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 20:29, 21 June 2013 (EDT)
:::No problem. Happy to help. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 22:31, 21 June 2013 (EDT)
Should real people be included in this? According to the talk page, [[Yūki Ōshima]] is generally credited as Yuki Ohshima. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 06:29, 25 June 2013 (EDT)
:I should think so. I know he's not relevant to our wiki, but [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasuhiro_Nightow Yasuhiro Nightow] is pretty specific about his name's Romanization, and I'd think there would be other people who had put thought into it. -[[User:LV|LV]] 09:28, 25 June 2013 (EDT)
::I'd say that, if there are real Japanese people who have their names spelled a particular way officially (in English letters), then by all means, let us reflect that. If they don't, however, we can just keep them in the Hepburn style. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 12:49, 25 June 2013 (EDT)
:The [[Yuki Ohshima]] page already exists... can someone remove it, please? --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:41, 28 June 2013 (EDT)
::[[Yuki Ohshima]] is still there. Also, [[Shaoshao Li (KP)|Shaoshao Li]] is officially spelt "Syaosyao Li", so we should probably treat her the way we treat the Japanese ones to be consistent. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 05:59, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
:::Deleted! There's a {{tl|tobedeleted}} template you can put on pages, BTW. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 07:11, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
::::Thanks, I didn't know! --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 07:37, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
:::::No problem. I think there should probably be some debate before moving Shaoshao as I get the impression from the talk page that it's another Minelba type situation possibly? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:26, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
::::::It is, and the page went through a LOT of romanization revisions before we settled on where it is now. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 17:04, 1 August 2013 (EDT)

== DuckDuckGo ==

Could whoever-has-FTP-access unblock [https://duckduckgo.com/duckduckbot DuckDuckBot] in http://tfwiki.net/robots.txt, please. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 13:59, 22 June 2013 (EDT)

== Robot ==

I was quite surprised to see we don't have an article about robots in general! There are robots other than Cybertronians in ''Transformers'', both man-made and natural lifeforms. We probably should have an article summing up the different types - after all, we do have an article on [[alien]]s. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:42, 28 June 2013 (EDT)

== Archives ==

Do we have a way of searching the archives, other than just manually opening them and looking through each and every one? --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 14:53, 2 July 2013 (EDT)
:You can restrict a search to the "Transformers Wiki talk" namespace, which usually works for me. At one point we had a form to do it at the top of this page. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:54, 2 July 2013 (EDT)

== Disambiguation pages and parsing ==

If the names on a disambiguation page differ in parsing, should the page name follow the initial use or the most common use? See [[Heavytread (disambiguation)]] and [[Knockout (disambiguation)]] for examples. The first case is at the most common form while the second is at the first used form. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 11:54, 3 July 2013 (EDT)
:There is [[Help:Disambiguation#Disambiguation pages|no policy]] that I can find. I would say it makes little difference, unless one of the forms was well recognized and the other was super obscure. Otherwise it is six of one, half dozen of the other. Not worth moving pages over. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 19:41, 3 July 2013 (EDT)
::I would agree it doesn't make much difference. Most of the time people are going to arrive there via redirection from a link whose text has the parsing that they're looking for. Only we Wiki editors are likely to go straight to a disambig and we already know what the other parsings are. I don't think the parsing is going to hinder anyone in trying to find the page. --[[User:Tigerpaw28|Tigerpaw28]] 21:00, 3 July 2013 (EDT)

== Wiki content used in official materials, again. ==
So ''Transformers Legends'' just put out a Doctor Arkeville card, and the character bio is a truncated version of the Wiki introduction. "DR. ARKEVILLE is a self-proclaimed evil genius who often allies himself with the DECEPTICONS. Like all mad scientists, he has designs to rule the planet Earth.... however, his success rate is sorely lacking." It doesn't MATTER or anything, but it seemed strangely familiar. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 09:13, 9 July 2013 (EDT)
:Derik checked a while back and found a whole ton of the Legends bios were copied from here.[http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=83287&view=findpost&p=2310050] I think the conclusion was we weren't going to worry about it too much. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 19:18, 9 July 2013 (EDT)

== Sizes ==

I brought this up on the [[Talk:Scale|scale talk page]] but got no response. Basically, for a wiki that tries to include as much as possible, tfwiki doesn't really address the sizes of the toys. For someone who's never actually bought any toys, terms like "Deluxe" and "Mega", or "Small Headmaster" and "Large Headmaster", or "Autobot Car" and "Mini Vehicle", aren't useful for telling how tall the toys actually are. Pretty much the only place this is addressed is the pages for the original Fort Max and the new Metroplex, which actually have numbers (22" and 24"), and seem to be the only place on the wiki where this is addressed, despite articles on both [[Scale]] and [[Size class]]. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 11:00, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
:I don't think an "average size" has ever been calculated for a deluxe. Look at the current Beast Hunters line, Starscream is quite a bit smaller than Ripclaw. As far as I know, size classes aren't really about the size of the toy but of the ''packaging''. Any deluxe figures should fit in the same shelf/peg space as any other. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 11:22, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
::That way lies madness. There's been enough fandom beardwringing about "shrinking/growing deluxes" for a lifetime. Let's not fall into that trap. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:40, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
::Khajidha, that's the sort of thing I'm talking about. Nothing on the wiki actually indicates how tall any of these toys are. You mention ''Beast Hunters'' Starscream, but all it says on his page is that that toy is "shorter than his First Edition toy". As far as I'm concerned, he could be anything from a couple of inches to over a foot! Everything just seems to be described in terms of other toys - as another example, the original Omnibots are only described as being "shorter than Autobot Cars". I'm not asking for a true average size - just enough to have some point of reference. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:25, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I think actual measuements would be useful. You would need to standardise what you measure (i.e. from the feet to the top of the head or to the highest point on the toy - not always the same, and determine whether this included any removable weapons/ accesories). We should probably limit the amount of info to stop it turning into an unnecessarily long list (you don't need height to head, shoulders and cannon where these are progressively taller for example). I'd also like to see both metric and imperial measurements, it's odd that the only system we seem to have is in imperial when metric would make more sense to me, I suppose both is better than choosing one or the other. It's a mammoth task though and I'm not sure it could ever be completed. If we start we will have to live with a degree on inconsistency. [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 13:54, 17 July 2013 (EDT)
:So, what if you can stretch their arms up in the air, or they can hold accessories in an unmarked position (maybe on their back?)
:Eh...I think it would be, at best, reasonable to measure them with no accessories in the pose depicted in the instructions.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:15, 17 July 2013 (EDT)
:: Ok, I've added height info for [[Prowl (G1)/toys| Prowl]]. I'm not going to add any more yet until I get some feedback on whether the format I've used is acceptable. What do you guys think? [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 09:30, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I think that if this is to go forward, that the length of the altmode is of more interest than its height in most cases. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:43, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
Figuring out the format should be done on a delete-able "sandbox" page rather than on a "live" one. And honestly, I'm still unsold on the usefulness of the info. But I'll humor for now...<br>
:* ''Dimensions'': ??in / ??cm (robot height), ??in / ??cm (vehicle length)<br>
This does bring up the question of how many dimensions to measure, and how to non-clunkily add it. It kind of feels like if you're going to actually put a numbered measurement down, just picking ONE dimension is insufficient... or to put it another way, you halfassed the job. Go full height/width/depth or go home. Toys with multiple altmodes present bigger problems of readability; the more numbers, the more boring a morass the entry becomes. (THIS kind of thing is why you sandbox format changes rather than put them on live pages.) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:57, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
:Ok but halfassed is a bit harsh, three quartersassed perhaps... I'm not sure about sandboxing so for Prowl
''Dimensions'': 10.5 cm/ 4⅛ in (robot height), 11.3cm/ 4⅜ in (vehicle length)
As for the reason to do it we can't assume everyone visiting the Wiki is a Transformers expert, you or I might understand 'about the same size as the 1984 Autobot Cars' but not every visitor will. The casual fan or even parent looking for information regarding what present to buy a child might really appreciate this. You also have to consider that the secondary market is now huge and this info isn't always present, you would expect this wiki to be able to fill in that gap. As a public service information provider we have to consider that not everyone has our background knowledge and be just as informative to the novice as we are to the expert, otherwise we are in danger of becoming a jargonistic clique who only provide for ourselves. In the same way I think we should also add difficulty rating as stated on the box (where present). If you consider the potential audience in its entirity I think the case for size information is obvious. [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 08:30, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::In that case, why not just do weight? It's not going to be changed by altmode, it's easy to measure, and you'd have a reasonable idea of scale from the weight; besides, the precision of exact size isn't really going to matter unless you're putting it in a display case, and in that case you're almost certainly a collector who understands size classes. Casual fans or parents just looking for a toy to play with aren't going to need precise measurements of size.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 08:44, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
:::Weight would vary too much due to the density of the materials. A mostly diecast figure may have the same mass as a MUCH larger modern figure with the thin plastic panels they use now. Robot height and altmode length are probably the most relevant measures for most figures. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:30, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::::Yeah, weight is definitely not a thing we need to measure. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:54, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::Any non-TF-fan parent looking to our wiki for toy purchasing information is already well and truly fucked. We really ''aren't'' a good resource for casual kid-toy purchase information for non-fans at all... I mean, just look at Movie Bumblebee's toy page. What parent is gonna wanna dig through all that to find their kid's birthday toy? (Never mind that the toy information is one of the ''last'' things we present; we handle their fiction first.) That demographic is gonna go to TRU's website and see what's available now, assuming they web-shop that way at all. And as pointed out, they most certainly aren't going to need precise measurements.
:: For "casual" fans, I think they have enough prior experience with toys to know the rough sizes most TFs fall under per given class (standard largish action figure range is the most common). For the more advanced fan who might conceivably need dimensions... then yes, width and depth are as relevant as height, if not moreso. Height doesn't play into stuffing robot-mode guys onto a display shelf anywhere as much as how much horizontal space a toy takes up... and frankly numbers are nothing next to just plain old physical trial-and-error on that score.
::As for difficulty ratings... that's a whole other can of worms. Hasbro's own ratings are horsehockey; they rated conversions mostly by size-class, not actual difficulty. At this point, that's basically giving out ''mis''information. And giving subjective difficulty ratings... less than ideal. Some people ''don't'' find RiD Side Burn or the Alternators unfun morasses of panel-massaging.
::And as for "jargonistic clique who only provide for ourselves"... you do know what site you're on, don't you? This is akin to accusing TVtropes of not being a good resource for people who want to get into a TV show they've not seen but have heard about. We are, ultimately, not a resource for people who kinda sorta maybe think Transformers are okay, but for people keen on digging into the guts of the franchise, the nitty-gritty, the obscure, the corners not often seen. We are very much a metaphorical rabbit hole; by design and intent we run far deeper than anyone on the outside would need. And yes, sometimes we DON'T provide info by choice... like the exact box-back bios and tech-spec numbers, but we DO provide links to places that you can get those if you really want them. The latter we don't provide because we could find no non-clunky-and-horrible way to present said info, which is very much a problem with measurements... which brings us back to the start. We'd pretty much have to provide ''all'' relevant dimensions to be of actual use to the people who'd conceivably need that kind of information, and presenting that in a way that's not clunky is a major issue. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:54, 24 July 2013 (EDT)

== Foreign Localization placement - again!!! ==

Said it on the page for the 1984 cartoon, will say it again here: the Foreign Localization section for cartoon episodes needs to go at the very bottom. It makes no sense to go from factoids (notes, etc.) to a list of names, then back to factoids (Trivia). Disrupts the flow of the page, buries the trivia, looks bad. -- [[User:Repowers|Repowers]] 17:51, 16 July 2013 (EDT)
:I've had this thought a couple of times. It seems like it would be more naturally placed below Trivia with the home video releases. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:41, 21 July 2013 (EDT)

== Some Transformer Knock-off cartoon ==

We have some Transformer-Knock-off cartoon made by china ( Not a big deal huh how about they use that cartoon charracter toy make them loke idiot cut and turn it into "Transformer Gobot Toyline )
Here the Final Episode
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI5fXIJY5_U

To Story:

Some stupid kid play games about Transoformer and get sucked into the game world who Transoformer get seperate into 2 side Animal ( Deceticon ) and Vehicle ( Autobot )

Vehicle: With 6 Clan Car,Police Car,Hellicopter,Bulldozer,Jeep ( They are Extinct only the stongest guy alive ),Jet and one extra Bike ( Only One ) ( Clan i mean they Fucking look like the Same Fucking Guy only the Officer on specific clan have different Color that mean they use the Same Fucking Model to make Hundred Guy )

Animal: Only 3 : Jaguar,Gorilla ( Only the leader the infanry are Rat but they look like the mech from Battle Tech Series ) and Dragon

== Korean, not Indonesian ==

The Indonesian foreign names of many of the Transformers are written in Korean. Why? They use a completely different script. I can't distinguish whether someone just phoneticized Indonesian names and have written them in Korean, or if they're Korean names and someone just mislabeled them as Indonesian. (I think I see examples of both, although I only have a passing familiarity with Indonesian so I'm not sure.) --[[User:Noviere|Noviere]] 14:23, 18 July 2013 (EDT)
:The one that you changed was added by Andreanromanky18, I guess we should review all of the others that he/she has added. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:43, 18 July 2013 (EDT)
::[http://id.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grimlock Indonesia Wikipedia] shows most of the characters have the same name as they do in English. [http://ko.wikipedia.org/wiki/%ED%8A%B8%EB%9E%9C%EC%8A%A4%ED%8F%AC%EB%A8%B8_%EB%8D%94_%EB%AC%B4%EB%B9%84 Korean Wikipedia] had Grimlock's name written differently. Hrm. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:36, 18 July 2013 (EDT)

== Grouping American/Japanese divergent fiction ==

I'm trying to standardize the G1 cartoon fiction sections, particularly when characters have both American and Japanese histories. For larger characters like [[Kup (G1)#Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Kup]] we have a big "''Generation 1 cartoon continuity''" masthead, with "''The Transformers cartoon''" underneath, some micro-continuities, and "''Japanese cartoon continuity''", which has its own sub-sections. On the other hand, we've got [[Hound (G1)|Hound]] with a "G1cc" heading, and all the Japanese sections as equal to "''The Transformers cartoon''" instead of under a "Jcc" header. I think Hound should have (1st tier) "G1cc", (2nd) "''The Transformers cartoon''" & "Jcc", (3rd) the various Japanese fictions.

There's also some discrepancies between characters that only appeared after [[The Return of Optimus Prime, Part 2|TROOP]], where American and Japanese continuity completely diverged. [[Pointblank]] has a "G1cc" header that includes "''The Transformers cartoon''" and "''The Headmasters cartoon''". [[Chromedome (G1)|Chromedome]], however, has "''The Transformers cartoon''" (and Wings as a sub-section) completely separated from the "''Japanese cartoon continuity''". I think a "G1cc" is preferable, since the stories flowing forward from ''The Rebirth'' or ''Transformers: The Headmasters'' do share the same underlying backstory.

Finally, there are characters that have only appeared in Japanese and American cartoon micro-continuities. [[Roadblock (G2)|Roadblock]] has appeared in America's Wingsverse and Japan's ''United EX'' fiction. Both of these continuities come from the original cartoon, as "add-ons", but there's nothing to indicate that in the way they're grouped under his fiction section. I think characters like Roadblock, Rapido, etc. should have their Wings/United EX sections grouped together, with a note of some kind explaining the connection.

Anyway, I wanted to bring this up here before I started sweeping through the G1 sections. Preferences one way or another? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 08:56, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
:I don't think character pages should concern themselves with continuity beyond the characters themselves. ''Headmasters'' Chromedome has absolutely no connection to Rebirth Chromedome in any way and putting them under the same section is deceptive. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 22:15, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::The problem with that is that a casual reader of the page may not know the connection between the US and Japan cartoons. Whichever way it's written, it will be clear that Chromedome was introduced separately in both the US and Japanese cartoons - however, grouping the two together would signify that, despite the difference in the portrayal of the character, these are two similar universes, as opposed to the fairly different Marvel universe or the radically different IDW universe. I don't like it when the wiki assumes too much prior knowledge on the part of the reader - just because ''we'' know the story behind the Rebirth/Headmasters timeline split, someone who only knows Chromedome from the IDW comics may not be as aware, and wiki articles should above all aim to be informative. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 03:26, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I don't see why that's the responsibility of character pages or how that would enlighten them instead of making them think there's a linear chronology for the character when there isn't one. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 11:00, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
::::The point I'm trying to make is that, assuming the article is written clearly, there would be no confusion as to whether there is a linear chronology, as the sections would be labelled "US continuity" and "Japanese continuity" or something similar - so as long as we've made that clear, we might as well point out that these two separate timelines were once the same timeline, but branched off before this character was introduced, so as not to give the impression of a completely separate "Japanese cartoon continuity" that is unrelated to the US one, unlike the actual situation which has a split timeline. Looking at Chromedome's page, both the Rebirth section and the Headmasters section mention Galvatron, but the page as written gives no indication that both "versions" of Galvatron, unlike the two Chromedomes, experienced exactly the same events for a while before Chromedome appeared - if Chromedome's page was the first page I ever read on the wiki, I would conclude that the Headmasters series was as unrelated to the US series as it is to the IDW comics. Grouping the two together would prevent any such misunderstandings without going into too much detail, and the reader could then consult the page about the Headmasters series if they want a full explanation. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 11:19, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::That was my concern. There could even be an opening note on the subject, like:
:::::{{note|The underlying history for American and Japanese G1 cartoon continuity is the first 95 episodes of the Sunbow cartoon, before splitting in two directions. Chromedome first appeared in the cartoon continuity after the split occurred, with two distinct histories.}}
:::::--[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 11:53, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
::::::The Marvel comic sections are already drowned in obnoxious continuity notes. Do we really need to do the same to the cartoon sections? [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 15:52, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::::I'm confused -- how are you making "being informed" sound like a negative? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 17:56, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::::I'd rather have "obnoxious" continuity notes than a confusing article. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 17:17, 25 July 2013 (EDT)

== New templates ==

[[Template:Nihongo]], same one as used on wikipedia.

Also, I had a suggestion for a [[Template:L]] (I forgot to get approval the first time) that would simplify the coding for any article with a parser from <nowiki>[[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus]]</nowiki> to <nowiki>{{l|Optimus Prime|WFC|Optimus}}</nowiki>, and <nowiki>[[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]</nowiki> to <nowiki>{{l|Optimus Prime|WFC}}</nowiki>.

Thoughts?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 11:51, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:I really don't see the need for a link template like that. It increases the learning curve to edit the wiki in exchange for a only a slight saving of characters. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 13:37, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:No. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 14:07, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
::Like Khajidha said, it's a solution that solves nothing in particular. Not everything needs to be relegated to templates. (I'm looking right at that awful Comicstory template.) [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 15:49, 25 July 2013 (EDT)

:Regarding the Nihongo template, I wonder if there's somewhere more useful we can point the question mark thingy at the end rather than a Wikipedia page with general Japanese info and WP-specific stuff for dealing with Japanese, though I'm not sure if we have a relevant help page (perhaps this is a sign we need one). --[[User:Abates|abates]] 19:03, 30 July 2013 (EDT)

== trying to find a template ==

I believe the subarticle [[2006/toys]], and the like, used to have a template pointing back to the year at the top of the article, but I can't seem to find that template. Does anyone know what it should be? Also, should these subarticles have a category? Thanks. --[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] 10:23, 15 August 2013 (EDT)
:I don't think "2006/toys" is meant to be viewed on its own. It exists for some organizational reason or another. Its content is automatically put on the [[2006]] page. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 19:05, 16 August 2013 (EDT)
::They can come up when you use the random page function though, like the suite pages do. As for the uplink, that wasn't a template, it was a [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Subpages subpages setting]. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:46, 21 August 2013 (EDT)

=="Thin gray line" template for splitting sub-sections visually==
Okay, this kinda hit me while working on [[Glit (KP)|Glit]]'s page... look at that fiction section. How can you tell where one one continuity ends and another begins at a glance? It's kind of a mess. The size differences between the subheader text is almost negligible. And Glit isn't even the most complex fiction section we got. The more subheadings we add to a section, and the loner those entries get, the worse it gets.<br>
Testing things out, I tried the "<nowiki>----</nowiki>" template, which puts a thin dividing line across the page. It works well as a visual separation, but the line itself is too dark. Can we either change the template so the line is, say, %50 gray (making it subtle but still noticeable and not confusing with the main subheader line breaks), or make a new template that does this function? This would be put between major subheadings; in this case, over the "IDW" and "Classics" headers. This might also be nice for Toy sections. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 03:14, 28 August 2013 (EDT)
:I suggested that like three or four years ago and got yelled at by everybody. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 04:17, 28 August 2013 (EDT)
::I would support it.
::I think it'd be a bit of a mess for characters around, say the marvel G1 stuff with its multiple branches... but definately worth it in the end. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 16:17, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::I can dig it. Honestly, I've used solid black lines to divide continuity clusters in a few huge articles myself already. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 16:35, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::Well, I don't think we'd put the line between the Marvel G1 sub-sections since they're all part of the same "branch". But between Marvel and IDW? Oh yeah. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:44, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::I raise the idea of solid black lines between Mrvel and IDW and gray lines between branches.
::::Does McFeely have an example of an article with a solid black line? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 17:11, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::::The trouble there is "solid black" already denotes the spit between MAJOR headers, like "Fiction" and "Toys". Gray is a "soft separator"; a visible marking, but not as STOP WE ARE MOVING TO AN ENTIRELY NEW SUBJECT as solid black. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 17:24, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::Yeah, that's an accurate assessment. Re Derik's question, I know it I did it on [[Matrix of Leadership]] and [[Transwarp]], I might've done it on some others but I honestly forget at this point. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 17:52, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::::::To follow up, I don't think we need a soft-line break between EVERY sub-header. I think that under, say, the Marvel G1 continuity clump, a header is enough to denote "here's where continuity may jump/branch so just a heads-up". The line better notes an out-and-out break where what came before had no ties to what comes after... jsut with the gray, we're still staying in the same ballpark of "Fiction" (or possibly even "Toys"). --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 18:51, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::::We'd use a different visual obviously...
::::::::I'm going to dinner but I'll do some mockups later so you call can go "Hell no, I hate that, are you crazy?!" and we'll get a better idea of what we ''don't'' want, and can maybe figure out something useful. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 19:28, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::::(Unrelated: I think I know what cluster Bot-Shots goes in.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 19:28, 12 October 2013 (EDT)

== Disambiguation suffixes ==

I would like to propose two modifications of our disambiguation style, both of which merely codify principles that we already seem to follow. First, I propose that franchise of origin disambiguation suffixes be limited specifically to characters, not places or things. Second, I propose that characters from external properties should never be given Transformers franchise disambiguations, but should always use tags appropriate to the external property. The first rule underlies the logic behind the recent move of [[Tyrest (Autobot)]] to [[Tyrest (G1)]] despite the presence of [[Tyrest (polity)]], which also originated in G1. The second is why [[Roadblock (G1)]] can be at that location despite the existence of [[Roadblock (G.I. Joe)]], whose first TF appearance was during G1. As these examples demonstrate, we are already actually doing this, we just don’t explain it very well. If there are no objections, I intend to clarify [[Help:Disambiguation]] with notes about these principles. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 09:42, 2 September 2013 (EDT)
:We don't strictly follow that first rule - see the various "Great War" pages, for example. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:26, 2 September 2013 (EDT)
::Plus there's [[Ark (G1)]], [[Ark (Movie)]], etc. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:22, 3 September 2013 (EDT)

:The one that always gets me is "(TF 2010)". [[Lugnut (TF 2010)]] is treated as G1, most of the others (e.g., [[Override (TF 2010)]], [[Terradive (TF 2010)]], [[Highbrow (TF 2010)]]) are treated as movieverse (oh, and the Mini-Cons just say "who knows"). The word is DISambiguation, people - G1 characters and movieverse characters should not share a disambig tag. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 23:48, 2 September 2013 (EDT)
::The (TF 2010) toys are disambiged by franchise. That toyline contained toys representing characters from more than one continuity. Lugnut was part of that line's Reveal the Shield subline imprint, which is when the line switched from a mostly Movieverse toyline to a mostly G1-based/Classics-style toyline. The end result of the characters you mentioned all sharing the same disambig despite being in separate continuities is due to the unfortunate nature of that franchise spanning more than one continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:19, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::I know all that and don't really care, because the end result is a broken disambig model that only works for rules lawyers. [Note that (Timelines) as a disambig is avoided '''for this very reason'''.] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 01:19, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::I love it when people tell me they don't care how the wiki chooses to disambiguate things. It makes me super want to talk with them further about these issues. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:23, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::You never talk ''with'' people on the public internet anyway. You talk ''at'' them.
:::::As for the subject... disambiguating by franchise may be a great plan (mileages may vary - I think it works only in the simplest cases), but it completely breaks in contact with a multi-continuity franchise. [And is more than a bit wibbly in the case of stuff like toys designed to match pre-existing High Moon WfC/FoC designs being listed only as "repurposes" in those articles because of ''later'' material.] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 02:30, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::Ultimately I don't think TF2010 is big enough of a franchise for it to be bothered breaking into tiny pieces. It's got eight new characters in it. It's not like Timelines, which spans years and years and multiple continuities. It's not a Big Deal enough to make a mess within the existing rules. It's nowhere near a quagmire. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:45, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::Also also, the reason Timelines is better split up is because due to its nature of also containing Shattered Glass and fifteen different permutations of many popular character names, disambiguating within it is pretty pointless anyway. Starscream (Timelines) would refer to which guy, exactly? The MW clone? The TransTech guy? The Shattered Glass version? Timelines breaks itself within our established rules. TF2010 absolutely does not, no matter how much you individually think having G1 and Movie guys in the same disambig is wrong. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:53, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::How is a disambig tag in any way related to how toys are listed on pages? I mean, unless you are legitimately suggesting that instead of disambiguating by franchise, we put all Thundercrackers ever on the same page, I cannot understand the connection here. -[[User:LV|LV]] 02:50, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::::It isn't, really, I jumped a track there [posting while insomniac and cranky is never advisable]. It just offends my sense of chronology to see the guy ''the design originated for'' listed as a "repurpose" rather than just listing the thing on both pages equally. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 03:07, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::::Which... we DO. List on both pages. See: lots of Shattered Glass character pages. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 03:10, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::::::It's listed, but [[Thundercracker_(WFC)#Generations|with a particularly silly note]] given that WfC Thundercracker is the original design. There's a difference between Shattered Glass using a toy that existed years before SG did as an entirely different character (e.g., SG Ravage from Glit), which is repurposing, and listing the ''original'' as a "repurpose". - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 03:44, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::::::Yeah, that happens not infrequently, like with Megabolt Megatron. It doesn't bother me. This wiki reports what actually happens, not what we wish would happen. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 04:11, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
Hmm. Seems I overlooked a few things about franchise identifications on non-character articles. It still seems that characters take priority over non-characters (per the Tyrest example I gave), but it isn't quite as strict a rule as I thought. Is there any dispute over the external properties point? --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:41, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
: I don't think so. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:08, 3 September 2013 (EDT)

Added an external properties note to [[Help:Disambiguation]]. Feel free to modify it if it seems warranted. Also, do we want to go at least as far as saying that if a character and a non-character from the same franchise need disambiguating that the character can retain the franchise parenthetical while the non-character gets something different? Basically saying that the characters get dibs on franchise tags. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:50, 7 September 2013 (EDT)

== Stub Templates ==

Okay, so at this point I think I should change my username to "Stubtemplatesix"...so before I go looking through the stub category, are there any other stub templates that people want made? -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 16:21, 11 October 2013 (EDT)

==From the Marvel Comics portion of the Generation 1 continuity family==
So I've been doing a bit of work with the Comic-only characters lately and I've noticed that while we have "from the Hearts of Steel portion of the G1 continuity family" and "from the IDW portion of the G1 continuity family" at the top of various characters' pages, all of the "from the Marvel Comics portion"s seem to have disappeared. Was there a purge of these? Do we not do them any more? Is there a good reason why not? Cheers --[[User:Emvee|Emvee]] 11:15, 28 October 2013 (EDT)
:There are some "from the Marvel portion..."s. I suspect it's more a case of "they were never added" than "they were removed". - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 13:01, 28 October 2013 (EDT)
::Okay, just making sure I'm not stepping on any toes if I start adding them --[[User:Emvee|Emvee]] 13:47, 28 October 2013 (EDT)
:::Well, I added a lot of the "IDW portion"s myself, so...
:::One thing - "portion" should be included in the link (<nowiki>[[Marvel Comics continuity|Marvel portion]] or [[Marvel Comics continuity|Marvel Comics portion]]</nowiki>) to distinguish from links to <nowiki>[[Marvel Comics]]</nowiki>. [I tend to prefer the former, since RG1, Classics and Fleetway are MCC splinters without being published by Marvel Comics.] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 16:35, 28 October 2013 (EDT)

== The AllSpark and the Allspark ==

At the end of the Predacons Rising movie, after Optimus tells the others of how he had to put the energy of the [[AllSpark]] into the Matrix of Leadership, thus rendering his spark incapable of separating from the multitude of others, Ratchet asks him "Are you telling us... that you are now... one with the AllSpark?!" Smokescreen answers with "That's what you say when someone kicks the..." and all proceeding dialogue and action pertain to that meaning that Optimus is on his way to die and go into the afterlife. BUT, up until now, all instances of the term "AllSpark" have been used to refer to the life-granting thing on the physical plane of reality, while the afterlife has been referred to (by us fans) as the "[[Allspark|All'''''s'''''park]]" (lowercase S), as a means to differentiate the two (since the afterlife dimension first introduced in Beast Machines and the life-granting cube first seen in the movies were hardly the same thing at the time). Like, a TF who's dead is one who is "one with the Allspark."<br>
But now, with the use of the phrase "[being] one with the AllSpark" in this scene, it seems to strongly suggest that the term related to source of Cybertronian life and the term related to the Cybertronian afterlife are now considered to be one concept containing all of the aspects of Cybertronian life, birth, death, and afterlife. And if such is now the case, does this call for a massive re-merging of the two separate articles with some McFeely-levels of rewriting? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:45, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:I'll just say I happen to be working on something already that pertains to this. But that that also seems like an overly specific reading of the dialogue on your part when it could just as easily mean the same thing it's always meant up until now (that the energy-AllSpark of ''Prime'' is, like all other AllSparks, merely a means of accessing the afterlife, rather than some physical manifestation of the afterlife in the material plane, and that Prime merely "became one" with it in an overly literal way that is not the norm that happened to poetically mirror the normal meaning of the expression), and that such a vague foundation is not one to justify a merging of the articles on. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 06:06, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
::Well, how many times has the phrase "[being] one with the Allspark" been used to refer to the Uppercase S life-giving concept of the physical plane instead of the lowercase S afterlife concept that it originally referred to? I highly (and sadly) doubt the folks at Hasbro bother to think of the two terms as referring to separate things like we fans do. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 11:25, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:::I've never made the distinction as it has always been obvious to me that Hasbro didn't. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 12:23, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
::::It's a vague distinction anyway. It's basically the same as all those times in the G1 cartoon that characters professed to be "joining the Matrix" or "entering the Matrix", or the time Rampage told Silverbolt it was "time to go back to the Matrix" at a time when the writers envisioned the Matrix as a protoform production facility. Characters in-universe talk a fair bit about returning to or becoming one with the object that spawned them; ''Beast Machines'' and subsequent work built on what that show did just lets us know there's more to it than that, without invalidating that sentiment either. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 12:29, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:I had to reread this several times to even understand what your concern was. Suffice it to say that I don't view this dialogue as changing anything we knew about either concept. -[[User:LV|LV]] 13:37, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:::::In that case, I now ask why we split the two in the first place back when the Cube info was being put on the afterlife dimension's page if the distinction is so vague as to be nonexistent/unnecessary. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 14:07, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::The Allspark is only one name for the afterlife. You could just as easily phrase your question "Why aren't the Matrix of Leadership and the Matrix dimension on the same page?" because that's exactly the same notion. And you wouldn't do that, now would you? Like I said, though, I'm gearing up to do some stuff with the Allspark article, which chiefly includes moving it to "Transformer afterlife" to separate out and better explain these distinctions and problems. I think it's the last major cross-universal meta-concept left after the Matrix, Energon and Transwarp, and the sparseness of the current article annoys me because, given how the Wiki is slowly but surely becoming a major resource consulted by the people creating the fiction, a thorough detailing of it can help mitigate ''exactly this sort of confusion'' in the future. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]]
:::::::But wasn't the term "Allspark" created specifically to refer to the afterlife? To clarify that "the Matrix" was just its nickname and not meant to refer to the Matrix of Leadership? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 20:19, 29 October 2013 (EDT)

Talk:Main Page

2013-11-05T04:15:39Z

Bumblejumper: /* Featured Article - October 2013 */

<span style="font-family:sans-serif;font-size:100px;line-height:100px;font-weight:900;">THE FUNNY STAYS.</span>
-The Management

__TOC__

<span style="font-size:2em"><b>Please use this talk page for discussion about the [[Main Page]].

To discuss site-wide policies, please visit [[Transformers Wiki Talk:Community Portal|the Community Portal talk page]].

If you ignore the first, second, and third things written on this page to complain about the captions, your transient whining will be moved to [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/People who will never contribute here but nevertheless want us to change everything]].</b>
</span>

==Archives==
*[[Talk:Main_Page/Archive1|Archive1]]
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*[[Talk:Main_Page/Archive3|Archive3]]
*[[Talk:Main_Page/Archive4|Archive4]]
*[[Talk:Main Page/Archive5|Archive5]]
*[[Talk:Main Page/Archive6|Archive6]]
*[[Talk:Main Page/Archive7|Archive7]]

== Formatting problems (just me?) ==

Now that the server has changed, all the formatting seems to have changed! Templates that should be on the right and next to the text (e.g. on episode pages) are on the left and pushing the text down! Is anyone else seeing these problems? --[[User:Flicky1991|Flicky1991]] 07:06, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:It's not just you, I'm seeing it as well. --[[User:Boy Blunderous|Boy Blunderous]] 07:09, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::We're on a newer version of MediaWiki, and it broke some of the templates. It'll be fixed soon, once we figure out why they're not formatting up right.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 07:22, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::As I said on the Community Portal just there, [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Configuration_settings#CSS.2FJs various LocalSettings.php variables] like $wgAllowUserCss and $wgUseSiteCss appear to have gone from "true" to "false" (or just plain deleted - I think they default false) in the move. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:39, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

== Go Box problem? ==

The GoBox is currently not there, no matter which browser I view this page in. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 07:50, 27 March 2013 (EDT)
:Same for me. Normally when it disappears all I have to do is refresh the page, but even that's not working at the moment. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 08:00, 27 March 2013 (EDT)
::The forum signature GoBoxes are knackered too. Those just come up as a white rectangle. Something is indeed amiss. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 09:00, 27 March 2013 (EDT)
:::So, is anyone on this yet? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 16:02, 27 March 2013 (EDT)

== Not On Schedule ==

Did IDW stop making TF comics? If not can we please update the Schedule? [[User:Phantom|Phantom]] 13:01, 4 April 2013 (EDT)
:I don't keep track of the comics much, but I've had a bash at updating it with this month's releases. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:05, 4 April 2013 (EDT)
::That should be fine, I think so long as the next issues's release dates are on there. [[User:Phantom|Phantom]] 16:19, 4 April 2013 (EDT)

== Current Releases Series Addition ==

Dunno who added the series abbreviation before each entry under the IDW Transformers section under Current Releases (MtMtE, RiD, Spotlight, Monstrosity) but I really like it. Makes it easier to quickly tell which latest item you're looking for. Could the same be done with the other categories (Transformers Prime especially)? [[User:Excise|Excise]] 13:10, 12 June 2013 (EDT)

==Featured Article - October 2013==
It's October 4th - is there a new Featured Article ready to go? - [[User:RolonBolon|RolonBolon]] 20:49, 4 October 2013 (EDT)
:We're gonna need a new one soon. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 17:23, 2 November 2013 (EDT)
I think the next featured article should be Bumper G1! - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 23:07, 4 November 2013 (EST)
:It's not impressive enough, since Bumper (G1) has barely appeared in anything. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 23:12, 4 November 2013 (EST)
: Yeah, you got a point there! - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 23:15, 4 November 2013 (EST)

Talk:Soundwave (WFC)

2013-11-05T04:13:51Z

Bumblejumper:

==Less or , more naughty?==
I noticed the notes section said his tenticles are "less naughty" than ROTF Soundwaves's, but ROTF SW only hacks one satellite, TFP SW threatens Autobots, children, shocks things... I thought it was a typo or something, until I got reverted. Why? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 23:13, 4 November 2013 (EST)

== Triple Changer? ==

Ok, we all know that Soundwave can transform into a Spy Rig-class Cybertronian truck, right? Well, right before his boss fight against Optimus and his team, he is briefly seen in the form of a Cybertronian device similar to a tapedeck, much like his original G1 counterpart's Earth mode. Does this mean he's a Triple Changer or is that just an interface mode like when you use the mounted turrets? --[[User:Cydra|Cydra]] 21:19, 4 July 2010 (EDT)
:As per our standards, we do not classify anyone as a "Triple Changer" (proper noun) unless they are specifically labeled as such. Lots of TFs have third modes who are not Triple Changers. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 21:31, 4 July 2010 (EDT)

== Toy Image ==

I'm not going to switch out the caption just 'cause I feel like it, but every time I look at the image, all I can think of is, "BECAUSE YOU ARE HEADCRAB SOUNDWAVE!"--[[User:Apcog|Apcog]] 19:09, 15 July 2010 (EDT)

==Cybertron Adventures==

Soundwave discovers that the Autobots have infiltrated the Datacore. Megatron sends him and Barricade to take care of the intrusion. The two speed out, and Soundwave must navigate a highway overgrown with Dark Energon crystals while dealing with swarms of Aerialbots before they can shut off access to the Datacore. An Autobot Destroyer blocks Soundwave's path and brings the roof down, forcing him to take an alternate route. he makes his way to a security station and downloads the information on the Autobots' advance, radioing Barricade to meet him at the assigned coordinates. When Soundwave arrives, though, he finds Barricade in the middle of a shooting gallery. The Autobots are soon joined by an aerial Destroyer, but the pair make short work of it. Soundwave intercepts a data download but cuts it off quickly, and races to intercept the escaping Autobots. Weaving his way through Dark Energon crystals and moving walls (huh?), he reaches the intercept point in time, causing Ironhide and Bumblebee to skid out of control... and right into a fusion blast from Megatron.
This is here because I cant figure out how to put this on the page-- [[<noinclude>User:</noinclude>Kuptrion]]

== Other Figures ==

Doesn't WFC Soundwave have an RPM figure and a Stealth Force figure? --[[User:Spongezilla|Spongezilla]] 4 August 2010 (EDT)
:I'm pretty sure that RPMs and Stealth Force are exclusive to the movie universe. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 16:14, 4 August 2010 (EDT)
::Hm, they used his Video game robot mode, and Inferno appears to be from the Classics Universe. Gah, the 2010 line is all screwed up. -- [[User:Spongezilla|Spongezilla]] 00:07, 5 August 2010 (EDT)
:::I'd say the Stealth Force figure is the movie guy, even though he has the WFC robot mode and the Animated vehicle mode. His bio talks about how he used to be a satellite and how he's just come down to Earth for the first time. That points to movie continuity to me. (Meanwhile, Stealth Force Silverstreak and Hound are clearly the G1 guys.) ((This should probably go on the Stealth Force page.)) --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:48, 5 August 2010 (EDT)
::::Well, given how the RPM/Speed Stars image at the bottom, and the package photography on the Stealth Force toy all represent WFC Soundwave... I'd say they're toys of this Soundwave and not ROTF Soundwave. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 13:23, 9 October 2010 (EDT)
:::::You're well late, it's discussed on [[Soundwave (ROTF)]]. Still, what with [[repurposing]], we can discuss it here too. [[User:Alientraveller|Alientraveller]] 13:37, 9 October 2010 (EDT)

What about the new Legion Class Soundwave. Mold wise it's clearly DOTM Soundwave, but the packaging is for the Prime line with his Prime Bio on the back. [[User:helli0n|helli0n]] 21:27, 6 June 2012 (EDT)
:I don't know much about the bio on the back but the front of the packaging omits the Prime name just like it does for Mirage and Evac. They wouldn't leave them out if they were blatantly meant to be Prime toys. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 21:45, 10 June 2012 (EDT)

== Voice Actor ==

If he doesn't have one then there's no point having it there. -- [[User:Anythingspossibleforapossible|Anythingspossibleforapossible]] 11:29, 29 November 2010 (EST)

== Quote ==

Could we not consider Starscream and Knock Out's exchane in Sick Mind for Soundwave's main quote? It fits with Soundwave's role as... well, the eyes and ears of the Decepticons, as the spy.

"That blasted Soundwave sees and hears everything."
"The eyes and ears of the Decepticons." {{unsigned|72.190.7.46}}

==toy picture==

It's here http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/transformers-prime-39/transformers-prime-soundwave-wheeljack-and-cliffjumper-at-nycc-173564/

It's "reining in", you guys. You ''rein in'' a horse. Reigning is something a monarch does.

==Shockwave (DOTM)==

Soundwave (Prime) is silent, he doesn't show any signs of sentience when someones talks to him, except moving his head to say no or yes, he just stands and watches.
He's apparently dangerous : Airachnid seems to have given the autobots the hell of a run in previous episodes, and he owned her.
Shockwave in the movie : the same. ( well apparently in prequel comics he kills and kills and kills. )
Should we point the similarity in the Notes ? Is it on purpose that two of the most popular characters EVER bear similarities or is it a coincidence ? [[User:SnipinScientist|SnipinScientist]]
:Well... no. "Soundwave doesn't speak, just like Shockwave in the Dark Of The Moon movie" is really not a noteworthy thing. There's lots of Transformers who don't speak. That doesn't make them identical/homages/noteworthingly similar. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 07:32, 18 February 2012 (EST)
: Decepticons who don't speak in the live-action movies are a dime a dozen. I suppose we could also note that Soundwave (Prime) is just like Movie Blackout, Bonecrusher, Ravage, Scorponok, all seven/eight/nine Constructicons, Sideways, all the protoform warriors, Crowbar, Crankcase, Hatchet... but at that point we're just being friggin' ridiculous, wouldn't you say? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 09:13, 18 February 2012 (EST)
::Bonecrusher, Demolishor, Mixmaster and Rampage did speak.--[[Special:Contributions/199.60.104.18|199.60.104.18]] 23:04, 22 February 2012 (EST)
:::That is not the point. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 23:55, 22 February 2012 (EST)

== Season 2 ==
Is it true that Soundwave is going to start talking in season 2 of ''Prime''?[[Special:Contributions/71.162.102.155|71.162.102.155]] 23:11, 23 February 2012 (EST)
:Well is he?[[Special:Contributions/71.255.172.244|71.255.172.244]] 16:33, 1 March 2012 (EST)
::You know as much about it as we do. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:59, 1 March 2012 (EST)
This topic is rendered moot. {{unsigned|Seriousrunner2|13:12, 15 November 2012 (EST)}}

== Go-Box ==

His Go-Box as it appears on message boards etc [http://tfwiki.net/goboxes/SoundwavePrime.png is blank]. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:50, 8 March 2012 (EST)

== Noticed on the deluxe toy ==

The paint apps on the nose of the vehicle mode look an awful lot like eyes, and the heels of the robot mode feet hinge just under it like a beak. In a sense, his vehicle mode seems to be at least a visual homage to Laserbeak, since Prime Laserbeak looks more like a bat than anything. Worth noting in trivia? --[[Special:Contributions/72.215.154.250|72.215.154.250]] 16:38, 11 March 2012 (EDT)

:No, that's just a coincidence. (and really, he doesn't look anything like Laserbeak.)--[[User:Roni134730|Roni134730]] 09:57, 12 March 2012 (EDT)
::Not like Laserbeak, but still very much a bird. The "'''Talon''' Grapple Cannon" even hangs below him like a bird's claws.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 02:45, 26 March 2013 (EDT)

== "Canons" ==

Someone might want to go correct that in the Prime toy's mention of the Takara release.

== Soundblaster ==

Should'nt we add the Soundblaster and Buzzsaw repaint of the Fall of Cybertron Soundwave toy to the page?

== RID Soundwave's arms ==

I just got a deluxe Soundwave the other day, and noticed that mine has an... ''interesting'' use of plastic in the parts of the arms that fold out with the hands on them: On his right arm, this piece is cast in a slightly flexible, but still rigid, plastic (''a la'' Wheeljack's swords), yet on the left arm, it's that annoying soft plastic. Did I get a factory reject, or is this a common curiosity? If all (or even multiple) figures have them, I think it ought to be mentioned on the page.
:- [[User:Queso|¡Usa El Queso!]] <sup>[[User talk:Queso|Complain here]]</sup> 02:15, 2 July 2012 (EDT)

:Managed to compare my Hasbro and TakaraTomy Soundwaves. The Hasbro version features slightly more rigid a plastic head, arms, tail-fins, nose, and Laserbeak wings, while the TakaraTomy version has soft rubbery ones. Interesting. [[User:Inkblot|Inkblot]] 06:59, 2 July 2012 (EDT)
::Mine's the Hasbro version. The nose and heels are soft, but they're just in between the two arms in terms of harness, whereas the head seems to match the right arm. The left arm is just weird, though. It's the only part that's made of a plastic ''that soft''. This isn't something that one would have to compare two figures to notice. It's blatantly (and painfully) obvious.
::- [[User:Queso|¡Usa El Queso!]] <sup>[[User talk:Queso|Complain here]]</sup> 23:58, 2 July 2012 (EDT)
:::Mine's the same way. I think it must be a more common malfunction or material swap or something. Not really sure.
:::--[[User:Dreadwing47|Decepticon Dreadwing, Megatron's loyal servant.]] 20:15, 26 January 2013 (EST)

== Soundwave's blasters ==

Should something be added about FoC Soundwave's handheld blaster? It's identical to G1 Prime's Ion Blaster, although it was omitted in the first run of FOC Soundwaves released in Australia (possibly all of them, but we don't know for sure)?[[User:Larkmarn|Larkmarn]] 15:19, 5 November 2012 (EST)
This is common knowledge and the similarity is already noted, the accesory was ommited entirely for cost cutting reasons.
[[User:Grimlock140|Grimlock140]] 19:10, 13 December 2012 (EST)

== Beast Hunters toy ==

Arms folding in, looks like I've been mistransforming him. Sorry about that.

Also, in regards the feet it seems I goofed there too; I meant the heels, which become the nose in vehicle mode. I don't think those were rubber on the original toy.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 09:47, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
: The rubberized sections [[#RID Soundwave's arms|varied]] on the original figure, so it could stand that this Soundwave would also have plastic differences that would vary per figure. For example, my BH Soundwave has a nose made of more rigid plastic, just like my PRiD Hasbro Soundwave. [[User:Inkblot|Inkblot]] 10:13, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
::Regarding the colors, while its not in the same placement (yellow chest and blue body) as the G1 character (or possibly the Cybertron version), it ''is'' pretty much the same shades, and it's hard to believe that they released a Soundwave with colors closer to the original archetype on ''accident''. I mean, we're not requiring explicit statements from the engineers to detail the homages on BH Bulkhead or Ratchet.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 17:52, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
:::Is it the same shades? G1 Soundwave was typically a much darker blue, and had gold accents, not bright yellow ones. Plus if they were deliberately going for a G1 homage, why would the deco artist throw in a bunch of that metallic brown too? Count me as a vote against it being an homage. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 19:46, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
:::Jalaguy basically just made my argument. Some color and design homages are obvious, but this one is arguable.--[[User:Roni134730|Roni134730]] 21:16, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
:::Sorry, but I'm rapidly coming to the opinion that people don't know what an "homage" is. It is not "kinda sorta if you squint reminds you of something". A G1 Soundwave homage would be FAR more coherent a layout and, given Hasbro's preferences, ''toy-based'' look. This has a vague resemblance at best. ''Not everything is a reference or homage. Sometimes it's just a coincidence.'' And barring a designer saying "Why yes I deliberately meant to invoke that", this is a very, very rough coincidence. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 21:22, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
::::Ya know, actually, the more I look at that picture the more I find myself agreeing with you guys. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 22:36, 26 March 2013 (EDT)
:::::So can we just remove that sentence once and for all?--[[User:Roni134730|Roni134730]] 00:09, 27 March 2013 (EDT)
::::::I'm fine with it, I withdraw my contention.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 23:26, 27 March 2013 (EDT)
== face? ==
in triage, megatron told knockout to fix soundwaves "faceplate", does this mean soundwave actually has a face underneath his screen, or was megatron abusinghis ability to ignore proper grammar? {{Unsigned|Soundwaveflya}}
:Could just as easily mean that it's a plate that serves as Soundwave's face. Also, in future, sign your talk page posts by typing four tildes: <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 05:19, 2 April 2013 (EDT)
wait, I was going from memory before, just rechecked and its visor, not faceplate, but I guess unless he either takes off the helmet (if their is one)or its referred to by either producers or in universe characters, the whole argument becomes pretty pointless [[User:Soundwaveflya|Soundwaveflya]] 07:28, 2 April 2013 (EDT)

== There something familiar about his Prime character model... ==
Lets see here, no face, long arms that almost touch the ground, long tenticles and chosing not to speak (well until recently) AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO SEES THIS? Is his entire character not based off Slenderman? Even his vehicle mode screams stalker. His presence in an area is just ominous. I mean it can't be coincidence, should we include this under notes? Does anyone agree with me? [[User:Shado prime|--Shado Prime]] 12:39, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
:I've seen this comparison drawn before, but it's almost certainly a coincidence. Slender Man was only created 17 months prior to TFP's TV debut, and didn't blow up into a major internet phenomena until well after that. The tentacles are very obviously derived from live-action films Soundwave, anyway. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 13:25, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
::Jalaguy, you said "Slender Man was only created 17 months prior to TFP's TV debut, and didn't blow up into a major internet phenomena until well after that." By well after that were you refering to a time somewhere around the airing of a [[Predatory|suspicious looking episode]]? [[User:Shado prime|--Shado Prime]] 22:24, 12 July 2013 (EDT)
:::If anything, the atmosphere of that was Predator, not Slenderman.
:::Which I'm glad about, Slenderman is fucking scary as hell. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 22:29, 12 July 2013 (EDT)
::::Never heard of this "Slenderman" thing before, but I have to agree that this is just coincidence. Heck, looking at images of Slenderman, it has similarities to all sorts of things from various horror stories, myths, and so on. To me, Slenderman is reminiscent of the silent guys from the Buffy the Vampire Slayer episode "Hush". Basically, there's just not enough that is distinctive to Slenderman alone to make this a reference to him. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 22:32, 12 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::And besides, Soundwave is not a supernatural guy trying to kill you in a forest. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 22:36, 12 July 2013 (EDT)

== WFC/FOC Visor ==
I noticed some confusion about soundwave's visor. To be clear in WFC it is yellow in-game and red in concept art. In FOC it is red throughout the game with the exception of a brief scene in Chapter 3: When optimus is captured and metroplex squashes megatron, his visor is yellow. However in the cutscene afterwards (and the rest of the game)it is red again. [[User:Shado prime|--Shado Prime]] 22:46, 12 July 2013 (EDT)

:The visor color in FOC has always been red, the shifts of color is to honor the cartoon which featured a red visor, the yellow one for the toy. [[User:SnipinScientist]] 24 August 2013

Talk:Main Page

2013-11-05T04:07:11Z

Bumblejumper: /* Featured Article - October 2013 */

Soundwave (WFC)

2013-11-05T03:57:44Z

Bumblejumper: /* Notes */ why did it say "less naughty" ? this Soundwave uses his tentacles for weapons, to attack, while rotf Soundwave only hacks a satellite.

{{faction|decepticon|hofsilver}}
{{disambig3|Soundwave}}
:''Soundwave is a [[Decepticon]] from the [[Aligned continuity family]].''
[[Image:Soundwave Prime.jpg|thumb|300px|<center>"..."</center>]]
'''Soundwave''' is the spy master of the Decepticons. One of [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]]'s earliest followers, and, many believe, instrumental to his rise, he uses his tentacles and a veritable army of [[Mini-Con|Minicon]] [[Deployer (WFC)|Deployer]]s to learn everything there is to know about his allies and his enemies. He was never very chatty, but these days, on Earth, he's become near silent, communicating by playing back recordings of other people's conversations. He just sneaks about, patiently looking for Autobot transmissions and creeping [[Starscream (WFC)|you]] out. Since the incapacitation of Megatron, Soundwave acts as a restraint on [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]], reining in his rather volatile emotions, and ensuring that Starscream's less than subtle ambitions are held in check.

Soundwave has the ability to receive transmissions from anywhere on the planet, bar the shielded Autobot Base. This allows him to spy on every being on the planet in the hopes of picking up Autobot-related communications.

After being rebuilt by his minions using arcane science, he took on the name '''Soundblaster'''.

{{quote|Watch out for the quiet ones.|[[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]]|"[[One Shall Rise, Part 3]]"}}

==Fiction==
===Aligned novels===
Soundwave was a gladiator from [[Kaon]] who almost bested [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]] in combat, an act that created mutual respect between the two. Soundwave saw in Megatron a desire to return to the swashbuckling spirit of the [[Golden Age]] of Cybertron, when Cybertronians emerged from the [[Well of All Sparks]] having to escape from the [[Underworld]]'s monsters rather than being put into a [[caste system|caste]]. He was appointed Megatron's lieutenant with [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]]. Though Megatron despised Minicons, Soundwave insisted on having them around to spy on their gladiators, including the time when Megatron's librarian friend [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Orion Pax]] came to visit. He was suspicious of Orion and even asked permission from Megatron to tail him as he returned to [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]].

After [[Decepticon]]s bombed Cybertron in Megatron's name, Soundwave sent [[Frenzy (WFC)|Frenzy]] and [[Rumble (WFC)|Rumble]] to search for the [[Matrix of Leadership]] in [[Crystal City]] (a place which design he always found self indulgent). Soundwave was not sure whether he should have bothered, as he was not superstitious and wondered what use a piece of a [[Star Saber (Prima)|broken sword]] could be. Instead he got chilling indications Crystal City's scientists were planning to revive [[Omega Supreme (WFC)|Omega Supreme]].

[[Image:WFCcomicDecepticons.jpg|thumb|250px|"Yeah, this look is cool now, but I don't think I'll have it ''forever'': I mean, who'd like to [[GEEWUN|see things looking the same for over twenty five years]], right guys? ...guys?"]]

Soundwave attended Orion and Megatron's hearing before the [[Autobot High Council|High Council]]. During this meeting, Soundwave helped to sow discord and tension by loudly shouting his complaints over security breaches that, in truth, he himself had caused. The Council noted that they were aware someone had tried to find the Matrix, and they appointed Orion [[Prime (rank)|Prime]] and requested he find it. This tore Orion and Megatron's movement in two.

During the final days of the war, Soundwave and his minions' research changed the fate of Cybertron. It was they who found the areas of the [[DataNet]] that [[Alpha Trion (WFC)|Alpha Trion]] had overlooked and not deleted, revealing the existence of [[Dark Energon]] on [[Trypticon (WFC)|Trypticon]] Station. It was he who remembered the [[Geosynchronous Energon Bridge]] below Crystal City that allowed for the mass transportation of Dark Energon between Cybertron and Trypticon. And it was the evidence he got from Rumble and Frenzy when they infiltrated Crystal City that revealed the existence of the [[Plasma energy|Plasma Energy Chamber]] and its two [[Code Key]]s, which enabled Megatron to poison the [[Core]] of Cybertron.

When Optimus removed the Chamber from the Core, beginning the planet's slow healing process, Soundwave boarded the ''Nemesis'' with Megatron, [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]] and [[Lugnut (WFC)|Lugnut]] to pursue the Autobot ''[[Ark (WFC)|Ark]]'' into the unknown reaches of space. {{storylink|Transformers: Exodus|Exodus}}

Soundwave regained consciousness onboard the ''Nemesis'' after emerging from the energy field created by the Space Bridge explosion over Cybertron. While Megatron demanded a status report, Soundwave was already deep at work in a console attempting to determine the answer. Along with Starscream and Megatron, Soundwave examined the tracking reports and confirmed Starscream's assumption that the ''Ark'' was likely not too far away. {{storylink|Transformers: Exiles|Exiles}}

===''Prime'' cartoon===
{{voiceactor|[[Frank Welker]] (English)}}
When a gladiator calling himself Megatronus vowed to challenge Cybertron's leadership, Soundwave was his first follower and chief amongst them. Soundwave remained at Megatronus' side, now Megatron, as the conflict escalated into a war. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 3}} Following the [[Great Exodus]], when the Decepticons were trying to decrypt an encoded Autobot transmission, Soundwave suggested they should let [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]] have a shot at interrogating [[Arcee (WFC)|Arcee]] and [[Cliffjumper (WFC)|Cliffjumper]]. {{storylink|Out of the Past}}

The Decepticons later arrived on [[Earth]]. During a Decepticon attack on Cliffjumper, Soundwave intercepted Arcee's comms talk. He later played it back to Starscream, prompting the Decepticon leader to send the drones after her. He later detected transmissions coming from deep space, that prompted the Decepticons to fire up the [[space bridge]], allowing Megatron to return. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 1}}

[[Image:DarknessRising5-Soundwaveturn.jpg|right|thumb|200px|''Voice actor:'' [[Snake-Eyes]] (English).]]
Shortly after Megatron left the ship on a mission, Starscream wondered aloud if Megatron had a touch of space madness, and Soundwave reminded him that their absent leader was still in charge. Starscream told him to step up global surveillance. Soundwave subsequently intercepted a transmission from [[William Fowler|Agent Fowler]] and, on Starscream's order, dispatched [[Laserbeak (WFC)|Laserbeak]] to capture the agent to learn the location of the [[Autobot Outpost Omega One|Autobot base]]. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 3}} When the Autobots attacked the ''Nemesis'' to retrieve Fowler, slaughtering dozens of their soldiers, Soundwave hid. He simply watched when Megatron returned and took his fury out on Starscream on the bridge for not waiting on his command. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 4}}

Starscream sent Soundwave to the [[Giant Sized Array]] radio telescope in [[Texas]] as they needed to use the array to target the space bridge at [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]. Soundwave hacked into the computer network at the site, but after he had lined up the dishes, someone realigned them. In response to Starscream's demands as to what was happening, he tapped into the base's security system and discovered that the Autobots' three human friends were in a nearby room, similarly accessing the computer. He extended a tentacle into the room they were in and attacked them. When [[Miko Nakadai|Miko]] tried to chop the tentacle with an ax, Soundwave took it from her and used it to sever the computer system's hardline, locking the dishes on Cybertron. The three kids entered the room in time to see him leaving, and Miko and Soundwave snapped photos of each other.

[[Image:MastersStudents-Soundwavesradar.jpg|thumb|left|200px|See how much more convincing I am as a [[:Image:Cybertronsoundwave.jpg|communications tower]] with this look?]]

Because of Soundwave's success, the Autobots resorted to sabotaging the space bridge, blowing it up and taking Megatron with it. {{storylink|Darkness Rising, Part 5}} At Starscream's order, Soundwave activated the comm system so Starscream could give a speech to the troops, declaring himself leader. Failing to impress the Vehicons, Starscream pressed Soundwave's sensors into locating [[Skyquake (Prime)|Skyquake]], a Decepticon secreted in a pod in the desert. Starscream and Soundwave reactivated Skyquake, only to find he wasn't receptive to Starscream's leadership, and instead set about fighting [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]. Soundwave detected a Decepticon signal from the site where the space bridge exploded, and when Starscream went to investigate, Soundwave sent Laserbeak to keep Starscream honest while he himself filmed the battle between Skyquake and Optimus and [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]]. Though the outcome of the fight was not favorable to the Decepticon cause, Soundwave was able to ensure that Starscream returned Megatron's barely-functioning body to the ''Nemesis''. {{storylink|Masters & Students}}

Soundwave intercepted a transmission from [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]] who was heading for Earth. At Starscream's order, he downloaded the necessary information to [[Makeshift (Prime)|Makeshift]], who took on Wheeljack's form and infiltrated the Autobot base. As Starscream and Soundwave paid a visit to the captive Wheeljack, Soundwave prevented his leader from terminating their prisoner, as he might be of use later. The two 'Cons retired to the ship's top deck to wait for Makeshift to activate the [[GroundBridge]], however Wheeljack broke free and started trashing the Vehicons. When Wheeljack escaped through the ground bridge and sent back Makeshift with his grenade activated, Soundwave and Starscream made sure to get well clear before he exploded. {{storylink|Con Job}} During another Autobot operation, Soundwave listened in on their comm chatter, prompting Starscream to send some Vehicons to attack. {{storylink|Convoy (episode)|Convoy}}

[[Image:Deusex-Soundwavecrouching.jpg|thumb|250px|And that's why there's no [[Ratbat (WFC)|Ratbat]].]]

When [[Breakdown (WFC)|Breakdown]] mentioned seeing an [[Energon Harvester]] in a fresco in [[Greece]], Soundwave was able to track the device's location to a museum. Breakdown and [[Knock Out (Prime)|Knock Out]] kept the Autobots busy in front of the museum while Soundwave sneaked in the back. He ran into [[Raf Esquivel|Raf]] and [[Jack Darby (Prime)|Jack]], who were already in the process of stealing the Harvester, and grabbed it from them before making a getaway in his vehicle mode. {{storylink|Deus ex Machina}}

[[Image:SickMind-Soundwaveobjects.jpg|thumb|250px|left|"Let me see some tenderness connected with a death, or that dark chamber, Spirit, which we left just now, will be forever present to me."]]

Starscream and Knock Out made a concerted attempt to convince Soundwave that Megatron was beyond saving, and that the only option left to them was euthanasia. Soundwave remained skeptical, and pointed out the patch cable that Arcee and Bumblebee was using to access Megatron's brain. Megatron's life support was damaged during the ensuing confusion, and though it seemed Starscream and Knock Out were content to leave Megatron flat-lining, Soundwave pressured them into reconnecting the cable sustaining their master. {{storylink|Sick Mind}}

After Megatron's resurrection, Soundwave kept him informed regarding Starscream's activities, including his attempt to resurrect Skyquake with the Dark Energon shard ripped from Megatron's chest, and the loss of his arm. {{storylink|Shadowzone (episode)|Shadowzone}} Soundwave watched as Breakdown was captured by [[MECH]], and reported back to Starscream. He was on the bridge of the ''Nemesis'' when Starscream passed the news on to Megatron, who was less than impressed that Breakdown had been taken by a bunch of humans. {{storylink|Operation: Breakdown}} He detected the magnetic anomaly caused by the [[polarity gauntlet]], causing Megatron to send Breakdown to go look for it. {{storylink|Metal Attraction}}

Megatron and Starscream headed to a stripped Energon Mine to discover mining drills still there. Starscream attempted to blame this on Soundwave. Megatron told Starscream that Soundwave had been filling him in on the second-in-command's activities. {{storylink|Rock Bottom}} Soundwave listened to Starscream's confessions after Megatron nearly terminated the second-in-command. {{storylink|Partners}}

When the new Decepticon space bridge was nearing completion, Soundwave supplied a diagram of the last component they needed. After they obtained said component, Megatron left the ship on a mission of his own. [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]] began searching the ship for the Decepticon leader and Megatron instructed Soundwave to send Prime to him. {{storylink|One Shall Fall}}

[[Image:SoundwavePlayingSparkbeat..jpg‎|thumb|200px|He's playing Dubstep.]]

Soundwave translated tremors coming from the Earth's core into sound, revealing it to be a heartbeat. Megatron did not appreciate this, as it was making his head hurt. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 1}}

After Megatron left the ship to talk to [[Unicron]], Soundwave monitored the comms channels for his master's return. When [[Airachnid (Prime)|Airachnid]] suggested considering a future without Megatron, Soundwave ominously looked at her. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 2}}

[[Image:Soundwavelayingdownthelaw.jpg‎|thumb|200px|left|YOU! SHALL NOT! PASS!]]
Soundwave continued to try to find some sign of Megatron. When Airachnid announced Megatron wasn't coming back and ordered the ship to [[Regulon Four]], Soundwave decided it was time to lay down the law. He defied Airachnid, who angrily attacked him, but the Decepticon spy master quickly proceeded to defeat Airachnid. Upon Unicron's defeat, Soundwave detected Megatron's signal and activated the GroundBridge, bowing in respect with the other Decepticons as Megatron entered the bridge of the ship. He had to hold Breakdown back when they saw that Megatron was accompanied by Optimus Prime. {{storylink|One Shall Rise, Part 3}}

With Optimus amnesiac and believing himself to be archivist Orion Pax, Soundwave made sure the ship's [[data core]] was clear of any incriminating evidence so Orion could be put to work decrypting information they'd stolen from the Iacon archives. When Arcee managed to get on board the ship to look for the lost Autobot leader, Soundwave made deft use of the GroundBridge to get her back off before Orion could see her. {{storylink|Orion Pax, Part 1}} When Orion eventually learned the truth, Soundwave relayed the news to Megatron. {{storylink|Orion Pax, Part 2}} He also notified Megatron when activity was detected on Cybertron, indicating that the Autobots had gone there in an attempt to help Optimus. {{storylink|Orion Pax, Part 3}}

When Megatron was angry after having had the [[spark extractor|latest find]] snatched from his hands, Soundwave reminded him there were still two more sets of coordinates to investigate. {{storylink|Operation Bumblebee, Part 1}} Soundwave was present when Megatron unsuccessfully tested the [[Forge of Solus Prime]]. {{storylink|Operation Bumblebee, Part 2}} He played back footage of Skyquake's demise for [[Dreadwing (Prime)|Dreadwing]]. {{storylink|Loose Cannons}}

Soundwave continued to try to decode more data from the Iacon archives, in a continuation of Orion Pax's work. When Airachnid requested Megatron's approval to take point in the hunt for the relics, Megatron requested that Soundwave remind him of her previous words when she planned to abandon him. Later, after Dreadwing and Breakdown's failure to execute her, Soundwave began tracing Airachnid's location during her communication to the ''Nemesis'' for Megatron. {{storylink|Crossfire}}

After the ''Nemesis'' crashed, Soundwave reviewed security footage and discovered that Bulkhead had been the one to cause it. Megatron brought it back online using Dark Energon, though the ship's guiding intelligence proved uncontrollable by the Decepticons. Soundwave plugged himself into the flight console in an attempt to regain control, but was zapped into stasis. {{storylink|Flying Mind}}

[[Image:Triage Soundwave visor reflection.jpg|thumb|right|250px|You--cracked--my--visor! [[Knock Out (Prime)|Prepare for sur...]] wait, wrong line.]]
He was on the ''Nemesis'' bridge when Knock Out left to find the first of the four relics decoded by the ship. {{storylink|Tunnel Vision}} Dispatched to find the third relic, Soundwave encountered the ''[[Jackhammer (Prime)|Jackhammer]]'' and used Laserbeak as a distraction. He soon uncovered the [[Resonance Blaster]], only to be attacked by [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]]. Though the Autobot managed to crack his visor, Soundwave triumphed, and was only stopped from dispatching Wheeljack by an SOS from Laserbeak. He picked up Laserbeak and returned to the ''Nemesis'', where Knock Out discovered a grenade implanted in the deployer. Once the offending item was removed, Soundwave returned to his work decrypting the Iacon database, unaware that the Autobots had also implanted a virus in Laserbeak, which passed into the computer and began transmitting the database to the Autobots' mainframe. {{storylink|Triage}} He returned to the bridge to listen to Megatron complain about how ineffective everyone else was, and watched [[Hardshell (Prime)|Hardshell]] and Knock Out argue. {{storylink|Hurt}}

When [[Silas|Cylas]] came to the Decepticons with the offer of a [[Project Damocles]] satellite, Soundwave was sent to a military base in [[Colorado]] to get the codes so they could control the satellite from the ''Nemesis''. He hacked into the computer, giving him the ability to use the satellite even as he was downloading the codes for it, but failed to stop Raf from knocking the satellite out of orbit. He retreated as the Autobots reached his position. {{storylink|The Human Factor}}

With new information about where the Autobots' human friends lived, Soundwave had Laserbeak patrol the area around [[Jasper]]. {{storylink|Hard Knocks}} Soundwave succeeded in decoding another set of coordinates, and Megatron sent him with a decoy Iacon relic to draw the Autobots off. While he managed to keep Optimus Prime's team occupied for a lengthy period of time, it was not long enough, and by the time he returned to the ''Nemesis'', Optimus had gotten hold of the [[Star Saber (Prima)|Star Saber]]. {{storylink|Legacy}} Continuing his work, Soundwave decoded more coordinates and reported them to Megatron while the latter forged the [[Dark Star Saber]]. {{storylink|Alpha/Omega}}

When Megatron returned from victory, he told Soundwave, in great detail, how he had destroyed the Star Saber with his own blade. He soon had two more sets of coordinates downloaded, resulting in Knock Out securing an [[Omega Key]]. When the final set decoded into an image of [[Smokescreen (Prime)|Smokescreen]], Soundwave joined Laserbeak in the field to capture the Autobot rookie. {{storylink|Hard Knocks}} He was on hand to show the image he'd decoded to Smokescreen. {{storylink|Inside Job}}

After firing up the space bridge so Megatron could go to Cybertron, Soundwave told Starscream about what he'd discovered regarding the location of the Autobots' human allies. He later helped Starscream kidnap the three kids and transport them to Cybertron for use as hostages. {{storylink|Regeneration (Prime)|Regeneration}} After handing over Raf in exchange for an [[Omega Key]], Soundwave took part in the activation of the [[Omega Lock]]. He survived the lock's destruction at the hands of Optimus Prime, and returned to Earth with the others. {{storylink|Darkest Hour (episode)|Darkest Hour}}

During the hunt for the scattered Autobots, Soundwave dispatched Laserbeak to monitor an attempt to off Jack Darby. The attack resulted in an explosion that took out Laserbeak, and though Soundwave worked, he was unable to retrieve any further surveillance data from the salvaged, charred Deployer. He opened a space bridge to Cybertron, through which Knock Out returned from a mission accompanied by the long-missing [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]]. {{storylink|Darkmount, NV}} Soundwave was present when Starscream proudly showed off the dancing monkey picture he'd found and later when Shockwave brought [[Predaking (Prime)|a Predacon]] to Earth. {{storylink|Scattered}} As Starscream dispatched troops to deal with a number of Autobot signals, Soundwave tried to point out that their army was being spread thinly. He suggested that the Autobots were likely to be using the ''[[Harbinger]]'' as a base, but [[Darkmount (Earth)|Darkmount]] came under attack before the Decepticons had a chance to act on the information. {{storylink|Rebellion (Prime)|Rebellion}}

He was forced to repair the ''Nemesis'' communication dish after the Predacon damaged it. {{storylink|Plus One}} Soundwave GroundBridged to Shockwave's aid in [[Texas]], when the other Decepticon came under attack from Autobots. With the help of Laserbeak, Soundwave managed to take down Optimus Prime and deftly GroundBridged a fragment of Predacon remains back to the ''Nemesis'' before the Autobots could get their hands on it. {{storylink|Project Predacon}}

When a plague inadvertently engineered by Knock Out and Starscream began spreading through the Vehicon population, Soundwave oversaw cleanup efforts. His group of Vehicons and Insecticons moved through the ship, destroying the infected, until the Insecticons suddenly broke off from the operation. He followed them, and on discovering that Airachnid was out of stasis and controlling them once more, used the space bridge to transport both her and the Insecticons to one of Cybertron's moons. {{Storylink|Thirst}} Soundwave hung around during a Decepticon meeting to determine what to do about the potential threat of the Predacons. {{storylink|Evolution}}

[[File:Soundwave Mocks.jpg|thumb|left|:)|250px]]
As the Decepticons gathered resources to rebuild the Omega Lock, Soundwave monitored some Vehicons stealing materials. He activated the GroundBridge for them when the Autobots turned up, but he himself was shot down by Optimus Prime and crashed into power lines, disabling himself. The Autobots took him back to their shielded base and attempted to interrogate him to find out what Megatron's plans were, but Soundwave merely erased his data and crashed his own hard drives before breaking his vow of silence to tell them he was superior. He remained offline until Laserbeak arrived and reactivated him with new orders—capture Ratchet. {{storylink|Minus One}} After returning to the ''Nemesis'' with Ratchet, Soundwave helped attempt to persuade his prisoner to cooperate by showing picture of the kids and the current Autobot base. {{storylink|Persuasion}}

The Decepticons were puzzled when they picked up Laserbeak's signal outside the warship, as Laserbeak was still attached to Soundwave's torso. {{storylink|Synthesis}} Stationed on the bridge during the Autobot attack on the warship, Soundwave used the GroundBridge to send the Wreckers to a different part of the ship. When the bridge was next attacked by Miko wearing the Apex Armor, Soundwave opened another GroundBridge and advanced on her menacingly, only for Raf to open a second GroundBridge directly behind him. The conflicting energies trapped Soundwave in the [[shadowzone (dimension)|shadowzone]]. {{storylink|Deadlock}}

===Titan Magazines ''Prime'' comics===
[[Image:Titan4.2 Soundwave listen.jpg|thumb|right|200px| You look different, Soundwave. Did you do something different with your entire face?]]
During the war, Soundwave took part in a mission led by Megatron to invade [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]] and destroy the [[Iacon Energon Refinery]]. The team had barely made it in before Soundwave detected that they'd been spotted and the five Decepticons had to take cover. Following a failed gambit which expended the other three team members, Megatron gave Soundwave a bomb. While his leader caused a distraction, Soundwave ran to plant the bomb, only to be struck by blasts from [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|one of the defenders]]. Megatron picked up his wounded second-in-command and helped him to safety, along with the other three Decepticons. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.2|War Story}}

Megatron and Soundwave somehow slipped some code into ''[[Invasionauts II]]'' to hypnotise Raf into opening the GroundBridge so they could send Vehicons through. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.4|Tinker, Tailor, Gamer, Spy!}} When Soundwave's plan to ambush the Autobots in [[The Wave]] went badly, he fired his remote-controlled hand at [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]]. The hand lodged in the scout's chest and later emerged when Bumblebee and [[Raf Esquivel|Raf]] were asleep. Despite trying its best to kill Bumblebee, Soundwave's hand was strapped to a firework and shot high into the air. Starscream and Soundwave later scoured the desert for the missing hand and managed to find at least one finger. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.12|The Evil Shred}}

Megatron had Soundwave broadcast his intent to wreck the [[Statue of Liberty]] to the world's media. Unfortunately the US military intercepted all the transmissions before they could be received, leaving Megatron very unhappy with his communications officer. {{storylink|Transformers Comic issue 4.13|Protecting the Lady}}
{{--}}

===Toy bios===
When Soundwave was severely damaged, his loyal Deployers set to work repairing him. Utilizing the ancient, mysterious science of an alien world, they succeeded, and Soundwave was revived. To reflect the fact that he was no longer content with just being the Decepticons' communications specialist, he renamed himself "Soundblaster", and took on a more combative role. {{storylink|#GenerationsSoundblaster|Voyager Class Soundblaster}}

===''Tales of the Beast Hunters''===
Soundwave intercepted a message between [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]] and [[Wheeljack (Prime)|Wheeljack]] indicating that the pair were heading for a derelict starship in the [[asteroid belt]]. As [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]] and [[Predaking (Prime)|Predaking]] headed out to tail the two Autobots, Soundwave monitored events on [[Earth]] to make sure no one else was following. {{storylink|Tales of the Beast Hunters Chapter 2}} When Predaking came back alone with the news Megatron had apparently perished in an explosion, Soundwave and the other Decepticons immediately suspected [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]] was responsible. {{storylink|Tales of the Beast Hunters Chapter 7}}

==Games==
===''Transformers: War for Cybertron'' (Xbox 360/PS3/PC)===
{{voiceactor|[[Isaac C. Singleton, Jr.]] (English)|[[Claudio Moneta]] (Italian)}}
[[Image:Soundwave WfC GameInformer Concept Art.jpg|300px|So Soundwave, you ever going to use that giant missile pod on your shoulder?
"Well there was that [[Spotlight: Soundwave|one time." ]]|thumb|right]]
Soundwave took control of the orbital station [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]] was posted at, helping [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]] to reach the [[Dark Energon]] by establishing a forward base within the station. He then directed Megatron to a Data Matrix Center in order to find a route to the Dark Energon that had not been blocked by Starscream.

Later, Soundwave notified Megatron that access to the core was impossible, as it was guarded by the Omega Gate. He and [[Breakdown (WFC)|Breakdown]] accompanied Megatron as they led the assault on [[Iacon (polity)|Iacon]], through which they would find and take the [[Omega Key]], opening the Omega Gate and allowing the core to be infused with Dark Energon. On their way to the [[Stellar Galleries]], Soundwave reported [[sniper (WFC)|sniper]]s, and after taking them down, Megatron infused the entrance with Dark Energon and took his team into the security station. Soundwave noticed that the batteries fed the security grid, and the trio infused each of them with Dark Energon, deactivating the security measures. Soundwave then detected the Omega Key behind their next door, and after opening it, the Decepticons arrived at the Stellar Galleries. They opened the container, finding not the key, but a message from [[Sentinel Zeta Prime|Zeta Prime]], who announced that he had taken the Omega Key, anticipating Megatron's plan. Zeta sent Autobot attack forces against them, but they were swiftly taken down. Megatron ordered Soundwave to trace Zeta Prime's broadcast, and Soundwave found it came from 12.7 cycles ahead. He then noted a weak wall, and the Decepticons broke it down and entered the cities' subsystems, providing a direct route to Zeta, and the Omega Key.

The group descended down a shaft and went through a tunnel, avoiding trains on the way, and after breaking down a door in a ventilation area, they were ambushed by Autobot cloakers. Soundwave dispatched them and infused Dark Energon into the batteries. Megatron congratulated him, and then ordered him to unlock the exit. Soundwave obliged, and the trio found themselves in another tunnel. Breakdown challenged Soundwave to a race, to which the Decepticon responded, in his trademark monotone, "Negative." Tough crowd. Rushing through the tunnel, this time full of moving trains, the group came to a station where they infiltrated Iacon's lower levels. Soundwave detected the Omega Key at last, and suggested proceeding through the logistics station. Roughing it through the Autobot attackers, Soundwave finally determined that the key was beyond the train tunnels.

Soundwave and his teammates arrived at Iacon's main streets, where they met up with [[Brawl (WFC)|Brawl]] outside of Zeta Prime's vaults, which were impervious to the small amount of Dark Energon Megatron was capable of channeling. After Megatron's squad helped Brawl clear the area, Brawl called in the Dark Energon bombers, but they were spectacularly shot down by the planetary guns. Brawl suggested disabling them, and Soundwave assisted in carrying out the plan. Autobots advanced all around, but Soundwave and the others managed to hold them off until the next wave of bombers arrived, clearing the street and destroying the Vault doors. Soundwave joined the others on their way to the entrance, but the squad was intercepted by a [[Destroyer (WFC)|Destroyer]]. Soundwave and Breakdown split from Megatron to flank him, and eventually they rendered him non-functional. Inside the vault, they avoided Zeta's traps and finally reached the Omega Key—but it too was a trap. Zeta then attacked them, using a giant hologram and controlling the chamber to his advantage, dropping the ceiling and sending holographic brutes to attack for him while safe within an impenetrable energy shield. (Even during the battle, Soundwave was impressed by the creation of endless energon clones, to which Breakdown responded, roughly, "NERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRD!") Soundwave's dorkiness proved useful in discerning the weakness of Zeta's machines—that the core rapidly overheated after prolonged use, and needed to open up in order to cool, rendering it vulnerable to attack. After the battle, Megatron plucked from Zeta's hand the "key"...which started to blink its lights and chirp. Zeta Prime informed them that the "key" he was actually a device that activated the real key: [[Omega Supreme (WFC)|Omega Supreme]].

As the three Decepticons flew away to track Omega, Soundwave noticed that the "key" was coming for them. Omega Supreme attacked, and thrust the Decepticons' star cruiser into a wall. Crash-landing, Megatron had a change of plans; force Omega Supreme to open the Omega Gate. Soundwave noticed a Decepticon [[Dropship (WFC)|Dropship]] across the bridge, but when the squad went to investigate, Omega Supreme intercepted them. Soundwave reported that his weapons were ineffective; Megatron told his soldiers to destroy the bridge supports, causing Omega Supreme's vast bulk to collapse it. But he transformed to his ship mode, flew back up, and forced the Decepticons to retreat inside. In a frenzy, Breakdown noted that the next door was locked, and Soundwave proposed that Dark Energon could open the door, which it did. Inside, Soundwave picked up a transmission from Starscream, who announced that he would be replacing the "deceased" Megatron as Decepticon leader. Enraged, Megatron threatened Starscream, but Soundwave informed his leader that communication to the surface had been cut off, so Starscream could not hear him.

The trio arrived at the lift, but found it to be locked down. Breaking the locks got the lift back to working condition, but on their way up, Omega Supreme returned and blasted it, forcing the Decepticons down the shaft at breakneck speed. Omega was still out there, so the emergency brakes' destruction was the Decepticons' only hope. At the bottom, they continued their journey to find a way to fight Omega Supreme—Soundwave noted that at the top of the tower were several heavy weapons emplacements which could at least theoretically damage Omega—but Omega Supreme didn't know the meaning of the word quit. (He really doesn't; not much in the processor department.) He grabbed the Decepticons, but Soundwave helped out in shooting Omega Supreme's hand, forcing him relinquishing the three from his grasp. They retreated inside a fortified Autobot position, and in order to prevent detection, Soundwave jammed their signals. Slaying the Autobots inside who dared attempt to counterattack, Soundwave unlocked the exit, which only let in more Autobots. They too, met their demise, but as Soundwave and his comrades escaped, he noticed that the Autobots' security was countering the effects of Dark Energon. Destroying the sentries turned to be a worthwhile solution, but then the Decepticons had to deal with Omega Supreme mining road. Soundwave's sensors indicated the presence of a bridge nearby, and though Breakdown was unsure, Megatron was willing to follow Soundwave's advice. Once again, Omega Supreme continued to stalk them, but Soundwave led his group to an alternate route...a dead end, to be precise, which Megatron was irritated with. Soundwave revealed that breaking a structurally-weak sealed doorway nearby took them to Iacon maintenance tunnels leading straight to the bridge terminal. When they arrived through the power conduits, Soundwave and the others fought through more Autobots and finally activated the bridge.

Racing across the bridge, they barely avoided Omega Supreme's pursuit, and Soundwave located another cargo lift that would transport them straight to the heavy ion turrets. On the lift he picked up several Autobot/Decepticon signals, a sign they were approaching the battle on the surface. Soundwave participated in the slugfest, and his analysis proved that the turrets nearby had enough firepower to legitimately damage Omega Supreme. Then, he showed no mercy using the turrets to breach Omega's armour and finally topple him to the ground below.

Soundwave, Breakdown, and Megatron followed Omega, and at the bottom, they were surprised to see him survive and transform into his mighty robot mode. Soundwave noted that energon batteries produced from within Cybertron were the source of Omega's limitless endurance, and further advised the team on battling Omega; avoiding his tractor beams would allow them to live, and his turrets were vulnerable, making them the prime target. When the turrets were blown, Soundwave saw that the batteries were being used to repair them, and so it became an objective to corrupt them with Dark Energon. When Omega Supreme used the batteries to heal himself, he was instead weakened, allowing the Decepticons to critically injure him. Omega Supreme was still alive even after all of that, but much weaker. Soundwave observed that his chest plating had been damaged, and Megatron ordered Soundwave and Breakdown to blast it, and Omega Supreme fell at last. Soundwave advised Megatron that now would be a good time to corrupt Omega with Dark Energon, but Megatron told Captain Obvious to shut up and did as he would have done even if Soundwave hadn't brought it up, laughing all the way.

After Cybertron's Core had been infected with Dark Energon, Soundwave was reassigned as head of [[Kaon]]'s prison, and watched over (i.e., tortured) Zeta Prime in his spare time. [[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus]], [[Bumblebee (WFC)|Bumblebee]], [[Sideswipe (WFC)|Sideswipe]] and [[Air Raid (WFC)|Air Raid]] led an Autobot breakout and battled Soundwave's minions [[Frenzy (WFC)|Frenzy]], [[Rumble (WFC)|Rumble]] and [[Laserbeak (WFC)|Laserbeak]]. Soundwave himself sustained heavy damage leaving the safety of his position to revive and retrieve each Minicon, showing uncharaceristic concern for other living beings. Eventually, defeated and critically damaged, Soundwave desperately attempted to restore himself by absorbing life force from Zeta's very own spark. His attempt to fully heal was halted by Optimus, who even took a shot from the Decepticon intended to finish off Prime. Although Soundwave and his minions fled, the damage had already been done and Zeta Prime expired moments later. {{storylink|Transformers: War for Cybertron (360/PS3/PC)|Transformers: War for Cybertron}}
{{-}}

===''Transformers: War for Cybertron'' (DS)===
:''Voice actor:'' [[Isaac C. Singleton, Jr.]] (English)
Soundwave hacked into the Autobot mainframe and, while Megatron and some other Decepticons kept the Autobots distracted, downloaded intel indicating the location of the Trypticon space station. As they approached the station in Megatron's ship, Soundwave reported that the inhabitants were taking up defensive positions and docking would not be possible. Though Megatron was confident they could ram the station, Soundwave turned out to be right, and they could only get close enough to drop a small team off on the debris surrounding the station. When the station was conquered and Dark Energon in Megatron's hands, Soundwave suggested it might be a good idea to test the stuff prior to use. It turned out to be unstable, and he warned it could result in destruction of its host. The Decepticons set up Kaon Prison as a testing ground and, after eleven failures, established that the Dark Energon could be used. When Barricade asked what happened to the failures, Soundwave would only say that their remains laid in the prison and creepily ask Barricade to get in the chair so he too could be infused with Dark Energon.

Trypticon station required more power, so the Decepticons sent a team to Cybertron's core to reactivate the Energon Bridge. Soundwave did not anticipate the activation of latent defense systems, triggered by the Decepticon presence, because he hadn't studied the same ancient files as Starscream. Megatron ordered Soundwave to give Starscream whatever he needed, and they succeeded in activating the bridge. Soundwave reported that they were only at 37% power — the Autobots had severed the bridge's link to the core using the Omega Key. Lazerbeak intercepted an Autobot transmission indicating that Zeta Prime was hiding the Omega Key, and Megatron ordered Soundwave to assemble a strike force to obtain it. They managed to find and defeat the Autobot leader, but the Omega Key he had was only the key to awaken the real key — Omega Supreme. Once the Decepticons fought their way through the Autobot defenses, Soundwave reported they had reached Omega Supreme himself. The Decepticons defeated the giant, reestablished the link to the core and infused it with Dark Energon. {{storylink|Transformers: War for Cybertron (DS)}}

===''Transformers: Cybertron Adventures''===
{{voiceactor|[[Isaac C. Singleton, Jr.]] (English)|[[Claudio Moneta]] (Italian)}}

{{charstubfiction}}
{{storylink|Transformers: Cybertron Adventures}}

===''Transformers: Fall of Cybertron''===
{{voiceactor|[[Isaac C. Singleton, Jr.]] (English)}}
Soundwave was present when Optimus was brought to Megatron by Starscream and [[Onslaught (WFC)|Onslaught]]. He watched as [[Metroplex (FOC)|Metroplex]]''' pulverised''' Megatron. He was the only one who hesitated in following Starscream. He secretly salvaged and with the help of Laserbeak, Rumble and an [[E.D.K. TechVolt]], rebuilt his glorious leader, improving on his original design. He infused Megatron with Dark Energon, and pointed his leader in the direction of Starscream. He took part in the assault on the factory the Autobots had built in the crater where Trypticon crashed, and once Megatron had rebuilt the giant Decepticon, came to power up Trypticon's power core. On Megatron's orders, Soundwave rebuilt Trypticon into the ''Nemesis'', a ship strong enough to make it towards [[Earth|the planet]] [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]] had chosen. When the Autobots launched the Ark, the ''Nemesis'' soon caught up, and Soundwave spearheaded the assault on the other ship. {{storylink|Transformers: Fall of Cybertron}}

===''Terrorcon Defense''===
[[Image:SoundwaveTerrorconDefense.jpg|300px|thumb|As awesome as he looks here, he's probably waltzing off after Bumblebee blasted him ''again''.]]
Soundwave attempted to retrieve Dark Energon from a mining area but despite his army of Vehicons and Terrorcons, Bumblebee managed to stop him. {{storylink|Transformers Prime: Terrorcon Defense}}
{{-}}

=== ''Transformers: Prime - The Game ===
[[Image:TransformersPrimeTheGame Soundwave.jpg|thumb|left|200px|Wait, I thought Daft Punk had two guys in it.]]
After [[Ratchet (WFC)|Ratchet]] saved Miko, and Raf- he had to shut down the reactors in which Soundwave set up to keep Raf from hacking into the Decepticon Database. Ratchet had to shut down each reactor as Soundwave deployed Vehicons, and blocked them with forcefields. Eventually towards the end the two ended up battling; ending with Ratchet defeating Soundwave. {{storylink|Transformers: Prime - The Game}}

{{-}}

==Commercial appearances==

===Transformers: War For Cybertron===
[[Image:WFC Gamestop Commercial.jpg|right|200px|thumb|The toy can do this if you try hard enough.]]
[[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]] arrived to a location where [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]], [[Starscream (WFC)|Starscream]], and Soundwave were battling Autobots. Megatron left, leaving Shockwave in charge. Shockwave ordered Soundwave to [[Transformation|Transform]]. Soundwave changed into Cybertronian boombox mode and played [[The Touch]]. {{storylink|Commercial#War for Cybertron|GameSpot's commercial for their Shockwave multiplayer exclusive}}
{{--}}

===Transformers: Prime===
Soundwave knows that out of all the radio transmissions in the universe, Megatron's favorite song is the ''[[My Little Pony]]: Friendship is Magic'' theme. {{storylink|Commercial/Prime|Megatron's Favorite Song (26 Hour Takeover marathon promo)}}

==Toys==
===Generations===
[[Image:Generationstoy-CybertronianSoundwave.jpg|thumb|300px|No [[Soundwave (Animated)|giant guitar]] this time!]]
*'''Cybertronian Soundwave''' (Deluxe, 2010)
**''Accessories:'' two "weapons"

: Part of the third wave of ''[[Transformers: Generations|Generations]]'' Deluxe Class toys, ''[[Transformers: War for Cybertron (franchise)#Toys|War for Cybertron]]'' Soundwave transforms into an SUV-style "communications truck", as seen in [[Transformers: War for Cybertron (360/PS3/PC)|the video game]]. He comes with his classic shoulder launcher and rifle, both of which can be mounted on his hands, right shoulder, and rear vehicle sides via [[5mm post]]s, and store inside his opening chest (approximating the visual of cassette spools). Soundwave's head features a [[light-piping]] gimmick, but the effect is largely neutered by his painted visor.

: This mold was [[repaint]]ed into ''[[Transformers United|United]]'' [[Soundwave (G1)/toys#United|Soundwave Cybertron Mode]].

::*''[http://tfu.info/2010/Decepticon/GenerationsSoundwave/soundwave.htm More information on Cybertronian Soundwave at TFU.info]''

{{-}}
{{anchor|GenerationsVoyager}}
[[Image:Generations-SoundwaveVoyager.jpg|thumb|300px|With all the downsizing, Soundwave's surprised he's gotten so big.]]
*'''Soundwave''' (Voyager, 2012)
**''Series / Number'': '''1 / #001'''
**''Japanese ID number:'' '''TG13'''
**''Accessories:'' Laserbeak/Data disc, shoulder cannon

: Part of the first wave of [[2012]] Voyager Class ''Generations [[Transformers: Fall of Cybertron|Fall of Cybertron]]'' toys, Soundwave is a larger mold, and comes with a shoulder cannon which can peg (via 5mm post) into his hands, right shoulder, and roof/back.

: He also comes with [[Legends Class]] [[Laserbeak (WFC)#Generations|Laserbeak]], who utilizes Soundwave's main [[gimmick]], storing and launching Laserbeak and other "[[data disc]]" minions. A button to the left of his head can be pressed to open his spring-loaded chest compartment, allowing up to three data discs to be stored inside. With discs stored, his back panel/roof now acts as a plunger, which can be moved forward in either mode to launch minions out. Launched minions should land on buttons on their undersides, thus triggering their [[Flipchanger|spring-loaded transformation mechanisms]] and springing them into action! ...Hopefully.

: As an undocumented feature, the seat on his vehicle roof holds [[Diaclone]] drivers. Additionally, Soundwave's trigger finger is molded into his left hand, presumably so he can push his own eject button.

: For some reason, his [[stock photography]] and [[instructions]] depict him with the ''[[The Transformers (toyline)|Generation 1]]'' [[Optimus Prime (G1)/toys#Generation 1|Optimus Prime]] toy's [[Ion blaster]] accessory, which isn't included with the final product.

: The [[TakaraTomy]] release of Soundwave, part of the fourth wave of Japanese ''Generations'' toys, features different colors, using a more purple-ish metallic shade of blue and replacing almost all of his gray parts (the exceptions being his face and "grill") with a much darker metallic shade. It also features none of the red and yellow [[paint operation|paint details]] on his arms and legs, and renders the seat on his roof black.

: Soundwave was [[redeco]]ed and [[retool]]ed into [[Blaster (FOC)|Autobot Blaster]].

::*''[http://tfu.info/2013/Decepticon/FOCSoundwave/soundwave.htm More information on ''Fall of Cybertron'' Soundwave at TFU.info]''

{{-}}
{{anchor|GenerationsSoundblaster}}
[[Image:Generationstoy-FOCSoundblaster.jpg|thumb|300px|"Am I New Soundwave, or [[#Beast Hunters|Old]] [[#Deluxe|Old]] New Soundwave?"]]
*'''Soundblaster''' (Voyager, 2012)
**''Series / Number'': '''1 / #002'''
**''Japanese ID number:'' '''TG14'''
**''Accessories:'' Buzzsaw/Data disc, shoulder cannon

: Also available in the first wave of [[2012]] Voyager Class ''Generations Fall of Cybertron'' toys, Soundblaster is a charcoal gray, red, gold, and yellow [[redeco]] of Voyager Class Soundwave, as is the trend with [[Soundblaster (disambiguation)|Soundblasters]]. In fact, he uses the exact same [[paint operation|paint mask]] as Soundwave, simply changing some of the colors. He now comes with [[Buzzsaw (FOC)|Buzzsaw]], a redeco of Laserbeak.

: His stock photography and instructions still depict him with the ion blaster accessory which he still doesn't have.

::*''[http://tfu.info/2013/Decepticon/FOCSoundblaster/soundblaster.htm More information on Soundblaster at TFU.info]''
{{-}}

===Prime===
{{anchor|Deluxe}}
[[Image:Primetoy-SoundwaveDeluxe.jpg|right|thumb|300px|Toy doesn't talk, just like in the tv show!]]
[[File:Prime-toy SoundwaveAM.jpg|right|thumb|300px|Good luck stickering this guy! ''You'll need it.'']]
*'''Soundwave''' (Deluxe, 2012)
**''Japanese release date'': '''[[April 28]], 2012'''
**''Series / Number'': '''1 / 004'''
**''Japanese ID number'': '''AM-09'''
**''Accessories'': [[Laserbeak (WFC)#Prime|Laserbeak]], Arms Micron "[[Zori#Prime|Zori]]" (TakaraTomy only)

: Part of the first wave of ''[[Transformers: Prime (toyline)#Robots in Disguise (2012)|Prime: Robots in Disguise]]'' toys, Soundwave transforms from a UAV not unlike the [[Wikipedia:General_Atomics_MQ-9_Reaper|Predator B drone]] into an angular batlike robot mode. His transformation includes a spring-loaded head that deploys automatically when his tail and thrust bottle are folded up. His vehicle mode has a [[5mm post|5mm port]] on the top of its fuselage; the robot also has 5mm sockets passing entirely through his palms. Any of these holes can mount the included Laserbeak, or he can store inside Soundwave's chest in either mode.

: In wave six of the ''Prime'' toyline, Soundwave was put into new packaging, which came with a DVD featuring the ''[[Transformers: Prime (cartoon)| Prime]]'' episode "[[Loose Cannons]]".

: The [[TakaraTomy]] release of Soundwave, part of the second wave of Japanese ''Prime'' product, has considerable differences from the [[Hasbro]] version. He comes with his own [[Arms Micron]], Zori, and cannons with 5mm ports and posts have been added to his wings (on his shoulders in robot mode) in order to accommodate said gimmick. Many of the Hasbro [[paint operation]]s have also been removed and replaced with numerous, small, customer-applied foil [[sticker]]s, including ones for his tiny sculpted kneecaps, which are practically guaranteed to peel off at the sides. In addition, the [[instructions]] for applying the stickers unfortunately contain an error, with the placement of stickers 14 and 15 being swapped around.

::*''[http://tfu.info/2012/Decepticon/Soundwave/soundwave.htm More information on Hasbro Soundwave at TFU.info]''
::*''[http://higekumatoytoy.blog60.fc2.com/blog-entry-1501.html Arms Micron Soundwave gallery at Alfes's blog]''

{{-}}

===Beast Hunters===
[[Image:PrimeBHtoy-Soundwave.jpg|thumb|right|300px|Yeah, being lost in the wilderness for a couple of months will do that to you.]]
*'''Soundwave''' (Deluxe, 2013)
**''Series / Number'': '''2 / 002'''
**''Accessories'': [[Ravage (WFC)#Beast Hunters|Ravage]], Talon Grapple Cannon
: Part of the first wave of ''[[Transformers: Prime (toyline)|Prime:]] [[Beast Hunters]]'' Deluxe Class toys, Soundwave is a redeco and extensive [[retool]] of the ''Robots in Disguise'' Soundwave mold, and transforms into a spiky aerial drone with a massive wingspan and three tail-fins. Aside from the usual peg-holes on his fuselage and palms, his wings have been retooled with two new peg-holes, with one on each wing. Instead of Laserbeak, Soundwave features a new partner in the form of Ravage, who is a robotic jaguar that transforms into a thing that fits into Soundwave's chest.

:Soundwave also comes with the "[[Talon Grapple Cannon]]", a spring-loaded launcher that fires a [[missile]] with an opening "claw" at the end, with the missile and launcher being tied together with a length of string. The launcher itself features an additional peg on each side, and its main peg is sculpted to be able to fit in the specially-shaped socket on his chest, allowing the cannon to mount on his vehicle-mode underside when Ravage is removed.

:His instructions include the [[Tales of the Beast Hunters Chapter 2|second chapter]] of the ''[[Tales of the Beast Hunters]]'' series.

::*''[http://tfu.info/2013/Decepticon/Soundwave/soundwave.htm More information on ''Beast Hunters'' Soundwave at TFU.info]''
{{-}}

===Go!===
*'''Hunter Soundwave''' ([[April 27|04–27]]–13)
**''Japanese ID number:'' '''G18'''
**''Accessories'': [[Ravage (WFC)#Go!|Ravage]], "Capture Anchor" weapon

: Part of the first wave [[TakaraTomy]] ''[[Triple Combination: Transformers Go! (toyline)|Go!]]'' toys, Hunter Soundwave is a redeco of the ''Beast Hunters'' Deluxe Class Soundwave toy, featuring a different blue, white, and black color scheme with a red faceplate. The back of the packaging erroneously depicts the ''Beast Hunters'' version of the toy.

{{picsneeded}}
{{-}}

===Cyberverse===
[[Image:BHtoy Cyberverse Soundwave.jpg|thumb|300px|Now let's see [[Laserbeak (WFC)#Beast Hunters|Laserbeak]] pop out of ''this'' guy's chest.]]
*'''Soundwave''' (Legion, 2013)
**''Series / Number'': '''3 / 005'''
**''Accessories'': Sonic Saw

: Part of the second wave of ''Prime: Beast Hunters'' [[Cyberverse#Series 3|Series 3 Cyberverse]] Legion Class toys, Soundwave is a smaller-scale toy. He comes with a "Sonic Saw" rifle with a chainsaw bayonet, and the weapon features four [[C joint|3mm posts]] and two ports, allowing it to peg onto any of the ports on Soundwave's hands, forearms/wings, and back/fuselage. This weapon, in varying colors, was also used by [[Hun-Gurrr (Prime)|Hun-Gurrr]], [[Smokescreen (Prime)#Cyberverse|Smokescreen]], and the [[Vehicon (Prime)#CyberverseAir|Air Vehicon]].

{{--}}

==Notes==
[[Image:TfprimeSoundwavePredator.jpg|thumb|But can he replay footage of "[[Operation: Firestorm]]"?]]
[[Image:VectorSigmaBotBuilderSoundwave.jpg|thumb|Deep Desert Soundwave.]]
* In ''War for Cybertron'', Soundwave transforms into a Cybertronian truck during gameplay, and his toy does the same, having only one alternate mode. However, the game also features a Cybertronian boombox mode, seen during a cutscene and the credits (in addition to a commercial for the Shockwave pre-order bonus), which the toy can approximate with some fiddling. In a ''Fall of Cybertron'' easter egg, he also briefly adopts a Cybertronian lamp post, in homage to [[More than Meets the Eye, Part 1|the first episode of the ''Generation 1'' cartoon]].
* Despite his toy and concept art appearance, Soundwave has a [[Soundwave (G1)/toys#Generation 1|yellow]] visor in the War for Cybertron game. This was changed to red for the Fall of Cybertron sequel (perhaps displaying, in-universe, his furthered dedication to the Decepticon cause?).
* According to the [[Transformers Hall of Fame]] biography, Soundwave [[Perceptor (Animated)|deleted his emotions to process information more quickly]], and is susceptible to [[Cyber Missions 1|too many sonic booms]].
* [[Duane Capizzi]] said Soundwave can speak, but just chooses not to. The decision was to contrast Soundwave with the overly talkative Starscream,<ref>[http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/transformers-prime-39/bonus-q--a-with-transformers-prime-creators---answered-171430/ TFW2005 Q&A January 2011]</ref> and at [[BotCon 2011]], the staff compared Soundwave to [[Boba Fett]]. Instead, he records what he overhears and replays it with a mechanical echo that is very similar to the echo of his G1 counterpart. <s>Sorry, [[Frank Welker|Frank]], only [[Megatron (WFC)|one character]] for now...</s> But when he ''does'' talk, he sounds a lot like Frank Welker.
* Soundwave's prehensile tentacles are reminiscent of [[Soundwave (ROTF)|another Soundwave]], although they are significantly more naughty.
* Soundwave's body parts are available to use in the Hub website's [[Vector Sigma Bot Builder]] online game. Normally, you cannot configure a generic 'bot using all Soundwave parts, but you can see what one would look like at right through the magic of Photoshop.

===Arms Up Modes===
In the Japanese ''Prime'' toyline, Soundwave has named powered-up modes when given various [[Arms Micron]]s in certain configurations:

*'''Night Attack Mode''' (ナイトアタックモード ''Naito Atakku Mōdo'')
**''Arms Microns'': Balo, Jida, Zori
: In this mode, shown on his box-back photo, Soundwave uses the two-Micron weapon [[Spike Hammer Rod]], while [[Jida]] in "Defense Shield" mode hangs on his left shoulder. What exactly makes all this ideal for nighttime attacks is anyone's guess.

*'''Jet Mode''' (ジェットモード ''Jetto Mōdo'')
**''Arms Microns'': Gora (x2), Zori
: Meant simply for flying in fast and blowing crap up, this heavily modified version of Soundwave requires some real work. Because of all the recycled non-''Transformers'' parts in this mode, TakaraTomy designer [[Takashi Nakase]] has nicknamed this version "Recycle Mode". Two jet thruster/fuel tanks are created using bottles from a Japanese "common yogurt drink" and a pair of [[Gora]]s painted up silver, with snipped Arms Micron sprues added on for detail. Soundwave also carries a large weapon made from Zori, a plastic fork, and more sprues. Yes, a plastic fork. You read that correctly.
: There is also a vehicle mode configuration for this Arms Up Mode, with the massive turbines on the end of Soundwave's wings and the weapon on top of the main body. The whole shebang can be seen [http://youtu.be/QJUMhgggH-Q in this TakaraTomy developer video on YouTube].

===Foreign names===
*''Russian:'' '''Barkhan''' (Бархан, "Dune")

==References==
<references/>

[[Category:Cyberverse]]
[[Category:Fall of Cybertron Decepticons]]
[[Category:Generations]]
[[Category:Go! Decepticons]]
[[Category:Gladiators]]
[[Category:Hall of Fame]]
[[Category:Prime Decepticons]]
[[Category:Spies]]
[[Category:Surveillance specialists]]
[[Category:War for Cybertron Decepticons]]

Talk:Jasper

2013-11-05T03:51:19Z

Bumblejumper: Created page with "So is Jasper NV a real place? - ~~~~"

So is Jasper NV a real place? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:51, 4 November 2013 (EST)

Talk:Scorponok (Movie)

2013-11-05T03:49:08Z

Bumblejumper:

Now that Scorponok's on the Game website, any of you flash diggers think you can fish out his CG art? I think it'd make a good image for the this entry. --[[User:Terrocon Blot|Terrocon Blot]] 08:56, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

:There's more than one of us?
:(I'll see what I can do, they're buried in a resource file somewhere I wasn't able to find...) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 09:26, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

::And apparently I like,d it was the Lunchables site that hid things in resource files- they're right there for the taking on Transformersgame.com. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 09:37, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I've noticed in one of the latest TV spots that Scorponok is only around 8-10 feet long. Should this be mentioned in the article? ...seeing as how wiki's work by the "truth by consensus" principal.

He appears as a Zord in Power Rangers?

No, somebody put that as joke.

So he turns into the helicopter's engine right? I always did wonder about that. - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:49, 4 November 2013 (EST)

== Scorponok - individual character, symbiont or drone? ==

I just added some details to the trivia sections regarding what parts of Blackout's alternate mode Blackout consists of, and how Jeff Mann described Scorponok as being "birthed" from Blackout. Can we say for sure whether he is a character of his own, rather than being to Blackout what Roller is to G1 Prime?--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 19:14, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

I personally saw him as more like what the animal-form cassettes are to G1 Soundwave, rather than a simple drone like Roller. --[[User:Nightshade83|Nightshade83]] 19:57, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

I have always considered Skorponok as an individual character, though more of an animal than any of the others in the movie. Simply Blackout’s pet, but not a drone of any kind. -- Guest 16:00, 19 February 2008

One thing I'm curious about: One of the documentaries on the second DVD of Transformers states that Scorponok's alternate mode is actually the engine of Blackout's helicopter mode. If so, did Scorponok actually survive, or, given that Blackout dies shortly after transforming from copter to robot, did he die with Blackout when the larger robot was destroyed? --[[User:IMAGinES|IMAGinES]] 07:33, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

== Robot mode mainpic ==

I'm probably the minority, but I think his robot mode should be used for his mainpic. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 11:08, 18 July 2009 (EDT)
:His real robot-mode is his scorpion mode [[User:Dead Metal|Dead Metal]] 11:17, 18 July 2009 (EDT)
::So his alternate mode is a bipedal humanoid? Interesting theory. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 11:35, 18 July 2009 (EDT)
:::Actualy, his main alternate mode in the movie is blackout's engine, his robot mode is only used in a flash game and in a comic. Besides, if his main mainpic was of the robot mode, it can only be the toy or an image from the comic.--[[User:Sunjumper|Sunjumper]] 12:41, 18 July 2009 (EDT)

MediaWiki talk:Community Portal

2013-11-05T03:42:03Z

Bumblejumper: /* New Theme */

__NEWSECTIONLINK__

This is the place for discussion of topics that affect the entire wiki. Some topics that would ordinarily be here have merited their own pages:

{{chapters|title=Specific Discussion Subjects|align=left|content=
<div class="list-header">'''Moving From Wikia:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving|Arriving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving|Leaving]]
* [[Transformers Wiki:Community Portal/Complaints|Complaints]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''New Ad Policy:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki:Ads|Ads]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Bookworm Database-Crash:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Damage Control Central|Damage Control Central]]
* [[Project:Bookworm Crash]]
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Leaving2|Leaving Take 2]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Server Move:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Arriving2|Arriving Take 2]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Relicensing:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Relicensing|Relicensing]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''Dealing With Vandalism:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/Vandalism|Vandalism]]
<br/><div class="list-header">'''GoBots Sister Wiki:'''</div>
* [[Transformers Wiki talk:Community Portal/GoBots|Discussion on the place of GoBots in this wiki]]
<br/> <div class="list-header">'''Wiki Technical Information:'''</div>
* [[Transformers_Wiki:Tech|A Not So Brief Summary of the Horrible Things That McFly and Co. Have Done To Keep This Wiki From Melting Down]]
}}<br/>

{{:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}/Archive}}


==Batchtaster?==

Really? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 18:19, 1 January 2013 (EST)

== Captions ==

I have often found myself simply reading this website for entertainment because it just appeals to my sense of humor that much. I have often found myself wanting to somehow upvote or like a caption because it was just that good. Is there a way to do this? If not, can there be? [[User:Tourny|Tourny]] 20:59, 5 January 2013 (EST)
:I don't think that'd ever happen, because at the end of the day, this a Transformers wiki, not a 'post your Transformers jokes here' website. The jokes aren't and never should be the main focus, they're just a fun side effect. If anything, such a system would kind of legitimise the people who show up and do just want to use this place as a place to post their 'hilarious' Transformers jokes without contributing anything useful, and god knows we don't want that... [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 04:52, 6 January 2013 (EST)
::A most welcome way of doing it would be to point out the captions you like by posting to your facebook or twitter or what have you, especially with a link to the TFWiki page in question. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:18, 6 January 2013 (EST)

== Aligned character page main images ==

Since we've finally beun to treat the Aligned characters like we do characters of other continuities by disambiguating them by franchise, does anyone else feel that a bunch of characters with (WFC) disambigs having their Prime designs as their main image feels a little off? I mean, [[Thundercracker (Armada)]] uses his Armada design as his main image despite his Cybertron depiction being his most prominent one. Wouldn't it make more sense to have the WFC designs be the main images for those characters who bear the (WFC) disambig and such? Especially since our policy says, "the main image [of a character's page] should be their original 'real world' form". --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:34, 7 January 2013 (EST)
:Not sure why it's there for Thundercracker, but characters like [[Sideways (RID)]] and [[The Fallen]] use their later body designs for their mainpics. It's the most prominent way they've appeared, same as Sideways and Fallen. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 00:40, 7 January 2013 (EST)
::The only reason Sideways has his Armada body at the top of the page is that there is no art of the RID body. His packaging image was a photo of his toy and he hasn't appeared in that body anywhere in fiction. The Fallen has his movie body because, well, it was our most popular page for a year or two, because of the movies, and so he was a special case. Regardless, a part of me is pretty okay with the Aligned guys having their Prime bodies at the top, ignoring all standards. That feels a lot different to me than the disambiguation parenthetical, which is there for organization, not for looks or presentation like the main image is. But my feelings are not super strong. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:31, 7 January 2013 (EST)
:::I think we should stick with the Prime images. I'm basically okay with the disambig change at this point after not being on board at first, but I think keeping their Prime main images will help mitigate the potential confusion or blurring of the lines that Aligned seems to always foster. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 05:09, 7 January 2013 (EST)
::::I think for the time being, Prime images make the most sense. ''Going into the future'', I think additional different-looking cartoons in the Aligned continuity would be a decent argument for returning to WFC bodies, because at that point they're simply one of many looks, instead of the less prominent of two. -[[User:LV|LV]] 11:49, 7 January 2013 (EST)

==Continuing spam==
With the spam continuing, even with captchas and email activation turned on, are we to assume that it's some actual poor bastards sitting there copypasting nonsense about handbags into pages? Would a possible solution be trivia-style verification questions? Something most TF fans would know, or could otherwise find out easily, but that a bored spammer would lack the initiative to find out? Like 'who is the Combaticon leader?' or 'what faction does Hound belong to?' and so on. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 14:57, 8 January 2013 (EST)
:''Are'' Captchas and email activation turned on? I'm not sure how they could be. These are obviously bots, and last I heard we'd only turned on the requirement to register before you can edit.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 15:05, 8 January 2013 (EST)
::Yeah, log out and check the account creation page, there's a reCAPTCHA thingmabob on there now. Sipher mentioned activation emails being turned on in the spam discusson further up the page, but looking at the sign-up page again, email isn't required, so I guess it can't be... [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 15:14, 8 January 2013 (EST)

::There are [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Anti-spam_features several simple steps] that would improve matters immediately and immensely - [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:TitleBlacklist TitleBlacklist] to block the likes of <nowiki>[[Talk:Something/]] and [[Talk:/Something]]</nowiki>, preventing users from creating User: pages with their first edit by requiring the Autoconfirmed permission to do so, adding a [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgSpamRegex $wgSpamRegex] to LocalSettings.php to prevent pages from being saved if they contain obvious trigger words like "viagra", "cialis", "online casino", "ugg boots" and so forth. They just aren't being used. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 19:20, 8 January 2013 (EST)

::reCaptcha is a piece of poop, security-wise. I'm also reluctant to add more extensions at the moment, due to performance issues, BUT. Find something simple and lightweight to REPLACE reCaptcha, and we can talk. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 05:38, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::$wgSpamRegex isn't an extension, it's a line of code you can add various banned words to (i.e., if "viagra" is in the list and someone tries to save a page that includes it, the page wouldn't save and they'd get a error message telling them why it wouldn't save. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:29, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::You know what WASN'T on? wgEmailConfirmToEdit. That may make a LOT more sense, as I'd wager that spambots aren't actually including legit emails. Email authentication is NOT the same thing. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 16:50, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

:I still don't think reCaptcha is helping, as noticed, and it doesn't have anything like, say, a lockout policy, so I've bit the bullet and added a modified version of the SpamBlacklist extension, adding in RBL support and some basic language filters in one go. It's reasonably light on DB traffic, too. Will it slow the flood? That remains to be seen, but they're still getting around it right now. I also think I've resolved the IP blocking issue, so we might (might!) be okay now. Turns out that adding a load balancer in front of the Squid caches hurts Mediawiki's IP detection logic. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 20:21, 16 January 2013 (EST)
::Alternate suggestion: could the system be modded to block an editor from creating an article until one of their edits is marked as patrolled (and thus approved as legitimate)?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 00:53, 24 March 2013 (EDT)

== We are moving very very soon. ==

That means at some point within the next few hours to few days the wiki will go to Read Only mode while McFly moves stuff around. Then we won't be hemorrhaging cash and things will run smoothly and we'll all have boners, even the ladies. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:12, 9 January 2013 (EST)
:I've got one right now! - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 17:23, 9 January 2013 (EST)

Okay, so, uh, what the hell happened? -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 00:43, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:We have moved. Some things are still being tweaked. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:46, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::Well, I knew we moved, just I thought nothing would look different. Oh, well. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 00:52, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::New Mediawiki software version. Some things got a little mixed up in the move, and newer versions decided to put the hammer down on bad practices. Other things are just... being refactored from a distinct lack of notes. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 01:43, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::Most of what's left is going to be us rejiggering some templates to more efficient code, and documenting the snot out of things so McFly doesn't name his first ulcer after us.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 02:02, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::: http://science.education.nih.gov/home2.nsf/Educational+ResourcesResource+FormatsOnline+Resources+High+School/928BAB9A176A71B585256CCD00634489 :p - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:25, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
:::::: Pedantry aside, I CAN name my migraines after you. Stress exacerbates THOSE. --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 20:05, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::::::: Which migraine's stronger then? Madness or little Sanity? :p - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 10:36, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

===Stuffs what have gone wrong(er)===
User CSS files aren't being called post-move. Basically, the stuff [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Configuration_settings#CSS.2FJs here] was previously all set true, now it's set false. [Is [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] even working?] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 07:25, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
: Compared old LocalSettings.php to new, wgUseSiteJs/wgUseSiteCss were NOT set over there. If you're not just making blanket assumptions, please point my not-MediaWiki-understanding ass to the right place. Remember, I built the house, but others (Scout? Derik?) actually laid out the rooms and installed the appliances. My understanding of Mediawiki extends out to "Ooh, shiny mediawiki package in apt repositories..." Anything else is a '''Wild. Ass. Guess.''' --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 20:05, 15 January 2013 (UTC)
::I'm not an expert ('''And I can't see the Wiki's LocalSettings.php myself to be sure!'''), but I have played around with MediaWiki a fair bit, so I'm beyond the "oh, shiny" stage and I know where to look at in http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Contents .
::For instance, I don't know what $wgAutoConfirmAge and $wgAutoConfirmCount are currrently set to. If the createpage and upload ''have'' been set, but those two variables are ''not'' set, a fairly minimal barrier would be two days & four edits before you can create pages and upload files - certainly, very few spambots will hang around for two whole days before editing!

<pre>
$wgAutoConfirmAge = 86400 * 2; # Two days times 86400 seconds/day
$wgAutoConfirmCount = 4;
</pre>

::If they HAVEN'T been set, you can add them with:
<pre>
# Only users with accounts in autoconfirmed group
# (registered accounts at least as old as $wgAutoConfirmAge and having at least as many edits as $wgAutoConfirmCount)
# can create pages:
$wgGroupPermissions['*' ]['createpage'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['user' ]['createpage'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['autoconfirmed']['createpage'] = true;

# Only users with accounts in autoconfirmed group
# (registered accounts at least as old as $wgAutoConfirmAge and having at least as many edits as $wgAutoConfirmCount)
# can upload files:
$wgGroupPermissions['*' ]['upload'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['user' ]['upload'] = false;
$wgGroupPermissions['autoconfirmed']['upload'] = true;
</pre>
::-[[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 10:36, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

===Broken templates===
{{tl|cal-date}} is broken, but I'm not template savvy enough to fix it. Anyone want to have a go? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 07:17, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
:Ja, I will fix it. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 00:15, 17 January 2013 (EST)
::$%^&* I'm getting ''closer'' to fixing it. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 15:02, 17 January 2013 (EST)
:::''*cries piteously*'' -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 15:43, 17 January 2013 (EST)
::::I've just had a go and I think that's sorted it! Not sure if there are any other broken templates lurking out there... --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:58, 20 January 2013 (EST)
===Storylink===
Are the storylinks looking odd for anyone else? They appear as full size text without the surrounding box from before for me. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 12:29, 20 January 2013 (EST)
:Yeah, storylinks, note boxes, disambig boxes, organisation templates (eg. listing comics issues) and episode/issue/etc. infoboxes are all not displaying correctly. I assume that the folks who know what they're doing with this kind of stuff are working on getting them fixed.. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 12:42, 20 January 2013 (EST)
::I think that's done it - or at least it's displaying normally for me now. Well done to all involved, much appreciated. --[[User:Emvee|Emvee]] 17:04, 22 January 2013 (EST)

== Still Confused About All This ==

I just got registered so that I can always find this site.

When I search for Transformers Wiki, all I get is Teletraan 1 and I don't like that site as well. Heck, their information on BotShots is woefully unsatisfactory.

Did this site used to be that site or the other way around? Much of the information in articles looks copied from one site or the other.

Apologies if this is the wrong place to ask these questions. I was looking for an e-mail address or something and couldn't find it. {{unsigned|Haven13}}
:No worries! We were originally at Wikia, but split with them in September 2008 and went independent. Wikia are still operating the old version, but it doesn't get updated in a lot of areas.
:Where is it you're searching for Transformers Wiki? We come up first on Google when I search on there. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:16, 23 January 2013 (EST)
::Ooh! Ooh! Let me guess! BING. (Who are blocked for '''hammering''' our wee servers.) --[[User:McFly|McFly]] 23:52, 23 January 2013 (EST)
:::Well, I just searched for "transformers wiki" on bing.com and we were the first result. Followed by the wikia site, wikipedia's main Transformers page, and wikipedia's Transformers (film) page. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 07:01, 24 January 2013 (EST)

== Key things missing from toy sections on character pages ==

There are a couple of things most toy sections don't have that would probably be useful:
* a link to the page about the toyline - some articles have it, but they don't seem to be the majority.
* for characters who've been more than one faction in fiction, knowing what faction their toy was sold as would be useful, especially if the toyline's page isn't split into Autobots and Decepticons.
Just a couple of ideas. --[[User:Flicky1991|Flicky1991]] 16:45, 2 February 2013 (EST)
:More than once I have thought a link to the toyline would be handy. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 21:31, 2 February 2013 (EST)

== New Theme ==

So, according to Hasbro, basically the entire new theme of the Transformers brand is now Beast Hunters. So why not change the wiki theme from Animated to Beast Hunters? Just a suggestion,if people don't like it, whatever. -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 12:15, 10 February 2013 (EST)
:That's a good idea. Even if not Beast Hunters specifically, a Prime-related theme would make more sense than Animated now, considering it's been a couple of years. --[[User:Flicky1991|Flicky1991]] 12:43, 10 February 2013 (EST)
:Yeah, sounds awesome! I'm in favor of a TFP theme, when do we change? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:42, 4 November 2013 (EST)

== Trivia/notes sections ==

While I have nothing against a "trivia" or "notes" section (we are not Wikipedia, after all), it is my opinion that such a section should really only contain general notes about the article's subject that are either really trivial, or too general to fit into any specific paragraph. In particular, a noteworthy two-line bit regarding a specific toy in an article about a character with multiple toys might better fit into the specific toy's entry. For example, if the toy had a prototype that was very different from the final toy, the toy's entry isn't very long and the info about the prototype doesn't fill the page either, it could better be added to the toy's entry (since it's actual information about the toy, and its design process), rather than treating it as marginal trivia that is ostracized from the main portion of the article. Likewise, informative notes about fictional appearances of a character and after-the-fact retcons that affect the general perception of said character are better added as notes to the specific fiction writeup, rather than shoving it into the "notes" ghetto. So simply put: Short notes that are directly related to a specific part of the article might better be placed in that very part, rather than in an inflated catch-all "notes" section. Thoughts?--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 15:45, 16 February 2013 (EST)

== Proposal to rename an article. ==

Hi, I'm proposing that the article "Brick Springhorn" be renamed to "Brick Springstern". Because of an error in the original comic, the character was given both names at various points during the story. A radio announcer called him "Springstern" and an editorial caption said he was "Springhorn". Usually, I'd agree with calling him "Springhorn". We can rationalise the mistake by saying the announcer was mistaken or drunk or something, and of course "Springhorn" is just a damn funny name. Except...

In the recent IDW reprint (which I was re-reading today), they have corrected the error, and he's now called "Springstern" throughout the comic. (Similar to how the IDW reprints corrected the Sherman Dam / Boulder Dam mistake).

Given that "Springstern" is now his name throughout the most recent printing, I'd suggest that most readers trying to look up the character will type "Springstern" into the search box. I know the redirect is in place, but I feel that maybe it should now be the other way round, with 'Horn' redirecing to a main article located at 'Stern'.

Advice and opinion welcome! --[[User:Ryan Frost|Ryan Frost]] 17:55, 14 March 2013 (EDT)
:This is terrible news, because you're probably right, and I hate it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:01, 14 March 2013 (EDT)

== Database dump ==

Hello! In my region I have a bit of an internet connection issue so I'm using WikiTaxi for offline wikia browsing. Since tfwiki is based on wikimedia system I was wondering if a database dump of current pages could possibly be generated for download? I see that it currently doesn't exist on your special: statistics page. I'd rather avoid any mirroring software as it would no doubt cause issues with the site so I hope someone can help with this.

Thank you in advance,

[[User:NocteDraconis|NocteDraconis]]
:I can't help personally, but it might be worth also posting this over in the [http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=83287 TFWiki discussion thread] on the Allspark board, it's frequented by several of the sysops/technical-know-how guys from here. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 09:05, 27 March 2013 (EDT)

:Thank you for pointing me in the right direction :)Though, I do hope someone will take notice of the question here as well. [[User:NocteDraconis|NocteDraconis]] 15:12, 27 March 2013 (EDIT)

== Proposing New Continuity Term for Multipath Books ==

Hi, I've been working on the first six Find Your Fate Junior books since I joined about a month ago, and just finished a summary for [[Dinobots Strike Back]]. While I'm still revising it, I just began editing relevant info into character pages, and starting with Starscream's, I found I needed a new term to explain how paths within the same book relate to each other without using the word "book". I didn't see anything that applies to this in the Continuities page, so I began referring to each individual book as its own "micro-continuity nexus". I think this is necessary to clarify that each book has its own tangle of paths which don't carry over to other books in the series, even though the books in that particular series are numbered by Ballantine.

For example, when moving from that first book onto Starscream's actions in [[Battle Drive]], I'd begin the first paragraph with: "In the next adjacent micro-continuity nexus, Starscream and Blitzwing were on a strafing-run to torch farmland, when..." since "later" isn't true with no possible book-to-book continuity, but I need to indicate that the summaries are moving on to the next book beyond just the storylinks in that section of the character page.

Please let me know if there's a better, established term I should be using for this phenomenon. Perhaps some term applied to video games with alternate endings? I don't know jack about TFVGs, and haven't studied those pages yet. I intend to add all relevant content from Dinobots Strike Back to the character pages soon, while it's still fresh in my mind, so please let me know if I'm at risk of muddying them up with a nonsensical term. [[User:Bumblevivisector|Bumblevivisector]] 23:49, 4 May 2013 (EDT)
: A couple years ago [[User:Hooper_X/SANDBALLS/Example_character_article/Games|I was trying to figure out how to describe video games with multiple playable characters, different endings, etc.]] and was leaning towards considering each individual path a [[splinter timeline]]. But that's just me and nobody else ever looked at what I came up with. So. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 12:51, 14 May 2013 (EDT)
::Yeah, I've gotten the impression that no one will say anything about others' sandboxes, but might once something's actually implemented and becomes a potential problem. I agree that "splinter" is as good a term as "path", and I see now that even the splinter page could use some work; seems like [[Earthforce]] should be mentioned as the first ''possible'' splinter, setting the precedent for the other Marvel examples listed, but that was likely a touchy subject for tending to veer into endless speculation.

::Your example looked like a workable outline, but I don't know enough about different TF games to visualize in detail how it'd apply. Have there been any two TF games with continuity that retroactively makes one possible outcome the "real" ending? (non-TF ex: Mortal Kombat II stating Johnny Cage beat Goro) "Nexus" just seems like the best word for a clump of splinters that all have equal weight, continuity-wise (one game, one book).[[User:Bumblevivisector|Bumblevivisector]] 19:11, 14 May 2013 (EDT)
:::How much of the [[splinter timeline]] article is from sources? Is that term actually used? If so, I think it would be best to keep with it. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 20:22, 14 May 2013 (EDT)
::::Oh, I just meant that the article looked like it could use a few more examples of splinters, assuming the word was most relevant as a descriptive fan term. If it's only documenting uses of "splinter" from official sources, then forget it. As long as no one's objecting to terms I'm using in FYF books and character page subsections, I'll just keep using them until I'm done documenting the first 6 books and worry about the wiki's broader terminology later.

::::Since they're classified as "multipath adventures", I'll usually just say "path" or "outcome" to indicate that they're all viable options with the same canonical weight, since "splinter" ''could'' imply either a timeline-shifting cataclysm, or that the splinter is inferior to a "main" timeline that far more fans are familiar with, a principle which would just inject fan-judgement into these particular books. [[User:Bumblevivisector|Bumblevivisector]] 21:16, 14 May 2013 (EDT)

== Holy grails and Want list need to be more visible. ==

Judging by just how long Jake/Stingray has been on the want list, these two things need to be more visible. Many people visiting the wiki probably don't even visit the home page let alone scroll down far enough to read those two little boxes.
Would it be possible to do something like the Go! boxes for them? [[User:RavenG|RavenG]] 02:40, 14 May 2013 (EDT)

So nobody else thinks something like this would be good?[[User:RavenG|RavenG]] 08:58, 2 June 2013 (EDT)
:I think the problem is more likely that no one has the items in question than that they need to be more visible. Most of those things are very obscure. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:37, 2 June 2013 (EDT)
:: All the more reason it should be more visible. The more people that know to look for this stuff, the more chances there are of actually finding it.[[User:RavenG|RavenG]] 01:51, 5 June 2013 (EDT)
::: It's second from the top, just below the Featured Article. It's more visible than 90% of the rest of the frontpage. And finding Holy Grails is NOT more important than showcasing our good content that we actually have. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:04, 5 June 2013 (EDT)

== Seen this? ==
[http://lmb3.net/2013/04/18/3633/ More info than you ever thought you'd need about the Ziploc TFTM iron-on promotion.] This all should be wiki'd up by someone. Possibly me. 09:51, 17 May 2013 (EDT) (look at that 100 million dollar growth in the first year - that's like ''Angry Birds'' levels of success.)

== Left-hand menu ==

FOC and Prime - the Game have been and gone by now, so we can probably take them off there. It's probably a bit early to put Transformers 4 on. Maybe we could put links to the MTMTE and RID comics? Is Transformers: Legends high-profile enough that a link on the menu would be useful? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 22:31, 21 May 2013 (EDT)
:Anyone else have an opinion? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 21:34, 27 May 2013 (EDT)
::I'd be down with MTMTE and RID on the sidebar, considering the level of popularity IDW's stuff is currently enjoying in the fandom. Legends is probably high-profile enough, but our article for it ''is'' still sporting a stub template, and I'd reckon that most people looking for information on the game will end up at the specialised Wikia rather than here. Once we get closer to 2014, I'd suggest we might subsequently want Thrilling 30 (once we have a page up) and Transformers 4 on there. [[User:Jalaguy|Jalaguy]] 04:54, 28 May 2013 (EDT)

== Spam filter acting up ==

Japanese Wikipedia is being blocked by our spam filter. Can it be whitelisted? [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 20:42, 3 June 2013 (EDT)
:The spam filter is blocking all external links at the moment. I've given it a poke, but because of the caching we do, it may take a few hours before it comes right. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 21:15, 3 June 2013 (EDT)

== New Category ==

Have we considered adding a category for characters that debuted in fiction before receiving a toy? As in, no toy was in production at the time they first appeared, but it was eventually made. I've noticed the number of examples growing lately, with [[Straxus (G1)|Straxus]], [[Grindcore (G1)|Grindcore]], [[Drift (G1)|Drift]], [[Nightstalker]], [[Wipe-Out]], the Female Autobots, [[Dion]], [[Hauler]], [[Devcon]]...

Can't think of a way to phrase it, though. "Fiction First characters"? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 10:31, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
:[http://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?ns14=1&search=Original&title=Special%3ASearch&fulltext=Advanced+search&fulltext=Advanced+search Precedent] suggests Cat:Fiction-original characters, with Comic-original and Cartoon-original subcategories. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 11:52, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
::But there's already a Fiction-Only characters category (with Comic- and Cartoon-only subcategories). So Fiction-original would therefore encompass Comic-original and Cartoon-original sub-categories, plus a Fiction-Only subcategory with Comic- and Cartoon-only as sub-subcategories? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 21:53, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
:::Sure. That would make, e.g., [[:Category:Comic-only characters]] a (direct) subcategory of both Cat:Fiction-only and Cat:Comic-original. (NB: There are, of course, more possibilities than comic- and cartoon-. I just picked them up as the most frequent) - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 23:00, 10 June 2013 (EDT)
::::I'm curious, would you include such characters as G1 Shockwave, G1 Reflector, and the casts of ''Animated'' and ''Prime''? Why or why not? - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 13:54, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
:::::In Shockwave and Reflector's cases, the toy was made first despite the character actually appearing first, so it's hard to judge, but I'd be inclined not to put them in the category, although I see why others would disagree. I don't know about the ''Animated'' situation, but the ''Prime'' show was made well before any toys were, so they certainly belong there. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:01, 11 June 2013 (EDT)

Yeah, I think this gets pretty hinky when you consider that to be technically correct we'd have to apply it in ''every'' instance where the fiction debuted before the toys did, regardless of whether toys were planned all along and it was just a quirk of release order.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 14:21, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
: Shouldn't it be a case of who developed it first? Dion was developed for fiction and then later turned into a toy (much later). Where a toy is designed and developed and then turns up in fiction (even if this is aired/ released before the toy is released) it was originally developed as toy. The Shockwave et al issue is easy to resolve if you forget about whether they were a transformer toy or not and focus on whether they were a toy or not. Here the character model for fiction is based on a toy, it is an artistic representation of something filtered through the necessities of the medium in which appears along with aesthetic considerations. Where a character is developped for fiction first the starting point is the characterization, personality, needs of the story etc. It is a different creative process. You have to consider if we have toy designers going for show accuracy or illustrators going for toy accuracy (or in some cases not worrying about accuracy at all). I do think the category tells us something about the creative process that has gone into each character/ toy especially where the dates on release as toy/ fiction are similar. I agree though that it could be a potential minefield and we will need source/ link information to back up which category each character would go in..... [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 14:48, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
The above is why I wanted to be clear on the wording. I'm thinking ONLY about characters who were first introduced in fiction at a time when there were no official plans to produce a toy of them...not characters whose first appearance in fiction just happened to beat their toy to release. --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 15:56, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
:Because if you split hairs that fine, it becomes an increasingly meaningless distinction relative to our existing categories. A category ought to be relatively simple to apply. Ideally it should be obvious without even needing to go to the category's page to read the description.--[[User:Rosicrucian|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 19:02, 11 June 2013 (EDT)
::It seems fairly simple to me - toys don't pop up out of nowhere, there are catalogue solicitations, ToyFairs, adverts and so forth that happen months before toys are/were released. To be "Fiction-original", the point would be to demonstrate that they weren't planned as a toy at any point around the release of the comic/etc (and we know it takes yoinks to develop a toy - diverging from actual original characters for the sake of examples - IDW Stealth Bomber Megatron and IDW muscle car Bumblebee were both fiction-original designs, and the not-quite-accurate toys took so long to develop and schedule that both announced after the IDW characters had *stopped* using those bodies! Whereas "Goldfire Bumblebee" may not have been officially announced before RiDW #18 came out, but is anyone in any doubt that the design was toy-first?) If in doubt, leave it out. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 15:01, 19 June 2013 (EDT)

== Gallery space ==

I know that the majority of this would already be covered on the fiction articles, and we want the wiki to have an organic and fun read to it, rather than being tables and lists, but would it be acceptable to add a gallery space for stuff like depicting the various designs and robot/alt mode pairs? For example, when reading about G1 Bumblebee in IDW having umpteen different designs, I kind of want to be able to see an exhaustive list pointing out each design and saying where it's from. Since this would be a separate namespace, it wouldn't clutter up the fiction articles, and might actually relieve some pressure to add a screenshot to the fiction articles just because it depicts a design or mode that no interesting screenshots had depicted.

This could also be expanded into interesting screenshots themselves, or for the Japanese series, animated gifs depicting named attacks. Something similar to [http://digimon.wikia.com/wiki/Gallery:Greymon this] or [http://digimon.wikia.com/wiki/Gallery:Ravemon this].

Suggestions and objections welcome, and if you guys aren't interested in this but know of a fansite that already does it, please bring it up as well, as this kind of obsessive categorizing is what I live for.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 14:55, 14 June 2013 (EDT)

== tales of the beast hunters chapter 22 sharkticon megatron ==

chapter 21 vertebreak

Chapter 22 (Sharkticon Megatron)

chapter 23 night shadow bumblebee

someone add this to tales of the beast hunters thanks {{unsigned|Jazz-meister}}
:This is copyvio, right? Don't we need to delete this?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 20:04, 14 June 2013 (EDT)
::It's not really a good place for it, no... --[[User:Abates|abates]] 21:18, 14 June 2013 (EDT)

== Romanizations of purely Japanese names ==

It has come to my attention that the way this Wiki romanizes Transformer names that are purely Japanese in origin (such as for [[Shouki|Shōki]], each member of the [[Dinoforce]], the recent [[Gan'ō]], etc.) feels a bit at odds with how we also handle official name spellings. Generally speaking, we tend to go with the names that are official, and seem to only really diverge from this if there's something inherently wrong with the official spellings, right? Well, for the aforementioned examples, each of them has an official spelling of their names written in English, yet this Wiki seems to forgo those official spellings for some reason and instead opts for a different spelling of each. My question is, if we have an official spelling of a purely Japanese name, and there seems to be little-to-nothing wrong with said official spelling, then why don't we always use it?, For Shōki, for instance, we've gone with spelling his name as such despite official packaging material with his toy spelling his name as "Shouki" in English. Similar cases also apply for the Dinoforce members and Gan'ō, as well. The only exception to this I can think of that we do use is "Ginrai", whose name would be more straightforwardly Romanized as "Jinrai", but we went with "Ginrai" due to official sources spelling his name with a G. So what makes Ginrai special enough for him to use the official spelling over the straight Romanization spelling?<br>
Now, I'm not suggesting that we switch every single romanized purely Japanese name out of the Hepburn style that we use. On the contrary, I think we should at least continue to utilize the current Hepburn style for names that have no official spelling in English whatsoever, or at least for those who haven't had theirs revealed yet. But for those who have (Shouki, the Dinoforce, Ganoh, etc.), I ponder as to why we don't just use what is official if what's official is indeed a decently acceptable alternative to what ths Wiki uses. I mean, there is precedence in us using the official spellings since we use "Ginrai" over "Jinrai". Why, we even use "Dinoforce" when the box and fiction both clearly say "Kyoryu Sentai" (Dinosaur Squadron/Taskforce) in Japanese. So what's been stopping us from using the official names for the non-Ginrai Japanese word TF names? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 01:08, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
:Part of the problem I feel here is evokes the "Spell My Name With An S" trope, and part trying to keep the spirit of the name's original meaning. For example, "Dinoforce" from "Kyoryu Sentai" feels more... real in English, I suppose, as contrast to someone actually writing out "Dinosaur Squadron/Taskforce". "Dinoforce" has that sense of quirkiness but it still carries the meaning without loosing too much. Sometimes, the official spelling that Takara uses just seems odd ([[Mirage (G1)|Ligier]]/[[Engrish#Deliberate Engrish|Rijie]] or [[Rartorata]], anyone?), and other times the name only makes sense if you have a passable grasp of the language. <sub>(The arguments I could bring up from subbing toku. Then of course, someone else could argue about "sentai" that used in the Super Sentai series...)</sub> --[[User:Lonegamer78|Lonegamer78]] 01:52, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
::I'm fine with us using "Dinoforce". I was just pointing it out as an example of us using an official spelling over a more literal one. Same with "Ginrai" vs. "Jinrai". But, what I'm really getting at is why we use spellings like "Shōki", "Gōryū", "Gan'ō", etc. when there are official TakaraTomy spellings of these as "[http://tftechspecs.com/pics2/12668.jpg Shouki]", "[http://tftechspecs.com/pics2/12710.jpg Goryu]", [https://twitter.com/tagoal/status/345702332438302720/photo/1 Ganoh]", etc. that feel just as valid as alternatives to what we currently use. (Not to mention easier to type.) This inquiry mostly stems from the discussion on [[Talk:Gan'ō|Gan'ō's talk page]], and raises the question as to why we don't use the official spellings in cases like these when there doesn't seem to be that much, if anything at all, inherently wrong with those spellings. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 09:53, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
:::Look, there's pretty much one reason we do it this way - Interrobang's unconquerable boner for the Japanese language. He pushed for it, and the reason it wound up happening is the same reason that right now nobody is taking on this argument against it. Because '''''nobody caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaares.''''' And nobody wants to have to go through changing everything again. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 15:12, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
::::In other words, "Sabrblade, have at it." - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 17:27, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
:::::Basically. I should point out I pretty much NEVER see Japanese use of English letters actually involving macrons and blardeeblar. And if we can get rid of a lot of that shit on the wiki, I'll be... well, I dunno about ''happy'', but less aggravated. I am 100% in favor of using the given romanization when it's obviously not incorrect. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 13:49, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
::At least going forward, I personally support the "use the romanization given" initiative, unless it gets as bad as Minelba.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:13, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
::::I'm all for consistency with the Japanese packaging when it's basically the same pronunciation. -[[User:LV|LV]] 18:51, 18 June 2013 (EDT)
Very well, then. Interrobang, huh? Figures. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:25, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
:Erg, just hit a speedbump. Tried to move Shōki's page to "Shouki", but it won't let me. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 11:17, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
::It's because there's already a page, redirecting to Shōki. An admin will have to delete the Shouki page. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 11:47, 19 June 2013 (EDT)
Can an admin delete the Dinoforce redirects? All of them have history, so I can't move them over. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 10:51, 20 June 2013 (EDT)
:There's still [[Būpink]], [[Pīpō]], and [[Kōmoribreast]], but I can't find any official romanizations, so I guess they stay where they are? [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 13:22, 20 June 2013 (EDT)
::Yeah, I'd say we can stick with the Hepburn style Romanizations for names/terms that haven't official been spelled in English yet (or unless there is something genuinely and inherently wrong with its English spelling).
::Also, thanks a bunch for helping out with this. I started to, but I got stuck when the redirects needed to be deleted first, and then came the TF: The Ride grand opening in Orlando that I was in attendance of, which took a lot of my time away from the Internet. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 20:29, 21 June 2013 (EDT)
:::No problem. Happy to help. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 22:31, 21 June 2013 (EDT)
Should real people be included in this? According to the talk page, [[Yūki Ōshima]] is generally credited as Yuki Ohshima. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 06:29, 25 June 2013 (EDT)
:I should think so. I know he's not relevant to our wiki, but [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasuhiro_Nightow Yasuhiro Nightow] is pretty specific about his name's Romanization, and I'd think there would be other people who had put thought into it. -[[User:LV|LV]] 09:28, 25 June 2013 (EDT)
::I'd say that, if there are real Japanese people who have their names spelled a particular way officially (in English letters), then by all means, let us reflect that. If they don't, however, we can just keep them in the Hepburn style. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 12:49, 25 June 2013 (EDT)
:The [[Yuki Ohshima]] page already exists... can someone remove it, please? --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:41, 28 June 2013 (EDT)
::[[Yuki Ohshima]] is still there. Also, [[Shaoshao Li (KP)|Shaoshao Li]] is officially spelt "Syaosyao Li", so we should probably treat her the way we treat the Japanese ones to be consistent. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 05:59, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
:::Deleted! There's a {{tl|tobedeleted}} template you can put on pages, BTW. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 07:11, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
::::Thanks, I didn't know! --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 07:37, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
:::::No problem. I think there should probably be some debate before moving Shaoshao as I get the impression from the talk page that it's another Minelba type situation possibly? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:26, 1 August 2013 (EDT)
::::::It is, and the page went through a LOT of romanization revisions before we settled on where it is now. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 17:04, 1 August 2013 (EDT)

== DuckDuckGo ==

Could whoever-has-FTP-access unblock [https://duckduckgo.com/duckduckbot DuckDuckBot] in http://tfwiki.net/robots.txt, please. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 13:59, 22 June 2013 (EDT)

== Robot ==

I was quite surprised to see we don't have an article about robots in general! There are robots other than Cybertronians in ''Transformers'', both man-made and natural lifeforms. We probably should have an article summing up the different types - after all, we do have an article on [[alien]]s. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 09:42, 28 June 2013 (EDT)

== Archives ==

Do we have a way of searching the archives, other than just manually opening them and looking through each and every one? --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 14:53, 2 July 2013 (EDT)
:You can restrict a search to the "Transformers Wiki talk" namespace, which usually works for me. At one point we had a form to do it at the top of this page. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:54, 2 July 2013 (EDT)

== Disambiguation pages and parsing ==

If the names on a disambiguation page differ in parsing, should the page name follow the initial use or the most common use? See [[Heavytread (disambiguation)]] and [[Knockout (disambiguation)]] for examples. The first case is at the most common form while the second is at the first used form. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 11:54, 3 July 2013 (EDT)
:There is [[Help:Disambiguation#Disambiguation pages|no policy]] that I can find. I would say it makes little difference, unless one of the forms was well recognized and the other was super obscure. Otherwise it is six of one, half dozen of the other. Not worth moving pages over. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 19:41, 3 July 2013 (EDT)
::I would agree it doesn't make much difference. Most of the time people are going to arrive there via redirection from a link whose text has the parsing that they're looking for. Only we Wiki editors are likely to go straight to a disambig and we already know what the other parsings are. I don't think the parsing is going to hinder anyone in trying to find the page. --[[User:Tigerpaw28|Tigerpaw28]] 21:00, 3 July 2013 (EDT)

== Wiki content used in official materials, again. ==
So ''Transformers Legends'' just put out a Doctor Arkeville card, and the character bio is a truncated version of the Wiki introduction. "DR. ARKEVILLE is a self-proclaimed evil genius who often allies himself with the DECEPTICONS. Like all mad scientists, he has designs to rule the planet Earth.... however, his success rate is sorely lacking." It doesn't MATTER or anything, but it seemed strangely familiar. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 09:13, 9 July 2013 (EDT)
:Derik checked a while back and found a whole ton of the Legends bios were copied from here.[http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=83287&view=findpost&p=2310050] I think the conclusion was we weren't going to worry about it too much. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 19:18, 9 July 2013 (EDT)

== Sizes ==

I brought this up on the [[Talk:Scale|scale talk page]] but got no response. Basically, for a wiki that tries to include as much as possible, tfwiki doesn't really address the sizes of the toys. For someone who's never actually bought any toys, terms like "Deluxe" and "Mega", or "Small Headmaster" and "Large Headmaster", or "Autobot Car" and "Mini Vehicle", aren't useful for telling how tall the toys actually are. Pretty much the only place this is addressed is the pages for the original Fort Max and the new Metroplex, which actually have numbers (22" and 24"), and seem to be the only place on the wiki where this is addressed, despite articles on both [[Scale]] and [[Size class]]. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 11:00, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
:I don't think an "average size" has ever been calculated for a deluxe. Look at the current Beast Hunters line, Starscream is quite a bit smaller than Ripclaw. As far as I know, size classes aren't really about the size of the toy but of the ''packaging''. Any deluxe figures should fit in the same shelf/peg space as any other. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 11:22, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
::That way lies madness. There's been enough fandom beardwringing about "shrinking/growing deluxes" for a lifetime. Let's not fall into that trap. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 13:40, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
::Khajidha, that's the sort of thing I'm talking about. Nothing on the wiki actually indicates how tall any of these toys are. You mention ''Beast Hunters'' Starscream, but all it says on his page is that that toy is "shorter than his First Edition toy". As far as I'm concerned, he could be anything from a couple of inches to over a foot! Everything just seems to be described in terms of other toys - as another example, the original Omnibots are only described as being "shorter than Autobot Cars". I'm not asking for a true average size - just enough to have some point of reference. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:25, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I think actual measuements would be useful. You would need to standardise what you measure (i.e. from the feet to the top of the head or to the highest point on the toy - not always the same, and determine whether this included any removable weapons/ accesories). We should probably limit the amount of info to stop it turning into an unnecessarily long list (you don't need height to head, shoulders and cannon where these are progressively taller for example). I'd also like to see both metric and imperial measurements, it's odd that the only system we seem to have is in imperial when metric would make more sense to me, I suppose both is better than choosing one or the other. It's a mammoth task though and I'm not sure it could ever be completed. If we start we will have to live with a degree on inconsistency. [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 13:54, 17 July 2013 (EDT)
:So, what if you can stretch their arms up in the air, or they can hold accessories in an unmarked position (maybe on their back?)
:Eh...I think it would be, at best, reasonable to measure them with no accessories in the pose depicted in the instructions.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:15, 17 July 2013 (EDT)
:: Ok, I've added height info for [[Prowl (G1)/toys| Prowl]]. I'm not going to add any more yet until I get some feedback on whether the format I've used is acceptable. What do you guys think? [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 09:30, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I think that if this is to go forward, that the length of the altmode is of more interest than its height in most cases. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:43, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
Figuring out the format should be done on a delete-able "sandbox" page rather than on a "live" one. And honestly, I'm still unsold on the usefulness of the info. But I'll humor for now...<br>
:* ''Dimensions'': ??in / ??cm (robot height), ??in / ??cm (vehicle length)<br>
This does bring up the question of how many dimensions to measure, and how to non-clunkily add it. It kind of feels like if you're going to actually put a numbered measurement down, just picking ONE dimension is insufficient... or to put it another way, you halfassed the job. Go full height/width/depth or go home. Toys with multiple altmodes present bigger problems of readability; the more numbers, the more boring a morass the entry becomes. (THIS kind of thing is why you sandbox format changes rather than put them on live pages.) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:57, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
:Ok but halfassed is a bit harsh, three quartersassed perhaps... I'm not sure about sandboxing so for Prowl
''Dimensions'': 10.5 cm/ 4⅛ in (robot height), 11.3cm/ 4⅜ in (vehicle length)
As for the reason to do it we can't assume everyone visiting the Wiki is a Transformers expert, you or I might understand 'about the same size as the 1984 Autobot Cars' but not every visitor will. The casual fan or even parent looking for information regarding what present to buy a child might really appreciate this. You also have to consider that the secondary market is now huge and this info isn't always present, you would expect this wiki to be able to fill in that gap. As a public service information provider we have to consider that not everyone has our background knowledge and be just as informative to the novice as we are to the expert, otherwise we are in danger of becoming a jargonistic clique who only provide for ourselves. In the same way I think we should also add difficulty rating as stated on the box (where present). If you consider the potential audience in its entirity I think the case for size information is obvious. [[User:Mister Jazzz|Mister Jazz]] 08:30, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::In that case, why not just do weight? It's not going to be changed by altmode, it's easy to measure, and you'd have a reasonable idea of scale from the weight; besides, the precision of exact size isn't really going to matter unless you're putting it in a display case, and in that case you're almost certainly a collector who understands size classes. Casual fans or parents just looking for a toy to play with aren't going to need precise measurements of size.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 08:44, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
:::Weight would vary too much due to the density of the materials. A mostly diecast figure may have the same mass as a MUCH larger modern figure with the thin plastic panels they use now. Robot height and altmode length are probably the most relevant measures for most figures. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:30, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::::Yeah, weight is definitely not a thing we need to measure. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:54, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::Any non-TF-fan parent looking to our wiki for toy purchasing information is already well and truly fucked. We really ''aren't'' a good resource for casual kid-toy purchase information for non-fans at all... I mean, just look at Movie Bumblebee's toy page. What parent is gonna wanna dig through all that to find their kid's birthday toy? (Never mind that the toy information is one of the ''last'' things we present; we handle their fiction first.) That demographic is gonna go to TRU's website and see what's available now, assuming they web-shop that way at all. And as pointed out, they most certainly aren't going to need precise measurements.
:: For "casual" fans, I think they have enough prior experience with toys to know the rough sizes most TFs fall under per given class (standard largish action figure range is the most common). For the more advanced fan who might conceivably need dimensions... then yes, width and depth are as relevant as height, if not moreso. Height doesn't play into stuffing robot-mode guys onto a display shelf anywhere as much as how much horizontal space a toy takes up... and frankly numbers are nothing next to just plain old physical trial-and-error on that score.
::As for difficulty ratings... that's a whole other can of worms. Hasbro's own ratings are horsehockey; they rated conversions mostly by size-class, not actual difficulty. At this point, that's basically giving out ''mis''information. And giving subjective difficulty ratings... less than ideal. Some people ''don't'' find RiD Side Burn or the Alternators unfun morasses of panel-massaging.
::And as for "jargonistic clique who only provide for ourselves"... you do know what site you're on, don't you? This is akin to accusing TVtropes of not being a good resource for people who want to get into a TV show they've not seen but have heard about. We are, ultimately, not a resource for people who kinda sorta maybe think Transformers are okay, but for people keen on digging into the guts of the franchise, the nitty-gritty, the obscure, the corners not often seen. We are very much a metaphorical rabbit hole; by design and intent we run far deeper than anyone on the outside would need. And yes, sometimes we DON'T provide info by choice... like the exact box-back bios and tech-spec numbers, but we DO provide links to places that you can get those if you really want them. The latter we don't provide because we could find no non-clunky-and-horrible way to present said info, which is very much a problem with measurements... which brings us back to the start. We'd pretty much have to provide ''all'' relevant dimensions to be of actual use to the people who'd conceivably need that kind of information, and presenting that in a way that's not clunky is a major issue. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:54, 24 July 2013 (EDT)

== Foreign Localization placement - again!!! ==

Said it on the page for the 1984 cartoon, will say it again here: the Foreign Localization section for cartoon episodes needs to go at the very bottom. It makes no sense to go from factoids (notes, etc.) to a list of names, then back to factoids (Trivia). Disrupts the flow of the page, buries the trivia, looks bad. -- [[User:Repowers|Repowers]] 17:51, 16 July 2013 (EDT)
:I've had this thought a couple of times. It seems like it would be more naturally placed below Trivia with the home video releases. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:41, 21 July 2013 (EDT)

== Some Transformer Knock-off cartoon ==

We have some Transformer-Knock-off cartoon made by china ( Not a big deal huh how about they use that cartoon charracter toy make them loke idiot cut and turn it into "Transformer Gobot Toyline )
Here the Final Episode
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tI5fXIJY5_U

To Story:

Some stupid kid play games about Transoformer and get sucked into the game world who Transoformer get seperate into 2 side Animal ( Deceticon ) and Vehicle ( Autobot )

Vehicle: With 6 Clan Car,Police Car,Hellicopter,Bulldozer,Jeep ( They are Extinct only the stongest guy alive ),Jet and one extra Bike ( Only One ) ( Clan i mean they Fucking look like the Same Fucking Guy only the Officer on specific clan have different Color that mean they use the Same Fucking Model to make Hundred Guy )

Animal: Only 3 : Jaguar,Gorilla ( Only the leader the infanry are Rat but they look like the mech from Battle Tech Series ) and Dragon

== Korean, not Indonesian ==

The Indonesian foreign names of many of the Transformers are written in Korean. Why? They use a completely different script. I can't distinguish whether someone just phoneticized Indonesian names and have written them in Korean, or if they're Korean names and someone just mislabeled them as Indonesian. (I think I see examples of both, although I only have a passing familiarity with Indonesian so I'm not sure.) --[[User:Noviere|Noviere]] 14:23, 18 July 2013 (EDT)
:The one that you changed was added by Andreanromanky18, I guess we should review all of the others that he/she has added. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:43, 18 July 2013 (EDT)
::[http://id.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grimlock Indonesia Wikipedia] shows most of the characters have the same name as they do in English. [http://ko.wikipedia.org/wiki/%ED%8A%B8%EB%9E%9C%EC%8A%A4%ED%8F%AC%EB%A8%B8_%EB%8D%94_%EB%AC%B4%EB%B9%84 Korean Wikipedia] had Grimlock's name written differently. Hrm. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:36, 18 July 2013 (EDT)

== Grouping American/Japanese divergent fiction ==

I'm trying to standardize the G1 cartoon fiction sections, particularly when characters have both American and Japanese histories. For larger characters like [[Kup (G1)#Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Kup]] we have a big "''Generation 1 cartoon continuity''" masthead, with "''The Transformers cartoon''" underneath, some micro-continuities, and "''Japanese cartoon continuity''", which has its own sub-sections. On the other hand, we've got [[Hound (G1)|Hound]] with a "G1cc" heading, and all the Japanese sections as equal to "''The Transformers cartoon''" instead of under a "Jcc" header. I think Hound should have (1st tier) "G1cc", (2nd) "''The Transformers cartoon''" & "Jcc", (3rd) the various Japanese fictions.

There's also some discrepancies between characters that only appeared after [[The Return of Optimus Prime, Part 2|TROOP]], where American and Japanese continuity completely diverged. [[Pointblank]] has a "G1cc" header that includes "''The Transformers cartoon''" and "''The Headmasters cartoon''". [[Chromedome (G1)|Chromedome]], however, has "''The Transformers cartoon''" (and Wings as a sub-section) completely separated from the "''Japanese cartoon continuity''". I think a "G1cc" is preferable, since the stories flowing forward from ''The Rebirth'' or ''Transformers: The Headmasters'' do share the same underlying backstory.

Finally, there are characters that have only appeared in Japanese and American cartoon micro-continuities. [[Roadblock (G2)|Roadblock]] has appeared in America's Wingsverse and Japan's ''United EX'' fiction. Both of these continuities come from the original cartoon, as "add-ons", but there's nothing to indicate that in the way they're grouped under his fiction section. I think characters like Roadblock, Rapido, etc. should have their Wings/United EX sections grouped together, with a note of some kind explaining the connection.

Anyway, I wanted to bring this up here before I started sweeping through the G1 sections. Preferences one way or another? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 08:56, 23 July 2013 (EDT)
:I don't think character pages should concern themselves with continuity beyond the characters themselves. ''Headmasters'' Chromedome has absolutely no connection to Rebirth Chromedome in any way and putting them under the same section is deceptive. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 22:15, 24 July 2013 (EDT)
::The problem with that is that a casual reader of the page may not know the connection between the US and Japan cartoons. Whichever way it's written, it will be clear that Chromedome was introduced separately in both the US and Japanese cartoons - however, grouping the two together would signify that, despite the difference in the portrayal of the character, these are two similar universes, as opposed to the fairly different Marvel universe or the radically different IDW universe. I don't like it when the wiki assumes too much prior knowledge on the part of the reader - just because ''we'' know the story behind the Rebirth/Headmasters timeline split, someone who only knows Chromedome from the IDW comics may not be as aware, and wiki articles should above all aim to be informative. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 03:26, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I don't see why that's the responsibility of character pages or how that would enlighten them instead of making them think there's a linear chronology for the character when there isn't one. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 11:00, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
::::The point I'm trying to make is that, assuming the article is written clearly, there would be no confusion as to whether there is a linear chronology, as the sections would be labelled "US continuity" and "Japanese continuity" or something similar - so as long as we've made that clear, we might as well point out that these two separate timelines were once the same timeline, but branched off before this character was introduced, so as not to give the impression of a completely separate "Japanese cartoon continuity" that is unrelated to the US one, unlike the actual situation which has a split timeline. Looking at Chromedome's page, both the Rebirth section and the Headmasters section mention Galvatron, but the page as written gives no indication that both "versions" of Galvatron, unlike the two Chromedomes, experienced exactly the same events for a while before Chromedome appeared - if Chromedome's page was the first page I ever read on the wiki, I would conclude that the Headmasters series was as unrelated to the US series as it is to the IDW comics. Grouping the two together would prevent any such misunderstandings without going into too much detail, and the reader could then consult the page about the Headmasters series if they want a full explanation. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 11:19, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::That was my concern. There could even be an opening note on the subject, like:
:::::{{note|The underlying history for American and Japanese G1 cartoon continuity is the first 95 episodes of the Sunbow cartoon, before splitting in two directions. Chromedome first appeared in the cartoon continuity after the split occurred, with two distinct histories.}}
:::::--[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 11:53, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
::::::The Marvel comic sections are already drowned in obnoxious continuity notes. Do we really need to do the same to the cartoon sections? [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 15:52, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::::I'm confused -- how are you making "being informed" sound like a negative? --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 17:56, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::::I'd rather have "obnoxious" continuity notes than a confusing article. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 17:17, 25 July 2013 (EDT)

== New templates ==

[[Template:Nihongo]], same one as used on wikipedia.

Also, I had a suggestion for a [[Template:L]] (I forgot to get approval the first time) that would simplify the coding for any article with a parser from <nowiki>[[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus]]</nowiki> to <nowiki>{{l|Optimus Prime|WFC|Optimus}}</nowiki>, and <nowiki>[[Optimus Prime (WFC)|Optimus Prime]]</nowiki> to <nowiki>{{l|Optimus Prime|WFC}}</nowiki>.

Thoughts?[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 11:51, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:I really don't see the need for a link template like that. It increases the learning curve to edit the wiki in exchange for a only a slight saving of characters. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 13:37, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
:No. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 14:07, 25 July 2013 (EDT)
::Like Khajidha said, it's a solution that solves nothing in particular. Not everything needs to be relegated to templates. (I'm looking right at that awful Comicstory template.) [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 15:49, 25 July 2013 (EDT)

:Regarding the Nihongo template, I wonder if there's somewhere more useful we can point the question mark thingy at the end rather than a Wikipedia page with general Japanese info and WP-specific stuff for dealing with Japanese, though I'm not sure if we have a relevant help page (perhaps this is a sign we need one). --[[User:Abates|abates]] 19:03, 30 July 2013 (EDT)

== trying to find a template ==

I believe the subarticle [[2006/toys]], and the like, used to have a template pointing back to the year at the top of the article, but I can't seem to find that template. Does anyone know what it should be? Also, should these subarticles have a category? Thanks. --[[User:MistaTee|MistaTee]] 10:23, 15 August 2013 (EDT)
:I don't think "2006/toys" is meant to be viewed on its own. It exists for some organizational reason or another. Its content is automatically put on the [[2006]] page. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 19:05, 16 August 2013 (EDT)
::They can come up when you use the random page function though, like the suite pages do. As for the uplink, that wasn't a template, it was a [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Subpages subpages setting]. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:46, 21 August 2013 (EDT)

=="Thin gray line" template for splitting sub-sections visually==
Okay, this kinda hit me while working on [[Glit (KP)|Glit]]'s page... look at that fiction section. How can you tell where one one continuity ends and another begins at a glance? It's kind of a mess. The size differences between the subheader text is almost negligible. And Glit isn't even the most complex fiction section we got. The more subheadings we add to a section, and the loner those entries get, the worse it gets.<br>
Testing things out, I tried the "<nowiki>----</nowiki>" template, which puts a thin dividing line across the page. It works well as a visual separation, but the line itself is too dark. Can we either change the template so the line is, say, %50 gray (making it subtle but still noticeable and not confusing with the main subheader line breaks), or make a new template that does this function? This would be put between major subheadings; in this case, over the "IDW" and "Classics" headers. This might also be nice for Toy sections. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 03:14, 28 August 2013 (EDT)
:I suggested that like three or four years ago and got yelled at by everybody. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 04:17, 28 August 2013 (EDT)
::I would support it.
::I think it'd be a bit of a mess for characters around, say the marvel G1 stuff with its multiple branches... but definately worth it in the end. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 16:17, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::I can dig it. Honestly, I've used solid black lines to divide continuity clusters in a few huge articles myself already. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 16:35, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::Well, I don't think we'd put the line between the Marvel G1 sub-sections since they're all part of the same "branch". But between Marvel and IDW? Oh yeah. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 16:44, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::I raise the idea of solid black lines between Mrvel and IDW and gray lines between branches.
::::Does McFeely have an example of an article with a solid black line? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 17:11, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::::The trouble there is "solid black" already denotes the spit between MAJOR headers, like "Fiction" and "Toys". Gray is a "soft separator"; a visible marking, but not as STOP WE ARE MOVING TO AN ENTIRELY NEW SUBJECT as solid black. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 17:24, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::Yeah, that's an accurate assessment. Re Derik's question, I know it I did it on [[Matrix of Leadership]] and [[Transwarp]], I might've done it on some others but I honestly forget at this point. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 17:52, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:::::::To follow up, I don't think we need a soft-line break between EVERY sub-header. I think that under, say, the Marvel G1 continuity clump, a header is enough to denote "here's where continuity may jump/branch so just a heads-up". The line better notes an out-and-out break where what came before had no ties to what comes after... jsut with the gray, we're still staying in the same ballpark of "Fiction" (or possibly even "Toys"). --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 18:51, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::::We'd use a different visual obviously...
::::::::I'm going to dinner but I'll do some mockups later so you call can go "Hell no, I hate that, are you crazy?!" and we'll get a better idea of what we ''don't'' want, and can maybe figure out something useful. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 19:28, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::::(Unrelated: I think I know what cluster Bot-Shots goes in.) -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 19:28, 12 October 2013 (EDT)

== Disambiguation suffixes ==

I would like to propose two modifications of our disambiguation style, both of which merely codify principles that we already seem to follow. First, I propose that franchise of origin disambiguation suffixes be limited specifically to characters, not places or things. Second, I propose that characters from external properties should never be given Transformers franchise disambiguations, but should always use tags appropriate to the external property. The first rule underlies the logic behind the recent move of [[Tyrest (Autobot)]] to [[Tyrest (G1)]] despite the presence of [[Tyrest (polity)]], which also originated in G1. The second is why [[Roadblock (G1)]] can be at that location despite the existence of [[Roadblock (G.I. Joe)]], whose first TF appearance was during G1. As these examples demonstrate, we are already actually doing this, we just don’t explain it very well. If there are no objections, I intend to clarify [[Help:Disambiguation]] with notes about these principles. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 09:42, 2 September 2013 (EDT)
:We don't strictly follow that first rule - see the various "Great War" pages, for example. --[[User:Flicky1991|flicky]][[User talk:Flicky1991|1991]] 14:26, 2 September 2013 (EDT)
::Plus there's [[Ark (G1)]], [[Ark (Movie)]], etc. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:22, 3 September 2013 (EDT)

:The one that always gets me is "(TF 2010)". [[Lugnut (TF 2010)]] is treated as G1, most of the others (e.g., [[Override (TF 2010)]], [[Terradive (TF 2010)]], [[Highbrow (TF 2010)]]) are treated as movieverse (oh, and the Mini-Cons just say "who knows"). The word is DISambiguation, people - G1 characters and movieverse characters should not share a disambig tag. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 23:48, 2 September 2013 (EDT)
::The (TF 2010) toys are disambiged by franchise. That toyline contained toys representing characters from more than one continuity. Lugnut was part of that line's Reveal the Shield subline imprint, which is when the line switched from a mostly Movieverse toyline to a mostly G1-based/Classics-style toyline. The end result of the characters you mentioned all sharing the same disambig despite being in separate continuities is due to the unfortunate nature of that franchise spanning more than one continuity. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:19, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::I know all that and don't really care, because the end result is a broken disambig model that only works for rules lawyers. [Note that (Timelines) as a disambig is avoided '''for this very reason'''.] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 01:19, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::I love it when people tell me they don't care how the wiki chooses to disambiguate things. It makes me super want to talk with them further about these issues. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 01:23, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::You never talk ''with'' people on the public internet anyway. You talk ''at'' them.
:::::As for the subject... disambiguating by franchise may be a great plan (mileages may vary - I think it works only in the simplest cases), but it completely breaks in contact with a multi-continuity franchise. [And is more than a bit wibbly in the case of stuff like toys designed to match pre-existing High Moon WfC/FoC designs being listed only as "repurposes" in those articles because of ''later'' material.] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 02:30, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::Ultimately I don't think TF2010 is big enough of a franchise for it to be bothered breaking into tiny pieces. It's got eight new characters in it. It's not like Timelines, which spans years and years and multiple continuities. It's not a Big Deal enough to make a mess within the existing rules. It's nowhere near a quagmire. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:45, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::Also also, the reason Timelines is better split up is because due to its nature of also containing Shattered Glass and fifteen different permutations of many popular character names, disambiguating within it is pretty pointless anyway. Starscream (Timelines) would refer to which guy, exactly? The MW clone? The TransTech guy? The Shattered Glass version? Timelines breaks itself within our established rules. TF2010 absolutely does not, no matter how much you individually think having G1 and Movie guys in the same disambig is wrong. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 02:53, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::How is a disambig tag in any way related to how toys are listed on pages? I mean, unless you are legitimately suggesting that instead of disambiguating by franchise, we put all Thundercrackers ever on the same page, I cannot understand the connection here. -[[User:LV|LV]] 02:50, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::::It isn't, really, I jumped a track there [posting while insomniac and cranky is never advisable]. It just offends my sense of chronology to see the guy ''the design originated for'' listed as a "repurpose" rather than just listing the thing on both pages equally. - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 03:07, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::::Which... we DO. List on both pages. See: lots of Shattered Glass character pages. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 03:10, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::::::It's listed, but [[Thundercracker_(WFC)#Generations|with a particularly silly note]] given that WfC Thundercracker is the original design. There's a difference between Shattered Glass using a toy that existed years before SG did as an entirely different character (e.g., SG Ravage from Glit), which is repurposing, and listing the ''original'' as a "repurpose". - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 03:44, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::::::Yeah, that happens not infrequently, like with Megabolt Megatron. It doesn't bother me. This wiki reports what actually happens, not what we wish would happen. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 04:11, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
Hmm. Seems I overlooked a few things about franchise identifications on non-character articles. It still seems that characters take priority over non-characters (per the Tyrest example I gave), but it isn't quite as strict a rule as I thought. Is there any dispute over the external properties point? --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:41, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
: I don't think so. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 13:08, 3 September 2013 (EDT)

Added an external properties note to [[Help:Disambiguation]]. Feel free to modify it if it seems warranted. Also, do we want to go at least as far as saying that if a character and a non-character from the same franchise need disambiguating that the character can retain the franchise parenthetical while the non-character gets something different? Basically saying that the characters get dibs on franchise tags. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 10:50, 7 September 2013 (EDT)

== Stub Templates ==

Okay, so at this point I think I should change my username to "Stubtemplatesix"...so before I go looking through the stub category, are there any other stub templates that people want made? -- [[User:Spydersix|spyder]][[User Talk:Spydersix|<sup>Use this!</sup>]] 16:21, 11 October 2013 (EDT)

==From the Marvel Comics portion of the Generation 1 continuity family==
So I've been doing a bit of work with the Comic-only characters lately and I've noticed that while we have "from the Hearts of Steel portion of the G1 continuity family" and "from the IDW portion of the G1 continuity family" at the top of various characters' pages, all of the "from the Marvel Comics portion"s seem to have disappeared. Was there a purge of these? Do we not do them any more? Is there a good reason why not? Cheers --[[User:Emvee|Emvee]] 11:15, 28 October 2013 (EDT)
:There are some "from the Marvel portion..."s. I suspect it's more a case of "they were never added" than "they were removed". - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 13:01, 28 October 2013 (EDT)
::Okay, just making sure I'm not stepping on any toes if I start adding them --[[User:Emvee|Emvee]] 13:47, 28 October 2013 (EDT)
:::Well, I added a lot of the "IDW portion"s myself, so...
:::One thing - "portion" should be included in the link (<nowiki>[[Marvel Comics continuity|Marvel portion]] or [[Marvel Comics continuity|Marvel Comics portion]]</nowiki>) to distinguish from links to <nowiki>[[Marvel Comics]]</nowiki>. [I tend to prefer the former, since RG1, Classics and Fleetway are MCC splinters without being published by Marvel Comics.] - [[User:SanityOrMadness|SanityOrMadness]] 16:35, 28 October 2013 (EDT)

== The AllSpark and the Allspark ==

At the end of the Predacons Rising movie, after Optimus tells the others of how he had to put the energy of the [[AllSpark]] into the Matrix of Leadership, thus rendering his spark incapable of separating from the multitude of others, Ratchet asks him "Are you telling us... that you are now... one with the AllSpark?!" Smokescreen answers with "That's what you say when someone kicks the..." and all proceeding dialogue and action pertain to that meaning that Optimus is on his way to die and go into the afterlife. BUT, up until now, all instances of the term "AllSpark" have been used to refer to the life-granting thing on the physical plane of reality, while the afterlife has been referred to (by us fans) as the "[[Allspark|All'''''s'''''park]]" (lowercase S), as a means to differentiate the two (since the afterlife dimension first introduced in Beast Machines and the life-granting cube first seen in the movies were hardly the same thing at the time). Like, a TF who's dead is one who is "one with the Allspark."<br>
But now, with the use of the phrase "[being] one with the AllSpark" in this scene, it seems to strongly suggest that the term related to source of Cybertronian life and the term related to the Cybertronian afterlife are now considered to be one concept containing all of the aspects of Cybertronian life, birth, death, and afterlife. And if such is now the case, does this call for a massive re-merging of the two separate articles with some McFeely-levels of rewriting? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 00:45, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:I'll just say I happen to be working on something already that pertains to this. But that that also seems like an overly specific reading of the dialogue on your part when it could just as easily mean the same thing it's always meant up until now (that the energy-AllSpark of ''Prime'' is, like all other AllSparks, merely a means of accessing the afterlife, rather than some physical manifestation of the afterlife in the material plane, and that Prime merely "became one" with it in an overly literal way that is not the norm that happened to poetically mirror the normal meaning of the expression), and that such a vague foundation is not one to justify a merging of the articles on. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 06:06, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
::Well, how many times has the phrase "[being] one with the Allspark" been used to refer to the Uppercase S life-giving concept of the physical plane instead of the lowercase S afterlife concept that it originally referred to? I highly (and sadly) doubt the folks at Hasbro bother to think of the two terms as referring to separate things like we fans do. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 11:25, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:::I've never made the distinction as it has always been obvious to me that Hasbro didn't. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 12:23, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
::::It's a vague distinction anyway. It's basically the same as all those times in the G1 cartoon that characters professed to be "joining the Matrix" or "entering the Matrix", or the time Rampage told Silverbolt it was "time to go back to the Matrix" at a time when the writers envisioned the Matrix as a protoform production facility. Characters in-universe talk a fair bit about returning to or becoming one with the object that spawned them; ''Beast Machines'' and subsequent work built on what that show did just lets us know there's more to it than that, without invalidating that sentiment either. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 12:29, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:I had to reread this several times to even understand what your concern was. Suffice it to say that I don't view this dialogue as changing anything we knew about either concept. -[[User:LV|LV]] 13:37, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
:::::In that case, I now ask why we split the two in the first place back when the Cube info was being put on the afterlife dimension's page if the distinction is so vague as to be nonexistent/unnecessary. --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 14:07, 29 October 2013 (EDT)
::::::The Allspark is only one name for the afterlife. You could just as easily phrase your question "Why aren't the Matrix of Leadership and the Matrix dimension on the same page?" because that's exactly the same notion. And you wouldn't do that, now would you? Like I said, though, I'm gearing up to do some stuff with the Allspark article, which chiefly includes moving it to "Transformer afterlife" to separate out and better explain these distinctions and problems. I think it's the last major cross-universal meta-concept left after the Matrix, Energon and Transwarp, and the sparseness of the current article annoys me because, given how the Wiki is slowly but surely becoming a major resource consulted by the people creating the fiction, a thorough detailing of it can help mitigate ''exactly this sort of confusion'' in the future. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]]
:::::::But wasn't the term "Allspark" created specifically to refer to the afterlife? To clarify that "the Matrix" was just its nickname and not meant to refer to the Matrix of Leadership? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 20:19, 29 October 2013 (EDT)

User talk:Escargon

2013-11-05T03:33:53Z

Bumblejumper:

Dude, stop. English names are not transferred across different characters. Big Convoy is not Big Prime. [[Gren]] is not Hook. Gaia Guardian is not Gaia Defensor, etc. [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 21:50, 14 September 2013 (EDT)
:Big Convoy has never been named in English, Gren's never been named as that, and Gaia Guardian doesn't have an English name. Those examples don't work at all. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 21:55, 14 September 2013 (EDT)
::You are severely missing the point. The Kre-O character has no name, English or otherwise. All we have is the assumed intent of the writer (so, "Alexa"). What applies to the original character does not automatically apply to homages, as I've shown with my examples.
::And, frankly, if you had an issue, a better method of action would have been discussing rather than automatically reverting the preference of the person taking the time to make those pages! [[User:Mimi|Mimi]] 22:03, 14 September 2013 (EDT)
:: Mimi has a point. using the Alexis/Alexa Kre-o as an example; this wiki typically uses the Japanese name unless/until and English name is made. So, while the Kre-O character might be based off Alexis from Armada, we must call her what the comic calls her. And since the comic calls her nothing, author intent is all we have to go on. I say stick with Alexa but keep the reference to Alexis in the notes/[[User:Stevo|Stevo]] 22:27, 14 September 2013 (EDT)
:::Eh. Whatever, I don't even know all that much about the Japanese names, so I'm not the best one to ask about it. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 16:59, 15 September 2013 (EDT)

Please don't say that being a woman is an insult. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:32, 22 September 2013 (EDT)
:For clarification, I think [http://tfwiki.net/mediawiki/index.php?title=Waspinator_(BW)&curid=335&diff=828439&oldid=827733&rcid=666524 Supernova222] was the one who said it first. Just letting that out there. --[[User:Inkblot|Inkblot]] 22:48, 22 September 2013 (EDT)
:I wasn't trying to sir. Inkblot is correct. I just undid my revision cause I wasn't sure if it was correct or not. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 06:37, 23 September 2013 (EDT)
:(sometimes I should just sit down and shut up.) [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 06:40, 23 September 2013 (EDT)

You need to settle down just a little bit. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 19:34, 12 October 2013 (EDT)
:Sorry, sir. I just got a bit too angry.[[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 19:38, 12 October 2013 (EDT)

Please explain why you revert everything I contribute on this wiki?! - [[User:SoundWave|SoundWave]] 15:53, 19 October 2013 (EDT)
:The Ravage note was unessasary. The Team Prime image was fine, though you might want to move it to the episode section. Also, good job on editing the Soundwave ROTF page, the rape thing is one of the few PG-13 level things that is not accepted here. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 15:56, 19 October 2013 (EDT)
:: Thanks. - [[User:SoundWave|SoundWave]] 16:01, 19 October 2013 (EDT)

Why did you remove my talk on the Knock Out page? I thought the talk pages were for disscussing changes? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:13, 4 November 2013 (EST)
:You're saying that being gay is a bad thing, and that is not acceptable. Quit it right now. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 22:15, 4 November 2013 (EST)
::Sorry, but being gay really is a bad thing, the Bible says so. But if the wiki community doesn't want it on there I won't add it again, okay? :) - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:19, 4 November 2013 (EST)
:::No, it's not a bad thing. If you ever add that again, you will get into some major trouble. Now don't add it again. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 22:21, 4 November 2013 (EST)
::::Sorry, I won't add it again. But plz don't be so cross, I didn't know it was against the rules I'm new here. what exactly do not mean "major trouble? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:24, 4 November 2013 (EST)
:::::Being banned. Saying stuff like that is absolutely against the rules. [[User:Escargon|Escargon]] 22:29, 4 November 2013 (EST)
::::::Okay, it's completely understood. :) But if I say "Bank robbers stink" is that okay? (Just thought I'd better ask so I don't violate any more rules, LOL, not off to a very good start, am I? :))BTW, you got a YouTube channel friend? - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:33, 4 November 2013 (EST)

User talk:Escargon

2013-11-05T03:24:47Z

Bumblejumper:

User talk:Escargon

2013-11-05T03:19:33Z

Bumblejumper:

User talk:Escargon

2013-11-05T03:13:57Z

Bumblejumper:

Talk:Knock Out (Prime)

2013-11-05T03:11:04Z

Bumblejumper:

[[Image:DeusExMachina-Knockout.jpg|right|thumb]]

He's vain, but not necessarily gay. I think its really inappropriate, gay is in my opinion a horrible crime. -[[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 22:11, 4 November 2013 (EST)
Jeez, dudes, he makes one comment about Prime's tires, and he's the next Side Burn? [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 00:43, 13 March 2011 (EST)
:I removed it, but apparently someone called Detour took issue with that and reverted me. --[[User:Peter Damian|Peter Damian]] 05:24, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::Because your words are not law. First of all, the stealth link is there to show precedence, not to say "DUDE HE'S THE EXACT SAME AS SIDEBURN", and second because he does appear to have a serious thing going on for cars... especially Prime. He's gay for Optimus. His comment about Prime was a character-defining moment that really belongs in the intro paragraph. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 05:30, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
:::I think "gay for Optimus" is a little strong. I do think the note should stay, because it is pretty notable that Knock Out shows up next to Optimus complimenting him on his rims and build. We've built up intro paragraphs on less, and schmoozing Optimus's looks isn't really an everyday occurrence in Transformers. That, coupled with Starscream's "Oh, you're one of THOSE." Oh, right, and he compliments Optimus because he reminds him of his [[Breakdown (WFC)|Partner]]. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:27, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::::I may be too old to know for sure, but wasn't he just taunting Prime? The way the kids these days talk? I mean, he was setting Prime up to get blasted, which might indicate it wasn't legitimate schmoozing. Just a thought. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 11:21, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::I don't think Knock Out was legitimately trying to make out with Optimus, no. Try to make him uncomfortable or set him off his game, probably. That doesn't mean his compliments were empty. I think he meant it, but was using it as a disorienting weapon, not as a "I WILL TOTALLY DO YOU LATER" sort of thing. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 12:26, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::Whenever something like that line turns into a pun, I guess I kind of discount it as character development. But double entendres, I guess. Off to watch the dang episode again. [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 17:49, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::Actually, it's my opinion that Knock Out was admiring "the awesome truck parked over there," not Optimus. He showed no signs of recognizing Prime as a Transformers until he, um, transformed. Breakdown fired at the building, not at Optimus. But that's just me.
:::::::- [[User:Queso|¡Usa El Queso!]] 23:20, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::::Yeah, I never thought Knock Out knew Prime was a robot. He was just a cool looking truck that Knock Out wanted to ...do whatever with. I mean, you're a medic and the leader of your opposing faction is sitting right there, you generally don't go up to him all HEY BIG BOY HOW'S IT HANGIN' (unless you're Comics Ratchet, I mean). [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 07:57, 14 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::If he didn't know it was a Transformer, then I'd expect some reaction shot from him when he found out. He's also clearly introducing Optimus to Breakdown, who will shoot him, which otherwise makes no sense. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:16, 14 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::Personally I think he was just complimenting Prime's truck mode without knowing it was Optimus. He's in love with himself. Any accusations that he's gay will be the same thing as G1 Tracks.[[User:DinoFreakUSA|DinoFreakUSA]] 14:01, 20 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::Also I think we should change things around a bit. I think he only likes cars because he thinks they're cool not because they remind him of Breakdown. Was there an official source that said this?[[User:DinoFreakUSA|DinoFreakUSA]] 00:34, 21 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::::"You're reeeeeeaaaaaaaal heavy-duty, just like my friend here." The statement in the article is factual: He likes big trucks, and he thinks they're like Breakdown. Your "because" is something you read into it. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 01:07, 21 March 2011 (EDT)
Starscream's "you're one of ''those''" line is a rhetorical device letting everybody know that the cartoon isn't going to go there. Since he immediately explained that he was taking about car-mode Decepticons. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 22:02, 25 March 2011 (EDT)

== GAY? ==

That's a little inapropriate for a show that children watch, and I'm sure he just likes cars and commented on Optimus to distract him.--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 13:46, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:I'd say the brutal death, zombiefication and further brutal manglings of Cliffjumper and the constant brutal eradication of Vehicon troopers are far more inappropriate for a children's show than a bot who likes other dudebots. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 13:57, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
::If it were humans, yes, but robots, parents probably don't care much.--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 14:23, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:::Then why do you care? Are you afraid there'll be gay bot marriage or gay bot sex? They don't even have straight bot marriage or straight bot sex. And honestly, leaving homosexuals out of the show could give out a bad message, you know? "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings, except homos, gross!" -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 17:08, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
::::I'm getting Tramp flashbacks from this conversation.--[[User:Spin-Out|Spin-Out]] 18:32, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:You are inappropriate for children. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 19:33, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:::::I personally don't care, but parents might overreact and try to sue Hasbro or some shit.--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 16:29, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
::::::Sue them over what, exactly? Take your conspiracy theories to a forum, please. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 16:35, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
: What a great birthday present, this person. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:05, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
:: All I'm saying they wouldn't suggest him being gay, because of very critical parents who are offended by that. And this is to Spin-Out: Why?--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 15:19, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
::::Sexual innuendo can happen in kids shows, dude. Sexual innuendo's like half of Beast Wars. But I have a feeling that it's not these fictional parents you're invoking who really has the problem here. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:58, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
:::Odd that the parents would have a problem with implications that a character might be gay, but have no problems with death and grisly dismemberment. Not to mention fake profanity. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 17:48, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
::::Which I already pointed out to him at the very beginning of this nonsense. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 17:51, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
:::::Truth be told, a lot of people have a bigger problem with sex/sexuality than violence (heck, didn't the TF:P crew say they could do violence but not swearing? Not my idea of taboo hierarchy either). Of course, this doesn't change the fact that Primo over here is trying to keep a clean slate by presenting his problem as someone else's problem he's merely trying to raise awareness off. Which I don't get either, because the note states this is how fans interpret it, not that the TF:P crew intended it this way. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 05:39, 9 April 2011 (EDT)
::I don't think it's something worth mentioning in the page (probably 100% coincidence), but his Knock Out voice is exactly the same as his Mercurymon voice from Digimon, which was a character that wore prominent makeup in both its forms. It's pretty clear that Knock Out's at least ''acting'' as if he's homosexual.[[Special:Contributions/98.222.213.161|98.222.213.161]] 16:01, 14 May 2011 (EDT)

== On a COMPLETELY different topic... ==

Anyone object to changing Knock Out's quote to "I'm not just an automobile; I'm an automobile enthusiast"? It's basically just a better phrasing of the current quote, anyway.
<br>- [[User:Queso|¡Usa El Queso!]] 2:37 PM, 10 April 2011 A.D.
: I was gonna just go ahead and do that anyway, because I can, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. In other words, go ahead. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:46, 10 April 2011 (EDT)
isn't it notable that he has no insignia? - [[User:SoundWave|SoundWave]] 18:27, 19 October 2013 (EDT)
:No, because Prime characters without visible insignias are a dime a dozen. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:13, 19 October 2013 (EDT)

== EDIT ==
I edited out the part in notes claiming the Botcon comment was "unintentionally insulting" because someone's personal feelings on the matter of a joke does not belong in a wiki, even the TFwiki. Please, do not put in your personal feelings on a subject when this is meant to be objectively informative and not an opinionated exposition. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:This isn't "personal feelings". Comparing homosexuality to a glitch ''is'' insulting to homosexuals, regardless of whether or not the comment was intentionally insulting. It certainly seems more like your personal feelings on the matter are what's making you remove it. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:00, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::You are viewing it as your opinion that it is insulting. My personal feelings on the matter are not what is making me remove it, it is the fact that your opinions on what you make the comment out to be are leaking into the entry, where it does not belong. There is no need to say that it is an insulting comment, because it is not. It was not meant to be insulting, and the only way things can be "unintentionally insulting" is when you use your personal feelings and views to interpret a comment. Again, wiki articles should be objective, and it is your personal opinion that it was insulting. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:::Please pick up a dictionary and look up the definition of '''''unintentional'''''. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:08, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::::I am well aware of what the word "unintentional" means, but you are making it out as an insult, intentional or not, when it is not meant as such in any regard. Again, it is you viewing and interpreting the comment through your own opinions and feelings which makes it insulting in any regard, and it is, yet again, not something worth contributing to any wiki article. It is but one phrase that the article can do without. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:::::'''Words mean things'''. To compare homosexuality to a glitch IS insulting, regardless of whether it was intended or not. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:16, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::::[http://genderbitch.wordpress.com/2010/01/23/intent-its-fucking-magic/ Intent! It's friggin' magic.] --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 21:53, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::::A glitch caused a ''robot'' to be homosexual-ish. On a scale of shocking statements, that... doesn't seem all that shocking, honestly. If he were human it would be one thing, but he's a robot. It would be like if a glitch in the AllSpark caused a robot to crave pizza, or wear pants, or any number of things robots don't ordinarily do. Not really an insult to pizza lovers and pants wearers. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 03:47, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::::You cannot simply divorce a statement from its real world context just because it's about a fictional robot. "Pizza lovers" and "pants wearers" do not face discrimination, bigotry, and hatred. Your comparison is absurd. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 16:22, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::The context ''is'' fictional robots. Applying it to the real world would be ''taking it out of context''. That's just how "context" works. They talked about how there was no "gay" or "straight" on Cybertron, then, in order to explain Knock Out's otherwise unexplainable behavior (because there is no gay or straight on Cybertron), they said a glitch in the AllSpark did it. [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 20:53, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::No, the ''context'' is the systemic oppression of.... eh, never mind you clearly don't get it at all. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 23:31, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::This is an article on Knock Out, not an article on the semantics of what was said and what wasn't said. This isn't a critique on the perceived injustices or political incorrectness of a Botcon panel, this is about Knock Out. Your feelings on the matter are irrelevant to the page's content.[[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:::::::I'm sorry, but TFWiki ''is'' about pointing out these sorts of things, be they [[Denton J. Tipton|editors blaming gaffes on fans]] or [[Pat Lee|unscrupulous business practices]] or, yes, comments that turn out unintentionally insulting.. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:31, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:If I said "There was a glitch in the AllSpark the day that Fred was created", Fred would be more then justified to treat that as an insult. I don't see why this is any different. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 20:45, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
: So if I said "God had a bad case of the squirty-shits the day Mangytron was born", that wouldn't be insulting? Good to know! (And yes, the "glitch" quote IS insulting.) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 21:35, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:You are all taking this entirely out of context. The TFwiki should be objective and abstain from personal feelings and comments. The articles should not reflect the author's opinions, but simply the content. If you are going to insult me because I am trying to be objective and have some level of quality, then that is very childish of you, considering I have done nothing of the sort. Again, that comment is reflected solely on opinion and not fact. That is the end of this asinine discussion. The TFwiki is about Transformers, not commentary on socially offensive jokes or phrases expressed through a Botcon panel joke. Keep that on TF message boards. The Wiki is not your soapbox. That is all. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 22:22, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::I'm sorry, but considering the Wiki's moderators (abates and M Sipher) are disagreeing with you, I'd say you're not in any position to say what the Wiki is and isn't for. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 22:26, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:::I do very much enjoy the redlinked newcomer lecturing the admin what the site is all about. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:34, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::::I know the fandom is big now and all but jesus, it's like, the posters here are Sipher and Walky and frickin' me, and you're all YOU SHOULDN'T BE POSTING OPINIONS AND STUFF ON ARTICLES motherfucker why do you think we took over this thing in the first place? WE ARE HERE TO GRIND OUR AXES. GRINDY GRINDY GRINDY. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 22:49, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::You're several years and 13,451 articles too late to try and dictate what this wiki is and isn't, which makes your claims of lack of context all the funnier. Also, "some level of quality" has not remotely been proven on your part, inasmuch the ''only'' thing you've done here is get in an edit war and try and tell everyone what we ''should'' be doing. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 23:09, 13 June 2011 (EDT)

I guess I'm a glitch! (So not helping, am I?) Let's all back off and breathe a bit. No matter what we say, someone somewhere is going to get offended. [[User:AUGH AUGH AUGH|AUGH AUGH AUGH]] 01:52, 14 June 2011 (EDT)

This is all a rather silly issue, particularly given how informal this wiki is and always has been. Leave it as is, and if you disagree, get over it. Go have some ice cream. It should cheer you up. [[User:Monty Prime|Monty Prime]] 03:36, 14 June 2011 (EDT)

[http://rockdown.tumblr.com/post/6513500039/if-i-could-have-the-transformers-fandoms-attention-for I think this is the living definition of "crying some more".] - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 15:54, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:The first comment being "They're faggots!" really brings this all home, doesn't it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 15:58, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:All I'm getting from that is "MY HIVEMIND IS BETTER THAN YOURS! NYAH NYAH NYAH-NYAH!". --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 16:07, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:Ahhh. Hilarity. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 18:27, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:Gaybashing: it's not just for the neurotypical anymore. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 19:06, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::And since Chris opened the gateways, I ended up finding Mangrytron's topic that led him here to kick up a storm. [http://doodlebob.tumblr.com/post/6503456665/darthshadow-when-asked-at-botcon-2011-the My favorite line has to be "Do you seriously all have nothing better to do than whine about the most inane of issues and act as if that’s the reason The Man is holdin’ you all down?".] --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 19:42, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:lol you guys went through the trouble to find my tumblr blog and act as if i'm gaybashing or something else entirely retarded like that. i didn't insult you, i didn't attack you, and you're all going apeshit over nothing. stay classy TF fandom. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 21:00, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::We will. And you can stay 15. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 21:06, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::Wow, you telling US to stay classy? Anyone who refers to someone as a "nasty fat fanc**t" has lost their right to tell someone else to stay classy. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 21:09, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:::protip: that wasn't me who said it but [http://rockdown.tumblr.com a friend of mine], but go ahead and get angry at the words being said. That's all any of you seem to be doing; getting angry over words that hold no weight or mean anything at all. Really, you're insulting me, going out of your way to say I'm gaybashing and implying I'm homophobic because I say a wiki should be an objective source of information and not a place to voice your opinions. That's how all GOOD Wikis are run, but none of you are concerned about being good, you're just concerned about voicing your loud and rather inane opinions. Calm your asses down and realize that I haven't attacked anyone; the only one who is attacking anyone is you guys. Or don't calm down and continue on. It's really, really funny. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 21:15, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::We haven't insulted you, our words hold no weight or meaning. If you choose to be offended by them, that's your problem. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 21:20, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::I'm not offended by it, I just thought I'd point out the fact you're all trying to paint me in a light where I'm some homophobic, uncaring, gaybasher is really immature, especially when I did no such thing to any of you from the get-go. The funny thing is, I'm not even straight. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 21:28, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::You'd be surprised just how many homophobes aren't straight. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 21:32, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::Good for you. As a gay person, I'm still calling you socially dense and immature. If you want to stick your head in the sand and pretend that subtle homophobia doesn't exist and that words have "no weight or mean anything at all", feel free to do so and leave the rest of us alone. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 21:37, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::I'm going to echo Interrobang's comments. Also, the best part is all that drama over on tumblr will do nothing but net TFWiki more page visits and more free publicity. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 21:59, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::That's like being one of those people who says, "I'm not racist! I have lots of black friends!" It doesn't help your case. I know this whole thing has been retreaded to hell and back, but I felt necessary to put in my two cents on the matter. The initial statement they made at Botcon was cute; about the Decepticons having a 'don't ask, don't tell' policy. That's funny, and avoids addressing the issue without making anyone feel uncomfortable. The follow-up, on the other hand, is a slap, because it means that any characters that exhibit that behavior (be it actual homorobosexualism or just narcissism to an nth degree) are a MISTAKE. Which means that their personality traits are a MISTAKE. And I'm sorry, that just doesn't sit well, regardless of what personality traits are in question. It's like saying the Allspak glitched when it made Optimus, causing him to be heroic. It doesn't matter if it's decrying homosexuality at that point, it's saying that a character's primary character traits are wrong, and caused by a screw-up in their creation. If you can't see how ''this'' would be insulting, there is no hope for you.

::::::Also, for the record, I for one welcome our homosexual robot overlords. --[[User:Boy Blunderous|Boy Blunderous]] 03:48, 12 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::Actually I DON'T see how it is insulting. A "glitch" in the AllSpark is the TF equivalent of a mutation. And homosexuality is a mutation. But so is heterosexuality. And so is sex in general. And blue eyes. And brown hair. And five fingers. And the scent glands of skunks. And the manes of lions. And purple flowers. And photosynthesis. And any other trait with any degree of genetic causation. ALL current lifeforms are mutations, mutation is an "error" or "mistake" in the DNA, therefore ALL lifeforms are mistakes. Glitches, if you will. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 14:43, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::With all due respect, Khajidha, but you don't know what a mutation is. Or a glitch. Or context. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 14:50, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::As a biology instructor I should hope I know what a mutation is. But as a teacher, I could probably have phrased my statements better. I was not talking of a trait as a mutation that occurs when each lifeform originates, but of each trait as originating in evolutionary history by means of mutation. The mutation that led to sex occurred hundreds of millions of years ago, but it was a mutation just the same. ALL life is different from the initial life form. In fact, the first self-replicating molecule (lifeform if you will) was RNA based. DNA itself is a change, a mutation, an error, a glitch. To me, the statement that a possible robo-homosexuality is due to a glitch in the AllSpark is the equivalent of saying that human homosexuality is due to a genetic cause (not a choice), and I fail to see how that is something the homosexual community is upset about. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:08, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::A mutation is not a glitch. A glitch is a fault, that results in something not working properly. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 15:15, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::::Which is what a mutation is. The mutated DNA strand does not function the way the original strand did, the way it is "supposed" to work. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:31, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::::Except that a mutation can still create something that works properly. A glitch outright causes an error. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 15:36, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::Just so everyone knows, the ''context'' is that a glitch caused a giant robot from a planet that doesn't even have "gay" or "straight" to act gay-like. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 15:51, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::On the barest side of technicality, Khajidha is right and Detour is wrong about mutations being glitches (but not at all to say that the BotCon line wasn't insulting. If you have to say "barely technically", then it should have been phrased better). Any mutation, whether it improves the chances of survival, lowers them, or doesn't effect them, is a glitch in DNA's process. As a reminder, that process is to ''exactly'' transcribe the existing strands. Mutations are not a purposeful, "natural" mechanic of DNA transcription -- DNA transcription doesn't have a "for this part, choose a base pair at random" step. The overwhelming majority of mutations are actually caused by the near-constant damage to DNA that results from base pairs that contain radioactive isotopes undergoing decay; I believe the rate is "6 mutations per second", but that was from one of Asimov's old papers, so it's probably far out-of-date.
:So on the ''barest'' side of the matter, calling it a "glitch" is a perfectly legitimate, not-necessarily-biased way to describe it. However, BotCon really should have realized that the primary way to interpret that is as a glitch in ''Knock-Out'', not the "process of RNA (that's what robots have, right?) transcription", sooo...yeah, it's unintentionally insulting.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:25, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::They didn't say "glitches are how every Transformer is made". They said "There was a glitch THAT DAY when Knock Out was made". They're using glitch in the electronics term, not the silly "robotic equivalent of a DNA mutation" way that Khajidha is touting. After all, as he says... mutations happen all the time. But computer glitches are outright error that cause a program not to work properly, or at all. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 16:33, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::Oy, really? Then yeah, that's f'd up.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 18:25, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::For reference, I didn't go to any trouble - I just found it when someone who has issues with the wiki posted a link it on Twitter, and even THEY thought you were being ridiculous. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 04:48, 15 June 2011 (EDT)

== Authoritorial Intent. ==

Was one of the reasons for Knock Out's name change <i>really</i> because Lugnut wasn't sexy enough? Or are we just going with the flow of the article? Because I've never seen the Notes section as a place for joking as such. [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 17:03, 4 August 2011 (EDT)
:Yes to your first question. Although the claim needs to be sourced. BotCon, I think? [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:14, 4 August 2011 (EDT)
::I believe it was said at BotCon, yeah. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 17:17, 4 August 2011 (EDT)

== Question about what side he's on? ==

in the Finale Episode of Season 3 he attempted to switched sides, Miko knocked him out before he got any answer from Optimus Prime, but knowing Prime he more then likely would have said yes (with some guidelines) so is he now an Autobot or at least a "Non-Aligned" Transformer? [[User:Chasemarc1701|Chasemarc1701]] 19:23, 27 July 2013 (EDT)
:Until we know otherwise, stick with Decepticon. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 19:57, 27 July 2013 (EDT)

My logic: If TFP-Prime can have a little Decepticon symbol at the top of his page for that time he was Orion Pax, then I don't see what the problem is, but just to be sure, we should probably wait until Predacons Rising comes out to confirm his allegiance. {{unsigned|PunchSydeiron|22:20, September 12, 2013 (EDT)}}
:He would have to be admitted into the Autobots as a member. Decepticons have allied themselves with the Autobots in other continuities and remained Decepticons. I'm thinking specifically of the Unicron Trilogy. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 22:43, 12 September 2013 (EDT)
::And Carnivac from Marvel UK. And Blackarachnia pre-''[[Crossing the Rubicon]]''. And Octane post-''[[Thief in the Night]]''. And... --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 10:15, 13 September 2013 (EDT)
:::Well If you've now watched "Transformers Prime: Predacons Rising" he fully changed side's to the Autobots, He actual was glad to see Optimus Prime. So his side preference would be Autobots. [[User:Speedy Question Mark|Speedy Question Mark]] 18:23, 15 September 2013 (EDT)
::::The movie's not out until October. Unless you're watching it through less-than-legal means, in which case it'd help to check [[Help:Official info|the Wiki's guidelines regarding leaked stuff]]. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 13:26, 15 September 2013 (EDT)

:Well, he really does seem to chance sides in Predacons Rising, what with the whole "knocking out Starscream, siding with the Autobots as the last line of defense against Unicron, and the way Optimus praised him for his actions" thing.

Talk:Knock Out (Prime)

2013-11-05T02:59:23Z

Bumblejumper:

[[Image:DeusExMachina-Knockout.jpg|right|thumb]]

He's not gay, can we remove all that, gay is too offensive for a kid's cartoon. We don't allow rape, we shouldn't allow gay either, it's just wrong. - [[User:Bumblejumper|Bumblejumper]] 21:59, 4 November 2013 (EST)
Jeez, dudes, he makes one comment about Prime's tires, and he's the next Side Burn? [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 00:43, 13 March 2011 (EST)
:I removed it, but apparently someone called Detour took issue with that and reverted me. --[[User:Peter Damian|Peter Damian]] 05:24, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::Because your words are not law. First of all, the stealth link is there to show precedence, not to say "DUDE HE'S THE EXACT SAME AS SIDEBURN", and second because he does appear to have a serious thing going on for cars... especially Prime. He's gay for Optimus. His comment about Prime was a character-defining moment that really belongs in the intro paragraph. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 05:30, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
:::I think "gay for Optimus" is a little strong. I do think the note should stay, because it is pretty notable that Knock Out shows up next to Optimus complimenting him on his rims and build. We've built up intro paragraphs on less, and schmoozing Optimus's looks isn't really an everyday occurrence in Transformers. That, coupled with Starscream's "Oh, you're one of THOSE." Oh, right, and he compliments Optimus because he reminds him of his [[Breakdown (WFC)|Partner]]. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 10:27, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::::I may be too old to know for sure, but wasn't he just taunting Prime? The way the kids these days talk? I mean, he was setting Prime up to get blasted, which might indicate it wasn't legitimate schmoozing. Just a thought. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 11:21, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::I don't think Knock Out was legitimately trying to make out with Optimus, no. Try to make him uncomfortable or set him off his game, probably. That doesn't mean his compliments were empty. I think he meant it, but was using it as a disorienting weapon, not as a "I WILL TOTALLY DO YOU LATER" sort of thing. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 12:26, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::Whenever something like that line turns into a pun, I guess I kind of discount it as character development. But double entendres, I guess. Off to watch the dang episode again. [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 17:49, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::Actually, it's my opinion that Knock Out was admiring "the awesome truck parked over there," not Optimus. He showed no signs of recognizing Prime as a Transformers until he, um, transformed. Breakdown fired at the building, not at Optimus. But that's just me.
:::::::- [[User:Queso|¡Usa El Queso!]] 23:20, 13 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::::Yeah, I never thought Knock Out knew Prime was a robot. He was just a cool looking truck that Knock Out wanted to ...do whatever with. I mean, you're a medic and the leader of your opposing faction is sitting right there, you generally don't go up to him all HEY BIG BOY HOW'S IT HANGIN' (unless you're Comics Ratchet, I mean). [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 07:57, 14 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::If he didn't know it was a Transformer, then I'd expect some reaction shot from him when he found out. He's also clearly introducing Optimus to Breakdown, who will shoot him, which otherwise makes no sense. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 11:16, 14 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::Personally I think he was just complimenting Prime's truck mode without knowing it was Optimus. He's in love with himself. Any accusations that he's gay will be the same thing as G1 Tracks.[[User:DinoFreakUSA|DinoFreakUSA]] 14:01, 20 March 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::Also I think we should change things around a bit. I think he only likes cars because he thinks they're cool not because they remind him of Breakdown. Was there an official source that said this?[[User:DinoFreakUSA|DinoFreakUSA]] 00:34, 21 March 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::::"You're reeeeeeaaaaaaaal heavy-duty, just like my friend here." The statement in the article is factual: He likes big trucks, and he thinks they're like Breakdown. Your "because" is something you read into it. - [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 01:07, 21 March 2011 (EDT)
Starscream's "you're one of ''those''" line is a rhetorical device letting everybody know that the cartoon isn't going to go there. Since he immediately explained that he was taking about car-mode Decepticons. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 22:02, 25 March 2011 (EDT)

== GAY? ==

That's a little inapropriate for a show that children watch, and I'm sure he just likes cars and commented on Optimus to distract him.--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 13:46, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:I'd say the brutal death, zombiefication and further brutal manglings of Cliffjumper and the constant brutal eradication of Vehicon troopers are far more inappropriate for a children's show than a bot who likes other dudebots. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 13:57, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
::If it were humans, yes, but robots, parents probably don't care much.--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 14:23, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:::Then why do you care? Are you afraid there'll be gay bot marriage or gay bot sex? They don't even have straight bot marriage or straight bot sex. And honestly, leaving homosexuals out of the show could give out a bad message, you know? "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings, except homos, gross!" -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 17:08, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
::::I'm getting Tramp flashbacks from this conversation.--[[User:Spin-Out|Spin-Out]] 18:32, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:You are inappropriate for children. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 19:33, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
:::::I personally don't care, but parents might overreact and try to sue Hasbro or some shit.--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 16:29, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
::::::Sue them over what, exactly? Take your conspiracy theories to a forum, please. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 16:35, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
: What a great birthday present, this person. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 18:05, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
:: All I'm saying they wouldn't suggest him being gay, because of very critical parents who are offended by that. And this is to Spin-Out: Why?--[[User:Primo|Primo]] 15:19, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
::::Sexual innuendo can happen in kids shows, dude. Sexual innuendo's like half of Beast Wars. But I have a feeling that it's not these fictional parents you're invoking who really has the problem here. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:58, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
:::Odd that the parents would have a problem with implications that a character might be gay, but have no problems with death and grisly dismemberment. Not to mention fake profanity. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 17:48, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
::::Which I already pointed out to him at the very beginning of this nonsense. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 17:51, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
:::::Truth be told, a lot of people have a bigger problem with sex/sexuality than violence (heck, didn't the TF:P crew say they could do violence but not swearing? Not my idea of taboo hierarchy either). Of course, this doesn't change the fact that Primo over here is trying to keep a clean slate by presenting his problem as someone else's problem he's merely trying to raise awareness off. Which I don't get either, because the note states this is how fans interpret it, not that the TF:P crew intended it this way. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 05:39, 9 April 2011 (EDT)
::I don't think it's something worth mentioning in the page (probably 100% coincidence), but his Knock Out voice is exactly the same as his Mercurymon voice from Digimon, which was a character that wore prominent makeup in both its forms. It's pretty clear that Knock Out's at least ''acting'' as if he's homosexual.[[Special:Contributions/98.222.213.161|98.222.213.161]] 16:01, 14 May 2011 (EDT)

== On a COMPLETELY different topic... ==

Anyone object to changing Knock Out's quote to "I'm not just an automobile; I'm an automobile enthusiast"? It's basically just a better phrasing of the current quote, anyway.
<br>- [[User:Queso|¡Usa El Queso!]] 2:37 PM, 10 April 2011 A.D.
: I was gonna just go ahead and do that anyway, because I can, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. In other words, go ahead. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 14:46, 10 April 2011 (EDT)
isn't it notable that he has no insignia? - [[User:SoundWave|SoundWave]] 18:27, 19 October 2013 (EDT)
:No, because Prime characters without visible insignias are a dime a dozen. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:13, 19 October 2013 (EDT)

== EDIT ==
I edited out the part in notes claiming the Botcon comment was "unintentionally insulting" because someone's personal feelings on the matter of a joke does not belong in a wiki, even the TFwiki. Please, do not put in your personal feelings on a subject when this is meant to be objectively informative and not an opinionated exposition. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:This isn't "personal feelings". Comparing homosexuality to a glitch ''is'' insulting to homosexuals, regardless of whether or not the comment was intentionally insulting. It certainly seems more like your personal feelings on the matter are what's making you remove it. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:00, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::You are viewing it as your opinion that it is insulting. My personal feelings on the matter are not what is making me remove it, it is the fact that your opinions on what you make the comment out to be are leaking into the entry, where it does not belong. There is no need to say that it is an insulting comment, because it is not. It was not meant to be insulting, and the only way things can be "unintentionally insulting" is when you use your personal feelings and views to interpret a comment. Again, wiki articles should be objective, and it is your personal opinion that it was insulting. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:::Please pick up a dictionary and look up the definition of '''''unintentional'''''. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:08, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::::I am well aware of what the word "unintentional" means, but you are making it out as an insult, intentional or not, when it is not meant as such in any regard. Again, it is you viewing and interpreting the comment through your own opinions and feelings which makes it insulting in any regard, and it is, yet again, not something worth contributing to any wiki article. It is but one phrase that the article can do without. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:::::'''Words mean things'''. To compare homosexuality to a glitch IS insulting, regardless of whether it was intended or not. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:16, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::::[http://genderbitch.wordpress.com/2010/01/23/intent-its-fucking-magic/ Intent! It's friggin' magic.] --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 21:53, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::::A glitch caused a ''robot'' to be homosexual-ish. On a scale of shocking statements, that... doesn't seem all that shocking, honestly. If he were human it would be one thing, but he's a robot. It would be like if a glitch in the AllSpark caused a robot to crave pizza, or wear pants, or any number of things robots don't ordinarily do. Not really an insult to pizza lovers and pants wearers. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 03:47, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::::You cannot simply divorce a statement from its real world context just because it's about a fictional robot. "Pizza lovers" and "pants wearers" do not face discrimination, bigotry, and hatred. Your comparison is absurd. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 16:22, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::The context ''is'' fictional robots. Applying it to the real world would be ''taking it out of context''. That's just how "context" works. They talked about how there was no "gay" or "straight" on Cybertron, then, in order to explain Knock Out's otherwise unexplainable behavior (because there is no gay or straight on Cybertron), they said a glitch in the AllSpark did it. [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 20:53, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::No, the ''context'' is the systemic oppression of.... eh, never mind you clearly don't get it at all. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 23:31, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::This is an article on Knock Out, not an article on the semantics of what was said and what wasn't said. This isn't a critique on the perceived injustices or political incorrectness of a Botcon panel, this is about Knock Out. Your feelings on the matter are irrelevant to the page's content.[[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]]
:::::::I'm sorry, but TFWiki ''is'' about pointing out these sorts of things, be they [[Denton J. Tipton|editors blaming gaffes on fans]] or [[Pat Lee|unscrupulous business practices]] or, yes, comments that turn out unintentionally insulting.. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 20:31, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:If I said "There was a glitch in the AllSpark the day that Fred was created", Fred would be more then justified to treat that as an insult. I don't see why this is any different. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 20:45, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
: So if I said "God had a bad case of the squirty-shits the day Mangytron was born", that wouldn't be insulting? Good to know! (And yes, the "glitch" quote IS insulting.) --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 21:35, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:You are all taking this entirely out of context. The TFwiki should be objective and abstain from personal feelings and comments. The articles should not reflect the author's opinions, but simply the content. If you are going to insult me because I am trying to be objective and have some level of quality, then that is very childish of you, considering I have done nothing of the sort. Again, that comment is reflected solely on opinion and not fact. That is the end of this asinine discussion. The TFwiki is about Transformers, not commentary on socially offensive jokes or phrases expressed through a Botcon panel joke. Keep that on TF message boards. The Wiki is not your soapbox. That is all. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 22:22, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::I'm sorry, but considering the Wiki's moderators (abates and M Sipher) are disagreeing with you, I'd say you're not in any position to say what the Wiki is and isn't for. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 22:26, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
:::I do very much enjoy the redlinked newcomer lecturing the admin what the site is all about. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 22:34, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::::I know the fandom is big now and all but jesus, it's like, the posters here are Sipher and Walky and frickin' me, and you're all YOU SHOULDN'T BE POSTING OPINIONS AND STUFF ON ARTICLES motherfucker why do you think we took over this thing in the first place? WE ARE HERE TO GRIND OUR AXES. GRINDY GRINDY GRINDY. [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 22:49, 13 June 2011 (EDT)
::You're several years and 13,451 articles too late to try and dictate what this wiki is and isn't, which makes your claims of lack of context all the funnier. Also, "some level of quality" has not remotely been proven on your part, inasmuch the ''only'' thing you've done here is get in an edit war and try and tell everyone what we ''should'' be doing. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 23:09, 13 June 2011 (EDT)

I guess I'm a glitch! (So not helping, am I?) Let's all back off and breathe a bit. No matter what we say, someone somewhere is going to get offended. [[User:AUGH AUGH AUGH|AUGH AUGH AUGH]] 01:52, 14 June 2011 (EDT)

This is all a rather silly issue, particularly given how informal this wiki is and always has been. Leave it as is, and if you disagree, get over it. Go have some ice cream. It should cheer you up. [[User:Monty Prime|Monty Prime]] 03:36, 14 June 2011 (EDT)

[http://rockdown.tumblr.com/post/6513500039/if-i-could-have-the-transformers-fandoms-attention-for I think this is the living definition of "crying some more".] - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 15:54, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:The first comment being "They're faggots!" really brings this all home, doesn't it. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 15:58, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:All I'm getting from that is "MY HIVEMIND IS BETTER THAN YOURS! NYAH NYAH NYAH-NYAH!". --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 16:07, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:Ahhh. Hilarity. --[[User:M Sipher|M Sipher]] 18:27, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:Gaybashing: it's not just for the neurotypical anymore. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 19:06, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::And since Chris opened the gateways, I ended up finding Mangrytron's topic that led him here to kick up a storm. [http://doodlebob.tumblr.com/post/6503456665/darthshadow-when-asked-at-botcon-2011-the My favorite line has to be "Do you seriously all have nothing better to do than whine about the most inane of issues and act as if that’s the reason The Man is holdin’ you all down?".] --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 19:42, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:lol you guys went through the trouble to find my tumblr blog and act as if i'm gaybashing or something else entirely retarded like that. i didn't insult you, i didn't attack you, and you're all going apeshit over nothing. stay classy TF fandom. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 21:00, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::We will. And you can stay 15. --[[User:Thylacine 2000|Thylacine 2000]] 21:06, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::Wow, you telling US to stay classy? Anyone who refers to someone as a "nasty fat fanc**t" has lost their right to tell someone else to stay classy. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 21:09, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:::protip: that wasn't me who said it but [http://rockdown.tumblr.com a friend of mine], but go ahead and get angry at the words being said. That's all any of you seem to be doing; getting angry over words that hold no weight or mean anything at all. Really, you're insulting me, going out of your way to say I'm gaybashing and implying I'm homophobic because I say a wiki should be an objective source of information and not a place to voice your opinions. That's how all GOOD Wikis are run, but none of you are concerned about being good, you're just concerned about voicing your loud and rather inane opinions. Calm your asses down and realize that I haven't attacked anyone; the only one who is attacking anyone is you guys. Or don't calm down and continue on. It's really, really funny. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 21:15, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::We haven't insulted you, our words hold no weight or meaning. If you choose to be offended by them, that's your problem. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 21:20, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
:::::I'm not offended by it, I just thought I'd point out the fact you're all trying to paint me in a light where I'm some homophobic, uncaring, gaybasher is really immature, especially when I did no such thing to any of you from the get-go. The funny thing is, I'm not even straight. [[User:Mangrytron|Mangrytron]] 21:28, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::You'd be surprised just how many homophobes aren't straight. -- [[User:Semysane|Semysane]] 21:32, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::Good for you. As a gay person, I'm still calling you socially dense and immature. If you want to stick your head in the sand and pretend that subtle homophobia doesn't exist and that words have "no weight or mean anything at all", feel free to do so and leave the rest of us alone. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 21:37, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::I'm going to echo Interrobang's comments. Also, the best part is all that drama over on tumblr will do nothing but net TFWiki more page visits and more free publicity. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 21:59, 14 June 2011 (EDT)
::::::That's like being one of those people who says, "I'm not racist! I have lots of black friends!" It doesn't help your case. I know this whole thing has been retreaded to hell and back, but I felt necessary to put in my two cents on the matter. The initial statement they made at Botcon was cute; about the Decepticons having a 'don't ask, don't tell' policy. That's funny, and avoids addressing the issue without making anyone feel uncomfortable. The follow-up, on the other hand, is a slap, because it means that any characters that exhibit that behavior (be it actual homorobosexualism or just narcissism to an nth degree) are a MISTAKE. Which means that their personality traits are a MISTAKE. And I'm sorry, that just doesn't sit well, regardless of what personality traits are in question. It's like saying the Allspak glitched when it made Optimus, causing him to be heroic. It doesn't matter if it's decrying homosexuality at that point, it's saying that a character's primary character traits are wrong, and caused by a screw-up in their creation. If you can't see how ''this'' would be insulting, there is no hope for you.

::::::Also, for the record, I for one welcome our homosexual robot overlords. --[[User:Boy Blunderous|Boy Blunderous]] 03:48, 12 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::Actually I DON'T see how it is insulting. A "glitch" in the AllSpark is the TF equivalent of a mutation. And homosexuality is a mutation. But so is heterosexuality. And so is sex in general. And blue eyes. And brown hair. And five fingers. And the scent glands of skunks. And the manes of lions. And purple flowers. And photosynthesis. And any other trait with any degree of genetic causation. ALL current lifeforms are mutations, mutation is an "error" or "mistake" in the DNA, therefore ALL lifeforms are mistakes. Glitches, if you will. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 14:43, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::With all due respect, Khajidha, but you don't know what a mutation is. Or a glitch. Or context. [[User:Geewunling|Geewunling]] 14:50, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::As a biology instructor I should hope I know what a mutation is. But as a teacher, I could probably have phrased my statements better. I was not talking of a trait as a mutation that occurs when each lifeform originates, but of each trait as originating in evolutionary history by means of mutation. The mutation that led to sex occurred hundreds of millions of years ago, but it was a mutation just the same. ALL life is different from the initial life form. In fact, the first self-replicating molecule (lifeform if you will) was RNA based. DNA itself is a change, a mutation, an error, a glitch. To me, the statement that a possible robo-homosexuality is due to a glitch in the AllSpark is the equivalent of saying that human homosexuality is due to a genetic cause (not a choice), and I fail to see how that is something the homosexual community is upset about. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:08, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::A mutation is not a glitch. A glitch is a fault, that results in something not working properly. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 15:15, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::::Which is what a mutation is. The mutated DNA strand does not function the way the original strand did, the way it is "supposed" to work. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 15:31, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::::Except that a mutation can still create something that works properly. A glitch outright causes an error. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 15:36, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::::::::Just so everyone knows, the ''context'' is that a glitch caused a giant robot from a planet that doesn't even have "gay" or "straight" to act gay-like. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 15:51, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::::::::::On the barest side of technicality, Khajidha is right and Detour is wrong about mutations being glitches (but not at all to say that the BotCon line wasn't insulting. If you have to say "barely technically", then it should have been phrased better). Any mutation, whether it improves the chances of survival, lowers them, or doesn't effect them, is a glitch in DNA's process. As a reminder, that process is to ''exactly'' transcribe the existing strands. Mutations are not a purposeful, "natural" mechanic of DNA transcription -- DNA transcription doesn't have a "for this part, choose a base pair at random" step. The overwhelming majority of mutations are actually caused by the near-constant damage to DNA that results from base pairs that contain radioactive isotopes undergoing decay; I believe the rate is "6 mutations per second", but that was from one of Asimov's old papers, so it's probably far out-of-date.
:So on the ''barest'' side of the matter, calling it a "glitch" is a perfectly legitimate, not-necessarily-biased way to describe it. However, BotCon really should have realized that the primary way to interpret that is as a glitch in ''Knock-Out'', not the "process of RNA (that's what robots have, right?) transcription", sooo...yeah, it's unintentionally insulting.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 16:25, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::They didn't say "glitches are how every Transformer is made". They said "There was a glitch THAT DAY when Knock Out was made". They're using glitch in the electronics term, not the silly "robotic equivalent of a DNA mutation" way that Khajidha is touting. After all, as he says... mutations happen all the time. But computer glitches are outright error that cause a program not to work properly, or at all. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 16:33, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
:::Oy, really? Then yeah, that's f'd up.[[User:KrytenKoro|KrytenKoro]] 18:25, 18 July 2011 (EDT)
::For reference, I didn't go to any trouble - I just found it when someone who has issues with the wiki posted a link it on Twitter, and even THEY thought you were being ridiculous. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 04:48, 15 June 2011 (EDT)

== Authoritorial Intent. ==

Was one of the reasons for Knock Out's name change <i>really</i> because Lugnut wasn't sexy enough? Or are we just going with the flow of the article? Because I've never seen the Notes section as a place for joking as such. [[User:TheMZone|TheMZone]] 17:03, 4 August 2011 (EDT)
:Yes to your first question. Although the claim needs to be sourced. BotCon, I think? [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:14, 4 August 2011 (EDT)
::I believe it was said at BotCon, yeah. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 17:17, 4 August 2011 (EDT)

== Question about what side he's on? ==

in the Finale Episode of Season 3 he attempted to switched sides, Miko knocked him out before he got any answer from Optimus Prime, but knowing Prime he more then likely would have said yes (with some guidelines) so is he now an Autobot or at least a "Non-Aligned" Transformer? [[User:Chasemarc1701|Chasemarc1701]] 19:23, 27 July 2013 (EDT)
:Until we know otherwise, stick with Decepticon. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 19:57, 27 July 2013 (EDT)

My logic: If TFP-Prime can have a little Decepticon symbol at the top of his page for that time he was Orion Pax, then I don't see what the problem is, but just to be sure, we should probably wait until Predacons Rising comes out to confirm his allegiance. {{unsigned|PunchSydeiron|22:20, September 12, 2013 (EDT)}}
:He would have to be admitted into the Autobots as a member. Decepticons have allied themselves with the Autobots in other continuities and remained Decepticons. I'm thinking specifically of the Unicron Trilogy. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 22:43, 12 September 2013 (EDT)
::And Carnivac from Marvel UK. And Blackarachnia pre-''[[Crossing the Rubicon]]''. And Octane post-''[[Thief in the Night]]''. And... --[[User:Xaaron|Xaaron]] 10:15, 13 September 2013 (EDT)
:::Well If you've now watched "Transformers Prime: Predacons Rising" he fully changed side's to the Autobots, He actual was glad to see Optimus Prime. So his side preference would be Autobots. [[User:Speedy Question Mark|Speedy Question Mark]] 18:23, 15 September 2013 (EDT)
::::The movie's not out until October. Unless you're watching it through less-than-legal means, in which case it'd help to check [[Help:Official info|the Wiki's guidelines regarding leaked stuff]]. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 13:26, 15 September 2013 (EDT)

:Well, he really does seem to chance sides in Predacons Rising, what with the whole "knocking out Starscream, siding with the Autobots as the last line of defense against Unicron, and the way Optimus praised him for his actions" thing.

User:Bumblejumper

2013-11-05T02:54:23Z

Bumblejumper: Created page with "Hi everyone, I'm Bumblejumper! I'll do my best to improve this wiki!"

Hi everyone, I'm Bumblejumper! I'll do my best to improve this wiki!