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Talk:Combiner

2015-07-21T20:33:30Z

Cehteshami: /* Moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus? */

==List of toys?==
Personally, I am inclined to say that this article is not an appropriate place to make a list of combining toys. Arguably there is ''no'' appropriate place for that, since we already have a combiners category. Does anybody else want to chime in? I don't want to just revert Evil-yuusha's work without at least making sure I'm not alone on it. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 05:34, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
:I like the article as it is. Yes, there's a combiners category, but I think having an article with a list of combiners that's further broken down by method of combination is cool, too. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 05:50, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
::I'm gonna have to agree, primarily on the basis that it's not just a simple list; the combiners are broken down into type, and the various types explained and detailed. - [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:09, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Okay, then, let's discuss how to improve this. I think that having the lists inbetween definitions of terminology is a bad idea. It puts too much space between the definitions. Also, the lists remove two-robot combiners from the "gestalt" category even though the text of the article explicitly cites that as a point of contention. At the very least, I think the lists should be moved to a newly-created section of this page, but creating a new "List of combiners" article might be even better. The page was written as an explanation of what combiners ARE and what different words people use for them, so inserting complete lists of combiners into the middle is incongruous. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 21:44, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

:::Hey everybody, I kinda just added those list on a whim (something to do on lunch break), sorry I started so much discussion! I didnt know there was a combiner list elsewhere, in fact I still can't find it! (Help!) Actually, since then I've been working on an updated draft for the Combiners page that clarifies some stuff and more or less reorganizes everything. I guess I agree with Steve-o, the list do kinda break up the flow of the page, but Im not sure how to move (or remove) them and still have them tie in with their associated terms at-a-glance. In trying to unmuddy the Combiner waters, I devised some new terms (at least i ''think'' theyre new!) to describe the often-argued "gestalt or not gestalt" combiners, as well as the "not quite an official combiner" characters. If anyone would like details before I post, or if the Mods think Im being too bold, please let me know! [[User:Evil-yuusha|Evil-yuusha]] 18:45, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for chiming in again, Evil-yuusha. For the time being, I've moved the lists into a new section just before the trivia, and changed their headers slightly to avoid giving preference to one or another meaning for "gestalt". Personally, I'm satisfied with that, but if anybody has other ideas, feel free to bring them up. The only other combiner list would be [[:Category:Combiners]], which is organized alphabetically, like all other categories, so it's probably not ideal for all purposes. I think that introducing newly-coined terminology is something the Wiki should be wary of, although we did invent the phrase "continuity family" so it's not totally out of the question. I would recommend bringing up ideas of that sort on the talk page before incorporating them into the article. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 00:11, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

:Well, the article as it stands now still leaves some ambiguity as to what is or is not a combiner proper, and of those, what qualifies as a gestalt. I thought that the term "Demi-Gestalt" could acknowledge lesser combiners that have the basic criteria of a gestalt, but still sets them apart from the "giants", as some fans feel they should be (like Slamdance).

:I thought the term "Pseudo-Combiner" could be applied to characters that do "combine", but do not qualify as "Combiners" (like Omega Supreme). Just lumping these (and there's a lot of them) under the heading of "Not Combiners" with every other TF seems unfair somehow.

:As a side note, I think the term "Super Robot" needs to be redefined, as it can refer to most any "big, strong robot", be it combiner, gestalt, pseudo-combiner, or anything else. - [[User:Evil-yuusha|Evil-yuusha]] 18:53, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

::I am pretty adamant that we not try to prescribe a definition for "gestalt". To some fans it applies only to large combiners, to some only to combiners with more than two members, and to some to any combiner. There is no "real" or official definition of it for us to go off of, so, I would prefer we simply describe its varied usage and leave it at that. Similarly for Super Robot: it is used, repeatedly, in official materials to describe -- as you say -- almost any big, strong robot. It's not a very useful term for that reason, but that's what it is. I don't think we can legitimately redefine it. I can go along with your pseudo-combiner thing, although I feel a little like there must be a better choice of words... To me at least, there is little combiner-esque about Omega Supreme. He combines with his PARTS, yeah... but "combiner" has pretty much always meant combining-robots in Transformers. I admit the Not combiners section could use some work. Feel free to take a stab at it. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:21, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

==Merge team articles with super-robot articles?==
Am I the only one who thinks that the articles for gestalts and the special teams that form them should be merged? I mean, if all the members of a special team appear at the same time, more often than not their combined mode will also appear. And any notable activities performed by individual team members can always go to the said character's own bio, yes? [[User:Takeshi357|Takeshi357]] 11:56, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

== Squawkbox ==

Since the first combiner was in the reign of Nova Prime, couldn't squawkbox be a legitimate combiner? --[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]] 02:46, 2007 October 4 (UTC)
:By far we only know the first combiner was in the reign of Nova Prime in IDW G1 Continuity. The origin of Combiniers differs from different continuities. --[[User:TX55|TX55]] 03:11, 2007 October 4 (UTC)

::I believe we're only talking about IDW here. In IDW it doesn't seem likely. Indications are Monstructor was the first and only try by Jhiaxus as 1) he came out a horrible and powerful monster and 2)Prime and the Autobots seem totally ignorant and stunned by the concept of multiple TFs combining to a single robot. It's concievable, I suppose that the Cons could have fiddled with it and the Bots don't know, BUT it seems that Furman's going to play the Combiners as a new Mega-powerful (able to kick Omega's tail) threat, which makes it unlikely the cons would have had them and not used them before. Most likely it's either a) a mistake or b) Squawkbox isn't a combiner in IDW. --[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 16:03, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

== When their minds don't combine. ==

I was going on the assumption that the combiner's minds must also combine to be a true combiner. I've seen examples where they don't. In [[Dreadwing Down!]], [[Dreadwind (G1)|Dreadwind]] and [[Darkwing (G1)|Darkwing]] talk back and forth when they are in [[Dreadwing (G1)|Dreadwing]] mode. Is that typical of Dreadwing? <strike>Is he truly a "combiner"? Was he ever called a combiner?</strike> [[Rail Racer (RID)|Rail Racer]] from RID has spoken of himself in the plural ("we are"). <strike>If it was up to me (and I understand it isn't), I'd be inclined to give that a new term, like "connector" or something.</strike> [edit: I looked it up like I should have done before posting.] - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 16:33, 31 May 2009 (EDT)

== Faction symbols... Why? ==

So... why are there faction symbols for this page? It's like to imply that Combiner technology is exclusive to Decepticons and Autobots, when it's clearly not... There are Maximals, Predacons, Minicons... And there's even Nexus Maximus, which from what I can tell, predates any factions whatsoever. It'd seem pointless to just put every single faction symbol for each group that possesses a combiner, so I'm taking it down altogether. If anyone has an argument against it, you can go ahead and try to convince me otherwise. --[[User:Ascendron|Ascendron]] 16:49, 31 May 2009 (EDT)

==Optimus Prime + Jetfire= ?==

: Are they combiners in ROTF? the toys do combine, but in fiction, Jetfire just gives his parts to be combined with prime.--[[User:Sunjumper|Sunjumper]] 11:54, 25 June 2009 (EDT)
::In fiction, no, Jetfire is dead at that point. I think it would fall under the category of [[super mode]]. In the toys, that is a good question. I haven't read any bio information describing what is supposed to be going on there. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 12:02, 25 June 2009 (EDT)
So, was Optimus Prime and Jetfire's corpse ever called a combiner? - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 15:09, 5 July 2009 (EDT)

:Um, possibly called "technically a combiner". I use <nowiki>{{note}}</nowiki> to state the difference. --'''[[User:TX55|TX55]]'''''[[User talk:TX55|TALK]]'' 03:13, 6 July 2009 (EDT)

== Fiction section ==

I just realized there is no fiction section to this article. It should say how combiner tech was developed in each continuity and usually the other faction steals the tech at some point, etc. etc. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 18:56, 4 August 2009 (EDT)

== Megatron + Tidal Wave ==

In ''Armada'', Tidal Wave could attach to Megatron in pieces to give him the "ultimate power", wouldn't that be a combiner of some kind? And speaking of Tidal Wave, he is technically three different ships or pieces that don't transform on their own but combine to form him. Wouldn't that be considered something? --[[User:LokitheGrammarNazi|LokitheGrammarNazi]] 11:29, 20 September 2010 (EDT)

== Diaclone ==

:''Scramble City-type combiners were initially designed to be a sub-line of Diaclone called... what else... Scramble City''
Is there a source for this? Because the info I have (which is corroborated on the [[Diaclone]] page) has the intended name as ''Jizai Gattai'' ("Free Combination").--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 21:27, 2 January 2011 (EST)

==Possible source of "gestalt"==
I was reading [http://www.amazon.com/Predator-Isaac-Asimovs-Robots-Time/dp/0380765101 some early-'90s pulp sci-fi,] and I came across this bit, spoken by robot describing himself: "I am a gestalt robot. I am comprised of six robots, both in body and in mind. [...] In the event of certain types of large-scale emergencies, I can divide into my component robots so that each can move directly to a different site to manage damage control. [...] Their positronic brains are physically distinct from mine, of course, but right now all six are merging data with mine to create my own personality. In order to divide, I will have to allow each latent personality to separate and take control over its data as well as its own body."

The plot of the book - in fact, [[wikipedia:Isaac_Asimov's_Robots_in_Time|the whole series it's in]] - revolves around a hunt for the scattered component robots. It was published in 1993, which seems like just the right timeframe to be the source of our fandom's usage. Of course there are stranger coincidences in the world, and this doesn't actually ''prove'' anything, but it seems worth a Note to me. Anyone disagree?

- [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 12:26, 6 September 2012 (EDT)

== What happens... ==

when a Scramble City combiner switches limbs with another? Could Menasor with another team's member attached still be considered Menasor in a mental sense, considering Menasor is defined by his personality with the five Stunticons as components? [[User:Avalanche|Avalanche]] ([[User talk:Avalanche|talk]]) 16:53, 28 April 2015 (EDT)

:In western fiction, nobody knows. In Japan you get [[Abomenaticus]], [[Comperian]], [[Cybertron Super Scramble]], [[Destron Super Scramble]], and [[Scramble 7]]. - [[User:Gimmick|Gimmick]] ([[User talk:Gimmick|talk]]) 16:51, 28 April 2015 (EDT)

Thanks. too bad western fiction doesn't have an answer. I'd like to see what IDW could whip up. [[User:Avalanche|Avalanche]] ([[User talk:Avalanche|talk]]) 16:53, 28 April 2015 (EDT)
:IDW already has Prowl as a part of Devastator. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 17:07, 28 April 2015 (EDT)
Yeah, but I mean that a big part of Menasor is that he's unstable because the Stunticons hate Motormaster. That mind is Menasor. What happens if you take out say, Drag Strip and put in a Protectobot or something. From my limited sources, it looks like Prowlestator was just a bigger Prowl. I could be wrong though.
::It hasn't specifically been done with Menasor, but [[God Neptune (BWSG)|God Neptune]] is canonically a different character to [[Piranacon (G1)|Piranacon]]. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 21:40, 28 April 2015 (EDT)
Thanks. ''That's'' what I was looking for. [[User:Avalanche|Avalanche]] ([[User talk:Avalanche|talk]]) 10:34, 29 April 2015 (EDT)

== Combiner technology improving over time ==

I don't think that any fiction directly addresses this, but it seems to me that Combiner technology definitely improves with each "generation", as it were. The original, Devestator, could only combine in one way and was idiotic and driven to bouts of rage. The first Scramble City combiners used only 5 people and could shift posistions, but were also extremely stupid (Superion) and psychotic. The next two however were much more successful. Defensor is considered to be fairly smart, and although Bruticus is dumb, he's also a fairly model soldier. You then get Predaking, who's usually considered fairly flawless, and even the personality flaws of Computron and Abominus seem to be more related to the people who make them up, as well as being fairly minor.

The thing is, I don't know if any of this is intentional. It's there if you read the Universe descriptions, but I don't believe that the comics or cartoon ever really addressed it. So, is it worth noting? Or is it just arguable fan theory? [[User:LiamK|LiamK]] ([[User talk:LiamK|talk]]) 16:32, 1 June 2015 (EDT)
: This seems more like fan speculation than anything else. Keep in mind that the combiner teams don't really have a "set" creation order, so to speak; in ''Combiner Wars'' Superion predates Defensor(and Monstructor is apparently older than ''all'' the other combiner teams), and in WFC Bruticus is apparently the first combiner. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 17:17, 1 June 2015 (EDT)

== Moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus? ==

I wanted to suggest moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus from Scramble City-type Combiners to Official mix-n-match Scramble City-type Combiners. Both of these gestalts have no dedicated limbs, they take limbs from other combination sets, just like Betatron does. I also think it is fine to have Ultra Prime and Optimus Maximus listed separately as they are not the same combiner, just like Abominus and Abomenaticus are not the same combiner even if they share the same core member. [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] ([[User talk:Cehteshami|talk]]) 14:34, 21 July 2015 (EDT)
:Why are we trying to shoehorn Combiner Wars into the Scramble City classification? These molds are not from Scramble City, therefor these (new) characters are not Scramble City combiners. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:39, 21 July 2015 (EDT)
::I think the classification is based on the combination method, not the line the toys sold from. So the Generations updates to Scramble City Combiners are also called Scramble City-Type, and their wave-mates get brought in under that classification due to the nature of their combination. At least that's what I guess the logic behind the decision is, I wasn't the one that originally put them there. [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] ([[User talk:Cehteshami|talk]]) 14:34, 21 July 2015 (EDT)
:::[[Bruticus Maximus (Energon)]] and the others of that type are also homages to Generation 1 Scramble City combiners, but get their own category. Not to mention these "new" scramble city types often get a sixth member (chest-plate/weapon) that can't become a limb, unlike the Seacons. That's enough diferences to split them off, in my opinion.[[User:Ascendron|Ascendron]] ([[User talk:Ascendron|talk]]) 14:42, 21 July 2015 (EDT)
::::I think the distinction is that these are not homages but the same characters, because these combiners are in IDW, they are explicitly G1. That's why, for example, looking at Superion's page it includes the information that in some parts of G1 fiction, Alpha Bravo is a team member. These aren't homages in a different continuity family, these are alternate versions of the G1 combiners in the same continuity family. To me the line of thinking goes like this: "Defensor, Superion, Menasor, and Bruticus are G1 scramble city-type combiners and depicted as such the Combiner Wars G1 fiction. Optimus Maximus, Victorion, and Sky Reign are part of the same toyline as the Generations updates to the G1 scramble city-type combiners using the same combining gimmick, therefore they are also scramble city-type combiners." I feel like that is an entirely separate discussion to my suggestion though, I went ahead and moved Ultra Prime and Galvatronus into the Official Mix-n-match category since there wasn't any comment opposed to that particular move. [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] ([[User talk:Cehteshami|talk]]) 16:33, 21 July 2015 (EDT)

Talk:Combiner

2015-07-21T18:35:07Z

Cehteshami: /* Moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus? */

Talk:Combiner

2015-07-21T18:34:49Z

Cehteshami: /* Moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus? */

==List of toys?==
Personally, I am inclined to say that this article is not an appropriate place to make a list of combining toys. Arguably there is ''no'' appropriate place for that, since we already have a combiners category. Does anybody else want to chime in? I don't want to just revert Evil-yuusha's work without at least making sure I'm not alone on it. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 05:34, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
:I like the article as it is. Yes, there's a combiners category, but I think having an article with a list of combiners that's further broken down by method of combination is cool, too. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC|KilMichaelMcC]] 05:50, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
::I'm gonna have to agree, primarily on the basis that it's not just a simple list; the combiners are broken down into type, and the various types explained and detailed. - [[User:Dark T Zeratul|Dark T Zeratul]] 08:09, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Okay, then, let's discuss how to improve this. I think that having the lists inbetween definitions of terminology is a bad idea. It puts too much space between the definitions. Also, the lists remove two-robot combiners from the "gestalt" category even though the text of the article explicitly cites that as a point of contention. At the very least, I think the lists should be moved to a newly-created section of this page, but creating a new "List of combiners" article might be even better. The page was written as an explanation of what combiners ARE and what different words people use for them, so inserting complete lists of combiners into the middle is incongruous. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 21:44, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

:::Hey everybody, I kinda just added those list on a whim (something to do on lunch break), sorry I started so much discussion! I didnt know there was a combiner list elsewhere, in fact I still can't find it! (Help!) Actually, since then I've been working on an updated draft for the Combiners page that clarifies some stuff and more or less reorganizes everything. I guess I agree with Steve-o, the list do kinda break up the flow of the page, but Im not sure how to move (or remove) them and still have them tie in with their associated terms at-a-glance. In trying to unmuddy the Combiner waters, I devised some new terms (at least i ''think'' theyre new!) to describe the often-argued "gestalt or not gestalt" combiners, as well as the "not quite an official combiner" characters. If anyone would like details before I post, or if the Mods think Im being too bold, please let me know! [[User:Evil-yuusha|Evil-yuusha]] 18:45, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for chiming in again, Evil-yuusha. For the time being, I've moved the lists into a new section just before the trivia, and changed their headers slightly to avoid giving preference to one or another meaning for "gestalt". Personally, I'm satisfied with that, but if anybody has other ideas, feel free to bring them up. The only other combiner list would be [[:Category:Combiners]], which is organized alphabetically, like all other categories, so it's probably not ideal for all purposes. I think that introducing newly-coined terminology is something the Wiki should be wary of, although we did invent the phrase "continuity family" so it's not totally out of the question. I would recommend bringing up ideas of that sort on the talk page before incorporating them into the article. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 00:11, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

:Well, the article as it stands now still leaves some ambiguity as to what is or is not a combiner proper, and of those, what qualifies as a gestalt. I thought that the term "Demi-Gestalt" could acknowledge lesser combiners that have the basic criteria of a gestalt, but still sets them apart from the "giants", as some fans feel they should be (like Slamdance).

:I thought the term "Pseudo-Combiner" could be applied to characters that do "combine", but do not qualify as "Combiners" (like Omega Supreme). Just lumping these (and there's a lot of them) under the heading of "Not Combiners" with every other TF seems unfair somehow.

:As a side note, I think the term "Super Robot" needs to be redefined, as it can refer to most any "big, strong robot", be it combiner, gestalt, pseudo-combiner, or anything else. - [[User:Evil-yuusha|Evil-yuusha]] 18:53, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

::I am pretty adamant that we not try to prescribe a definition for "gestalt". To some fans it applies only to large combiners, to some only to combiners with more than two members, and to some to any combiner. There is no "real" or official definition of it for us to go off of, so, I would prefer we simply describe its varied usage and leave it at that. Similarly for Super Robot: it is used, repeatedly, in official materials to describe -- as you say -- almost any big, strong robot. It's not a very useful term for that reason, but that's what it is. I don't think we can legitimately redefine it. I can go along with your pseudo-combiner thing, although I feel a little like there must be a better choice of words... To me at least, there is little combiner-esque about Omega Supreme. He combines with his PARTS, yeah... but "combiner" has pretty much always meant combining-robots in Transformers. I admit the Not combiners section could use some work. Feel free to take a stab at it. --[[User:Steve-o|Steve-o]] 22:21, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

==Merge team articles with super-robot articles?==
Am I the only one who thinks that the articles for gestalts and the special teams that form them should be merged? I mean, if all the members of a special team appear at the same time, more often than not their combined mode will also appear. And any notable activities performed by individual team members can always go to the said character's own bio, yes? [[User:Takeshi357|Takeshi357]] 11:56, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

== Squawkbox ==

Since the first combiner was in the reign of Nova Prime, couldn't squawkbox be a legitimate combiner? --[[User:Chiasaur11|Chiasaur11]] 02:46, 2007 October 4 (UTC)
:By far we only know the first combiner was in the reign of Nova Prime in IDW G1 Continuity. The origin of Combiniers differs from different continuities. --[[User:TX55|TX55]] 03:11, 2007 October 4 (UTC)

::I believe we're only talking about IDW here. In IDW it doesn't seem likely. Indications are Monstructor was the first and only try by Jhiaxus as 1) he came out a horrible and powerful monster and 2)Prime and the Autobots seem totally ignorant and stunned by the concept of multiple TFs combining to a single robot. It's concievable, I suppose that the Cons could have fiddled with it and the Bots don't know, BUT it seems that Furman's going to play the Combiners as a new Mega-powerful (able to kick Omega's tail) threat, which makes it unlikely the cons would have had them and not used them before. Most likely it's either a) a mistake or b) Squawkbox isn't a combiner in IDW. --[[User:ZacWilliam|ZacWilliam]] 16:03, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

== When their minds don't combine. ==

I was going on the assumption that the combiner's minds must also combine to be a true combiner. I've seen examples where they don't. In [[Dreadwing Down!]], [[Dreadwind (G1)|Dreadwind]] and [[Darkwing (G1)|Darkwing]] talk back and forth when they are in [[Dreadwing (G1)|Dreadwing]] mode. Is that typical of Dreadwing? <strike>Is he truly a "combiner"? Was he ever called a combiner?</strike> [[Rail Racer (RID)|Rail Racer]] from RID has spoken of himself in the plural ("we are"). <strike>If it was up to me (and I understand it isn't), I'd be inclined to give that a new term, like "connector" or something.</strike> [edit: I looked it up like I should have done before posting.] - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 16:33, 31 May 2009 (EDT)

== Faction symbols... Why? ==

So... why are there faction symbols for this page? It's like to imply that Combiner technology is exclusive to Decepticons and Autobots, when it's clearly not... There are Maximals, Predacons, Minicons... And there's even Nexus Maximus, which from what I can tell, predates any factions whatsoever. It'd seem pointless to just put every single faction symbol for each group that possesses a combiner, so I'm taking it down altogether. If anyone has an argument against it, you can go ahead and try to convince me otherwise. --[[User:Ascendron|Ascendron]] 16:49, 31 May 2009 (EDT)

==Optimus Prime + Jetfire= ?==

: Are they combiners in ROTF? the toys do combine, but in fiction, Jetfire just gives his parts to be combined with prime.--[[User:Sunjumper|Sunjumper]] 11:54, 25 June 2009 (EDT)
::In fiction, no, Jetfire is dead at that point. I think it would fall under the category of [[super mode]]. In the toys, that is a good question. I haven't read any bio information describing what is supposed to be going on there. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 12:02, 25 June 2009 (EDT)
So, was Optimus Prime and Jetfire's corpse ever called a combiner? - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 15:09, 5 July 2009 (EDT)

:Um, possibly called "technically a combiner". I use <nowiki>{{note}}</nowiki> to state the difference. --'''[[User:TX55|TX55]]'''''[[User talk:TX55|TALK]]'' 03:13, 6 July 2009 (EDT)

== Fiction section ==

I just realized there is no fiction section to this article. It should say how combiner tech was developed in each continuity and usually the other faction steals the tech at some point, etc. etc. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 18:56, 4 August 2009 (EDT)

== Megatron + Tidal Wave ==

In ''Armada'', Tidal Wave could attach to Megatron in pieces to give him the "ultimate power", wouldn't that be a combiner of some kind? And speaking of Tidal Wave, he is technically three different ships or pieces that don't transform on their own but combine to form him. Wouldn't that be considered something? --[[User:LokitheGrammarNazi|LokitheGrammarNazi]] 11:29, 20 September 2010 (EDT)

== Diaclone ==

:''Scramble City-type combiners were initially designed to be a sub-line of Diaclone called... what else... Scramble City''
Is there a source for this? Because the info I have (which is corroborated on the [[Diaclone]] page) has the intended name as ''Jizai Gattai'' ("Free Combination").--[[User:Nevermore|Nevermore]] 21:27, 2 January 2011 (EST)

==Possible source of "gestalt"==
I was reading [http://www.amazon.com/Predator-Isaac-Asimovs-Robots-Time/dp/0380765101 some early-'90s pulp sci-fi,] and I came across this bit, spoken by robot describing himself: "I am a gestalt robot. I am comprised of six robots, both in body and in mind. [...] In the event of certain types of large-scale emergencies, I can divide into my component robots so that each can move directly to a different site to manage damage control. [...] Their positronic brains are physically distinct from mine, of course, but right now all six are merging data with mine to create my own personality. In order to divide, I will have to allow each latent personality to separate and take control over its data as well as its own body."

The plot of the book - in fact, [[wikipedia:Isaac_Asimov's_Robots_in_Time|the whole series it's in]] - revolves around a hunt for the scattered component robots. It was published in 1993, which seems like just the right timeframe to be the source of our fandom's usage. Of course there are stranger coincidences in the world, and this doesn't actually ''prove'' anything, but it seems worth a Note to me. Anyone disagree?

- [[User:Jackpot|Jackpot]] 12:26, 6 September 2012 (EDT)

== What happens... ==

when a Scramble City combiner switches limbs with another? Could Menasor with another team's member attached still be considered Menasor in a mental sense, considering Menasor is defined by his personality with the five Stunticons as components? [[User:Avalanche|Avalanche]] ([[User talk:Avalanche|talk]]) 16:53, 28 April 2015 (EDT)

:In western fiction, nobody knows. In Japan you get [[Abomenaticus]], [[Comperian]], [[Cybertron Super Scramble]], [[Destron Super Scramble]], and [[Scramble 7]]. - [[User:Gimmick|Gimmick]] ([[User talk:Gimmick|talk]]) 16:51, 28 April 2015 (EDT)

Thanks. too bad western fiction doesn't have an answer. I'd like to see what IDW could whip up. [[User:Avalanche|Avalanche]] ([[User talk:Avalanche|talk]]) 16:53, 28 April 2015 (EDT)
:IDW already has Prowl as a part of Devastator. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 17:07, 28 April 2015 (EDT)
Yeah, but I mean that a big part of Menasor is that he's unstable because the Stunticons hate Motormaster. That mind is Menasor. What happens if you take out say, Drag Strip and put in a Protectobot or something. From my limited sources, it looks like Prowlestator was just a bigger Prowl. I could be wrong though.
::It hasn't specifically been done with Menasor, but [[God Neptune (BWSG)|God Neptune]] is canonically a different character to [[Piranacon (G1)|Piranacon]]. --[[User:Abates|abates]] ([[User talk:Abates|talk]]) 21:40, 28 April 2015 (EDT)
Thanks. ''That's'' what I was looking for. [[User:Avalanche|Avalanche]] ([[User talk:Avalanche|talk]]) 10:34, 29 April 2015 (EDT)

== Combiner technology improving over time ==

I don't think that any fiction directly addresses this, but it seems to me that Combiner technology definitely improves with each "generation", as it were. The original, Devestator, could only combine in one way and was idiotic and driven to bouts of rage. The first Scramble City combiners used only 5 people and could shift posistions, but were also extremely stupid (Superion) and psychotic. The next two however were much more successful. Defensor is considered to be fairly smart, and although Bruticus is dumb, he's also a fairly model soldier. You then get Predaking, who's usually considered fairly flawless, and even the personality flaws of Computron and Abominus seem to be more related to the people who make them up, as well as being fairly minor.

The thing is, I don't know if any of this is intentional. It's there if you read the Universe descriptions, but I don't believe that the comics or cartoon ever really addressed it. So, is it worth noting? Or is it just arguable fan theory? [[User:LiamK|LiamK]] ([[User talk:LiamK|talk]]) 16:32, 1 June 2015 (EDT)
: This seems more like fan speculation than anything else. Keep in mind that the combiner teams don't really have a "set" creation order, so to speak; in ''Combiner Wars'' Superion predates Defensor(and Monstructor is apparently older than ''all'' the other combiner teams), and in WFC Bruticus is apparently the first combiner. [[User:Grum|Grum]] ([[User talk:Grum|talk]]) 17:17, 1 June 2015 (EDT)

== Moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus? ==

I wanted to suggest moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus from Scramble City-type Combiners to Official mix-n-match Scramble City-type Combiners. Both of these gestalts have no dedicated limbs, they take limbs from other combination sets, just like Betatron does. I also think it is fine to have Ultra Prime and Optimus Maximus listed separately as they are not the same combiner, just like Abominus and Abomenaticus are not the same combiner even if they share the same core member. [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] ([[User talk:Cehteshami|talk]]) 14:34, 21 July 2015 (EDT)
:Why are we trying to shoehorn Combiner Wars into the Scramble City classification? These molds are not from Scramble City, therefor these (new) characters are not Scramble City combiners. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] ([[User talk:Khajidha|talk]]) 13:39, 21 July 2015 (EDT)
:I think the classification is based on the combination method, not the line the toys sold from. So the Generations updates to Scramble City Combiners are also called Scramble City-Type, and their wave-mates get brought in under that classification due to the nature of their combination. At least that's what I guess the logic behind the decision is, I wasn't the one that originally put them there. [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] ([[User talk:Cehteshami|talk]]) 14:34, 21 July 2015 (EDT)

Combiner

2015-07-21T15:38:31Z

Cehteshami: /* Combiner list */

[[File:studioox combiners whatif.jpg|upright=2.2|thumb|Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer.]]
{{quote|Decepticons are '''obsessed''' with combining. Put two of 'em in a room and within seconds one will be standing on the other's shoulders. '''Fact.'''|[[Swerve (G1)|Swerve]]|[[The Waiting Game]]}}
A '''combiner''' is a group of Transformers that assemble and combine their bodies into a single machine, or that composite machine itself. Most combiners form a larger Super Robot with its own unique personality (a character in its own right), but other varieties of combiner exist, forming vehicles, weapons, or other items. Combiners tend to be considerably larger and more powerful than the average Transformer, equivalent to strategic-grade weapons.

There are a number of combiner-related terms that can be easy to mix up, partially because some of them are used interchangeably. Additionally, most of them have no formal definition and thus may be used differently by different fans. Consequently, most of the discussion which follows should not be taken as the word of [[Primus]], but as a rough description of common usage.

==Terms for combiners==
[[File:Combiner logo.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|Worst...logo...ever.]]
'''Combiner''': As above, a member of a group of Transformers who assemble into a composite form. Also refers to that composite form itself. This is the most general term for all combining Transformers. "Combiner" is the most common term for combining Transformers that has been used by Hasbro in an official capacity, starting with the ''[[Micromaster]] Combiners'' from 1990 (with the exception of the more limited "special teams" and a recent official use of the term "gestalt"), having even appeared with its own logo on the [[Transformers: Robots in Disguise (2001 toyline)|2001 ''Robots in Disguise'' toyline]] packaging.

[[File:DevastatorDissectionDreamwave.jpg|upright=1.4|thumb|What, no Terror Claws? No Cranium Regulation Unit? What kind of lame dissection is this?!]]
'''Gestalt''': Generally only a "big robot" combiner with an emergent personality, but usage is imprecise. The term was coined by fans, and there was never consensus on how broadly it could be applied; for example, if [[Squawkbox]] would fall under the category or not. The term was and remains quite popular in the fandom, and it eventually gained official use as well. It's unclear when or how it first arose, but it is commonly understood to refer to [[wikipedia:gestalt psychology|gestalt psychology]], wherein the word roughly means a thing that is greater than or different from the sum of its parts. ''(For more on its origin and meaning, see [[#Notes|Notes]].)'' It remained firmly in realm of [[fanon]] for years, though its appearance in some ''[[Transformers: Energon (franchise)|Energon]]'' design sketches showed that the term had caught on with Hasbro designers. Then in 2007, "gestalt" [[Canonizing|made its first official appearance]] in the bio of the ''[[Titanium Series]]'' [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]] toy, followed in the same year by the "[[Spotlight: Optimus Prime]]" comic (referring to [[Monstructor (G1)|Monstructor]]), and again in 2009 in the "[[First (and Second) in Flight]]" comic wherein [[Perceptor (Animated)|Perceptor]] describes [[Jetfire (Animated)|Jetfire's]] & [[Jetstorm (Animated)|Jetstorm's]] combination into [[Safeguard (Animated)|Safeguard]] as a sort of "gestalt powerlink".

'''Scramble City combiner''': A specific type of [[The Transformers (toyline)|Generation 1]] giant gestalt that follows the five-member design featured in the Japanese [[Scramble City (toyline)|''Scramble City'' toyline]]. The team leader is larger than the other members and forms the main body of the combiner, while the others are smaller and form the limbs. The limbs are interchangeable, although there is always a generally-accepted “normal” formation. Further, the limbs are interchangeable from one Scramble City-style combiner to another, making for a large number of bizarre combinations. (See [[Abomenaticus]], [[Cybertron Super Scramble]], [[Comperian]], [[Destron Super Scramble]], and [[Scramble 7]].) Limbs are also able to attach to and augment Metroplex & Metrotitan (see "Notes" below). Note that this term is purely descriptive rather than being a proper name.

'''Special Team''': A synonym for Scramble City-style combiner. When the ''Scramble City'' toys were marketed in Europe they were referred to as Special Teams, and the term even appeared in the [[The Transformers (Marvel comic)|UK comic book]] series. The term was used in some marketing materials in the US, such as packing lists for the toy [[Case|case assortments]], but never appeared in US fiction until the [[Transformers: The Ultimate Guide|''Ultimate Guide'']] was published in 2004. It was also used as the name for a [[Target]] [[exclusive]] five-pack of [[redeco]]s of ''[[Transformers: Cybertron (toyline)|Cybertron]]'' [[Legends Class|Legends]] toys released under the ''[[Transformers: Universe (2008 toyline)|Universe]]'' banner, "Special Team Leaders". Ironically, none of these toys were actually ''combiners''—the term simply referred to the ''characters'', since the redecos were [[homage]]s to the leaders of Generation 1 combiner teams, four of which were Scramble City-style combiners.

'''Super Robot''': A robot which is formed through the combination of two or more Transformers. Powered-up [[robot mode]]s composed of only one Transformer who combines with some of their own accessories are often also referred to as Super Robots, such as [[Powermaster]] [[Optimus Prime (G1)|Optimus Prime]] or the incarnations of Prime from ''Robots in Disguise'' and all three ''[[Unicron Trilogy]]'' series. It is probably safe to informally refer to any such mode as a Super Robot (thus including, say, G1 [[Ultra Magnus (G1)|Ultra Magnus]] and ''Energon'' [[Landmine (Energon)|Landmine]]). Note that this means Super Robots are not always combiners and do not have to have their own personality. Rather, Super Robot and combiner are two different categories of Transformer which ''sometimes'' overlap. A one-robot Super Robot may also be referred to as that robot's [[Super Mode]].

'''Fusilateral quintrocombiner''': Coined by [[Simon Furman]] in [[Swarm (issue)|issue 9]] of the [[Transformers: Generation 2 (Marvel)|''Generation 2'' comic]] to refer to the [[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticons]]. It presumably is meant to refer to all the Scramble City-style teams except possibly the Seacons, as their combined forms consist of six robots (not five, so they could possibly be fusilateral hexocombiners I guess...). It may also apply to the Predacons, but it doesn't matter because nobody uses this term anyway.

'''Amalgam model''': Yet another obscure term for combiners first used by Simon Furman via [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] in the "[[Devastation Derby!]]" story in the UK comic books.

==Types of combiner==
As mentioned above, most combiners form a super robot. However, there are many other types of combining in the Transformers multiverse.

In the ''Energon'' franchise, most of the Autobot characters were able to combine with each other in pairs much like ''[[Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers: Victory (franchise)|Victory]]'''s [[Multiforce]]. These combined forms can probably be considered Super Robots. The combined form was simply controlled by whichever Autobot was "on top". Make whatever jokes you will.

Generation 1 contains many examples of combined [[alternate mode]]s, including [[Reflector (G1)|Reflector]], [[Dreadwing (G1)|Dreadwing]], [[Big Powered]], the [[Triple Combination Battlestar Attack|Battlestar]], and the [[Targetmaster|Double Targetmasters]].

The [[Micromaster Combiner]]s are made up of Transformers whose altmodes combine into vehicles, with one partner being the front and another the rear. The combined forms do not have specific names. Thanks to the generic peg-and-socket connection method used, any two Micromaster combiners can be linked (though some such as the dump truck/space shuttle combo may attract comment). These altmode combiners should not be confused with the Micromaster "Sixcombiners", six-robot teams who combine to form a Super Robot.

The [[Unicron Trilogy]]'s [[Mini-Con]]s brought to the fiction combined weapon modes, like the [[Star Saber (Armada)|Star Saber]] & [[Vorpal Saber]] [[sword]]s, [[Requiem Blaster (Armada)|Requiem Blaster]] cannon, and [[Skyboom (Armada)|Skyboom Shield]].

The [[Power Core Combiners]] use a different type of combining method. Instead of using 5 robots, the combined final robot is formed by one "Commander" type robot, and 4 different drones that form the arms and legs.

==Not combiners==
Not all cases of multiple things attaching to each other are combiners. As mentioned above, many Super Robots—which are formed through a conglomeration of parts—are not combiners. [[Landmine (Energon)|''Energon'' Landmine]], for example.

A similar case can be found in [[multi-component Transformer|Transformers who have two or more "components" which combine into a single entity]]. [[Sky Lynx (G1)|G1 Sky Lynx]] has lynx and dino-bird components, [[Omega Supreme (G1)|G1 Omega Supreme]] has tank, base, and rocket components, and [[Magmatron]] has three dinosaur components. However, all of these components are considered to be "part of" the overall Transformer, even through they can act independently. The [[Duocon]]s are another case of this sort. All of these examples are ''not'' combiners because there is only ''one'' Transformer involved in each of them, regardless of how many bodies that Transformer may simultaneously operate. Such robots are occasionally referred to as "Reverse Combiners" within the fandom.

(Confusing things further are the comics which treated Sky Lynx and the Duocons as triple changers, able to transform between the combined mode and the ones for individual components without any parts separating off.)

Sometimes a smaller Transformer will attach to and enhance a larger Transformer in some way. This is the case when Mini-Cons powerlink with bulks, as well as with [[Binary bonding|binary-bonded]] partners like [[Headmaster (technology)|Headmasters]], [[Powermaster]]s/[[Godmaster]]s, [[Kiss Player]]s and [[Breastforce]] members. Although these examples do include more than one Transformer (or a Transformer and a fleshling), they are not considered "combiners". The simplest justification for this is that, in these cases, the "combined" form is almost exactly the same in appearance as the non-combined form.

And sometimes [[Beast (G1)|things just combine for no real reason at all. Just deal with it. We hate it, oh God yes, but there it is. We're sorry.]]

==Fiction==
===Generation 1===
====Marvel Comics continuity====
=====Combiner teams=====
{{noteukonly}}
[[File:Constructiconsbornmarvel.jpg|left|upright=1.1|thumb|"...Well, at least our origin is consistent this time."]]
The [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicon]]s were designed and built by [[Shockwave (G1)|Shockwave]] as the first combiner team. They were given life through [[Matrix of Leadership|Creation Matrix]] energy stored in [[Optimus Prime (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Optimus Prime]]'s head. The Constructicons had considerable difficulty coordinating together as Devastator in their first mission. {{storylink|The Next Best Thing to Being There!}}

Optimus Prime assigned a secret project to the architect [[Grapple (G1)|Grapple]]. {{storylink|Rock and Roll-Out!}}

[[File:Superion drawing devastation derby.jpg|thumb|upright=0.85]]
''The [[Special Teams]] were first conceived within [[Buster Witwicky (G1)|Buster Witwicky]]'s mind shortly after the human had relinquished control of the Creation Matrix to Optimus Prime. Shockwave was able to view this data remotely and prepare for their development.'' {{storylink|Second Generation!}}

Grapple's project was finished and revealed as [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]], who was able to combine his rocket and tank modules into one mighty robot. This form of combination was considered inadequate next to the combination of the six Constructicon warriors, so the Autobots decided to learn learn how to utilize the more advanced technology. They staged an attack on a Decepticon coal mining base which drew out the Constructions. When they combined, [[Bumblebee (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Bumblebee]] was there recording their transformation pattern. {{storylink|Command Performances!}} [[File:Menasor superion heavy traffic.jpg|thumb|left]] They used this information to construct the [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbots]]. Unfortunately, they were forced to go on their first mission with only [[Silverbolt (G1)|Silverbolt]]'s personality programming completed, leaving the rest of the team, and [[Superion (G1)|Superion]], rather indifferent towards [[human]] casualties. {{storylink|Aerialbots over America!}} After their first mission proved a failure, Optimus Prime had [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] wipe their memory, and started reprogramming them with the Creation Matrix. However, [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]], who had gotten a lift to the ''[[Ark (G1)|Ark]]'' on Silverbolt's plane mode, had injected Optimus Prime with a [[cerebro-shell]] with which [[Megatron (G1)/Marvel Comics continuity|Megatron]] was able to steal energy from the Creation Matrix and bring his newly-built combiner team, the [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] to life. {{storylink|Heavy Traffic!}} The [[Protectobot (G1)|Protectobot]]s and [[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticon]]s were the next combiner teams to become part of their respective factions' Earth-bound crew. {{storylink|Afterdeath!}}

{{note|The exact origin of the Protectobots and Combaticons is not revealed.}}

[[File:Predaking gone but not forgotten.jpg|thumb|upright=1.1]]
''The combining [[Predacon (G1)|Predacons]] were summoned to Earth from Cybertron by Megatron.'' {{storylink|Prey!}} The Predacons were ''again'' summoned to Earth by Shockwave. {{storylink|Gone but Not Forgotten!}} The [[Technobot (G1)|Technobot]]s were part of [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]]'s crew and the [[Terrorcon (G1)|Terrorcon]]s were part of [[Scorponok (G1)|Scorponok]]'s crew on [[Cybertron (planet)|Cybertron]]. They had the ability to combine. {{storylink|The Transformers: Headmasters|Headmasters}} ''The [[Seacon (G1)|Seacon]]s were combiners that were summoned from Cybertron to Earth by Shockwave.'' {{storylink|Enemy Action!}} They later came under the command of [[Ratbat (G1)|Ratbat]]. {{storylink|Club Con!}}

{{note|It is not revealed how the Combiner technology that was developed on Earth was found among these Cybertron based crews. Some of the Decepticons on Cybertron were in contact with Earth Decepticons, so perhaps the technology was passed along and the Cybertron Autobots stole it from the Cybertron Decepticons. Or the Cybertron Transformers just developed the technology independently.}}

=====Other combiners=====
[[Darkwing (G1)|Darkwing]] and [[Dreadwind (G1)|Dreadwind]] combine to form [[Dreadwing (G1)|Dreadwing]]. {{storylink|People Power!}} They appear to keep their individual personalities in their combined mode instead of merging their minds.

====Generation 1 cartoon continuity====
=====''The Transformers'' cartoon=====
On Cybertron, the [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]] were existing Transformers who were brainwashed by [[Megatron (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Megatron]] to become Decepticons. Megatron also adapted them with the ability to combine into [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]] to challenge [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]]. Omega Supreme pursued the Constructicons for millions of years. {{storylink|The Secret of Omega Supreme (episode)|The Secret of Omega Supreme}} In 1984, the Constructicons were (re?)created on [[Earth]] with the ability to combine to bolster the Decepticons' strength. {{storylink|Heavy Metal War}}

{{note|For more on the conflicting origin of the Constructicons, see [[Constructicon (G1)#Origin inconsistency|here]].}}

The [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticon]]s and [[Aerialbot (G1)|Aerialbot]]s were built from scratch and given personality by [[Vector Sigma]]. They were designed with the ability to combine. {{storylink|The Key to Vector Sigma, Part 2}}

[[Starscream (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Starscream]] installed the [[Combaticon (G1)|Combaticon]]s' [[personality component]]s into junked military vehicles. This brought the vehicles to life with the ability to combine. {{storylink|Starscream's Brigade}}

The [[Protectobot (G1)|Protectobot]]s became part of the Autobot forces on Earth and were able to combine. {{storylink|The Revenge of Bruticus}}

Years later, the [[Predacon (G1)|Predacon]]s originated as combiners under the command of the [[Quintesson]]s. {{storylink|Five Faces of Darkness, Part 5}} The combinable [[Terrorcon (G1)|Terrorcon]]s were part of [[Galvatron (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Galvatron]]'s troops. An intellectually enhanced [[Grimlock (G1)/Generation 1 cartoon continuity|Grimlock]] created the [[Technobot (G1)|Technobot]]s with the ability to combine. {{storylink|Grimlock's New Brain}}

=====''Wings Universe''=====
{{Wingsnote}}
Combining technology was the brainchild of the Decepticon warlord [[Deathsaurus (Victory)|Deathsaurus]], {{storylink|Hasbro Transformers Collectors' Club issue 36|Bruticus's ''Wings Universe'' profile}} who debuted the technology about nine million years ago on his new recruits the Combaticons, giving them the ability to combine into [[Bruticus (G1)|Bruticus]]. {{storylink|The Coming Storm: Part 5}} Later, Megatron defeated Deathsaurus to become sole leader of the Decepticons, stealing Deathsaurus's technology to augment his Constructicons with the ability to form Devastator. {{storylink|Battle Lines, Part 5}}

====Dreamwave ''Generation One'' continuity====
Experiments in combining were conducted both before and during the early phase of the civil war, in a process known as [[mass intellect]]. However, the combined forms suffered in that the stronger minds tended to drown out the weaker ones. Following the failure of the planetary engine turbines, the Constructicons turned their attention to the mass intellect process. They eventually developed a hyper vortex processor that managed to preserve the individuals minds in the combined whole. Testing the process on themselves, the Constructicons combined into Devastator. While the Constructicons were able to preserve their minds, Devastator was hampered by the need of all six Constructicons to agree on a course of action, which was usually destroy the Autobots. As a result, the combined intellects of the Constructicons did not translate to Devastator, who instead suffered serious mental disabilities. Despite this, Devastator's destructive capabilities greatly pleased Megatron, and he ordered the Constructicons to continue their experiments. {{storylink|Transformers: The Ultimate Guide}}
{{groupstub}}

====IDW Generation 1 continuity====
Combination between Cybertronians dates back to the era of the Thirteen Tribes, sometime after the departure of the Knights of Cybertron. [[Nexus Prime (Classics)|Nexus Prime]] wielded the [[Enigma of Combination]], a relic of unknown power that facilitated combined forms between two or more Cybertronians. He engineered the Headmaster-style linkage between humanoid Cybertronians and the beast-bots of [[Onyx Prime (G1)|Onyx Prime]], and likely other forms of combination as well. {{storylink|Earthfall Part 3: The Mind Bomb|The Mind Bomb}} [[Galvatron (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Galvatron]] of the Darklands saw these mergers as an abomination, and warred against these early Combiners when the Thirteen Tribes fractured. Galvatron killed Nexus Prime in combat and captured the Enigma but was unable to destroy it. He decided to launch it into space in hopes that it would crash and burn up in some star.

[[File:Monstructor-idw1.jpg|thumb|left|200px|Wubba wubba wubba is Monstructor's song.]]

After the remaining Thirteen abandoned Cybertron, the remnants of the Thirteen Tribes came under the rule of Nova Major, who assumed the mantle of his former master [[Prima (G1)|Prima]] to become [[Nova Prime]]. The new Prime instructed his chief theoretical scientist [[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] to find a way to recreate Combiner technology without the Enigma. Galvatron opposed these experiments, but concealed his role in the death of Nexus Prime. {{storylink|The Crucible}}

[[Jhiaxus (G2)|Jhiaxus]] eventually succeeded in creating a form of Combiner technology, resulting in [[Pretender Monster|six volunteers]] being merged into [[Monstructor (G1)|Monstructor]]. Unfortunately, in this first prototype, the merging process led to insanity, and they were sealed away by [[Omega Supreme (G1)|Omega Supreme]]. {{storylink|Spotlight: Optimus Prime}} {{storylink|Primus: All Good Things}} [[Shockwave (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Shockwave]], a student of Jhiaxus, continued his combiner research as part of the Decepticon army, at the insistence of Megatron. {{storylink|Shockwaves}} [[Ambulon (G1)|Ambulon]] was modified into a leg as part of an experimental Decepticon combiner, but he defected and the project seemingly went nowhere. {{storylink|How Ratchet Got His Hands Back}}

Having escaped after millions of years, the Monstructor components captured by the Autobots {{storylink|Spotlight: Optimus Prime}} and placed into the custody of [[Fortress Maximus (G1)|Fortress Maximus]] while [[Jetfire (G1)|Jetfire]] and the [[Technobot (G1)|Technobot]] studied them with the goal of rehabilitating them. The technology stymied Jetfire, who estimated it would take a lot more study before progress could be made. He didn't get the chance, however, since the "Monstructor Six" were soon captured by the [[Decepticon Secret Service]]. {{storylink|Spotlight: Arcee}} Monstructor was then captured by unidentified minions of [[Nova Prime|Nemesis Prime]] {{storylink|Spotlight: Hardhead}} and used to guard the [[Nega-Core]] on Rotan. He was engaged in combat by the Decepticon Secret Service and [[Arcee (G1)|Arcee]] while the Autobots sneaked around him. {{storylink|Spotlight: Sideswipe}} Following the battle, he fell under Decepticon control and was put under the command of [[Bludgeon (G1)|Bludgeon]]. {{storylink|All Hail Megatron issue 15|Lost and Found}}

Prior to the Surge, [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] followed up on the missing Shockwave's combiner research. The Decepticons finally completed their own combiner in the form of [[Devastator (G1)|Devastator]], bypassing the insanity normally caused by uniting the minds of several individuals by having the like-minded [[Constructicon (G1)|Constructicons]] form him, and deliberately suppressing their individual personalities in the combination. {{storylink|Before the Dawn}} After the devastation caused by Devastator during the Surge events on Earth, Spike Witwicky of Skywatch prioritized the sanctioning of the Constructicons. He personally hunted down Scrapper and killed him to prevent Devastator from ever being reformed. {{storylink|Scrapper (issue)|Scrapper}} After retrieving Scrapper's corpse from Skywatch, however, the Constructicons demonstrated the ability to continue forming Devastator, albeit with a "dead leg". {{storylink|Chaos Part Three: Kings|Kings}}

Several years after Devastator's first appearance, [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]] used illegal combiner technology to modify the [[Stunticon (G1)|Stunticons]] to be able to form [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]]. Swindle wanted Menasor to kill [[Ultra Magnus (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Ultra Magnus]], any other Autobots as were in reach, and steal a space ship [[Hot Rod (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Hot Rod]]'s Autobots and the Decepticons which Swindle had both been working on to get off Earth. {{storylink|Things Fall Apart, Part 4: "Enemies of the System"|Enemies of the System}} However, the minds of the Stunticons couldn't unite properly and kept conflicting, causing Menasor to be defeated by the Autobots. {{storylink|Things Fall Apart, Part 5: "Earthworks"|Earthworks}}

[[File:IDWRID14 prowlstator.jpg|thumb|right|175px]]

Using a mysterious energy emitted by Cybertron's core, [[D-Void]] combined [[Galvatron (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Galvatron]]'s [[Sweep (G1)|Sweep]] army with brainwashed Decepticon soldiers, creating a [[Deceptigod|giant monster]] under the entity's direct control. {{storylink|Chaos Part Three: Kings|Kings}} Inspired by D-Void's ability to create a powerful combined body by repressing the wills of the individuals, [[Megatron (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Megatron]] learned to manipulate the very same energy. He maintained the signal on the outskirts of the New Iacon settlement, discombobulating the sensors of individual Cybertronians who ventured too far from the growing city. Multiple Cybertronians, such as the Aerialbots, experienced a different effect under the signal's influence. Unnatural conflict developed between the Aerialbots, pitting them against one another until they spontaneously reformatted into a single combined entity (perhaps as a CNA-level defense mechanism). [[Ironhide (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Ironhide]] and the Dinobots experienced a similar reaction when they went looking for the Aerialbots, until they encountered Superion. Together, Ironhide, the Dinobots and combined Aerialbots (now known as [[Superion (G1)|Superion]]) apparently made a large enough group that the combiner signal stopped affecting them. {{storylink|Dinobot Hunt}} {{storylink|Night and the City}}

Meanwhile, [[Bombshell (G1)|Bombshell]] and the Decepticon leadership had secretly taken control of the Autobot strategist [[Prowl (G1)/IDW Generation 1 continuity|Prowl]], retrofitting his quarters in New Iacon as "The Black Room", an experimental theatre off the security grid where they could improve further on the combiner signal and technology. Prowl and Megatron were both re-engineered with new bodies, part of a modular design with the similarly modified Constructicons to create Devastator from different components. {{storylink|Before the Dawn}} Prowl was forced to link with the Constructicons to form a Devastator under the control of Bombshell's cerebro-shells, but when Arcee killed Bombshell, Devastator went haywire. A Prowl-centric Devastator personality emerged from the combiner, rampaging out of control and even ripping apart Superion, who had returned from the wastelands. {{storylink|Plan for Everything}} Ironhide managed to reach Prowl's core personality within the combiner, encouraging him to separate. When Megatron tried to trigger his own Devastator combination with the Constructicons, the Autobots stopped him. {{storylink|Heavy Is the Head}} As a result of these events, the Constructicons began to see Prowl as a kindred spirit, and allied themselves with the Autobots in order to remain with him. {{storylink|Second Exodus}} Prowl has since become the de facto leader of the Constructicons, and tactically deployed Devastator on several occasions. {{storylink|Black Planet: Dark Cybertron Chapter 11|Black Planet}}

Monstructor resurfaced after the Chaos war, allied with Jhiaxus and Bludgeon. The Combiner prototype opposed Orion Pax and his allies on several occasions until Shockwave's plans were finally obstructed. {{storylink|Syndromica (1)}} {{storylink|Syndromica (2)}} {{storylink|The Becoming: Dark Cybertron Chapter 10|The Becoming}} {{storylink|Black Planet: Dark Cybertron Chapter 11|Black Planet}} {{storylink|...And the Damage Done: Dark Cybertron Finale|...And the Damage Done}}

[[File:MistakesAndMayhem-Defensor.jpg|thumb|left|200px|"To fight monsters, we created monsters of our own."]]

Out of concern for the destructive potential of the various Combiners, Starscream (as ruler of Cybertron) ordered a team of scientists to work on repairing the damaged Superion. [[Wheeljack (G1)|Wheeljack]] agreed to assist in the repair efforts, and volunteers like [[Powerglide (G1)|Powerglide]] and [[Alpha Bravo]] have presented themselves to become part of the Superion combiner as necessary. {{storylink|The World of Tomorrow}} The [[Enigma of Combination]], recovered from Earth by Prowl-Devastator and stolen by Starscream's agent [[Scoop (G1)|Scoop]], {{storylink|The Onyx Interface Conclusion: The Obliterati}} was used to accelerate repairs. The Enigma was also used to enhance [[Menasor (G1)|Menasor]], whom [[Swindle (G1)|Swindle]] immediately set loose on [[Caminus]] to rob the planet blind. {{storylink|First Contact (IDW)|First Contact}} Subsequently, Superion was deployed to successfully stop Menasor. {{storylink|The Sum and Its Parts}} However, Prowl got wind of contact between Cybertron and Caminus and returned with the Constructicons to Cybertron, {{storylink|The Possible Light}} forming Devastator to forcefully sever interplanetary relations. Even the might of Superion failed against Devastator, and so Starscream drafted the newly-arrived informal association of "[[Protectobot (G1)|Protectobot]]s" to form [[Defensor (G1)|Defensor]], who finally stopped the rampaging giant. {{storylink|Mistakes and Mayhem}}

With Prowl in custody, Starscream rebuilt Devatator using the Enigma, integrating Scoop into the gestalt in the hopes that his religious zeal to his "chosen one" would make Devastator's psyche easier to control. Prowl, down not but out, countered by roping Rattrap into stealing the Enigma, and causing a distraction by liberating the Stunticons, who combined into Menasor and attacked the Space Bridge. He was intercepted by the three other combiners. Realizing that time was running out, Prowl used the Enigma to create a makeshift combiner from nearby Autobots- Optimus Prime, Ironhide, Sunstreaker, Mirage, and himself. Now operating as "[[Optimus Maximus (G1)|Optimus Maximus]]", this new combiner headed out to put a stop to the mayhem. {{storylink|You, Me, and the Universe}}

Devastator was furious at Prowl for "abandoning" him, and this anger overwhelmed Scoop's ability to keep the combiner in line. Optimus Maximus, after pulling himself together, teamed up with Superion and Defensor in a fight that spanned the galaxy. The trio ultimately emerged triumphant, with both Menasor and Devastator knocked back into their component 'bots. Optimus Maximus willingly split himself apart in the aftermath so that Prowl could be arrested. {{storylink|Combiner Wars Part 5}}

The combination process appears to have deeper ramifications — and deleterious psychological side-effects — for Cybertronians; Galvatron described the process as "rotting away the individual". {{storylink|Onyx Interface Part Three: ONoffON|OnoffON}} After becoming part of Devastator, Prowl began suffering energon "nosebleeds" {{storylink|Earthfall Part 3: The Mind Bomb|The Mind Bomb}} and began unconsciously referring to his Constructicon teammates as "Scrapper". {{storylink|Earthfall Chapter 5: I Dream of Wires|I Dream of Wires}} Likewise, the five Constructions started losing their individual quirks and personality traits, speaking with an increasingly unified voice. {{storylink|Onyx Interface Part Three: ONoffON|OnoffON}} Defensor and Superion both showed an unwillingness to split into their components, which worried Optimus Prime. Prowl referred to their new gestalt modes as the team's new "normal form", and noted that it was difficult for combiner teams to stay separate. {{storylink|You, Me, and the Universe}} After his arrest, Prowl taunted Optimus Prime, arguing that since they had formed Optimus Maximus together, a part of Prowl would always exist in Prime's mind. Prowl also mentioned that his experiences as Devastator meant that he no longer saw the Decepticons as enemies, but as a part of him. {{storylink|Now and On Earth}}

Meanwhile, the Transformers of an unspecified Cybertronian colony world evolved [[Micromaster Combiner]]s. When merged with [[Metroplex (G1)|Metroplex]]'s mind, [[Windblade (G1)|Windblade]] caught a glimpse of [[Vanquish (G1)|Vanquish]] and [[Fireshot (G1)|Fireshot]] separating from their combined vehicle mode. {{storylink|Windblade issue 4}}

The [[Ammonite]]s, a diminutive faction of robotic shapeshifters far more advanced than Cybertronians, were "omnicombinational": any Ammonite could combine with many others into a wide variety of forms, even mimicking [[Paddox|Cybertronians]]. {{storylink|Little Victories}}

===2001 ''Robots in Disguise''===
Combination was taken for granted and combiners were commonplace. (About half the characters are combiners, depending how you count.) No special explanation of their origin was offered.

====One-robot combiners====
*In the television show, [[Megatron (RID)|Megatron/Galvatron]] was able to transform into his hand mode and then combine with his ship, the ''[[Megastar]]''.

====Two-robot combiners====
*[[Optimus Prime (RID)|Optimus Prime]] is capable of combining with his [[Relatives|brother]] [[Ultra Magnus (RID)|Ultra Magnus]] to form [[Omega Prime]].

====Three-robot combiners====
*[[Team Bullet Train]], consisting of [[Midnight Express (RID)|Midnight Express]], [[Railspike (RID)|Railspike]], and [[Rapid Run (RID)|Rapid Run]], combine into [[Rail Racer (RID)|Rail Racer]].
*[[Fortress Maximus (RID)|Fortress Maximus]] is technically a three robot combination, although most of those robots could be considered drones. [[Cerebros (RID)|Cerebros]] and [[Emissary]] combine together to form Fortress Maximus's head, which connects to the body.

====Four-robot combiners====
*The [[Build Team]], [[Wedge]], [[Grimlock (RID)|Grimlock]], [[Heavy Load (RID)|Heavy Load]], and [[Hightower (RID)|Hightower]], can combine into the robot [[Landfill (RID)|Landfill]].

====Five-robot combiners====
*The combined form of the [[Commandos]] is a being named [[Ruination (RID)|Ruination]]. This combiner is controlled almost entirely by [[Mega-Octane]], in order to be a more effective, coordinated being than most other combiners.

===Unicron Trilogy===
====''Armada'' cartoon====
[[Optimus Prime (Armada)/Cartoon continuity|Optimus Prime]] could combine with his trailer to form a Super Mode robot. With this ability at his disposal, he beat the tar out of every Decepticon at least once. Then a new magic mushroom appeared: [[Jetfire (Armada)|Jetfire]]. During a battle with the Decepticons, the Autobots were totally getting slagged by [[Megatron (Armada)/Cartoon continuity|Megatron]]'s new tactician [[Thrust (Armada)|Thrust]] and his 'henchman' [[Tidal Wave (Armada)|Tidal Wave]]. Right when it seemed hopeless, a space shuttle fell from the sky and combined with Optimus to form Jet Optimus. Needless to say, Megatron was rather surprised. The Decepticons kept trying to beat the Autobots and miserably failed each time, frequently due to this new team-up, which also helped the Autobots survive and win [[the Unicron Battles]]. A third magic mushroom appeared late on in the series literally out of nowhere. Prime's new 'shroom, named [[Overload (Armada)|Overload]], formed a large pair of cannons on top of Super Optimus's shoulders. Overload's additional firepower, combined with the already impressive firepower of the Requiem Blaster, enabled Optimus to destroy the being known as [[Sideways (Armada)|Sideways]].

The Decepticons were not without their own combiner; Tidal Wave was able to combine with Megatron to form additional armor and a back-mounted [[jet pack|rocket pack]]. The only practical upshot of this is that Megatron could now fly, which came in handy from time to time.

The three [[Mini-Con]] companions of the humans Rad, Alexis and Carlos could band together to form Perceptor. There were three other Mini-Con combiner teams who could form the [[Star Saber (Armada)|Star Saber]], the [[Skyboom (Armada)|Skyboom Shield]], and the [[Requiem Blaster (Armada)|Requiem Blaster]]. A fourth weapon existed as a [[Vorpal Saber|dark clone]] of the Star Saber, wielded by the evil [[Nemesis Prime (Armada)|Nemesis Prime]].

====''Linkage'' comic====
The non-flying members of the evil [[Speed Chaser Mini-Con Team]] could form the [[Magnawing]] aircraft to transport themselves around. {{storylink|Linkage Part 4}}

====''Energon''====
During this period, one couldn't swing a dead cybercat without hitting a combiner, as every Autobot, save for the Omnicons, was capable of merging with another, or with an augmenting portion of his vehicle mode. Then the [[Bruticus Maximus (Energon)|three]] [[Constructicon Maximus|Maximus]] [[Superion Maximus|teams]] arrived, giving the Decepticons two five-part combiners and the Autobots one.
{{see|Spark of Combination}}

====''Cybertron'' comic====
The [[Deep Space Mini-Con Team]] could combine into the [[Umbral Blaster]]. {{storylink|Revelations Part 5}}

====''TransTech''====
The [[Sky Terror Mini-Con Team]] could form the [[Chaos Saber]] while the [[Zephyr Blade Mini-Con Team]] could form the [[Pyro Saber]].

===Live-action film series===
Experimental combiner technology was developed by the Decepticons for combat advantage (yeah, that's right, the 'Cons do invent stuff themselves sometimes) and then used on the [[Constructicon (ROTF)|Constructicon]]s who are able to form [[Devastator (ROTF)|Devastator]]. Comfort was rather decidedly not on the top of the list of priorities and, as a result, the process is brutally painful to the Transformers involved, which also makes the combiners fuse in a very aggressive and painful manner (it's a vicious circle). The mental and physical torture involved leaves Devastator only interested in causing destruction.<ref>Devastator's [http://www.hasbro.com/transformers/en_US/discover/Battle-Bios.cfm Battle Bio] at Hasbro.com</ref>

[[Knock Out (ROTF)|Knock Out]] hopes to undergo the "combination retrofit" process.<ref>Knock Out's toy bio.</ref>

{{note|No details are given regarding this "combination retrofit" technology, but it is a possible factor in [[Skids (ROTF)|Skids]] and [[Mudflap (ROTF)|Mudflap]]'s ice cream truck mode.}}

Combiners are not limited to one combination scheme. Their final form may also vary.<ref>[http://unicron-events-interviews.blogspot.com/2009/10/hasbro-q-10212009.html Hasbro's answer to Unicron.com] as part of the [[Hasbro Q&A/October 2009#Unicron.com|October 2009 Q&A]].</ref>

===Aligned continuity===
Combining is an art as old as Cybertron itself; the very first combiner, [[Nexus Prime (Prime)|Nexus Prime]], was also one of the [[Thirteen]]. [[Shockwave (WFC)|Shockwave]] would eventually experiment with combination technology.
Before the [[Great War (Prime)|Great War]], Shockwave experimented on the [[Combaticon (WFC)|Combaticons]] during his time at [[Crystal City]]. Their combined form, the savage and uncontrollable [[Bruticus (WFC)|Bruticus]], was deemed too dangerous and was put in stasis for safety.

In [[Kaon]], he created three combining [[Insecticon (WFC)|Insecticon]]s, which were torn apart by [[Megatron (WFC)|Megatron]] during a gladiatorial pitfight. During the war, the Combaticons were re-activated and opted to join the Decepticons, putting their nigh-unstoppable combined form to good use. Midway through the war, he perfected his experiments, creating the [[Constructicon (WFC)|Constructicon]] combiner known as [[Devastator (WFC)|Devastator]]. Autobot saboteurs managed to steal and reverse-engineer combiner technology, and created [[Defensor (WFC)|Defensor]], who battled Devastator to a standstill at the [[Tagan Heights]]. {{storylink|Transformers: Exodus}}

The five [[Aerialbot (WFC)|Aerialbots]] aboard the ''[[Ark (WFC)|Ark]]'' were combiners; their gestalt form of [[Superion (Prime)|Superion]] was instrumental in rescuing both Autobots and Decepticons from the Quintesson-controlled [[Aquatron]]. {{storylink|Transformers: Retribution|Retribution}}

The Decepticon criminal [[Chop Shop (RID)|Chop Shop]] was formed from five identical robots. Notably, he could function without all of his limbs in-place and could appropriate minicons like [[Fixit (RID)|Fixit]] as replacement limbs. {{storylink|More than Meets the Eye (RID)|More than Meets the Eye}}

==Combiner list==
{{note|Due to the many uses of redecoes as new characters and convenience for reading, each mold is listed on its own line, with all different-character decoes/retools on the same line.}}
;Combiners with two members
*[[Optimus Prime (Armada)/toys|Jet Optimus]]
*[[Mega-Dinobot]]
*[[Decibel]]
*[[Legout]]
*[[Slamdance (G1)]]
*[[Squawkbox]]
*[[Dreadwing (G1)]] / [[Darkwings]]
*[[Stormtrooper (Cybertronian)|Stormtrooper]]s
*[[Multiforce]] members
**[[Wingwaver]]
**[[Dashtacker]]
**[[Machtackle]] 
*[[Dreadwing (G2)]] and [[Smokescreen (G2)]]'s combined form / [[Formation Scream]] / [[Dreadwing (RID)]] / [[Gigant Sniper]]
*[[Powered Master]]s
**[[Sky Powered]]
**[[Land Powered]]
**[[Big Powered]] ''(actually consists of three members)''
*[[Powerlinx#Energon|Silver and Gold Powerlinx users]]
*[[Safeguard (Animated)]]
*[[Skids (ROTF)]] and [[Mudflap (ROTF)]] in ice cream truck mode

;Combiners formed by main bodies with power-up partners
{{See also|Super Mode}}
*[[Ginrai|God Ginrai]]
*[[Star Saber (Victory)|Victory Saber]]
*[[Omega Prime]]
*The combined form of [[Optimus Prime (Armada)|Optimus Prime]] and [[Wing Saber (Energon)|Wing Saber]]
*[[Optimus Supreme (Energon)]]
*[[Optimus Prime Super Modes#Live-action film series|Power Up Optimus Prime]] (''aka'' [[Optimus Prime Super Modes#Live-action film series|Jetpower Optimus Prime]])

{{note|Optimus Prime and Jetfire are not a combiner in the fiction — Optimus simply uses Jetfire's corpse as parts to enhance his strength and firepower.}}

;Combiners with three or more members (non-Scramble City-type)
*[[Devastator (G1)]]
*[[Devastator (ROTF)]]
*[[Predaking (G1)|Predaking]]
*[[Raiden (Headmasters)|Raiden]]
*[[Monstructor (G1)]] / [[Dinoking (Victory)|Dinoking]]
*[[Road Caesar]]
*[[Liokaiser (Victory)|Liokaiser]]
*[[Big Rescue Force]]
*[[Landcross (Victory)|Landcross]]
*[[Magnaboss]] / [[Magnaboss II]]
*[[MegaWing Galvatron]]
*[[Dark MegaWing Galvatron]]
*[[Prime Processing Unit]] {{storylink|Collect and Save}}
*[[Tripredacus]] / [[Tripledacus]]
*[[Tri-Rex]]
*[[Rail Racer (RID)]]
*[[Landfill (RID)]] / [[Constructicon Devastator (Ultra)]]
*Unnamed [[Minibot combiner]] {{storylink|Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers issue 8|Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers issue 8}}
*[[Beast (G1)|Beast]] {{storylink|The Beast Within|The Beast Within}}
*[[Insectrain]] {{storylink|Hearts of Steel issue 2}}
*[[Reedman]]
*"[[Deceptigod]]"
*[[Abominus (Prime)]] / [[Goradora]]

;Triple Combination combiners
*[[Gekisoumaru|DaiGekisou]]
*[[Kenzan|DaiKenzan]]
*[[Gekisoumaru|GoGekisou]]
*[[Ganoh|GoGanoh]]
*[[Hishoumaru|GoHishou]]
*[[Jinbu|GoJinbu]]
*[[Kenzan|GoKenzan]]
*[[Sensuimaru|GoSensui]]

;Scramble City-type combiners
*[[Bruticus (G1)]] / [[Battle Gaia (OC)|Battle Gaia]] / [[Ruination (RID)|Ruination]]
*[[Defensor (G1)]] / [[Guard City]]
*[[Menasor (G1)]]
*[[Superion (G1)]]
*[[Abominus (G1)]]
*[[Computron (G1)|Computron]]
*[[Piranacon (G1)|Piranacon]]<ref name="seacon">With extra "limb" robot used as weapon.</ref> / [[King Poseidon]]<ref name="seacon" /> / [[God Neptune (BWII)]] / [[God Neptune (BWSG)]]
*[[Bruticus (WFC)]] / [[Ruination (FOC)]]
*[[Optimus Maximus (G1)|Optimus Maximus]]
*[[Victorion]]
*[[Sky Reign]]

;Official mix-n-match Scramble City-type combiners
*[[Abomenaticus]]
*[[Comperian]]
*[[Cybertron Super Scramble]]
*[[Destron Super Scramble]]
*[[Scramble 7]]
*[[Ultra Prime]]
*[[Galvatronus]]
*[[Betatron]]

;Micromaster-type combiners
*[[Micromaster Combiner]] Squads
**[[Barrage (Micromaster)|Barrage]] and [[Heave]]
**[[Blackout (G1)|Blackout]] and [[Spaceshot]]
**[[Blast Master]] and [[Phaser]]
**[[Direct-Hit (G1)|Direct-Hit]] and [[Power Punch (G1)|Power Punch]]
**[[Excavator (G1)|Excavator]] and [[Stonecruncher (G1)|Stonecruncher]] / [[Retro]] and [[Surge (G1)|Surge]]
**[[Fireshot (G1)|Fireshot]] and [[Vanquish (G1)|Vanquish]]
**[[Full-Barrel]] and [[Overflow]]
**[[Grit (G1)|Grit]] and [[Knockout (G1)|Knockout]]
**[[Half-Track (G1)|Half-Track]] and [[Meltdown (G1)|Meltdown]]
**[[Hammer (G1)|Hammer]] and [[Sledge (G1)|Sledge]] / [[Cement-Head]] and [[Terror-Tread]]
**[[Missile Master]] and [[Moonrock]]
**[[Oiler]] and [[Slide]]
**[[Power Run]] and [[Strikedown]]
**[[Roadburner]] and [[Wheel Blaze]]
*[[Sixliner]] / [[Sixtrain]]<ref>Sixtrain was redecoed and retooled from Sixliner.</ref> / [[Rail Racer (Universe)]]<ref>Universe Rail Racer uses the same deco as Takara's 2003 redecoed "reissue" of Sixtrain.</ref>
*[[Sixbuilder]] / [[Decepticon Sixbuilder]] / [[Constructicon Devastator (Micromaster)]]
*[[Sixturbo]] / [[Defensor (Universe)]]
*[[Sixwing|Sixwing / Berserker Sixwing / Destron Sixwing]] / [[Superion (Universe)]]

;Mini-Con combiners
*[[Perceptor (Armada)#Armada 3|Perceptor (Armada)]] / [[Perceptor (Universe)]]
*[[Perceptor (Armada)#Energon 3|Perceptor (Energon)]] / [[Heavy Metal (Energon)|Heavy Metal]] / [[Windcharger (Energon)]] / [[Perceptor (Armada)#Cybertron|Perceptor (Cybertron)]]
*[[Mirror]] / [[Nightcreeper]]
*[[Requiem Blaster (Armada)|Requiem Blaster]] / [[Umbral Blaster]]
*[[Skyboom (Armada)]] / [[Magnawing]]
*[[Star Saber (Armada)]] / [[Vorpal Saber]] / [[Energon Saber]] / [[Cryo Saber]] / [[Chaos Saber]] / [[Pyro Saber]]
*[[Centuritron]]

;Maximus-type [[Powerlinx]] combiners
*[[Bruticus Maximus (Energon)]] / [[Bruticus (G1)|Bruticus Maximus (G1)]] (Universe) / [[Bruticus Maximus (ROTF)]]
*[[Constructicon Maximus]] / [[Devastator (G1)|Constructicon Devastator (Classics)]]
*[[Superion Maximus]] / [[Superion (G1)]] (Universe) / [[Superion (ROTF)]]
*[[Nexus Prime (Classics)|Nexus Prime]]

;"Omnicombinational" [[Stentarian]] combiners
*[[16444/9]]
*[[Paddox]]
*[[Centuritron]]

==Unused concepts==
[[File:Generations Street Combiner.jpg|upright=0.85|thumb|He transforms into a traffic jam.]]
Combiners were a very popular idea during the Generation 1 toyline and as such there are loads of scrapped combiner designs that never got past the drawing board. Among them were:
*A Scramble City-style dinosaur combiner. The body is a T-Rex, while the limbs are a Pterodactyl (right arm), Ankylosaurus (left leg), Dimetrodon (left arm), and Styracosaurus (right leg)<ref>[[Transformers Generations Deluxe]], p22</ref>
*A decidedly goofy organic insect combiner composed of a stag beetle (right leg), another beetle (left leg), grasshopper (left arm), fly (right arm), and a cockroach body.<ref name="p99">[[Transformers Generations Deluxe]], p99</ref>
*A cybernetic beast combiner that did not form a robot, but rather a large cybernetic monster. It is formed from a cyber bat, mole, stag beetle, and a couple of fish things.<ref name="p99" />
*A fifteen (!) vehicle Micromaster combiner where the only attached parts not contained by the component robots were the large robot fists. This combiner consists of three uniformly colored teams (in a similar fashion to the vehicular Voltron of the same time period):
**Air team (blue)- two jets, two helicopters, a space shuttle.
**Construction team (green)- a hauler, a bulldozer, a steam shovel, a tank (don't ask), a missile carrier (don't ask).
**Street team (red)- two cars, a motorcycle, a formula racer, a jeep.<ref name="p108">[[Transformers Generations Deluxe]], p108</ref>
*Another, simpler dinosaur combiner composed of a Pterodactyl, a not-really-a-Stegosaurus, and a T-Rex with a very large head. The three combine into a dinosaur thing similar to [[Magmatron]]'s combined dino mode. It shares many visual characteristics with Tomy's relatively simple robot designs.<ref name="p108" />
[[File:ClassicVehicombiner.jpg|upright=0.85|thumb|Either the smallest steamboat ever, or the largest car in existence.]]
*A five vehicle combiner (evidently not Scramble City-style in nature) composed of a steam engine (right arm), steam boat (torso), car (right leg), truck (left leg), and plane (left arm).
*A base consisting mostly of ramps and a hollow tower in the center that combined with 14 non-transforming cars and vans. Two vehicles make up each limb, with three crammed in the chest, two for feet, and one that slides into the tower's gun platform to form the head. The ramps would then act as an exoskeleton to contain all of the components.<ref name="p79">[[Transformers Generations 2009#Volume 2|Transformers Generations 2009 Vol. 2]], p79</ref>
*A robot formed from a truck cab and four cars with no robot modes that each have flip out weapon arrays. This may qualify more as a conventional "super robot" than a standard combiner, but we may never know.<ref name="p80">[[Transformers Generations 2009#Volume 2|Transformers Generations 2009 Vol. 2]], p80</ref>
*A "Duocon" (or rather, "Triocon", in this case) style robot formed by three cars. One car splits in half to form the arms, another splits for the legs, and a third folds in half to reveal the robot head and connect it all together.<ref name="p80"/>
*A Concorde jet that split into two robots, where the front portion's robot can pop out three wheels and a spare cockpit to give it a land mode. Presumably the larger rear robot could do the same.<ref name="p81">[[Transformers Generations 2009#Volume 2|Transformers Generations 2009 Vol. 2]], p81</ref>
*Two military convoy "trains", one good, one evil, of six vehicles each hooked together that combine along the lines of Devastator but with loads more guns. The robot core is formed by a tractor trailer that leads either convoy, the good one being long nosed, the evil one being flat, each with trailers that open up into small cannon platforms usable by the five smaller robots. Said trailers also become their respective combined form's handgun. The other five members each have a specific large weapon such as a missile rack or chaingun that they can also use in robot mode.<ref name="p83">[[Transformers Generations 2009#Volume 2|Transformers Generations 2009 Vol. 2]], p83</ref>

==Notes==
*The origin of "gestalt" as a fan-term is unknown; the earliest documented use is in 1998, when it was already in common parlance.<ref>[https://groups.google.com/group/alt.toys.transformers/msg/af8234bb79475e5f?dmode=source&output=gplain&noredirect Earliest known alt.toys.transformers post using "gestalt"]</ref> Intriguingly, however, the [[wikipedia:Isaac Asimov's Robots in Time|''Robots in Time'' series of novels]] published in 1993-94 prominently feature a "gestalt robot" who could split into six smaller autonomous robots, each with a different personality. If this actually inspired some Transformers fan searching for a good word to use, there is no evidence of it, but the publishing timeframe is conspicuously close to the opaque early days of the online fandom.
*[[Devastator (G1)|Generation 1 Devastator]] and [[Raiden (Headmasters)|Raiden]] are the only combiners from the [[Diaclone]] toyline.
*[[Scramble City (toyline)|Scramble City]]-type combiners were initially designed to be a sub-line of ''[[Diaclone]]'' called ''Jizai Gattai'' ("Free Combination"). This goes along with their ability to interact with and attach to [[Metroplex (G1)|Metroplex]] and [[Metrotitan (Zone)|Metrotitan]], the designs of which were also originally intended for the ''Diaclone'' line.
*Six of the seven released Generation 1 Scramble City-type combiners were apparently released in themed pairs, themes usually further reinforced by their team members' tech spec bios to some extent.
**Aerialbots (air vehicles) and Stunticons (ground vehicles)
**Protectobots (rescue vehicles) and Combaticons (offensive vehicles... and a space shuttle)
**Technobots (futuristic vehicles) and Terrorcons (fantastical beasts)
**The Seacons are the odd men out, but the above-mentioned unreleased dinosaur Scramble City-style combiner may have been an intended adversary.
*Combiners - or, perhaps more appropriately, ''gestalts'' - are almost always much larger than their components would suggest; examples from almost any incarnation of the franchise that includes them show combiners that tower over regular or even large Transformers even when the individual team members are smaller than average. Perhaps the most egregious example, the Dreamwave G1 comics present Devastator as almost absurdly huge. After engaging and defeating Superion, he holds one of the latter's component members in his hand, his [[robot mode]] proportionally no larger than a doll.
*The [[IDW Generation 1 continuity]] mentions [[mass displacement]] when the - again, immense - size of Devastator is brought up, and in this case the example is even more notable because one of the components of this incarnation of Devastator is Prowl, whose own head ''physically grows'' into the combined mode's head.

==Footnotes==
<references/>

[[Category:Combiners| ]]
[[Category:Fandom]]
[[Category:Gimmicks]]

Talk:Combiner

2015-07-21T15:37:57Z

Cehteshami: /* Moving Ultra Prime and Galvatronus? */ new section

Talk:Turmoil

2013-10-08T14:09:11Z

Cehteshami:

Just wanted to see what the quote on on the 3rd picture from the top on Turmoil's page is from. Just to be clear, it's the one that says:

"We're not doing Madame Chao's; the service is terrible."

"But takeout, you say!"

"Yeah, but why should I give my business to— Moishe, dainum."
Thanks [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] 10:08, 8 October 2013 (EDT)

Talk:Turmoil

2013-10-08T14:09:02Z

Cehteshami:

Just wanted to see what the quote on on the 3rd picture from the top on Turmoil's page is from. Just to be clear, it's the one that says:
"We're not doing Madame Chao's; the service is terrible."

"But takeout, you say!"

"Yeah, but why should I give my business to— Moishe, dainum."
Thanks [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] 10:08, 8 October 2013 (EDT)

Talk:Turmoil

2013-10-08T14:08:28Z

Cehteshami: Created page with "Just wanted to see what the quote on on the 3rd picture from the top on Turmoil's page is from. Just to be clear, it's "We're not doing Madame Chao's; the service is terrible." "…"

Just wanted to see what the quote on on the 3rd picture from the top on Turmoil's page is from. Just to be clear, it's "We're not doing Madame Chao's; the service is terrible."
"But takeout, you say!"
"Yeah, but why should I give my business to— Moishe, dainum." Thanks [[User:Cehteshami|Cehteshami]] 10:08, 8 October 2013 (EDT)