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Talk:Trypticon (WFC)

2012-05-05T01:39:27Z

Riptor One: /* Is the ship in Prime even called the Nemesis? */

==Some helpful quotes with regard to his sentience==
"Puzzled, Megatron read the encrypted message. Trypticon? That pile of semi-sentient junk?" - Megs, p.69

"Was the entire station sentient? Had it been given a Spark? [...] 'I do know Trypticon was created——re-created I should say; given Spark'" - Alpha, p.80-81

"'Now Shockwave,' Megatron said. 'What you see around you is a great machine, an orbiting drone, yet perhaps there is potential for a bit of Spark within." - p.154

Either Alpha Trion exaggerates how sentient Trypticon is, or Megatron is wrong. In either case, it was Shockwave who used multiple captive Sparks to turn Trypticon into a coherent, transforming being with its own immune system. [[User:Alientraveller|Alientraveller]] 19:03, 9 August 2010 (EDT)

:It's pretty clearly a case of the sort that shows up a bunch in Exodus, where two seperate revisions of the story both accidentally made it into the book. It's likely the Shockwave one was meant to be the one included, but they both were... so we have to take both as possible fact. There's no reason to give the Megatron comments more wieght than what Orion and Alpha Trion say earlier. So we have two different accounts of Trypticon being altered into a Transformer and brought to life. That Shockwave seems to need to use multiple borrowed Sparks to do what one Spark should do and does in the earlier origin is odd but there's no real reason to believe that His Version of the sparking is what "works" to makes Tryp. alive/sentient vs. the other. --[[Special:Contributions/76.28.76.206|76.28.76.206]] 20:18, 9 August 2010 (EDT)

Trypticon also clearly isn't the station Starscream once commanded in the actual WFC game. He's a different, much less destroyed one that doesn't show up until Aerial Assault. -[[User:LV|LV]] 17:22, 30 November 2010 (EST)

== Station mode ==

Are there any good shots of his space station mode from the video game to be used for Wiki purposes? --[[User:Sabrblade|Sabrblade]] 16:43, 9 February 2012 (EST)

== Anon's merge proposal ==

I say go with the merge. [[Omega Supreme (Animated)]] and Teletran-1 were eventually merged. - [[User:Starfield|Starﬁeld]] 20:35, 15 April 2012 (EDT)

==Merge from Nemesis (Prime)==
Shouldn't this disambiguate with [[Nemesis Prime (disambiguation)|Nemesis Prime]] or am I the only bastard sad enough to find that funny?
: I was going to say that the main image caption would be good enough for that, but I guess it got changed to something I don't understand? --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:45, 14 December 2010 (EST)
::Apparently anons have been messing around with it nonsensically for the past two days, so I just reverted the whole thing back to Abates's version from December 10th. --[[User:Detour|Detour]] 17:49, 14 December 2010 (EST)
:::That's too bad, because I wanted to do an image caption along the lines of "The store exclusive version is redecoed as Ultra Magnus." [[User:Hooper X|-hx]] 07:03, 15 December 2010 (EST)
Shouldn't this be merged with [[Trypticon (WFC)]], this is his alt-mode, and in Exiles it's stated that Trypticon is now stuck in ship mode, so that must mean that the Nemesis that appears in ''Prime'' could be Trypticon.[[Special:Contributions/71.162.103.17|71.162.103.17]] 23:01, 8 February 2012 (EST)

:I want to say there was a discussion about multiple ships named the ''Nemesis''... was that in this continuity, or another one? -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:22, 9 February 2012 (EST)
::That was movie continuity. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 01:27, 9 February 2012 (EST)
:::''Thaaaank you''!
:::In which case I'm fine with moving to Trypticon (WFC)-- but I also favor a non-standard section ==Nemesis== prior to ==Fiction== to explicitly point out that he and the ship are one in the same. The fiction section should theoretically do the same, but I think it's important to make it super-clear since the two state-of-beings are so separate. This would be similar to the ==Origin== section we sometime use to clarify when things are especially funky. -[[User:Derik|Derik]] 01:55, 9 February 2012 (EST)
::::Trypticon appears in WFC, Exodus, and Exiles, Nemesis appears in Exiles and Prime. I've looked at both articles cloosely, they can fit perfectly together. Basically all that needs to be merged is the cartoon section.[[Special:Contributions/71.162.109.207|71.162.109.207]] 18:19, 9 February 2012 (EST)
:::::I added a merge tag anyway.[[Special:Contributions/71.162.109.207|71.162.109.207]] 18:20, 9 February 2012 (EST)

Er, shouldn't the intros have been merged rather than the Nemesis one being slapped under the existing Trypticon one? Also, now that this is about a Prime thing, it needs to be a Trypticon (Prime), yes? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:37, 17 April 2012 (EDT)
:I went with the above suggestion of a special "Nemesis" section. Maybe it would be better handled in the intro paragraph, except I don't think Trypticon becomes the ''Nemesis'' in War for Cybertron, so maybe not. I don't know the current policy on aligned disambiguations. - [[User:Starfield|Starﬁeld]] 16:50, 17 April 2012 (EDT)
::Presumably the whole Trypticon became the Nemesis thing is in the production bible everyone is working from. We might get more info when Flying Mind screens, anyway. I don't think I agree with Derik's idea though-a combined intro would be better. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 17:18, 17 April 2012 (EDT)
:::I agree. Summarizing up the entire entity is the point of the intro. I'm not the right person to do it, though. I didn't play WFC very much or read the novels. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:42, 17 April 2012 (EDT)

Y'know, now that we've moved this, I sure hope "Flying Mind" doesn't screw it up. :-\ - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 05:16, 18 April 2012 (EDT)
:I was kinda hoping we'd wait to see what happened in that episode before doing anything, but oh well. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 17:14, 18 April 2012 (EDT)
::Whatever happens, this is already canon, isn't it? I mean, it isn't incorrect or anything. - [[User:Starfield|Starfield]] 20:54, 18 April 2012 (EDT)
:::Well sure, but if the warship turns out to be some ''other'' dude in the ''Prime'' cartoon, then we'll have to give it its own article and split Trypticon back out with the note that he's "sometimes" the Nemesis, or something like that. - [[User:Chris McFeely|Chris McFeely]] 04:38, 19 April 2012 (EDT)
::::I'm wagering the whole "Trypticon is the Nemesis" thing is in the [[Binder of Revelation]] and there's a good chance it won't be a problem, but we'll see! --[[User:Abates|abates]] 05:19, 19 April 2012 (EDT)

== Is the ship in Prime even called the Nemesis? ==

I don't recall it ever being named as such, and in the credits of Flying Mind the voice of the ship is credited as "Warship".

Also, I heard recently that Trypticon isn't the only Nemesis, but rather one of many "Nemesis Class Ships" in the Aligned Continuity. Is there anything to back this up in the novels, because I have not read them yet. --[[Special:Contributions/24.70.2.53|24.70.2.53]] 00:25, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:It was referred to as the ''Nemesis'' in "[[Shadowzone (episode)|Shadowzone]]". --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:32, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

: Right. I just rewatched "Shadowzone" and Optimus actually calls the ship "The Nemesis" when wondering where the kids could of been 'ground bridged' to after they went missing. Easy to miss if youre weren't paying attention to the dialogue.--[[User:Riptor One|Riptor One]] 21:39, 4 May 2012 (EDT)
::and to answer your other question now I've been able to check, the following sentence occurs in Exiles: "The Nemesis itself had become stasis locked after its final transformation out of Trypticon mode", which seems fairly clear in that Trypticon is the ship known as the ''Nemesis''. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 01:41, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

Talk:Flying Mind

2012-05-05T01:30:00Z

Riptor One: /* Nemesis or Trypticon? */

I found a different description for the episode that is pretty much the same except it says the Nemesis becomes sentient. Shouldn't the description be changed on here?

==''Nemesis'' or Trypticon?==
So is the speaking thing supposed to be Trypticon, or the ''Nemesis''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s computer? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 23:43, 28 April 2012 (EDT)
:It's left open to interpretation. The intelligence is not named or explained in any way, and is credited as "Warship". --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:12, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::The wiki seems to be assuming it is Trypticon, going by the Trypticon (Prime) page... should we be? [[Special:Contributions/118.93.48.54|118.93.48.54]] 22:36, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
:::My thoughts exactly. We do not have any confirmation that the Nemesis IS Trypticon. And it still remains fairly ambiguous whether Exiles is to be taken into account or not. [[User:Rayqui|Rayqui]] 03:18, 30 April 2012 (EDT)
::::Agreed. The Warship hasn't even been named on the show, so who knows if it is in fact "The Nemesis", yet alone Trypticon. I don't think 'EXODUS' or 'EXILES' should be viewed as the Prime 'bible', as TF novels are notorious for being ignored by other media. {{unsigned|75.118.37.154|23:06, 30 April 2012 (EDT)}}
:::::One: sign your posts. Two: get your facts right. The Nemesis HAS been named before. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 23:14, 30 April 2012 (EDT)
::::::But the Nemesis has never been named "Trypticon", or even alluded to, in TF Prime. The merge was really too hasty. [[User:Rayqui|Rayqui]] 08:33, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::I stand corrected Spydersix, I just rewatched "Shadowzone" and Optimus actually calls the ship "The Nemesis" when wondering where the kids were 'ground bridged'. my bad.--[[User:Riptor One|Riptor One]] 21:28, 4 May 2012 (EDT)

:::::::Can further discussion of the issue please be held on [[Talk:Trypticon (Prime)]] since that's the article it concerns? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:34, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

==Voice actor==
Who voices the ''Nemesis'' anyway?[[Special:Contributions/71.255.166.246|71.255.166.246]] 23:54, 28 April 2012 (EDT)
:Kevin Michael Richardson. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:12, 29 April 2012 (EDT)

==Soundwave==
Soundwave also shows signs of sentience, since the beginning he has only showed his opposition to Airachnid's command back in Orion Pax.
Now, when Trypticon ( or the Nemesis ) gave Megs a headache just like Unicron did, and Megatron said to regain control of the vessel, Soundwave acts weirdly, he tries to set things back quickly, as opposed to everything he has done before, he does everything smoothly and without any hurrying.
Does this need to be pointed ?
--[[User:SnipinScientist]] , 29 April 2012
:Uh, when was it ever claimed that Soundwave is non-sentient? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:32, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::Seems to me Soundwave showed sentience back in Masters and Students when he sent his deployer to observe Starscream "rescue" Megatron rather than just blindly following Starscream's orders to observe Skyquake terminate Prime. And again in Sick Mind when he basically orders Starscream and Knockout to reattach Megatron's life support after Arcee shot it off. Oh and going bak to Darkness Rising Part 5 he chooses to deliberately cut the ground line with the axe, clearly knowing that by doing so no one can change the direction the radio dish is locked onto. Soundwave doesn't speak, that's not failing to show signs of sentience. Oh and it was One Shall Rise Part 3, not any part of Orion Pax, where Soundwave opposed Airachnid's attempted takeover. -annonymous 5/4/2012 8:53 AM EST

==Dark Energon==
Since Unicron has been killed, neutralised to vapor, whatever, shouldn't Dark Energon be useless ? And Why did they stop searching for other deposits and using it ? --[[User:SnipinScientist]] , 29 April 2012
:Why would Dark Energon be useless if Unicron is dead? There's no evidence it requires his will to revive the dead. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:34, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::We don't know for certain if Unicron is dead or not, only that Prime may have succeeded in extinguishing his spark. However, Energon is supposed to come from Primus and according to what's revealed in One Shall Rise Primus became one with the Core of Cybertron. Cybertron's supposed to be a dead planet. If Cybertron is dead, then wouldn't Primus be dead? If Primus is dead, then shouldn't energon be useless if dark energon becomes useless if Unicron is dead?

== WTC ==
Sorry if this seems like a stupid question, but should it be noted that this is the first time the World Trade Center has been seen in a Transformers cartoon since 9/11? -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 21:09, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
:Does the WTC actually appear? I don't see it in the shot of Manhattan at the end. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 22:51, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::Look carefully at the last shot, it's over on the left side. It's the tower under construction that comes from under a cloud. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 22:54, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
:::It's also in the first half a second of the Tunnel Vision promo. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 22:59, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::::So are we noting it? -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 18:33, 30 April 2012 (EDT)
:::::If it can be proven with a screenshot.--[[User:Carrion|Carrion]] 16:47, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::Why is this something that absolutely needs to be noted? [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:03, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:::::::Carrion- Here it is. [[Image:WTC in Flying Mind.jpg|thumb|200px]] Interrobang- [[User: Abates|other]] [[User: Carrion|people]] seem to think its worthy to note, so..... -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 17:07, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::::I'm finding myself agreeing with Interrobang. There really is no reason to make a big deal out of this. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 17:09, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:::::::::It woulda been notable if they'd accidentally used a shot with the old WTC in. The new one, probably not. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 17:23, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::::::Okay. I'll still put in the picture, without the circle, just because the article needs images. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 17:30, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:::::::::::Regardless, those black bars shouldn't be there in the final image. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:32, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::::::::A contextless picture of Manhattan isn't an useful image for an episode's page. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:50, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

== Pictures ==
Ok, so I added some pictures. They need captions, since I have a horrible sense of humor and any I put in will probably be deleted immediately. Also, I would have uploaded a picture of the Nemesis, but I could not find a shot of it without the Hub logo on it. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 17:57, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

=question on error section=

doesn't his eyes turn purple when he is using dark energon? {{unsigned|156.33.195.254}}
:That's what I thought, too. Although he always has dark energon in him (I think), infusing the Nemesis with it might have turned his eyes purple. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spyder]] 21:53, 2 May 2012 (EDT)
::I think you're right Spydersix about it always being in him. Also, does it seem that whenever he gets around dark energon now his eyes turn purple and his insignia glows? Or whenever he intends to use it.

Talk:Flying Mind

2012-05-05T01:28:47Z

Riptor One: /* Nemesis or Trypticon? */

I found a different description for the episode that is pretty much the same except it says the Nemesis becomes sentient. Shouldn't the description be changed on here?

==''Nemesis'' or Trypticon?==
So is the speaking thing supposed to be Trypticon, or the ''Nemesis''<nowiki>'</nowiki>s computer? -- [[User:SFH|SFH]] 23:43, 28 April 2012 (EDT)
:It's left open to interpretation. The intelligence is not named or explained in any way, and is credited as "Warship". --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:12, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::The wiki seems to be assuming it is Trypticon, going by the Trypticon (Prime) page... should we be? [[Special:Contributions/118.93.48.54|118.93.48.54]] 22:36, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
:::My thoughts exactly. We do not have any confirmation that the Nemesis IS Trypticon. And it still remains fairly ambiguous whether Exiles is to be taken into account or not. [[User:Rayqui|Rayqui]] 03:18, 30 April 2012 (EDT)
::::Agreed. The Warship hasn't even been named on the show, so who knows if it is in fact "The Nemesis", yet alone Trypticon. I don't think 'EXODUS' or 'EXILES' should be viewed as the Prime 'bible', as TF novels are notorious for being ignored by other media. {{unsigned|75.118.37.154|23:06, 30 April 2012 (EDT)}}
:::::One: sign your posts. Two: get your facts right. The Nemesis HAS been named before. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 23:14, 30 April 2012 (EDT)
::::::But the Nemesis has never been named "Trypticon", or even alluded to, in TF Prime. The merge was really too hasty. [[User:Rayqui|Rayqui]] 08:33, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::I stand corrected Spydersix, I just rewatched "Shadowzone" and Optimus actually calls the ship "The Nemesis" when wondering where the kids were ground bridged. my bad.--[[User:Riptor One|Riptor One]] 21:28, 4 May 2012 (EDT)

:::::::Can further discussion of the issue please be held on [[Talk:Trypticon (Prime)]] since that's the article it concerns? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 16:34, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

==Voice actor==
Who voices the ''Nemesis'' anyway?[[Special:Contributions/71.255.166.246|71.255.166.246]] 23:54, 28 April 2012 (EDT)
:Kevin Michael Richardson. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 00:12, 29 April 2012 (EDT)

==Soundwave==
Soundwave also shows signs of sentience, since the beginning he has only showed his opposition to Airachnid's command back in Orion Pax.
Now, when Trypticon ( or the Nemesis ) gave Megs a headache just like Unicron did, and Megatron said to regain control of the vessel, Soundwave acts weirdly, he tries to set things back quickly, as opposed to everything he has done before, he does everything smoothly and without any hurrying.
Does this need to be pointed ?
--[[User:SnipinScientist]] , 29 April 2012
:Uh, when was it ever claimed that Soundwave is non-sentient? --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:32, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::Seems to me Soundwave showed sentience back in Masters and Students when he sent his deployer to observe Starscream "rescue" Megatron rather than just blindly following Starscream's orders to observe Skyquake terminate Prime. And again in Sick Mind when he basically orders Starscream and Knockout to reattach Megatron's life support after Arcee shot it off. Oh and going bak to Darkness Rising Part 5 he chooses to deliberately cut the ground line with the axe, clearly knowing that by doing so no one can change the direction the radio dish is locked onto. Soundwave doesn't speak, that's not failing to show signs of sentience. Oh and it was One Shall Rise Part 3, not any part of Orion Pax, where Soundwave opposed Airachnid's attempted takeover. -annonymous 5/4/2012 8:53 AM EST

==Dark Energon==
Since Unicron has been killed, neutralised to vapor, whatever, shouldn't Dark Energon be useless ? And Why did they stop searching for other deposits and using it ? --[[User:SnipinScientist]] , 29 April 2012
:Why would Dark Energon be useless if Unicron is dead? There's no evidence it requires his will to revive the dead. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 18:34, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::We don't know for certain if Unicron is dead or not, only that Prime may have succeeded in extinguishing his spark. However, Energon is supposed to come from Primus and according to what's revealed in One Shall Rise Primus became one with the Core of Cybertron. Cybertron's supposed to be a dead planet. If Cybertron is dead, then wouldn't Primus be dead? If Primus is dead, then shouldn't energon be useless if dark energon becomes useless if Unicron is dead?

== WTC ==
Sorry if this seems like a stupid question, but should it be noted that this is the first time the World Trade Center has been seen in a Transformers cartoon since 9/11? -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 21:09, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
:Does the WTC actually appear? I don't see it in the shot of Manhattan at the end. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 22:51, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::Look carefully at the last shot, it's over on the left side. It's the tower under construction that comes from under a cloud. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 22:54, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
:::It's also in the first half a second of the Tunnel Vision promo. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 22:59, 29 April 2012 (EDT)
::::So are we noting it? -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 18:33, 30 April 2012 (EDT)
:::::If it can be proven with a screenshot.--[[User:Carrion|Carrion]] 16:47, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::Why is this something that absolutely needs to be noted? [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:03, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:::::::Carrion- Here it is. [[Image:WTC in Flying Mind.jpg|thumb|200px]] Interrobang- [[User: Abates|other]] [[User: Carrion|people]] seem to think its worthy to note, so..... -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 17:07, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::::I'm finding myself agreeing with Interrobang. There really is no reason to make a big deal out of this. --[[User:Khajidha|Khajidha]] 17:09, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:::::::::It woulda been notable if they'd accidentally used a shot with the old WTC in. The new one, probably not. --[[User:Abates|abates]] 17:23, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::::::Okay. I'll still put in the picture, without the circle, just because the article needs images. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 17:30, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
:::::::::::Regardless, those black bars shouldn't be there in the final image. --[[User:ItsWalky|ItsWalky]] 17:32, 1 May 2012 (EDT)
::::::::::::A contextless picture of Manhattan isn't an useful image for an episode's page. [[User:Interrobang|—Interrobang]] 17:50, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

== Pictures ==
Ok, so I added some pictures. They need captions, since I have a horrible sense of humor and any I put in will probably be deleted immediately. Also, I would have uploaded a picture of the Nemesis, but I could not find a shot of it without the Hub logo on it. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spydersix]] 17:57, 1 May 2012 (EDT)

=question on error section=

doesn't his eyes turn purple when he is using dark energon? {{unsigned|156.33.195.254}}
:That's what I thought, too. Although he always has dark energon in him (I think), infusing the Nemesis with it might have turned his eyes purple. -- [[User:Spydersix|Spyder]] 21:53, 2 May 2012 (EDT)
::I think you're right Spydersix about it always being in him. Also, does it seem that whenever he gets around dark energon now his eyes turn purple and his insignia glows? Or whenever he intends to use it.