Talk:Hot Rod (DOTM) - Revision history

TheLastGherkin: /* Move */ Futureproofing sandbox link

2023-08-17T18:34:59Z

Move: Futureproofing sandbox link

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:34, 17 August 2023
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	::A split, to me, seems like a good compromise between the franchise-of-origin letter of the law, the repeated moving-the-chairs-around debates since 2017, and being friendly to read to a complete casual. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 05:30, 8 December 2022 (EST)		::A split, to me, seems like a good compromise between the franchise-of-origin letter of the law, the repeated moving-the-chairs-around debates since 2017, and being friendly to read to a complete casual. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 05:30, 8 December 2022 (EST)
	:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)		:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)
	:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/~~Poll~~\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)		:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Rodimus (DOTM)\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)
	I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)		I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)
	::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)		::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)

Escargon: /* Move */

2023-05-31T16:17:25Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:17, 31 May 2023
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	:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)		:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
	::::::Here's the thing, it isn't a G1 Universe where one evolved into the other & gained a new name, up until no media or toy bio mention anything about that, clearly nothing, so idk why it has to be the case for 2 distinct characters, I agree too that Dino & Mirage are different themselves but the argument that the DOTM toy doesnt provide much info to be split.... sorry but the wiki does this kind of stuff all the time for covenant ease, even for the smallest of character being name-dropped & I mentioned Cyclonus & Skids because of how the wiki organized them, idk how it's called tho, "suites"?? -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)		::::::Here's the thing, it isn't a G1 Universe where one evolved into the other & gained a new name, up until no media or toy bio mention anything about that, clearly nothing, so idk why it has to be the case for 2 distinct characters, I agree too that Dino & Mirage are different themselves but the argument that the DOTM toy doesnt provide much info to be split.... sorry but the wiki does this kind of stuff all the time for covenant ease, even for the smallest of character being name-dropped & I mentioned Cyclonus & Skids because of how the wiki organized them, idk how it's called tho, "suites"?? -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
			:::::::There's nothing making them distinct because the DOTM Rodimus has literally nothing to him; he has no bio that makes him his own character. And I literally just explained why the cases for Snow Cat and Screech are different. As I said months ago, I think that this whole thing is a result of new editors not getting how disambiguation tags work; it's not what's more "notable," it's about internal organization. There's no real reason to split and every push to do so ultimately boils down to a lack of understanding of how these things work. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 12:17, 31 May 2023 (EDT)

MahXyme: /* Move */

2023-05-31T15:49:28Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:49, 31 May 2023
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	:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech		::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
	:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)		:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
			::::::Here's the thing, it isn't a G1 Universe where one evolved into the other & gained a new name, up until no media or toy bio mention anything about that, clearly nothing, so idk why it has to be the case for 2 distinct characters, I agree too that Dino & Mirage are different themselves but the argument that the DOTM toy doesnt provide much info to be split.... sorry but the wiki does this kind of stuff all the time for covenant ease, even for the smallest of character being name-dropped & I mentioned Cyclonus & Skids because of how the wiki organized them, idk how it's called tho, "suites"?? -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)

Escargon: /* Move */

2023-05-31T13:51:38Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:51, 31 May 2023
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	:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech		::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech
			:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)

MahXyme: /* Move */

2023-05-31T13:04:43Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:04, 31 May 2023
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	:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)
			::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech

ThatGuy79: /* Move */

2023-03-08T17:02:02Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:02, 8 March 2023
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	::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)		::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)
			:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)

Fritz: /* Move */

2023-03-08T16:33:28Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:33, 8 March 2023
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	:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)		:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)
	I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)		I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)
	If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)		::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)
			:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)

ThatGuy79: /* Move */

2023-03-08T16:15:00Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:15, 8 March 2023
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	:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)		:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)
	I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)		I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)
			If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)

Catgirl at 22:45, 23 January 2023

2023-01-23T22:45:25Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:45, 23 January 2023
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	:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)		:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)
	:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)		:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)
			I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)

TheLastGherkin: /* Move */

2022-12-14T12:58:55Z

Move

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:58, 14 December 2022
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	::A split, to me, seems like a good compromise between the franchise-of-origin letter of the law, the repeated moving-the-chairs-around debates since 2017, and being friendly to read to a complete casual. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 05:30, 8 December 2022 (EST)		::A split, to me, seems like a good compromise between the franchise-of-origin letter of the law, the repeated moving-the-chairs-around debates since 2017, and being friendly to read to a complete casual. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 05:30, 8 December 2022 (EST)
	:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)		:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)
			:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)

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	::A split, to me, seems like a good compromise between the franchise-of-origin letter of the law, the repeated moving-the-chairs-around debates since 2017, and being friendly to read to a complete casual. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 05:30, 8 December 2022 (EST)		::A split, to me, seems like a good compromise between the franchise-of-origin letter of the law, the repeated moving-the-chairs-around debates since 2017, and being friendly to read to a complete casual. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 05:30, 8 December 2022 (EST)
	:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)		:::Well, for one, I don't think other Hot Rods particularity matter when it comes to this page. And for two: the main difference of Crosshairs and Hot Rod is that 07 Crosshairs had a contradictory profile. Rodimus doesn't. Being entirely frank, the idea of this split seems less motivated by "reader friendlyness" and more the result of constant misunderstandings of what the disambiguation tags are for. Every one of these conversations about "should we move this or that" always feels like we're treating our audience as being completely unable to figure out on their own why things are at a specific disambiguation tag, which I feel does them a disservice. And again, I know this is rich coming from me, someone who constantly rails against the idea that we can't have small pages, and someone who things that ROTF Lockdown and AOE Lockdown should have separate pages, but why would we need a small, useless little Rodimus (DOTM) article with maybe at most the stuff from BotCon 2015 Megatron's bio card on it for fiction? [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 07:27, 8 December 2022 (EST)
	:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/~~Poll~~\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)		:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Rodimus (DOTM)\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)
	I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)		I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)
	::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)		::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)

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	:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)		:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
	::::::Here's the thing, it isn't a G1 Universe where one evolved into the other & gained a new name, up until no media or toy bio mention anything about that, clearly nothing, so idk why it has to be the case for 2 distinct characters, I agree too that Dino & Mirage are different themselves but the argument that the DOTM toy doesnt provide much info to be split.... sorry but the wiki does this kind of stuff all the time for covenant ease, even for the smallest of character being name-dropped & I mentioned Cyclonus & Skids because of how the wiki organized them, idk how it's called tho, "suites"?? -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)		::::::Here's the thing, it isn't a G1 Universe where one evolved into the other & gained a new name, up until no media or toy bio mention anything about that, clearly nothing, so idk why it has to be the case for 2 distinct characters, I agree too that Dino & Mirage are different themselves but the argument that the DOTM toy doesnt provide much info to be split.... sorry but the wiki does this kind of stuff all the time for covenant ease, even for the smallest of character being name-dropped & I mentioned Cyclonus & Skids because of how the wiki organized them, idk how it's called tho, "suites"?? -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
			:::::::There's nothing making them distinct because the DOTM Rodimus has literally nothing to him; he has no bio that makes him his own character. And I literally just explained why the cases for Snow Cat and Screech are different. As I said months ago, I think that this whole thing is a result of new editors not getting how disambiguation tags work; it's not what's more "notable," it's about internal organization. There's no real reason to split and every push to do so ultimately boils down to a lack of understanding of how these things work. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 12:17, 31 May 2023 (EDT)

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	:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech		::::Hello I want to add some Oil to the fire, no seriously i'm in favor of spliting them per se like how it was proposed not so long ago for Dino & ROTB Mirage ala Cyclonus/Snow Cat or Skids/Screech -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
	:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)		:::::...This "situation" is nothing like any of those examples. Dino and Mirage is because the two are radically different; Cyclonus and Snow Cat is because of Hasbro's intents behind the scenes (which I question anyway because we're not supposed to be influenced by authorial intent); and Screech has been separate ever since he was introduced in 2009 because of the alternate dimension shenanigans going on with him. DOTM Hot Rod has two things: a toy with no bio and a one-sentence mention in a bio card about an alternate dimension Megatron. Not nearly enough to be split. [[User:Escargon\|Escargon]] ([[User talk:Escargon\|talk]]) 09:51, 31 May 2023 (EDT)
			::::::Here's the thing, it isn't a G1 Universe where one evolved into the other & gained a new name, up until no media or toy bio mention anything about that, clearly nothing, so idk why it has to be the case for 2 distinct characters, I agree too that Dino & Mirage are different themselves but the argument that the DOTM toy doesnt provide much info to be split.... sorry but the wiki does this kind of stuff all the time for covenant ease, even for the smallest of character being name-dropped & I mentioned Cyclonus & Skids because of how the wiki organized them, idk how it's called tho, "suites"?? -[[User:MahXyme\|MahXyme/MahXymal]] ([[User talk:MahXyme\|talk]]) 11:49, 31 May 2023 (EDT)

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	::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)		::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)
	:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)		:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)
			:::...oh. I do think they should stay on the same page, but given that the DOTM guy is ''only'' called Rodimus and never Hot Rod, I can see it going both ways. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 12:02, 8 March 2023 (EST)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:33, 8 March 2023
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	:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)		:Split DOTM Rodimus proposal currently located '''[[User:TheLastGherkin/Poll\|here]]'''. [[User:TheLastGherkin\|TheLastGherkin]] ([[User talk:TheLastGherkin\|talk]]) 07:58, 14 December 2022 (EST)
	I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)		I think it's silly to merge the two pages. There's nothing to suggest Rodimus and Hot Rod were, are, or ever will be the same character - DOTM Rodimus has basically no appearances aside from a toy that never uses the name "Hot Rod", while TLK Hot Rod never gets the Matrix or so much as decides to go by "Rodimus". For all we know, the people who have spent years decrying this design for not being G1 were right; this ''isn't'' G1 Hot Rod, because G1 Rod Rod already existed and became Prime ''before'' the drastically different Hot-Rod-in-name-only TLK character came on the scene. And it isn't like we've never had similar situations like this in both toys and media where two characters exist with the same or similar names, so frankly I don't see why it's such a big deal now. I say leave them separate. [[User:Catgirl\|cat]] ([[User talk:Catgirl\|talk]]) 17:45, 23 January 2023 (EST)
	If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)		::If movie Divebomb and ROTF Divebomb can be on the same page, then DOTM Rodimus and TLK Hot Rod can be on the same page too. [[User:ThatGuy79\|ThatGuy79]] ([[User talk:ThatGuy79\|talk]]) 11:15, 8 March 2023 (EST)
			:::ROTF Divebomb is the same character as Movie Divebomb, his Scout class toy bio specifically says so. -- [[User:Fritz\|Fritz]] ([[User talk:Fritz\|talk]]) 11:33, 8 March 2023 (EST)