Talk:Nightbeat - Revision history

Deceptitran: /* Deceptitran fixes v1.0 - wikia_unspam#1 - */

2009-03-27T08:59:50Z

Deceptitran fixes v1.0 - wikia_unspam#1 -

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	:I think Sipher'd (probably) agree with that call- but he (and I) are really, really wary of formalizing that kind of thing. Because it can really easily lead to people deciding that declaring "G1 Blurr is CLEARLY more prominent than Armada Blur!" is acceptable.		:I think Sipher'd (probably) agree with that call- but he (and I) are really, really wary of formalizing that kind of thing. Because it can really easily lead to people deciding that declaring "G1 Blurr is CLEARLY more prominent than Armada Blur!" is acceptable.
	:Really- if you ''ever'' do this kind of direct-link it should have a two-part requirement. Not only does one claimant for a name have to be demonstrably 'prominent,' all other claimants have to be be demonstrably 'obscure.' So the standard isn't just 'more prominent,' but it's 'prominent among a field of nobodies.' -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 03:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		:Really- if you ''ever'' do this kind of direct-link it should have a two-part requirement. Not only does one claimant for a name have to be demonstrably 'prominent,' all other claimants have to be be demonstrably 'obscure.' So the standard isn't just 'more prominent,' but it's 'prominent among a field of nobodies.' -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 03:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	::I can agree to that. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 03:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)~~<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>~~		::I can agree to that. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 03:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

ItsWalky at 03:50, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T03:50:15Z

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	:I think Sipher'd (probably) agree with that call- but he (and I) are really, really wary of formalizing that kind of thing. Because it can really easily lead to people deciding that declaring "G1 Blurr is CLEARLY more prominent than Armada Blur!" is acceptable.		:I think Sipher'd (probably) agree with that call- but he (and I) are really, really wary of formalizing that kind of thing. Because it can really easily lead to people deciding that declaring "G1 Blurr is CLEARLY more prominent than Armada Blur!" is acceptable.
	:Really- if you ''ever'' do this kind of direct-link it should have a two-part requirement. Not only does one claimant for a name have to be demonstrably 'prominent,' all other claimants have to be be demonstrably 'obscure.' So the standard isn't just 'more prominent,' but it's 'prominent among a field of nobodies.' -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 03:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		:Really- if you ''ever'' do this kind of direct-link it should have a two-part requirement. Not only does one claimant for a name have to be demonstrably 'prominent,' all other claimants have to be be demonstrably 'obscure.' So the standard isn't just 'more prominent,' but it's 'prominent among a field of nobodies.' -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 03:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
			::I can agree to that. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 03:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Derik at 03:44, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T03:44:42Z

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	And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	:If "prominence" on a character is hard to discern, link to the disambiguation. If it's not hard to discern at all, link to the most prominent character. Where things are obvious, do the obvious. That's not real difficult. We're aiming for ease of use here. If someone types in "Nightbeat," who are they looking for? Why force 99% of the people looking for a "Nightbeat" to go through another page? --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 02:10, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		:If "prominence" on a character is hard to discern, link to the disambiguation. If it's not hard to discern at all, link to the most prominent character. Where things are obvious, do the obvious. That's not real difficult. We're aiming for ease of use here. If someone types in "Nightbeat," who are they looking for? Why force 99% of the people looking for a "Nightbeat" to go through another page? --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 02:10, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

			:I think Sipher'd (probably) agree with that call- but he (and I) are really, really wary of formalizing that kind of thing. Because it can really easily lead to people deciding that declaring "G1 Blurr is CLEARLY more prominent than Armada Blur!" is acceptable.
			:Really- if you ''ever'' do this kind of direct-link it should have a two-part requirement. Not only does one claimant for a name have to be demonstrably 'prominent,' all other claimants have to be be demonstrably 'obscure.' So the standard isn't just 'more prominent,' but it's 'prominent among a field of nobodies.' -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 03:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

ItsWalky at 02:10, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T02:10:43Z

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	:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

	And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
			:If "prominence" on a character is hard to discern, link to the disambiguation. If it's not hard to discern at all, link to the most prominent character. Where things are obvious, do the obvious. That's not real difficult. We're aiming for ease of use here. If someone types in "Nightbeat," who are they looking for? Why force 99% of the people looking for a "Nightbeat" to go through another page? --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 02:10, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

M Sipher at 02:01, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T02:01:42Z

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	::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

			And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Derik at 01:50, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T01:50:04Z

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	:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)		:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
			:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

ItsWalky at 01:10, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T01:10:30Z

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	:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)		:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though very briefly. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

ItsWalky at 01:06, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T01:06:23Z

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	:::I agree that this ''should'' direct to G1 Nightbeat, but I understand the conflict. Declaring one part of fiction 'more important' is the first step towards declaring that some things are 'non-canon' and refusing to document them, or actively suppressing their existence.		:::I agree that this ''should'' direct to G1 Nightbeat, but I understand the conflict. Declaring one part of fiction 'more important' is the first step towards declaring that some things are 'non-canon' and refusing to document them, or actively suppressing their existence.
	:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)		:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
			::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though very briefly. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Repowers at 00:55, 5 February 2008

2008-02-05T00:55:59Z

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	I can't say I agree with the "link to most popular character" thing. For consistency's sake, I feel that if there IS a disambig page, then the non-parenthetical redirect should go to that. One could make a fairly compelling argument that, say, the movie and Animated Bumblebees are more popular than G1 Bumblebee, though you'd get just as many arguemtns against mostly from G1 fans. I'd rather not have to deal with that kind of "notability" crap and just go with a blanket disambig redirect. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 23:05, 4 February 2008 (UTC)		I can't say I agree with the "link to most popular character" thing. For consistency's sake, I feel that if there IS a disambig page, then the non-parenthetical redirect should go to that. One could make a fairly compelling argument that, say, the movie and Animated Bumblebees are more popular than G1 Bumblebee, though you'd get just as many arguemtns against mostly from G1 fans. I'd rather not have to deal with that kind of "notability" crap and just go with a blanket disambig redirect. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 23:05, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
	:I'd have to agree. I generally prefer G1 over the other stuff, but really, what makes G1 Optimus more notable than RiD Optimus or UT Optimus? Who is the best of the [[Megatron (disambiguation)\|Megatron]]s? What about all the Grimlocks? Surely, G1 Grimlock is more notable. Yet we should redirect to the disambiguation for fairness sake. Admittedly, some, like [[Jazz]] and [[Ark]], just link to too many pages, so we should probably have a bot fix those (or a really dedicated user). Overall, I think that Disambiguations should take priority. If there's just two, leave it at the first article written. Otherwise, I say disambig. -- [[User:SFH\|SFH]] 23:12, 4 February 2008 (UTC)		:I'd have to agree. I generally prefer G1 over the other stuff, but really, what makes G1 Optimus more notable than RiD Optimus or UT Optimus? Who is the best of the [[Megatron (disambiguation)\|Megatron]]s? What about all the Grimlocks? Surely, G1 Grimlock is more notable. Yet we should redirect to the disambiguation for fairness sake. Admittedly, some, like [[Jazz]] and [[Ark]], just link to too many pages, so we should probably have a bot fix those (or a really dedicated user). Overall, I think that Disambiguations should take priority. If there's just two, leave it at the first article written. Otherwise, I say disambig. -- [[User:SFH\|SFH]] 23:12, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
	::I'd say [[Bumblebee]] should redirect to [[Bumblebee (disambiguation]] for the reasons M Sipher suggests. There's a lot of popular Bumblebees. But there's no other Nightbeat that comes close to the prominence of the original. This adheres to current policy. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 23:49, 4 February 2008 (UTC)		::I'd say [[Bumblebee]] should redirect to [[Bumblebee (disambiguation)]] for the reasons M Sipher suggests. There's a lot of popular Bumblebees. But there's no other Nightbeat that comes close to the prominence of the original. This adheres to current policy. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 23:49, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

	:::I agree that this ''should'' direct to G1 Nightbeat, but I understand the conflict. Declaring one part of fiction 'more important' is the first step towards declaring that some things are 'non-canon' and refusing to document them, or actively suppressing their existence.		:::I agree that this ''should'' direct to G1 Nightbeat, but I understand the conflict. Declaring one part of fiction 'more important' is the first step towards declaring that some things are 'non-canon' and refusing to document them, or actively suppressing their existence.
	:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
			::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

Derik: fixing .sig

2008-02-04T23:54:27Z

fixing .sig

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:54, 4 February 2008
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	:::I agree that this ''should'' direct to G1 Nightbeat, but I understand the conflict. Declaring one part of fiction 'more important' is the first step towards declaring that some things are 'non-canon' and refusing to document them, or actively suppressing their existence.		:::I agree that this ''should'' direct to G1 Nightbeat, but I understand the conflict. Declaring one part of fiction 'more important' is the first step towards declaring that some things are 'non-canon' and refusing to document them, or actively suppressing their existence.
	:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		:::In this case the decision is easy though-- None of the other Nightbeats have any fictional appearances, at all. Justification enough. We can re-evaluate this decision int he future if that changes. -Derik 23:54, 4 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:10, 5 February 2008
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	:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

	And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
			:If "prominence" on a character is hard to discern, link to the disambiguation. If it's not hard to discern at all, link to the most prominent character. Where things are obvious, do the obvious. That's not real difficult. We're aiming for ease of use here. If someone types in "Nightbeat," who are they looking for? Why force 99% of the people looking for a "Nightbeat" to go through another page? --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 02:10, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:01, 5 February 2008
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	::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		::::Bad example. See [[:Image:Mini-cons.jpg\|here, left and front.]] -- [[User:Repowers\|Repowers]] 00:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)		::::He was also in the Armada cartoon, though [[:Image:Nightbeat07.jpg\|very briefly]]. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 01:06, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
	:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>		:::::Speaking role! Speaking role as new justification! -[[User:Derik\|Derik]] 01:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

			And this is ''exactly'' the kind of backpedaling desperate justification I hope to avoid. "Notability" is a very dangerous slope I'd prefer to steer clear of. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 02:01, 5 February 2008 (UTC)<div id="wikia-credits"><br /><br /><small>From [http://transformers.wikia.com Teletraan I: The Transformers Wiki], a [http://www.wikia.com Wikia] wiki.</small></div>