Talk:Toy Fair 2010 - Revision history

Geewunling at 10:42, 12 December 2010

2010-12-12T10:42:38Z

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	==Hailstorm==		==Hailstorm==
	Is he [[Mindset]] or an ROTF homage of him? - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 07:43, 14 February 2010 (EST)		Is he [[Mindset (G2)\|''Generation 2'' Mindset]] or an [[Mindset (TF 2010)\|ROTF homage]] of him? - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 07:43, 14 February 2010 (EST)
	:He's an ROTF character designed in homage to Mindset, a la Sea Spray. --[[User:Monzo\|Monzo]] 07:59, 14 February 2010 (EST)		:He's an ROTF character designed in homage to Mindset, a la Sea Spray. --[[User:Monzo\|Monzo]] 07:59, 14 February 2010 (EST)
	::Well, this is where it gets sticky. The guys at Toy Fair maintain that the Adjectiveless "Transformers" line that has all these movie-esque designs is not just movie. It's supposed to be "everything," a "celebration of all things Transformers." Even though there's a "Generations" line that's differently packaged and has, uh, Drift and Thrust and Straxus in it. I'm not sure how much to take them at their word for this because they might use different terminology than the Wiki. For example, after they got done saying this, I asked if this meant that Sea Spray was, you know, the "same exact guy as G1 Sea Spray" and not just an homage. They said it was G1 Sea Spray, and that's why he was blockier than the other designs. (Even though he fights a Movie-esque guy in his bio.) So, uh. Yeah, yeah, we know that what Hasbro considers "the same character" is not what we consider "the same character." But the one Hasbro rep was very adamant that Sea Spray was actually Sea Spray. So it COULD actually be Mindset. And it COULD be really friggin' confusing for us to categorize. (I kind of don't want to even mention this so as to not destroy our fragile little minds, but the truth must be paramount.) --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 08:45, 14 February 2010 (EST)		::Well, this is where it gets sticky. The guys at Toy Fair maintain that the Adjectiveless "Transformers" line that has all these movie-esque designs is not just movie. It's supposed to be "everything," a "celebration of all things Transformers." Even though there's a "Generations" line that's differently packaged and has, uh, Drift and Thrust and Straxus in it. I'm not sure how much to take them at their word for this because they might use different terminology than the Wiki. For example, after they got done saying this, I asked if this meant that Sea Spray was, you know, the "same exact guy as G1 Sea Spray" and not just an homage. They said it was G1 Sea Spray, and that's why he was blockier than the other designs. (Even though he fights a Movie-esque guy in his bio.) So, uh. Yeah, yeah, we know that what Hasbro considers "the same character" is not what we consider "the same character." But the one Hasbro rep was very adamant that Sea Spray was actually Sea Spray. So it COULD actually be Mindset. And it COULD be really friggin' confusing for us to categorize. (I kind of don't want to even mention this so as to not destroy our fragile little minds, but the truth must be paramount.) --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 08:45, 14 February 2010 (EST)

M Sipher: /* Adjectiveless Transformers */

2010-02-16T16:37:24Z

Adjectiveless Transformers

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	:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	::::F!SRLT2010 .... oh, my, that's awful. I tend to think we might want to wait a bit more and see how things play out before we try to sort everything out. Perhaps the associated fiction, if any, will make things clearer.--[[User:Jimsorenson\|Jimsorenson]] 11:32, 16 February 2010 (EST)		::::F!SRLT2010 .... oh, my, that's awful. I tend to think we might want to wait a bit more and see how things play out before we try to sort everything out. Perhaps the associated fiction, if any, will make things clearer.--[[User:Jimsorenson\|Jimsorenson]] 11:32, 16 February 2010 (EST)
			:"Hunt for the Decepticons" is a promotion/game, not a subline. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 11:37, 16 February 2010 (EST)

Jimsorenson: /* Adjectiveless Transformers */

2010-02-16T16:32:19Z

Adjectiveless Transformers

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	::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)		::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			::::F!SRLT2010 .... oh, my, that's awful. I tend to think we might want to wait a bit more and see how things play out before we try to sort everything out. Perhaps the associated fiction, if any, will make things clearer.--[[User:Jimsorenson\|Jimsorenson]] 11:32, 16 February 2010 (EST)

M Sipher: /* Hailstorm */

2010-02-16T16:18:50Z

Hailstorm

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:18, 16 February 2010
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	::Well, this is where it gets sticky. The guys at Toy Fair maintain that the Adjectiveless "Transformers" line that has all these movie-esque designs is not just movie. It's supposed to be "everything," a "celebration of all things Transformers." Even though there's a "Generations" line that's differently packaged and has, uh, Drift and Thrust and Straxus in it. I'm not sure how much to take them at their word for this because they might use different terminology than the Wiki. For example, after they got done saying this, I asked if this meant that Sea Spray was, you know, the "same exact guy as G1 Sea Spray" and not just an homage. They said it was G1 Sea Spray, and that's why he was blockier than the other designs. (Even though he fights a Movie-esque guy in his bio.) So, uh. Yeah, yeah, we know that what Hasbro considers "the same character" is not what we consider "the same character." But the one Hasbro rep was very adamant that Sea Spray was actually Sea Spray. So it COULD actually be Mindset. And it COULD be really friggin' confusing for us to categorize. (I kind of don't want to even mention this so as to not destroy our fragile little minds, but the truth must be paramount.) --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 08:45, 14 February 2010 (EST)		::Well, this is where it gets sticky. The guys at Toy Fair maintain that the Adjectiveless "Transformers" line that has all these movie-esque designs is not just movie. It's supposed to be "everything," a "celebration of all things Transformers." Even though there's a "Generations" line that's differently packaged and has, uh, Drift and Thrust and Straxus in it. I'm not sure how much to take them at their word for this because they might use different terminology than the Wiki. For example, after they got done saying this, I asked if this meant that Sea Spray was, you know, the "same exact guy as G1 Sea Spray" and not just an homage. They said it was G1 Sea Spray, and that's why he was blockier than the other designs. (Even though he fights a Movie-esque guy in his bio.) So, uh. Yeah, yeah, we know that what Hasbro considers "the same character" is not what we consider "the same character." But the one Hasbro rep was very adamant that Sea Spray was actually Sea Spray. So it COULD actually be Mindset. And it COULD be really friggin' confusing for us to categorize. (I kind of don't want to even mention this so as to not destroy our fragile little minds, but the truth must be paramount.) --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 08:45, 14 February 2010 (EST)
	:::Is Hailstorm really supposed to be an homage to Mindset? As in, someone from Hasbro actually said this? Because except for having four missile on their backs, they look almost nothing alike to me: [http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=20669 ]. At any rate, yeah, I'm not sure how literally we should take Hasbro PR-type guys on this sort of thing. "Hunt for the Decepticons" by all appearances is a continuation of the movie-verse, so if Seaspray's part of that, he'd be movie-verse, too, right? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 13:11, 14 February 2010 (EST)		:::Is Hailstorm really supposed to be an homage to Mindset? As in, someone from Hasbro actually said this? Because except for having four missile on their backs, they look almost nothing alike to me: [http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=20669 ]. At any rate, yeah, I'm not sure how literally we should take Hasbro PR-type guys on this sort of thing. "Hunt for the Decepticons" by all appearances is a continuation of the movie-verse, so if Seaspray's part of that, he'd be movie-verse, too, right? --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 13:11, 14 February 2010 (EST)
			::::Yes, he's completely supposed to be -or be an homage to- Mindset. got this from several different Hasbro people, including Archer. Mind you, I think that Hasbro IS thinking on this differently than we are, and that really, it shouldn't be hard at all to figure out who's ROTF and who isn't... pretty much everything pre-"Generations" in their presentation sure looked ROTF to me, bios included. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 11:18, 16 February 2010 (EST)

	== Categories ==		== Categories ==

Starfield: /* Adjectiveless Transformers */

2010-02-15T19:41:37Z

Adjectiveless Transformers

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	:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)		::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)

Chris McFeely: /* Adjectiveless Transformers */

2010-02-15T18:04:24Z

Adjectiveless Transformers

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	If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)		If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)

KilMichaelMcC: /* Adjectiveless Transformers */

2010-02-15T17:54:22Z

Adjectiveless Transformers

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	If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)		If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)

Starfield: /* Franchises */

2010-02-15T17:16:12Z

Franchises

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	::Power Core Combiners is a franchise all of its own, yes. They said that PCC is not connected to either Generations or ROTF, but is its own little entity. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 20:50, 14 February 2010 (EST)		::Power Core Combiners is a franchise all of its own, yes. They said that PCC is not connected to either Generations or ROTF, but is its own little entity. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 20:50, 14 February 2010 (EST)
	:::But still, what story continuity should Powercore Combiners go in? They're not enough to start their own continuity that is unconnected to everything else. [[Special:Contributions/95.148.9.83\|95.148.9.83]] 11:49, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:::But still, what story continuity should Powercore Combiners go in? They're not enough to start their own continuity that is unconnected to everything else. [[Special:Contributions/95.148.9.83\|95.148.9.83]] 11:49, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			::::We don't know yet. By using "PCC" as the disambiguation, we don't have to know about their continuity to make a page for them. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 12:16, 15 February 2010 (EST)

	==Hunt for the Decepticons==		==Hunt for the Decepticons==

95.148.9.83: /* Franchises */

2010-02-15T16:49:16Z

Franchises

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:49, 15 February 2010
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	::Power Core Combiners is a franchise all of its own, yes. They said that PCC is not connected to either Generations or ROTF, but is its own little entity. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 20:50, 14 February 2010 (EST)		::Power Core Combiners is a franchise all of its own, yes. They said that PCC is not connected to either Generations or ROTF, but is its own little entity. --[[User:ItsWalky\|ItsWalky]] 20:50, 14 February 2010 (EST)
			:::But still, what story continuity should Powercore Combiners go in? They're not enough to start their own continuity that is unconnected to everything else. [[Special:Contributions/95.148.9.83\|95.148.9.83]] 11:49, 15 February 2010 (EST)

	==Hunt for the Decepticons==		==Hunt for the Decepticons==

Starfield: /* Adjectiveless Transformers */ new section

2010-02-15T16:43:02Z

Adjectiveless Transformers: new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:43, 15 February 2010
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	::I don't know if we should be treating that as a full toyline, Starfield. It seems more to be a [[subline imprint]] of the broader "Transformers" in this case. Roughly equivalent to NEST Global Alliance.--[[User:Rosicrucian\|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian\|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 00:10, 15 February 2010 (EST)		::I don't know if we should be treating that as a full toyline, Starfield. It seems more to be a [[subline imprint]] of the broader "Transformers" in this case. Roughly equivalent to NEST Global Alliance.--[[User:Rosicrucian\|Rosicrucian]][[User Talk:Rosicrucian\|<sup>Talk</sup>]] 00:10, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	:::Sounds about right. So, the toyline is "Transformers" with a subline of "Hunt for the Decepticons". Any suggestion for franchise disambiguation? Something that won't be confused with [[Transformers 2010 (franchise)]]? - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 00:21, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:::Sounds about right. So, the toyline is "Transformers" with a subline of "Hunt for the Decepticons". Any suggestion for franchise disambiguation? Something that won't be confused with [[Transformers 2010 (franchise)]]? - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 00:21, 15 February 2010 (EST)

			== Adjectiveless ''Transformers'' ==

			Adjectiveless ''Transformers'' doesn't exactly sound like a franchise in the traditional sense. It looks like Hasbro intends this to be the core brand. I suggest "(Transformers)" as a disambiguation. It looks confusing at first, but I think it is accurate. If it is intended to be the core brand, then it is really franchise-less. That way Hailstorm can be put at "Hailstorm (Transformers)" without taking a stand on which continuity he belongs in, since Hasbro seems to be leaving that question somewhat open. In that way it is like the original "The Transformers" franchise. The downside is that if Hasbro ever retcons adjectiveless ''Transformers'' to be "Generation 3" we would have to change everything.

			If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:37, 16 February 2010
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	:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	::::F!SRLT2010 .... oh, my, that's awful. I tend to think we might want to wait a bit more and see how things play out before we try to sort everything out. Perhaps the associated fiction, if any, will make things clearer.--[[User:Jimsorenson\|Jimsorenson]] 11:32, 16 February 2010 (EST)		::::F!SRLT2010 .... oh, my, that's awful. I tend to think we might want to wait a bit more and see how things play out before we try to sort everything out. Perhaps the associated fiction, if any, will make things clearer.--[[User:Jimsorenson\|Jimsorenson]] 11:32, 16 February 2010 (EST)
			:"Hunt for the Decepticons" is a promotion/game, not a subline. --[[User:M Sipher\|M Sipher]] 11:37, 16 February 2010 (EST)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:32, 16 February 2010
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	::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)		::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			::::F!SRLT2010 .... oh, my, that's awful. I tend to think we might want to wait a bit more and see how things play out before we try to sort everything out. Perhaps the associated fiction, if any, will make things clearer.--[[User:Jimsorenson\|Jimsorenson]] 11:32, 16 February 2010 (EST)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:41, 15 February 2010
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	:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)		::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			:::The Japanese franchise could be moved to "Fight! Super Robot Lifeform Transformers 2010" to help avoid confusion. "TF 2010" sounds a little too much like a proper official name, but it is just an identifier so I think it could work. The franchise page itself could clear things up. - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 14:41, 15 February 2010 (EST)

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:04, 15 February 2010
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	If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)		If that doesn't work, we might bend our own rules a little bit on franchise of origin and find a more specific identifier, in this case "Hailstorm (HFTD)". - [[User:Starfield\|Starfield]] 11:43, 15 February 2010 (EST)
	:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)		:I think using (Transfomers) would seem a bit... silly. But, I don't know that there's a better alternative. --[[User:KilMichaelMcC\|KilMichaelMcC]] 12:54, 15 February 2010 (EST)
			::I lean towards "TF 2010". Of course, there is the Japanese franchise by that name. Erhn. - [[User:Chris McFeely\|Chris McFeely]] 13:04, 15 February 2010 (EST)