Talk:Roller (IDW)
Roller (drone)
Since Orion's memories of Roller were wiped at the end of All Our Parlous Yesterdays, we can no longer just assume that Orion named his drone module after Roller, so I took that little bit of information off.--DeathbotTheGreat (talk) 22:02, 13 January 2015 (EST)
So ummmm...SPOILERS
If a certain "thing" turns out to be true about Roller and his...current whereabouts, will we be merging pages? --Nu-Priest (talk) 19:45, 18 February 2015 (EST)
Tarn_(DJD) / Roller Merge...
Aight boys, So it is offically confirmed that Tarn and Roller are the same guy... Shall we merge?? Or Maybe not? Cuz Tarn is sort of Roller's Alter-Ego... Hyruk (talk) 11:42, 8 April 2015 (EDT)
- Well, it's not, so no. - Chris McFeely (talk) 11:46, 8 April 2015 (EDT)
- And even so, starting a new section on a page with a title that would be a major spoiler, causing it to show up on the Recent changes page... is KIND OF A DICK-ASS MOVE. --ItsWalky (talk) 12:34, 8 April 2015 (EDT)
Wandering Roller
The info from Unite Warriors was lumped back into this page, I see. Now, I can understand that WR being G1 Roller is a JP-only thing... but does that necessarily mean that there's a "US interpretation" that makes Wandering Roller specifically a version of IDW Roller? Best case scenario, in my view, is that WR "doesn't exist" in the US; without English-language fiction backing it up, it seems like a weaker case of, say, something like the recent merging of some of the RID characters with their "G1" versions (e.g., IDW Gigatron now being on RID Megatron's page).
Just 2c from a sporadic editor/longtime lurker Magaroja (talk) 11:53, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- Does WR have any American fiction? --Khajidha (talk) 11:58, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- To my knowledge, no.
- And on re-thinking it... *sigh* I think I "get it", but I do so grudgingly, knowing full well my thoughts are relatively irrelevant given how little I've contributed to the site. Technically, yes, the specifications of how WR looks are derived from IDW Roller, so it makes sense to have SOME info relating that on the website, and again given the treatment of other slightly similar situations, sure, "it's a version of IDW Roller". Just not a fan, is all (and I wasn't a fan of merging RID characters into G1 guys either). But eh. Magaroja (talk) 12:05, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I get it, but think the way you had it was more honest. --Khajidha (talk) 12:12, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- "Wandering Roller" is Japan's version of IDW Roller. I mean, look at it. That's not in question. They took the Rook toy and they did it up to look like IDW Roller. Then, Japan eventually decided that Wandering Roller and buggy Roller were the same character in their continuity, but not before originally showing that WR used to look exactly like IDW Roller. That last-minute revelation doesn't magically prevent WR from being the Japanese version of IDW Roller, and the brief summary and link through to the other article is, IMO, more representative of the actual situation than just a note claiming "pfft, no, this guy who looks just like IDW Roller isn't teeeeeechnically a version of IDW Roller." Jalaguy (talk) 12:21, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- But they never actually showed them as two characters? So your "pfft" note is exactly what happened. That's how I see it. --Khajidha (talk) 12:30, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I agree with Khajidha. Wandering Roller isn't IDW Roller. He's a guy we were temporarily misled into THINKING he was IDW Roller. There are not multiple continuities at play -- Unite Warriors is his only story and it's clear from that storyline that W Roller is drone Roller, not IDW Roller. Wandering Roller should get the same treatment as Tarn: a Note at the bottom saying we REALLY thought he was IDW Roller, but it later turned out he wasn't. --Xaaron (talk) 12:38, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- He can be more than one thing at once! Wandering Roller is JG1 drone Roller and JG1 IDW Roller. The revelation is "surprise, our version of IDW Roller is the same guy as G1 Roller!" not "surprise, our version of IDW Roller isn't actually our version of IDW Roller!" Jalaguy (talk) 13:06, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- Where was he shown to BE IDW Roller as opposed to simply homaging him? --Khajidha (talk) 13:13, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- Chapter 1 implied WRoller was IDW Roller. The last Chapter said he was JG1 Roller. So, is he both, or is he just JG1 Roller? Well, what's the evidence he was IDW Roller? He looked like him once. But Transformers look like each other all the time, especially across dimensions. RotF Bludgeon was only listed in the Notes of G1 Bludgeon for years until Legends finally appropriated that body for him, and it was added to Toys. Just looking like a guy isn't enough. It CAN'T be enough, given the way the TF franchise and repurposings operate. G1 Roller and IDW Roller are separate characters/concepts. There isn't any real evidence to say the meta-concept of the separate IDW Roller is ALSO embodied in JG1 Roller, just because JG1 Roller once looked like IDW Roller. --Xaaron (talk) 13:18, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I'll put it like this - prior to the release of the final chapter, there was zero question that Wandering Roller was a version of IDW Roller, right? He looked like IDW Roller, had a take on IDW Roller's backstory, etc. Nobody would have argued "gee, can we really be sure?" The revelation that he is also G1 Roller does not somehow unwrite/invalidate all those things that made him super-obviously a version of IDW Roller. If, to create a wild hypothetical, a new chapter of the Legends manga declared that JG1 Windblade was actually rebuilt by the Zamojin from Lancer, would we strip the Legends fiction and toy from Windblade (G1), leaving just a note saying "we thought this character was Windblade, but no, it was actually Lancer!"? Jalaguy (talk) 13:28, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I would hope that we would do exactly that, because that's what the fiction said. All that buildup is just red herrings. You wouldn't write up a mystery novel and say that character one was the villain because all the clues pointed to him/her if the last chapter said "nope, it's actually character 2 who killed everybody", would you? --Khajidha (talk) 13:54, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I'll put it like this - prior to the release of the final chapter, there was zero question that Wandering Roller was a version of IDW Roller, right? He looked like IDW Roller, had a take on IDW Roller's backstory, etc. Nobody would have argued "gee, can we really be sure?" The revelation that he is also G1 Roller does not somehow unwrite/invalidate all those things that made him super-obviously a version of IDW Roller. If, to create a wild hypothetical, a new chapter of the Legends manga declared that JG1 Windblade was actually rebuilt by the Zamojin from Lancer, would we strip the Legends fiction and toy from Windblade (G1), leaving just a note saying "we thought this character was Windblade, but no, it was actually Lancer!"? Jalaguy (talk) 13:28, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- He can be more than one thing at once! Wandering Roller is JG1 drone Roller and JG1 IDW Roller. The revelation is "surprise, our version of IDW Roller is the same guy as G1 Roller!" not "surprise, our version of IDW Roller isn't actually our version of IDW Roller!" Jalaguy (talk) 13:06, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I agree with Khajidha. Wandering Roller isn't IDW Roller. He's a guy we were temporarily misled into THINKING he was IDW Roller. There are not multiple continuities at play -- Unite Warriors is his only story and it's clear from that storyline that W Roller is drone Roller, not IDW Roller. Wandering Roller should get the same treatment as Tarn: a Note at the bottom saying we REALLY thought he was IDW Roller, but it later turned out he wasn't. --Xaaron (talk) 12:38, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- But they never actually showed them as two characters? So your "pfft" note is exactly what happened. That's how I see it. --Khajidha (talk) 12:30, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- "Wandering Roller" is Japan's version of IDW Roller. I mean, look at it. That's not in question. They took the Rook toy and they did it up to look like IDW Roller. Then, Japan eventually decided that Wandering Roller and buggy Roller were the same character in their continuity, but not before originally showing that WR used to look exactly like IDW Roller. That last-minute revelation doesn't magically prevent WR from being the Japanese version of IDW Roller, and the brief summary and link through to the other article is, IMO, more representative of the actual situation than just a note claiming "pfft, no, this guy who looks just like IDW Roller isn't teeeeeechnically a version of IDW Roller." Jalaguy (talk) 12:21, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- I get it, but think the way you had it was more honest. --Khajidha (talk) 12:12, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- And let's not oversell "all those things" that made him "super-obviously" IDW Roller. It's really just TWO things: (1) WRoller apparently looked like IDW Roller before Unicron found him, and (2) he had a "vengeful spirit" because he was "abandoned by his comrades". Well, the final chapter completely explained away (2), providing a different scenario where WRoller was abandoned. He was talking about something else, not MTMTE #36 or anything like it. Which leaves (1). Just looking like somebody CANNOT be enough to say they're the same person in TF fiction. And for a comparable scenario, Nightbird (G1) is still a separate page from Nightracer (G2), even though Fun Pub used a place-holder image of 'Bird in A Flash Forward before introducing 'Racer.
- There were reasons to think WRoller was the UW version of IDW Roller. But then the story went a different direction and explained away those reasons. What's left isn't enough to support the WRoller = IDW Roller idea. --Xaaron (talk) 14:25, 28 November 2016 (EST)
Okay. Is it any way helpful to readers who might be looking for toys of IDW Roller, or information about the G1-universe, black and orange friend of Optimus Prime Roller who showed up in the Unite Warriors comics, to sequester the information on him down in IDW Roller's notes section? I'm going to lean towards "no". (Seriously, guys, this is not something that it's a good idea to get up our own asses about.) --Riptide (talk) 13:32, 28 November 2016 (EST)
- Kind of a moot point. Whether Wandering Roller is listed under Toys (above the Notes line) or depicted below in the Notes section, it's still going to be virtually the last thing on the page. Regardless of which idea we go with, anyone who hits Ctrl + End is going to see the Toy and the explanation for it in the same place on their screen. The only practical difference will be whether a Unite Warriors fiction section is present on Roller (IDW). --Xaaron (talk) 13:41, 28 November 2016 (EST)
