Talk:Sideways (Armada)

Main image

Hey, wasn't there a different Sideways profile pic at some point? One that wasn't just his head again, which is really redundant with the headshot of him just a further bit down the page? --ItsWalky 21:27, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Fixed! --ItsWalky 21:47, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

I changed it earlier because the original pic there was total crap and tiny. Oddly enough I was going to use the Armada cardart (which has exactly the same pic you used), but I was warned against it for some reason. --FFN 05:11, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

RID Sideways = Armada Sideways

I'm gonan throw out this interesting nugget-- RiD Sideways is the same character. Even JAPAN thinks so. Their Robotmasters page lists Sideways 1st appearance as RiD (or was it CR? It's been awhile, and it's moot for the purposes of this Wiki.) The POINT is, Armada is the SECOND toyline Sideways/Doubleface appeared in, not the first.

I noticed this as well. Also, I noticed that Axer`s page claims that he is the ONLY character to physically cross over from continuity to continuity. Based on the information from the article this is not likely true. Any objections?--Autobotx1010 19:39, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Okay, Sideway's page does indeed already say that R.I.D. sideways is the same person, and ditto with the Robot masters version. Scroll down, it's all there in the toy section. Sideways doesn't appear in the fiction for R.I.D., just the toy line, so only the toy was mentioned.

Plus, Axer's page says he's the first character to cross continuity, not "only."

You're joining an argument that is seventeen months old. It's been resolved for a while. --Atomic spaceman 21:55, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

If you assume that RM Sideways is the same character as Armada Sideways (a fair assumption) then it logically follows that RiD Sideways probably is as well. (he's no further removed from the Unicron Trilogy than is the Sideways in Robotmasters version of G1.) The fact that RiD sideway's packaging-partnet was another continuity-hopper lends credibility to this approach-- but the Takara stance that he 1st appeared in the line before Armada is the real clincher for me.

Disagreement? -Derik 05:31, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

I had the RiD toy listed on this page in the beginning, but thought instead to just suggest on both pages that they are probably the same guy. Believe me, I agree with you. But if there's enough support, back in here the RiD version goes. --ItsWalky 05:35, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

RID Sideways was not a Japanese release. RID has no ties to Armada, either. It's a name reuse, as the reused bio for RID Sideways was saw in Armada does not even relfect the same character. A ninja? Don't think so. RID Sideways was also an Autobot hero. Totally seperate character. Also want to point out that the character is named Doubleface in Japan, severing the ties to any "Sideways" name use for a toy that is US only. --Bodycount

Hrm. Well for reference here's my post on the subject back in the day exploring the issue- the Takara site said CR BTW, though I don't have a link. (It's probably still up, but I have no idea where Takara's RM site is, so...) -Derik 05:41, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Bodycount- read the damn post I linked to.

• Takara says it's the same character, even with all the renaming.
• Though it didn't come through int he cartoon, Armada Sideways WAS suppsoedly a ninja
• Eat me

-Derik 05:44, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Takara also recognized Galaxy Force as part of the Micron Trilogy and lists the characters as the same ones from the previous two shows. Do you also accept that idea? Oh, and I would eat you, but I don't think I can fit that much geek into my stomach.

Man, 2005 used to be the FUTURE, now it's already "back in the day." Anyway, I would agree with Derik the RiD Sideways is most likely the same guy. Unicron can dimension jump after all, and have his servants do the same. --KilMichaelMcC 05:46, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Oh, crap, Derik! I totally forgot about Takara listing RiD Sideways as RM Doubleface's first toy. Thanks for reminding me, and that's certainly enough to join the two probably-the-same guys into the same page. --ItsWalky 05:48, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

...was this not in the first paragraph on the talk page? Admittedly, the usenet post was SPELLCHECKED, and thus much easier to understand. -Derik 05:52, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

I did edit this page last night, mostly at first I corrected the spelling on the RM section, then added a basic outline for RiD Sideways since there was nothing there when I got here, unaware of the connection between UT and RiD Sideways. However, I understand that somehow the RM Doubleface section got attributed to me. I never claimed that Doubleface was a different character, I just fixed some spelling errors, and I, like most fans, didn't know exactly what the connection was between RiD and Armada Sideways. I am not that useless. -- 21:18, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

And who are you, anyway? (I only bring it up because your identity is an important part of your statement here.)--G.B. Blackrock 13:49, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

All this fussin' and fightin' last year when someone could've just looked up Hasbro's online bio for Armada Sideways and seen that it's almost a word-for-word lift from RiD Sideways. Same tech spec numbers, too.--MCRG 16:58, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Hasbro was just emerging from their steal-big-chunks-of-bios-from-old-bios phase at the time these were published. While strong evidence-in-favor (and admittedly we did overlook it) I doubt that it would have been considered decisive. -Derik 20:21, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Turncoats

I think Sideways should retain the turncoat category, his 'actual alliance' being to Unicron nonwithstanding. If I look int he Turncoat category, i expect to see characters who've switched sides, and that's Sideways. -Derik 21:01, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

He didn't really switch sides. He was working for Unicron the entire time, and that job has him posing as both an Autobot and a Decepticon. If that's being a turncoat, then we need to put Punch, Armada Jetfire and Armada Scavenger in there as well, because they were also Decepticons at some point. Imagine three factions, A, B and C. If a guy from side A goes undercover as a B and later "betrayes" be and "becomes" a C, his true alligence is still with A, as he never was actually a B or C anyway. --FortMax 21:20, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

And all those American soldiers who went and fight for the British weren't turncoats either- because that's where their loyalties always lay?

That's the origin of the term.

I realize there's a difference between a turncoat and a double-agent... but sideways seems like he belongs in both somehow. :p Armada thrust, I assume, is a turncoat? -Derik 21:33, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Uh, if Americans were fighting for the British in the American Revolution, then I don't see how their allegiance wasn't to Britain instead of America. I know you like to be incoherent, Derik, but come on now. Interrobang 23:54, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Bad Luck

In Transformers Cybertron Sideways had alot of bad luck. IG he fell into alot of traps.

Yes, yes he did. THAT made me laugh like I was 10. Which I'm not. Oh, and sign your posts, for the love of Primus. The 'Bee :) 19:37, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

RiD Art?

I wince a little to even ask but... does any art of his RiD incarnation exist? --Some jerk who didn't sign his name!

Nope! RID stuff didn't have packaging art, just retouched toy photography. So since that version never got any fiction, d'oh well. Which is just as well, since the Armada guy probably belongs up there anyway. --ItsWalky 02:01, 7 April 2009 (EDT)

RM Section

The Robotmasters section has this note;

In this continuity family, the character is known as "Doubleface," which is one of his Japanese names. Since Robot Masters is a Japanese franchise with no English-language equivalent, we do not use the English name "Sideways" in this section.

...huh? We're not using English names for characters that have them because the fiction was published in Japan? That seems not-right. -Derik 13:03, 13 April 2009 (EDT)

I added that note to account for the way the section was already written, under the assumption that it was written correctly. I have no strong feelings on the matter. Edit: Okay, I've got some feelings now! I'm thinking you're right, Derik, on the logic that if we use "Doubleface" for the RM section, then we would also need to use "Convoy," "Beast Convoy," etc. I think the reason the section was written the way it was is that the author was preserving a veneer of ambiguity over the character, noting that he only CALLED himself by this particular name, for whatever value you choose to give that. But at this point is there any reason to cast that doubt? I don't know RM well enough to say for sure, but the discussion above and what I've gathered about the nature of RM suggest to me that there's no good reason to treat him differently than all of the other old-characters-in-new-bodies that are RM's stock in trade. - Jackpot 23:28, 13 April 2009 (EDT)

I wrote the section using "Doubleface" because that fiction has no English-language equivalent. I'm not super-attached to using his Japanese name there. I just thought it might be appropriate. Part of the reason is that we call his toy "Doubleface" in the respective toy section. We don't "translate" that into his English name, so it felt weird doing it for Robot Masters. --ItsWalky 23:51, 13 April 2009 (EDT)

The Fiction and Toy sections have different naming rules, though (or so I'd gathered). Each individual toy is labeled as whatever is on its packaging, period. But for fiction, we homogenize as much as possible (hence calling RM Convoy "Optimus Prime"). So.... yeah, I'm going to change that section. Also, while I'm at it - Robot Masters isn't its own continuity family, is it? The fiction is pretty sparsely documented here, but what I've been able to scrounge up says it's in some G1 universe or other. Characters are just warping like crazy from across time and space to a G1 Earth in the year 2004. So I'm going to change the continuity-family label too. - Jackpot 00:27, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

Yeah, RM definitely isn't its own continuity family. --ItsWalky 00:42, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

The name change is especially bothersome to me here because... RM Doubleface is the toy that explicitly established that all the Doublefaces were the same character. "This guy first appeared in RiD."

While on the subject... I thought that Cybertron Sideways was actually an AU version of Armada sideways or something... isn't Planet X actually from a parallel universe? -Derik 00:46, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

No, Ask Vector Prime makes it clear he is the same guy. He just happens to be from a parallel dimension, originally. Or... well, wait. Did the Planet X attack happen before or after Gigantian got moved to that parallel dimension? Eh. --ItsWalky 00:48, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

Oh, that makes sense, I guess. Assuming he was in the RiD universe "before" armada (and he'd have to be, his fiction is a straight line afterward) there's really no reason the Armadaverse has to be his "home" universe.

...I feel like this might benefit from an "Origins" section explaining that unlike other characters, this fiction section is all the same iteration of the same guy. -Derik 00:52, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

I'm working one up right now, though I'm putting it in "Notes". You can do as you wish with it when I'm done. - Jackpot 00:59, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

That's good to-- possibly a better way of presenting it too. -Derik 01:01, 14 April 2009 (EDT)

TV Magazine?

There was a Robotmasters story featured in TV Magazine as well? Anyone have scans? Lightsyderthe2nd 10:05, 1 May 2009 (EDT)

(RID)?

Why isn't it Sideways (Armada)? Because he's more prominent in the Unicron Trilogy, and if I recall RID Sideways was a toy only guy. Gearshift 15:01, 29 July 2009 (EDT)