Talk:Transformer afterlife
The Allspark may be connected to The Well Of All Sparks from War Within.
Infact, it seems quite probable that the Allspark is simply an abbreviated term for The Well Of All Sparks, which lies deep underground, close to the heart of Cybertron.
Other Names
I always assumed that The Allspark was just a disambiguation of Primus. Which is what I also thought about The Matrix (not the Leadership variety), The Oracle and Vector-Sigma.
And apparently I was misinformed.
And Knowing is half the battle.
The Primus Alpha trion chats with int he TFU comics is vastlly different from the alllsparkk Primal and Botanica commune with during Beast machines.
the confusion is that the Allspark, the Oracle, and Primus are so... interlocked. Th Allspark, for instance, onyl seems to 'step in' halfway through BM when Megatron's corrupting program has rendered the Oracle unable to get shit done, and it friggin' NEEDS someone to do something.
Oracle = Semi-cryptic
Allspark = Acid Trip metaphor-visions
Primus = Capable of witty conversation
basically, that's how you can easily tell them apart. (especialyl when you start getting into things liek Cybertron Primus, which is more disembodied.)
Hell, Primus is complicated enough by himself. The way I see it, the Oracle is just an evolved Quint AI program.
The Allspark is the absolute essence of Primus. A Transformers Spark is just a tiny tiny portion of the Allspark. Primus's essence is ALL the Allspark. His perspective is such that he's utterly beyond mortal comprehension. However, if he feels like it, he can "talk down" to us by one means or another.
It's like Primus lets tiny "pieces" of himself go so that they can gain knowledge & experience and then eventually return, bringing it all back to him. It's a neat way of "powering up" while he's "sleeping", and it was probably part of Primus's plan to defeat Unicron, given how poorly he seemingly did the first time around.
Fancruft alternate theory
When I was watching Beast Wars / Machines, I saw it monotheistically. That is, Primus was not the Allspark, but the Creator of the Universe AND the Allspark. The Allspark was, in my interpretation, a multidimensional being of much power and little experience. When the Quintessons needed a true randomization and personality generator for their robots, they used pieces of the AllSpark. This is the reason all Transformers long to "all be one". This is based on G1 and BW/BM only, so comics and later TV and comic series can't be viewed this way, but it was remarkably self-consistent with the show at the time. --71.213.138.218 23:10, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
Confusion by Beast Wars team
It seems to me that, when watching the Generation 1 film, Prime stated "Soon, I shall be one with the Matrix." As it was later revealed, the Matrix was where the wisdom of ancient Autobots was contained to bring strength and guidance to the current Prime. His statement, however, could have lead to the confusion between the Allspark and the Matrix, which are obviously two totally different things. The Beast Wars writers must have assumed that, since the Matrix is a piece of Primus, and the Allspark is Primus's collective spark, that the Matrix was another name for the Allspark. Of course, there was no evidence to support that all Autobots transcended to the "Matrix," since Prime had only indicated that he himself would join the Matrix. In an attempt to add depth to the series, as we all know, the Beast Wars team did indeed invent the concept of the spark well AFTER Generation 1, but one can see where the confusion lies in retrospect. It is such that I feel that the fandom should recognize the "Matrix," as singularily the item of power which becomes fused with the spark of the Prime, and the "Allspark," is the Well of Sparks, and the originator/afterlife of the Transformers, and not get the two confused at all.
- There have been plenty of Generation 1 stories after Beast Wars that took the Spark/Allspark concept onward. Check out the MTMTE profile guide (and probably the DK Ultimate Guide), in the back, where it talks about these concepts at length. Also, the article at retcon. Brilliant textwork! --67.188.23.44 22:33, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
Movie AllSpark
Just a note... it looks like the movie MacGuffin's "official" capitalization is "AllSpark". This probably doesn't warrant its own page (I've already made a redirect), we should probably go about fixing this on Movie pages... um... because. And for future notice. --M Sipher 05:11, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
- As long as we're discussing major changes- I feel like this page should be about the movie version first, due to prominence, and the BW.BM stuff moved down below. -Derik
So in Dreamwave's Armada continuity the Matrix is mysteriously absent.... but there's a Hhydroelectric dam called the Allspark. This is a coincidence, right? No relation to the used-to-power-a-planet and -stored-in-hoover-dam renamed-Matrix Allspark in the movie?
I'm just asking, should the dam be merged into this article? -Derik 05:47, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
- No. The Allspark power plant is just a power plant named after the Transformers message board. --ItsWalky 05:57, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
- And I'm sure Hoover Dam isn't... wait, no, that doesn't work as a comeback. It would only work if Herbert Hoover had transfered his mind into the Dam like Boltax, so that Hoover Dam was Hoover.
- (actually, that sounds kinda cool.) -Derik 06:13, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
- It seems the decision has been made to keep the BW and Movie Allsparks as one page. I want to kinda question that. Other than the fact that both grant TFs life they are VERY different things. One is a dimension consisting of the essence of Primus (in the concepts final evolved form). The other is a mysterious artifact, a cube, that grants any machine that comes near it life (though not neccissarily sentience). That's a much bigger difference (known dimension vs mysterious artifact) than that between the Movie and G1 Arks and THEY get seperate pages. I think the combination here is rather forced and disrruptive.--ZacWilliam 19:57, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
- The "BW" Allspark is, by definition, a multiversal thing. Until we get more information on the Movie All Spark, which, as you say, is a "mysterious artifact," I don't think we know enough to say they're irreconcilable. --ItsWalky 21:22, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Parsing
Frenzy's subtitles parse the plot device's name as "All Spark". Are we going to go with that? Interrobang 06:53, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Pleasures of heaven?
Maybe I'm missing the reference/joke but I don't get the bit about the cube granting the "pleasures of heaven" and that linking to the Demon in the dark from the Marvel Comic. Anyone able to explain?--ZacWilliam 22:48, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
- It's a reference to the Wikipedia:Lament Configuration from the Hellraiser franchise, the engravings of which tell of bestowing the "pleasures of heaven" upon those who can solve it. Unfortunately, this was engraved by a masochist, so to him "pleasures of heaven" meant "leather-clad demons from depths of hell rip your skin off"--Speedbreaker 22:56, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
