Talk:Transformation

"Maintaining a transformed state requires a constant output of energy. The 'base' state for a Transformer seems to vary- sometimes robot, sometimes vehicle or skirmish mode. Most Beast Warrriors have their beast mode as their base state."

Where does this come from? Interrobang 15:37, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Maintaining a transformed state using up energy comes from "A Decepticon Raider in King Arthur's Court." I don't know where this stuff about Beast Warriors having their beast mode as a "base state" comes from. Or the term "base state" for that matter. If that's not from canon, I'd suggest "root mode," from "The Autobot Run." --KilMichaelMcC 15:49, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

BM mostly, I knwo there's a similar bit in G1 somewhere... probably not able to switch to vehicle mode due to low power. (It's not jazz's paralyzed half-transformed stated in Desertion of the Dinobots.) -Derik 15:51, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't really see BM as evidence for beast mode being the "root form". They were in beast mode all the time because Vehicon scanners couldn't detect them while they were in beast mode, not because it was their root form or whatever. Interrobang 22:03, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, but if they were startled, or knocked out, or broke their concentration in some way, they would automatically snap back to beast mode, rather than robot mode. The beast mode was their "default," and they had to teach themselves to transform out of it, unlike the more common method of starting with robot mode, and going to alt mode. - Chris McFeely 22:21, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

That suggests this is the case only for the technorganic Maximals, not for "most Beast Warriors" as the article reads.--KilMichaelMcC 01:02, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Just to pin down the G1 reference, in "Decepticon Raider," Warpath is forced to revert to robot mode, stating that he's getting so low on energy he can't even stay transformed. --KilMichaelMcC 15:54, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

*glomps* Thank you Ethan! I remembered from viewing the eps there was an instance of explicitly that behavior in the cartoon- but not what ep it was. -Derik 02:16, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

TF cogs?

Has there ever been a mention of a transformation cog outside of metroplex and trypticon?

Also, i take issue with the 'Lithonians dont' transform' thing. They do transform in Marvel UK continuity, as they were seen to do so in the Marvel TF:TM adaption. Put another way- in at least SOME versions of the Multiverse, Lithonians transform. -Derik 02:22, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

You will note, sir, that said comment is under "Animated continuity," where it is true. Feel free to add a comment to the contrary under the comic header. :) - Chris McFeely 19:08, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Unit 1 had his transformation cog damaged. --ItsWalky 02:25, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Statement weights

I think this article kind of sucks right now. I'm glad to see some of the weirder statements cited, but that's not good enough. I think a lot of the statements made in the opening section are overstated, even if we restrict ourselves just to the continuities they are based on. I think it's clear that transformation usually is *not* a mentally rigorous task, for example. I highly doubt that maintaining a certain mode is more strenuous than maintaining the other except in unusual circumstances (such as, arguably, the BM Maximals). One obscure reference to something in one episode does make a statement multiversal, or even universal when the weight of evidence from other stories in that universe goes against it. Basically, I am inclined to heavily rewrite the opening to make it actually match the vast majority of the fiction. But right now I need to go have lunch. --Steve-o 18:58, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't disagree, but, just re: the rigorous thing, I think it's worth pointing out that the Headmasters-in-training from Headmasters had a bloody hard time of it, and required a lot of training before they could get it right. So there is something to be said for transfoming being a rigorous task to learn, at least, if not to perform constantly. - Chris McFeely 19:10, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

I've just made a number of large changes to this article in an attempt to make it something besides a misleading mishmash.

• I moved a lot of material around and/or added qualifiers so there should be no more cross-continuity errors.
• I removed the stuff about "root" modes mainly because I've never heard anybody use the term before and would rather not try to introduce it to this wiki without us at least discussing it first.
• I added more citations and removed a seemingly erroneous statement that Junkions are descended from Cybertronians. (Walky says this probably came from the MTMTE guidebook, but it says nothing about the origin of the race, only the planet itself.)
• Slightly expanded Beast Era discussion.
• Questioned relevance of Warpth's "Decepticon Raider" statement.

I have a remaining qualm about the first paragraph under the G1 cartoon section. I have no recollection of transformation leading to the Autobots' victory in the first great war, and would like somebody to confirm that. To my memory, it simply helped them out, but the Decepticons picked up on it and started transforming as well long before War Dawn, presumably even during that same war. That's all from FFOD, right? --Steve-o 23:36, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

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