MediaWiki talk:Community Portal/Archive18

[[{{#sub:MediaWiki_talk:Community_Portal/Archive18|0|-0}}|«]]	Community Portal / Archive18   e	[[{{#sub:MediaWiki_talk:Community_Portal/Archive18|0|-0}}|»]]
from~? to~? notes:

Custom toys?

Do you think we should start a article, or articles about Custom toys, Garage kits and third party upgrade sets? You know like the Jizai toys , the Cyber fembots, the HTM-01 Bumblebee and those TFClub upgrade stuff, like the Classics UM armor. I think we should have one, but I think I should ask before I once again start a disastrous think like my first article..Dead Metal 12:21, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

No. Unless it's official licensed Hasbro/Takara product, it's got no place here. -hx 12:50, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

No. --M Sipher 13:27, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

No, definitely. --TX55^TALK 14:12, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

OK, but doesn't Jizai toys have some kind of license from Takara that lets them sell theyre stuff exclusively at Wonderfest? At least that's what I believe I've read as they said they couldn't attend the last one.Dead Metal 16:26, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

Kitbash is probably the most you can do. -- SFH 18:28, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

We should investigate the One Day License TakaraTomy (and other license holders in Japan) grant to small 'garage kit' makers to sell their wares at Japanese conventions. We should at least acknowledge it. --FFN 12:41, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I could live with that - maybe give One Day License its own entry and give some examples of popular customs sold under it (the Jizaitoys sets come to mind... wasn't that fan-made fusion cannon for AM Megatron done the same way?) -hx 13:09, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Humor message template

I've been thinking: Isn't it time that we make a message that informs people that humor is allowed on this wiki? I mean, we've got the whole THE FUNNY STAYS at the top of the main page talk, but maybe we need a more proactive one. As for transformer quotes, I bet something from Random Blitzwing would suffice. -- SFH 18:28, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

I concur. Though I think we should consider how Memory Alpha and other major wikis usually copy-paste a welcome message with all relevant policy links, rules and guidelines for newcomer registered members. Might be too much work, though, as we don't have a 24 hour rotating staff. --FFN 12:41, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

You know, I think that a welcome template would be a good idea. That's pretty much all I do on Wookieepedia these days. I could start working on one. -- SFH 16:00, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

UK G1 covers and cover varaints and stuff

Some of you may have realised that I have uploaded some UK G1 covers. But the nature of how the UK stories are depicted om Teletraan 1 is one article per story, as opposed to one article per issue. In essence this means that only one cover per story can be uploaded.But shouldn't there be a system where every cover can be catalogued here? Should there a "Covers" section? In the case of Time Wars and Space Pirates we have a half-dozen of covers to chose from, all good, but only space for one.And on a similar vein, shouldn't there be a section for UK covers for the US stories. For the most part the US covers were inferior, hence the UK havng to draw up new ones in the first place. Using my "covers" idea from above, it could be "UK covers" section. What does everyone think?(And while I'm on it, maybe a variant covers section for the more modern issues? Mind you, as I type this, I have no idea whether such a thing is actually being done). Drmick 14:54, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

A system where every cover can be catalogued seems to be a fascinated idea! --TX55^TALK 16:18, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Yea it would be, and I would be able to help, since I have lots of the new idw covers, but would it be bad if they were signed, I man can we use signed covers for that, or would those covers be taken down?Dead Metal 16:32, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Man, I'm so used to having my edits undone I thought TX55 was being sarcastic. I have every UK G1 page scanned on my hard drive, inc the covers. Although, in fairness, there are sites out there with better scans. Drmick 16:43, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Wow wow, wait a minute. I wasn't being sarcastic, really. I really think we should have a thing like this as a single article page as some sort of catalog page(Marvel UK Cover Gallery, maybe?). But it would be take a little work. --TX55^TALK 17:06, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

• Marvel UK #1
  Marvel UK #1
• Marvel UK #2
  Marvel UK #2
• Marvel UK #3
  Marvel UK #3
• Marvel UK #4
  Marvel UK #4
• Marvel UK #5
  Marvel UK #5

The problem with this is the page would be huge. There were 332 (or so) UK issues, Plus, many UK issues had two stories (heck, one issue had three stories: A UK story, a US story and part of the Heasmasters mini-series) --FortMax 17:53, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

This problem is not unique to the UK comics. Lots of recent books from IDW and Dreamwave have multiple covers. We just put 'em in at the bottom. See Dreamwave Armada issue 1 for a random example. -- Repowers 17:33, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

"...have multiple covers. We just put 'em in at the bottom". Ok, we could start doing that, but the logic centre in my brain says each UK issue should have it's own cover, rather than putting all the covers (for Time Wars for example) at the bottom of that article. Drmick 19:51, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

That's an artifact of the the UK stuff being storyline articles instead of issue articles. I think each issue should have it's own page (for vital statistics and image credit linking, if nothing else) but at the moment those pages would be baren of info, unless you also want to rewrite all the summaries.

Maybe a "This multipart storyline has a detailed synopsis at ARTICLENAME" on the individual pages as a temporary make-do? -Derik 20:05, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I think I'd rather see one gigantic list page, with a table of contents for each page, rather than 332 individual articles each with a minimum of information, which would also require a second click-through to get to the actual story info. That info should be on the wiki somewhere.... but considering how hacked apart the UK stories were, I dislike the idea of making story pages subordinate to issue pages. -- Repowers 20:18, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Child pages that are just the technical details? "Time Wars/Marvel UK issue 199" -Derik 01:11, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Serious question then - why do we have (e.g.) Stormbringer issue 1 (etc) as the main articles rather than everything at Stormbringer? Surely we should be consistent in having either everything sorted by issue, or everything sorted by story rather than some hodgepodge? - SanityOrMadness 12:08, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

'Cause the UK stories are uniquely chopped up. Stormbringer #1 is written to have an opening, a middle and a conclusion. UK stories share issues with other stories (most of which are already presented as single stories in the US issues), and are sometimes cut off in mid-sentence. Story summaries of individual UK issues wouldn't make much sense, and would be ridiculously short. in short, the UK comics are treated uniquely because they are a unique case. -- Repowers 12:15, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Right, now, ladies. Enough yapping. I'm not proposing all the UK issues get their own articles, for all the reasons above. I need a system whereby they get archived correctly though. To use the mantra "don't come to me with problems, come to me with solutions" I propose that all the UK covers get stuck into their respective articles (and be appropriately named and wikilinked in the 1st place). What I need you girls to do, is to decide the format by which they go ino those articles (top, bottom, sideways, collaged, separate section etc) Drmick 18:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I think top and sideways will be too messy - for any three part or longer story there'll be so many covers running down the side that they'll hit images in the synopsis et al. A special gallery at the bottom may be best.

Also what are people's thoughts on always including the Collected Comics covers? There's a mix of reusing a cover from one of the issues reprinted in it (1, 2, 7, 13-15, 17-19, Autumn 92, Easter 93, Summer 93), using a cover from another issue not reprinted in it (3, 16, Summer 92, Winter 93, Holiday 94, Summer 94, Autumn 94) and brand new covers (4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12). Timrollpickering 00:03, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Disambiguation images?

Dunno if this has been brought up before, but would having thumbnail images on the disambiguation pages be a worthwhile thing? It'd take forever to carry out, of course, but it's something that wouldn't require any new image files (just reuse character page images) and would add a nice visual component to the selection on disambig pages. -- Repowers 17:36, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I saw something like this on the Bumblebee (disambiguation) page and thought it looked like a neat concept. The only problems I can think of would be using images for larger articles (with 6+ redirects) and people with slower internet connections. --Professor Icepick 17:43, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

One big problem is that Transformers tend to change bodies every so often, especially Primes and Megatrons. Which body would you show? Armada Megatron looks nothing like Energon Megatron who looks nothing like Cybertron Megatron, and G2 Megatron has more in common visually with Armada Megatron (both transform into green and purple tanks) than he does his own G1 form. --FortMax 18:00, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

The Prime page wouldn't gain much by it- all red stuff. Still, I like the idea in concept... it might be worth exploring if it can be done in a compact manner that complements the text descriptions. (And really, some of our disambig pages are getting ridiculously long, we're gonna need a synthesize a new high-density format sooner or later) -Derik 20:08, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

In most cases, the image should probably just be the main image from the character's page. Simple solution... assuming they can be seen at small size. Test page at User:Repowers/Sandbox3. -- Repowers 20:13, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

At the very least, you need dividing lines/separating boxes. Plus, there's a shit-ton of empty whitespace there, which looks awful. There's probably some ways to fill that vertical space by itemizing the contents of the original sentences...

• Bumblebee
• Apperance year: 1984
• Origin: Generation 1 continuity family

Or someshit. Could probably fill horizontal by making it a 2-character-wide table. (I just really hate large expanses of blank space.) --M Sipher 20:47, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I like that. I was thinking about disambig-images myself a while back, and the whitespace issue was also my reservation. A lot of the boilerplate you're introducing could be automated via a template, so it wouldn't be too tedious. For what it's worth, though, I still think the date-template goes a long way toward making the long lists palatable, and I don't see the need for images as particularly urgent. - Jackpot 00:02, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

If you're doign first appearance, can I also suggest last appearance? It tells you a lot if a character was active from 1987-1989 as opposed to 1982-1997. Or 1984-Ongoing.

Prowl is the prime example of why the date-template isn't... necessarily viable. It's long, and it'd have to stop and read 'em all. I'd be nice to be able to see- "Oh hey, RiD Prowl-- CLICK!" I actually have some thoughts on the matter... but I think I'll wait for Rob's design to evolve one or two iterations first- I think it's going somewhere useful. -Derik 00:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

"Last appearance" would mean near-constant updating of a fuckton of disambig pages. Characters can come back any time. --M Sipher 01:33, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I just made two test pages. I prefer the first one, but it would be lots of blank space for several pages. But I hate putting non-original character in the middle.

ps. I think 1st appearance would be better. --TX55^TALK 01:38, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I prefer how we currently have a sentence-ish description of who each version is, which I think would fit better in Rob's mock-up (with Siph's additions). And, yeah, thirded on the no-last-appearance. - Jackpot 01:58, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I took a crack at it here.--Rosicrucian^Talk 02:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)--Rosicrucian^Talk 02:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)I kinda like the image I put up at Sunstorm (disambiguation)... --ItsWalky 02:37, 3 June 2008 (UTC)I think disambiguation pages are just fine the way they are now, and any change that involves adding images should be done with a minimal impact on the current format. --KilMichaelMcC 04:22, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Ooh, Kil's not gonna like my pass on the idea at all... -Derik 05:06, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I like Walky's image too... but as more Sunstorms pile up, I fear that group shots liek that aren't practical to maintain. (That said, I want someone to take a picture of all the Roller toys together. It would be awesome.)

How many different Sunstorms do we expect to pile up? There's still only four, despite how many toys they've gotten. If they make 30 more G1 Sunstorms, that doesn't change the image. If they add one to, say, Animated, we'd have to update the image, but until then... --ItsWalky 12:37, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

File:11rattrap.GIF

Derik has had a lot of caffeine today.

Okay, I did pass at a picture disambig template Template:Disamb-charbox. OMGWTFLOL, it's madness? Aye, but there be a method to it... this layout uses a CSS change to accomplish crimes of passion not possible with simple inline CSS. (This is how we did our messageboxes originally.) So to see what it's SUPPOSED to look like... go to my Wikia CSS file, copy the code there, and save it to your own. (Or, just look at the screenshot, but that's much less exciting.)The Picture disambigs are 300 pixels wide- but that's with full-size text. I figure you could scrunch. They display in as many columns as can fit on the user's page (like the picture gallery here) to maximize the use of the page.This is a proof-of-concept build- to be sure it could be done. If carried through to completion, it'd allow you to assign multiple faction symbols, one or none continuity logos for the bottom, (both of which would be faded back for legibility.) Box borders might used to visually code prominence- a major characters with 100 + appearances gets a black border, normal characters a gray one, and guys that barely exist a light gray one. Cosmos will probably have a single year '2008,' while Obsidian would be 1999-2007 and Bumblebee might be 1984-ongoing. Lots of information presented succinctly. Actual colors, proportions etc... would be subject to change. Oh, and I think there's room for a brief italic comment or note at the bottom of the box.-Derik 05:06, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeaaaahhh.... I'm going to have to stick with "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." The current format for disambig pages is fine, and if we want to pretty them up a bit with some images, that'd be fine too, but I don't think it's necessary to radically overhaul them. --KilMichaelMcC 05:29, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Energon (disambiguation)? -Derik 05:54, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Is that a question? Are you suggesting there's a problem with that particular page? Because I think it's fine. --KilMichaelMcC 06:25, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, this is quickly approaching "skip it" levels. The majority of disambig pages really aren't that big or complicated, and the existing text, most notably the franchise they came from, should be more than enough. And really, would pages like Sam (disambiguation) really gain anything from any of the proposed new formats? Because they'd LOSE a lot more... --M Sipher 13:18, 3 June 2008 (UTC)Refinement #1. Same place, still requires CSS change. (It might be possible to do it without a CSS change, but the code becomes ungodly ugly.) Screenshot. Responses appreciated. -Derik 04:37, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

That's..... that's getting somewhere. I'd say ditch the "Transformers" logos (which are redundant and pull the eye confusingly), remove the "Appears:" (also redundant clutter) and last-appearance dates (personal taste), and we're just about there. Edit: Also, I'd like to see the explanatory sentence-fragments worked into the resulting whitespace. I think it's still a very good idea to have the brief description (name of alt-mode, significant subgroup, anything else that might be necessary to distinguish the character from those around it) because that sort of thing is rarely conveyed by a robot-mode pic if you don't recognize it at first sight. - Jackpot 05:22, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, you can put in a text note (it's on the Universe Micromaster.) -Derik 05:28, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, but your screencap barely shows that. What I'm getting at is, I'd like to see what it would actually look like if all of the boxes retained the information currently in their descriptions. To see if it's too much text, if it can flow well the way it currently does, if it all ends up seeming redundant, whatever. It's the sort of thing I'd make my own Sandbox for, but I don't have the skillz. And I think you've made something so close to my ideal format, I'd love it if you humored me. - Jackpot 05:35, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

V3 I think the copy could be cut down- I removed the continuity since it was in the text, but in reality I think you'd swap that out. Realistically this would be their most common altmode and anythign important about them. (Oops, and I muffed up animated!Prowl's, oh well) -Derik 06:13, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Thank you, sir. I'm diggin' it. And I agree that if we can pull bits out of the text and put them elsewhere in the layout, all the better. For instance, you don't even need to mention the allegiance as long as the symbols are up in the corner. And, if I were doing it, I'd make the second line "[date] [continuity]", with no "range" and no last appearance (as I agree with Siph on that count). With all the room being saved, maybe even have an extra line either above or below it for alt-mode. Also, I still think the TF-logos need to go.

At any rate, I'm off to bed, but I thank you again for humoring me. Take my suggestions or not; I think what you're making is pretty and promising.

- Jackpot 06:24, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

I still think this is all entirely unnecessary and find the current format entirely sufficient. --KilMichaelMcC 05:39, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

There's been grumbling for awhile about finding a better way of diaplaying information specific to really high-density disambigs. Nothing needs to be decided now, but it's a useful discussion to have. (And yeah, that means that you saying you don't think it's necessary is useful-- the amount of benefit derived from any new layout would have to offset the negative karma is it being different, and thus less consistent.)

I'd just like to point out that TM2 Prowl shows up in "Withered Hope"... and it's cameos like that that is the reason I'm against "range". It's deceiving as well, as TM2 Prowl was NOT "active" for ten years. He had a toy for one, then did nothing anywhere for nine... and then barely did anything again. --M Sipher 13:35, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, and late G1 guys like Action Masters who didn't make fiction appearances until the modern comics could end up listed as "1989-2008" or some such, as if they were being used the entire time. That wouldn't really make a lot of sense. While I still oppose this whole idea, if changes are made the years listings should be dropped entirely. --KilMichaelMcC 01:27, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Well- first appearance year would be kept, right? We use that on long disambigs already. -Derik 01:52, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

WOWWiki?

Can anyone tell me why I have a message bar on the top of every page from the WOWWiki that I can't get rid of, even though I've never been there before? --Xaaron 03:13, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

I've got that too. It's quite annoying. I didn't even have any idea what GuildWiki was about. --KilMichaelMcC 06:12, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

They just merged their database, and clearly things are Fucked Up. This far I have gotten unhelpful advice that will clearly not solve the problem. -Derik 06:44, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

It got so annoying to me that I hid all user messages. It's just visually coded too prominently, i can't not read it each tiem the page loads, and it's incredibly obnoxious.

[1] .usermessage{display:none;}

Note: This should be considered a short-term solution until Wikia fixes things, because it stops you from receiving necessary messages too. I think i could rig it globally so the message notice would only show up if you have messages on this wimi... but I'd need an Admin's help, and we'd probably only do that if Wikia doesn't fix the problem soonish. -Derik 09:16, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Dumb question, probably

I remember there being transformers that could combine together to make one big kick-ass transformer. Did I imagine this? If it is true, do they still make them? Could I obtain a set? Thanks, Stimmlerjohnson 03:16, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

See Combiner. They do occasionally still make them, or rerelease old ones.--Rosicrucian^Talk 03:22, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Thank you, that is exactly what I needed to know.Stimmlerjohnson 16:22, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Ads

so, it looks like Wikia is changing the way the wikis look a bit, and one of the things that looks potentially harmful to our wiki is advertisements in the top right OF THE ARTICLES, pushing down the main image. For Characters and stuff, it is gonna suck having the pic that shows us what character we are looking at needs to be scrolled down too. I don't suppose we have a choice in the matter, so what are we gonna do to avoid our articles looking bad?i'm gonna miss the way the wiki looks now, its hot. :(--Skyglide 00:13, 12 June 2008 (UTC)Wow, this looks terrible. And it comes just a month after the last hideous change, so I figure by fall this place will look crappier thna About.com. Why the hell have I been giving Wikia free content if they're going to present it like this? How much money can they need? And how can they really think this will keep ad revenue sustainably high when it's guarandamnteed to drive people away? Chip 00:52, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Hey, Wikia guys, please try a little harder and find a place to put new OMG PRECIOUS ads other than inside the damn articles themselves.--Thylacine 2000 01:53, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Okay, I just opened the Nova Prime page, and was greeted by a John McCain campaign banner between the title and the disamgs. This gotta go. --Xaaron 11:15, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Firefox.

Adblock Plus.

("This has got to go" would be a pretty decent McCain campaign slogan if he hadn't gotten into bed witht he greepy people he crusaded against.) -Derik 11:17, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

While seconding what Derik just typed, the following code, added to [[2]]:YOURUSERNAME/global.css (replacing YOURUSERNAME with your login name here - you can log in there with the same username) appears to zap all the ads on Wikia regardless of browser. For now, at least - SanityOrMadness 15:33, 17 June 2008 (UTC)I actually thought the last change was pretty nice (well, we made it the best it could be with the colors and that banging name thing with the 'shopped animated logo.). but this new one makes me want to drink bleach. It looks terrible. Ads IN the articles? what has this world come too!? damn you wikia! why hath thou forsaken us!?!?!?--Skyglide 19:40, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

#adSpace0 {display:none !important}
#adSpace1 {display:none !important}
#adSpace2 {display:none !important}
#adSpace3 {display:none !important}
#adSpace4 {display:none !important}
#adSpace5 {display:none !important}
#adSpace6 {display:none !important}
#adSpace7 {display:none !important}
#adSpace8 {display:none !important}
#adSpace9 {display:none !important}
#adSpace10 {display:none !important}
#adSpace11 {display:none !important}
#adSpace12 {display:none !important}
#adSpace13 {display:none !important}
#adSpace14 {display:none !important}
#adSpace15 {display:none !important}
#adSpace16 {display:none !important}
#adSpace17 {display:none !important}
#adSpace18 {display:none !important}
#adSpace19 {display:none !important}
#adSpace20 {display:none !important}

.widget WidgetAdvertiser {display:none !important}
.WidgetAdvertiser {display:none !important}

ARGH. How the hell am I supposed to get rid of these fucking ads in the articles? Galvanisation 11:06, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

You see that big block starting #adSpace0? Add that to "User:Galvanisation/monaco.css" (or, if you visit other Wikia wikis, adding it to [[3]] should take care of them cross-Wikia - anyone else, substitute your own username for Galvanisation, obviously).

Firefox/AdBlock is another alternative. - SanityOrMadness 11:38, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

"You see that big block starting #adSpace0?". Sweet! Excellent work guys. Drmick 09:52, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

I just talk to a staff ask if the damn ads could become hideable by clicking on a "x" mark on it. She say she will take the advise to other staff in the next meeting this weekend. Wish us luck. --TX55^TALK 12:28, 25 June 2008 (UTC)