Talk:Swerve (G1)
That's weird. What dialogue does Swerve have in the Japanese cartoon that he doesn't have in the American version? -LV 13:42, 27 April 2011 (EDT)
- 私のアイスクリームを触れないでください。-hx 19:04, 27 April 2011 (EDT)
Why isn't his appearance in 'Forever is a long time coming' not mentioned? I feel it is necessary to have it included for the security of Earth. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 122.109.106.118 (talk • contribs){{#if:| {{{2}}}|}}.
Revamp?
[edit]Am I alone in thinking his bio needs an overhaul now that he has an actual personality and character beyond his Techspecs bio? I would think his awesome MtMtE portrayle should be at the very least added to the opening bio. yes? --76.28.76.206 11:41, 16 February 2012 (EST)
Sky High?
[edit]Why is Swerve's partner Flanker linked to Micromaster Sky High instead of the Micromaster Flanker? Bass X0 05:22, 8 November 2013 (EST)
- For the same reason we don't keep Universe Tankor on BM Tankor's page. --ItsWalky 05:27, 8 November 2013 (EST)
- Universe Tankor IS on BM Tankor's page. And that situation doesn't seem analogous to this one. --KilMichaelMcC 11:08, 8 November 2013 (EST)
- Oh wait, maybe you meant the Micromaster train Tankor. But that still doesn't seem analogous. The question is whether the plane who comes with Swerve's original intent of being Micromaster Sky High trumps his name change to that of another Micromaster jet. --KilMichaelMcC 11:10, 8 November 2013 (EST)
- NO WAIT AGAIN. You meant Octane. Sorry. I own that toy but I literally never think of it with that name. --KilMichaelMcC 11:13, 8 November 2013 (EST)
- I think he's asking what makes people think Flanker is an alternate name for the pre-existing character Sky High in the first place, and I second that question. --Xaaron (talk) 17:30, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Look at them next to each other. --ItsWalky (talk) 18:52, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Weren't Flanker and Payload identified as Blast Master and Sky High during BotCon 2013, too? --Detour (talk) 19:09, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- The file names of the stock photos released during BotCon '13 named "Flanker" as Blast Master and "Payload" as Sky High, but looking at the sculpts it's pretty clear those names got switched up accidentally. Flanker's mould is based on Sky High and Payload's mould is based on Blast Master. Jalaguy (talk) 19:14, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- ...And? Even if they were the exact same mold and not just a similar mold, a new name and a new paint job has been enough to create a distinct character since the 1984 Decepticons. The "file names of stock photos" sounds like it falls into the realm of non-canon, like Cybertron Overhaul originally intended to be named Trailbreaker. --Xaaron (talk) 19:36, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- They don't have new paint jobs. They have the same paint jobs. Because they are obviously new versions of preexisting characters. Like, say, Skrapnel and Trailcutter and Motorbreath. -LV (talk) 20:43, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Nonsense! Sky High is white. Flanker is blue. Sky High is patterned after an SST with one tailfin. Flanker is some other kind of plane with two tailfins. And your examples of re-naming all involve some remnant of the original name being preserved (Shrapnel, Trailbreaker, Motormaster), which Flanker does not. --Xaaron (talk) 21:51, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Tankor. Darkmount. There's a Bot Shots Wildrider stand-in named "Brake-Neck". "Flanker" has Sky High's colors, albeit reversed, and is clearly designed to have the same head as the Micromaster, and Hasbro referred to him as Sky High internally. There is no virtue in the wiki being willfully ignorant in this case. -LV (talk) 23:08, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Nor is there any virtue to turning a homage into the same character by force of will alone. Different name. Different color scheme. Different vehicle mode. Besides a similar head design, you're using unofficial information that Hasbro likely didn't intend to make public in order to claim an official connection. --Xaaron (talk) 23:30, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Hasbro's information is unofficial? Is that what you are actually saying here? --M Sipher (talk) 00:00, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- If I'm understanding what "file names of the stock photos" means, yes. The display plates at BotCon and SDCC, the packaging, and all other officially released sources of information from Hasbro say the guy is "Flanker". But someone read the URL of an image and found it said "Sky High" instead. That's unofficial information, similar to stuff found in the original production bible. It sounds like a preliminary name that was abandoned before actual release. Worthy of a note, sure, but not something that would require merging two characters. Otherwise, Rippersnapper (G1) and Frenzy (G1) should be merged thanks to the Sunbow cast list someone uncovered. --Xaaron (talk) 01:13, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Maybe if Frenzy and Rippersnapper shared all their robot mode detail. --ItsWalky (talk) 04:18, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- The Legends Cyb. Jetfire redeco in Powerglide colors was obviously originally intended to be Powerglide, but the name was changed to Fireflight and so we consider it a Fireflight toy and not a Powerglide. Why doesn't this apply here? It's not quite like Octane/Tankor, because no one thinks giving a toy designed to be the Decepticon Triple Changer the name of the Vehicon General changes the toy into the other character. But changing substituting one Autobot Micromaster Jet for another Autobot Micromaster Jet isn't that big a of a stretch. --KilMichaelMcC (talk) 09:28, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Cybertron Jetfire wasn't specifically designed detail-for-detail to be Powerglide, on the other hand. A red jet that looks like Cybertron Jetfire may as well be Fireflight as Powerglide; a space shuttle that looks like Blast Master and is colored as Blast Master and who was going to be named Blast Master is much less convincingly a guy we've never heard of before named "Payload". Just like Tankor. -LV (talk) 12:14, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Who's arguing about Blast Master? I certainly agree that Cosmos's partner Payload should be considered Blast Master-with-a-new-name. There's no other G1 Payload he could be. The thing about the thing actually being discussed is that Flanker is an existing name of an existing character who is also a Micromaster Jet not-entirely-dissimilar to Sky High. So I think there is an ambiguity here as to whether this situation is "This toy was supposed to be Sky High but we can't use the name so we're giving him a different one" and "This toy was supposed to be Sky High but we can't use the name so now it'll be Flanker instead." --KilMichaelMcC (talk) 12:21, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- The idea that we could take two guys who both went through the exact same process of design-to-release-name and decide one is the guy he was intended to be all along and one is some other guy baffles me even more than the rest of this conversation. -LV (talk) 14:09, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Because only one case has the "looks" of one existing Micromaster but the name of another. Consider: a new G1 franchise, purple-and-black Insecticon toy is released. It turns into some previously unassigned insect, like a ladybug. The toy is named "Shrapnel", but in robot mode it LOOKS like Kickback. Which page would you put it on? --Xaaron (talk) 16:29, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- The idea that we could take two guys who both went through the exact same process of design-to-release-name and decide one is the guy he was intended to be all along and one is some other guy baffles me even more than the rest of this conversation. -LV (talk) 14:09, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Who's arguing about Blast Master? I certainly agree that Cosmos's partner Payload should be considered Blast Master-with-a-new-name. There's no other G1 Payload he could be. The thing about the thing actually being discussed is that Flanker is an existing name of an existing character who is also a Micromaster Jet not-entirely-dissimilar to Sky High. So I think there is an ambiguity here as to whether this situation is "This toy was supposed to be Sky High but we can't use the name so we're giving him a different one" and "This toy was supposed to be Sky High but we can't use the name so now it'll be Flanker instead." --KilMichaelMcC (talk) 12:21, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Cybertron Jetfire wasn't specifically designed detail-for-detail to be Powerglide, on the other hand. A red jet that looks like Cybertron Jetfire may as well be Fireflight as Powerglide; a space shuttle that looks like Blast Master and is colored as Blast Master and who was going to be named Blast Master is much less convincingly a guy we've never heard of before named "Payload". Just like Tankor. -LV (talk) 12:14, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- The Legends Cyb. Jetfire redeco in Powerglide colors was obviously originally intended to be Powerglide, but the name was changed to Fireflight and so we consider it a Fireflight toy and not a Powerglide. Why doesn't this apply here? It's not quite like Octane/Tankor, because no one thinks giving a toy designed to be the Decepticon Triple Changer the name of the Vehicon General changes the toy into the other character. But changing substituting one Autobot Micromaster Jet for another Autobot Micromaster Jet isn't that big a of a stretch. --KilMichaelMcC (talk) 09:28, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Maybe if Frenzy and Rippersnapper shared all their robot mode detail. --ItsWalky (talk) 04:18, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- If I'm understanding what "file names of the stock photos" means, yes. The display plates at BotCon and SDCC, the packaging, and all other officially released sources of information from Hasbro say the guy is "Flanker". But someone read the URL of an image and found it said "Sky High" instead. That's unofficial information, similar to stuff found in the original production bible. It sounds like a preliminary name that was abandoned before actual release. Worthy of a note, sure, but not something that would require merging two characters. Otherwise, Rippersnapper (G1) and Frenzy (G1) should be merged thanks to the Sunbow cast list someone uncovered. --Xaaron (talk) 01:13, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Hasbro's information is unofficial? Is that what you are actually saying here? --M Sipher (talk) 00:00, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Nor is there any virtue to turning a homage into the same character by force of will alone. Different name. Different color scheme. Different vehicle mode. Besides a similar head design, you're using unofficial information that Hasbro likely didn't intend to make public in order to claim an official connection. --Xaaron (talk) 23:30, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Tankor. Darkmount. There's a Bot Shots Wildrider stand-in named "Brake-Neck". "Flanker" has Sky High's colors, albeit reversed, and is clearly designed to have the same head as the Micromaster, and Hasbro referred to him as Sky High internally. There is no virtue in the wiki being willfully ignorant in this case. -LV (talk) 23:08, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Nonsense! Sky High is white. Flanker is blue. Sky High is patterned after an SST with one tailfin. Flanker is some other kind of plane with two tailfins. And your examples of re-naming all involve some remnant of the original name being preserved (Shrapnel, Trailbreaker, Motormaster), which Flanker does not. --Xaaron (talk) 21:51, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- They don't have new paint jobs. They have the same paint jobs. Because they are obviously new versions of preexisting characters. Like, say, Skrapnel and Trailcutter and Motorbreath. -LV (talk) 20:43, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- ...And? Even if they were the exact same mold and not just a similar mold, a new name and a new paint job has been enough to create a distinct character since the 1984 Decepticons. The "file names of stock photos" sounds like it falls into the realm of non-canon, like Cybertron Overhaul originally intended to be named Trailbreaker. --Xaaron (talk) 19:36, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- The file names of the stock photos released during BotCon '13 named "Flanker" as Blast Master and "Payload" as Sky High, but looking at the sculpts it's pretty clear those names got switched up accidentally. Flanker's mould is based on Sky High and Payload's mould is based on Blast Master. Jalaguy (talk) 19:14, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Weren't Flanker and Payload identified as Blast Master and Sky High during BotCon 2013, too? --Detour (talk) 19:09, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Look at them next to each other. --ItsWalky (talk) 18:52, 9 November 2013 (EST)
- Universe Tankor IS on BM Tankor's page. And that situation doesn't seem analogous to this one. --KilMichaelMcC 11:08, 8 November 2013 (EST)
I think the sensible thing to do at this point is for us to wait and see what the package bios have to say about these guys personalities. If they match Sky High and Blast Master, we can safely say it's a "for trademark reasons" name change, if not, I guess the toys go elsewhere.
(On a related note, Tailgate's partner "Groundpounder" is a mould based on Micromaster Neutro in a colour scheme totally different to both him and the original Groundpounder, so god knows what we do there.) Jalaguy (talk) 04:16, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Jalaguy is right, we should wait for the bios. And then we can also argue about whether Payload is Blast Master or Phaser or some evolved combination of the two... he looks more like Phaser to me but there is no way to be sure until we find out if he is a reckless rookie or a control freak. Mister Jazz (talk) 12:35, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- There is zero question that Payload is based on Blast Master. --ItsWalky (talk) 13:39, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- Really? Ok, I just thought as Phaser has a red torso, small circle details near the elbows and the cone shape on his shoulders there were similarities. To me that's enough to suggest design elements from both characters. Payload turns into a full shuttle, not the just the aft section after all. If there is official confirmation one way or the other fine but I haven't seen any so I thought I'd raise the question. Mister Jazz (talk) 16:12, 10 November 2013 (EST)
- There is zero question that Payload is based on Blast Master. --ItsWalky (talk) 13:39, 10 November 2013 (EST)
Escaping from the thread above, let me ask this question: have we ever previously had a new toy of a G1 character released in a G1 line in its originally-intended deco and wound up considering it to be some other character? I can think of one example: Alt Windcharger, who we do indeed consider Windcharger instead of Overdrive, despite it being an Overdrive toy in Overdrive colors with an Overdrive head. By that metric, this obvious new toy of Sky High probably does count as a new toyu of Flanker instead, although all this really does is make me think considering the Alt a version of Windcharger instead of Overdrive was the wrong thing to do. -LV (talk) 14:17, 10 November 2013 (EST)
Designer insight
[edit]Joe Kyde had this to say on the subject of these toys' creation on the Allspark boards:
This confirms that giving them the original guys' names wasn't an option, and that they were designed with being those guys in mind. Me, I'd say this is justification enough for Flanker to go on Sky High's page, Payload on Blast Master's and Groundbuster on Neutro's... Jalaguy (talk) 13:14, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- I agree, better now with confirmation. Mister Jazz (talk) 14:01, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- Also agree. Makes it a little more solid. --Xaaron (talk) 15:10, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- More solid? That makes it clear to me that this Flanker is not designed to be G1 Flanker, but that is pretty much all the definite meaning I can wring out of that statement. Saying his art was inspired by Sky High isn't saying all that much. It only barely reaches the level of "visual homage." I'd say the toy left the design phase as a "he's whoever" kind of guy, leaving his identity to be filled in by marketing if they feel like it, or left undefined if they don't. - Gimmick (talk) 16:47, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- He states that if the names were availible, they would of used Sky High, Blast Master, and Neutro, so that makes it seem confirmed. Escargon (talk) 16:55, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- By "art inspiration" he meant that the moulds were based on the three Micromasters' packaging artworks - he mentioned this earlier in the thread. And I don't see how a statement from the designer saying that in an ideal world they'd have the original names suggests that the toys were in a "he's whoever" situation. If the trademarks had been available, Kyde would've said "call these guys by these names", and they probably would've been released with their original names. Jalaguy (talk) 17:16, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- More solid? That makes it clear to me that this Flanker is not designed to be G1 Flanker, but that is pretty much all the definite meaning I can wring out of that statement. Saying his art was inspired by Sky High isn't saying all that much. It only barely reaches the level of "visual homage." I'd say the toy left the design phase as a "he's whoever" kind of guy, leaving his identity to be filled in by marketing if they feel like it, or left undefined if they don't. - Gimmick (talk) 16:47, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- Also agree. Makes it a little more solid. --Xaaron (talk) 15:10, 11 November 2013 (EST)
This isn't really new information. We knew Flanker was designed to be Sky High pretty much just by looking at him. It's just the existence of the other Flanker that gives pause when definitively stating which character the toy ultimately should be considered. But now I'm just repeating what I've already said. --KilMichaelMcC (talk) 18:33, 11 November 2013 (EST)
- Alternators Windcharger was designed to be Overdrive, was released as Overdrive under Binaltech, and was only renamed into "Windcharger" for Alternators due to trademark reasons. We still consider him "Windcharger who looks like Overdrive" instead of "Overdrive who uses Windcharger's name". Just sayin'.--Nevermore (talk) 17:56, 7 November 2014 (EST)
Japanese Voice Actor
[edit]What does he say in the Japanese Dub? (AutoTrooper2801 (talk) 17:50, 4 May 2022 (EDT))